Open 316 - Hard Boiled (Day Two)
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Nevermind- this is ridiculous it seems like you guys went through several options, so can someone just summarize the plan so I can say whether or not I agree.
I will say this, in Open set ups the town have one major advantage NUMBERS and scum have one major advantage KNOWLEDGE. While we sit around and wonder who is who and turn on each other the only thing scum has to do is survive and try to take out our PRs since they are a threat to them. Outing our PRs is never good especially day one, I would dare say lynch Hoopla or Muff see the flip so we can analyze the motivations behind pushing this plan then go forward with Night Actions and tomorrow we can address the mass claim idea because today I don't see it doing any justice.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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I refuse to read a plan that seems to have been re-worked several different times. Also, notice how I don't care. I said I was going V/LA you guys could be a little considerate on the posting and know that NO I don't want to read pages and pages of thoughts.
Goodness, calm down. It's either explain it to me, or have a clueless teammate which then would foil your plan because you'd want me lynched and then blah blah blah claim day 2 anyway. I don't have the patience for people being rude to me. I started off nice and all I ask for is the same WITHOUT THE ATTITUDE-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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I never said it should be stalled, but I am asking for a summary not of the game but of a plan I wasn't around for during it's conception. ONE THING- the plan. We are on the same team and if you don't want to help me understand what you guys have had days to talk about then don't.
For the record, I am reading but if you guys are trying to hear my thoughts and speed up the process then you should help. If not then you can wait while I read and work on my other games as well and I will get to this when I feel like it. Does that work better for you? Probably not, but those are the only choices short of lynching me for not wanting to read.
Also, the only reason I even ask and refuse to read is because I am against this plan. I am giving you guys the chance to pitch this to me because as it stands I will not be participating.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Hey DarkScum... keep up and stop quoting things that are no longer relevant. Yes, I went through saying I wouldn't re read but I have conceded defeat if this is how you've all decided to go... and I've read what everyone has written since I came back from V/LA. I don't care what you think about me claiming last it's no big deal if we are going in sections- I will claim last in every catagory as far as Not Dect/Psy or Dect/Psy.
As far as you painting me to be scummy...I'm apprehensive there is a difference, but wouldn't you love it if people thought I was scum.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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It's not difficult- but it's players like you that make me not want to waste my breathe. People don't want to hear why I disagree and think about it- you just want to hear why I disagree so you can argue me down and try to prove me wrong. Not interested in that. I want to get this over with, and lynch someone so we can gain some information-- this play by numbers thing not only takes out 90% of the sport and spirit of the game, but if it was developed by scum then they have already thought of how to manipulate it.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Amrun wrote:I AM INTERESTED. How many times do I have to say?Stop being a sensitive little flower and read words.
If you have found holes in the plan, I want to hear them.
It's not being sensitive- I'm just not going to cooperate with rude people. Go ahead with your plan and see how well it works. The longer you give me attitude, the longer I am going to be uncooperative. Which is why it doesn't benefit the town to lash out disrespectfully because then you have an upset townie(me) who couldn't care less. I want to win, but teammates like Amrun make me want to play games spitefully-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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I never said anyone was being "mean" there is a difference between mean and RUDE. The attitude that I am getting from these posts are less than favorable. You obviously aren't reading... I wasn't just like "OH I AM AGAINST ANY PLAN"...I am just against mass claiming and honestly given any other situation most people would be but I see a lot of sheep hiding behind Hoopla's experience and I want her lynched because this was originally her idea and her flip will show the plans true motivation. If she is town, we can re work things after scum's NK and figure out how to proceed.
As it stands, no I am NOT OKAY with scumhunting from only a few people giving others the chance to coast by in the game just because they go uncounter claimed- not to mention I would love to see if we even make it through claims without counter claims and exactly how we choose to solve that problem.
I called you scum, because I love to see how words get under people's skin. For this game there are 3 scum members.
