Open 869 | Fight for the Winter Court [Game Over!]

[skitter30]

Hello hello to all!
This pl is ridiculously awsome

@ydra vla on fridays, saturdays, etc

[skitter30]

Hey i'm at a thing, i'll read and be around in a few hours

[skitter30]

skitter actually participates in her own real life to the exclusion of mafia and I don't think her activity can be anything indicative. Like she actually unplugs.

Indeed she does
I'm around now for a bit, gonna read up now

[skitter30]

do you think

there is great value

in turning the wall into a second gate?

What do you mean by that? put a top consensus townread there?

like

i feel like

the benefit to me locking in keep would be to force the mafia to move me or concede the keep

whereas the main benefit to me locking in the wall would be turning the wall into a second gate

so i was wondering if you thought there was great value in that since it seems you've been thinking about the setup et cetera

I absolutely cannot articulate this but this post really pings me and feels bizarrely scummy to me

[skitter30]

I think i'd like to play the keep the most and that's the one i probably would be best at

I don't really want to go to the gate tbh, i have no feelings on wall

[skitter30]

Practically how would you do that?

[skitter30]

This is way too fast for my brain atm LMAO

I know you're mostly joking but any game with me/you/skitter would be the biggest shitshow, but ~we'll see~

Actually @demona i change my mind with 34 - i think you thought a lot abt the optimal strategy for how you should play this but 34 makes me think it's coming more from a town perspective

I think isis on p2 is townie

I like chara and prisms' vibes but nai for both of them. Maybe prisms' vibes are *slightly* on the townier side but i can't read them so well so not very confident on that

Ffery feels weird and a little scummy, as does coral

[skitter30]

Practically how would you do that?

being town enough,

like you just stated you prefer the keep and feel you would be best suited to it

is this because you feel you are going to towntell very strongly?

and if so, if you went to the wall wouldn’t the wall basically become the gate with you as the confirmed?

but i wonder how to weigh the value of that

I mean wall could be gate to my pov but wouldnt be gate to the pov of the other two people there , which i think is a meaningful difference

I think i would enjou the keep the most and is what i'm best at (i.e. townhunting). I didnt think abt it much more than that tho and i am kinda fine with going wherever

[skitter30]

Eh i do want to call prism town but someone shout at me if i make any decisions off of that

[skitter30]

I have this odd feeling that skitter's *here*.

Demona seems sincere about being easily found as town, Do people who've played with them before agree?

Coral feels pretty town.

Why did you say this abt me?

[skitter30]

i can't read shiki for SHIT but i remember reading something structurally like this from her so i'm inclined to take her at face value atm at my own peril

She's v structurallu like this i'm just not sure how good she is at replicating this thought process as scum, that's sort of what i'm spinning in my mind rn

[skitter30]

I don't think tammy's entrance is ai

[skitter30]

Ok that was a really dense 7 pages
Most of my thoughts on various players are above, i also got some minor scumpings on catboi but not giving them much weight just yet

[skitter30]

What is scummy to you about Coral?

Their posts feel kinda constructed and premeditated, and not really what they actually think

Why do you townread them? What do u think abt the fact that i think you're a little scummy?

[skitter30]

oh and hello Tempest! and hello skitter. :>

Hello! :)

[skitter30]

I don't think tammy's entrance is ai

you just like being contrary to me specifically, don't you skitter. :>

Apparently!

[skitter30]

Because I thought it. You were present right at the opening of the game and then nothing for the first few hours. I wondered if you'd choose to observe for a while, and if so, why not interact.

No, just something came up irl right after i posted and had to bounce for a bit

[skitter30]

Can scum swap someine into gate and then conftown that person?

[skitter30]

Ok then i don't think it matters so much honestly who we put there ... if scum has v stronf feelings abt who they want to conftown they'll conftown them anyways

[skitter30]

I think isis on p2 is townie

Do tell.

I don't think the pov in 36 37 is likely to come from scum

(Or at least, if they had this thought, i don't think they would say it ...)

[skitter30]

Ok that was a really dense 7 pages
Most of my thoughts on various players are above, i also got some minor scumpings on catboi but not giving them much weight just yet

Ah as expected

Why as expected?

[skitter30]

and I like their concerns about scum making early moves to lock into minigame slots

I'm concerned because this seems to be coming from a scum pov
Like it seems like their concerns are stemming from 'having thought abt how they'd play this as scum'

Wrt you: fair, i have tried to block parts of that from my memory. You feel really like weird and distant tho

[skitter30]

If we're going to try to herd scum into one place rn i'd put ffery and coral at the wall

[skitter30]

I don't think you expect to get towncred for them, i just think the things you're posting are more likely to come from scum then town

@coral ^

Pedit g'luck with the car!

[skitter30]

Like i guess my thoughts when i'm tend to trend more towards 'this is jow i think town should play the game'

And less 'i think scum is going to play like this so this is how we can counter that'

If that makes sense

[skitter30]

My pronoun is she I know you're not trying to maliciously misgender me but they is a synonym for "I clocked you and want to finish this convo quickly without figuring you which kind of thing you are" in my day to day life so I don't love it ok

Ah! My apologies

[skitter30]

I don't think you expect to get towncred for them, i just think the things you're posting are more likely to come from scum then town

what do you think my goal would be of posting them as scum?

