Newbie 1117(Town Wins)

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/confirm

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1. This is my first game; am I supposed to make a judgement based off what I Imagine the roles to be like?
2. Take the treats. All in good time, when it comes to the money, I guess. And plus, nothing feels like it's worth it when it comes to easily.

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Aanyways, I've gone through the 3 pages.
Answers to whatever questions I remember seeing:
This isn't the first time I've ever played mafia, though this is the first time I've played at a dedicated mafia site. So I have some idea as to what I should be doing, but all those crappy abbreviations or whatnot are causing some annoyance.

By the way, what the hell is a 'Blue'?

Obviously, Random and BB are attracting the most attention here.

Random for making a pretty solid case, then dropping it. This is really, really weird, and though I can accept your explanation of wanting to relive some pressure, it feels off. Switching is quite scummy as you created a convincing image as a townie and then threw in a random vote into the mix to confuse everyone mroe. As for pushing hard, I see no problems with that because I'm pretty prone to jumping the gun myself if I think I've gotten onto something; and then the submit button's already been hit and then I realise the lack of thinking that went into my posts or whatnot.

BB's stance (as I see it) on lynches seems to be on a defensive position, and prefers to take safer and more conservative routes of choice. However, wheter or not he is mafia this is definitely not helpful for townie, as all Mafia needs to win is for townie to do nothing with their votes. Still, I guess this could kinda be attributed to not reading the rules.

As for the other guys posting, I have no idea. They aren't showing very much of themselves.

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Thanks Toasty and Bv. I've got the Abbreviations covered; it's just annoying to keep looking on the wiki for them.
And it looks like the only one who has yet to post is Quackerz.

and for me, Random guy's consistant contribution never left him on the same level as BB to begin with. All BB's doing is getting super defensive around everyone's comments and questions, and not answering some of them. I dunno what your alignment is, but you seriously are making things worse.

Just calm down and explain, or take a stand like Random.

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Oh Lord, going through, going through these 5 pages gives practically nothing new. The only people who've really posted, and thus by extension revealed quite a bit about themselves or their possible roles are Random and BB, and as a result they've also fallen under the most suspicion; everyone else is unreadable.

Anyway, these are just some random lines I've picked up on by others which stood out to me. They aren't FOS's, just to try and keep the discussion going.

How do you think those questions will help determine other players' alignments?

First person to object to Random's Q's, has been glossed over for RedCobalt's and BB's objections. Just sayin, if you're going to look at an unwillingness to reply to questions posed, at least look at it evenly.

It's just different, I'll go with it, but don't expect me to lead any lynches d1.
Either way, had I said "I refuse to answer these questions" or the what I did say, the disagreement with the questions would seem scummy.
Gonna wait for more posts. Don't hammer on me if it comes to it.
I'm not going to sheep and say that something is a great idea if I have issues with it.
I mentioned the not hammeran because I didn't want to die with my song unsung.

Again, this crapload of stuff is due to BB's consistent posting.

It shows us an obsession against SEEMING like scum. As a VT I can't see what BB has to fear about looking scummy is; unless you think that either your powers of deduction or your role is valueble to the townies, I don't personally see any real problem with dying; it's part of the game and allows others to move on and pick up deductions from there. Only two situations I see here are that BB's a power role or you're scummy.

Obviously, avoidance of leading lynches, avoidance of 'sheeping' or bandwagoning, afraid of hammering, whatever. You say that Random's scum reads on you are bogus and you say he jumps on every little thing you say, but these little things kinda build up to big things when you're this paranoid about being lynched.

Random, started scummy, but he has over the posts, kinda like showed me that he is to clean to be scum, he is willing to open up and explain his ideas without holding anything back. I still kinda think your "null"
...
Because , i feel that your the most ... strangest !

