Newbie 2119: Pictures of People Wearing Cool Hats | GAME OVER

[Bellaphant]

VOTE: av

First!

[Bellaphant]

The nice thing about last game was av was obvscum: pls don't let him charm you into limming obv town again!

Dragon is prob town, page one hot take

[Bellaphant]

Poor patch, up was so scummy but patch was so chaotic, it reminded me of my first newbie game.

@dragon, it was wild, they elimed obv!town Omi day one

[Bellaphant]

Noone else on this page is town yet.

[Bellaphant]

Dragons town af. If we are talking about weak entrances, can I interest you in venmar?

[Bellaphant]

[can we get a VC?

[Bellaphant]

[can we get a VC?

There is literally one on this page????

Sorry, posting without coffee X

[Bellaphant]

VOTE: venmar let's get a wagon going

[Bellaphant]

It's as much as a scum read as I have right now, I'm not town reading black or comet either. The votes are really spread out so let's get something moving

[Bellaphant]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

[Bellaphant]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

Ahaha no, it's a response to delta talking about dragon: I like this post because it's the kind I see myself making as town, so I town read it. It's not that deep

[Bellaphant]

The fact three people have jumped on 'its a scum slip ' without asking how likely that actually is (like, I've seen it....once, in the last year) should be ringing alarm bells. The partner hunting is Sus as well.

P-edit no, I know. I would make the kind of post dragon made when I'm town (in general), as the reasoning fits with how I think. So, I can see it from town!dragon.

[Bellaphant]

Delta said it about dragon. Delta said that dragon was scummy for....talking through his shit vote? Which feels town to me

[Bellaphant]

TOWNREAD

This is clearly LAMIST and therefore you are confirmed mafia rolecop.
Just kidding, there's no mafia roleblocker in this setup.

Am I doing this right, guys?

For real though I don't think I like this entrance by Black so my RVS vote has turned semi-serious.

I think no-one really addressed this and I'm really struggling with what even this is, but I want to apply pressure here.

No-one seemed to make anything of this? I get the need for us to break out of RVS and make something happen, and I think more pressure applied here will be better at propelling us out of this 'Hi everyone, nicey-nicey phase' than pressure applied to Venmar who hasn't said much or Kawaii who has said nothing at all.

No more nicey-nicey, only gameplay.

On a note, activity-wise I think it's a bit rogue too to be critiquing people who are posting for not... posting again within 8 hours? Dragon there's enthusiasm and then there's unrealistic expectations. Setting some expectations for you, I'll post something as a minimum every 24 hours, but this isn't going to be my focus early morning or late evening every day and it'll likely be over 8 hours between posts.

UNVOTE: Patch
VOTE: DragonEater70

Here. My whole response was 'meh, I do this as town, dragons probably town, this is a shit reason to scum read someone'

[Bellaphant]

Considering there are 2/8 not!me players who are mafia and considing I saw very little effort for anyone to ask questions like 'how likely is this', I don't think it's unreasonable for me to considering that 1/3 might not have pure motives?

It might be a playstyle thing? I'm always looking for town, but this was an issue in the last newbie too. People talking about not voting to avoid a self hamnwe doesn't feel weird ns premature to you?

[Bellaphant]

See, I kind of feel/felt this way about black: the sequence was dragon posted shading them, delta posted shading that post, and I posted shading delta/supporting dragon/low key supporting the shade on black , and then when she also jumped on the slip it felt connected.

That might be nuts though. But like, of the people I've already said I lm not town reading and the people who jumped on me, theres a big crossover m

@black, I'll go back and find the quote, it might have been commet, just talking about the hammer (plus any sort of partner searching before a flip) felt really premature

@venmar, that kind of makes sense.

[Bellaphant]

UNVOTE:

[Bellaphant]

@black, If you read the last newbie that me and patch where in, it felt a lot like this too: people jumping on slips and pr hunting and partners and really focusing on 'scun reads' day one, and a lot of it was scum driven. Sorry, I realise I talk Ans assume knowledge of context a lot

[Bellaphant]

@dragon, could you maybe direct your issues with me into clear points? Coz I feel like I've explained both the original post, Ans then my reaction (there's a big crossover between 'slots I'm not town reading' and 'slots that were more than happy to jump on clumsy wording (likely) to be a scum slip (unlikely)'. Plus, apart from one readlist, I feel I've been the most open with my reads? So like....what's the actual issue?

[Bellaphant]

Also you say I'm throwing shade but like 'until she meaningfully contributes '. Like...bruh.

[Bellaphant]

It's not defensive to point out that five people (delta, commet, venmar, black and you) all's jumped on and seemed to just accept a scum slip. For you all to be town, that would mean the scum team is exactly two of: patch, kawia and AV.

Is that.... likely to you?

P-edit I'll look at that post now but maybe not coherently answer

[Bellaphant]

TOWNREAD

This is clearly LAMIST and therefore you are confirmed mafia rolecop.
Just kidding, there's no mafia roleblocker in this setup.

Am I doing this right, guys?

For real though I don't think I like this entrance by Black so my RVS vote has turned semi-serious.

He never said 'this is a shit vote ' but I read that as the message. Like...'here is a joke to cover the fact I feel weird about scum reading this slot and am also aware it's a bad reason to do so but here we are.'

The thing is, now reading that back, it feels more awkward than just straight town. The version I just wrote feels like a really town thought process, but from others' reactions, I'm now doubting if this whole thing is over something that wasn't even there.

Am I making sense at all?

