open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: Enchant

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Enchant

your current play is the least helpful thing you could possibly be doing atm

[Alyssa The Lamb]

great

I'm glad we had this experience

[Alyssa The Lamb]

because of voting patterns the way they were - i believe we *don't* have a n3 vig

bingo

[Alyssa The Lamb]

the more you talk about me, the more fake it sounds

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Humhum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

So Enchant

What exactly are your thoughts on the game as a whole

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Very interesting

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I want to analyze a bit, but I feel like the game is simply solved from here just at a glance

Hold

[Alyssa The Lamb]

So Enchant

What exactly are your thoughts on the game as a whole

We are in ass.

Also, WHY THE FUCK YOU CAN'T EVEN DECIDE WHO TO LIM BUT THEN "WOW ENCHANT THAT WAS WORST PLAY".

Like, i even told you what to do.

K

So what are your thoughts on the game as a whole

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Ftr I think the second scum is obvious by now with an Enchant scumflip

I think my PoE is pretty much the same as it was yesterday, just with Enchant being way more likely now than yesterday

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Gonna have to explain the skitter scumread to me

[Alyssa The Lamb]

What do you think of everybody's entrances this day phase

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Hi I'll be around soon

I still think you should look at entrances today

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Eh I was hoping for a little beyond what you actually looked at but I see the ambiguity

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean, I guess I'll just say it

I think the scumteam is exactly Enchant + Datisi + Something_Smart

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Why datisi fwiw.
I feel his lack of engagement in thread is a toss up.

Datisi is kinda slotted into the 4th "scum" slot for me atp

Who would be a backup scum if either datisi or SS were modconfirmed town?

skitter

[Alyssa The Lamb]

wow look only one kill
i am shocked
SHOCKED i tell you

okay, assuming that scum!mare doesn't take neighbourizer as top scum in draft: from my pov, either the team is exactly catboi/alyssa/kaiji, or enchant is lying.

anything that disproves that team?

HOODED WITH ENCHANT

VOTE: ENCHANT

good shit

i am increasingly angry we did not vote him out yesterday

and I think this set of posts is scummy af

[Alyssa The Lamb]

fwiw

I still think my general take on Mare being town because of no action on night one is still valid, which inherently makes Enchant scum by default

I still think my reasons for townreading catboi are valid
I still think that Pooky/Menalque both setting up the claim is not indicative of that slot being town, especially if someone like Something_Smart is scum with them; I feel like skitter is a little bit too careful as scum to want to buy into that too much, and I'm kinda iffy on how many other slots would really buy into that as much as they did without hard selling it when the time was right

atm I think what happened is that Menalque just mega fucked the plan with the claim and the scumteam have been wanting to distance away from it so that it doesn't bring the entire team down

I lowkey think Datisi outright TMIed the exact scenario we're in with 6243

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm not really fond of how skitter approached it either but it's nowhere near as egregious

[Alyssa The Lamb]

eh actually skitter's entrance is fine

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it's possible

[Alyssa The Lamb]

with Mare/Catboi being town and Enchant/Datisi being scum

Kaiji doesn't fit the profile of somebody that would make these kills

You and Skitter both do, but I think Skitter looks a bit more town

that's basically it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

don't you love rhythm games in the sense that if you slow it down to like 70 or 80% speed, it gets like 50x harder

that's my life right now

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I don't generally buy into NKA much, but I'm clearly out of tune with how people think, just, in general.

I think that a Kaiji-scum/catboi-town world only makes sense if scum did have the N3 vig and Kaiji was just angling to win yesterday, and even then I find it unlikely that Kaiji would see that as the easiest way to win.

The nightkills this game very strongly signify a "stable" type mindset

You and skitter are the types of players I strongly expect to have that type of mindset

Kaiji (at least I suspect as much) and myself are players that have an "unstable" type mindset

aka the nightkills this game aren't trying to fuck with people, they're playing around mechanics and avoiding PoEs

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I subscribe to everything

because everything has a place and nothing is always useful

[Alyssa The Lamb]

is this a game where Kaiji would kill midwaybear on night two?

even at this point I can only see "prevents him from being conftown" as a compelling reason why he was a good kill at all

[Alyssa The Lamb]

okay

so who in this playerlist kills midwaybear night 2

[Alyssa The Lamb]

the doctor was also leashed

you could really just kill whoever you wanted and then kill midwaybear afterwards if people buy that their actions are legitimate