I dont think there's a goal or inherent scum motivation
I think it just belies a scum pov

[skitter30]

I was thinking straight majority assignment, not declaring who gets to choose first. Of course that might make some people unhappy to be sent to a place but someone's got to go.

I don't hate this fwiw

[skitter30]

I don't really believe that you think I would aimlessly post my scum pov without a goal in mind.

I'm not saying 'aimlessly post your scum pov'
I'm sayinng you were making a post to share your thoughts abt the game which i think happen to be more likely to come from scum

Those arent quite the same thing

[skitter30]

What does that even mean in this context

[skitter30]

I lowkey kinda wish someone had lolpicked a game - it would make it easier to then figure out where *other people* should go based off of thay

I'm not sure how we're now going to crack the ice to start placing people

[skitter30]

What does that even mean in this context

I think it feels to me like if you had thought about it on a deeper level then you wouldn't have found it to be a significant point. That may be my own bias in the situation, but still, it feels like when I attempt to guide you towards why I believe that to be the case, you are uninterested in trying.

It doesn't feel like an engagement meant to sort me, it feels like you've decided your point and don't want to look into it any further. Which, realistically, is your right! It still feels a bit wrong to me, though.

Well, i guess, what are you trying to guide me towards exactly? Or how should I read it differently?

I will admit this is like a vibe thing that i put a lot of weight in

[skitter30]

I'm not sure how we're now going to crack the ice to start placing people

This is why I thought finding the consensus towniest person and having them pick first could be useful.

I don't hate this either tbh

[skitter30]

is her read on you scummy to you?

That is p obviously the implication, yes

[skitter30]

Gate
catboi
skitter30
Isis

This is, uh, interesting

And g'nite to all

[skitter30]

I actually think that your content after your opening is worse

[skitter30]

Ouch go for the jugular!

That’s okay though! Sometimes I’m an acquired taste.

Could be!
Not sure it makes you scum either tho

[skitter30]

since you're here...

Gate
catboi
skitter30
Isis

This is, uh, interesting

And g'nite to all

define 'interesting'

I don't really get the thought process - why gate, why me/isis when isis was indicating she didnt want to be in the same game as me, why are you there

Like holistically i don't 'see' it

But i think later chara indicated it was a meme so

[skitter30]

I think 266 is funnee and therefore it's +EV

you're the only one who understands me.

[skitter30]

I don't really get the thought process - why gate, why me/isis when isis was indicating she didnt want to be in the same game as me, why are you there

Like holistically i don't 'see' it

But i think later chara indicated it was a meme so

I mean, there could be a million reasons, yeah? maybe we're the leftovers, maybe chara thinks we're the scumteam, maybe chara thinks we're all town, sans context you can't really infer anything. I had, by chance, written down the exact same assignment for the Gate in my notepad but I don't really think that says anything about Chara's alignment.

And I don't see anywhere Chara has indicated the post was unserious?

Yeah and i dont think it says anything abt chara's alignment either, it was just, well, interesting

[skitter30]

Actually i do maybe think tammy is scum >.>

[skitter30]

I lowkey kinda wish someone had lolpicked a game - it would make it easier to then figure out where *other people* should go based off of thay

I'm not sure how we're now going to crack the ice to start placing people

mm tempting me

would you be likely to like

disengage with me as mafia?

I dont think so, i actually think you would be easier for me to engage with as scum than some other people here

[skitter30]

As scum?
I would try to avoid prism/catboi/isis

[skitter30]

I did realize after i wrote that that my play could be read in that light, but eh

[skitter30]

quoted skitter here because i found it funny that scum skitter would want to avoid the players i put her with. i feel vindicated somehow. :>

I also have quite a lot of trouble reading catboi and tend to violently misread isis so, uh, overall i think that would probably not be the most successful grouping

[skitter30]

i'm concerned that skitter's "oh Tammy might actually be scum" post and my own initial read are both biasing me into continuing to read Tammy's contribitions as scum.

I'm gonna wait till she finishes catching up before solidifying this read

[skitter30]

skitter I probably get right in the long run but maybe a guardians game is too short term and doesn't provide enough info

Can u elaborate a bit more please? Why do you think i might not be solvable in this timeframe

[skitter30]

skitter I probably get right in the long run but maybe a guardians game is too short term and doesn't provide enough info

Can u elaborate a bit more please? Why do you think i might not be solvable in this timeframe

because in early games I've misread you a lot (e.g. last time we played this setup together), when I have a clear arc of what you're doing in the game it gets easier (coalition). maybe that was because I had outside observer perspective and some degree of mechanical data, but at any rate this setup provides data as well. Of course this is all generalities from me that don't say much about what I feel about this game.

hmmmmm

[skitter30]

My current guess for the scumteam is ffery coral tammy

[skitter30]

I'm not sure i particularly care where they (or anyone else) goes, i just want to try to herd them to the same spot

[skitter30]

>.>

[skitter30]

Also no clue where the Isis thing comes from. Her experience with you is more limited IIRC and she's more likely to just townread you for NAI reasons as a result.

From catboi's pov it's not relevant whether I'd townread his scumgames right?

