Mini 2293: Death Note. Postgame!

[Gimli]

hi

[Gimli]

I love enchant's modposts for some reason

he is too cute

[Gimli]

my initial idea for this d1 is:

- do not talk about claims period

- do not hint at any parts of your role

- scumhunt, give it ALL the time we possible have to find scum.

this is a game where town needs to be precise and lock tight. a good misflip ends the game today. a bad gameday can lose us the game just the same.

so take your time find each other do not put people at E-1.

so those are my ideas

[Gimli]

this is a game where town needs to be precise and lock tight. a good misflip ends the game today. a bad gameday can lose us the game just the same.

idk why I said misflip

(I promise I'm town and not wolfslipping)

[Gimli]

and I'm so happy with this mod design by enchant, I feel like I'm in the manga rn lol

[Gimli]

Black, I had a similar read to yours, but mine was that my first read was Lorne is probably not kira for the way he is interacting with the game

maybe I can townread you.

[Gimli]

Black, I had a similar read to yours, but mine was that my first read was Lorne is probably not kira for the way he is interacting with the game

maybe I can townread you.

I don't think I'd be playing any differently if my alignment was different
I can imagine my followers crying if I was Kira and already at L-1 during Day 1 because I did a little trolling

I don't wanna talk about how I think kira is going to try playing this out for obvious reasons but the way you started isn't quite what I imagine.

of course you can be scum but the game winning flip is unlikely to be you IMO. but it's early. it's just an impression.

[Gimli]

I liked a total o 0 kokichi's posts

[Gimli]

who could forget everyone's favorite part of death note, this amazing song

forgot how cool this intro was

[Gimli]

VOTE: kokichi oma

just a bunch of meh

[Gimli]

Well, hello there. This one appears to be late to the big Kira Suspect Convention.
VOTE: Malakittens

I don't think I'd be playing any differently if my alignment was different
I can imagine my followers crying if I was Kira and already at L-1 during Day 1 because I did a little trolling

optimal tbh.

hi HPE looking forward to playing with you again

why are you voting mala? cause she is always scum?

any thoughts on players so far?

[Gimli]

from the people who have posted so far I think koki is the most likely kira as well

I like kawaii's two posts even though they're kinda nothing as well. maybe kawaii would try to appear more townie as scum, especially as Kira, instead of pointing at them and calling them kira.

bit of a stretch IK.

[Gimli]

Just kinda picked someone at random, my experience with scum!Mala was only the one game so this one isn't going so far as to say she's on a roll with getting scum.
Kokichi is ZZZ, this one doesn't think it super trusts Lorne and the skill claim, and Black's pro-active stance is nice to see. Strong opinions on multiple people seems to just not really be my thing this one notices but it'll try and not constantly have lukewarm reads on most people this time around.

you mean you think kokichi is boring? does that mean anything alignment-wise for him in your opinion?

[Gimli]

yeah but he is quoting a very scummy post by kokichi and calling him kira for it, it's not really random, there's a read on a player here. I think maybe as scum kawaii would be more elaborate, and IDK if kira is condidently doing anything tbh. if this is a chess game, kira is the scum's king. IDK if it plays too loosey goosey but ofc kira might do that if we start just reading people as not kira for playing loose.

I don't think it's kawaii anyway.

[Gimli]

I guess I kind of thought it wasn't serious but it could be

well I'm taking it at face value. I do scumread kokichi, maybe rather strongly given how little evidence I have rn, and I find that post to be quite reminiscent of kokichi's scum game in ab:loaf. does a push, then tries to buddy up when he starts getting heat, and the backtrack doesn't feel like a normal solvey townie thought to have. 'you voted me back so you're more likely town' is a tired approach to mafia, I'm very likely omgusing people as scum anyway so it doesn't work, and I'm not voting koki cause he voted me, I'm voting him cause of all his posting not ringing townie to me and I think he knows that.

so to see that someone else read that post and thought it was scummy, I'm satisfied with it.

[Gimli]

The game you're referring to, I vote TL and pushed him all of day 1. Never tried to buddy him as well. I was the MAIN factor as to why TL was the day 1 vote.

more importantly than me being wrong about your behaviour in that game, is how can you possibly townread me for 'voting you back' and how could you phrase that as your vote being some sort of reaction test. I don't see the townhunting in this? also in ab:loaf at least I voted you first.

you did the same kind of superficial fake solving reasoning with STD. 'i thought you were scummy the other game so maybe now you're town' is another example of you having tired reads in page 2-3 or whatever. that's why HPE thinks your posts are boring.

I think these two posts are particularly scummy, just so we're clear:

Wait, you're right.



You did the same thing there and you were town and I tunneled you all game. Also the other game I thought you were town you were scum now that I think about it.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: kokichi oma

just a bunch of meh

In the 2 games I've played with you, every time I voted you, you voted me back. You were town those games so I wanted to see if you would do the same here. Good work

[Gimli]

okay so we're both using wrong meta to identify things. to me the important thing is that I don't believe you have a townhunting attitude wrt me and STD. but if I'm wrong, maybe in time I'll find you in this game. I don't expect you to townread me for voting you, and I don't expect you to townread STD for posting a jokey entrance just because he did the same thing in haunted village.

[Gimli]

well I beat you and your team regardless

but maybe I am hyper focused.

[Gimli]

vanderscamp is the towniest player I think. lorne trolled a bit too much to be kira. but the one player with nearly no kira equity is hopefully meg. cause of that thing meg posted. I don't really wanna talk about it too much, but I feel that meg might have openclaimed kira alignment, and it's still not a good flip because we should be focused solely on kira hunting.

[Gimli]

they won't flip though. we shouldn't be hunting for followers. we should be using the followers to get to kira.