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it's not like the scumteam are going to have to worry about getting screwed over by a watcher or a jailkeeper

and if kaiji is scum, then what are the odds he even 'gambits' that Andante would do what she did

but then you run into the same problem of him just arbitrarily pushing a really odd tunnel on a slot that was pretty much just town based on that one action alone

[Alyssa The Lamb]

galron was 100% the best choice for a kill last night and I think borderline every single possible scumteam in this game would've made that kill

[Alyssa The Lamb]

that slot was one of town's last PRs
it was probably never going to be voted out
it's the only remaining town role that can catch scum in any way
it sheds no light at all on the tension in the game outside of Kaiji's tunnel

really there just isn't a better choice

[Alyssa The Lamb]

and... that's playing with mechanics and avoiding PoEs

that's not a kill made just to fuck with people

[Alyssa The Lamb]

like when I have a choice in who to kill, 80+% of the time I will go for the slots that are either the least likely to buy into the narrative that all the wrong towns are pushing, or the ones that are the most likely to shut down the wrong thought processes. Kills tend to look really odd when I'm scum because I don't just kill people that have good reads or that are just competent players just for those reasons alone

I suspect Kaiji is a similar type of player, but I think that's a bit more on the rare side since that's more of a "mastermind" type scum mindset since generally those types of kills have a tendency to make town more unpredictable in the short term and so it's harder to really make those types of plans work

I'd argue most people probably fit under the more stable type of mindsets, but this game feels way more like a textbook example of it than anything, which is one of the reasons I think Kaiji just isn't likely to be scum this game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I suspect Kaiji is a similar type of player, but I think that type of playstyle is a bit more on the rare side since that's more of a "mastermind" type scum mindset since generally those types of kills have a tendency to make town more unpredictable in the short term and so it's harder to really make those types of plans work

edited so it looks less awkward

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Mare really needs to play

[Alyssa The Lamb]

The mostly full list is in my iso somewhere

Might have to fix catbois and kaijis though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

So Datisi

Your thought processes in those posts are janky and incongruent with each other

And it's really not worthwhile to engage into that when your response to anything I say is to unproductively snark about it and then afterwards have no real opinion on my slot despite not leaving any real opinions on the slots you're actually townreading, at least that I can see

Your thoughts look fake and I see nothing to townread about you when I can find reasons to townread just about every slot, and you can outright see this if you read my posts

And having zero opinion of me at this stage is really fucking sus, idc if I'm in the PoE for being harder to townread than other slots since that's generally fair (and you even went about it in a town way in holiday dance despite me being even more blatantly town), but you and skitter both have given me this sense that you aren't even assessing me in any way, which is very often a scum tactic from those that aren't super confident scum players

[Alyssa The Lamb]

And having zero opinion of me at this stage is really fucking sus, idc if I'm in the PoE for being harder to townread than other slots since that's generally fair (and you even went about it in a town way in holiday dance despite me being even more blatantly town), but you and skitter both have given me this sense that you aren't even assessing me in any way, which is very often a scum tactic from those that aren't super confident scum players

You're in my poe, and i dont know how to assess your olay rn

Do you think i should be townreading you? If so, why?

I'd expect you to not be as 2d with your reads as you are now

You played like I would expect you as town to play earlier in the game and it feel off a cliff big time

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'd expect you to not be as 2d with your reads as you are now

You played like I would expect you as town to play earlier in the game and it feel off a cliff big time

Busy irl
Not an excuse but it is what it is, i didnt have the mental capacity for this last week

Ought i be townreadinf you now?

I don't ever expect a townread from you

I at least expect you to be parsing me

[Alyssa The Lamb]

This always feels shitty to say, but I really feel like catboi would be playing better from a dayplay perspective if he was scum

This is usually the benchmark for how I parse mariar too

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I at least expect you to be parsing me

You're gonna hate this but i feel like i dont have much to read you with

Okay

What is your general thoughts on me then

I would find it hard to believe that you forget I'm in the game at all

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Idk

If I assume SS is town, then Kaiji gets more likely to be scum

The issue is I can't even tell if these suspicions on him are convincing to me or not

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I dont like you trying to get the nolim yesterday

W h a t

When did this happen

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Yeah I'm kinda stumped on how to even respond to that

Nolim only makes any sense if there's a n3 vig at risk and I was pretty adamant at least a couple times that I was pretty certain there wasn't

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Also because we no limmed yesterday, we lose if we get it wrong now

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Now that I think about it, I'm suddenly extremely annoyed that my idea to kill outside of the guilty was shut down yesterday

We had no reason not to once it was clear there wasn't a n3 vig

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Skitter if that was towards the end then that was literally just me trying to get a flip at all

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That's some pretty wild recursion right there

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm tired

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Nothing that's being said is changing my thoughts about the game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alyssa but who else shares your thoughts? Are you not worried about that?

