Open 249: Mayo Clinic **Game Over!**

[HackerHuck]

Hi folks. I'll be reading up and posting my thoughts by the end of the day.

unvote

[HackerHuck]

First off, my eyes started glazing over toward the end of this, so I haven't really digested the last page or two. However, I did see this and I really don't get it.

Can you please quit stalling the game by bringing up arguments that occured ages ago? Thanks.

@Jesse: I didn't see the second part of your post, but for antihero, it is a combination of gut and stuff like the above that makes me think he is scum. He has clearly shown a blatant laziness in terms of reading.

Only thing I have to add is that warrior is obvtown and you guys would be best following him. Proxy-vote to warrior until I am able to get consistent access/time to analyze.

Apologies about the flow of this, but I was just making notes as I went through. I'm also pretty tired, so I hope it all makes sense to you.

This is an odd defence of Katsuki. Only his third post at the time.

@Katsuki: Yes I have, I was just wondering if you're asking me to participate in random shit.

Just wondering: how familiar are you with each other?

Around half of this game participated in this exact setup last time. We all ended up dead.

Katsuki's push on Muthaa seems forced and really doesn't have merit.

Unvote
Vote: Katsuki

I think he's just trying to get the game moving along a bit.

This one is really weird. Not only did he miss where Jesse explained it, I don't really see why it's voteworthy even if Kastsuki was wrong.

And what do you think that means?

I thought it was because he might be scum, and casting a vote would cause too much cognitive dissonance for him. But since there are better things to persue, like Katsuki and SSS's defense of it.

@Scott: Oh are you protecting muthaa's lack of wanting to place a vote?

Jesse at least explained why they didn't

, muthaa has yet to.

Really? And where did he do this?
UNVOTE: nopointinactingup
VOTE: Katsuki

Nothing was happening, so people wanted to start a wagon to get discussion going. I'm going to:
unvote, vote:antihero

why does it matter whether or not jesse votes?

Chainsaw defense, much? What I say to warrant a vote?

no because if he truely were claiming scumz he would be mod killed
any way there's nothing here against gandalf, but no point you are looking really scum, and ultra super dumb.
unvote
vote nopoint
if you aren't scum(which it's looking like you are), this would almost be a kill a dumb doctor who would just protect scum and confuse the town policy lynch

Ah, f$#%, here we go again.

Based on what he said here, I don't get why he voted Katsuki over SSS.

I thought the chain of posts starting here was a little off.
warriormode doesn't look that good there.

Gandalf is utterly unreadable to me. Claiming scum is kind of a null-tell but at least he's generating discussion with his antics.

Muthaa is suspicious to me, the bandwagon was useful to get us talking a bit more and he seemed against it.
@Muthaa - Please clarify how you feel about bandwagons in general, are they usually good or usually bad or what?

unvote; vote: JesseSheffield

my vote belongs here again. I don't like Jesse's reason for not voting. Sure, having a reason to vote is good. But, sitting there not voting and saying he isn't going to randomly vote will not cut it. I can't imagine he has NO opinion on ANY player.
@Jesse - Has anyone done anything scummy in this game so far? Who do you suspect the most?
Also I'm not familiar with the term scumseeking. I have a vague idea, but could you explain more?

Page 4 and he's talking about not getting reads? I don't like how he's acting like the game is so advanced at this stage. Most of the posts so far have been nonsense.

Since this is an open game, I'm assuming that the votecount on Jesse here should be two, correct?

Vote Count: Day 1

7 to lynch; 6 to no lynch.

Katsuki: (3)

Muthaa, Scott Brosius, Antihero

Antihero: (2)

warriormode, smashbro

nopointinactingup: (2)

drmyshottyizsik, animorpherv1

JesseSheffield: (1)

Phaen, nopointinactingup

drmyshottyizsik: (1)

Gandalf

Gandalf: (1)

Katsuki

Once again, any mistakes, let me know. etc etc

Later tonight, or tomorrow morning I will be doing a prod check.

_{Edit was to appease ani w/ the spelling of his name.}

Antihero's vote on Jesse is weak. It seems that he didn't like how the Jesse wagon was dying off so he tried to kickstart it again.

This game makes my head hurt. At least it isn't the most stupid.

In all seriousness, gandalf didn't claim scum, nopoint is just tyring to make it seem like that.

vote nopoint

This is his only post relevant to this game and its a pretty crappy one due to the accuracy of his point.

Unvote, Vote: animorpherv1

Really? With all that's starting to happen, you pick on a lurker/flaker? This seems like a copout and it's magnified by your other contributions.

Katsuki's bemoaning of the Jesse wagon doesn't feel right. He had been voting Jesse previously and now he's saying that the wagon looks bad.


I don't get this.