[Bellaphant]

Sorry, that was an answer to 240 black

[Bellaphant]

My issue a lot with my town game is I find it a lot harder to justify my scum reads, especially when they feel crazy. I sr av in our last game, but he manages to push through two lims, one on a claimed town pr, as scum: so I empathised a lot with dragons 'this is a bit shit but here we are' but...like I said, I'm worried now I projected!

[Bellaphant]

@delta, what I thought was there v what was actually there clearly don't match, do they? I also think people wouldn't have been so confused by what I meant in the first place if they did? (Genuinely curious)

P-edit at both of you, I'm saying the same thing Ans I'm not sure how to be clearer?

P-edit his whole talking around the vote thing made me feel like he doubted his own thought process. Like I said, it's now pretty clear to me I was projecting, so no he never said that, but at the time I really /felt/ that was his message. Wishful thinking maybe.

[Bellaphant]

@black, I thought dragon was casting doubt on his own thought process, a thing I often do and struggle with as town, especially with 'uncommon' scum reads. I read his post and was like....oh, cool. Then delta aaa like 'this is a bit shit ' and my repsinse was 'meh, why would scum basically admit to their thought process being a bit shit' but I'm hindsight, I think I added a ton more to dragons post that was there because I over identified with something.

Is that clear?

[Bellaphant]

289 is a general question to everyone btw: is it more likely that one of the five people who jumped on the slip are all town and that the team is precisely two of (AV, kawia, patch) or is that...not that likely?

[Bellaphant]

Esp because in the last couple of pages three(?) People have suddenly said that a PT slip is massively unlikely, but in the moment noone did? Like, I would be shocked if there wasn't some scum fuel to that fire, Ans I don't think that's defensive of me?

Anyway, stopping hyper posting, bedtime.

[Bellaphant]

Ugh I kinda scum read comet and I don't wanna.

[Bellaphant]

Yea, mostly , the bit about your post isn't quite right though. think I must word things a lot less clearly than I think I do.

I thought you were being overly critical of something that looked +town and that I couldn't see the scum benefit to. I was mainly saying 'why would scum draw attention to weak reasoning?': the rest is right. I often refer to myself as town!Bella as an abstract concept, I didn't realise it would be controversial!

I am now more confused about dragon, because I read meaning into his post that wasn't there.

[Bellaphant]

More specifically, I thought your post was quite scumn, because it felt like an attack on a 'bad' post that wasn't that bad, and also a weird defense of black, who dragon was voting. This aligned with my earlier reads so I was fairly ok with 'dragon towny, delta and black scummy '.

P-edit I'll do a readlist in the am. But yeah, comet/black/delta/venmar as kinda where my head was at, which is a lot of scum reads considering two people aren't really posting.


In terms of where I am now, I think comet/black are probably still strong sr, I think venmar and delta have shown some town thought processes and I am massively confused about you. Does that help?

[Bellaphant]

The first at delta, the rest at dragon.

Basically, comet and black seem to be going with the flow too much? Comet was fine with the scum slip Ans now says it's unlikely, and black...posts a fair bit but like what are her actual reads/impact? Annoying as this conversation about me making no sense is, I feel like I'm getting somewhere a bit with my understanding of delta, Ans a bit of you, but black? No. I look for 'progession' of the game/your own understanding a lot as town!tell I guess.

[Bellaphant]

Sometimes, 'doing things' is scummy, like venmar and the partners chat (which did seem a bit scummy), or deltas original response to you, which kicked this thing off. But scum either really want to be listened to (AV in the last game) or don't want to be noticed

[Bellaphant]

Not voting because I think if this is a genuine scum slip the best play for Bella could honestly be self hammering to prevent any further discussion on this, but consider my vote on her in spirit then.

You know the butterfly meme? 'is this avoiding the wagon?'

Re-reading comet they might just be...nice. #mixedfeelings

[Bellaphant]

Random question but who are you scumreading?

i used to scumread bella really hard and then i scumread venmar and then i scumread you and at this point i don't know and don't think i can make conclusions yet because i'm really bad at scumhunting
i can say that i townread black, you, and venmar, though

I think you are actually doing a rather excellent job.
Why are you townreading Black specifically?

Dragon asking my questions.

[Bellaphant]

I need to actually re-read this specific venmar post, I have more a vague memory of narrative crafting than the words.

[Bellaphant]

Also, thank you comet! I won't be here much today

[Bellaphant]

I mean, even Bella unvoted me in #204 after saying in #203 that my my explanation in #202 made sense lol. If anyone agrees with Delta then definitely speak up

@Black

You should vote Bella or Delta

Eh, the original 'we' post isn't as bad as I remember but I really don't like this. @venmar, this reads as you know I'm town in sentence one but then are still encouraging a vote in sentence three. Clarify?

[Bellaphant]

I had a terrible 'fun free' cake because my nieces and nephews have allergies, but last night I had a hot chocolate brownie and ice cream so I feel ok about it, comet!

[Bellaphant]

Patch being town is probably the strongest read I have

[Bellaphant]

Patch being town is probably the strongest read I have

Interesting and I'd love for you to go into that a little deeper when you can. Is it a vibe-based read? Patch hasn't done anything scummy this game but I can't say I've been particularly inclined to read town into them - and they're definitely one of my weakest reads atm in a firm 'null' category.

It's basically exactly both of what you said (I know how pockety that sounds!)