I don't really have problems with the logic you use here like Toasty does, despite contradiction yourself. I mean, reads are often confusing and muddled up anyway. But what I cannot forgive is that if you have a muddled or confused read, in this situation you would hold off for more posts, rather than push in a random direction or gut feeling, especially as you seem to have some hard evidence on Random, and feel that you have something to go on. Rather, you revert to some basic hunch, and vote BB. It feels counter productive. BB has enough pressure already from people voting on him, pressuring him more probably won't make him spill more, unless he happens to get to L-1. I think that your lead on Random would probably have been more effective, while random has made rather good cases on others and we understand his reasoning style and postition, there haven't really been as many questions posed to him as have been posed to BB.

Anyone who says that they wouldn't manipulate other players is a flat out liar, infact someone is likely already trying, it's a scum tactic and i don't need to do it in this game, that's not to say i've never saw town manipulate people to go for what they believe to be scummy players, but that's not exactly a pro-town way to play.

very few suspicions here, just a question though.

Would you do that^ as in, manipulate us town players in order to go for a lynch you believe to be scummy? Why?

And then on the list, there are these ppl, who I've got no real idea of.
Myself
Quackerz
Bo <-- Anything else is shot; not much point reading until the replacement comes.
Kad
Toast - I am worried, Toast. I kinda agree with Bv that for the sheer volume of posting that you have done, there's much less substance compared to BB. What's going on? Sure, the other guys are lurking and saying nothing, but other than that one post; you're almost as good as lurking. Or am I picking up too much here.

Whatevs. Wish the others would post a little more...

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In reply to my supposed seeming new to this game then understanding it, I have to say that I have played this game before albeit in an informal manner where nobody knew what they were doing, and all townies and mafia, 3rd party, had power roles.

While I can see my mistake, I don't quite see where it seems like I fully understand this game. Also, I don't see how that should affect how you read my alignment.

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@Bv.

I didn't realise that what I was doing is known as rolefishing.

I also didn't realise that it was a scum tell.

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Wouldn't you read DBK's posts anyway to see how much he's said about himself already?

And also, Quackerz amazingly has only 1 post so far.

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@ Toasty: If you think the beginning is BS, then try be like SRG and ask questions, and read the responses of the different players.

@Muffin: So, why are you so keen on defending RC?

[Quote = "Muffin"]Are you suggesting RC is scummy because his reasons for thinking BB is scummy are weak? I personally didn't like RC's vote on BB either, but this didn't come off as scum-looking-for-something-to-call-scummy, I read it as him genuinely thinking BB is scummy.[/Quote]

I read this oppositely; genuinely thinking BB is scummy means that RC would probably have to think things through very carefully; anyone throwing about statements with poor logic is likely to come off as scum trying to confuse the town and fake scumhunting. I dunno, I just think that any arguments could probably be better thought out. And RC hasn't discussed too much, it feels like his participating just for the sake of looking like he's doing something.

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Wait, BB, so your ridding yourself of any responsibility if RC gets lynched and turns out to be townie?

I dunno about you but I tend to read someone's argument, and go back and see if I come to the same conclusion before I do something as important as vote rather than simply wagon, right?

Just some Q's

RC:
In 75, what do you mean by backup plan? I see no correlation between manipulation and the said backup. Just a confusing point I still don't get.
In 149, you say you don't see you being wishy-washy, but aren't you kinda taking both sides of the argument for SRG? Why do you deny this?

Muffin:

It's not as simple as just "agreement".

He's noticing most of the same things I noticed on reading through, and interpreting them the same way I interpreted them. I was able to follow his thought process because it matched mine.

I still don't see how you came to the conclusion: "Since he had the exact same thought process as me, he can't be scum"
Scum can still build a perfectly logical case of mislynch based on errors by a townie and you'd probably be able to follow perfectly and come to the same conclusion (say)

BV also used the exact same thought process to clear Muffin off as town somehwere, I think post 139.

Can you guys please tell me why?

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BB...whatever you do seems to just produce the opposite effect.

Please return to your usual playstyle rather than these one word answers...

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Can people, in their next post, say whether they think Toast is scum/town and why?

Muffin, why do you want to know what they think about a particular player? I have no idea if this is a norm here or whatever, but wouldn't it be advantageous for mafia to know who the townies in general are suspicious of and if that player if not mafia, try and push for a mislynch?

Like, this thing sorta reminds me of my rolefishing, I'm trying to to good but it looks like it might cause more harm.