Yes, but see 382. We want to put people in that are likely to get an accurate read regardless of the person's alignment, not "Don't worry this strategy works BECAUSE I'm town"

Also i like this approach
Although i don't think i'm *great* at reading a lot of people in this game. I think demona is probbaly my easiest read

[skitter30]

Yeah i don't think we're going to get 3/3, but i think aiming for 2/3 is a worthy goal

I think based on who i can read best/easiest, i want to be with demona for sure. I'm tbh not *super* confident in sorting anyone else in this pl that i can declare i want to be with any other person just now
(Different people for different reasons)

[skitter30]

kitty/Tempest/absinthe is my early call. Isis could replace one.

Catboi is interesting

[skitter30]

I will say that isnt the best metric to read me ...

[skitter30]

I will say that isnt the best metric to read me ...

proven by SCIENCE

I'm kidding, I don't actually read you that way and am more inclined to just sort you later when I have more to work with.

Ok fair cuz if u actually did i would have some things to say abt that lol

[skitter30]

I mean i'm fine if you feel that way abt my towngame, but i take issue with you *read* me using that metric

[skitter30]

Yeah i'm a littlr wary of coral going into a chara/isis game, esp. since isis is townreading coral ...

[skitter30]

:)

[skitter30]

Swapping the entire Gate/Keep people probably works too, but I'm selfish and basically don't want to deal with actually having to convince someone else that cat is scum if I reach that conclusion. From an outside perspective, I also just think it makes sense to quarantine the reigning Don Corleone there~

I would prefer keep or wall over gate tbh. I don't especialy want gate

Not sure how well i'd read tammy also

And really don't think coral should go with isis/chara

[skitter30]

Ok i gotta bounce now, have a great weekend everyone

[skitter30]

what do you think about being placed with me and Isis at the Wall, Coral? i don't know who originally suggested it, iirc it was being discussed by skitter before Prism floated the idea more concretely.

i don't personally think it's a great placement for you.

sharing reads is usually productive, too?

amending this, i meant it was being discussed by skitter as something she

didn't

want before Prism put the idea there, but i don't know who she was arguing against.

My visceral reaction to the notion of you/isis going to the same room is that i didnt want coral as the third, so i voiced that thought. I don't think i was arguing against anyone in particular

[skitter30]

Ya that's exactlu what i'm worried abt

[skitter30]

Hey i'm kinda around now, catching up

[skitter30]

VOTE: wafer wall

I actuallu think this probably does *not* come from scum even tho i dont really like it

[skitter30]

On and off for the next bit, i'll actually be here in like an hour
Were u waiting for me >.>

[skitter30]

I guess T->S I'd go something like

skitter, cat, demona, Isis, Chara, Coral, Tempest, absinthe

Some of this ordering is honestly random and I can see specific flips changing things greatly but I'll throw the dart for now and just YOLO look at people individually

Let me read up first

As of rn it isn't really different than what i had yesterday

[skitter30]

I actually feel marginally better abt tammy

[skitter30]

I still think ffery is scummy and am feeling worse on catboi

[skitter30]

My other two pairings are all outta wack ahhhhhhhhh

Okay that makes Gate Coral, skitter, absinthe/Tempest which ~isn't ideal~ and I'm wondering if putting Isis/Chara in Gate is better

I dont especially want to be in gate, and if i ended up ic'd i'd have a really, really hard time with this matchup

[skitter30]

skitter clear would be kinda hype tho

It'll probably end with me throwing a brick through her window with a frowny face attached but it'd be kinda hype tho

I really don't want to get ic'd tbh >.>

[skitter30]

I'm either wildly wrong this game and skitter is just taking advantage of it or a thousand little angels decided to all hold hands and give us the same reads to steamroll with

I like actually think you're town here and it's scaring me that i'm getting snowed >.>

[skitter30]

but she struggled in Perpetual when she protected people, and she's likely to run into similar issues here.

(Tbf you had some doubts but were nowhere close to actually doing anything abt that)

Pedit i like chill hangout with friends!

[skitter30]

Ahhhhh coral feels ao scummy to me

[skitter30]

I'm a bit more skeptical of skitter skimming through the first few pages but I'm actually curious to hear her thoughts on pairings/locations again, originally we wanted Keep but I'm wondering what she thinks of Gate.

Keep > wall > gate, i'm just envisioning getting ic'd and ending up in a paranoid spiral and being the decider and i really don't want to tbh

[skitter30]

If you're scum and trying to put one over on me I hopefully figure it out before then but right now I don't think you'd target the keep if that was your plan.

how likely do you think it is that scum!faker would have actually been targeting the keep rather than counting on me locking in the keep and you all going elsewhere?

Fwiw there was no indication faker was imminently trying to get you into keep and your selection was a kneejerk reaction out of proportion to the actual discussion being had

[skitter30]

Like idk why you keep acting like faker was trying to herd you to keep, that wasnf happening

[skitter30]

My location opinions haven't changed, I still like:

Keep: Faker/catboi/absinthe
Wall: demona/Isis/Chara
Gate: skitter/Tempest/Coral

I'm also interested to hear skitter's location thoughts here, which won't be for a few hours yet I suppose.

I would prefer wall at this point

[skitter30]

Actually wait: @coral why is me/you/tempest at gate a good idea from your pov?