Like, I kinda scum read you (but mainly black) for this go with the flow vibe, although if I had to chose one I think it's black.
Delta and venmar occupy a similar position in my head in that I sometimes think their arguments are really towny but sometimes I think they are pushing a narrative/agenda
AV and kawai arent here
Dragon is feeling really town at points but I always scum read them a bit for buddying/insincerity, in a way that I feel is different from how I feel about delta and venmar
And then patch just...isn't vibibg scum/I can't to any specifically scumny posts, like I can with everyone apart from av and kawia

[Bellaphant]

Realistically, it isn't + town to elim AV or kawai today and I don't feel patch is a good elim, partially because I feel it's low info because of their slightly low impact posting.

So then we're left with 'everyone else '. And I kinda don't want to elim in you/dragon/delta

[Bellaphant]

@comet, I have had a lovely, if very child-led weekend and have a chocolate unicorn to eat later!
@av, I'm sorry!

[Bellaphant]

I mean, even Bella unvoted me in #204 after saying in #203 that my my explanation in #202 made sense lol. If anyone agrees with Delta then definitely speak up

@Black

You should vote Bella or Delta

Eh, the original 'we' post isn't as bad as I remember but I really don't like this. @venmar, this reads as you know I'm town in sentence one but then are still encouraging a vote in sentence three. Clarify?

I was simply saying that even the person the discussion revolved around; the person I was scumreading and accusing of making a PT slip, found my explanation satisfactory. In my mind it was just noteworthy; kind of like if you had a trial and the prosecutor convinced the defendant (you) of a point but not the defense attorney (delta), if that analogy makes sense.

I don't like this as an explanation and also find it weird that you are encouraging a vote between two people who sr reach other without looking into that.

[Bellaphant]

Actually I'd appreciate others' interpretation of the above

[Bellaphant]

No, me and black.

[Bellaphant]

And my point still stands anyway: these three people sure have a lot of srs between them.
Strawman, pivot, chainsaw sure are a ton of buzzwords though. Much genuine thought, many wow.

[Bellaphant]

It's kind of the problem with your explanation as well: defendant, etc - it doesn't feel genuine. It also just doesn't follow for me: why would you care what Bella!scum thougjt of your post? Why wouldn't you interogate why I was supporting you in that moment, rather than using it as a 'gotcha' to the person you were arguing with?

[Bellaphant]

Tl:Dr your thought process doesn't feel genuine and your wording seems to rely on
'buzzwords' or stock ideas rather than genuine reaction

[Bellaphant]

...you just said you didn't wanna talk to me and then called me dismissive?? O.o

I'm trying to ask you questions to work out your thought process. What I'm trying to avoid is sr you based on a language difference because I don't wanna be a dick. It's kinda up to you what you wanna do with that.

[Bellaphant]

I meant interogate in your own mind, not me, I agree that would've been pointless: but it just didn't occur to you like that? That's fine if that's your answer

[Bellaphant]

K, maybe this is just a vibes thing?

[Bellaphant]

Do you want to direct some questions my way? You've talked a lot more about me than to me, which is always a red flag.

[Bellaphant]

@dragon, I generally expect a thought process at all? Like...ok, why is scum!Bella defending me here instead of jumping on, why is scum!Bella taking my side instead of delta, etc. It's like I said about your original post with my slip issues: it's automatic for me to see delta response to you shading black and wonder what that means about delta Ans black, as well as delta Ans you. Like it's also really clear in his response he wasn't and isn't thinking town!Bella at all.

[Bellaphant]

Can you talk to me specifically about venmar? They seem to be coasting on a sr of me but won't engage with me, which is fucking weird. I quite like the catch up, black, some goos vibes.

Tonally, comet is super town and in trying not to let that influence me like I'm trying not to let venmar being frustrating influence my read. I'm not saying I want comet to start a random 1 v1 but just chat though some more individual thought processes.

[Bellaphant]

Specifically I like the dragon push from black.

[Bellaphant]

The 'slip' was me: I read way more into a post from dragon than was there and then worded it so badly that like.... five? People decided it was from the scum pt. I think most people now don't think that/venmar (and black?) Still sr me separately

Re: inconsistencies around reads, I think I answered this but I think a big part of it is I'm worried I'm reading people for the wrong reasons, specifically with venmar and comet (I find venmars posting independently scumny of their tone, but I am worried I'm sr-ing comet's being affable as a scum agenda to 'blend in'). Comet, venmar and black wre all in the slip group too - I'm 99% certain one scum is here.

With patch, apart from you and kawia I can point to posts from everyone that seem really scumny: I'd struggle to do that with patch? Either way, I think patch and comet become more readable over time - I remember in mine and comets first game I think I sr them early Ans then by day two was like 'im never voting this'

[Bellaphant]

Oh, the vote thing: I'm not even sure now what I meant, it's possible I read the names wrong and thought he was telling delta to vote between me and black, who sr each other? Apparently comprehension is not my strong point this game.

[Bellaphant]

What's the point? What I want is a case from you, even bullwt points, so I can have something decent to respend to. Like, you are right im frustrated about how you are engaging me, but it's because I'm not getting anything out of it to read you, rather than because it isn't 'appearing' the way I want: I felt I got decent reads out of the my back and forth with delta a few pages ago, but im not getting it with you and I cant work out why. And like, you adding in

', as if you're more interested in steering our discussion in a way you want and make our interactions appear a certain way rather than actually engaging with me in an organic way.' just again makes me feel like you are narrative forming, which was the issue earlier.

[Bellaphant]

Patch's Initial take 'maybe dragon is sketch town' is kinda fine, I feel like dragon 'buddies' as either Alignment, but their response to black is bad. Hmmm

[Bellaphant]

AV shows up in 410 but doesn't say too much. I like that he's questioning Dragon here

I like Comet's analysis in 412 and 416 and find myself agreeing with her on Venmar

Like, I kinda scum read you (but mainly black) for this go with the flow vibe, although if I had to chose one I think it's black.