[Gimli]

I think I wanna watch death note again now

[Gimli]

let's say we follow a plan that kills indiscriminately between kira and followers.

say we use that plan to get 'wolfy people' and people who are openly talking to kira in thread like meg

say we kill them and the game doesn't end

the problem we have is that we don't know what we killed. we might have killed a townie instead. we need some sort of strong evidence to kill based off things that aren't specifically kira hunting, which is hunting for a mastermind serial killer, and normal scumhunting tools might as well be a bunch of ass. so we need to kill off based on a 'could this player easily be kira?' type of mindset first. if we get followers, that's good. but it should be secundary and accidental when we do it imo.

[Gimli]

VOTE: malakittens

[Gimli]

There's important thing i cut out of rules and just noticed.

All dead players flip without revealing any information. I am returning this back in "Setup" section.

here, lorne. enchant just decided to make things worse for us.

[Gimli]

there's one way we can learn if the followers are dead:

[Gimli]

Hiding. If both your Followers are dead and you used ability Assasinate already, mod will warn you about this and unlock this ability. At day, you can lose Death Note and memories permanently, becoming innocent for "Brainstorm" of Detective and unable to use "Write". Criminals will stop dying (message "Criminals in prison not dying anymore" will be posted publically), so everyone will realise you used this ability. This action can't be reversed.

[Gimli]

starting to have doubts on kokichi

gimli, why malakittens?

I don't know if keeping the pressure on kokichi is going to help.

I have you lorne kawai black vander HPE and ofc meg as not kira or either way not good d1 wagon

so I think (mala, koki) is where things can be since I'm kinda nullscum read on mala's entrance and talking to enchant instead of talking to people

and I have a read on mala playing traitor that would suit an x role but not a y role. I'll talk about this later.

[Gimli]

I didn't mean that enchant is not people lol I meant like, she came here and talked to the mod and not the players

[Gimli]

I love the setup, no complaints here. this is entirely playable imo.

[Gimli]

I don't like when there's a random 3p in game cause it's ???????????

here there's a bunch of mechanics and how people have to interact with each other given the roles they have, that make it interesting to investigate. I'm rly rly happy with this setup lol but I get the no flip thing can be annoying.

[Gimli]

@black: this read

Kira followers fake claiming is actually genius the more I think about it. The followers don't know each other and Kira doesn't know them, but they all know what skills aren't in play. Claiming a skill that isn't in play let's your two buddies know you're with them

Assuming I'm right about the rules, strong read from this that Black is not a follower

the man is paying attention, and while kira is follower hunting, they might not do so in public like this.

vander gets not kira points and not follower points for this post, imo.

[Gimli]

what I said re: followers is that "we need some sort of strong evidence to kill based off things that aren't specifically kira hunting". if we have a sure read on someone as being with kira, we'll kill them. but kira hunting comes first.

[Gimli]

he also likes my posts

[Gimli]

well I suppose you're the towniest now black

[Gimli]

so kawaii is a follower?

[Gimli]

they literally put 'i'm death, straight up' in the signature

is this softing to kira

[Gimli]

(koki, mala, kawaii) imo

[Gimli]

they literally put 'i'm death, straight up' in the signature

is this softing to kira

Pretty sure signature stuff is against rules so I don't think that's the case.

How do you know it's not the case? It can totally be the case. All I know is that I wasn't seeing this signature, then I refreshed it and there it was. Even if we exclude the signature, the posting is making sense as signaling just the same. It's weird cryptic phrasing.

Idk why you're so quick to disregard that as nothing.

[Gimli]

Lmao

[Gimli]

It's whatever but the whole thing feels like signaling to me

We can resume our other conversations now

[Gimli]

Why is he quoting that in this thread if it's unrelated to this game?

[Gimli]

I don't wanna keep talking about it but if we want to flip a follower the best case I see atm is kawaii.

What meg did, I clearly see the town motivation for it, so I'm not bothered with it not do I think is too likely to be a scum.

[Gimli]

I'm voting malakittens

[Gimli]

I'm voting malakittens

Did my thoughts about Vander change your opinion of him at all?

I could've explained my Vander townread a lot better than I did, and I think your case is very good and makes a lot of sense, but I also think Vander's posts only feel scummy when taken out of context, I think they're all towny entrances in real time.

Jsyk I read your case and am taking it into consideration. You're my strongest townread at this point in time.

[Gimli]

there has never been setup spec because the setup is open

[Gimli]

the only questions related with the setup that I think are justifiable for us to go through d1 is 1) how to kira hunt/who to kill etc that we already went through; and 2) specific talk about skills. I don't think we should talk about skills because the kira followers can coordinate with kira. unless we wanna go full claiming abilities and do something else to break night actions.

I don't wanna talk about 2), I normally leave it with the smarter players, so I was expecting kokichi to help with that sort of buisness but he seems to be scum unfortunately.

[Gimli]

let me read and figure this out

I'm not completely against it because we're dealing with flipless.

[Gimli]

mala: wake me up when mech talk is over

us: *mech talk intensifies*

[Gimli]

after reading I think it's a bad idea

a lot of these roles are gonna be useful for players when kira and followers don't know we have them. we can absolutely screw with scum here with some of that stuff. but I think it's gonna be more of a player specific thing where each of us uses our abilities well at night and knows when to claim it. that's it. but if someone else has an idea I'm all ears.

[Gimli]

I think Gimli is pretty clearly the most town person in the game atm

[Gimli]

I think you're town meg but I don't wanna stop kira from giving you their death note

so like I'll keep you in a idk pool to help you achieve your dreams

[Gimli]

I used my special ability

[Gimli]

I don't see where meg jumped on any of my reads. he didn't say why he voted you, kokichi. can you walk me through your meg read?

[Gimli]

yeah but they didn't respond to you, you can't just say it was my case that did anything to that vote

in other news I think I know your main now and it's cute and idk what to do with that. do I tilt you in many directions until you become scummy, do I let you cook, idrk.

I think I'll let you cook

[Gimli]

I think you're more likely to try tiring me out with gotchas as scum, koki

[Gimli]

I really like HPE's posts, the push on kokichi, and all its leans. I'm calling a towncore of black/vander/HPE aorn, with a townread on Azu. I agree with leaving lorne and STD at null atm. I think flipping inside of (koki, mala, kawaii) is good for d1.