First I thought Jake and Muff Definitely
Then Hoopla and Muff...
DarkFlashlight and Amrun just sheeping townies? But possibly scum.
I want to take out one of the people behind this plan and then we move forward
NINJA'D
Fine- I won't participate in a Day 1 massclaim...I at least tried to hear you guys out--so if we are going to be stubborn then let's be stubborn-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Definitely do- however I am done arguing with you...
You've showed your true colors, you'd like me lynched and wouldn't that ruin your perfect little plan? Oh I know it would...if you are town don't be so full of yourself to let your frustration control your votes. I know I am being difficult...but mass claiming this early is not pro-town and I am playing MY best game to ensure a town win.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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NINJA'D
sheep can be town...they are just confused/misguided townies.
Right now, there is almost no way any of you have a good grasp on who could be scum or not, I mean besides me because I've decided to speak out against the plan. I never said it didn't sound good, but so do a lot of things and their are several ways it can go bad. The vig can die just by random NK-- scum get lucky...I did in a couple of games. The plan is not rock solid and really nothing is, but I don't like that you all just hop on board . I know I'm town, it's the rest of you I'm worried about and instead of using the time to put pressure on people and actually figure out who's scum you've decided to play by numbers like they can't be manipulated. I want Hoopla gone because if she is scum no doubt she's already thought of a way to turn the tables. If she's town, then she can claim at L-1 if she wants and if it's a PR she lives.
I feel bad for you guys acting like know-it-alls...I am open to this plan, but you have to pitch it better. I am not seeing that it's all that beneficial, and no I am not pointing out flaws because I don't have that burden. I just don't have to participate and if you lynch me for that then you go off of your plan and you cannot go forward unless I agree to claim..>WHICH I DID but the loud mouths just had to continue antagonizing
But regardless- you guys can get your attitudes together or throw your plan in the garbage and have me lynched instead.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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My signature does sum me up...that was the point
I do care about the plan, and I genuinely think it's something to be skeptical of. As far as disproving counterclaims you cannot until Day 2 after the Night Phase, so we give scum a free pass for day one??? We should always try to hit scum first...no matter what, even though mislynches happen day one they aren't good or acceptable-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Honestly, I appreciate you swank for being blunt and I get it. But I am not going to be held into a plan I didn't agree with and wasnt around for, lynching me would be against your win condition because that is all it's based off of, but I understand and I am not going to bend over for arrogant people.
When they learn how to talk to people respectful in a mature manner, I will be more cooperative.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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I don't need the phony back handed apologies, and I am not here to survive that is where people are wrong. They are upset with me and willing to get rid of me as if it hurts just myself, this is a team game and voting me is putting yourselves down one player who will actively scum hunt and is doing so in the process of all of this-- my refusal reveals a lot and if I am forced to go by lynching then so be it. But I really hope you guys are smarter than lynching someone who disagrees--what motivation would I have to be outwardly against this plan? even still? just to put heat on myself? really...not smart, but I will understand and accept it as stupid play if I have to go and hopefully town will still win.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Hoopla wrote:I think glowball can manage to get through the cycle of Det-Psych/not Det-Psych and so on.
IS that all you are concerned about...outing the Det?
Why aren't we considering any other courses of action? Why not just let the PRs stay hidden, and give them their orders or a choice of 2 people and they can decided after that. I just think the motivation to get the best PR out is scummy and I would like us to explore other options. I am sure that if you guys could come up with this plan you can come up with an equally effective plan that doesn't involve day one claiming.
I also appreciate the apologies, I can say I have been difficult but I am just not the type to bend over because when all is said and done if the town does get screwed I want to make sure I tried my best.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Funny how AtF isn't going to stop my actions...you guys are fine and you've been fine, this is how I play and honestly I cannot take what you two say as much because both of you are on my radar as scum.
