Newbie 150 - Game Over

[NanookTheWolf]

Random Vote: Quidgyboo

[NanookTheWolf]

Like the new avi dybeck ...

I get the feeling that your vote wasn't really all that random.

[NanookTheWolf]

Why are you voting for that?

Fos: Deathsquiggle

Unvote: Quidgyboo

.. as my fos above most likely will turn into a vote.

[NanookTheWolf]

He must have known enough about no lynch to mention it though .. I mean maybe I was just a naive noob, but I don't recall even knowing what no lynch was when I first started mafia, or at least didn't think about it as a strategy of any sorts ..

[NanookTheWolf]

You know deathsquiggle .. if you're vote didn't mean nothing, then why place it?

I understand if you're trying to get conversation started and what not .. as that is something that is usually needed in newbie games (especially day 1),

I'm starting to get a vibe that deathsquiggle is just overly excited about this game or something, because a lot of the choices he's making are pretty scummy, but at the same token he's being quite active which isn't something that I usually count on from newbie scum .. so in light of that

Fos: Adele/Quidgyboo

[NanookTheWolf]

Well, my Fos is turning into a vote here ..

Vote: ~deathsquiggle~

I understand you're new, but I just can't let these vibes I get from you pass. You start off voting for No Lynch, and then follow voting for yourself.

You are either overly excited about this game, or confused as all hell as to what you should do, and think that by "starting conversation", you'll be 'helpful' to the town.

[NanookTheWolf]

You're right, the mafia does know everything they need to know right now .. but with the way you are posting, do you seriously think they are going to kill you at night? No, and you know why .. because you will be easy prey for them to leave for later in case we get to endgame, and since you are so hard to read, it turns into a perfect lynch in the end for scum.

I'd rather get rid of the scummy ones now, whether scum or not, to save us the trouble later. That is of course you don't happen to be the cop or doctor ..

[NanookTheWolf]

You're right, the mafia does know everything they need to know right now .. but with the way you are posting, do you seriously think they are going to kill you at night? No, and you know why .. because you will be easy prey for them to leave for later in case we get to endgame, and since you are so hard to read, it turns into a perfect lynch in the end for scum.

I'd rather get rid of the scummy ones now, whether scum or not, to save us the trouble later. That is of course you don't happen to be the cop or doctor ..

Are you trying to get me to role-claim day one?

FOS: Nanookthewolf

Are you trying to get yourself lynched on day one?

I'm not trying to get you to role-claim more so then anyone else, but if it does come down to it, which it hasn't yet, and you have a pro town power role, it may be wise both for you and the town.

[NanookTheWolf]

Well, that's his third vote .. I'd really like to hear from Dybeck and Quidgyboo on how they

feel

about the game before a lynch takes place. And no this isn't me seeking out lurkers, as I would say something about Adele, but he made it clear earlier how he felt about ~Deathsquiggle~.

[NanookTheWolf]

I apologize Adele .. I call everyone he, unless I notice pink otherwise ..

Anyways, as to the stupid comment there Deathsquiggle, if Seol thought that this were how you normally act, then why would he vote for you.

Also, I was under the impression that you had no previous experience playing mafia before .. this makes my vote even more interesting.

[NanookTheWolf]

I don't know why everyone thinks that this lynch is too easy. I mean sure, the actions he took place are all signs of possible scum, there is a reason why they were considered that you know.

[NanookTheWolf]

Excuse me .. Page 3 of a newbie game is progress just so you know. I may be a "tad bit pushy", but the fact that you are trying to lead suspicion off from DS, and onto me, adds suspicion on your part in my opinion.

I don't think that I am pushy about this at all. If we all sit here and debate this for another 5 or so pages, what does that get us? We'll be right back where we left off, or at least I will, as I don't think I'll be forgetting what DS has done early on, and most likely he'll just do something else scummy later.

Ps - At least I have reasoning for my vote, unlike you, who seems to be still voting someone random.

[NanookTheWolf]

Funny how ~ds~ hasn't had anything to say, now that he isn't in the spot light or nothing.

As for this bit with Dybeck finding Seol to be scum because Seol doesn't feel scummy, is just immature if you ask me.