Shotty- i got scum vibes from him for trying to make Gandalf change his vote off of him and onto one of the major wagons. didn't like that.

Actually, I think it's more telling that Gandalf obeyed this without question.

Unvote
Vote:gandalf5166

All in all, I don't really understand the Mufaa wagon. He's been kind of lurky, but why him over my predecessor or warriormode or even Shotty?
From my read, I'm leaning scum on warriormode and Antihero, warriormode sticks out the most to me. VOTE: warriormode

[HackerHuck]

Weird, it looks like I lost a post from last night.

Katsuki's bemoaning of the Jesse wagon doesn't feel right. He had been voting Jesse previously and now he's saying that the wagon looks bad.

Eh? When have I ever voted Jesse?

I'm not sure what I was thinking. I read back through and it seems that you were pretty consistent in your opinion of Jesse and his wagon.

Why would you bring this up now?

Massclaim maybe tomorrow depending on our situation. Today I would rather keep scum/SK in the dark.

I'm not really a fan of either wagon, but I'm getting concerned about why the Mufaa claim has stalled.
To those currently voting for Katsuki, why him over Mufaa?

[HackerHuck]

Well, it seems we have no shortage of people willing to hammer, so we need to keep in mind that someone needs to do it before deadline or nothing happens. I would also like to see a claim, but I also don't want a no-lynch today because we can't get our act together.

I won't be online to hammer at deadline, so unless someone else can guarantee to do it closer to deadline, I'll hammer in about 12 hours.

[HackerHuck]

I'm not getting hypocrisy scumvibes off of Muthaa like I am katsuki.

...such as?

[HackerHuck]

Please read this post.

Not really getting what you're going for there, but it doesn't seem to be misrep. I do notice that you bring up jesse a lot. What's your opinion on him?

[HackerHuck]

UNVOTE: warriordude
VOTE: Shotty

[HackerHuck]

I just doubt that the reason would be a no lynch when there were so many players interested in hammering.

You'd think so, but no one really jumped on with a vote to put him back to L-1.

He'd have to be hopelessly optimistic to hope for No Lynch. He doesn't want his name on the final vote count for some reason.

I can't really think of a pro-town reason for that, but no one else was willing to push for a late Shotty wagon. I can understand that, since I'd rather not risk the no-lynch myself.

UNVOTE: Shotty
VOTE: Muthaa

That should be L-1 again.

[HackerHuck]

Wow, pretty hard to believe that with six doctors we weren't able to protect any of the three townies that died last night. Good news is no vig deaths, but I was really surprised that all three of those slots flipped town.

This is one case where I think that a massclaim is a really good idea. Given what happened yesterday, Katsuki should go first. Please claim when you post your analysis.

Anyone claiming vig needs to claim their target, but I don't think that the docs need to.

[HackerHuck]

Reasons for me first. I do not mind claiming, but I am not claiming just because you say "you first". Also, I'm in class so analysis is out of the question (posts will be colorful ).

Hacker's statement bothers me. Would you like to provide any reasoning as to why you are distraught over the lack of doc protection on questionable players at best?
If anything, those 3 dying N1 was a good thing, as it removes a ton of distractions for today's lynch. Considering that 2 of those were vig shots, the lack of doc protection was a GOOD thing.

Hacker: Your scum suspects please.

Typical process for claiming is that the scummiest person goes first. Although I've got you leaning town, you were the only other wagon of any size yesterday. That says to me that you should go first. Since it's semi-open, I'm really not too concerned about order.

Why do you think I'm distraught about the lack of doc protection? It's just statistically unlikely. With six docs and three kills, it's just surprising that the killers managed to avoid doc protection and each targeted someone different. I'm more interested in why you think it's a good thing that the vigs killed townies. All things equal, lynching a townie is better than NKing one. A lynch gives you some more data.

preview edit-
If you look, I said that they don't need to, not that they shouldn't. I don't think it matters if doctors claim who they protected, so I don't want it to be used to hold up the claiming process.

[HackerHuck]

Ok, I might NOT be doing the analysis... mod didn't list non-voters I don't think.

I must say scott did a good job of doing nothing the entirety of D1 in terms of voting...

Muthaa was the only non-voter, unless you were going to go back and look at every single vote count.

Who was suggesting that we coordinate doc protects for tonight?

The value in the massclaim is that it should give us a pool of suspects for today - six. If we mislynch, then it puts our fate in the hands of the vigs as to whether we make it another day. I'd rather give the vigs a 1 in 5 chance of hitting scum at night, especially since the mafia doc might make it necessary for both vigs to hit the same scum. It also forces the mafia to think harder about whether they should go after a vig who is likely to be protected or stick to one of the claimed doctors.