Just play YOUR game, and stop bringing up old stuff. I mean zMuff is grasping because it was something he just brought back up for no reason, if he wasn't trying to say anything I about me then his point was useless.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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see now swank is contributing to the anarchy...
I see every game as a team- I mean seriously yeah we don't know who is scum, but we know EVERYONE isn't scum. I'm not going to be a paranoid freak about the game and I believe in general it is pro-town to work together that being said, I cannot get behind something I don't support. I wouldn't follow you guys off a cliff either- shot me....better yet lynch me if you don't like it.
The longer you guys keep bringing me up as a subject for anything other than scumhunting the longer I will be uncooperative. Seriously, if you have a question I will answer it- but it's to a point where you guys are just shooting me down because I don't want to fall in line with your plan and I am being difficult. You guys are attacking my personality not scum hunting and there is a difference.-
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There are 3 mafia goons. Naming 4 people isn't a problem in my book- as far as lynching you guys goes well if you go forward with the plan I won't really have that option. I am out numbered but it doesn't mean I won't speak my mind until the very end.
Giving reads is a part of this game sorry if you don't like it. I am not even against everyone for the plan for instance I think Swank is pro-town and he's come down on me for being uncooperative. There is just something about the passion and motives that I get from you, Muff, Am, and Hoop that make me think you are scum.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Okay I took the time to look over this plan- it is PRETTY good, but it isn't 100%. It's a numbers game and the scum pulling it off would have to be someone NO ONE suspects but given where the idea originated and the amount of people for it...I think there is a definite win scenario for scum. I would post my notes but that would kind of be like coaching if they haven't already thought of it themselves.
This is what bothers me about Hoopla. If she is scum, then Pre Game they could have discussed this strategy and if they are thinking of the plan I saw that could work then we are screwed if we hold ourselves down to this. I mean it really doesn't INCREASE our odds, it's just more systematic and therefore less worrisome in the beginning. Down the road this could hurt us...although I am reluctant to say how for fear that will we still go through with it for the positive aspects and that no one will see my side and then I've given scum the game.-
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That being said...I will go along with this plan, as far as claiming goes and I will see if it is worth it from there as far as Day 2 and Day 3 goes. Anything is worth trying, but if after we claim I don't see good odds as far as the groups go I will express my concerns.
So whenever you guys are ready I am a willing participant-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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Well I could explain it but it would probably be a bit confusing, because I have charted out almost every possibility for the splits to go and NKs and Lynches, Vig kills. So Just sit down and look at the plan and then get a piece of paper and draw it out and then draw it out again and go through EVERY phase. We CAN win this, but it definitely requires a level of hesistation because with a plan like this scum will have the strength of even more knowledge as they know what we will be doing, and for every action there is a counter action. I just hope that at any moment we need to be prepared with a plan B and people need to be ready to evacuate the plan if things go south, because if we mess up the plan is done for.-
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glowball Mafia Scum
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BTW I think we seriously need to consider that scum has thought about how to handle this situation because there was very little resistance to this plan, which is another reason I was skeptical. It was proposed to mass claim, something usually not pro-town this early and there wasn't much of a struggle from anyone besides myself- I mean questions here and there but nothing too intense. There are 3 mafia goons, and there aren't 3 people protesting the plan so chances are that scum have some idea how to beat this because if not they would just surrender Day 2.
Also, Neil your avatar makes ME smile- I want to have all of the Rock's babies!-
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DarkFlashlight wrote:glowball wrote:Okay I took the time to look over this plan
Please explain this.
I took the time to look over this plan. I sat down,put my thinking cap on and used my eyes and brain to understand all possible outcomes.
DarkFlashlight wrote:
glowball wrote:Well I could explain it but it would probably be a bit confusing, because I have charted out almost every possibility for the splits to go and NKs and Lynches, Vig kills.
Where did you do this? A piece of paper?