Why though?

I don't feel patch is a good elim, partially because I feel it's low info because of their slightly low impact posting.

Didn't you say earlier that I don't have much impact either? What makes a Black lim better than a patch one?

At the time, info: I feel like I get tons more info on dragon/venmar/delta of a you lim than a patch lim, because of interactions.

This page though, my reads are flipping.

[Bellaphant]

What's the point? What I want is a case from you, even bullwt points, so I can have something decent to respend to. Like, you are right im frustrated about how you are engaging me,

but it's because I'm not getting anything out of it to read you

, rather than because it isn't 'appearing' the way I want: I felt I got decent reads out of the my back and forth with delta a few pages ago, but im not getting it with you and I cant work out why. And like, you adding in

', as if you're more interested in steering our discussion in a way you want and make our interactions appear a certain way rather than actually engaging with me in an organic way.' just again makes me feel like you are narrative forming, which was the issue earlier.

You've had no indications or inkling from our countless encounters or my other posts as to why I might be scumreading you? Why are you so adamant to get a case out of me? Is the opinion of someone you consider scum as to why they think you're scum this important to you?

- I am not fully convinced that your "PT Slip" wasn't one. I think your explanation was OK enough for me to not be convinced, but your explanation was more plausible than evidence against it.

- I found your early posts scummy because throwing out concrete reads in early pages like if someone is or isn't town doesn't sit well with me, it usually reads to me as fake engagement and I pointed this out all the way back in #138

- I thought your behaviour to try and shutdown and stifle discussion around your "PT Slip" was suspicious, I think the town reaction would've been to explain yourself, give context, engage with your wagoners, etc, whereas the scummy reaction, which is what you did, is to discredit the discussion entirely rather than knowing that the "slip" allowed us to escape RVS and start the game, and exploring an avenue like that allows town to pressure someone while letting town to also see how people react to it. I pointed this out in #170 AND #177

- I think your recent engagement with me reeks of an inorganic approach to interacting with a scumread of yours. You seem more interested in how I interact or should interact with you than what I actually say or do tbh. Your refusal to put your vote on me despite me being your biggest SR and spending many of your posts wanting others to weigh on me is also just objectively weird to me.

- The vibes are just off

The bolded is also very confusing/contradictory because idk how I could be your biggest(?) scumread who you find "scummy independent of my posting", while also not getting anything out of our interactions to read me?

VOTE: Bellaphant

Everyone aboard, Venmar has changed direction

...why would I want a case to respond to, really? Your sr of me seems just not based on ai things, which is what I suspected.

Re: the PT - how many times have you experienced a real PT slip? I have, once. It lost the scum the game in elo

I always give out trs, generally early. Another stock Bella phrase is 'town enough for day one/page x'

I've explained the maths on the slip: unless you think the scum team was two of patch/AV/kawia, then I don't think poibtibg out there was scum on my wagon was bad? I also didn't shut down discussion

I'm trying to read you. *shrug* what would be a scun reason for avoiding a vote?

[Bellaphant]

I've never done that.

[Bellaphant]

Vox's progression on me is super weird though

[Bellaphant]

@comet, after the last page I'm not sure patch is town at all. But I've had wine.

Yeah, even Bella. The defendant thing feels weird too. The issue is ia that I feel I'm approaching venmar with a 'naybe my SR is vibes ans we think differently And...' and venmar is just like 'bella is scum for ...mostly nai reasons but let me shade her some more '

P-edit I don't think vox 's progress on me is townie at all.

[Bellaphant]

Like, If I'm town in page 17, where some of my bigger content is, plus 'vibing' somewhere else, plus the push on me could've been scum motivated....shoe horning in a Bella sr just feels weird.

[Bellaphant]

@venmar, but why? Why are these things scummy?

Re:AV, my issue isn't that he read our of turn, it's that the TR on me is cancelled out by an earlier sr: that doesn't seem like logical progression. If I go back and stare at page 12 or whatever, I probably sr black again but that isn't where the game or my reads are - it would be super weird.

[Bellaphant]

@delta, I found black much more town when she was posting recently

[Bellaphant]

@av, I still find that weird because I find it much harder for a TR to decay than that? *Shrug* ask me questions anyway

[Bellaphant]

V
@av, I am napping in bed with the little ones (yes we co-sleep). I think venmar is the kind of player that I text book scum read: unaffable, intransigent, doesn't understand my vibes based play, etc. This is all playstyle stuff and these players, shockingly, also seem to sr me when they shouldn't!

What's bothering me about venmar is that his posts and responses also feel inorganic; the closest to a valid feeling thought orocess was him saying about the 'gotcha'. This links with my issues around his sr of me - he made a case and I'm like....right, why would scum do X, why is that different from Bella!town, and his response is 'i said what I said'

With five people, I believe I was initially pushed by dragon, black, comet was in two minds but could easily see itz venmar was partner hunting off it, delta took it one of the most serious and even patch said it could've been a slip. I'm not sure why you keep saying it was only three, like I'm trying to inflate

[Bellaphant]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

One

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

Hmmm. If it is a PT slip then the first half of Bella's comment is them referring to their Venmar vote

Yeah I think we should pressure this

VOTE: Bella

Two

Tbh my vote on Bella turned from mostly rvs to not random even before this page, throwing around "reads" like they did on page 1 bascally never sits well with me unless it's done as a joke or to elicit a specific response which I don't think was the case here, they also have provided 0 attempt to explain any of their "reads" too.