I mean

The slots that aren't really here are the ones I need to convince

But like I'm not seeing anything from skitter or datisi that wouldn't be hard to fake and I still see them as being more likely to hold scum than you being scum

So

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Actually I do have one thought

Mares posting makes me feel better about my townread on that slot

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean if people have specific things they want to talk to me about I'll talk to them

But I'm starting to get busy with other things again so it's going to be a little harder to just do stuff just because

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Catboi how confident are you in reading kaiji

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I kinda feel like his trajectory the last few days is still sensible and actually inherently town indicative, but I want a check on it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I am making a couple assumptions

But I'm not seeing them as likely to be wrong in a vacuum unless we have a very odd scumteam

[Alyssa The Lamb]

What do you need to have a foothold in the game?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alright

Well I'm rapidly losing faith that this game is winnable

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Okay

Is there an ingame reason that this might be happening?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean

Rereading is generally detrimental to most people

[Alyssa The Lamb]

No I just generally don't think I'm very accurate and rereading tends to be actively detrimental to my reads, contrary to popular wisdom

How do you generally get your reads

Like what type of logic

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Ok

Catboi

The scumteam don't need to do any gymnastics to win from this stage, almost every possible scumteam would simplify what they want to do in order to ensure they get that one inevitable game winning elim

So does anything change with that info, especially since that doesn't mean they necessarily have to search for it today?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Ftr from your POV, looking at how people are treating your 1v1 is probably going to be the best way to get accurate reads since that's the thing you uniquely know the answer of and simultaneously the thing that town and mafia have different levels of knowledge on

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'd argue that Datisi is really obvious scum from that mindset but I won't explain why in case you're able to figure that out yourself

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Kaiji my main doubt about you is that you're saying all this about me when you were pushing me as scum yesterday too

It really is probably just better to go into your thought process changes yesterday since it would address both of these, and it would give the others more to get reads off of since they'll probably be the main ones having to decide this

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I independently have thoughts about that

But I don't see value in outing then immediately until after this is resolved

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Just indicating why your reads shifted throughout d3 is probably enough kaiji

Like when they happened and why

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Kaiji you're acting similarly to how you were when you were scumreading me

[Alyssa The Lamb]

It's not

[Alyssa The Lamb]

btw I never said you're playing poorly

I said you're being completely insufferable

my apologies if i said something that felt shutting down - i am autistic and miss cues and directly telling me does help me recalibrate and realize what im doing (which is what im doing now)


as the saying goes - beggars cant be choosers - and if youre one of the only ones even remotely willing to interact and discuss i need to take that and im willing to yield ground here.

I mean more along this vein

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alright well

Give me a bit and I'll go into my final solve and why I'm leaning that way

I think I'm never going to be able to get enough to correct it if I'm wrong

[Alyssa The Lamb]

By give me a bit I mean probably until evening time

I'm at work for a good while yet

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Also holy hell I've been in this game almost a full month

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I deadass have a huge problem with giving myself too many obligations

[Alyssa The Lamb]

lol

I wrote my whole big thing and then lost it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

fuck that shit I'm out

[Alyssa The Lamb]

tl;dr

Mare is just town
catboi is very likely just town
Kaiji is just town
S_S is probably town

Skitter is scum for being extremely indecisive and not having any progression in her reads for the sheer amount of questions she's asking and amount of times she's engaging, she's also almost certainly the one-shot vig
Datisi is scum because his early posts this day phase are one big incongruency (faked excitement followed by lukewarm TMI in a very short timeframe)
Enchant is scum because duh

All three make sense as scum together because
1. it makes the most sense that active players are scum
2. they have had the most lukewarm progressions and have done very little to progress the game for their activity level
3. it makes complete sense that they would push Kaiji like this since he's the easier target to push between him and myself, we are the two slots that are the most threatening to them at this point, and scum only need to ensure one kill in order to win so a sudden oversimplification of how someone is viewing the game is significantly more likely to be scum indicative at this stage of the game

done

I'm not writing all that shit up again and wasting another two hours on it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it wasn't.