Yes- and on my computer.-
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Amrun wrote:Hoopla wrote:jake: unless you're going to lift your activty rate by 400% (I mean, be capable of posting nearly every day and keeping up with the game), I'd suggest replacing out, because you'll just fall behind again and hurt town deeper into the game, which is worse than cutting your losses now.
and...please-
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Hoopla wrote:glowball wrote:@Hoopla....why did you feel the need to reply to Swank?
Because it's a silly thing to say. And I thought it should be quoted in all its glory at the top of the new page.
Why did you feel the need to ask me that question?
I just find that scum tend to reply to things about themselves that didn't require any attention, it's like they are worried that someone else might agree so they are on the defensive- not to mention your response was just nothing.
I felt the need to ask you the question because that's part of the game.-
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Oversoul you are scum. You are active lurking scum, who's decision to suddenly become active was based on the opportunity to corner neil since many player have some suspicions of him already.
Here are some things that bothered me...
Oversoul wrote:zMuffinMan wrote:
Yes, it would neutralise one of town's PRs (in my plan, the det-psych), but here's the thing. Any sort of mass-claim is going to 'neutralise' at least one of the PRs. My plan protects what I consider to be the more useful PRs (vig-tracker, HT) in exchange for the sacrifice of the det-psych (baiting the N1 kill) and most probably the hider at some point.
You brought up the issue of counter-claims, but it's a non-issue, because the vig-tracker cannot be counter-claimed (he won't be claiming) and the HT issue I already proposed a solution. But here's the thing: even if the vig-tracker did claim and was counter-claimed D1, the real vig-tracker could choose to be a vig and vig the liar, and we'd have all our other PRs alive tomorrow. There is really no counter-claim issue here. So yes, I'm being dismissive.
Nothing scummy about the first part and it actually presents itself as a town read. However,I am curious as to how the Hider Tracker is more beneficial than the hider itself. Should the Hider even be chosen as the nightkill, scum will most likely lose a night.Also, what point is there to the Hider Tracker if the Hider is publicly claiming who he is going to hide behind?It seems contradictory.
Isn't the bolded what you accused Neil of? Fishing for tips for scum or scum trying to deduce the best kill and wanting more answers as to how the game will unfold so they can try to beat it. Not to mention, this is just hypocrisy since you bashed Neil for the same thing IMO.
Oversoul wrote:This seems to be the first notion that some believe Hoopla is scum and has orchestrated a grand scheme that looks beneficial to the town, but in some obscure way it puts them all in grave danger.Perhaps in the scum QT (do they have one?) they have created their own plan beginning with this post?
I just love it when people try to fake town slips- they always sound so ignorant. Now I am not opposed to anyone being attacked and saying straight up "I am town" it's not helpful, but it's just more honest then playing dumb. Oversoul, if you are in 3 games and none of those seem to be newbie games although you only have 67 posts I am going to assume you have some offsite experience and I am also going to assume you've read the role PMs provided by the Mods on the first page of every game- MEANING you KNOW there is a QT and pretending that you don't know is just playing dumb. Town slip=failed.
Oversoul wrote:Even when the game is tipped in your favor? This post also shows that zMuffin is also willing to play the game as is, in a suboptimal fashion for the sake of not going against odds that are tipped in the town's favor. Surely he would know that given he already proposed an optimal situation and defended it in #83.
YOUR favor? Distance/Alignment slip? Odds, tipped all things scum would take heavy knowledge in- maybe this is a stretch but something about Oversoul isn't sitting right with me.
UNVOTE: Hoopla
VOTE: Oversoul-
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Oversoul wrote:Muffin, you are null-leaning scum.
Glowball,it is funnyyou say those are slips when they aren't. And I can't accuse Muffin and Neil of doing the same thing? I don't need answers to my questions because I'm not looking for the answers. They are rhetorical questions. I hope your other reads aren't as wrong as this one, Glow.
You know what is really funny? How I never asked for answer-- don't jump on the defensive unless you intend on actually addressing the points I made instead of trying to discredit them through patronizing mockery.-
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