Also tbh Not sure why some people throwing shade at me but whatever

Three

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

This seems pretty damning atm - it’s reading to me like a post meant to be in scumchat where Bella’s partner asking for help with making a read? Or checking to see if something they want to say might seem scummy?

Not voting because I think if this is a genuine scum slip the best play for Bella could honestly be self hammering to prevent any further discussion on this, but consider my vote on her in spirit then.

Four

*snip*

Thanks for misrepping my intentions dude.
When did I criticize someone for not posting again within 8 hours?
And that post you quoted is a freaking joke.

@Dragon:

I didn't represent any intentions in this post, nevermind misrepresent them. With respect to critique, I read your #118 as critiquing the wider game for not posting essentially overnight. Wasn't an AI comment, more just saying like 'yo, chill'.

@Venmar,

after Bella's slip you have posted thrice, mentioning Bella once. Whilst your vote is already there you've looked at casting aspersions towards Dragon and myself without addressing the Bella slip. Can we get a comment on your thoughts there?

It's a bit odd that your top SR (correct me if this is wrong, but your vote being on her plus #138 indicate that she is your top SR) does something like that and you don't reference or acknowledge it.

Ninja'd:

@Comet

can you justify that? I don't see the link between Bella's post and my own, I'm keen on seeing the logic you're using there.

'after Bella's slip' five

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

so this means you're scum?
not gonna vote though i gotta catch up because i don't want to accidentally hammer

Six

[Bellaphant]

Av, I talked about this in excruciating detail to black and dragon later.

[Bellaphant]

NGL, it's weird how that AV spent some time talking about bussing before getting caught up, feels a weird way to focus your efforts. However, I want to go back to my quotes in a bit and actually re-read people's reactions. Somepoint when it's not naptime, I feel like theres something valuable in there, like how delta feels 'informed' but the wrong way!

[Bellaphant]

And you!
@i am happy, do you think I slipped? Let's make it a full house. If you don't, can you let me know who's response is scummier?

[Bellaphant]

Fair. I'm mainly having fun with myself trying to get the full house

[Bellaphant]

Also, I'm 99% sure I am going to hear people talk about you in person on Friday night, which is fun to me.

[Bellaphant]

Okay hold on

Bella I can’t believe this obvious scumslip!

It's really annoying that this makes me tr you a little bit.

And yes! Kids mean we can't do all of it but my folks are having them for the weekend and me and klick are freeeeee

[Bellaphant]

I've told you my read on you is rubbish, dragon: I see some towny thought process but some of your posting comes over as buddying/fake/too focused on how you look.

Honestly right now one of the biggest things in your favour is that you reacted first to the 'slip': it feels like a pretty wild gambl for scum to take.

[Bellaphant]

@ venmar, I'd like you to respond to the below from my response to 503


I've explained the maths on the slip: unless you think the scum team was two of patch/AV/kawia, then I don't think poibtibg out there was scum on my wagon was bad? I also didn't shut down discussion

I'm trying to read you. *shrug* what would be a scun reason for avoiding a vote?

[Bellaphant]

VOTE: patch

Their responses to black were really poor.

P-edit I tend to find town make the weirder leaps? It seems more likely to me that town saw a thing and scum whipped up the fire. Pp-edit I voted patch before you said that

[Bellaphant]

Ok, 'easily frustrated and dismissive' then.

You did make me laugh though. <3

P-edit that's at venmar

[Bellaphant]

@dragon, patches 20-23(ish) were just super scummy

[Bellaphant]

The they in my post was patch, not you.

[Bellaphant]

As confusing as av's catch up is, it's better than not doing it *cough* happy *cough" and also doesn't vibe with his meta (sorry) from the last two scum newbie games, where he aggressively pushed an agenda.

[Bellaphant]

Last game he counter claimed a pr, manages to coral town on town who'd made a mistake (they looked like they were pr hunting, were obv town), counter claimed a guilty, got the pr elimed, and then finally got elimed, having made it to day three.

Slight possibility he doesn't want to pull that level of obvs!scum straight away again with the same people, but ....

[Bellaphant]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

One

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

Hmmm. If it is a PT slip then the first half of Bella's comment is them referring to their Venmar vote

Yeah I think we should pressure this

VOTE: Bella

Two

Tbh my vote on Bella turned from mostly rvs to not random even before this page, throwing around "reads" like they did on page 1 bascally never sits well with me unless it's done as a joke or to elicit a specific response which I don't think was the case here, they also have provided 0 attempt to explain any of their "reads" too.

Also tbh Not sure why some people throwing shade at me but whatever

Three

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

This seems pretty damning atm - it’s reading to me like a post meant to be in scumchat where Bella’s partner asking for help with making a read? Or checking to see if something they want to say might seem scummy?

Not voting because I think if this is a genuine scum slip the best play for Bella could honestly be self hammering to prevent any further discussion on this, but consider my vote on her in spirit then.

Four

*snip*

Thanks for misrepping my intentions dude.
When did I criticize someone for not posting again within 8 hours?
And that post you quoted is a freaking joke.

@Dragon:

I didn't represent any intentions in this post, nevermind misrepresent them. With respect to critique, I read your #118 as critiquing the wider game for not posting essentially overnight. Wasn't an AI comment, more just saying like 'yo, chill'.

@Venmar,

after Bella's slip you have posted thrice, mentioning Bella once. Whilst your vote is already there you've looked at casting aspersions towards Dragon and myself without addressing the Bella slip. Can we get a comment on your thoughts there?

It's a bit odd that your top SR (correct me if this is wrong, but your vote being on her plus #138 indicate that she is your top SR) does something like that and you don't reference or acknowledge it.

