open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[Datisi]

heh, glad to know my faker alt guess was very much correct

i have some Thoughts on the draft numbers but they'll have to wait until i get out of bed and have coffee, so like

this is a glorified ego post basically

[Datisi]

imagine thinking when u can just establish a meta of always picking 1

hey, this is MY meta, what the fuck dude

okay, draft thoughts. i have a meta of always picking 1, and s_s has a meta of always picking 9. therefore, i think pooky and flow trap are +likely to be town, because it's likely that *someone* in the scumchate went like "hey, these two always pick the same numbers, we should like, not pick them". and if someone like skitter (who i'm pretty sure has played in those games and who would probably run some checks as scum) or nsg (who just openly admitted to being aware s_s always picks 9) flips red, that goes to +++town for pooky and flow.

moreso for flow than pooky, because i can imagine scum!pooky being aware of the above and then still picking 1 just to fucking troll me, but whatever.

[Datisi]

now, nobody's introduction especially pinged me as scummy, so...

VOTE: skitter how come you didn't rvs me this time?

[Datisi]

A) draft gave me something interesting to work with for rvs

oh, that's what the "related note" was.

i don't remember a game where you *didn't* vote me in rvs, but i don't think you'd purposefully lie about it as scum, so i don't feel like actually going back to check.

[Datisi]

i dunno, i just noticed that you did it in a few games that we've been together in, so i thought it had some purpose of sorting me early or something. so the fact that the "tradition" was broken was interesting enough to call out, a least.

[Datisi]

Datisi did u finally roll scum against me u scumfuck??

i have literally never rolled scum in my life, what are you talking about

[Datisi]

Is it to deter other people from picking them?

but there’s no pregame communication

how would you expect people to know that you just hope enough people do?

oh wow nice dumbslip iv i guess you're confirmed town now hehe

[Datisi]

VOTE: innocentvillager

[Datisi]

Also let the record show that i've no idea how to read iv and while the prior page is probably indicative of something, i've no idea what that something is

this is actually kinda how i feel and i wanna say skitt is +town for the mindmeld or whatever

[Datisi]

Not really thrilled with skitter's start. I instinctively did not like the statements about catboi and IV, and checked it against several games but it doesn't line up with any she's played with me as either alignment.

VOTE: Mare

Meh.

you don't like skitter, so you will unvote her?

[Datisi]

lol yeah, I wanna say skitter town, and I think it's dats who made the comment (could be wrong on who) so dats is suspicious, just gotta keep an eye there

this post is such a mess, i genuinely have no clue what you're even accusing me of. mind clarifying?

[Datisi]

VOTE: skitter

Hi everyone. I pretty much agree with Datisi’s thoughts on flow trap not being w/w with SS. It is more likely than not that scum has someone who was aware of SS pattern, but not guaranteed. Having meta numbers seems a little broken lol

I have no idea why this post pinged me but it did mildly

i mean, my point was that flow trap is unlikely to be scum period, not that they're unlikely to be s/s with s_s. so i am curious where is that interpretation coming from.

[Datisi]

midwaybear scum
Datisi scum

Mare town
andante town
Faker town

/sigh

are these serious or?

[Datisi]

here we go again. *ahem* why am i scummy, iv?

[Datisi]

here we go again. *ahem* why am i scummy, iv?

I think you are spending way too much time in the scum PT

so, serious accusation of being scum, but a meme response. iv, why do you always make me scumread you?

[Datisi]

Like Datisi u actually think I’m scum here or?

by now? not really. i've been skimming this game but everything is kinda getting blurred together and i have no thoughts, so. will try again later.

[Datisi]

Datisi: maybe ur town

i didn't say he's town, i said i'm not scumreading him anymore.

[Datisi]

thus far i like andante and dats

can i get the spice behind these two

[Datisi]

thus far i like andante and dats

can i get the spice behind these two

both of you are just feeling very chill
and i think both of you as scum are more tense/stilted/less likely to give real-time free-flowing thoughts than you've been thus far

do you think i'm not chill than in that potions game or?

[Datisi]

i have no clue what skitter sees in those posts that is townie, but considering i have been wrong like twice on how i thought town!skitter reads me, i will shrug my shoulders and say "i guess?"

[Datisi]

VOTE: flow trap

was kinda thinking what catboi is thinking there so why not

[Datisi]

*opens game*

yeah, andante is town

*closes game*

[Datisi]

Eh, why to this? I don't have feelings there at all yet really

something about her posting felt like she's genuinely interested in solving this game? i think it was some posts questioning iv that gave me a feeling of uninformedness

this last post saying "i don't care abt your read on me but i need your read on iv!!" is a bit weird but /shrug

also i have no read on iv at this point in time and i will actively not have a read on him at least until mid day 1

[Datisi]

well ok the benefits of a massclaim are to lock scum into a claim and I think their picks say a lot about their priorities and stuff

We have draft info too

We can read into this kind of stuff and share what we all put in for the draft etc and unravel the whole auction

It’s not completely dumb

See, here's what I don't like, your 27th post in this game was "how bad is a massclaim" after about 20 posts of "let me defend why I picked the number I picked" like, something feels VERY off here, and I think the simple answer is just, you're not town. Like, you asked about massclaim, jumped straight into making "reads". Something feels very off.

oh yeah it was this post

this seemed a bit too effort-y for scum who's faking reads early

[Datisi]

literally none of them are important don't worry

[Datisi]

i can't really blame him lol

pedit: @420

[Datisi]

No i was just kinda ironically indicating that he shouldnt have that read given the micro etc
And the ironically bit since dats was joking

I didnt really have any thoughts on ur post otherwise tbh

fun fact - i don't even remember what "dumbslip" iv posted in that micro, i wasn't thinking about that at all when i called him out earlier

[Datisi]

Pooky has 5 minutes to post a herosolve or he's confirmed mafia

skitter catboi andante

pooky what the fuck is this? you're not gonna call me scum for the 10 billionth game?

[Datisi]

cakez's wallposts give a townie aura

i have nothing concrete to back that up with

[Datisi]

why can't we both pocket sircakez

[Datisi]

why the fuck is this game on page 26 and i have about two halves of a read

[Datisi]

"because you're bad at this game" no i'm not i choose to blame all of you instead

[Datisi]

they told me to fuck off and that they won't make up my reads for me, now what

[Datisi]

And fwiw andante's probably my strongest townread, the one on dats has lessened a bit

did you miss how chill i was being, i even meme scumclaimed

[Datisi]

is it weird that i actually think nsg is townie for this post? like, if she entered the game townreading me, i'd be concerned. and this feels like something i'd expect from her, at least going from the vibes i got from her playing in my games.

pedit: referring to 661.

[Datisi]

thank you iv very cool

[Datisi]

the question was partly formed that way to invite discussion. partly because i kind of expect some smartass to go "so you agree you're scummy? so you're scum?" and i wanted to shut that down pre-emptively, but i didn't know a good way to do that without writing the whole thing out so i decided to just start with "is it weird" and call it a day.

[Datisi]

on the subject, what's your impression of how you've played this game? do you think you've played towny, scummy, neutral / you've been playing resembling your typical towngame / scumgame?

i think i've been playing scummy, but my play so far here doesn't really resemble either of my typical towngames or scumgames.

generally, what makes me townie and what mostly makes my towngames is gut reads, in-moment thoughts, and feeling mostly relaxed and natural (and townbloc building, but that's follows after reads, obviously). now, the gut reads and thoughts aren't present because this game feels like mud currently and i've gotten very little from it so far. and, i'm aware i'm sounding a bit off tonally, mostly around iv, because this is like the 4th game in recent times where we start off with "r u scum though" and it's gotten repetitive.

the reason why i say this doesn't resemble either of my games is because i'm not that terrible at... faking my towngame, especially early. if i had to, i think i would be able to make up some "reads" that i'm not naturally getting right now.

the impression i've gotten from seeing you play in my games is that you would look for things like Actual Game Related Thoughts in my play, and considering i've given the bare minimum so far... your read makes sense.