I don't get it, I submit to you guys a player whose actions obviously constitute as scummy, and you're off chasing someone that doesn't appear scummy at all. Plus, to add to the reasoning of it, you vote for him because he must be scum as he doesn't act like it.

I'm keeping my vote.

[NanookTheWolf]

you just seem to be extremely scummy, thats why everyone's fos'ing you

So let's just let him slide since he is new and all ..

[NanookTheWolf]

Nanook - This is where things get interesting. Some of the logic used in games to determine who's scummy is effective when applied to newbies, and some isn't. No-lynching and placing a second vote are not, in my opinion, effective - these are behaviours we see from newbies

all the time

. The same goes for his overall confused and defensive play. It would be the easiest thing in the world to lynch him for his behaviour to date.

Normally I would agree, but this isn't just one little thing that a newbie did .. I mean this guy basically has met multiple scum readings ..

There are other details that I use for catching newbie scum, and I'll admit that voting for no lynch isn't usually one of them, but voting no lynch and then turning and voting for himself, I mean what more could you ask for.

I can't follow this wagon on Seol, I don't care if he is scum, because even though it may hold true that Seol is good at being scum, that is no reason to lynch anyone, especially over someone else who seems to be playing it so poorly.

As for the Dybeck wagon you all are talking about, I really need to look more into that, cause in all honesty I must have missed the reasoning somewhere behind that.

[NanookTheWolf]

I voted for myself only after I was told it would be a good way to get people to talk.

Also, I'm watching the discussion mentioned, but nothing about it says scum to me. Does it to you, Nanook?

Why are you just asking me? I'm not the only other player in this game, and you should be trying to find clues as to who scum are .. oh wait, no you don't, cause you already know who scum are, duh?

in a newbie game, i wouldnt expect mafia to be acting totally suss right away, especially jumping at a no-lynch vote
i would expect scum to be acting as unscummy as possible, especially the obviously tells

So you're saying that in games that aren't newbie setups, you'd expect the scum to act suss right away? I don't think that the setup has anything to do with how people act in the game, it's their role, and how they defend their position in the game that determines that. Plus, a lot of the actions as is the case for this game.

[NanookTheWolf]

Alright, I've reread the thread, and the only thing that stands out for me is how insanely paranoid and jumpy nanook has been.

Here:

You know deathsquiggle .. if you're vote didn't mean nothing, then why place it?

I understand if you're trying to get conversation started and what not .. as that is something that is usually needed in newbie games (especially day 1),

I'm starting to get a vibe that deathsquiggle is just overly excited about this game or something, because a lot of the choices he's making are pretty scummy, but at the same token he's being quite active which isn't something that I usually count on from newbie scum .. so in light of that

Fos: Adele/Quidgyboo

He FOS's two people, then a few posts later he changes his FOS on me into a vote without waiting for either of them to really explain anything.

Why are you just asking me? I'm not the only other player in this game, and you should be trying to find clues as to who scum are .. oh wait, no you don't, cause you already know who scum are, duh?

I picked a name at semi-random, and since I'd been reading on of your posts, I settled on you. And to answer your question? I think I have a pretty good idea at this point.

Vote: NanookTheWolf

Tell me why you're jumping at shadows, otherwise this is the vote I'm sticking with. When I FOS'd you you got aggressive and suggested FOSing you would get me lynched. This time I want real answers for why you're acting this way.

You want to bring the voting pattern into this game .. fine.

Yes, I've fos'd a total of 3 people, one of which turned into a vote .. a vote which hasn't been removed since I've placed .. OMG! .. You can't count my initial vote though, as it was only random .. now let's look at your voting/fos'ing record.

Random vote

vote: Seol

Like I said, random doesn't count ..

Okay, everyone has posted, so there's no lurkers right now.

unvote

Vote: No lynch

Your second post of the game, you decide to vote for no lynch .. this obviously caught my eye.

Nothing is happening in here.

Vote: Dybeck

just to turn up the pressure.

You unvoted no lynch in the previous post, and turn to Dybeck .. still not sure why, although you state to add pressure ..

you wanted to get people talking, and i bet that would be one way to get people talking very quickly

Ok. 8)

vote: Deathsquiggle

8)

Now this is when I feel pretty confident of your scuminess .. You say you voted yourself because beaker said it would start discussion, however I think that you used this as scapegoat for you not to have to respond to the question as to why you voted for Dybeck, which makes you look even more like scum .. and possibly Dybeck as well.

you wanted to get people talking, and i bet that would be one way to get people talking very quickly

I did as you suggested, and people did not start talking quickly.