Most important, it gets the claims out in the open today. If we don't claim today and end up in LYLO tomorrow, the scum a chance to counterclaim vig to get the win.

I think there's some value in massclaim today, but very little downside if we do it.

[HackerHuck]

Who was suggesting that we coordinate doc protects for tonight?

Last time we only had one vig alive D2 (me) and I orchestrated a protection scheme. This could work again. After claims, the vigs can agree who protects who (probably wise to have 2 claimed doctors protecting each vig) and assign the other 2 claimed doctors elsewhere. Scum will know who is/isn't protected but it also confirms scum if someone who was supposed to be protected dies.

How did you miss that?

Opps, I read that post in preview, so I somehow missed it. I haven't thought it through fully, but on the surface that plan doesn't seem to work. We have two claimed doctors protecting five claimed doctors. That only works if we guess right on the two doctors being protected.

What do you suggest we do if we somehow get three vig claims?

I'll be happy because it puts the town in a good position. How would your protection racket work if there are three claimed vigs? Don't answer it in thread until after everyone claims.

[HackerHuck]

Hackers posts have bothered me

v

ery much today. Espec

i

ally statin

g

that

K

atsuki is the scum

i

est player just because it was the second

l

argest wagon yesterday.
One, we can't use "so and so is scummy because theres a big wagon" we need to provide reasoning and evidence (

l

ike most people do). Anoth

e

r thing wrong with this is that nopoint an

d

shotty (two of three people that were

s

cummy) I believe were all on t

h

at wagon at some p

o

int. In fact you weren'

t

on that wagon which makes me feel like you're coming up with a lame excuse as to switch your suspicions to ka

t

suki.

Typical process for claiming is that the scummiest person goes first.

Although I've got you leaning town

, you were the only other wagon of any size yesterday. That says to me that you should go first. Since it's semi-open, I'm really not too concerned about order.

I were going to set myself up to switch, why would I bother to mention that again today?
I'll admit that I didn't look closely at the names on the final wagon. I was mainly going off of the number (3) behind his name. That said, his was still the most recent wagon to compete with Muthaa, so I'm not sure why you're trying to argue that point. I'd rather get the claims started to so we can move on. Why don't you just pick who goes next?

[HackerHuck]

So, um, are we just gonna sit here until deadline again?...

Activity usually drops on the weekend and I believe we're waiting on massclaim direction. Since Warriordude went first, I suggested that he pick next.

[HackerHuck]

This is taking way too long. We should massclaim and then just pick one of the claimed doctors to lynch. I'm in that pool, so whoever posts next should claim.

[HackerHuck]

Doctors - three are scum:
Antihero
Scott Brosius
Katsuki
JesseSheffield
Phaen
HackerHuck

Vigilantes - confirmed town:
warriormode
smashbro_of_the_SSS

Also, anyone have any insight on why Nopoint was killed? I don't see any particular reason, since he wasn't especially active town, but he does vote for jesse, katsuki, and muthaa through the day.

I don't see any value in that line of thought.

It's also best not to discuss why the vigs chose their respective targets. We don't really want to tip the scum off onto their train of thought and there's no reason to doubt their claims.

I'm going to look back into the claimed doctors, but won't get around to it until this evening.

[HackerHuck]

I'm a little disappointed that no one showed up to even ask why I hadn't got to my read through. Come on people, no posts leads to no votes and no votes leads to no lynch. I also want the vigilantes to remain active. You guys are going to have a big role tonight, so it's important to press us so that you know who to target after today's flip.

Here's my take on the other five docs. We're only 14 pages in and there are a lot of empty posts in that.
Anithero - His biggest contribution is a vote on Katsuki and he makes a wall of text post that really doesn't put together a solid case. Most of what he says about Katsuki doesn't even jive with what actually happened, so it looks to be mostly misrep. Oddly enough, he finds Nopoint to be townie. I'd put him in the mostly fluff category

Jesse - I don't have a problem with his choice not to random vote. He's certainly not alone in stance. I find his discussions of scumhunting versus scumseeking to just contribute a lot of noise, but I don't see it as being a scumtell. His claim that Phaen would be his top scum suspect is consistent with his beliefs, albeit not how I would go about making a casae. Iso 18 is a really good wrap-up and explains his thought process enough that I'm leanig town on Jesse. Post 22 is indicative of a new player and is incorrect. Jesse, it is your problem if you can't get your point across. It's no good to be right if no one will listen to you.

Phaen - She seems to be very tentative and I really didn't like how both of her real votes (Jesse and Katsuki) were really just pressure votes. It seems a little hypocritical coming from someone who really had a problem with Jesse not taking a stand.