[Datisi]

scumread which side? or is this Hot New Scum Theatre?

[Datisi]

because I really think you are scum.

what's making you so confident this early?

[Datisi]

i do know who skygazer is!! and yeah, giving it time is what i'm planning to do, it sometimes takes a bit but it'll come to me.

[Datisi]

i would like to thank all of you for not spamming additional 30 pages while i was asleep

because I really think you are scum.

what's making you so confident this early?

I didn't like your interaction with IV earlier and how you both sort of didn't want to go any further. I also found 642 a bit off. But yeah, that doesn't warrant this level of confidence so I don't think I will ISO you rn or anything like that.

i actually think this makes midway kinda townie? like, his whole read of me. i feel like scum!him in this situation would go "i have a light scumread on datisi based on this". and the way he's going "i really think datisi is scum but i think i'm getting confbiased here" makes me think it's more likely that the thoughts are actually real? like, i *think* scum here would be spending more time fleshing out the read on me or trying to justify it, and wouldn't be wasting time in writing how confident they are on it, especially considering scum!him would know these reasons aren't really good and that i *can* post a lot and be annoying so like idk i just don't see this coming from scum!him

also the "datisi/nsg are s/s" feels like a plausible thought.

Scum theater. But, I feel like I'm getting too conf biased (around your slot) because I really think you are scum. I'm starting to build a narrative that makes you scum regardless of other alignments(nsg/skitter), and I don't think that is very good. Maybe you are scum, but I don't want to tunnel at this point.

This post. feels too much like something scum would say. like a "ok.. backing off on my push on you.. cause I know you're town... and this isn't working for me" those are definitely the vibes I get from that post.

why do you think scum!midway would be backing off his push on me *already*? like, i'm more scumread than townread, it's not like anyone is getting heat for scumreading me, like literally three seconds ago i started townreading someone for scumreading me? what's the logic behind this?

but even still i suppose the point that i'm trying to get across is that you still need some kind of relevant body of work for reference and it just seems strange to me that you take one game as sufficient for that.

is this you just disagreeing with skitter about the quality of her read or is it saying you think skitter's scummy for it? if the latter, is there a reason you didn't mention my townread of andante which is arguably of worse quality?

generally, what makes me townie and what mostly makes my towngames is gut reads, in-moment thoughts, and feeling mostly relaxed and natural

(and townbloc building, but that's follows after reads, obviously). now, the gut reads and thoughts aren't present because this game feels like mud currently and i've gotten very little from it so far. and, i'm aware i'm sounding a bit off tonally, mostly around iv, because this is like the 4th game in recent times where we start off with "r u scum though" and it's gotten repetitive.

also, do you not think you're doing this?

up until the point i posted that? no, i don't think i was doing that. mainly because i saw very little of this game that actually made me think "x is y alignment" (that one post from andante being town!indicative is a rare example). so if i wasn't *having* reads, i knew i didn't post them either. and considering a lot of my relaxedness comes from the fact that i have gutreads and i can act based upon them, and i wasn't having them at that point... yeah, i think i wasn't doing that either.

why do you ask? do you like, disagree that i was giving reads or something? you yourself said you thought my more recent posts weren't as relaxed as before...

if ur so tired of these interactions why do you still engage in them/feel half-reluctant to? don’t you usually get some useful read out of me

because i feel a sort of obligation to? it's like a long-running inside joke, we always scumread each other at the beginning of the game, sort of how i pretty much always open with "oh no ico rolled scum for the umpteenth time" when i play with him recently. or how i joke about george/norwee being scum together. it's a running joke. the problem is that i don't actually GET anything from you alignemnt-wise as i get from ico or george (because i actually kind of don't suck at reading those two). my way of reading you is generally "wait an in-game day or two, and THEN read iv" because form what i know of you, your start as scum is good but you get tired the more the game progresses, while you don't get the same tiredness as town. i can't read you early game and i don't try to. but i continue the joke, mostly because of social pressure actually. i don't wanna be the person that stopped doing the joke, it feels rude.

if i was giving the impression that i was actually successfully sorting you in last games, lol idk. in that mini normal, your early "scumread" of me felt contrasting enough to the rest of the game's read of me that i felt like i could actually get insight into your thoughts there. here i would just go "yeah i can see it" because i CAN see it because this game feels like mud currently.

how do you think scum!you approaches/pockets me/pushes me?

no clue. i did think about what i would do if i rolled scum against you in some prior games, and my generally plan would've been "try to survive d1, kill him asap on n1". as for how would the "try to survive d1" look, no clue.

when did this turn into a wall i'm gonna post it for now

[Datisi]

Was thinking about how scum are typically more conciliatory toward scumreads on them in the early game and mulling over Datisi's response to nsg in my head and but don't know how much I believe that

fwiw i was lowkey thinking the same

i skipped over this originally - skitt, is this just a general read? because from what i remember of my own scumplay, my plan in the early game often was "post some nonsense, if someone starts attacking me, pry into their read on me, poke holes in their case and argue with them". now, i can't remember if you've *played* in any games where i've done that as scum, but i don't remember my recent scumplay reflecting what catboi said at all, so.

VOTE: midwaybear i am just not seeing anything towny from this slot and i would have expected to see something by now or something idk

does anyone know if mwb meta has changed in the last year?

how come you're going "i'm not seeing anything townie from midway so i'm gonna vote there" when you just posted an occam's case for me being scum and i know you love voting me?

VOTE: midwaybear i am just not seeing anything towny from this slot and i would have expected to see something by now or something idk

does anyone know if mwb meta has changed in the last year?

"not seeing anything towny" seems kind of a bit far? His last few posts around skitter/datisi/nsg were weird in a kind of twisty way but I didn't think 698 and the stream of consciousness type thought there where he's typing out an explanation and goes "actually this sounds kind of silly" feels real enough.

are you saying that you think his recent posting is fake? because i'm not sure how that ties in to your previous read of him and why you're replying that way to iv's vote there?

[Datisi]

now, this might look like i am just sheeping catboi, but

VOTE: s_s

[Datisi]

faq:

"does this mean you're now townreading flow trap?"
no, right now i don't feel like trying to sort someone who has 113 posts, of which probably at least 100 aren't game related.

"why are you voting s_s?"
i realized his iso is like, nothing game related. i can imagine scum!s_s being lazy here.

"are you scum?"
go into the scum pt, look at post #0, do you see my name written there?

...what do you mean "yes"? i fucking told you not to bus me already i am doing fine t̶h̵e̵y̵ ̵͓͒̀w̷̦̯̿o̵͕͎̚n̵͔̒̃́͝t̵͕̞̗̑̎͝ ̶̡̩̰͎̝͖͑̉-̶̼̒̒̌̏̓-̶̖̪͔͈̹̆̒̃̍̄-̷̲̻̻̣̊̒̆͑̔̍̚͝͝-̵̧̩̟͈̺̬̖͓̯̄̏͆̾͒

[Datisi]

is it strictly necessary? i don't know. my impression of your towngame is that you get really solvey and really spammy and that scum!me would have a difficult time pushing you. plus you're familiar with my scumgame which makes you dangerous to scum!me. but i can't say that i would always 100% nightkill you n1 as scum because that also depends on how you're reading me at that moment, how the majority of the game is reading you, whether there's any outed pr's, whether there's anyone who's an even bigger threat... like, you would definitely be a strong n1 contender for me, but to say that i would ALWAYS nk you n1 would be a lie.

