Open 833: Twin Trap [Postgame]

[redtea]

VOTE: not_mafia
wanna see if he can sorted early

[redtea]

spicy idea

[redtea]

Nice new avatar you've got there

Can't say mine has changed in 5 years

ty my adhd demanded it
I respect avatar long-haulers

[redtea]

We should set NM to E-1 specifically so he is unable to do his self-vote opening

What makes you think N_M reads before he posts?

wake up babes new scum strat just dropped

Is the first elimination always town? Because how are you supposed to know who's who?

I'm a little confused
but no it's not always town, but town is, numbers-wise, always the most likely elimination, as they are the majority

[redtea]

btw sorry Deimos
hope to actually play with you this game

[redtea]

We should set NM to E-1 specifically so he is unable to do his self-vote opening

What makes you think N_M reads before he posts?

wake up babes new scum strat just dropped

Is the first elimination always town? Because how are you supposed to know who's who?

I'm a little confused
but no it's not always town, but town is, numbers-wise, always the most likely elimination, as they are the majority

redtea, do you see a problem with this post? It's not fatal but it's big. I am going to look through your other games to see if it is common for you.

no? are you saying i don't make jokes?

Particular tell inconclusive. Tonally redtea's different than their completed town games.

VOTE: redtea

those completed games you reviewed wouldn't include ones i've flipped but are ongoing would it? You can't talk about it, but there's no rule against making use of available knowledge afaik.
said this in another game but i'm experimenting with my playstyle. If you look more closely, you can see the change from my first games after hiatus to now.
take what you will from all that

[redtea]

redtea, do you see a problem with this post? It's not fatal but it's big. I am going to look through your other games to see if it is common for you.

no? are you saying i don't make jokes?

just realized you probably weren't referring to my meta here, unless you know me already.
in which case no i have no idea

[redtea]

Nope. That's not the problem.

I don't reference ongoing or use things I can't point to. How do you think you've changed?

tfw you hit submit a second too late

fair enough
(this isn't copy-pasted from my other post like this, this is paraphrased using my memory):

Spoiler:

I've been trying to find a balance between more casual play and tryharding, because doing the latter all the time gets stressful eventually bc of the expectations I put on myself; knowing the effect lurking can have on your slot is additional pressure. In an effort to keep having fun, I've been experimenting with my playstyle, to mixed results. I'm still figuring it out the ideal effort/fun/results ratio.

[redtea]

so you wanna explain whatever it was you were seeing?

[redtea]

what if no one's jealous of you ever

[redtea]

Two words: temporal scope.

If redtea said that it's likelier for town to be eliminated

today

because

they

are the majority, I'd be jumping for joy. But given that they instead made the generalised claim that town is

always

the likelier elimination, I see "they" as a far more natural and grammatical pronoun than "we", because games where redtea either isn't playing or isn't town-aligned are included in "always".

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if it was empirically +scum to use "we" in a context like that because such pronoun tells are fairly popular and something I know I've been self-conscious about before as scum, increasing the probability of making a sentence less grammatical for the sake of using the alignment-consistent pronoun.

My two cents.

oooh. Now I get it.
Well I'm sure glad there's someone smart here to make a concise defense. We would've ended up in a stupid 1v1 where I flail to try to convey this idea.

I feel like I'm usually pretty aware of my language when I'm offering game explanations like that, town or scum. I haven't scumslipped like that yet but ig there's a first time for everything.

[redtea]

what if no one's jealous of you ever

just realized this sounded pointed instead of rhetorical

[redtea]

well
does anyone have special setup insight favoring town

[redtea]

I think redtea got slightly scummier over [their] last few posts btw

.....
i'm just. Going to let people on this list who've played more with me address this. I really don't see anything out of the ordinary, so if nothing else, it'll tell me who to scumread.

[redtea]

I haven't read up and dont really plan to but idk what ur on. NM has some pretty sexy reads despite the fact that he doesn't post much. So get ur facts straight.

true facts, he hasn't led me astray yet I think.
Then again I don't know if I've played against scum!NM recently if at all. For all I know scum!NM can't even be found without finding his buddies first. That's the impression I've been getting from others.

I want to vote the monkey. There's evidence to suggest he's evil, and his personality is not preferable.

VOTE: Almost50

Lol jk VOTE: Kop Let's figure out who's bad

I have time, let's talk. What should we discuss?

what made kop seem like a better start over a50?

personally, i keep trying to see if nm can be sorted early but i haven't been able to get that to happen yet.

[redtea]

nya!

catboi is ruthless

[redtea]

I think redtea got slightly scummier over [their] last few posts btw

.....
i'm just. Going to let people on this list who've played more with me address this. I really don't see anything out of the ordinary, so if nothing else, it'll tell me who to scumread.

So I take it you're a meta person?

somehow it's happened
but also it's page 6

[redtea]

Yeah. I think I've played the most with you among this player list.

I realized "played with me recently for a decent amount of in-game time" would maybe be more accurate. Also forgot NM doesn't fucking talk lmao

[redtea]

nah I wouldn't expect to sound towny, I just wouldn't expect I sound not town either.