Katsuki - Lots of noise, makes a pretty basic case on Nopoint that gets Antihero all riled up for some reason. Both of his cases (gandalf and Nopoint) are really weak, but are made early in the game. The worries I see are where he says that he always lines lynches, and the fact that he's been less active since the massclaiming went through.

Scott Brosius - This guy has totally been flying under the radar. Only 16 posts and he's discussed claiming in about five of them. I'd throw him in my scumpile.

Based on my reads, I'd put the scumteam as Antihero, Phaen, and Scott Brosius. That's in descending order of most scummy to least scummy, followed by Katsuki and Jesse in that order.

I don't really care if anyone else puts together a ranking or not. Just have something to say about my list.

[HackerHuck]

Sorry I've been neglecting this game. Let me rectify that.

Hacker: What exactly is misrepresented in my Kat case? And why didn't we hear about what was misrepresented from you yesterday?

For being second on your scum list, the case on Phaen is pretty weak.

Katsuki - Lots of noise, makes a pretty basic case on Nopoint that gets Antihero all riled up for some reason.

That's not the only thing that got me "riled up." Besides the crappy case on nopoint, he also called me scum when questioned.

I'm not seeing the case on Scott; I'm sensing people are just piling on simply because of number of posts (Hacker). Can someone actually show me something he wrote that's scummy?

Kat and Hacker look the scummiest to me; Scott looks townish

VOTE: Hackerhuck

See what follows for the misrep. In my initial read, I noted your case on Katsuki as being incorrect. When I looked at the five suspects today, I dug in a little deeper. I would suggest you do the same.

Yes, my case on Phaen is not very strong, but in comparison with the five other doctors, that's where she sits. Same with Scott, since I've got town reads on Katsuki and Jesse. If Scott hasn't posted very much, why do you think he looks townish?

Misrep looking specifically at post 191.

Scott voted Katsuki for his push on Muthaa, to which Katsuki responded:

@Scott: Oh are you protecting muthaa's lack of wanting to place a vote? Jesse at least explained why they didn't, muthaa has yet to.

This is hypocritical. Jesse had not explained

why

he wasn't voting at the time, so it could be argued that you are protecting Jesse's actions.

I don't see how it's hypocritical. In fact, Katsuki is calling out Scott for being hypocritical because he considers Jesse's lack of voting scummy, but Muthaa's wasn't.
Jesse

had

explained why he wasn't voting and it was quite clear.

Oh, yeah, I don't random vote. You'll learn that.

Your words sum up the misrep nicely.

...he actually gave reasoning with it (if you want to dispute the reason, that's a different issue).

On page 5 is the nopoint vote. Here's the post for that:

After looking at some things...

Vote: Nopoint

Mostly fluff posts, and easy voting Jesse. As someone who does not vote, Jesse seems like a too easy target.

I don't see how nopoint's vote was an "easy vote" when he actually gave reasoning with it (if you want to dispute the reason, that's a different issue). Also, I didn't see Jesse's not voting as a reason in nopoint's vote post.

I asked you to summarize the nopoint wagon on page 6.

Oh, and by the way, and we have yet to hear why the JS wagon is opportunistic.

I'm not sure why you would even say these things. He says right in the quote why he thinks Jesse is the easy vote. Giving a reason for a vote doesn't mean it isn't on an easy target. He also mentions why it's opportunistic in the same post he says it (if you want to dispute the reason, that's a different issue).

Wagoning someone over their playstyle is, well, bad, and makes for a pretty easy opportunistic vote too.

You should also note that in the original quote, he's referencing all of the people voting Jesse, not just nopoint.



I disagree that getting the opinions from the vigilantes is important. Ultimately they will likely make the final decision on who to lynch, but if they totally lead the discussion, it will be harder for them to get good reads on us doctors. The vigs should be probing, but most of the content should be coming from the claimed doctors.

[HackerHuck]

Hacker what do you think of Phaen's recent posts since you ignored them.

I didn't see anything specifically addressed to me. If you're talking about the scum slip you called out, I don't think it's a smoking gun and it's not enough to move my vote. If you read my list, she was already number two on my scumlist, so I don't think anything has changed.

[HackerHuck]

This post is quite the gem.
Lets have the docs, half of which are scum, lead the scumhunting.

How are you going to figure out who the scum are if the confirmed townies are the only ones doing scumhunting?
Let the docs run around pointing the fingers at each other and have the confirmed town sort out the mess. That way everyone that matters is on record.
The other part of that is that we don't want the vigs laying out all of their suspects so that the scum have a better idea of whom to target with their doc and nightkill.

You don't want to commit to a target now anyway, because you should be reevaluating your vig target based on who gets lynched and how they flip.

[HackerHuck]

Vote Count: Day 2

5 to lynch someone; 4 to not lynch anyone.