[Datisi]

And I wanted to push mwb before you because I think he’s scummy,

i was under the impression you were also thinking i was scummy?

[Datisi]

i skipped over this originally - skitt, is this just a general read? because from what i remember of my own scumplay, my plan in the early game often was "post some nonsense, if

someone starts attacking me, pry into their read on me, poke holes in their case and argue with them

". now, i can't remember if you've *played* in any games where i've done that as scum, but i don't remember my recent scumplay reflecting what catboi said at all, so.

Not sure how to answer this/kinda just what i said earlier ... your back and forth with nsg feels weird on your end and just kinda overly defensive, and ngl it kinda seems like you're doing the bolded

er, you do get that i meant it as "attack them for it"? like, going "yeah lol i can see that" without offering any case for why they're wrong is something i never do. and how was i being defensive with nsg? like, i literally said "you are right i'm playing scummy af" how is that defensive??

[Datisi]

is something i never do as scum* hopefully it's obvious from context

[Datisi]

now i'm being defensive, yes

me being defensive is something i do as either alignment

and the way i played around nsg to me looks like the opposite of defensive so i am really curious where that is coming from

[Datisi]

curious wrt skitter, i don't care about iv's read on me at this moment in time

[Datisi]

VOTE: skitter

here's a thought. i dislike the way skitter went from townreading me for ??? reasons to walking back from it. frankly it kinda mirrors the thread in a weird way. i can imagine scum!skitter starting the game off with townreading me because i'm generally a loud townspew-y player so why get into that mess when she can try to get on my good side early. but once she realized i'm *not* getting townread? "nevermind datisi isn't townie anymore".

i don't like the callouts for being "defensive" either. because she started off with agreeing with catboi that i was being conciliatory towards nsg's scumread on me (and with the implication that that's scummy), and then it turned into me being overly defensive of the scumread. don't those two things have the opposite meaning? it feels opportunistic, like she's grabbing onto the general scumreads on me before i turn them over and making sure that doesn't happen. i don't like it.

[Datisi]

and for the record, something like ^^ that is what i was talking about when i said "scum!me grabs scumreads on myself, argues with them, and starts attacking there". not the "lol ye nsg i totally see what you mean".

[Datisi]

no rush, i'm around for a while

[Datisi]

conciliatory
/kənˈsɪlɪətəri/

adjective

intended or likely to placate or pacify.

basically saying i'm trying to go "wow nsg ur scumread is solid ur town pls don't hurt me"

[Datisi]

you admitted to wanting to shut down someone saying “oh you agree you’re scum”.

yes? to me the "oh, so you agree you're scum?" is a kindergarden-level gotcha that i would've guessed someone like iv would love to say because he thinks he's funny and i wanted to not waste time there.

why should i ~care~ about things nsg said about me? like, i know she's wrong on my alignment, i'm not gonna be wasting time trying to convince her she's wrong there because i do think i'll be able to show it as the game goes on, but i *will* use the opportunity to try to read her.

@iv, if i'm wrong, i'll figure it out. i wanna see her response.

[Datisi]

Anyone know if there's a user-made extension to convert entire threads to PDF?

I'm swamped with end-of-year stuff at work but am hoping to read on my flight later. I'm not eager to download each page individually, but if I have to I will.

you can add "&ppp=200" to make each page have 200 posts instead of 25, though i know that's not exactly the solution you asked for.

[Datisi]

And if you wanted to read her... it felt like a relatively neutral springboard to use? Despite the scumread on you she was mild and I think it could’ve been good discussion to figure out where she was coming from and thus motivation and thus alignment, etc.

i didn't specifically set out to have a read on nsg, i just saw something that made sense to me from town!nsg's point of view, and considering it's relatively early and i'm currently prioritizing quantity over quality, it felt fine. also it was like 1am.

do you find me scummy for it? is this conversation helping you read me?

[Datisi]

Huh. To me, if someone comes out of the gate thinking I’m scum on entrance I think I’d personally want to know why like... immediately. And then discern from there.

if i had thought the scumread is uncalled for, i'd have called her out and demanded explanation.

what is this conversation telling you?

[Datisi]

so, like... you gonna offer some Fresh Takes, or...?

[Datisi]

ummm I'm running into a major thing in my reads here... Datisi/Innocentvillager, do yall always interact like this when yall play together? like, I guess I'm asking like, do you 2 have a lot of history? cause there's this thing I'm noticing, and I think Innocentvillager is either scum trying to pocket datisi, or this is just how you 2 play in games together..
So if Datisi/innocentvillager could help me out here, I'd appreciate it, cause yeah, I start to question my reads when I start having a million scum points for people

yeah, we pretty much always interact this way, more or less

[Datisi]

imagine solving the game via social deduction when you can solve it by MATH

[Datisi]

except if a townie picked 1 too, then we'd be completely fucked. while choosing multitasking no less.

pedit: @mare

[Datisi]

lol what

[Datisi]

why is sleepless town

[Datisi]

okay, i guess it does make sense how it can be called defensive while also calling my read on nsg placating. i usually associate the word "defensive" in mafia with attacking someone for their read and calling it bad, which isn't actually what the word means.

[Datisi]

VOTE: skitter

here's a thought. i dislike the way skitter went from townreading me for ??? reasons to walking back from it. frankly it kinda mirrors the thread in a weird way. i can imagine scum!skitter starting the game off with townreading me because i'm generally a loud townspew-y player so why get into that mess when she can try to get on my good side early. but once she realized i'm *not* getting townread? "nevermind datisi isn't townie anymore".

i don't like the callouts for being "defensive" either. because she started off with agreeing with catboi that i was being conciliatory towards nsg's scumread on me (and with the implication that that's scummy), and then it turned into me being overly defensive of the scumread. don't those two things have the opposite meaning? it feels opportunistic, like she's grabbing onto the general scumreads on me before i turn them over and making sure that doesn't happen. i don't like it.

- i liked your early game, and you were giving me similar vibes to what i've often seen from early-town-you. i'm not sure tbh why you find that read to be quite shocking
- given that you *don't* think that you're being townie for you, i'm also not sure why you have a problem with me changing my mind
- in this pl you wouldn't be a high priority person to buddy for scum-me imo, i don't think i would really put much, if any, thought into trying to avoid 'getting into that mess' by 'getting on your good side early'
- if that *was* my plan i certainly wouldn't lol-reverse it just because some people are calling you scummy, i'd probably wk you ...
- i'm lowkey surprised that you think this is the tactic that i'd take as scum (particularly the bit where i'd reverse course so suddenly)
- i think you were trying to deflect nsg's scurmead but like in a non-aggressive way. it isn't 'classically' defensive but you were trying to get her a bit off of your back i think, so it read as defensive to me

- i found it "shocking" because i think (i haven't gone back to check the potions game) i've seen you call scum!me relaxed early, and frankly i have no clue whether those posts "should" be townie or not because it was mostly memeing and banter. so i didn't get why you were thinking i was townie there, and considering you didn't exactly explain how it differs from my intros as scum.
- you started changing your mind before i said it, which means it wasn't in reaction to it. like my problem is that your change of the read could be driven by the change of the thread atmosphere towards me
- i don't think it's a stretch to say that i am a pretty difficult person to eliminate as town, most of the time. and that i can use my townread status to drive the game forward
- why are you surprised about it? do you think i should have some background knowledge on why scum!you doesn't do this?
- the point on what the words mean is fine and all, but it doesn't resolve my bigger problem which is that i feel like you should know that i tend to get quite defensive about scumreads/votes on me as town so you calling that out about me is ??? weird?