[redtea]

Is the first elimination always town? Because how are you supposed to know who's who?

Because I find it easier to believe that this is scum poorly faking noobtown than town with two completed games already still making such a noobish comment.

to me it seemed like Dorsey brought the question up because of having experienced a repeated pattern with limited data. That's how I understood it.

[redtea]

Even for page 6 I think you are concerningly IIoA. There's an obsessiveness with self-meta and a complete absence of any semblance of an attempt to sort another player

Maybe because that's exactly what I was doing? Specifically shooting down weird analysis with easily accessible information?

[redtea]

"complete absence of any semblance of an attempt to sort another player"
did you want me to sr you or TA or something?
I'm not as into voting people for rvs talk as some. Clearly.

[redtea]

*that's to say besides you and ta, there wasn't much else to comment on except football or whatever, in my opinion

[redtea]

Even for page 6 I think you are concerningly IIoA. There's an obsessiveness with self-meta and a complete absence of any semblance of an attempt to sort another player

Maybe because that's exactly what I was doing? Specifically shooting down weird analysis with easily accessible information?

okay, never mind. You're right. It's only worth anything if meta is something someone wants to or has the time to do. And if they don't then yeah, what I'm saying is useless. If I had accompanying commentary that didn't require that extra reading it would be one thing, but I didn't.

I got annoyed people don't automatically want to play the way I'm playing and it was dumb. If you pings were felt from whatever was in my first few posts you got pings. And if you get pings from THIS post, that's how it is.

I apologize.

[redtea]

all I have to say is I'm wary of trying to read Deimos early after our last game so I'm not gonna have anything there for a while.

otherwsie- nope
but I can see how many people I can convince to vote nm with me VOTE: notmafiaVOTE: notmafiaVOTE: notmafiaVOTE: notmafia

[redtea]

tyyy, didn't even realize it was past midnight

[redtea]

I'm starting to think that's the case, but I thought I'd give this a try.

[redtea]

Is the first elimination always town? Because how are you supposed to know who's who?

Majority of the time it is town because town have the majority. But it's not exactly a bad thing if it does end up being town who is eliminated, it can sometimes end up for the greater good.

Two words: temporal scope.

If redtea said that it's likelier for town to be eliminated

today

because

they

are the majority, I'd be jumping for joy. But given that they instead made the generalised claim that town is

always

the likelier elimination, I see "they" as a far more natural and grammatical pronoun than "we", because games where redtea either isn't playing or isn't town-aligned are included in "always".

This is a town post, with a town perspective/mindset.

I haven't read up and dont really plan to but idk what ur on. NM has some pretty sexy reads despite the fact that he doesn't post much. So get ur facts straight.

VOTE: Noraa

This pinging me.

This is pinging me.

[redtea]

I'm sure you are not mafia

[redtea]

Do u have READS

I don't feel the need to respond to redtea's posts this page because I think Norwee summarised my point very well here.

And it's not just "do you have reads", it's "where have you shown that you are trying to generate reads", y'know.

I get that most of the content so far is RVS and there are other players who have lacking analysis but redtea is one of us who has posted the most so I was hoping for

something

from them.

I'm afraid you expect too much.
Also the answer to "where" is "nowhere" except in response to kop #163 recently and Dorsey #121-#122.

[redtea]

looking at Dorsey's iso, I was hella ignored so
VOTE: Dorsey

[redtea]

Happy birthday though

thanks man

[redtea]

there's this handy little link right next to your post number
says iso
could try to use it

[redtea]

nice

[redtea]

is nm pocketing me?

Nah, I'm good

mod should let me vote twice just for this

[redtea]

almost didn't crumb did he
seems like kind of a lolshot

[redtea]

I haven't paid attention to football in a few years but recently a season pass to Arsenal matches kinda fell into my lap.

Oh, a gooner. I'm a Kop. (Imagine how funny this would've been if you were a Mafia Goon and I was a Cop in a game).

Anyway, I'm Egyptian, so "a part of me" still feels for them Gunners

lmfao was it this post
wow

[redtea]

This is an ego post. I'll be back sooner than later

First two letters of first two words: TI
First letter of first word in each sentence: TI

Perhaps

oooh
hmm

[redtea]

Norwee how much have you played with Noraa

A couple of games.

Upon re-reading D1 I shouldn't have bothered asking because you are likely town

if norwee seems town he's probably scum
but trying to sort norwee early doesnt seem to turn out well so don't expect me to go after him

[quote="In"post 287, Noraa"]

Pray tell why you would assume my comment pertained to the Dorsey flip instead of the almost50 nk, especially given all the context immediately following?

almost was literally almost certainly not vt by tone and the way he was so slippery feeling. i dont see how anyone can look back and be like oh its surprising almost was a pr.[/quote]
what Deimos said about this
but also like, he clearly made that first comment BEFORE isoing aka "looking back at" almost50, sooo what's your deal exactly?

[redtea]

But they're unlikely to be confbiasing because they expressed a tr on me D1 so it's more likely these posts come from a scum agenda.

hahahahahahah this applies to you far better than myself unfortunately

this sounds ridiculous and if you want anyone to take it seriously you better do some PbPA

[redtea]

That question goes for everyone else too actually.