Ninja'd:

@Comet

can you justify that? I don't see the link between Bella's post and my own, I'm keen on seeing the logic you're using there.

'after Bella's slip' five

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

so this means you're scum?
not gonna vote though i gotta catch up because i don't want to accidentally hammer

Six

@iam, here are some responses

[Bellaphant]

So you are most Sus of black, comet and patch from rbaoe reactions, happy?

[Bellaphant]

? This is a weirder argument than town!Bella by far

[Bellaphant]

Patch voted venmar in kinda Rvs on page four, unvoted on page 11 and hasn't voted since 0.o

[Bellaphant]

Tbh my eyes have completely glazed over the last few pages

fucking same lmao

Same

UNVOTE:

P-edit I have four, patch. Page tops, that is, not sr

[Bellaphant]

I found your engagement with black super weird patch but the last few pages have been better. You seem to be posting today as the whims strike, which...feels risky for scum..My reads are shot, I think we need to shift to a wagon and get some consolidation/info after night. We need either a compromise lim, which right now feels like dragon or happy or an info lim (black/delta? Who I basically tr)

We really rushed the lims last game but it wasn't an accident, it was very scum sided.

O edit why the fuck are we back at RVs?

[Bellaphant]

Also talking of fuck, the tone of that dragon post was super weird.

[Bellaphant]

Patch, I find your takes really chaotic, that's what I mean about whims - I normally look for straightforward progression of thoughts but you seem to just be posting whatever strikes you. It's probably more town than scum because faking chaos feels both hard and risky.

[Bellaphant]

The one happy used to push your reaction black, the one about lying, felt a bit fake

[Bellaphant]

Popping in to say that I kinda had that reaction to patch too and interestingly it was comet who called me out on it: then patch has a series of bad looking pages and then some townier ones and I think I'm just at null!town?

[Bellaphant]

Yeah, the whim stuff. I think I'm biased because they were like this last game: they were in 3p and their responses had been so chaotic that i would've found it really hard to make the right choice. Like by the end of day one I was the only person not in anyone's lim pool, but patch sr me all game.

Im not confident on this read at all, I think some flips will help (for example, comet flipping scum makes patch town)

[Bellaphant]

Patch and vox giving each other a mutual skim pass is odd tho

[Bellaphant]

@comet, we're mainly talking about patch

[Bellaphant]

Can you link me to that, comet?

@ AV, I feel like I've answered that elsewhere and I also don't feel like talking about venmar more is productive for me today and it certainly isn't for him: one of my issues with him is that he's focused on some stale reads, so circling the same thing isn't gonna move that on.

[Bellaphant]

Finishing up page 28 and Black's been involved in loads of conflicts suddenly. I'm still town-reading her and honestly think she comes out of the arguments looking good in my eyes, but I'm not sure if this has any significance.

That's true. Everywhere I look for scum people just get mad at me for it. First patch, then Dragon, then AV. Happy seems to like the fact that I kinda SR him?

This game definitely got interesting over the last couple of days

It's made me tr you, if it helps ?

[Bellaphant]

...wait, patch gets accused to scum slip in that game and doesn't mention it here??? That's Sus af, right?

[Bellaphant]

....kinda proving my point here. Go talk to/about some other people. What do you think of comet's read list?

[Bellaphant]

Specifically what do you think about their dragon and AV takes?

You can stop pulling my pigtails now. It's boring and it's starting to hurt.

[Bellaphant]

Where are you, delta? If you don't mind X

[Bellaphant]

VOTE: dragon

@patch, when you get a sec can you talk about the 'scun slip' in your scum game?
.

[Bellaphant]

So far only two of the hats have been cool, Shea, I'm very dissatisfied

[Bellaphant]

I really don't think delta is a good lim today. I'm also worried that he's a kinda consensus meh, and that these wagons have been fairly stale for days: it's never a good sign.

[Bellaphant]

I think dragon is making some bad pushes - me, delta, black, and their tone is just super off. The 'fucking lying' post just felt like a massive over exaggeration and it's even weirder when it's not followed up.
My lim pool is basically patch/dragon/comet/you

[Bellaphant]

I've decided it's just not productive today, and I'd appreciate you just being ok with that.

[Bellaphant]

It's more a Poe lim pool than anything else. I'm pretty sure black, delta and happy are town. I usually am more confident in a few more town by page 40, but we're also not on day one. We just need to get a flip.


I have no fucking clue, really, on comet. I find their reads a bit strange and their sr on me is boring.
Venmar I'm not dealing with today.
The majority of your posting/solving seems to be about me being scum, which is just hard for m to think you actually believe. It's boring. I don't see you massively challenging anyone else really.
Patch I'm not 100% sure on, like I said I'll tr them for a few pages, then sr them.
And dragon I've talked about.

It doesn't help that most of my sr are either voting for me , or on of my trs.

[Bellaphant]

Specifically, you dragging me back to venmar feels like a giant red flag. Like, I'm all about progress.

[Bellaphant]

I think Delta's town. I'm just ready to end the day.

[Bellaphant]

This is hypocrisy now: what do you think about the fact the wagons have been so stale?

[Bellaphant]

Our first newbie, we were done by 60 something pages. I hate long newbie day ones

[Bellaphant]

Jeez, a girl really can't set a boundary can she.

[Bellaphant]

It's not a specifically you problem, venmar (you've been fairly cool actually), but it's a pattern that I tend to find myself in with ms, that there's a mutual scum read for what feels like a massive personality difference and it always ends up circular and frustrating for me. It really bothers me, more than it should, and I just don't want to be in that space at the minute.