[Datisi]

i'm trying to think if it's fair to say "since when the hell do you think my scumgame is about *avoiding* conflict" and i don't think i have any immediate examples for why it *would* be fair to say that to you, i.e. what you should be familiar with

what do you think about me alignment-wise from all this? i feel like you're responding for responding's sake but i don't actually, like, see you *reading* anything from it

[Datisi]

i think you're being defensive

datisi, nice to meet you

[Datisi]

i feel like i should be giving thoughts on this skitt/mare fight considering it is happening as we speak, but literally the only thing that's coming to me is "lol is this theatre" because the fight feels like it was born out of... pretty much nothing?

[Datisi]

i think you're being defensive but i'm not convinced it's super scum-indicative or anything (as i said before) and i'm not really getting anything ai out of this convo

i took "not convinced it's super scum-indicative" to mean "it's scum-indicative, but not greatly so"

[Datisi]

Nope, not born out of nothing.

maybe born out of nothing is a wrong word, but it feels like this argument could have been over much more quickly and calmly and instead it's escalated into voting when to me it looks like there was kinda no need to? it feels like it's being fueled to continue past its natural point

now, typing that out i realize town sometimes does vote in order to sort better but it still felt unnatural to me goddammit

[Datisi]

i'm skimming the game, currently on page 44, and i wanna say i think cakez is very town but i don't know if i'm actually townreading him or if i'm just feeling bad for incorrectly vigging him last game

[Datisi]

actually how serious is the scumread on pooky? if it's very serious, can there be an explanation other than "pokemon large gave me ptsd"?

[Datisi]

Datisi is alright, nothing about him is really screaming scum to me yet

why is this "yet" here lol

[Datisi]

oh I mean if ur ok with it VOTE: pooky

i am unironically starting to think iv is scum, was about time

[Datisi]

okay i think i have a bunch of "kinda townie but wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if i am wrong" reads and no scumreads (no the iv one doesn't count) can someone point me in the right direction

pedit: oh good timing, why is faker town?

[Datisi]

oh I mean if ur ok with it VOTE: pooky

i am unironically starting to think iv is scum, was about time

Why?
Also like all of your takes on the prior page feel a bit off to me

because the "lol haha ok i can vote pooky if he wants" without actually inputting any thought into what that means for pooky's alignment or how he's using the vote to sort or whatever means he's not thinking about this game. scum!iv knows he has to project thread presence but also scum!iv hates his life. he just said he wants to find a new wagon but actually coming up with who to vote for and why is Difficult. so voting pooky and noping the fuck out of the game is easy.

the reason i say it doesn't count as a scumread is because i am aware that it's not outside of iv's townrange to do something like this and that i am pretty much wasting my time here. but my first thought *was* that it's scummy so i felt it was worthy calling it out anyway.

what feels off? and like, my only take was that cakez was town lol

[Datisi]

i mean i can see it was a meme vote, but the meme vote accompanied with ~nothing~ doesn't give me good vibes

idk what to tell you about the cakez post because it like, feels fine to me lol

i guess if you have questions, feel free to ask?

[Datisi]

Is it only that post that's making you think iv might be scum?

it was the only post in my today's readthrough that made me think "oof, bad post" and i didn't see anything townie from him so

i disliked his "sleepless is town but ohoho i will not tell you why" bullshit yesterday but i know if he decides to not give reasons he's not gonna change his mind if i pry further so i dropped it

[Datisi]

it's almost like... i acknowledged the read isn't strong and that i'm prone to bias there...

[Datisi]

mmm

i think mare is Town, Actually

midway is kinda falling off on my townie scale but /shrug should probably let him do his thing a bit more before i start jumping on it

oh, and i just realized flow trap went from spamming the everliving shit out of the thread with nonsense to going p much completely quiet once the actual discussion started, and the fact that p much nobody else noticed that makes me think that's +likely to be scum but also not majorly because early game etc

[Datisi]

i think her reasons to scumread cakez are like, objectively "bad" but i've been there where someone did a thing as scum and i found it suspicious and they did the thing again and i was like !!! and i know it can be difficult to get shaken out of your confbias, especially when you think you're being unfairly attacked over it, so i would actually place her insistence on the read as +town

because if she were scum, the read would've been bullshit in the first place so i don't think she'd have that strong of a reaction to being proven wrong

[Datisi]

iv, tell me who to vote for

[Datisi]

iv why do *you* think faker is town

[Datisi]

bc i asked skitter the same thing earlier

and the emphasis is meant to show that the idea isn't "i'm looking to townread faker" it's "i'm trying to figure out people's reasons for townreading faker to try to read them"

[Datisi]

Datisi, I'm honestly not really vibing with IV's Mare tr, it's not an actual reason and feels like it stems from TMI, what are your thoughts with how IV is calling mare obvtown...

considering my own read is also close to "idk mare is pretty tonally townie" i can't really scumread him for it lol

you got a read on me at this point?

[Datisi]

Do you see where I'm going with this?

and umm still don't sr you yet

kinda? but also i don't think it's scum! indicative for iv so yeah

why do you keep saying "yet"?

[Datisi]

this conversation is lowkey tanking my read of andante, feels like scum who saw a townie not feeling like backing up their read in detail and is now trying to make everyone see it as scummy

[Datisi]

don't know if it overrides the points for effort i felt from her earlier but like yeah

[Datisi]

you're town till I sr you then you're maf, that's how I'm dealing with reading you lol what's wrong with yet?

the fuck lol? why would you deal with me like that? and it implies that you WILL scumread me at some point and you're just waiting for me to start being scummy or something, which is weird

[Datisi]

your stubbornness about iv having to provide Reasons and getting annoyed at me not seeing it as scummy feels like a shark that's smelling blood but the swimmer already got out of water and it's scummy, andante

[Datisi]

what's wrong with how I make my reads?

do you treat everyone "town until otherwise" or just me? if just me, why?

[Datisi]

like, weren't you just going at me for not liking how IV made a read?

am i not allowed to question you on two things at the same time?

[Datisi]

you tried to get me to agree with your iv read then started throwing a fit when i said i don't agree lol

[Datisi]

your stubbornness about iv having to provide Reasons and getting annoyed at me not seeing it as scummy feels like a shark that's smelling blood but the swimmer already got out of water and it's scummy, andante

really? to me it was more like "this is what Andante didn't do when she was scum before"

you have exp with her being scum?

[Datisi]

wait, i thought i was scum pocketing iv?

[Datisi]

VOTE: flow trap

[Datisi]

i have interacted with a bunch of other people the fuck you on about lol

[Datisi]

yeah, if someone else is vouchering for your meta and iv think i'm wrong then i'm probably wrong and this argument is a waste of my time

[Datisi]

i have interacted with a bunch of other people the fuck you on about lol

IV hasn't

how does that result in me being scum lel

[Datisi]

i'm a cop with a guilty on andante

[Datisi]

VOTE: flow trap

what caused this vote?

the fact that flow trap went from spam to silence when things started happening, and i don't have better scumreads currently

and i felt stupid holding my vote on skitt when i didn't really scumread her anymore

[Datisi]

[spoiler/]

because fuck you that's why[/spoiler]

oops

[Datisi]

scum!cakez also did play against town!pooky in that c9++ mena modded

[Datisi]

So you think I lied about my computer being broken?

no, frankly i forgot you said that

[Datisi]

This post pinged

Why? It seems like a valid question

i don't know

i think this post is townie

i don't know why, i feel like she would've made something up there if scum

(yeah ik awkward timing to be posting this it is what it is)

[Datisi]

and i felt stupid holding my vote on skitt when i didn't really scumread her anymore

what happened here btw?

not sure what you're asking? i'd been thinking about removing my vote from you for a while bc i wasn't scumreading you anymore, but i didn't want to just unvote and i didn't have a better target for it so i just left it there

then after the spat with andante i felt a need to change my vote again, but i realized i don't actually want to vote andante anymore, so i figured why not go with my earlier thought of how flow went from 100 to 0

[Datisi]

i don't actually want to vote andante anymore

as in, i did want to vote her, but i changed my mind before actually placing a vote, but i was still in a ~vote-changing momentum~ if that makes any sense

[Datisi]

one of the things i care about as scum is having a clean, irreproachable trajectory. what you're describing is very much not that

from around here, this spoke to me i guess

if you're feeling worse on me, why not vote me? what's stopping you from feeling good about that vote

[Datisi]

one of the things i care about as scum is having a clean, irreproachable trajectory. what you're describing is very much not that

from around here, this spoke to me i guess

if you're feeling worse on me, why not vote me? what's stopping you from feeling good about that vote

[Datisi]

i obviously don't believe in 767 anymore but i still believe it made sense based on what i knew at the time, so if you want to discuss it again or something lmk

[Datisi]

ok:

- why did you think scum-me would be basing my read on you based on the thread trajectory / why i would walk back a townread so easily?
- how convinced are you that andante is scum rn?