I've played one game in recent memory with a50 and that's ongoing iirc.
why?

I refuse to believe Dorsey's town flip and will play the rest of the game believing this is a 3 scum set-up

same tbh umu

[redtea]

I've played one game in recent memory with a50 and that's ongoing iirc.
why?

Trying to understand the kill.

Wondering if people who've played with him might've seen something bc of previous experience?
The game I played with him, he was also a pr (and I was town)

But they're unlikely to be confbiasing because they expressed a tr on me D1 so it's more likely these posts come from a scum agenda.

hahahahahahah this applies to you far better than myself unfortunately

this sounds ridiculous and if you want anyone to take it seriously you better do some PbPA

What?

what

[redtea]

if norwee seems town he's probably scum
but trying to sort norwee early doesnt seem to turn out well so don't expect me to go after him

So are you null on him rn or what?

functionally

[redtea]

oh
post-by-post-analysis

basically going "here here here and here is why I think this", usually why they think someone is scum

[redtea]

Nora's post sounds baseless and omgus

[redtea]

if norwee seems town he's probably scum
but trying to sort norwee early doesnt seem to turn out well so don't expect me to go after him

So are you null on him rn or what?

functionally

So you saying you think my play is townie but that is something you think is scummy for me?

Sorta
I thiiiink if you sound towny but relatively sober (not in an alcohol consumption sense), that points towards scum!you

[redtea]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

lmao
why

[redtea]

didn't have any better ideas or?

[redtea]

fair enough ig
VOTE: Not_Mafia so he can show up and do something so I can unvote him again

[redtea]

nm death tunneled dunn in true love 1028 from the get go and he was on the money and i never forgot

[redtea]

then again it was like three months ago or something

[redtea]

"when I moved to redtea because I believed their playstyle to be intrinsically anti-town regardless of alignment."
wh
(would you be willing to provide critique post-game I would greatly appreciate it)

[redtea]

If you haven't eat yet go do it, it will pay off in helping you get that problem set done more accurately/quickly/with less stress/at all

[redtea]

Sorry for the ambiguity that was the explanation of why the Dorsey wagon was still good and applied to them, not to you. Also "anti-town" is a bit of an exaggeration but imo they definitely had the lowest town wincon +equity.

that does make the sentence... make more sense. I don't know why I parsed it the way I did.

[redtea]

enough
VOTE: Nora's
if you flip town I won't be happy

[redtea]

ta did you actually read these last few pages
are you and Noraa partners

[redtea]

Vulture I just want you to know your case on me is atrociously stupid.

[redtea]

where's vulture come back

[redtea]

page top guarantees my manifest

[redtea]

Hmm i like post 482 from Vulture. (The case on Redtea)
So that makes me want to do Redtea.
I feel like they haven’t been openly or brazenly scum. But they are struggling a bit to keep up with other people’s towniness. Which makes me think they could just be scum that’s having a bit of a rough one right now.
I can’t really remember any post that made me think: "ah yes, this comes from town."
VOTE: Redtea

fair assessment but I can't believe you agreed with vulture's case
"case"
which is another point towards scum!you this game IMO but I also want to see what others think about it

Vulture I just want you to know your case on me is atrociously stupid.

Wow, great counter.

WHY is it "stupid"?

I think I wanted to see how seriously people took it before bothering to respond

[redtea]

He has also made a couple of posts earlier such as on day 1 that sounded really robotic and artificial that pinged me. Which i can bring up if i need to.

parodoxically I have to exert effort to sound genuine a lot of the time
I'm curious which ones tho

[redtea]

It is convenient that me scumreading you is a point towards scum!me.
Truly.

hey, part of the reason you sr me I said is fair. The other part I think is dumb and therefore opportunistic.

[redtea]

There's just so many excuses in his ISO like I understand that we get sick. Life happens. But I swear all his last posts have just been "Sorry I'm not posting. I'll post someday"
I guess I also find his defense on me weird now. It kinda feels like it's going for the reverse mindset approach. The more you defend someone, the more someone else will find them scummy type thing

this describes me way better than it does norwee

[redtea]

well except for the defense part

[redtea]

Saying norwee is sus because of sickness is dumb and opportunistic

[redtea]

^An exchange for sure

[redtea]

waaiiit don't lim me now that vulture's back!

[redtea]

I'll claim
I'm the town watcher

[redtea]

unfortunately my info is shitty, all I got was that almost50 visited Deimos

[redtea]

oh I'm hammered
shit
I'm so sorry town
my experimentation kind of failed big time

[redtea]

don't forget ta hammered without letting me claim

[redtea]

I mean I'm fuckin dead so youll see ig

[redtea]

Im srs tho

[redtea]

it's always common courtesy

[redtea]

I forget how fast a lim can go through though, so it is my fault for thinking I had the luxury to wait around

[redtea]

it's okay, it was a bad time for me to be absent + the timing wasn't great. I get why it happened

[redtea]

Noraa basically caught the second by confidently stating that post 110 comes from pr!Redtea

wtffff
and they were right