Scott Brosius: (4) (L-1)

JesseSheffield, Phaen, smashbro_of_the_SSS, warriormode

HackerHuck: (2)

Antihero, Katsuki

Phaen: (1)

Scott Brosius

Not Voting

HackerHuck


Once again, any mistakes, let me know. etc etc

Mod

, it looks like I should have two votes.

I didn't realise that I hadn't voted. I thought it was on Antihero, but I guess I missed it in my day one post.

I'll give us another day to get some more posting in before I drop the hammer on Scott. Based on his last post, I'm now doubtful of a Scott/Phaen/Antihero scum team, but he could just be throwing up some noise.


Edit was to fix a number by mod. 10/4/10 9:28pm EDT

[HackerHuck]

You know.

Scott is starting to seem more town than phaen right now.
Phaen activity thus far in D2 is... slightly like scott in D1... This bothers me, as it seems like that phaen may be trying to avoid saying anything incriminating against herself...

Yet you're not voting for either...

I'm also thinking Scott's town now. If he were scum, one of his buddies would have hammered to gain some town cred. Anti-hero made it clear he wasn't voting and and Katsuki didn't want to do it either. I'm swapping Scott for Katsuki in my last scum slot, although I'm not entirely sure that both scum would camp out on me so early in the day.

Although I'd prefer an Antihero lynch, this will even things up (2 docs on each wagon). Let's see who jumps where.

VOTE: Phaen


And in case it's still not obvious, the docs should

only

be protecting the vigilantes tonight and it would be best to pick one randomly to maximize the chances of protection.

[HackerHuck]

Katsuki, what ever happened to your beef with Antihero? You two were all over each other for a while yesterday and you both seem to have dropped it.

I'm also interested in what Antihero thinks about Katsuki's interest in wagoning me today. Do you think he's bussing or do his actions make one of us appear more townish?

[HackerHuck]

Antihero has been :goodposting: today, hence why my attention has been focused elsewhere, like on hackerscum for example. I have yet to find anything scummy in antihero posts today, though I too am rather curious as to why he still finds me scummy.

Really?
I'm now very curious what you find to be :goodposting: Could you link/quote some of that?
I'm also wondering what happened to this-

Erg.

I will see if I have the energy for analysis tonight. I have another I must get to first though.

My top suspects are as follows
Hacker - For D2 comments. I think I explained some of it already. He is my top candidate.
Scott - Accuses me of doing nothing when his own iso is essentially empty. Seems like coasting scum imo.

Antihero: Useless player. Knows nothing but misrep.

Phaen is prob town imo. Need to look at her though.
Jesse is most likely town as well.

I REALLY THINK, THOUGH, THAT WHAT OUR VIG'S THINK ARE MOST IMPORTANT. CONFIRMED THEY ARE, NONE OF THE REST OF US ARE.

So you've recently said that you think Scott is more town than Phaen, you're now saying that Antihero is :goodposting:. I get that you think I'm scum and maybe that earlier comment means you think that Phaen is scummy now. If that's the case, then who is your new third scum?

[HackerHuck]

Your wagon is small and probably not going anywhere. Kat's "interest in wagoning" you doesn't mean you're on opposite teams. In fact, since your wagon probably isn't going anywhere, it looks more like a bus.

Really? Why would someone think that my wagon wouldn't go anywhere? Let's look at who has suspected me since Day 2 began.

So my initial list right now:

Scum:
Hacker
Antihero
Scott
(from most to least)

My top suspects are as follows
Hacker - For D2 comments. I think I explained some of it already. He is my top candidate.
Scott - Accuses me of doing nothing when his own iso is essentially empty. Seems like coasting scum imo.
Antihero: Useless player. Knows nothing but misrep.

Kat and Hacker look the scummiest to me; Scott looks townish

VOTE: Hackerhuck

Sorry about being gone.

My top scum suspects are Scott, Katsuki, and Huck.

I get the sense Jesse is town. The other two I'm just unsure about.

My scum list is still the same for now.

I'm still feeling a HH, Antihero, Phaen scumteam.

Vote: Hacker

At the time Kastuki voted for me, there were four other people who had me on their scum list - WarriorMode, Antihero (with a vote), Phaen, and Scott. Smashbro had yet to comment on me and Jesse really hadn't either. If anything it seems that I would be a pretty easy lynch. That is unless 3 of those 5 are scum and don't want to all be caught lynching town. I guess that might be why someone wouldn't expect my wagon to go anywhere.

[HackerHuck]

Katsuki - you need to reply to this post.

Isn't doing much to push for it? You shitting? Just go LOOK at the shit he's posted, and tell me that its not scum logic. ESPECIALLY the post of "OH HAI LETS HAVE THE DOCS CONSISTING OF 50% SCUM DO THE SCUMHUNTING SO THAT THEY CAN HAVE AS MUCH INFLUENCE OVER THE LYNCH AS POSSIBLE".