I do think it's slightly Sus that a)more people have you vageuly on their scum pile with less clear reasons than me and b) AV is more interested in bothering me about that than them.

[Bellaphant]

It feels (like, a feeling feeling) weird to me that AV has repeatedly tried to drag the chat back to something non productive. It kind of happened with his catch up too - it felt circular in places. It also ticks in with the fact I feel he's over focused on me: it looks like from his catch up he's just decided I'm scum and is reading the whole game through that lens, without, weirdly, doing the thing that you and him are saying I should be doing to you: campaigning for my lim.

[Bellaphant]

I think delta has been the leading wagon since like....Friday? I was e-3 before that, then am still the joint lead I think? That normally suggests that the scum are fine with the wagons, no?

[Bellaphant]

Yes, plus I think he is more than likely to flip town.

If there isn't appetite fos a dragon lim (and tbf he isn't here), I'd do pathc

[Bellaphant]

The wagons not really resembling those pools is also weird

[Bellaphant]

Didn't I vote patch?

[Bellaphant]

How am I associated with dragon, in voting him?

To answer your other q, I think it's weird that you literally got accused of doing the thing I got accused of doing, when you didn't, and didn't think to mention it? Like ...it wasn't a scum slip. It's so rarely a scum slip, that you could literally pint to a recent example of the convo happening about you!

[Bellaphant]

Can you give me a tl:Dr thought summary on comet, delta and AV, black?

[Bellaphant]

Tbf to happy I am also advocating for a not delta lim

[Bellaphant]

@mod, vpa til Monday

Eastermeet! No signal in the forest

[Bellaphant]

^this, basically

[Bellaphant]

Black, patch, AV, time to make a choice. We're running out of time for a claim

[Bellaphant]

Three of my top TRs are voting Delta while my top SR is voting with me on Dragon

I don't like that

I kinda felt this earlier

[Bellaphant]

? I'm not tr-ing patch and some of my tr are voting delta. That's all

[Bellaphant]

No, what I said. Let me go back and read what you said.

[Bellaphant]

Yeah,. No, no idea what the issue is with what I said? Patch is voting with me and in my lim pool.

[Bellaphant]

I'm just talking about patch

[Bellaphant]

What e am I? It's murder mystery night, I'm gonna be busy for like....three hours

[Bellaphant]

I'm the DR. Patch is voting dragon, sorry. I'm slightly drunk

[Bellaphant]

Would you like to see my crumbs?

If delta is cc-ing, he's just scum

[Bellaphant]

NGL, it's weird how that AV spent some time talking about bussing before getting caught up, feels a weird way to focus your efforts. However, I want to go back to my quotes in a bit and actually re-read people's reactions. Somepoint when it's not naptime, I feel like theres something valuable in there, like how delta feels 'informed' but the wrong way!

NHS. As in, our national health service

I found your engagement with black super weird patch but the last few pages have been better. You seem to be posting today as the whims strike, which...feels risky for scum..My reads are shot, I think we need to shift to a wagon and get some consolidation/info after night. We need either a compromise lim, which right now feels like dragon or happy or an info lim (black/delta? Who I basically tr)

We really rushed the lims last game but it wasn't an accident, it was very scum sided.

O edit why the fuck are we back at RVs?

Strike, as in the junior Dr strike lash week, shot (injection), emergency (accident and emergency)

[Bellaphant]

I was pretty sure the day would end with my claiming somehow.

[Bellaphant]

UNVOTE:

[Bellaphant]

It's delta and AV isnt it?

[Bellaphant]

TBf if you are gonna lim me, my flip makes the next moves fairly clear. I'm not even sure what I've done wrong, I was sure I was on a wagon with patch.

[Bellaphant]

????

[Bellaphant]

TBf we should probably vote someone who is loudly clamouring for my lim over fucking nothing, again.

[Bellaphant]

....I actually really trusted my delta read. I'm fucking confused

[Bellaphant]

I feel worse about black, which I don't want to, and about the same about av.

[Bellaphant]

I really want you to be town. I can't work out why people keep pushing you as my partner when I know I'm town

[Bellaphant]

I thought mw Ans patch were voring for the same person at some point. Is that a fact or not?

[Bellaphant]

People should only claim cc, not a role I think?

[Bellaphant]

I didn't. Fucking. Say. That.

[Bellaphant]

....ugh. I clearly didn't mean delta, I meant dragon. I'm sorry for shouting

[Bellaphant]

No, wait, I'm confusing myself. Can I do this when I'm not drunk?

[Bellaphant]

I think comet and venmar are probably town. Null town? I don't want another conversation about venmar.

[Bellaphant]

Comet and venmar were voting delta, but so were two of my biggest sr and I was on a wagon with patch. I just felt discomfort around both wagons. I've been saying the delta wagon is bad for a long time.

[Bellaphant]

I've got muddled by words, I'm dyslexic, it happens. Sorry, I get even more muddled trying to work out what maitake I made

[Bellaphant]

^isnt worth an inspext I think

[Bellaphant]

There doesn't seem to have been a cc? We've had most people?

[Bellaphant]

Are we elimed?

[Bellaphant]

I think dragon is basically town here, from the flip, but I'm surprised you've cleared AV? I need to go back and work out why I felt what I did, but when delta cc-ed my gut was 'its delta and av'

I also wonder, from the way delta cc-ed and then back tracked (was it a trap, like comet thought, or did they get cold feet/bad advice) if it means they were getting advice in the PT.


I

[Bellaphant]

I also think venmar is town.