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I have a feeling this game is going to go on for another month

[Alyssa The Lamb]

anyway I'm pretty much fine with just ending the day today

if Enchant is town then this game just wasn't winnable in the first place anyways

[Alyssa The Lamb]

shrug

VOTE: Enchant

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I wouldn't even be upset if enchant dying ends the game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Good to know Enchant is scum!

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Enchant now can't be town unless the team is exactly Mare + catboi + me

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I hope so

[Alyssa The Lamb]

understandable have a nice day

[Alyssa The Lamb]

was it really a wasted shot when it was on one of the invested obvious town in the game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

hey remember how mafia has literally fucking never doubled up on numbers? isn't that funny?

the fact that it's pooky makes this not really a point

[Alyssa The Lamb]

the only other person I'm ever going to consider is SS

[Alyssa The Lamb]

deadass I do not have the energy for this game today

[Alyssa The Lamb]

idk the fact that I correctly townread both Andante and Mare off really simple things and maintained them pretty much up to their deaths is pretty much enough for me

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I was going to say that I really doubt there's a mafia vengeful

and then I remembered that mare was neighborizer so that doesn't actually prove anything

[Alyssa The Lamb]

also is there any reason whatsoever for me to engage into datisi here

if he's legit scum like I still think is more likely than not, then it's just going to devolve into a nonsense back and forth drowning out the game and just remove any efficacy my points on him have

[Alyssa The Lamb]

actually I wonder if these weird reads on me was because I was getting correct reads off odd mechanical decisions like that

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm becoming more and more convinced that these kills were planned out in advance rather than decided upon the night they happened

[Alyssa The Lamb]

lol

[Alyssa The Lamb]

so skitter is >90% sure I'm scum after doing zero critical thought on my alignment for multiple day phases

yeah that's a legit thought process

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm becoming more and more convinced that these kills were planned out in advance rather than decided upon the night they happened

Idk why u keep talking abt this, or why this is important

and what exactly do you mean by "keep talking about this"

[Alyssa The Lamb]

also you're actually fucking nuts if you think I would feel safe having pocketed the single most volatile person in the game

frankly I value pockets very little in general, but I don't expect anyone to believe that offhand

but relying on being townread from the slot that is the most likely to just arbitrarily turn on me (considering HE LITERALLY DID THAT EARLIER IN THE GAME ALREADY) is such a bad play

[Alyssa The Lamb]

When kaiji started pushing me hard yesterday, you basically threw ur weight behind his solve, with very little critical thought of your own, and *that's exactly how scum-you plays this out*

what

[Alyssa The Lamb]

did I enter a different dimension or something

[Alyssa The Lamb]

btw no I don't kill Mare sorry

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Not sure what you're saying

it means that never happened

[Alyssa The Lamb]

was literally anybody except for me believing that Enchant + Datisi were a scumteam up until Kaiji started warming up to it towards the end of the day?

that's literally what I pushed with you as the most likely candidate as the third because I was just townreading everybody else

saying that I just sheeped Kaiji yesterday is almost disturbingly wrong

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm not townreading him anymore

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go ignore the thread for a little bit so that people forget I exist even though this is one of the most highkey situations one could find themselves in at the lategame

I need to make sure I don't accidentally say something that will turn Kaiji against me, if you know what I mean

[Alyssa The Lamb]

What's your solve today then ?

Who do you want to flip?

I'll decide that when I figure it out

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go ignore the thread for a little bit so that people forget I exist even though this is one of the most highkey situations one could find themselves in at the lategame

I need to make sure I don't accidentally say something that will turn Kaiji against me, if you know what I mean

this is a very snarky way of saying I'm going to bed btw

[Alyssa The Lamb]

This day one flow trap argument feels really reachy

[Alyssa The Lamb]

If that's still one of your main arguments when it's one of those types of information that's most prone to change with flips, especially when you're suddenly sure, it doesn't look genuine at all

[Alyssa The Lamb]

And idk how Enchant + Mare even affects it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Actually not even enchant since he was consensus scum yesterday

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm pretty certain Kaiji never survives this long if skitter and I are both scum

The game gets a lot simpler for us when he's not in the game and both of us together could probably brute force a win from this spot

Instead we kill... Mare. Ok

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm pretty sure Kaiji means yesterday

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean

What exactly is there to prove or disprove that theory

Because the town version of that is I just think you're scum and don't feel like putting effort in

That's not exactly out of my townrange in a game like this

[Alyssa The Lamb]

And wrt yesterday - i mean sure, but its a lot easier to fit scum-me into your pov than scum-kaiji all of a sudden.