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Muffin, you're ignoring me.

Also, I really don't see how 'gut' could possibly be as valid as a case built with evidence. The whole point is to use 'gut feeling' or a 'hunch' as a starting point whereby you start to take action, questioning people, and thus scumhunting. And then any accusations which follow should have evidence.

Just because I looked at your posts and randomly said "you look evil to me" and "therefore you are scum" doesn't really make it valid reason for me to be voting for you.

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Oh, ok, muffin. If you put it that way, I guess it makes sense.
But a different question. When you said giving reads is a way of advancing the game, why not just ask for everybody's read on every player in the game?
Also, how do you read toast? What're your hunches which make you want to know how other people are reading him?

I personally read Toast as Townie, while his excessive IIoA is a point of suspicion, he has provided analysis and is keen to follow up those who act indecicively (whether or not this is actually a scum read is another issue) specifically with DBK, RC and BB.

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...I think we just have a very inactive crew.

I still reckon BB's silence as to actual scumhunting is comparable to TT's lack of posting. When you mentioned that he should stop being so concerned about himself, I went to view in Iso. If you look at it, maybe in the first 2 he answers some questions, and the rest of it is essentially him posting about how he shouldn't be hammered and defences, requests for FOS's on him and so on.

I actually see no proactive sort of scumhunting whatsoever.

Also, as more experienced players, I have a question. Would it be wise to push BB to L-1 and force him to claim, or do we wait for some responses in defense to his possible quicklynch?

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Forgot to add that BB is also happy to accept others arguments, etc.

But then again, so is RC and all the other guys who've stopped posting. =S

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...Soo, who're you going to apply those reads to?

You can quote as much as you want from the mafia wiki, but that doesn't really help the discussion at all, and isn't scumhunting either.

Also, the only "aggression" I see is from Muffin, and he's doing hounding whoever he thinks is scum and helping the discussion move forward.

What are your reads on people. Stop telling us you're not sure, if there are suss people, start asking them questions.

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Sigh~

You're trying to say less to have less FOS right?

Might I ask why Kad and RC?

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...................That was a post full of defense. I'm still hoping for some sort of thing akin to analysis here.....

and playing badly is a pretty null read. But i think I'm the newest here??

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Busy right now, exams. Will post on weekend.

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BB, are you saying it doesn't matter if we mislynch?

Mod: I was looking for BBmolla's previous vote (if any) but you only have 8 votes in the previous update

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Whoops, sorry BV. Coulda told me that earlier. Just that in my previous games (elsewhere) , I jumped the gun a bit too quick and ended up screwing myself over, so I'm kinda trying to be conservative here.

Vote: Kad2361

Has not been posting at all, given little to no reasoning or helping with scumhunting; pops in every now and then to avoid looking like lurking and points fingers elsewhere every time, no consistency.

So tell me Kad, what're your reads and why?

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I'm not quite sure whether you were being sarcastic or not, Toasty.

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BV, how would you normally attempt to distinguish Village Idiot from Mafia?

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Kad, maybe before you ask others about their reads how about you tell us some of yours?

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You couldn't put it less plainly. You just contradicted yourself, you said he was a dumb, then scum read? What??

Or am I being an idiot?

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Sorry about inactivity guys, exams over friday.

As for Kad, I'm just waiting for him to at least try to explain himself...like Voided put in #300. Also, he should probably claim anyway because Muffin's probaly gonna switch votes onto him.

I think that in the past few posts BB's case has been getting a lot stronger, he's been fully explaining his thought, and his actions are starting to make a lot more sense. Please. No more one line replies.

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To me, it feels like Voided jumped the gun and maybe he should have waited for Muffin:

What if Muffin changed his mind and Voted for BB?

I dunno, is it only me who is interested in who Muffin would have actually hammered?

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Bah!

Great, I was nightkilled on Night 1 First game ever.
Whatever, Go townie!!

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Whoops, kinda just left after I got nightkilled :s

And sorry for the necro

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Thanks guys for all your responses, what little time I enjoyed alive was pretty good. XD