[Gimli]

The reason I like playing with Gimli is he is one of the few people who can post as much as I can in a game. I enjoy this banter. Since I always enjoy making the game about me.

I like playing with you and enjoy the banter just the same, koki

too bad you keep randing mafia when I'm town. I wish we could play this the other way around to see if you're as good at catching me as you're good at making me townread you.

[Gimli]

VOTE: kokichi

E-2

[Gimli]

HPE, I'm afraid kokichi is a good enough player to escape from a tough situation and sway us into doing something horrible instead. I agree we should talk it out as much as possible, but koki has a surprising range of manipulation methods as scum, especially as early as d1. I'm voting there because I feel good about it. if people quick hammer we can figure out what it means later.

[Gimli]

sorry meg but that's really bad idea

[Gimli]

at night we have kira assassinating

scum getting our names

all sorts of scum advancing wincon shit

it's bad to give them night without trying to kill them first.

[Gimli]

detective has a dayvig

[Gimli]

if we're running up the detective on day 1 that's horrible ofc but the way to play is the detective claims, we don't roflkill them, and then they figure out who they're gonna accuse of being kira and dying with them.

then we'll have d2 to find kira.

if someone claims detective they're most likely lying

[Gimli]

light yagami is an extremely motivated character

[Gimli]

those townreads feel good man

[Gimli]

If this is Lorne trying to get Kira Gimli to know he's a follower I'm going to lmao

I know he is joking, but that was an upsetting post because if we troll with kira softs then that opens up thread dynamics where kira followers can signal to kira.

[Gimli]

I mean I'm not saying 'don't make jokes about being kira or calling people kira' i'm saying what the consequence is

[Gimli]

the problem with kokichi being kira is that everybody is scumreading kokichi

[Gimli]

UNVOTE: wanna think about it some more

if koki is scum, that's exactly the type of manipulation tactics I expect him to use and make people feel insecure and lots of other bad things. he has no reason to bring up past games w/ you just to complain about your reads in that game.

he is also doing that w/ me, saying I'm only scumreading him because I'm scared of being fooled. it's simply undermining our leans with things that are not this game. in this game, kokichi is scummy, and doing these things fits with his scum range. I expect town koki to try and talk on the level of where the conversations are instead of doing this.

[Gimli]

the problem with kokichi being kira is that everybody is scumreading kokichi

If you're town, I'm gonna need your town game here. You don't think HPE's line of reasoning was bad? What am I missing?

I don't, I think your defense to me was scummy. maybe we're just not finding each other in this game but I agree with HPE's read anyway and I think it is a townie even if you're also a townie.

speaking of reads we don't agree with, you're TOWNREADING kawaii? walk me through that read please.

[Gimli]

I think kawaii's almost always kira or follower in this game

[Gimli]

I think kawaii's almost always kira or follower in this game

That's nice

why are you townreading kawaii?

[Gimli]

Why do you like kawaiis posts I feel like it's possible kira would have the most confidence to come into the thread and randomly call other people kira

I'd have the least confidence as Kira, self-conscious in every post, I'd fade away in the bg and be a non-entity

do we think kawaii has faded away and became a non-entity?

[Gimli]

in other news I think I know your main now

Is this the reason you're acting unreasonable toward me? Because I can assure you, I don't think you do.

your meg thing was wild
your townlean on me at the beginning of the game was strange, same to your STD early read
you're being manipulative and degrading people to fade scumreads on you (said STD hammered obvtown, said I'm just acting paranoid cause other game)
IDK how you're townreading kawaii
I have seen you take many stances but I'm not seeing you solve

I'm acting more confidently abt you because the things you're doing - almost everything you're doing - are things I'm scumreading. the only person who isn't scumreading you atm is malakittens, and that's because she likes your kokichi roleplay apparently.

[Gimli]

VOTE: kawaii kame

[Gimli]

We are on evens, I'm partial to a day 1 no lim here tbh.

Terrible idea. As a wise person once said. "Scum mindset"

Lich was never wrong

[Gimli]

Considering the fact that me and your posting has taken up about over 50% of the post and the most of that me trying to defend myself instead of being given the opportunity to find scum, is probably the reason. I'm not being manipulative, I'm stating my reason for why I feel that way. Would you rather me make up a reason?

well I think you're being a distraction as well.

you want me to explain with a fine comb why I'm townreading HPE; you want HPE to explain why its townreading Meg; while you're townreading Kawaii and you're not explaining why. is it associative?

[Gimli]

VOTE: kawaii kame

If I was follower, do you think I would openly Town read kawaii like this? Assuming that you think hes Kira. You either underestimate me or I underestimate you. Not trying to be manipulative but I don't see the switch to Kawaii understanding here. Unless it's independent to me then thats fine.

I'm voting kawaii cause he said he'd fade as kira and he faded and then confirmed it.

are you going to defend kawaii? towncase him then. I don't wanna kill town, do I. right now I don't know what to make of your townread.

[Gimli]

I don't want to hang Kokichi anymore

who do you want to hang?

and why did that warrant a townread? (if that's a townread)

[Gimli]

I think kokichi is probably a townie given recent interactions, and I find the way lorne malvo is interacting with the game to be very political. I'd be interested to see him solving in a way that's more disruptive and not going with whatever seems to be a strong thread narrative. I wanna know that Lorne is at least trying to solve.

me thinking koki is town is something I have to take with a grain of salt because kokichi will definitely win me over in real time interactions regardless of his alignment. but once I re-read the daystarting posts that felt scummy I don't really feel that way anymore about them.

I do want to slam dunk on kawaii, though, so talking about why you think kawaii is town would be really good.

self-conscious in every post, I'd fade away in the bg and be a non-entity

do we think kawaii has faded away and became a non-entity?

I do
[/quote]

do you see this?