FOS

: Beaker, for being a lyer and trying to make me lynch myself.

Unvote

Ok, now you unvote yourself, and fos beaker because he made you do it .. Do you see how this makes you look yet?

You're right, the mafia does know everything they need to know right now .. but with the way you are posting, do you seriously think they are going to kill you at night? No, and you know why .. because you will be easy prey for them to leave for later in case we get to endgame, and since you are so hard to read, it turns into a perfect lynch in the end for scum.

I'd rather get rid of the scummy ones now, whether scum or not, to save us the trouble later. That is of course you don't happen to be the cop or doctor ..

Are you trying to get me to role-claim day one?

FOS: Nanookthewolf

My reasoning for mentioning the cop/doc bit is because yeah if you're going to be lynched .. I do want you to role claim .. I don't care what day it is, If you claim cop, then if there is a doc in the game, you're safe. You claim doc, then that keeps us from lynching you for the day and you get killed at night which betters our odds on killing scum on the current day.

Then a post or two later, you state that you can't roleclaim because you don't have a role .. after just making a big deal about claiming on day 1?

Alright, I've reread the thread, and the only thing that stands out for me is how insanely paranoid and jumpy nanook has been.

Here:

You know deathsquiggle .. if you're vote didn't mean nothing, then why place it?

I understand if you're trying to get conversation started and what not .. as that is something that is usually needed in newbie games (especially day 1),

I'm starting to get a vibe that deathsquiggle is just overly excited about this game or something, because a lot of the choices he's making are pretty scummy, but at the same token he's being quite active which isn't something that I usually count on from newbie scum .. so in light of that

Fos: Adele/Quidgyboo

He FOS's two people, then a few posts later he changes his FOS on me into a vote without waiting for either of them to really explain anything.

Why are you just asking me? I'm not the only other player in this game, and you should be trying to find clues as to who scum are .. oh wait, no you don't, cause you already know who scum are, duh?

I picked a name at semi-random, and since I'd been reading on of your posts, I settled on you. And to answer your question? I think I have a pretty good idea at this point.

Vote: NanookTheWolf

Tell me why you're jumping at shadows, otherwise this is the vote I'm sticking with. When I FOS'd you you got aggressive and suggested FOSing you would get me lynched. This time I want real answers for why you're acting this way.

Then there is the vote on me, for being aggressive. I read the post after you fos'd me, and maybe it's me, but I don't see the aggression you speak of. I made a smart ass comment and that's about all I really get from it.

You know you sit here and say that I I'm jumping at shadows, I don't know what the heck you're talking about .. I've stuck with you since I've voted for you, and have made a total of 3 fos's .. how is that jumping? Especially compared to all of the votes you've made, which out number my votes/fos's combined?

My vote stays.

[NanookTheWolf]

My vote was turned into a huge big deal by others, but to me I just think that he's the current most suspicious. This isn't a vendetta or anything!

But he's certainly a mile more suspicious to me than deathsquiggle.

Here's the thing Dybeck, your vote was turned into a huge deal because of the reasoning you are using to vote for seol. You're saying that seol is the most suspicious as he hasn't acted suspicious .. so how is it that that makes hi a mile more suspicious then ~ds~?

[NanookTheWolf]

You know what, depending on Dybeck's answer, I actually am thinking about moving my vote towards him atm.

[NanookTheWolf]

Here's the thing Dybeck, your vote was turned into a huge deal because of the reasoning you are using to vote for seol. You're saying that seol is the most suspicious as he hasn't acted suspicious

NO! That's not my reason at all!

I'm saying that I didn't find anybody suspicious, therefore the scum are obviously good at concealing their identity, therefore I voted for someone who is known to me to be good at that. That's all!

And it wasn't even a significant vote - just the next step up from random voting!

Christ, if I'd said "Random vote - Seol", it would have caused much less furore.