[skitter30]

SKITTER SKITTER SKITTER SKITTER SKITTER

TIGERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

SKITERRETIKS

HI HI HI

[skitter30]

grumble grumble stupid deeply held religious beliefs that i respect but are mildly inconvenient because i don't get to talk to my friend in my internet game grumble grumble

Indeed

[skitter30]

But also now at this point I am in fact struggling to identify scum because most people feel towny to me.

I am kinda sus of catboi, but also i don't know if he takes this approach as scum

[skitter30]

You're misinterpreting 677. I think she's saying what if I was positioning for Keep publicly but secretly hoping that demona would lock it, giving me the free way out, and her actually locking Wall made it fall through.

(I think, maybe your interpretation is correct)

?????????????

shiki what the duck

?

my second preference as i think i just get iced at the gate

like i don’t really get how that’s upsetting to you as you’ve just stated your preference for the keep and for me to not be in the keep

unless you think me just waiting was correct which okay maybe

but i thought about your post and whether or not it’d be reasonable for us to be together and

shrug

I thought that this was what you were trying to say with this

[skitter30]

* you being demona

[skitter30]

Like idk why you keep acting like faker was trying to herd you to keep, that wasnf happening

I think you're wrong about that. I don't see it as a necessarily bad thing for town to do, but I definitely felt herded yesterday. The pressure decrease after I agreed was palpable. To me anyway.

? Decrease after you agreed to what?

[skitter30]

i don’t really think faker was trying to herd me to keep

i was asking catboi that question because it seemed like catboi was saying faker wouldn’t suggest potentially going to the keep if faker was scum

and so i was wondering how, like, committed(?) catboi thought faker was to that suggestion

Fair enuf

[skitter30]

I'm not actually saying he is scum but yes this is 100% in his wheelhouse and that was a big part of why I typed 'Seriously?' to him yesterday when he first pulled that out, especially because he initially made a show of hiding reads at first

I beliebe you when you say this

But like what does scum-him get out of this

[skitter30]

Actually wait: @coral why is me/you/tempest at gate a good idea from your pov?

To be more precise, my wants are these:

1) catboi/Faker/absinthe at Keep
2) Isis and Chara together
3) Me not with Isis and Chara at the Gate

There's a limited number of valid combinations that satisfy these, and that one happens to be my favorite, but I'm not married to it. You, me, and demona at Wall could be fine, but I think the swap from that could result in some situations that I would not prefer.

1. Why do you want absinth with faker/catboi at keep
2. Me with you and tempest at gate is one of the worst possible pairings i can think of

[skitter30]

I skimmed a lot, but i don't think my thoughts have changed substantially othwr than what i've already said

Current guess for scumteam is coral/ffery/catboi

I also don't reallu have a read on chara fwiw

[skitter30]

This is why when I reread the game and found your initial post about the Wall and revisited it, things sort of clicked.

This is how i normally feel abt demona

[skitter30]

I like absinthe in Keep with catboi and Faker.

Why is that, exactly?

I like Faker's plan for it, mostly. I'm currently leaning towards feeling trusting of Faker (rookie mistake), and at the same time not feeling town on absinthe. So that + Faker wanting to pair up + absinthe feeling a little resistant towards accepting that arrangement = me wanting to voice support of it.

I like absinthe in Keep with catboi and Faker.

Why is that, exactly?

I like Faker's plan for it, mostly. I'm currently leaning towards feeling trusting of Faker (rookie mistake), and at the same time not feeling town on absinthe. So that + Faker wanting to pair up + absinthe feeling a little resistant towards accepting that arrangement = me wanting to voice support of it.

Also, the other side to this is that I think absinthe would do well there if town, so either way it seems like a good grouping.

I dont understand how this is strong enuf reasoning to base the rest of the game around

[skitter30]

2. Why do you think that? It doesn't seem bad from my perspective.

Well i scumread both of you
Ig if one of you get ic'd that's good for me but if i get ic'd that is like the mast pairing i want to sort thru

[skitter30]

Someday you're going to figure out how to read me.

Ffery do you think i should be townreading you at this point?

[skitter30]

I dont understand how this is strong enuf reasoning to base the rest of the game around

I suppose another side of it would be that I don't have any conflicting opinions that are strong enough to want to try to overrule what seems to be the preference of someone forming a group that doesn't involve me.

The context is that this is a 'want' that led you to forming a me/you/tempest pairing

So like ig i'm kinda confused why the catboi/faker/ffery pairing made by someone elese is strong enuf to base the rest of the game on (including where you yourself go)

Like this explanation doesnt fully square with me with describing that pairing as a condition for how you arrived at your own pairing ...

[skitter30]

I was just rereading that post and trying to decide what i felt abt it

Pedit the ffery post isis quoted

[skitter30]

Sorry @ffery remind me which game you were scum in with me?
A few games are starting to run together in my mind >.>

[skitter30]

Sorry @ffery remind me which game you were scum in with me?
A few games are starting to run together in my mind >.>

That absurd normal game. 2181.