- because most of the time, i'm a loud annoying mfer who is generally a better idea to pocket than to push. but there are certain games where it takes me longer to get started, and adding to the thread feeling of "datisi is scummy tho right" makes it so much more difficult for me to get properly started at all. and like you said, half the game is a difficult misflip. considering i am a almost-always difficult misflip but sometimes i have a show start and turning the game against me further makes sure i don't have a start at all (like what happened in 1992), i think it's worth for scum to sacrifice a bit of their trajectory points to make sure i'm flippable

- not at all, i'm back to thinking she's town. the fact that s_s said that her behaviour is closer to her town meta than scum meta and the fact that iv also told me i am wrong was enough to kick me out of my tunnel and make me realize what i'm seeing is probably not as scum indicative as i first thought

it's almost 2am and i am half asleep so i will get to any of your other q's tomorrow

[Datisi]

ok fair enuf, have a great night and get some sleep!

just a few more things that i'm gonna leave here for you for tomorrow:
- i feel like your reads are somewhat fickle and that you're walking them back when you get some resistance
- i feel like you're being kinda defensive (nsg back-and-forth, pushing me when i said you pinged me, now this andante thing)
- given that i'm still pushing you, how does that factor into how you're reading me given the first point above? (i.e. why am i not scum trying to misflip you and keeping up this push on you in order to maintain a viable misflip)?

- my reads being fickle is correct and you're saying a factual statement about me this game. but my response to it is "is that scummy?" and i don't want a general "well scum is more likely to change their opinion when faced with backlash" i want an actual answer. do you get the vibe that i am changing my reads in order to placate people and that i'm doing it out of survivalism? do you have any issues with how i've been changing them? if yes, why didn't you ask about them instead of just plopping down the "changing reads when faced with contrary opinions" sticker?

- again, factual statement about my play this game. i'm defensive. i'm defensive as either alignment, i don't think you can pretend that i am not. if you want to talk about whether you think my defensiveness is town or scum motivated, we can do that. but my only response to "you're defensive!!" is "yes, i am, nice to meet you."

- part of it is that i guess i am pocketed by the "scum!me would've tried harder to have a townie trajectory" line. part of it is that, from what i remember of your play and of the games we've played together, the issues you're having with my play is around what i'd expect from town!you? like, i have a degree of self-awareness to know that i'm not my usual obvtowny here. so the things you're pushing do make a degree of sense. why you're not scum who is recognizing these issues anyway, because i know you're capable of it? no idea. call it gut.

[Datisi]

A skitter thing

What do you think scum!skitter does in this game state?

Probably goes more for majority opinion pushes

is this not more-or-less majority push? like, from what i saw, a lot of people have at least some degree of suspicion about me.

Dats, I'm gonna need a better explanation on the 274 vote cause I feel like you need more considering how you said the numbers made me less likely to be scum earlier.

just because i said that the numbers mean you're more likely town than random doesn't mean i'm not gonna vote you if i feel you're being scummy.

[Datisi]

VOTE: midway

why not

[Datisi]

holy shit is this town!iv?

[Datisi]

you feel wrong

[Datisi]

- not that you're trying to placate people per se, more that it makes me think you lack conviction in your reads since you're willing to change them when you recieve pushback, ehich is indeed a trait i associate with scum. Like usually i'd think if you thought X was scum, you'd push them, and try to convince other people etc, and here you're just willing to drop it, which makes me think its not a real read (but rather something you made up) and that you dont want to go against thread consensus.

- ok ehy do you think so much of your iso is being defensive around your reads instead of just pushing the ones you feel strongly about?

- i mean ok, this makes very little sense: i was scum earlier for pushing you at a time when other people were scumreading you because i'm taking advantage of a convenient gamestate, but wheb i double down and push you more i'm getting townread and that logic has gone out the window? This is also kinda why i dont like your reads, this doesnt followthrough from what you were saying before ...

- i mean like... first i'm not sure where you're getting the idea that scum!me would be afraid of going against the thread consensus and be afraid of sticking to my reads. second of all, i do lack conviction in my reads, at least for scumreads. if you wanna actually question why certain things made me change my mind, you're free to do so.

- because i do not have reads that i feel strongly about that i can push (any reads that i feel strongly about are maybe a couple townreads that aren't getting heat right now so i can't really push them anywhere)

- i did this thing called ~changed my mind~: i decided that you saying scum!you would take greater care to have a good trajectory and not mindlessly push me is probably true, and now that you've actually elaborated on your reasons for thinking i'm scum, i don't have a problem with them.

[Datisi]

but nothing in that was about dats being scum

skitter has been pushing me being scum for like 4 years now, what are you on about

[Datisi]

Also, well: why is everyone else's opinion influencing your reads so much?

do you want a holistic "my reads weren't that strong in the first place so the things people said against them were enough to change my mind" or do you want me to go through the times where i changed my mind and specifically write what influenced those? because idk how else to answer it

i'm voting him bc iv present a case that looks good enough on the surface that makes me both townread iv and think it's worth pushing midway and seeing what happens

[Datisi]

VOTE: midwaybear

skimmed chromatic ascension. this isn't the same thing.

VOTE: midway

why not

nope, i voted him after you said why you were voting him

i didn't even read the quotes you posted

[Datisi]

1429 is my "case"?

yes

to be clear i did not read whatever quotes you posted and i am not going to because second-hand meta is useless to me. but the fact you entered with "ok midway is being different than in this other game" made me think you probably have something (because otherwise midway would just vote you back and i don't think scum!you is bold enough to bullshit a meta case without any truth to it) and since my read of midway was lowering anyway, there was no reason for me not to vote

[Datisi]

ye, i read 1431-1433, that's what i called you town for in 1434

i get that "case" in a traditional sense would involve some more arguments, but just saying "midway is playing different here than he did in game xyz" is also a case in my mind, just a very short one

[Datisi]

to be frank with you, it's one of those things where i don't understand why you think i would even lie about this as scum?

[Datisi]

"if you all agree 1429 isn't the case" then you can vote me out and you'll all have an egg on your face when i flip green?

like, the sequence of events is: i read 1429 where you said this isn't the same midway from another game (implying he's scum here because he was town there). iv might be onto something, let's vote there and see what happens. oh look, iv is actually elaborating in 1431-3 on how he is different, iv might actually be town. and i voted midway because iv presented a case on why midway might be scum - midway is acting differently here than this one town!game.