[Gimli]

argh I botched my quote but you get it

[Gimli]

we can just kill kawaii today unless kokichi has a tremendously good reason to think he is town

[Gimli]

At this point a daykill on Kawaii doesn't feel necessary. Sinking into background is feeling more and more like a scum thing to this one but even if we condemn them in a day or two it honestly doesn't think it would be worth it especially for the detective reveal. And then there's the aspect of when you wait multiple days, the gamestate and what we know and who's scummiest will change. Condemn now = Total gamble, condemn later = We don't even know if we'd want to at that point. Thus if you want Kawaii dead NOW, vote them. Though again this one prefers dragging the game days out for max discussion and analysis.

I didn't understand anything you wrote.

we are eliminating kawaii cause it's the most likely kira rn and your defense is word salad which is quite frankly very alarming.

the more people write weird things about kawaii and softdefend them with crappy or obscure reasoning, the more I wanna just go ahead and get that elimination through. I think I'm convinced we need to flip kawaii.

[Gimli]

Do we really think kawaii is Kira because they said they would act a certain way as Kira and then acted that way? That just doesn't seem like something scum would do. To assume Kawaii is Kira we have to assume they would just out themselves D1 for no reason

Also Kokichi brought up a Gimli meta analysis that everyone just overlooked. Gimli is definitely acting more confident in his reads this game and it's not just exclusive to the Kokichi read. All of his reads have felt definitive. Just feels weird

I think the most likely kira is kawaii cause he is scummy as all fuck to the point where I don't even. IDK what else to do with d1, my mind is all set with this (non)flip.

if you think I'm scummy for being more confident of things then that's okay.

[Gimli]

ah

no of course he didn't mean out the detective. we can just vote out a scummy slot. we don't need to out the detective to do that.

[Gimli]

Gimli can you scum case Kawaii?

sure.

let's remove the fact that it did absolutely nothing, not a single read, not a single game advancing question or statement and it just went full scum potato lurk mode. then there's this idea, that maybe a new player like kawaii (who I assume is a new player) will be actually too self conscious and frozen up if he randed fucking kira in a game like this, and would just truthtell ITT and fade to the background and become a non entity:

Why do you like kawaiis posts I feel like it's possible kira would have the most confidence to come into the thread and randomly call other people kira

I'd have the least confidence as Kira, self-conscious in every post, I'd fade away in the bg and be a non-entity

Why do you like kawaiis posts I feel like it's possible kira would have the most confidence to come into the thread and randomly call other people kira

I'd have the least confidence as Kira, self-conscious in every post, I'd fade away in the bg and be a non-entity

do we think kawaii has faded away and became a non-entity?

I do

there's nothing more self conscious than this last post. IDK what else do you need. maybe kawaii is kira, maybe kawaii is a follower, but I'm betting the bank on this being a wolf regardless. it's a wolf. it's not knowing what to do.

if the defense is 'surely he wouldn't play this poorly' then IDK what else you want as a case. this is the most blatant lolkira we have. if it's a dead end it's fine cause it's just d1. but I say we roll with the truthtelling and flip it and see what happens.

worst case scenario we lost the kawaii slot playing like absolute potatoes.

[Gimli]

ah

no of course he didn't mean out the detective. we can just vote out a scummy slot. we don't need to out the detective to do that.

Then follow your heart's desire as you please. The longer it takes Kawaii (AND Mala) to resurface, the more this one grows wary of them.

I didn't understand that post of yours because I didn't see you were interpreting daykill as the investigative outing themselves.

I'm also wary of mala but I think what she posted was okay.

[Gimli]

you pointed at koki and called him kira, you didn't elaborate. I was projecting my own thoughts into your post clearly.

[Gimli]

kame is kira the game is over

lets rerand

[Gimli]

if anyone needs further convincing lmk

gd morning team

[Gimli]

I know you like spending time in thread with me lorne, but we can play other games too

[Gimli]

I just don't buy it was a gambit by kame, I think he has to say something to defend himself now anyway so saying that is as good as anything. I think it's relevant that kokichi/HPE/black all defended kawaii to some extent (with black ignoring kawaii and pushing me for confidence) so we have a completely fitting story to push throguh and figure out. koki wasn't working for kira cause everyone was fine hanging him. with kawaii there's more resistance with much less reasoning to be townreading. I started getting heat by black after I was set with the kawaii flip and whatnot.

I also think it's funny that koki is saying people are sheeping me when everyone that's scumreading kawaii is doing so independently, clearly. it's just a blatantly scum play so far and defending it from the angle of 'gimli is sus' doesn't feel right.

[Gimli]

'koki wasn't working AS being kira'

[Gimli]

meta: kawaii just finished a newbie and posted like a hydra of grandpamo and shirou

viewtopic.php?sid=&f=11&t=90503&user_select%5B%5D=36997

kawaii's experience with mafia is:

I've played in school/in forum

IDK I feel weird hard casing the guy this hard, I'm not saying I KNOW THIS IS 10000% MAFIA but dudes what more do we need?

[Gimli]

this is all grasping at straws in a very blatant manner, which points unequivocally towards you being kawaii's follower. it's a bad spot having to defend such overtly wolfy play, and you're outing yourself, imo, by doing so.

[Gimli]

if i'm detective or assistant then I still want props from getting the rest of it right:

1. Detective - mala
2. Assistant - STD
3. Taskforce Member - vander
4. Taskforce Member - meg
5. Taskforce Member - gimli
6. Taskforce Member - lorne
7. Taskforce Member - HPE
8. Kira Follower - black
9. Kira Follower - kokichi
10. Kira - kawaii

[Gimli]

kokichi if you have a green role can you stop scumsiding please?

[Gimli]

I am going to give the entirety of my strength to flipping kawaii

[Gimli]

I have one goal for this gameday and it's putting six votes on kawaii.

[Gimli]

they're not using any abilities tonight if we flip kira

[Gimli]

you're putting a smile on my face kawaii, your posts are very funny.

I still think you're just kira, sorry.

[Gimli]

I still want to see more from Mala. But, Gimli what would you say of a HPE vote off today?