Ooooooo that one
That was a great game for me lol
(@prism i think that was our firsf game together! And there were many bickerings abt my absurd gamestate conclusions that were *entirely* right!)
But tbh i'm not reading you based on meta, like at all. Idk how to metaread you and i'm not taking any past games into acct

[skitter30]

I'm fine with you in keep i just don't want to end up in gate

I do think you should go with catboi tho
An tbh the idea of farming out my catboi read sounds like an increasingly good idea

Pedit i very distinctly remember having an argument with you abt borkscum that you refused to believe soooo

[skitter30]

Tbh i don't think i'm going to make much more progress on reads, i'm kinda fine with starting to put people in minigames

[skitter30]

Pedit i very distinctly remember having an argument with you abt borkscum that you refused to believe soooo

SCHEDULE A DOCTOR'S APPOINTMENT IMMEDIATELY

IMMEDIATELY

I actually just went back and both of these things happened at different parts of the game lol

My memory of 2181 is apparently day2+, i had completely burned day1 out of my memory

And i did have an argument abt borkscum that u were quite skeptical abt lol

[skitter30]

New idea we quarantine all of the SO-having normies in one place

It's amazing how much of a normie i am >.>

[skitter30]

Is anyone strongly townreading chara?
And if yes, why?

[skitter30]

Is anyone strongly townreading chara?
And if yes, why?

what's up with this question skitter!! if i didn't know better i would say you scumread me or something. :>

More like i'm realizing i don't have a reason to townread you
You're like one tier above my solve if that makes sense

Ought i be townreading you?

[skitter30]

Like i dont especially think you're scummy, i just have no reason to think you're out of your scumrange either

I think u would be p hard for me tonsort confdently

[skitter30]

I think i'm kinda at:

Wall - demona, me, coral
Gate - chara, isis, {ffery/tammy}
Keep - catboi, faker, {ffery/tammy}

[skitter30]

I don't really know where i'd go if i'm not in wall tbh

I don't think a me/faker/catboi keep is the best idea
And otherwiss i'm.in gate with a bunch of people i sr

[skitter30]

Unless faker/catboi go somewhere else in which case i'm fine with keep

Pedit why ?

[skitter30]

Maybe a kneejerk, but you're suggesting joining the two players I know least about at this table.

Ok so .... why does that mean scum-me would 'love' this?
Also i've been saying for a whilei think i should be with demona

[skitter30]

Where do u think town-me should go?

[skitter30]

I think in this game it's most likely catboi/faker. From my pov i'm confident enuf to towntell in {a varient of 3p elo} with most combos of the rest of the pl that i'm not *so* worried abt other people having to read me

I'm mostly worried abt who i have to read and idk where to put myself if not for wall

[skitter30]

Ok it's p interesting to me that two different people are having an issue with me going to wall now

When i've been saying for mosf of the game that i think i should go with demona

--
Isis where do u think i should go?

[skitter30]

Isis where do u think i should go?

Also ffery

[skitter30]

like is there really benefit to me rambling about how like, skitter did something similar to her first few posts where she scumread me and then townread my follow up posts while i was trying to interact with her about it as scum before and that’s why i asked about her likelihood to disengage from me wanted to feel if her response felt like knowledgeable

while skitter and others discuss whether or not skitter should come to wall

when i also think that that discussion is likely to weigh just as much to me as other thought

Fwiw i have no memory of doing this in the past

[skitter30]

I am kinda partial to wall still

[skitter30]

(And am finding it really interesting that i'm getting vague nondescript opposition to that)

[skitter30]

Where do u think town-me should go?

I want town-you to go where you want to go.

Thinking about it some more this morning, I'm less concerned. Just because catboi and/or Faker wouldn't be in the same minigame with you doesn't mean they can't influence your game and vice versa. That applies to any scenario about your alignments.

I think i want to go to wall
But i'm a little ???? at the notion that you're finding it sus that i want to go to wall as that's a good pairing for scum-me without really having an opinion on where town-me would go instead

[skitter30]

i am not opposed in case you thought my recent posts were voicing opposition to you joining the wall

like in theory i could maybe understand absinthe’s position that she was worried about scum!you potentially wanting to fool me but it seemed like she was saying that scum!absinthe would want to fool me because i am unfamiliar with absinthe but! i am not unfamiliar with you

I wasnt including you there fwiw

And i read absinthe post abt being worried abt a me/you/coral pairing

[skitter30]

If we're putting me at gate can it at least not be with 2 scumreads of mine? I think i get ic'd there and that won't be a fun time for me
I'm at a thing, will respond to the above later

[skitter30]

Gate: Tempest, skitter, Coral

From my pov this is not my ideal placement

[skitter30]

Isis where do u think i should go?

Also ffery

Go fight Faker in Keep y'all both have big personalities.

I don't remember what the keep does

Also I read a couple posts ahead of this on catch-up but not more

This has apparently been taken

[skitter30]

If we're putting me at gate can it at least not be with 2 scumreads of mine? I think i get ic'd there and that won't be a fun time for me
I'm at a thing, will respond to the above later

If you scumread two people couldnt you do pretty well filtering between which one is better foundations? I'd think two townreads would be worse. Maybe I have it backwards though

I mean ideally i'd have one of each

Eh. I'll go if that's what's been decided

[skitter30]

Could be confirmation biasing here but this kinda sounds like a perspective slip. Like you know that we’re town and the gate will remain as is. From my point of view, with your stated scum reads, you should be expecting some changes. If coral and I are scum, one is leaving. If ffery and catboi are scum, one of them is moving. With your scum reads, you should be expecting movement, but you’re like ope gonna be the ic with two of my scum reads and it doesn’t sound very genuine.