Reassessing is a thing

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Kaiji and catboi are town

Idk anymore on the rest

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I've had a pretty good read on the game from my townread side on flips so I'm fairly confident that those reads are more likely to be correct then my scum reads

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean, if skitter is ascetic cop, Mare can guilty her.

She can't be

I had her pegged as cop d2 and she didn't play like one immediately after d3 started

It would've been more beneficial to keep it up at that stage than immediately break it I think

[Alyssa The Lamb]

As in, it would have to be almost entirely deliberate for her to be playing like a cop and just arbitrarily dropping it only to claim VT feels like a really dumb move

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Datisi

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Ok currently leaning:

We no lim

Enchant checks Alyssa.

No.

My prevailing thought regarding no kill is that Enchant, if scum, just claims a guilty on a town, the scumteam kill whatever town is most likely to see through the deception, and they just need to convince whatever other towns are left that they're right and they're simply home free

I still really hate this sequence as well

And why do I can it out instead of letting that exact sequence happen and killing him the next day exactly

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Call it out

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean

Who am I convincing exactly

[Alyssa The Lamb]

All I'd really need to do to prove skitter is talking out of her ass is to just quote my entire trajectory on her, including every time I said her lack of trajectory on me at all was really fucking odd

And up until today she had zero real thoughts on why I'm a scumread other than the flow trap wagon

Like, what?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

We've engaged multiple times and this is what happened

She had an excuse every single time

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Like I really don't see how skitter ever wins as scum without hard pushing me at this stage in the game

It's not even a bad idea in general because I'm one of those players that pretty much always gets paranoia scumread by this stage of the game

Skitter very commonly wants to think through everything in the endgame and make sure she's on the right track and making the correct call, but instead she's just hard pushing me out of the gate with reasoning that just doesn't stand up to scrutiny

Like tbh if this by itself isn't strong evidence, idk what to tell you that will be convincing. I feel like I've been incredibly obvtown at multiple points and I've directly shut down several possible miselim possibilities for myself on slots that are confirmed town now

I don't want to engage into these arguments because then they can be spun to mitigate this, and that's a lot more damaging than just not engaging into them

[Alyssa The Lamb]

and again, my whole mo as scum is 'clean trajectories'. I dont devise a messy elo where i need to push someone with 'reasoning that doesnt stand up to scrutiny'

I'm just going to put this out there

This only makes the idea that I'm your only push worse

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Worse for you

Not worse in general

[Alyssa The Lamb]

As for when I'm obvtown

I don't go to that much effort when I'm scum only to essentially not change my reads at all, yet still finding new things to reach those same reads

It's really unnecessary for this type of game and it's similarly unnecessary to simply have all these correct town reads on people that can potentially be pushed and keeping these simple reasons as justification for those reads

And then just kill them all off

[Alyssa The Lamb]

sorry, I'm drained atm

rough work week + other obligations being a stresser

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it's hard to have a clean trajectory on somebody that isn't me in this game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

alyssa can you describe your progression on skitter slot please

Generically town initially due to relative activity+engagement

Sometime later in D2 I caught on to her defending Andante in a very "I know she's town" type of way, figured it was because she was cop with an inno on Andante and didn't want to out her role

Just townbinned both of the two for the rest of D2, I was trying to send a signal that I caught on to what she was doing but I don't remember if I actually did or not, I think I did, got questioned about it, and decided not to follow up

D3 I found out she wasn't a cop since her trajectory on Andante didn't align with it, realized that I'd just been townbinning on her based on that and reset

Figured out she was scumreading me for really odd reasons, she had no read on specifically me despite that only ever having happened before in a town her/scum me world where I was perpetually staying in the background (aka not this). This is never how she has acted towards me before in a TvT world and her responses to me poking about this were very lackluster

I decided to give her space anyways since our one other game together was TvT where we had very lukewarm reads towards each other (I died N1 after replacing in halfway through the day so it's not that strong) and it being a year and a half before that since the last time I had any interaction with her in a game