I can't, I'm too concerned with kawaii now and I'm not voting elsewhere.

[Gimli]

meta case against me is that I'm too confident. we're playing a 10er with a majority of players I played with before, and I think kira is especifically a newbie who couldn't sustain the weight of their role in game, so I happen to think the game is easy.

I'm not outing the detective nor the assistant. I'm posting bragging rights on a possible scenario. you're the ones making a big deal out of it.

[Gimli]

cry abt it

[Gimli]

yes thats the worldview you're supposed to sell

you're playing well from a difficult position

[Gimli]

vander is my kira and im shoving on everyone and endgaming, thats why im confident

there I said it first and spoiled your fake read

[Gimli]

I was one of your strongest TRs. Wild how me saying I don't think kawaii is Kira can completely flip that. Your tunnel is really long with no end in sight

yes it only stops when I flip it, so you will have to kill me for it which is why my wagon composition is literally kira and followers.

why would I think it's anything else man

I'm sorry if I'm wrong

[Gimli]

if youre town stop defending scummy af slot

[Gimli]

lets talk this through then. why do you think kawaii is towny?

[Gimli]

I asked you something else. why is kawaii a townie?

[Gimli]

then please vote him with me because I think he is kira

[Gimli]

HPE, to kawaii's post you think is excellent, let me respond to that then:

Why pursue me if you feel weird casing me? What more do we need? We need more than this, Idek the people you listing, circumstantial evidence, why does me playing like people Idek implicate me? Like wtf? I'm in confusion, this case you have against me is completely circumstantial, I say I'd fade away and become a non-entity as Kira and I happen to fade away and become a non entity, meaning I'm Kira? Me playing the way I say I'd play Kira only means I

might

be Kira, me being away is not evidence I am Kira, it only increases the likelihood of me being Kira. How tf does me saying I'd fade away and become a non-entity as Kira, only to fade away and become a non-entity help me

fade away and become a non-entity

, you noticed me being gone because of what I said, me drawing attention to myself like that achieves the opposite of me fading away, in fact it made me an entity by causing me to come back when you called out my red-herring, I like the call out, showed you had a town mindset, but now you're being overconfident tunneling me on pure circumstance, if I assume good faith. If I assume bad faith, you're Kira pursuing the easiest kill without having to write my name in the Death Note

the newbie that just ended had kawaii making some 400 posts. while that's not enough to scumcase someone, its clear from kawaii's posts that they're having a hard time producing content. other than pushing me and defending themselves, I wouldn't say kawaii done anything this game, and that contradicts with their freshest town meta of being involved.

kawaii said that was all theatre to be read as kira so they could farm reactions from it. I simply do not believe that to be the case, I think kawaii wasn't looking scummy on purpose.

kawaii isn't scum just because he did exactly what he said he'd do as kira; but because the meta read and the truthtelling are accurate descriptions of someone picking up this role and being incredibly self conscious about it.

I started to push kawaii, and suddenly people started defending him. when I was pushing kokichi, there was no resistance from any parts of the thread. when I started pushing kawaii, I started to become a wagon myself. that increases the likelihood that I'm onto something and that's why I'm pursuing this elimination, to the very end and even if I annoy enough townies to be flipped for it.

[Gimli]

As to why I'm disengaged with this game, this is intentional, I want people to think I'm Kira to see how Kira/followers react to me, though I was tempted to ask why Black is 0% follower with Gimli being 100% town, I held back to attempt this gambit

It's possible followers exist in Kokichi/HPE, though I'm not finding saying I should not be eliminated to be sufficient evidence, it doesn't make total sense to defend me as followers if their genuine belief is I am town

HPE do you seriously believe what kawaii is saying here?

[Gimli]

I got your back Gimli
VOTE: KawaiiKame

nice

[Gimli]

He will probably go like usual though. His slot hasn't really done anything this game

so just like kawaii?

[Gimli]

yes its just kawaii

[Gimli]

yes its just kawaii

Towncase Lorne for me

my lorne read: playing too political, could be scum. could even be kira! but I'm killing kawaii, because kawaii has associatives that work.

its a never changing read. if im wrong on kawaii we can all kill lorne tomorrow. today I'm never moving my vote.

[Gimli]

we will know if the game ends

[Gimli]

if kawaii is a follower thats meaningless to lorne's alignment, he can still be kira

[Gimli]

sure

[Gimli]

dont let lorne malvo sway us from killing kawaii

[Gimli]

@Gimli

Why do you think Lorne could be Kira now after posting twice earlier in the game that he's not?

if flipping kawaii doesnt end the game then I'll consider lorne as a possibility

[Gimli]

dont let lorne malvo sway us from killing kawaii

For a moment there I thought you meant that I'm opposing a kawaii hang lmao

no you're just being wolfy lol

but we keepin a tight ship, I'm sure std and mala will join the wagon when they're around

[Gimli]

UNVOTE: Lorne Malvo
Thinking it can semi-safely write off Lorne as just being a goofball townie here now that he's given SOME form of explanation to his actions. Its on the fence about if it wants to slap even a pressure vote onto Gimli because his push is bad but his persistence is intriguing and this one feels like even followers would have more self-preservation than to keep pushing a wagon that is teetering on the edge of backfiring and killing them.

Well even if I'm wrong about Lorne at least I got him to do something

I'm still leaning

Gimli

over

kawaii

but I'm not as sure as I once was

[Gimli]

if i'm detective or assistant then I still want props from getting the rest of it right:

1. Detective - mala
2. Assistant - STD
3. Taskforce Member - vander
4. Taskforce Member - meg
5. Taskforce Member - gimli
6. Taskforce Member - lorne
7. Taskforce Member - HPE
8. Kira Follower - black
9. Kira Follower - kokichi
10. Kira - kawaii

I strongly believe black is not a follower, I think the initial post about not understanding what followers know was genuine.

ur probably right

im mad at myself for not putting HPE there instead of black

[Gimli]

I think we should just stay the course on Kawaii, I ultimately just don't really believe that trying to act scummy was a play.
If it were a play I would have expected some kind of deeper analysis of what reactions Kawaii got from it, but that didn't happen.

agree w this and everything else vander posted rn (including criticism of my bad plays)

[Gimli]

What makes you suddenly think me a follower? Because this one won't vote Kawaii with you?

yeah you're weird about kawaii

[Gimli]

its my undying confidence that kawaii is kira and me adjusting everything else to this worldview

as I said I'll reeval once it flips and the game doesn't end.