Read my iso. hacker's opening post D2 plus that is more than enough in my eyes that he is scum.

Maybe you should explain to us why the vigilantes should do the talking, thus telegraphing their night actions to the scum. I can think of one reason why you might want that to happen.

[HackerHuck]

Katsuki - you need to reply to this post.

[HackerHuck]

Come on Katsuki, you might want to bus your partner before the vigilantes come in here and drop the hammer.

[HackerHuck]

I am quite content with my vote on you hacker, thanks.

Because you're really hoping for a no-lynch?

I will respond to any other stuff that may need responding when I have the time.

I seriously doubt this.

[HackerHuck]

smashbro- I think we should not stack if we lynch town and stack if we lynch scum.

Seriously? Don't stack regardless. All of the real doctors should be protecting you guys, so a failed vig kill means guaranteed scum.

Esurio - it's a pretty easy read. If you just skip to the start of day 2, that will be a good start.

[HackerHuck]

Here are the outcomes if you don't stack:
Hit two scum: 2v 2t 0m - win
Hit one scum and scum doctor block: 2v 2t 1m - guaranteed scum lynch for the win
Hit one town and scum doctor block: 2v 1t 2m - guaranteed scum lynch
Hit one town and one scum: 2v 1t 1m
bad vigging: 2v 0t 2m - lose
Unintentional stack hits town: 2v 1t 2m
Unintentional stack hits scum: 2v 2t 1m

The way I see it, you're slightly better off not intentionally stacking - 2/7 guaranteed win, 1/7 chance of losing and the remaining 4/7 chance gives you good odds going into night.
That said, it's not a huge advantage and it's ultimately up to you guys. I tend to prefer not giving the scum any additional information, because it does allow them to alter their strategy. You're assuming that the scum aren't going to risk a non-kill by targeting the vigilantes, but if you stack on a scum target, they might as well take their chances targeting a vig.

At the time Kastuki voted for me, there were four other people who had me on their scum list - WarriorMode, Antihero (with a vote), Phaen, and Scott. Smashbro had yet to comment on me and Jesse really hadn't either. If anything it seems that I would be a pretty easy lynch. That is unless 3 of those 5 are scum and don't want to all be caught lynching town. I guess that might be why someone wouldn't expect my wagon to go anywhere.

This is non sequitur.

I might expect your wagon to not go anywhere because, I don't know, you're not actually getting any votes.

Hindsight is 20/20. How would Katsuki have known that?

Since my wagon isn't going anywhere, how about you do something useful and comment on the two leading wagons - Phaen/Esurio or Scott.

[HackerHuck]

Waiting on esurio, would love to hear what he has to say.

Esurio is a she

Hacker is still spewing scum logic. If there were ever anything called "scum motivation", it'd be hacker's posts.

I think you need to explain this better, otherwise Warriordude and SmashBro might listening to said 'scum motivation' and following my scum logic. If you're really town, you would back up that accusation with some facts.

It also erks me that hacker keeps trying to call his wagon a "dead wagon that will go nowhere", since I severely disagree with that, especially with the extension we got.

Please read more carefully. Antihero is the one who stated that my wagon is a dead one that is going nowhere.

Your wagon is small and probably not going anywhere. Kat's "interest in wagoning" you doesn't mean you're on opposite teams. In fact, since your wagon probably isn't going anywhere, it looks more like a bus.

Really? Why would someone think that my wagon wouldn't go anywhere? Let's look at who has suspected me since Day 2 began.

At the time Kastuki voted for me, there were four other people who had me on their scum list - WarriorMode, Antihero (with a vote), Phaen, and Scott. Smashbro had yet to comment on me and Jesse really hadn't either. If anything it seems that I would be a pretty easy lynch. That is unless 3 of those 5 are scum and don't want to all be caught lynching town. I guess that might be why someone wouldn't expect my wagon to go anywhere.

This is non sequitur.

I might expect your wagon to not go anywhere because, I don't know, you're not actually getting any votes.

---

two things wrong with this:
one were not killing 2 scum at night. mafia doctor is going to protect his buddy. another thing, smashbro and I would not unintentially stack. there's a way to guarantee avoiding that. which leaves 4 outcomes:

Hit one scum and scum doctor block: 2v 2t 1m - guaranteed scum lynch for the win
Hit one town and scum doctor block: 2v 1t 2m - guaranteed scum lynch, then separate night kills for the win.
Hit one town and one scum: 2v 1t 1m- win by next night
bad vigging: 2v 0t 2m - lose

3 ways to win one way to lose. = 75% chance

Have some optimism. We could lynch the mafia doc today. If you have a way to avoid unintentionally stacking without telling the scum who you are targeting, I would agree. Otherwise, you don't want to tip off the scum for who you're targeting. That way if you do target town, they may inadvertently stack with you.