No, i just fear the scenario where i'm wrong and one of u *is* town and i have to decide which

[skitter30]

Gate: Tempest, skitter, Coral

From my pov this is not my ideal placement

we're gonna make you WORK for the W skits, gotta use those hunting instincts where we need u

and also make ur life hard as mafia

Apparently

[skitter30]

Should i just go to gate?

[skitter30]

I thouht the point of keep is catboi/faker

Isis do you townread coral?

[skitter30]

To me most of coral's posts just feel kinda scummy. If she's town idk how to get over that

[skitter30]

Usually tone, often mindset

[skitter30]

Tempest why do you think i'm scum again?

[skitter30]

VOTE: gate

[skitter30]

Expansion plz
Seems like it's primarily based on my interactions with coral and i'm not sure i ~get~ it

[skitter30]

What's bizarre is the insistence that I'm scary and slippery and too dangerous to let go anywhere else but also deflated and playing like a chump. It can't be both things.

This feels a little strawman-y tbh

[skitter30]

If i'm around i shall try

But would also like to vocalize that i'm finding catboi increasingly scummy

[skitter30]

I don't have anything else to add tbh

Other than: bad prism!

[skitter30]

I'm getting the vibe scum like these placements fwiw

[skitter30]

I can't skitter will hit me with the bad Prism stick

Bad prism

[skitter30]

Fwiw i think these matchups have one scum a piece
I think they like (and/or) are resigned to these matchups

[skitter30]

I don't like how everything died down post ~saturday night

Pedit yes it totally is now hush

[skitter30]

I don't think catboi and ffery make sense as scum together if that's the case

Either/or with coral would make sense, but idk who the third is

[skitter30]

Chara would work actually

Pedit i don't think ffery chooses keep if she's scum with catboi @ prism how do you think that makes sense

Pedit2 which one do you scumread @ prism?

[skitter30]

Yeah, same tbh

[skitter30]

Chara/catboi/coral

Pedit then why does catboi just, like, accept going to keep? Idk why he loses motivation right then

Pedit2 i think i read all of that pressure retroactively, it didnt seem so strong to me after the fact but fair enuf

[skitter30]

I'm not as convinced tammy is scum anymore and idk who the third is

[skitter30]

But chara feel better and catch up later!

[skitter30]

cat is the one who wanted to go to Keep with me to begin with, and a lot of his downturn started when I actually got onboard and started insisting on it. If he's scum a lot of his lack of activity might be demotivation, but it might have also been hoping for a shift that could put the choice to bail out of his hands. 2 in isn't instalosing and worth flailing out of as long as they have a viable swap.

Ig i just feel like: why does he bring it up in the first place as scum? I think he can reasonably expect this to actually happen so it'd be weird to me if he just like lost motivation for this thing happening

[skitter30]

Chara/catboi/coral

Pedit then why does catboi just, like, accept going to keep? Idk why he loses motivation right then

Pedit2 i think i read all of that pressure retroactively, it didnt seem so strong to me after the fact but fair enuf

mm why isis town?

There's been a lot of random posts that just don't feel like they come from a scum pov throughout the game imo

[skitter30]

Fair enuf

[skitter30]

cat is the one who wanted to go to Keep with me to begin with, and a lot of his downturn started when I actually got onboard and started insisting on it. If he's scum a lot of his lack of activity might be demotivation, but it might have also been hoping for a shift that could put the choice to bail out of his hands. 2 in isn't instalosing and worth flailing out of as long as they have a viable swap.

Ig i just feel like: why does he bring it up in the first place as scum?

I think he can reasonably expect this to actually happen

so it'd be weird to me if he just like lost motivation for this thing happening

I don't think it was expected at all. I think my initial reaction of a hard no was much more expected.

I would have been p surprised if you guys *didn't* end up in the same minigame tbh

[skitter30]

Apparently

But eh the loss of motivation does make more sense in that context

[skitter30]

Lol

[skitter30]

I'd be really surprised if we get 0-0-3 for sure

I'd be somewhat surprised if 2-1-0 tbh

[skitter30]

Skitter - I'm not quite how much more there is to flesh out with that read. For some reason that interaction feels like it's important to me alignment wise. Now sometimes I do get fixated on something that means nothing, but sometimes it does mean something. For me Coral seemed pretty town in that interaction, whereas the arguments you were making against her statements felt off. Well in the moment, what I thought was most off was Chara as her poking felt scummy, then I thought maybe I was wrong about Chara and then I got back to thinking that it was you that was off in that conversation.

I agree with you that it is in fact important, i just think you're reading it backwards

[skitter30]

...Hey skitter, want a winter holiday present/visit from a possum? Totally unrelated to 1254, don't even read that one.

I, uh, have yet to go Christmas shopping. Maybe at some point.