[Bellaphant]

....I think that is kinda whwre I am, I'm worries about just jumping on consensus lim in black but if it's just right it's just right.

[Bellaphant]

See, I kind of feel/felt this way about black: the sequence was dragon posted shading them, delta posted shading that post, and I posted shading delta/supporting dragon/low key supporting the shade on black , and then when she also jumped on the slip it felt connected.

That might be nuts though. But like, of the people I've already said I lm not town reading and the people who jumped on me, theres a big crossover m

@black, I'll go back and find the quote, it might have been commet, just talking about the hammer (plus any sort of partner searching before a flip) felt really premature

@venmar, that kind of makes sense.

Early game Bella had this down I think

[Bellaphant]

Yeah, I basically don't want to elim in happy/venmar/dragon and can see reasons the other three could be scum.

I'll re-read delta in iso at some point.

[Bellaphant]

......delta's interactions with patch basically all look really coachy, they fence sit basically all the time on black 'she could be Bella's partner if that wasn't bonkers' 'she playing....fine', this happens /a lot/, and I think they engage with av/about av less than half a dozen times.


Hmmmm

[Bellaphant]

Can you look at delta next, just to confirm or deny my general takes there? All three could be scum partners

[Bellaphant]

That all feels very early game though black.

[Bellaphant]

......delta's interactions with patch basically all look really coachy, they fence sit basically all the time on black 'she could be Bella's partner if that wasn't bonkers' 'she playing....fine', this happens /a lot/, and I think they engage with av/about av less than half a dozen times.


Hmmmm

This, is this a fair summary

[Bellaphant]

Patch feels like the boring answer, black the hard one And av is like the jack in the box one

[Bellaphant]

You are saying that town!black would not know that a cc could still not clear both of us, but scum black would because from her pov it could be a pr and a vt?

[Bellaphant]

TBf I tr Delta.. annoyingly my brain told me one of delta/venmar was town and I picked wrong

[Bellaphant]

Patch pushing on to black, not dragon, is legit poor

[Bellaphant]

Like, they can't push a who they've buddied, dragon just looks clear, but I'd expect a push on, so they've picked the 'other' option

[Bellaphant]

It's even weirder when like, black is the one giving the most pressure but they are saying 'y'all'. I've barely commented on patches actions, mine are from delta

[Bellaphant]

VoteCount 1.7

Deltabreedy [ 3 ]

Cometbright, Dragoneater70, Venmar

DragonEater70 [ 3 ]

Deltabreedy, Bellaphant, patchwork

patchwork [ 2 ]

iamveryhappy, Black

Bellaphant [ 1 ]

AurorusVox

Not Voting [ 0 ]

With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to be eliminated.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2023-04-15 23:59:00)

VoteCount 1.8

Deltabreedy [ 4 ]

Cometbright, Dragoneater70, Venmar, AurorusVox

DragonEater70 [ 3 ]

Deltabreedy, Bellaphant, patchwork

patchwork [ 1 ]

iamveryhappy

Not Voting [ 1 ]

Black

With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to be eliminated.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2023-04-15 23:59:00)

VoteCount 1.9

Bellaphant [ 3 ]

Black, AurorusVox, patchwork

Deltabreedy [ 3 ]

Cometbright, Dragoneater70, Venmar

DragonEater70 [ 2 ]

Deltabreedy, Bellaphant

patchwork [ 1 ]

iamveryhappy

Not Voting [ 0 ]

With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to be eliminated.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2023-04-15 23:59:00)

VoteCount 1.10 FINAL

Deltabreedy [ 5 ]

Cometbright, Venmar, patchwork, Dragoneater70, AurorusVox

Cometbright [ 2 ]

Deltabreedy, Black

patchwork [ 1 ]

iamveryhappy

Not Voting [ 1 ]

Bellaphant

With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to be eliminated.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2023-04-15 23:59:00)

Deltabreedy has been eliminated.

Spoiler: The Role

Mafia Goon

It is now night. Deadline for night choices is in (expired on 2023-04-17 22:02:00)

[Bellaphant]

Does delta and patches scum sit in the same wagon for so long tho?

[Bellaphant]

...patch goes from one counter wagon to delta to the other between vcs.

[Bellaphant]

Maybe there are three scum and black is using wifom

[Bellaphant]

Legit tho we need to hear a lot more from av and happy before I want to end the day Ans pressure to do otherwise is scummy

[Bellaphant]

Can you explain why? We're In a pretty good position even if we mis lim

[Bellaphant]

Hi guys, sorry for not declaring V/LA, but I had a flight yesterday so was busy the last 2 days.
I will start catching up soon, but my top 2 suspicions from D1 are definitely Black and Bella.

?? I'm conf town

[Bellaphant]

Whatcha studying?

[Bellaphant]

I did English, then a pgce in English and then a master's. I currently teach level two, lol.

[Bellaphant]

Sorry, my head isn't in it properly. I feel like elim -ing black then patch is probably the right take

[Bellaphant]

Patch , who is it?

[Bellaphant]

I read deltas iso for everyone but venmar I guess, that's my next job

[Bellaphant]

Had my quick paranoia spin; it's still not venmar.

Can we do patch?

[Bellaphant]

Ok yeah it's super weird to keep saying vote me Ans the actions not matching.

Am I hammering ?

[Bellaphant]

VOTE: black

It's bedtime and dragon and happy might not move their votes.

[Bellaphant]

It's delta and AV isnt it?

You rock Bella

I kept saying av was scummy for their catch ups all about me! And drunk Bella got it right.

I'm sorry to comet and black, it's paranoia isn't it. My gut has been right on both of you every time.