---

Katsuki - I'm not forgetting this. It shouldn't be too hard for you to comment on since he's only posted four or five times today. I'll even make it easier for you by quoting the post I keep asking you about.

Antihero has been :goodposting: today, hence why my attention has been focused elsewhere, like on hackerscum for example. I have yet to find anything scummy in antihero posts today, though I too am rather curious as to why he still finds me scummy.

Really?
I'm now very curious what you find to be :goodposting: Could you link/quote some of that?
I'm also wondering what happened to this-

Erg.

I will see if I have the energy for analysis tonight. I have another I must get to first though.

My top suspects are as follows
Hacker - For D2 comments. I think I explained some of it already. He is my top candidate.
Scott - Accuses me of doing nothing when his own iso is essentially empty. Seems like coasting scum imo.

Antihero: Useless player. Knows nothing but misrep.

Phaen is prob town imo. Need to look at her though.
Jesse is most likely town as well.

I REALLY THINK, THOUGH, THAT WHAT OUR VIG'S THINK ARE MOST IMPORTANT. CONFIRMED THEY ARE, NONE OF THE REST OF US ARE.

So you've recently said that you think Scott is more town than Phaen, you're now saying that Antihero is :goodposting:. I get that you think I'm scum and maybe that earlier comment means you think that Phaen is scummy now. If that's the case, then who is your new third scum?

[HackerHuck]

Back up with fact? I already posted about the stack/no-stack situation thanks.

I had to check, but I found that you did comment on stacking kills. I'd just like to know how it differs from my 'scum logic'?

We don't need vigs both targetting the same person imo. If one of the targets doesn't die, then we lynch them, simple as.

This would allow us to find scum faster.

smashbro- I think we should not stack if we lynch town and stack if we lynch scum.

Seriously? Don't stack regardless. All of the real doctors should be protecting you guys, so a failed vig kill means guaranteed scum.

Katsuki - keep reading all the way to the bottom.

and what is it that you want me to answer in there? I do not get what you want.

Are you deliberately being difficult? There were only four lines of my own comments in that quote. How hard was it to find the question? I'll even let you off the hook for the second half of that post. The bolded part should make it very clear what I'm after. I want to know

why

you think that Antihero was :goodposting:

Antihero has been :goodposting: today, hence why my attention has been focused elsewhere, like on hackerscum for example. I have yet to find anything scummy in antihero posts today, though I too am rather curious as to why he still finds me scummy.

Really?

I'm now very curious what you find to be :goodposting: Could you link/quote some of that?

[HackerHuck]

Oh HELL NO DON'T YOU MISREP ME, HACKER.

IN CLASS, WILL DIG UP THE POSTS I NEED WHEN I CAN. I HAD GIANT CHUNKS OF THEORY EXPLAINING WHY WE SEPERATE IF WE LYNCH SCUM, STACK IF WE MISLYNCH.
SAME WITH THAT LITTLE THING YOU WANT FROM ME.

Misrep? Is that not one of

your

quotes in its entirety? I'd like to know how that could possibly be misrep.



If you've somehow changed your mind and think stack is better, prove how I'm wrong with my math or assumptions. Warriormode did just that, but now he thinks it's a 75% of winning if we don't stack. What is it that we're missing?

You don't have to convince me, just the two vigilantes.

[HackerHuck]

It is misrep, because you are trying to associate the stuff you've said to mine, and present it as if we're saying the same thing.

How are these not the same thing? If they're not the same thing, you don't need to look at whatever else you've posted to explain how they're different.

We don't need vigs both targetting the same person imo. If one of the targets doesn't die, then we lynch them, simple as.

This would allow us to find scum faster.

smashbro- I think we should not stack if we lynch town and stack if we lynch scum.

Seriously? Don't stack regardless. All of the real doctors should be protecting you guys, so a failed vig kill means guaranteed scum.

You've been caught in a lie and now you're flailing. Same thing with your :goodposting: comment about Antihero. There aren't any examples, so you're trying to make a bunch of noise so that people will forget about it.

[HackerHuck]

HACKER, YOU ARE A LIAR, PLAIN AND SIMPLE.

ME GETTING CAUGHT IN

YOUR

LIE IS DUE TO YOUR MISREP. I COULD CATCH YOU IN LIES IF ALL I DID WAS TWIST YOUR POSTS AND WORDS.

Where's the misrep? What does your bolded bit have to do with stacking? If I'm lying, you should be able to point to it.

Where is this?

