Mod action necessary for repeat flaking

[Nancy Drew 39]

This thread seems to never ever get made, so before yet another one complaining about replace outs happens again, why aren’t more people penalized for doing this unless rl or actual internet issues are to blame?

This is the official policy of MU, why not on MS?

[Nancy Drew 39]

I don't think there is an official policy but when stuff like that happens action is usually taken. [from what I've seen]

My point is it should be because far more games go to shit as a result of repeat flaking than replace outs. When a slot is left for days in games with no prods/replacements/no action of any kind on either the part of the player or game mod, it absolutely hurts the game and is extremely unfair to the players who signed up to play and are actively trying to play, so something ought to be done about that.

[Nancy Drew 39]

This thread seems to never ever get made, so before yet another one complaining about replace outs happens again, why aren’t more people penalized for doing this unless rl or actual internet issues are to blame?

This is the official policy of MU, why not on MS?

If we penalized ppl for flaking then who'd be left to play?!?

I agree with you in the sense serial flakes should be punished but it might be seen as some kind of invasion of privacy or something if we start asking people why they flaked.

but I think this is mostly self-resolving? Like I'm pretty sure Yume ate a site bam or something.

It's not nearly as common as it used to be (or maybe it still is) but mods can and would deny entry to serial flakes.

but the newest fad is if you get prodded 3 times in a game you are force replaced so like maybe we should make a thing where if you are force replaced 3 times you get like a month ban or something and then 3 bans for flaking you get a year.

Yes but unfortunately not all game mods are always on top of this and even when they are. it’s extremely annoying to have to wait for a player - who has a prior history of doing this in past games, drag the game out - which deprives the rest of the playerlist valuable info about their slot. This is particularly problematic in smaller games with less players.

[Nancy Drew 39]

As someone who never flakes out of games, I'm obviously biased, but I do feel that it's a commitment that can be reasonably upheld. Barring extreme circumstances, you should be able to at least notify the mod if you will no longer have time to play.

I think a penalty for flaking out of games would be pretty reasonable, though I don't know if it would actually help anything, because it's really hard for me to understand why someone would flake out at all (unless they're a new player who completely forgot about the site).

Well, it would deter serial flakers, which is whom I’m most concerned about. Exactly! I don’t think I’ve ever flaked once on this site unless it literally involved internet or rl issues that could not be helped and even then I did my due diligence in trying to keep the game mod apprised of that. I have flaked on another site - not MU because of extreme formatting frustrations but that obviously isn’t a problem for me on this site.

[Nancy Drew 39]

We do penalize people for excessive flaking or replacing out - if you search the ban thread for "replacing," there are several results detailing restrictions we have placed on users for excessive replacing out in the past. unfortunately we are not omniscient and have to rely somewhat on reports of this occurring in order to be aware of a large pattern emerging. on my end, I try to keep an eye on the replacement request queue for any names coming up a lot, which is admittedly not a perfect proxy; as far as I'm aware, there aren't any players in recent history who would be penalized for excessive replacement. if you see people flaking out or replacing out of games repeatedly, then please report it so we can take appropriate action.

Yes excessive replacing out can also be a problem as well but I view excessive serial flaking as essentially extremely disrespectful to both the game mod and other players and if you’re onsite and literally ignore three subsequent prods, you clearly don’t want to be in said game anyway, so why not just let the mod know and spare them from having to go through all that? Perhaps a database of players who do either excessively might possibly be worth looking in to?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Excessive replacing out whether by choice or by force is against the rules and has been enforced. But we are not omniscient and it takes the cooperation of the community to help identify if there is someone really doing that. The worst monitors the replacements queue and has an easy line to the rest of us if he notices.

No one has been banned for it in recent memory cause no one has done it in recent memory lol

When flaking becomes habitual, it should be an actionable offense. It is incredibly disrespectful not just to the game mod, but also the players to just ditch one game after another.

Who wants to share a player list with someone who can't show the slightest modicum of courtesy so the moderator can minimize the time that slot is vacant? I don't.

+1

@mods, this thread is specifically about the problem of excessive or serial flaking, replacing out of games is not the actual topic of this discussion, because a slot doesn’t remain vacant in that case.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Someone flaking would be replaced, yeah? So the effect would be the same.

Only after having received three prods.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Someone flaking would be replaced, yeah? So the effect would be the same.

Yes, but the moderators seem to treat flaking as the same severity as a normal replace out. This thread is advocating for there to be a distinction between the two with unannounced flaking having more severe consequences than replacing with notice.

+1

Well, especially in the case of frequent serial flaking anyway. It really really hurts games when a slot relains vacant for too long. This situation can almost potentially break a game if more than one player at a time is doing this concurrently.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I’m not aware that flaking is even reportable at this time? With all due respect, the entire point of what I and other people are arguing is that they would prefer a player replace out before needing to undergo 3 prods if they really don’t intend to continue with the game. I’m not concerned with players who miss prods for good faith reasons but still intend to continue the game. What my issue is with players who opt out of games by flaking in lieu of replacing out, so I think penalizing serial replacing out actually worsens the problem and encourages flaking, which is clearly much much more destabilizing to any ongoing game.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I would prefer to actually change the prod times to 72 - 48 - 24 and give nudges if other players request it up to 24 hrs prior to an official prod (12 for the third one) but I don’t understand that why the mods aren’t getting that players flaking in lieu of replacing out is the main issue here, not how fast or slow they are to respond to prods and not all game mods are up to speed with the prod times.

My issue is with players who flake and get force replaced when they’re very clearly on MS playing other games. Those players could obviously choose to replace out but force the game mod to essentially babysit them, when it’s blatantly clear that the player has clearly already abandoned that particular game.

Eta: I think a database alerting game mods to serial offenders would be a good thing as well as receiving a warning for flaking in three games concurrently with proof of rl issues and internet not being responsible, which would clearly be the case if that player is posting elsewhere on MS and particularly in other mafia games.