And as for my certainty about ~ds~, I've obviously only got the same information as the rest of you - all I can say is that I REALLY don't think he's scum, I genuinely think he's a townie, and if i'm wrong, I will eat my hat. I think people are clutching at straws and jumping on 'evidence' that isn't really scummy, rather than stimulating discussion - and that's the easiest way to lose a mafia game.

I'm past thinking that anyone is going to join me on this wagon - since whichever two of you are scum have painted me pretty black here. History will be my judge!

If the vote isn't all that significant, and you don't have any evidence against Seol, then why are you still voting for him/trying to get others to join you?

The only reason you're voting for him is because he's a good player basically, and I find this reasoning to be rubbish ..

Unvote: ~ds~, Vote: Dybeck

[NanookTheWolf]

I don't think any of you look scummy.

When that happens, it means someone's hiding it very well.

No-one hides it better than Seol. And his deliberate misrepresentation of my words right at the very top of this game tickle my spider-sense.

deathsquiggle has all but admitted to being a townie right? Yet Seol is still pushing for a claim. This is not the way to play out Day 1 of a Newbie game.

unvote, vote: Seol

Here is your initial reasoning for voting Seol .. You're voting for him because of his deliberate misrepresention of your words .. ok.

i see your logic dybeck, you're stating that a scum will be trying especially hard to hide scummy tactics
thats one reason that im still cautious about lynching ~ds~, he seems to be to obviously showing off possible scumness

That's part of what I'm saying

I just REALLY feel, deep down in my heart, that it's not deathsquiggle.

That's fine.

I believe the scum are Adele and Seol.

I have no justification for this statement other than 'I reckon I'm right'.

This statement will ultimately end up in my being lynched today, and I post it here for no other reason than when this game is over, I can say 'I told you so.'.

That is all I have to say on the matter.

I don't necessarily find this scummy as you do justify your reasoning with saying that it's for end game. If they both are scum, then congrats to you, as I just don't see it.

It means I'm back to my theory that since I find nobody suspicious, it must be Seol.

I'm certainly not going to be falling all over myself to lynch on the basis of that alone.

My new theory is that Adele, Seol and Aelyn are all the same person, or all multiple aspects of Rainbow Brite's personality disorder.

Ok, you just said that I twisted your words, when my explanation is pretty damn similar to that of which is underlined above.

No way. Not deathsquiggle. No way in this world is deathsquiggle mafia.

I don't care how much you think you trust someone .. this just isn't something that you say unless you are masoned with someone and know you're alliance. If ~ds~

is

mafia, then I guess I can say 'I told you so', eh?

I personally think all of the accusations leveled against ds are the product of misinterpretation of his over-zealousness, or manipulation of his personality to get an easy lynch.

I just wish I could spot who of you was doing which of these.

As for my vote on Seol - don't get the impression that I'm completely and unwaveringly adamant about lynching him. My vote was turned into a huge big deal by others, but to me I just think that he's the current most suspicious. This isn't a vendetta or anything!

But he's certainly a mile more suspicious to me than deathsquiggle.

A mile more huh? The only thing you've got for your offense towards Seol is that his play style seems off, he misrepresented something you wrote earlier, and that he isn't acting suspicious .. Only one of these reasons I actually could agree with voting for.

As for me jumping the bandwagon, I did say that depending on your answer I may switch my vote. Plus, if I wanted to be on an easier lynch, I would have stayed with ~ds~ as he already had three votes, while I believe you only had 1 ... Which I correct myself in seeing that you have two ..

Unvote: Dybeck

Quidgy has a vote on you, and before you suddenly get quick lynch, I want to make sure that's where he wishes to leave his vote.

[NanookTheWolf]

So, you're voting for me based solely on my playing style .. I'll have to keep that in mind. Since I know where you stand, back to

Vote: Dybeck

I can't believe that I have 3 votes .. Well, if you want a claim, all you're going to get out of me is TOWNIE.

[NanookTheWolf]

I know that this may come out scummy, considering the above vote count, but I'm willing to support the lynch of either Dybeck or ~ds~ .. Although I strongly oppose that of myself.

[NanookTheWolf]

What do you mean show you guys a reason? I think that I've been pretty damn helpful to this game, of course I doubt that ~ds~ and dybeck feel that way as they are the two people that I've felt strongly against ...

As for my comment about supporting either of the two other bandwagons, I just wanted to make sure that where I stood was still known, I wouldn't support just any bandwagon, just those that I feel are scummy.