Pretty much maintained that nullish scum read throughout

Eventually turned that into a full scum read when I realized that this blunt indecisiveness/lack of confidence with consistent engagements that go nowhere makes the most sense for scum to have as a strategy for a game that has this many posts and no real progress being made

Starting today I backed off mainly because I trust my townreads in this game more than my scumreads. It simply makes more sense to try to find all the town rather than find all the scum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I hope so, I'm pretty sure I did mention it when the townread went away

[Alyssa The Lamb]

this isn't 2019 anymore

and I was never a fan of the playstyle of just hard shoving all your scumreads through

[Alyssa The Lamb]

A game where I went out of my way to be forgettable so I could kill you before you could push the game in a direction I could control, yes

This is a pretty far cry from that considering I was pushing my own reads way more and shoving myself into the spotlight

[Alyssa The Lamb]

This was the mustard micro

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm not seeing a reason to continue this engagement

[Alyssa The Lamb]

If it wasn't obvious

Skitter and I are confirmed not partners

[Alyssa The Lamb]

SS and skitter and myself are all confirmed not SvS
Datisi and skitter confirmed not SvS

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I guess if there's a random venge then it's not 100%

[Alyssa The Lamb]

But the likelihood goes way down

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Nobody really caring about the catboi vote is interesting I guess

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Idk maybe

I think scum are pretty set in what they want to do by now so maybe it's mostly indicative of that being right

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Oh there's six players

[Alyssa The Lamb]

You can tell how much I care at this point lmao

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Ok then, i feel like i tried

Also

If you're town, you've done a really bad job this game of showing me that your engagements are in good faith

That's not meant to be an insult, just a blunt truth as to why I'm not really willing to engage into them anymore

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That said

Atm I'm just thinking that Datisi is going full derp mode and the team is just skitter + ss

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Or skitter is having a horrific game and Datisi is riding on her coattails

It's one or the other since I think both being town never happens here

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I feel like Datisi makes more sense with catboi than SS though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Btw SS what are your thoughts on the game again

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Hey me too

Let's make it a party

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Ok then, i feel like i tried

Also

If you're town, you've done a really bad job this game of showing me that your engagements are in good faith

That's not meant to be an insult, just a blunt truth as to why I'm not really willing to engage into them anymore

I really dont know why you think i'm acting in bad faith. I am more than happy to continue the convo, and i do think thay there's a chance that i'm wrong, and understanding your approach to the game will help me get there if i am

If you dont want to engage with me tho, that's fine - i've accepted that there's only so much i can do (/so much time and energy i'm willing to put in) here to change the probably inevitable outcome

the thing is

if you're town, then the last dozen or so engagements don't leave a whole lot of precedent that they're getting you anywhere in progressing a read on me
if you're scum, then the engagements are just an easy way to look like you're engaged into the game and looking to drag out tangents that lead nowhere

either way, it potentially drowns out the game in nothing to have an extended back and forth and I'm seeing little benefit to doing so, especially when you consider this:

1. Kaiji is already engaged enough to ask for whatever he needs from me to get a read
2. catboi basically isn't playing
3. S_S basically isn't playing and isn't exactly known for going too hard on reading people regardless
4. Datisi is very unlikely to be turned in a TvS world

so if this IS a TvS engagement, then I'm effectively achieving nothing for convincing anyone else. If this is TvT, then I frankly don't know how to resolve this in a way that leads both of us to the correct answer because in that case, we're both pretty much stuck in our individual tunnels towards each other

but regardless

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I kinda want to reread Datisi because I had the lurking feeling he's been doing sweet fuckall aside from insisting that he should be town because of taking the same number as pooky but it feels like

if

they were gambiting, it makes no sense for menalque to have been shielded as hard as he was and the more plausible explanation is that scum were afraid of him getting cleared off the flip and didn't want it to happen

otherwise there's no reason it was so hard to flip a 1shot vig who had already fired and who wasn't playing the game

I still think that at best scum were just playing slowly on flipping that slot

I really don't think scum went out of their way to save him really ever

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Datisi

skitter30

Andante

Kaiji northsidegal

Something_Smart
SirCakez
catboi
Mare
Menalque PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear

Midwaybear gives the most info on the game itself if flipped
SirCakez is a slot I think will have to be flipped at some point, so is a safe option for future sanity reasons
catboi is the single slot most likely to be turned on for paranoia reasons, so is a safe option even though I don't think it's very productive atm
S_S mostly is just a slot I struggle to read, nowadays I'm a little more confident I will be able to read him correctly over time since I think the game won't be stagnant like it was early in the day forever, so I'm not really into it
Mare/Menalque are the lazy way out kills that will have to be sorted somehow eventually but it gives us borderline nothing to kill today