[Gimli]

UNVOTE:

I need to think

[Gimli]

'I tried to play like kira and now people want me dead for it' lmao

[Gimli]

BBT needs to update his signature

[Gimli]

then koki comes here hard pressing for us not to kill kawaii and my instant reaction is 'we should just kill kawaii'

[Gimli]

I almost liked those posts though for real

so let's consider when kawaii isn't kira. then hpe/koki/black would probably be townies because who wouldn't take the easy d1 here as kira/follower, right?

we're pointing at STD/lorne/malakittens? if that's the case

I'm keeping vander as a townie in any configuration

[Gimli]

lorne = playing to his charms and being political. could be kira
std = is std. if I can't read him in a normal game then I can't read him in this game.
mala = safe stances. is townreading me, which fits a TMI pov instead of a townie one since she thought I was mafia throughout HMS mutiny game.

[Gimli]

I'm organically townreading meg, vanderscamp and I think I should probably townread black? but idrk if that's smart yet.

[Gimli]

I like his reads on both HPE and black, I felt they made sense from his pov as a townie

[Gimli]

I go to the movies like one time and you guys play the shit out of it

let me refresh my thoughts, let the potato think

[Gimli]

Kawaii...I've been feeling it's Gimli for a long time. Just read my iso if you want to know why

It's not a super strong read but it's the strongest one I have atm

I'm never kira. you can think I'm a follower but I wouldn't play kira like this.

you have to realise that kira is not putting their neck outs for anyone.

[Gimli]

I see possible kira in only a few slots.

kawaii I already said why, but that read grew tired as he started to actually get involved and put lots of thoughts out there. they seem to be coming from a genuine place, so I'm no longer interested in flipping there today. pending me reading all that stuff you guys wrote with attention.

malakittens.

lorne.

std.

those are the people I'm thinking as possible kira.

I still think vander comes from a genuine solvey place.

[Gimli]

You theorize I am the passive/defensive Kira, one who is overwhelmed by the weight of my role, unprepared to be who I am, not ready to be Kira- someone who is completely collapsing in front of your eyes in real time, only responding to defend myself and not deeply analyzing the game to scumhunt

I saw you as an active/offensive Kira, someone who is pinning down the easiest elimination and pursuing it full force based on contradictions, but now that I realize the play you making I do not see this, if you're not Kira, and I'm not Kira, then Kira lies some place in the middle, someone who is active/defensive, passive/offensive, someone who is careful in their thoughts/words, someone who articulates their reasons semi well, someone who is potentially defensive, if not disarming

If we ascribe to this active/defensive theory Kira is among Black/HPE/Kochi
Kochi is naturally disarming/affable, seemingly shifting to any mood at any time adapting to the state of the game we in, fitting into town blending in like a chameleon, I'm always amused by the character Kochi posts I find it funny, the lack of edge I get is a potential danger, you pursued Kochi b4 and like you I'm confused how Kochi is Kira since they feel town

Black feels simultaneously offensive/defensive, pursuing you/Lorne while defending me, I genuinely believe everything Black says is a town mindset, questioning everyone and everything, including me, I like this inquisitive mind a lot, actively engaging with the game with thoughts/feelings I logically/emotionally follow, feel she's pursuing mafia as she sees them

HPE feels chill to me, saying your Kira case against me is flimsy, I do not fail to see I am bias with this, HPE's statement aligns with my pov of not being Kira, HPE simultaneously saying a case exists of me being scumlean while saying my defense is excellent, Ik you think it's not, I want to know why HPE thinks it is, I feel HPE's playstyle suits Kira the most but I don't think HPE is Kira

Vand is on the opposite side going against me, this pursuit feels town with saying I'm awkward/minimal engagement, thoughts flow naturally building a case against me, constantly asking why people think I'm town, I find these significant:

this entire post is very good, but to highlist the parts I enjoy the most: first of all, kawaii understands and acknowledges completely my read on him. I like this, I think it comes from a place of honesty. he then paints me as kira, aggressively pursuing the easy gameday flip. that also makes sense and I can see why some people would want to kill me. he then gives this game a different solve, away from me and him and the wild polarization of possible wagons that I put in front of him. he then analyses different types of players as townreads, and all of the townreads seem to be working just fine.

so I think kawaii is town.

[Gimli]

I almost liked those posts though for real

so let's consider when kawaii isn't kira. then hpe/koki/black would probably be townies because who wouldn't take the easy d1 here as kira/follower, right?

we're pointing at STD/lorne/malakittens? if that's the case

I'm keeping vander as a townie in any configuration

I think mala is a good option out of those.

I'm starting to come around on mala

[Gimli]

i don't think that's a good poe, i'm not kira and i don't think it's mala or lorne tbh

i think that post by kawaii just now is potentially trying to buddy it doesn't actually say much of anything new

VOTE: kawaiikame

this is really scummy

VOTE: malakittens

[Gimli]

hahahah I wanna scream at you black you towny potato

[Gimli]

in other news, I think it's malakittens now

[Gimli]

STD got jumpy and went after kawaii after mala's name started to get noticed

he is protecting her

of course, I knew that already.

[Gimli]

I'm probably going to take more of a backseat this game. It feels like no one is really seeing what I'm seeing in regards to several of my reads so I'm starting to feel self-conscious about how good they actually are. I probably need to reread at some point and get better footing here

I think kawaii's responses have been ok. It seems like they are more determined to contribute and help solve but part of me feels like that might be because they were scumread for not doing that before. Their answer to my question about pretending to be Kira felt genuine

StD posturing to vote for kawaii and then doing it felt opportunistic. StD, question for you. Originally you said you didn't feel like kawaii was solving/hunting. Has this opinion changed in light of kawaii's recent flurry of posts?