I HAD GIANT CHUNKS OF THEORY EXPLAINING WHY WE SEPERATE IF WE LYNCH SCUM, STACK IF WE MISLYNCH.

What about this?

Hacker is still spewing scum logic. If there were ever anything called "scum motivation", it'd be hacker's posts.

If you weren't referring to my comments on stacking, then what scum logic am I still spewing?


Antihero is still ignoring this game.

[HackerHuck]

Also, belated HIIIIIIIIIIIIII to HackerHuck. I don't know if you remember but you were an SE in my first newbie game on this site. <_<

Anyway, less talking, more reading.

I remember playing in a newbie game with you, but I didn't realise that it was your first game. Glad to see you're still around.

and what is it that you want me to answer in there? I do not get what you want.

Are you deliberately being difficult? There were only four lines of my own comments in that quote. How hard was it to find the question? I'll even let you off the hook for the second half of that post. The bolded part should make it very clear what I'm after. I want to know

why

you think that Antihero was :goodposting:

Antihero has been :goodposting: today, hence why my attention has been focused elsewhere, like on hackerscum for example. I have yet to find anything scummy in antihero posts today, though I too am rather curious as to why he still finds me scummy.

Really?

I'm now very curious what you find to be :goodposting: Could you link/quote some of that?

Having trouble finding where Antihero was :goodposting:?

ARE YOU FUCKING PURPOSEFULLY TRYING TO BE ILLITERATE, OR ARE YOU JUST NORMALLY THIS MUCH OF A WISEASS?

NO SHIT YOU ARE MISREPPING, YOU DIDN'T EVEN FUCKING QUOTE THE STUFF WHERE I WAS TALKING ABOUT STACKING VIG SHOTS, USED SOMETHING ELSE TO SAY THAT "OH HAI KAT YOU DIDN'T SAY STACK VIG SHOT, MY THOUGHTS ARE SAME AS YOURS"

STRAIGHT FUCKING BULLSHIT

READ MY FUCKING POST WHERE I QUOTED THE STUFF, I AM POINTING OUT YOUR DAMN FUCKING LIES. IT WAS ALREADY A RESPONSE TO AN EARLIER SCUM-LOGIC POST OF YOURS.


SOMEONE DEAL WITH THIS ASSCLOWN. I HAVE LITTLE DOUBTS THAT HE IS BEING ILLITERATE ON PURPOSE.

So you admit now that you did change your mind and that you were also using scum logic? Or are you saying that I made up that quote? If my logic is scum-logic, point out how it isn't right. All you've done is point to your post, which doesn't refute mine in any way. If my logic is so bad, why aren't you trying to prove to Warriormode why he should listen to you?


Esurio's vote now has me a little worried. My entire scumlist is voting for me, so I may be wrong about one of them.

[HackerHuck]

I am fine with a Phaen or Antihero lynch today.

Or Katsuki, but let's see if we can get that antihero wagon going.

UNVOTE: Esuriospiritus
VOTE: Antihero

Maybe he'll show up again now that his name has been called.

also, i don't exactly remember where the scott wagon dissappeared to, but

unvote

. I still think he is scum. Scott, if you think esurio/Phaen is scum, then why are you agreeing with who that slot believes is scum?

Smashbro - you should keep those kinds of thoughts to yourself. It's not doing anyone a favor by making your suspicions known.

[HackerHuck]

Maybe he'll show up again now that his name has been called.

Why am I not surprised. It didn't even take 2 hours.

Smashbro has a valid question. I'm not sure why he needs to keep it to himself.

Unless this is just to excuse Scott from coming up with a response.

Come on, I know you can read. Scott answered that question before I even posted, so stop trying to make hay.

Do you still think that Katsuki is bussing me?

[HackerHuck]

So, scott has disappeared. How convenient.

I thought that you didn't care what the claimed doctors think, or are you hoping that he'll come in and hammer me before the vigilantes coordinate their plans?

[HackerHuck]

It does seem like the town should have been able to keep on with a 2-2 and vigilantes remaining, but no one seemed to contradict us when we were talking about town losing with this same scenario. That said, the setup would actually lend itself to being a bit broken with a massclaim, because the only way town could have lost after night 1 would be for the vigs missing scum entirely last night.

Oh and hacker I hope you wern't offended by my raging or anything.

...

= =

No, I figured that you were flailing scum, so that's kind of expected. I was more frustrated that no one was really following me. I was very surprised by your turn in behaviour on day 2, because I felt you were likely town through day 1 - note that I even protected you. Jesse had me fooled, but I got a little nagging feeling when he also turned on me so quickly when I made the switch from Esurio to Antihero. I was a little disappointed that no one voted any of my suspects after I flipped town. Still may have ended with a town loss, but I would have felt like I didn't die for nothing.

gg all