Funny how ~ds~ suddenly has something to say, huh?

I don't know what you all want me to say here, I mean I've been active, and I've played aggressively sure, but if you knew me, you'd also know that this is how I usually play the game .. Not so much in larger games, as they take more thinking, but in newbies 90% of the time this is my style and obviously I'm not lying about that as someone else has already made the remark.

[NanookTheWolf]

Strange how I come ino the game as soon as anyone asks where I am. Heh. Oh well.

As I said earlier, Nanook was looking suss to me.

I understand he is generally an aggresive player

, but that doesn't sit well with me. He jumps about practically screaming for a bandwagon, and that's just not cricket

unvote, vote nanook

.

As for why I am not posting more, I am very busy as of late. I'd like to stay in the game but I understand if you would like me replaced.

I wouldn't have had to use "I always play like this" as a defense, if it wasn't presented to me in the first place ~ds~.

[NanookTheWolf]

I'm sorry, but if someone is going to vote for me based on aggressive behaviour, which they know I usually play that way, then yes I am going to defend myself against it.

You know for two players who haven't had a whole lot to say in this game (~ds~, Qb), You both suddenly have come out of your shell .. and both have some aggression yourselves.

I almost hope that you guys lynch me, I mean hopefully it will answer some questions for the town and PROVE that I'm innocent and that something is up with ~ds~, and dybeck.

[NanookTheWolf]

If this is your usual style, is it often successful? If not, why not consider changing? Seriously, I've been updating my records, and you're both very high on aggression and low on support for other players. Is it that you can only see the bad, or that you think it's a higher priority to just go ahead and lynch?

If this is my play style .. I can't even really define that I have a particular playing style, even though I did state earlier that I normally do play aggressively. I think that when I get into the heat of a game, you're right, I do stand out as aggressive, and no that isn't going to change. If you don't think that my tactics are successful, then don't follow them, they have been good to me throughout the 2 years I've been on the boards.

If you think that I am the only player who plays with abrupt techniques then wait til you meet some others. Some of our best players on these boards play with much aggression and are good at it, if I'm not, well there is nothing I can do about that, cause you can't just change the way you play from my point of view.

I'm not even going to bother arguing about the bandwagon bit, as all the evidence is there. Just check to vote counts and you'll see exactly how I've voted compared to others. You guys keep saying that I'm jumping, but I'd beg to differ. I mean I've been on a total of 2 actual 'bandwagons' not counting my initial random vote.

I don't understand what you mean in the above quote adele when you say that I'm low on support for other players .. what do you mean by that? Is it that I don't point out others that I "trust" in a game, cause I hate to tell you something, but this is a game of mafia, and you're right, I don't believe everything that I hear .. but I will argue my case especially when I find it to be a strong one.

[NanookTheWolf]

Ok, so yeah .. what Adele did yesterday definately warrants some discussion ..

I'm still suspicious of ~ds~, and I apologize for the dybeck thing, but if the mod didn't list him as town, I'd still think he was scum based on his play. None the less, I'm a little weary of Seol, but I can't use the excuse of him being good at being scum a warranted reason to vote for him, so I won't use that. If I find something else appealing maybe, but nothing has really shown thus far.

Quidgy has been pretty quiet, and lurking isn't a scum tell any more so then a townie one in my book to tell the truth except when it actually does seem deliberate when players are avoiding the arguments taking place.

I'm at a loss right now, as I feel almost betrayed by the mod for Dybeck being innocent, so without more discussion, I'd vote ~ds~/Adele .. Let's see if more talking can persuade me otherwise.

[NanookTheWolf]

At this stage in the game, I would be weary of even listening to a cop/doc claim in all honesty.

[NanookTheWolf]

So Dybeck was right about Seol, and I about ~ds~ .. Damn!

[NanookTheWolf]

Oh! It was Seol!

What a freakin surprise

My I-told-you-so-ability is somewhat crushed by the fact that I was ~ds~'s biggest defender

I was just going to say that I wouldn't gloat too much if I were you ..

[NanookTheWolf]

Seol, I didn't think that anyone would put out a vote so early, and since someone did it after I posted, and before the game ended .. I had no way to yell at him.