Mala feels really lurky but I read that it's a playstyle thing, and other than that her posts feel pretty town to me

Right now I still think it might be Gimli, but I'm just not confident in anything I feel right now and I need to refresh before I feel like I can effectively contribute

agree with all of this

I don't think mala has been too towny, I think she is posting well reasoned safe thoughts. of course she could have a reason to be doing that as town, but I don't see a kira hunting mindset in her posting.

[Gimli]

I think a follower's mindset would be defending kira, not defending necessarily the followers

[Gimli]

she posted zero scumhunting posts

[Gimli]

I think a follower's mindset would be defending kira, not defending necessarily the followers

Followers don't even know who each other are so there's a chance they've scumread each other by now

yes, they could be at each other's throats, unless we wagoned kira already and they had to hardpost in kira's defense. that'll make them obvious.

[Gimli]

yeah I think mala's posts have been pretty bad, I don't like the way she is making way to the kawaii wagon, it feels opportunistic. and these zzzz and .... whatever irony things were things you were townreading her for in HMS mutiny, and while she didn't know the scum she was scum and so had scummy emotions.

[Gimli]

Gimli left his tunnel and is solving the game. Personally I love to see it

I'm still in my tunnel

I don't think the recent Kawaii posts were town, I think it's overcompensating for earlier scumminess.

I think he is playing a hard oddball style this game but I find myself with more reason to townread than to scumread him atm. kinda won me over with his last few posts.

[Gimli]

excellent game btw enchant

this d1 has been amazing

[Gimli]

i've been scum against town mala in the past and have pushed her for what i feel are similar reasons that people are pushing her for.

who do u think is scum pushing mala?

[Gimli]

I'm locktowning kawaii and not looking back

I do think you've been too focused on certain slots while ignoring others like malakittens etc. I dont really think kokichi plays kira like this.

[Gimli]

I don't think kira puts their neck out for you the way you were playing d1. none of the kawaii defenders have much kira equity (koki, black). if any of them is kira, they're happily killing you off and putting it on my tab.

[Gimli]

HPE wasn't defending you

HPE is probably a townie as well fwiw

[Gimli]

HPE wasn't defending you

I feel HPE was defending me implicitly even tho explicity saying they didn't defend me in dismantling being a potential Kira me follower

This is how I read HPE when being pursued by you, why do you feel Kira is malakittens?

posting too 'correctly', afraid of taking hard stances, opportunism around your wagon

[Gimli]

she was trying to find a reasonable position to enter your wagon, she didn't even have it in her to cast a vote I think?

did mala vote anyone? let me check

[Gimli]

yeah she voted STD, who's also a likely kira candidate, in rvs. she is still in her RVS vote after one whole week of mafia.

[Gimli]

yeah she voted STD, who's also a likely kira candidate

Why do you feel STD is a likely Kira candidate besides poe?

playing safe

could be defending mala cause mala signaled to him that she is a follower. could be a follower defending kira!mala

got jumpy when I started to feel like your wagon was bad. was fine laying in the back when I was trying to murder you and koki and black were trying to murder me. which fits the 'scum laying back while town infights' kind of spot.

[Gimli]

get well soon, HPE

[Gimli]

kokichi, wanna do a truce and hang malakittens instead?

[Gimli]

eliminate, not hang. sorry.

[Gimli]

its a circle but it was perfect d1 play from town imo

let's see if we're right

[Gimli]

Ngl

I suck at day 1, but I largely feel like I’m being wagoned because I’m not a huge loud poster. Which I feel like is bullshit and you all should feel bad.

The only player who has played with me numerous times prior is STD. I have played with gimli once.

Those who have a case otherwise “she’s not posting a lot” please quote it, thank you

you're not being wagoned for this reason. but ok I kinda like the tone of these posts, so lemme ask: who you wanna kill today? you're still RVS voting STD. I understand you're busy, but you leave us with little to work with and parse through ty.

[Gimli]

Here’s the thing that’s bothering me re: gimli
If he *thinks* I’m decetive than he shouldn’t be voting me.

That's an incredible point

I was hinting at where kira and followers could be potentially if I was wrong about kawaii/you/koki as the scum team

[Gimli]

the detective and the kira will play similarly

the followers and the assistant will play similarly

I'm not detective hunting

[Gimli]

I just put her there cause std defended her in a premeditaded manner. i wasn't making a detective read, i just put a pair there for flimsy reasoning

[Gimli]

ofc the same types of dynamics occuring between kira and follower will occur between detective and assistant, including wrt pushing people to e-1 and what will each claim and whatnot. when you kira hunt you will eventually push town PRs, there's no way around it.

[Gimli]

you're scumreading me for playing the game imo

[Gimli]

Knowing this don't you think it would be wise to push people for reasons other than how they are playing?

no.

[Gimli]

I just put her there cause std defended her in a premeditaded manner. i wasn't making a detective read, i just put a pair there for flimsy reasoning

That's silly. Assistant might also defend the detective in this way. You're ignoring that when you push

I'm literally acknowledging that? std did what assistant would do to detective. and what follower will do to kira. can you parse the difference? cause I can't mate, unless I'm the assistant or the detective I can't tell the difference.

[Gimli]

okay

[Gimli]

So nothing changed to make you think mala is more likely to be Kira and yet here you are pushing her

Yeah I think it's just Gimli here

I'm townreading kawaii

[Gimli]

what does it mean 'its just gimli'? there are three scums, and you already waffled this answer before because you think I can be either kira or follower, so how come 'its just gimli' is a real thing you're thinking? flipping me ends the game, thats what 'just gimli' means?