Lol

[skitter30]

i think it's more than BOP for catboi tbh

(and fwiw beyond me i think there's like several players in this game that can be bop'd, including myself, so this prob not the best metric overall? but eh)

pedit what do those words mean >.>

[skitter30]

that's not the one with lims, but finding town

i do think that it's going to be impossible to read him without some element of bop imo

(also fwiw i'm not sure i'm the most bop-est person in this pl, but once again, eh)

[skitter30]

I'm not sure i'm following what she's trying to say

[skitter30]

I mean from my pov that'll be a mess, esp. if i get ic'd

[skitter30]

I'm not sure i'm following what she's trying to say

if everyone fine with it being locked in as it was and as was proposed some time ago and there are two people left to lock in it seems much more likely to force two mafia into one location if those players are switched, yes?

like you said you thought 1/1/1 was likely as proposed

would this not make that less likely?

Oh yeah that makes sense
(Couldnt really understand your post / didnt realize that's what you were trying to say)

I feel bad messing up the +fun but from a wincon perspective i'm not opposed
(In that universe would prefer isis to end up with me tho - i think she's easier for me to read than chara)

[skitter30]

Oh nm >.>
Well from a me-reading perspective that gate's gonna be rough

[skitter30]

That does make chara scummier imo

See y'all on the other side

[skitter30]

This is, uh, interesting. My immediate thought is that i was put there aince i think prism is town, which is making me rethink both of them (which perhaps was the point ?)

Also this means there were 2 town at gate. Not sure if any broader conclusions can be taken from that ...

I still think it was 1-1-1 eod

[skitter30]

My first thought there is that it's absinthe scum, not sure about skitter/cat. Will read both back over when I'm actually awake and moving and know how to read.

Tempest is going to hate being clear but I believe in her, also I got you as town in the end~~~

Tbh i'm kinda ok with you/catboi figuring each other out and me not deciding here
(Or me being the person voted i suppose)

In a vaccuum i still think you're town but from my pov this swap is kinda forcing me to reconsider that, esp. with jow badly you snowed me in that micro

Also ya also happy i got to town-tammy in the end

[skitter30]

It does make sense for scum-ffery to want to try to get out of that keep

[skitter30]

I really cant imagine a universe where i choose to swap into this as scum

[skitter30]

And like i said this makes me a lot more sus of you

And now later, i have to 'do my job' and 'work'

[skitter30]

Sorry skitter but I think it's plausible you go into this matchup. You saw me whiff a spectate and saw me struggle in both 2181 and PYP. You haven't seen most of our private discussion around games I've spectated and Open House beyond the cursory mention earlier this game.

1-1-1 gives a lot of viable swaps but swapping you/absinthe looks favorable.

There's a difference between 'seeing you struggle in prior games' and 'putting myself in a matchup that i know i'd hate'

I don't randomly gain motivation as scum, and this would make me a lot less motivated

Either way my guess is currently still catboi/coral/chara, and that post from chara on the prior page os quite icky

[skitter30]

I think voting for isis is a loss there for town

[skitter30]

I think voting for isis is a loss there for town

so you think i am mafia…?

Sorry i got the minigames confused, nm
But i think chara is scum there

[skitter30]

i was really hoping for this outcome because i think if Isis and i are both town we can find each other, even if demona if scum is being exceedingly town to me and Isis both. unfortunately the game has in a way just started.

This doesnf make sense to me

[skitter30]

It's about who town has to pick between. skitter is probably more afraid of my scumplay than any other player at the table. I'm not good at reading her and have got it reversed basically every time.

You and catboi are tied
Which is why i'm not thrilled to be here

[skitter30]

not a lot of what i say tends to make sense to you, skitter.
what doesn't make sense about it?

I don't get why you're excited to go to keep with scum isis

[skitter30]

I think voting for isis is a loss there for town

so you think i am mafia…?

Sorry i got the minigames confused, nm
But i think chara is scum there

i'm confused about this whole post, how does voting for Isis being a loss for town make demona mafia? the wall wincon is voting scum, if voting is a loss that means she's town to skitter, not that demona is scum.
what do you mean by getting the minigames confused?

For a second i thought that if you vote isis
A second scum can hammer
(I also somehow forgot demona was there)

Yes i know that doesnt make sense

[skitter30]

It's about who town has to pick between. skitter is probably more afraid of my scumplay than any other player at the table. I'm not good at reading her and have got it reversed basically every time.

You and catboi are tied
Which is why i'm not thrilled to be here

how about the third option?

?

[skitter30]

skitter I'm going to assume 1392 isn't a slip but if it is I'm going to clown you all of the postgame

Sounds good

[skitter30]

not a lot of what i say tends to make sense to you, skitter.
what doesn't make sense about it?

I don't get why you're excited to go to keep with scum isis

you mean Wall, i assume.

because i thought she was scum before, and i thought the best chance of me confirming that is having demona here with us, and scum didn't end up messing with the configuration with swaps. so i get to try and do the thing i've been hoping to do all game, which is win a minigame under my own power.
and in the scenario where we're both wrong on demona i believe we can figure it out, so to me it's a win/win. i don't think that's where we are though.

Yes i did
Ok fair enuf, thanks

[skitter30]

...Do you mind walking me through why I'm in the Keep as scum, along with why I swap out someone that I am 100% sure I can snow in absinthe?

Fwiw i can see scum-you doung this

[skitter30]

skitter swapping to keep as scum with absinthe is borderline nonsensical in my eyes

@catboi can you elaborate on this statement plz?