If I don't lie about this, then I have to admit that I didn't actually vote midway because of innocentvillager's case

i mean like, for this to be true, i would have to be such a scum player to forget why i was voting midway in the hour and a half it passed from my vote in 1430 to me explaining my vote in 1467 - i don't understand how *you*, who often praises me as being not shit at being scum, can think *that* is more likely than me, as either alignment, calling 1429 a case on midway

to be clear, i don't mean the above to say you're scummy, i remember you pulling some similar nitpicky bullshit on me in 2207, i'm just saying lol i can't believe what you're forcing me to defend here

[Datisi]

Another case in point: you were scumreading iv as recently as yesterday, but now you want to townread and sheep him on midway?

i was what? oh, you thought that 1203 and 1208 was going to hold any significant influence over his alignment in my mind? i didn't even remember that happened by today, that's how unimportant that was

"but datisi, how can you think iv is scum and then forget about--" that dude fucking *breathes* in a scummy way. if i could hear his keyboard clicking, i'd think it's clicking in a scummy way. if i were to take every single instance where i thought "hey, that was scummy from iv" i would've yeeted him like three times over in this game alone

i call him out for being scummy, partly because of the meme and partly because it leads to interactions with him which sometimes actually are properly readable, but it's not gonna actually stick in my mind as a worthwhile point against him because i know i'm very biased when it comes to reading him

he said he's seeing some ~meta stuff~ that indicates midway is scummy, i decided to sheep him on it to see what comes from it. then he wrote out an elaboration and i decided he's actually looking townie from it. so... yes?

[Datisi]

the reason i say it doesn't count as a scumread is because i am aware that it's not outside of iv's townrange to do something like this and that i am pretty much wasting my time here. but my first thought *was* that it's scummy so i felt it was worthy calling it out anyway.

it's almost like... i acknowledged the read isn't strong and that i'm prone to bias there...

[Datisi]

the *actual* irony in all of this is that this kinda read switching and hopping is actually very difficult for me to fake as scum but c'est la vie

[Datisi]

where the hell are you pulling nsg out from now?

[Datisi]

oh wait, lemme guess, i'm having an interaction with you that is very similar to the interaction i've had with her, and you're town, so you think there's no way it was distancing from a partner?

[Datisi]

i don't townread her anymore

[Datisi]

you got no idea >_>

[Datisi]

Townlean: Something_Smart, Datisi

what made you change my slot from null to townlean?

@Datisi why was cakez very town for u?

fuck if i remember

i said it was something on page 44, let's see

i reread page 44 and i have no clue lmfao. i think it was a mixture of thinking 1093 was like, really Tonally Town and thinking how i don't think scum!cakez would be going out on a limb here to attack pooky the way he is. the argument of "cakez got burned in c9++ for forgetting to fake paranoia so obviously if he drew red here he wouldn't forget it again" is nice, but i'm not sure if scum!cakez would actually be going straight for pooky like this - like it seems more natural to me to fake paranoia in a more lowkey way

this definitely is a read that i should revisit at some point because i kinda tuned cakez's posts out in the recent times but this was why i was townreading him at the time

[Datisi]

- i'm getting bored of my dats vote

first faker calls me heavy, now skitter calls me boring, goddamn >_>

[Datisi]

(i figured, that was an invitation to say where your mind is at wrt me)

[Datisi]

midnight just turned here, so happy new year!

i'm not sober enough to read that whole thing but i can ctrl+f for my name so -- hold on my neighbours are blowing up the whole street with fireworks

ok so

- it did not "take me a little bit to be sure what i was seeing", i wanted ico flipped from page 5, i was just galaxy brain fishing for associates (we saw how well that turned out)
- also i don't really scumread iv at this moment in time so if that's what you're counting as points in my favour maybe scratch that
- i could prob write three full paragraphs about self-meta and my wims as town and scum and that and this game specifically so like if you're interested in that lemme know i guess
- we have not. i think we've only played once as t/t in a recent white flag game, where nsg repped in like lateish d1 and i was fearkilled n1 so yknow

[Datisi]

okay so

at first i probably was scumreading iv, but like the big point there is that like i scumread iv every game lol. like he breathes in a scummy way. so the fact that i was scumreading him doesn't actually say anything about his alignment (or my own for that matter bc i would probably have to fake that) and like i am aware that he sounds vvvv scummy to me regardless his alignemtn so you knwo

big self meta bullshit that nobody cares about:

when i am obvtown, i am obvtown. like. that game you saw we played together, was one of my *holy shit datisi is town* games. my towngame sometimes looks like that - and general rule of thumb is that it looks like that when i have reads i have a degree of confidence in (not necessarily when they're good reads lmao) so. then there are games like this one, where... i don't have very confident reads at the start here. and like the thing is, 95% of my reads are gut, and i still don't know exactly what triggers them, so it's not like i can actually try to make the gamestate be so i get more reads -- p much all i can do is tap in the dark and poke around until my gut does get triggered by stuff.

this ability to make gutreads early-to-midgame is especially hindered if most of the game thinks i'm scum already - that is what i was talking about with skitter. those instances are *very* rare, but they happen, and i think skitter is aware of that considering she was there for one of my meltdowns like that. which is why i was like "oh skitter is trying to make me relive newbie 1992 huh" (which, fun fact, was *the game* that made me swear on never playing in a newbie game again because holy shit i am not a good example to newbies but anyway uh)

also fun fact fun fact: whenever someone was like "i played with datisi in [game] and he was obvtown there and he's not obvtown here" i was town!! every single goddamn time that happened i was town!! anyway

i don't think it is true that i "care more" as scum but i think it does appear that i care more as scum simply because i am chatting in the pt often and helping the team make plans (iv knows about this one ) but also i do try harder to maintain a thread presence. like in town games i am like "ok if i'm not getting reads rn, i'll step away and try again" and as scum i DON'T do that because i am well aware i am never going to "get reads" as scum because i already know everyone's alignments and so i never have a reason to "step off" from the game so (and no i don't try to fake stepping off from the game bc my posting schedule is so inconsistent anyway there's no way to know) -- but also as scum i am extremely paranoid and scared that i will be found out (seriously read some of my notes pts when i am scum they are a hot mess) so i kinda try harder to maintain thread presence and appear to be driving the game forward because i KNOW i can't reach the level of read purity that i have as town so i try to make it up by sheer presence and volume of posts and also being really loud and sometimes doing bullshit that makes you think "surely haha surely scum wouldn't do that"

but yeah the level of obvtowniness you saw from me in that one game we played? i (yet) cannot fake that shit as scum so

/end big self meta bullshit that nobody cares about:

i honestly have NO CLUE how nsg would be approaching me as scum because (1) i don't know what nsg's opinion is of my towngame considering we played like, very briefly and (2) i have no clue how scum!nsg operates, what she finds important, how she plans to win the game so like -- i genuinely have no idea how nsg would approach me

if that question was supposed to be "how do you plan to read nsg", the answer is sorta "wait until a bit later game, if she stops doing Really Good Analsysiy start pressuring her and go from there"

ok

this post is a drunken mess i am sorry

[Datisi]

i like to think my english is good but in altered states of mind it sometimes starts to Slipp

if it's not legible i can rewrite it tomorrow i guess

did you like it at least

[Datisi]

and sometimes doing bullshit that makes you think "surely haha surely scum wouldn't do that"

this is lowkey my favorite scum tactic because it's easier than genuine effort

i will regret saying this in a future scumgame

that makes it sweeter though

because there's an added layer of "are they doing the thing they said they love to do as scum" wifom

[Datisi]

i actually cared a lot about that post tho LOL idk if that's me putting too much on meta like i think ur being truthful about that regardless of your alignment here

yeah because i was totally about to spew lies about my meta while in a playerlist where half the game knows my meta LOL

[Datisi]

Datisi can you provide an example of a towngame where you said something similar to your self meta wall? and like, were scumread by the game for not being towny enough and you had to explain why?

i don't think i've ever done a complete self-meta wall like that, mostly because nobody ever asked lol

however, there have been games where i've gotten "wow datisi you were very towny in [towngame] and you're not townie here, are you scum?" and i had to defend with "not every towngame is like that, leave me alone"

the first thing that comes to mind is these two posts from chara's folly, which is an over a year old game at this point but i think the meta is still valid considering my scumgame hasn't ascended to the point of being able to fake my obvtowniness. (and before you ask "who the fuck is tanner and why are you linking his posts", that's my public alt)

Spoiler:

some games the townspewing machine is simply broke and i get executed and then people go "wait how did that flip town??"