[Gimli]

well your kira hunting has been poor, you're playing this like one of your micros and it's not

I'll be V/la for the rest of the week now bye

[Gimli]

hmmm

[Gimli]

idk if your town game is actually this bad

[Gimli]

I want to know Gimli's defense to this, I'm having a hard time believing Gimli is Kira/follower but you have good points giving me 2nd thoughts...

he is scumreading me for playing the game, I don't have much to respond to that post. yes the detective and kira will have similar associatives, but that's not what I'm solely basing any reads of mine on. I'm townreading you and other players who are playing in a way that feels to come from a genuinely solvey place.

[Gimli]

Now I'm thinking we just win if we flip Meg but them being Kira is mainly an associative feeling I have with Gimli being a follower. I'd be down to vote for either of these two today

so now you're thinking like I'm thinking when I try kira hunting

I think that thing meg posted that I'm townreading feels like trying to bait kira into giving the death note to a townie. and I don't think that sort of gambit is something actual kira is gonna think about.

but if you wanna hang meg on associative read, go ahead im not gonna stop u

[Gimli]

@black re: meg, that's reading into it after the fact though

what's more likely, that meg thought that as a townie/follower, or as kira just to get a weird angle in which people think she is unlikely kira? with the possibility of drawing horrible attention to herself and getting hanged over 'you're a follower' type of accusations?

[Gimli]

you're exasperating man

[Gimli]

but, sure, it's okay. I could be meg's follower. it makes sense from your point of view.

out for a few days now hopefully

pedit: I just did, it's a simple thing but you won't acknowledge that I could be townreading her for it. it's fine. you have your point.

[Gimli]

oh my

okay im gonna towncase meg then im gonna bounce and yeah near deadline cause im so scum and not having something irl that will keep me from posting

[Gimli]

what's more likely, that meg thought that as a townie/follower, or as kira just to get a weird angle in which people think she is unlikely kira?

Thought what?

okay this is me towncasing meg. I just skimmed her ISO and I like all her mech ideas, I think they all come from solving and not from being scum and mech talking, they're game advancing and creative ideas that tend to come from town even if they're not all good fmpov.

one of those good smart posts is the 'for kira's eyes only' post. it's a sharp entrance into the game and is trying to advance wincon. you (black) shrug everything off as 'easy risk reward blablabla' because you're not reading things properly, imo.

re-read meg's post. ask yourself if this is something YOU would do as kira. then ask if the majority of players would ever think of doing something like it. are you sure the risk reward isn't here? because I tell you this, there are certainly many ways this could've gone wrong, imo.

meg can be a follower, just openly talking to kira ITT. but she won't be kira. and I think the blatant behaviour seems to come more from town imo.

here is the post so you can re-read it:

Spoiler: For kira's eyes only

You should definitely swap with me so I can kill people with the death note tonight.
I known it seems silly but consider the following pros and cons.

Pros

- If I am VT, it frames me and you appear innocent.
If I am a Kira follower, I would kill a townie and you would be fine.
If I am a power role, I'm likely killing a townie instead of whatever I'm supposed to be doing.
The frame is permanent.
It would be funny.
Literally noone would believe you actually did this and I would likely be limmed tomorrow for claiming it happened, assuming I am town.

Cons

There is an incredibly low chance you die to your own Death Note, although this would be a funny outcome.
You don't choose who dies n1.


Pros seem to be outweighing the cons here.
And I got my fanciest pen <3

[Gimli]

if you think meg is a FOLLOWER, then you should hang lorne, not me

if you think meg is kira, then git gud

[Gimli]

I think you're playing like ass tbh and I think it makes sense that a bunch of people are SRing you

that's @kokichi

[Gimli]

I think you're playing like ass tbh and I think it makes sense that a bunch of people are SRing you

that's @kokichi

I think only Meg is at this point. And I guess Kawaii as well partially because I am the Ultimate Supreme Leader

VOTE: kokichi

[Gimli]

all your posting is ass this game

I'm gone gbye

[Gimli]

you know what I changed my mind lets hang meg sorry meg

VOTE: meg

leggo all votes on meg

[Gimli]

ANYTHING
IS
POSSIBLE

[Gimli]

I don't know where the investigator and the assistant are, and I don't want us to make a mistake.

I've done many things trying desperately to figure out the best kira-follower-follower combination in this game, because I absolutely love every part of it and the lore. once I stopped scumreading kawaii, I've been looking at some different places trying to figure out who can be kira.

please keep this in mind moving forward when I'm no longer a distraction, if killing me is something town wants to do. actually come back and read my post please. or figure out at least why I'm saying the things I'm saying.

I think black/kawaii are townies. I think kokichi might be town, but idrk. I don't think he is kira cause he doesn't need to defend kawaii that much as kira. I liked vanderscamp all game, and I said why I don't think it's meg. so the pool of potential kira is quite short. lorne/mala/std/hpe/ only.

I think kira is in the std/mala pair, and I think it might actually be std. I tried wagoning mala to see what would happen, but he seemed like not wanting to do much to save it. and it's possible mala's rvs opener is signaling to kira. the 'Hi.' post.

[Gimli]

VOTE: std

[Gimli]

when I die and the game doesn't end, you could probably wagon STD tomorrow and it'd might be a good thing cause he might be your kira

[Gimli]

the followers know who kira is

thats why i thought kokichi and black were your followers

i wouldn't attack you if im a follower of someone else's kira

like this is page 41 you still don't know this

game got too exasperating now...

[Gimli]

STD literally just read mala as carefree town in a game where she was scum

I have no idea how he wouldn't adapt the way he reads mala coming into this game, and I find the fixation on two carefree looking posts to be unreasonable.

[Gimli]

koki

std > mala, dont you think?

[Gimli]

@koki your meta case is bad

what about std, are you townreading him?

[Gimli]

koki

std > mala, dont you think?

Is your case on StD that he's not adapting to Mala? Anything else?

have you townread anything he posted?

[Gimli]

thats his playerstyle

I dont see him solving, I find him opportunistic

he jumped on my wagon and im sure as a townie he wouldnt think im scummy