Mare/Menalque are the lazy way out kills that will have to be sorted somehow eventually but it gives us borderline nothing to kill today

just realized this looks weird

we get basically nothing from flipping either of them

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I've seen people scumread me for that Menalque slot read

Idk what to tell you about that one, it's simply more productive to kill slots that give more information about the game than slots that have done zilch in that situation, if you want to scumread me for not wanting to kill a slot that has nothing readable that happened to be scum in a gamestate that was extremely lethargic with multiple unreadable slots, idk what to tell you there at that point

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm leaning back towards Datisi being just scum again

[Alyssa The Lamb]

you have to bend over backwards in some way to make just about any team work

[Alyssa The Lamb]

this is kinda like back when everyone who was being scumread would go into why they don't make any sense by play as being scum

and so it makes all of the arguments meaningless because it just means that someone played differently from how they normally would as scum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

something something pooky something something unpredictable something something blah

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I got dumped last night so mafia pls throw for me thx

oof

that sucks, sorry

[Alyssa The Lamb]

3.5 days

[Alyssa The Lamb]

who wants to extend the torture even longer by just eliminating S_S today

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Because I want to suffer even longer by eliminating the probable scum that will make tomorrow just as fun filled and absolutely not a torturous mess

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Can you imagine a Skitter/Datisi/Alyssa/Kaiji endgame

[Alyssa The Lamb]

can i answer that? i want to answer that. i have a funney remark to answer to that.

oh god please do

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alyssa why are you wanting to flip ss today?

It'll make for popcorn tomorrow

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Because nobody has paid next to any attention to him

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Haven't I also said at some point that you're the scum that's most likely to just get forgotten if you aren't sorted conclusively early on

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Do you think that a skitter+datisi team just forgets about you when you would be a good default partner for just about anyone

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alright

Are we all about ready to end the day

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Yup

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Oh hey is the game finally ending

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Because this means at least one town is pretty much sold on me being scum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

And yet you're voting me

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Why not kaiji

[Alyssa The Lamb]

To be clear my readlist looks like Datisi > Kaiji > Alyssa > catboi > skitter.

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Oh that's town to scum

Nvm

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Yolo

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'll vote whoever idc who

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: skitter

Alright

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Yup

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm really whatever about this ending tbh

I'm just glad I don't have to play mafia anymore

[Alyssa The Lamb]

There was so much apathy in this game that it was borderline impossible to get anywhere even though I correctly identified so many people as town

Like why is this such a huge problem on the site now, this has been a thing in practically every game I've played this year

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Something_Smart

Datisi
skitter30

SirCakez

Sleepless Assassin
Andante
innocentvillager

catboi

Alyssa The Lamb flow trap
northsidegal
Mare

Menalque PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear

Faker

This feels like a comfy solve

I'm fucking lolling

I need to trust my early solves way more

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That needs to be a lot more standard imo

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Btw sorry for not engaging into you, this was one of those weird scenarios where I felt it was disadvantageous to regardless of your alignment

And by the end I was too done to care anymore

[Alyssa The Lamb]

And our curse continues

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I wonder if we would've won if my giant post had actually gone through instead of being lost after 2 hours of work and me having to type up a quick abridged version

[Alyssa The Lamb]

This game was pretty torturous for everybody that played to the end Prism

We all played like shit but it really was more a collective thing then just everyone individually playing bad

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean

The biggest issue this game is that there was never any good pushes that resulted in anything

From my minimal look into day one, that was just as prevalent in day one as every other day

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Scum have no reason to do anything if town can't put pressure on anyone

And with the game stalling that much, eventually town will find reasons to suspect mostly each other

That's basically it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Yeah, at the deadline

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Idk what to tell you Prism

My biggest issue in day two was just people not being willing to do anything even when I was specifically pushing to get any wagon going and pushing for people to contribute more

From what I saw at the deadline scramble, people were really hesitant to bend their thinking and so what you ended up getting is that one wagon just shifted back and forth while the other wagon just sat there and watched

This was literally what the game was, and at some point I just gave up on it and tried to get what I can

And ofc that just meant I found things that weren't actually AI to scumread, and every other active town essentially did the same thing

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I analyze all my games well past the time they end