I don't have any big points. It's just that I've played a really traumatic game with TownTisi and he was so blatantly obviously town like it was as obvious as the sun in the sky.

here there is just darkness

fun fact, i've heard this before.

i had a game where i was blatantly obviously town similar to [game that shall not be named], autumnal mafia. and the people that played in that game used the "datisi was so towny in that game, he's not here, is he scum???". and guess what, i was town every single time that happened:

Datisi hasn’t struck me as particularly Town yet, which I expect from them early on.

Comparing to the last game [autumnal mafia] we played?

Yes, you were very obviously Town that game from early on. Not sure if it was just that game? I’ll have a look back.

I don't actually have a solid scumread on Datisi. It's some mixture of an lolsolve/paranoia/gut. I don't know how to articulate it. I guess it's also notable that Datisi was obvtown in Autumnal but isn't here, but that's not solid either.

I feel like I'm not remotely interested in voting Datisi but Autumnal he was absurd to the point I would bodyguard him after I got public copped so it doesn't seem good relatively.

[Datisi]

there's also this post from the recently finished anyhing upick where pooky was grilling me for not being obvtown to his standards:

But why are you convinced on Datisi!scum? How is he different here than from Yin and Yang? Obviously not including micro since he was bleeding obvtown in that game.

he's nothing like yin and yang rofl

he was so obvtown in yin/yang you could see it from space

and now that i look back on these examples, i notice just how often pooky's mind goes "datisi not being obvtown? datisi scum???" and he recently also fucked up my record of not getting misyeeted as town which is lowkey making me wonder why he hasn't been paranoid about me this game at all LMAO

[Datisi]

sleepless, what did you get from my drunken ramble?

[Datisi]

and to make sure we completely shoot ourselves in the foot, we then also picked multitasking, yeah you got it iv

[Datisi]

but if two scum picked 1, they already knew they sure as hell aren't gonna be anywhere close to the top

coupled with 1 being a pretty popular pick for town too...

[Datisi]

like if i had randed scum with pooky and he was like "i am picking 1 fuck you" i probably would've just let him and picked something else instead because i don't actually care to argue with him about it

[Datisi]

Datisi. I can confirm that that post is in fact a drunken mess.

true but probably a town one tbh

hm?

[Datisi]

it was kinda ~honest~ especially since you wrote it while drunk, feels a little too elaborate and *real* for scum-drunk-you to come up with

i mean it was honest yeah, but like it was facts of (1) i always scumread iv (2) what my meta is (3) i don't know what nsg scumgame is like - it's things that even if i wanted to lie about them, there's no gain for me to lie about them, and there's no way for me to get away with lying about them

if you wanna make an argument that it's tonally town or something then maybe, but honest? yes it was honest but do you imagine scum!me would've lied about any of that? or how do you imagine scum!me would write it

also i haven't read the huge post yet and i'm watching something rn so i'll read it in a bit

[Datisi]

i feel like when you say you always scumread me it confuses people into thinking you actually think I’m scum

can u find a different phrasing looool

i do think you're scum! i am just also aware that my read on you and your actual alignment don't actually correlate at all! but yes i get how that could be confusing

[Datisi]

hmm

I mean I just feel like I had a self meta argument that convincing (look I was town in all these games where people scumread me for not being obvtown - that’s why you shouldn’t kill me for not being obvtown) I would be eager to bullshit that too and could do it drunk

i am also pretty aware that writing self meta is actually rarely convincing to most people because *ahem* Self Meta Bad, and also i wasn't actually doing it while someone wanted to kill me so

i am trying to think of scum!me and whether i would be able to / want to write a post like that as scum, and i'm not actually sure - but that doesn't really matter anyway. the more important question is whether i think town!skitter could use a post like that to townread me, and i think the answer is yes. i'm not sure if scum!skitter like, gains anything by forcing a townread of me there, and she potentially gets heat for "why are you townreading datisi for talking about self meta" because Self Meta Bad(tm) so yeah makes sense to me

[Datisi]

Datisi why do I change my mind on you every time I talk to you

you're changing your mind because i assumed that self-meta wouldn't have gotten me out of trouble, if i had even been in trouble because i wasn't, with a post that you yourself agreed was nai in the first place

like at this point i don't even know what to tell you

[Datisi]

it was mostly a protest vote.

is this something you do as scum? i wanted to townread it, but then i realized i might be falling for the "just because i've seen this person do this as town, doesn't mean it's actually town indicative" fallacy

[Datisi]

@skitt, i read the wall, and i'm like - at least half the time, i was thinking "oh right, i forgot [person] is in the game"

the fact that even after a full read i could not tell you a single Actual Read that sleepless has is problematic, but i'm not quite sure if it's due the post not having any or me just losing focus every three seconds.

I'm slightly surprised not to see Datisi have any issue with Innocentvillager. We kind of mind melded on Iconeum after a bad entrance last game even though it took him a little bit to be sure on what he was seeing.

i thought this part ^^ was kinda townie, like i can sorta see the "i mindmelded with this person previous game, now i'm not, scum?" but like, he doesn't do *much* to push that forward so that is kind of diminished then i guess

the rest of it feels like a lot of words for nothing, overall can see busy town write it and can see scum write it i guess

[Datisi]

Can people explain why they are unwilling to vote Cakez?

i'm not exactly unwilling, he has fallen off in the recent times obviously, thought i'd need to revisit your reasons for thinking he's scum

it just feels like there's too many "this person needs a push" people right now >_>

[Datisi]

faker r u ok

[Datisi]

Do you like race cars, Datisi?

uh, they're cool, i guess

[Datisi]

sorry, i am only able to connect meanings to posts if they're 5 pixels or less to each other, can you please include some arrows or something for me too

[Datisi]

(that was a jab only at myself if that wasn't clear)

[Datisi]

VOTE: midwaybear

i still really don't want to kill the best town player on d1 (yes that is a real thought i have as town too) but ya idk what my tiger read is anymore

despite iv admitting he sometimes does "too stupid to be scum" stuff earlier in this game, i am tempted to townread his nonsense vote/unvote of skitter

[Datisi]

@sleepless pls answer 1671

@pooky pls answer 1672

[Datisi]

sleepless, what did you get from my drunken ramble?

Can you quote it for me?

...

1648

the thing you asked me to write

[Datisi]

Do you have anything that you have noticed town-him does as scum, specifically? Do you think I'm falling into that same trap seeing him for the first time?

not sure what "noticed town-him does as scum" means... and i don't know. my first encounter with iv was when we were scumpartners, so it's difficult for me to say what first impressions of him *should* be.

After seeing your first game I got the impression you have a strong scum game and I think a few people even said as much.

why does seeing my one "good" towngame make you think i have a strong scum game? is it anything other than "well good town game = probably a strong player = probably a strong scum game"? not really ai, i'm just curious.

Do you think I'm way off and should drop it or is this something that is possible?

i don't actually know, you could be onto something. the only things i know about nsg's scumgame are general things that i've heard from other people here and there, which is that she's lower effort as scum, struggles to keep motivation up, and similar stuff. so in that frame, it's not *impossible* i guess.

here's a question, can i get your general view on the gamestate or on the people's alignments or something? like, doesn't have to be super detailed, i just wanna see where your mind is at. (and typing that, i get the feeling i asked you the exact same thing last game. hm. anyway.)