[skitter30]

I don't think cat's explanation that I'd prefer you to absinthe here makes a ton of sense. Tempest scumread you and I can manipulate her into leaning into it from Keep. I've had my fun with you in Melancholia, while ffery hasn't gotten to face me yet. The only points for it are "+challenge" and "Supreme confidence that I'll win anyway", but I'm on record in another game as Keep being explicitly to my strengths as town and my favored game. I started out angling elsewhere then

went out of my way

to go to Keep anyway precisely because I love how the game is styled.

I'm curious as to what you think about the recent back/forth. I also think Tempest should weigh in.

I'm not sure:
- i'm only half skimming rn and will actually reread ajd think abt this after work
- i don't follow why cat thinks i don't swap there
- i think that you/ffery beinf scum together is wild given you pressuring her to join keep yesterday. If she is town i do see an element of you enjoying the challenge of me being here and doing this swap, esp. if she has very strong feelings abt being elsewhere (this is true for catboi as well)
- i'll see what tammy says r.e. me voting but i am nowhere close to making a decision at this time. I also think this is more likely to get resolved via you two voting. I would prefer on me since i know i'm town but eh
- in a vaccuum catboi feels scummy to me but (esp. In this back and forth) but i am very, very worried abt getting snowed by either of you

[skitter30]

it was the scumread idea and believing we could read each other well, i think i was being coy about the read too and hoping it'd look like my preference was largely personal + thinking i could read Isis.

Eh this is kinda townie tbh

[skitter30]

Also from my pov catboi strongly indicating he's going to vote me is a good thing ...
And makes prism look worse

Of course this could be bravado but eh

[skitter30]

- i don't follow why cat thinks i don't swap there

because I think scum-you wins a 1v1 with coral pretty handily, if you're both scum you don't have any options I guess but then your Day 1 is kind of silly

Ya agreed , esp. for the last bit

[skitter30]

Basically rn from my pov i dont know why i'm, like, here

As scum i only imagine switching with ffery if she's scum and has a *very* strong preference to not be there, otherwise i dont think i make that swap

Pedit idk who 1464 is addressed to

[skitter30]

I would prefer on me since i know i'm town but eh

if a vote is placed on not you and you are town then town loses the keep

unless the ‘eh’ was like,

like ‘well we all lose sometimes’

in which case yes but also! i would rather not

Yes, hence from my pov
I would strongly prefer this. I am aware that from your pov that is not a given tho

[skitter30]

I also think skitter agrees she should not be the voter so YEET

I mean so long as:
1. You two are v confident you can get it right
2. Otherwise you'lll vote me

[skitter30]

Cuz i'm not sure i'll get that necessarily and i don't think it's worth fighting over

[skitter30]

If I whiff on cat I will give you your very own brick, which you can then shotput into and through my window

Yes, i most certainly will

[skitter30]

Basically i think we're most likelu to get keep right, if, in this order:
1. Catboi/prism sort each other out
2. They vote me
3. I have to vote

[skitter30]

If I whiff on cat I will give you your very own brick, which you can then shotput into and through my window

There is absolutely no notion of reciprocity in this statement

[skitter30]

After work ^

[skitter30]

Maybe coral is town and it's ffery who's scum in keep

[skitter30]

skitter -- I'm trying to decide which makes more sense. That you were moved out of the Gate because of your alignment or because of your reads.

Plz elaborate on the 'because of your alignment' bit

[skitter30]

Plz no voting in keep until i can get thoughts out on the other 2 minigames

And @faker i agree with u. I think the likelihood of town winning keep is strictly in the order i outlined above

[skitter30]

At the Keep, Nutcracker Soldiers must vote on one player. If that player is a Nutcracker Soldier, the Nutcracker Soldiers win; otherwise, the Minions of Summer win.

Isnt keep just one townie has to vote on the other town?

[skitter30]

Right >.>
Ok yeah then i want one of u two to vote me

I

[skitter30]

Right >.>
Ok yeah then i want one of u two to vote me

I

can you...explain what you were thinking there and why that is not a perspective slip?

I have no idea tbh, something along the lines of 'one of catboi/prism is town so needs to vote'

(Mechanics are, uh, not my thing)

[skitter30]

Scum-skitter would probably like to not go up against Tammy in the Gate. Maybe she sees the keep as an easier win given how minigames shaped up.

No? That doesnt seem so bad at all tbh

[skitter30]

but coral is arguing that me doing so would make it unnecessary to actually resolve the keep and get my flip and that it's sooo much more valuable to treat the other voices here as confirmed town

Coral seems to think thay both town need to vote town to win keep
(Which is wrong and is what prompted my question)
I think her post makes more sense in context

[skitter30]

I'm increasingly concerned by demona

[skitter30]

Scum-skitter would probably like to not go up against Tammy in the Gate. Maybe she sees the keep as an easier win given how minigames shaped up.

No? That doesnt seem so bad at all tbh

You think you could beat Tammy at gate as mafia?

Seems easier than trying to solve this, ya

[skitter30]

You voting resolves keep tho, no?

[skitter30]

Right that's what i'm confused abt: is it just one vote (i.e. one town has to vote town and that's it), or to complete the game is it technically two?