[Datisi]

I meant what town-him does that looks scummy.

mm, not sure if i could identify it precisely. i think it's his tendency to sometimes be troll-y or meme around as town, which i often i register as him avoiding solving. and i think his town mind sometimes uses moonlogic which i register as him bs'ing. those are my best guesses.

[Datisi]

what is beetlejuicing?

popping in when you're mentioned

like if i don't post shit for 2 days, someone says "datisi might be scum tho", and 3 seconds in i'm there like "no fuck you i'm not"

and it's scummy bc it shows that you are reading the game but not responding or something, idk

can you tell me what you find unfakeable in 1669?

[Datisi]

for completely inexplicable reasons, i still think cakez is town

no i don't know why, don't ask

[Datisi]

boi, do you want me to scumread your ass here

[Datisi]

boi, do you want me to scumread your ass here

yes because you have shown you read me wrong before so if you SR me here things will be in balance

my record of reading you is currently 2/3, can you piss off

i don't see it

you see maf writing 1903? and like the amount of effort catboi is giving? like I'm pretty sure he's not maf

lmao what

i think i would say that this post is townie from andante, because i genuinely cannot imagine scum going "you know what, i will call 1903 townie for effort" like what is the effort in that post? pressing the quote button? it's so wack it's probably coming from town

i guess i kinda object to your classifying that wall as 'ambitious' as scum, i think for a lot of people coming in with a wallpost like that to catch up is a lot easier as scum than interacting with, like, everything else

Yes, but that's not what would come to mind when I think of a typical catchup. I wouldn't even call it a catchup, it's more of a summary of his thoughts on topics he deemed important. At least in my own experience, a quotestripe is usually pretty easy to do as scum but something planned out and organized like that would be harder.

i think i want to say that s_s is probably townie for this assessment - like, if he's scum with sleepless, i don't get why he makes a post like this that can be traced back to him later instead of just pushing someone else. and if he's scum without sleepless, why does he post this. i dunno, i think the thoughts here are also a bit more nuance-y than what i'd expect from scum!s_s here in this context, it just feels... weird that he'd choose this to focus on, idk

also i think i have started to Not Townread mare at some point in this game, might have to decide if it's an actual scumread by now

[Datisi]

it just feels... weird that he'd choose this to focus on

oh, i just realized why my subconsciousness was reading it as townie

we're running out of time, right? and scum!s_s was already getting kinda pressed for not really, like, doing things this game. and coming out with a defense of a slot that's currently a wagon contender while not really pushing anyone else risks you being called out for "well who do you want to wagon instead?" and the answer "idk lol" then risks people scumreading you for obviously not giving a shit what goes through. and he's not really pushing elsewhere or even giving ideas as to where we should be pushing. doesn't seem like something an experienced scum does

now i know this read might be not that applicable to s_s considering i think he's not really that much of a driving force as town usually, so maybe it would make sense if scum!him thinks he can get away with that here where most people know his meta, but uh yeah idk lole

[Datisi]

people i actively don't want to wagon: datisi, s_s, skitter, cakez, andante, iv

people i don't have strong reasons to wagon but could if it was really needed: sleepless, northsidegal, catboi, faker

poe: flow, mare, pooky, midway

[Datisi]

not sure if s_s should be in the first tier at the moment but whatever

[Datisi]

I want a Pooky, Mare or Midway wagon
Could also be sold on SS or catboi or maaaaybe flow trap or NSG

bruh why are you copying my reads

[Datisi]

can we also discuss why is pooky not even pretending to be trying to sort me

[Datisi]

My method of sorting you in almost every game is to leave your ass alone and you will eventually say something that makes me hard-townread you for ?!? reasons because I think hey there's no way scum!tisi makes that post.

you also entered white flag screaming for my head and rc's anything upick screaming for my head

and you were giving me shit in both chara's folly and yin and yang for not being Obvtown Enough

but ok

[Datisi]

lol townbinning datisi for now

why is this a "lol" worthy sentence

[Datisi]

don't the numbers say that the neighbourizer is like a 17/18 a town role or something - i think the pyp i ran in august was the first time in history it was a scum role, and scum beat like 3 townies who all went for neighborizer

[Datisi]

pedit i'm like p sure i had neighborizer as scum 2x

i'm talking pyp games

if i'm correctly recalling the the thread s_s made, at that time it was 16/16 town

[Datisi]

i am physically incapable of receiving a red role pm

[Datisi]

I still don't understand why Harvard Medical School is asking me to provide a two page communist-classist interpretation of & response to Craig Morgan's "Redneck Yacht Club", but I guess they know what makes a good doctor better than I do.

"not available in your country"

[Datisi]

every minute spent listening to country music is a minute spent not being in hell that is playing mafia

i can probably find it myself but i just wanted to mention the bs that is youtube

[Datisi]

my focus isn't here currently and i am also tired but if you have anything specific you want to ask me or have me look at, let me know

[Datisi]

it's a bit embarrassing how long it took me to register what the question is asking. the green one, clearly.

[Datisi]

it appears to be a car, perhaps a racing car, running over some sort of animal. it resembles a tiger.

[Datisi]

maybe it's gonna be like that old pyp game where we did nothing for the whole day then in the last 3 hours we scrambled and flipped scum

two days in a row

[Datisi]

VOTE: flow

[Datisi]

hi friends, i actually have Things to do today so i'm not able to properly catch up until like 5? hours from now and ik the deadline is close, so if anyone needed me for anything urgent, pls point me in that direction, thank you

[Datisi]

Town: datisi

when and how did this happen lol

[Datisi]

ok, that's when, what's the how

[Datisi]

ok, that's when, what's the how

it's a secret

[Datisi]

i think i officially went from "having a vague idea what is going on" to "being completely lost"

pedit: idk lol gut

[Datisi]

fuk u i was typing that before you did

i'm still out the house and i've been doing shit the whole day so if you want my updated opinion that will have to wait as i haven't even caught up yet

[Datisi]

people i played against on lichess either wreck my ass in 5 moves or blunder their queen in 3 moves, no in-between

[Datisi]

holy hell

[Datisi]

oh hello there

[Datisi]

they aren't alts

[Datisi]

Why do you want to kill flow trap?

they started off posting like 100 posts pet minute (tbf most of the game was spamming at the time) and like 97.3% of their posts were no actual content

and then they suddenly stopped posting, i think it was because their computer broke down or something? but from that point on, if you asked me for *one* content post that they made, i could not tell you. one read of theirs. no idea.

i missed ~10 pages bc today was busy and i'm in the process of catching up but this is the reason why my vote is there

[Datisi]

they aren't alts

>.>

<.<

i mean, flow played in one of my newbies so i knew they aren't an alt, and i just assumed a 2009'er isn't an alt, sorry if i am wrong

[Datisi]

i can't recall a time where he was seriously pushed. the only time ive actually seen him get flipped was as scum in 2167 when he finally got flashed he put up very little resistance and just memed and rolled over after playing pretty well for most of the early game.

I got pushed in Chromatic Ascension and Mini Normal 2195 (where I was actually pushed by scum Datisi lol). So you can look at my final posts there if you want to see how town!me reacts to elim pressure (and I was elimed in both games).

*intense ptsd*

but yeah. from what i remember of that game (pls don't make me go back to reread i don't want to go back to reread), i think midway was acting kind-of similarly to how he was acting in 2180, and that i *heavily* abused that. so, might not be completely scum!indicative.

[Datisi]

Okay, thank

why haven't you outed a read on me yet

[Datisi]

Okay, thank

why haven't you outed a read on me yet

Bc I’ve been here all of 5 mins and haven’t played in like 4 months

i have posted at least 3 posts in that time