Open 333 : Carbon-14 - Game ended

[Cobblerfone]

/confirm

Saulres is probtown.

[Cobblerfone]

Cobbler, what makes you say that?

I'll say at the end of RVS. Now, some questions:

@Whiskers: I briefly read a couple posts of one of the games you were in. You seem to have a delightful posting style. How do you expect to do this game?
@Kondi: I checked a completed newbie game that you replaced in and saw that your very first vote was for scum. Do you expect you'll do as impressively this game?
@Xalxe: I saw on your wiki page that you prefer to be a pro-scum player. What do you like about being scum? Do you feel you do poorly as town?
@Saulres: What is your experience with mafia? Have you played much off-site?
@DonJosh: I remember playing some marathon games with you, but I couldn't find any normal ones to research. How would you describe your play?

@Everyone: What's so bad about Mist?

[Cobblerfone]

...No. RVS Policy Lynches can go wrong. Especially with such a small setup.

@DonJosh: I remember playing some marathon games with you, but I couldn't find any normal ones to research. How would you describe your play?

I'm pretty terrible at mafia in all honesty, but I'm trying out a new playstyle this game.

True, it's just one mislynch before lylo.

Noted, I didn't really remember the one I played with anyway.

@Xalxe: I saw on your wiki page that you prefer to be a pro-scum player. What do you like about being scum? Do you feel you do poorly as town?

Darn, you do your research...

Do I detect sarcasm?

@Everyone: What's so bad about Mist?

My bias is primarily based upon her Mish-Mash performance. I have yet to see a Mafia game performance.

kondi, on the other hand, is a chronic flaker.

You would policy lynch for a non-mafia reason? wa.......t. Can you explain further?

@Saulres: I read some werewolf games on an off-site forum, then moderated one on another one. Then played on the second forum, then joined here, and now I play between the three sites. The first site is much more quick paced. 24 hour days/nights and use plurality lynch instead of majority.

[Cobblerfone]

Now that Mist's posted:

@Mist: Why do

you

prefer to be pro-mafia? Do you feel you don't play as well as town?

[Cobblerfone]

OMFG where is that first site, I hate slow games so much.

Their games tend to be drastically unbalanced nowadays. One mod in particular regularly bans claiming. And probably would even if it were balanced.

Anyway, a nolynch is a bad idea, yeah, because then it'd be one lynch until mylo.

Cobblerfone, what's your preferred alignment?

I like being town. Especially when there's more experienced and fun players in the game. I don't think I'd be able to enjoy those as scum. I'd be distracted by all the "idiots" that can't see I'm scum. But then, first scum game ended quickly, and my second one was a dead horse walking, so IDK. I like watching and learning from fun players though, players like DGB, Reckoner, and Spyrex.
PREDIT:
My favorite role is Cop. Both my completed off-site cop games I got a guilty off of a tiny scumtell on the first possible night, then subsequently got lynched the next day. Lost both times, though the first was due to bad setup (town was able to lynch correctly on D2 and lose because the scum was a lover.) and the second, the guy I got a guilty on somehow convinced the town that he was the miller/traitor, and that he got converted, and that he was the only hope for finding the other scum...yeah...

[Cobblerfone]

1. is answered by my location.
2. Why do you play mafia? For fun and a challenge. The two are not unrelated. Plus the social aspect, now that I've been thinking about it.
3. I answered.
4. When do you get to post? Anytime, though I'll tend to post morning and evening my time, with some posts possibly throughout the day.

[Cobblerfone]

(Addendum: Anytime does not include between 11 PM and 8 AM my time.)

[Cobblerfone]

Okay, kondi still hasn't responded. So I'll just say I have a townread on Whiskers and a weaker one on Saulres. Whiskers, because pony asked for my favorite alignment then put some extra thought into it and asked for my favorite role. Saulres because of the L+3 thing and redoing his post.

[Cobblerfone]

VOTE: DonJosh

For claiming he's trying out a new playstyle.

[Cobblerfone]

Your "Let's all unvote and be out of RVS" prompted another round of RVS to occur-- case in point, Cobblerfone's "Donjosh says he's trying out a new playstyle, lynch him lol." I assume this is random-vote, as "trying out a new playstyle" is not indicative of scum.

Actually it was serious. To explain, "trying out a new style" can be an excuse to avoid comparisons to previous town-meta. It's not much, but it's early. With my townread posts I felt we were out of RVS but still in RQS, so... yeah.

@Xalxe: Why do you have a townread on Don? And why am I neutral?

PREDIT:Darn ninjas.

[Cobblerfone]

Actually it was serious. To explain, "trying out a new style" can be an excuse to avoid comparisons to previous town-meta. It's not much, but it's early. With my townread posts I felt we were out of RVS but still in RQS, so... yeah.

Why are you trying to avoid comparisons to prior town meta?

?
I was talking about DonJosh.

@Kondi: It was Newbie 1112. You are also so obvtown it's not even funny.

[Cobblerfone]

Scumspects: Mist for #101 (mainly the copycat cry of "Whiskers stop vote hopping" rubs me wrong) DonJosh is relatively only leaning scum for previous reasons. Xalxe is getting scummier by the post. Examples of my posts without content please? The only reason I'm not voting you right now is because I'd expect scum acting like you are to be more competent than this. And I don't see a Mist/Xalxe scumteam as likely.

VOTE: Mist

[Cobblerfone]

What I mean by "posts w/o content" is that you were very good at asking questions, but there's been no followup. Same goes for Mist. Why bother asking questions if they're not helpful? (useful question btw)

I ask questions to get a frame of reference.

[Cobblerfone]

And sometimes questions can be important no matter what the content...

What do you mean, exactly?

[Cobblerfone]

@mod: you have Mist as having two votes but her name still appears as voting for herself along with Xalxe's and mine.

[Cobblerfone]

Also, Whiskers is voting DonJosh

It should be correct now. ~ Otolia

[Cobblerfone]

I already pm'd the mod but just so you all know, I'll be V/LA til late Monday.

[Cobblerfone]

132 rubs me the wrong way.

I feel slightly more comfortable with my vote.

[Cobblerfone]

I'm back, the only problem I see is if the target is a PR who the scum will kill.

[Cobblerfone]

I'm fine with the plan. I had to go to bed right after that post. Plus I realize now that if Xalxe is town this is effectively lynching while taking away the scum's nightkill.

Though I don't see how.

[Cobblerfone]

Sorry, the "though I din't see how" was refering to a deleted part of the post refering to how the scum might do something WIFOMy, but I couldn't see how they could so I deleted it.

[Cobblerfone]

?

I didn't get a guilty on Xalxe.

Very funny. Beware of the guilt though ~ Otolia

[Cobblerfone]

I trust kondi more.

VOTE: Xalxe

If things really get down to the wire and if it isn't Kondi, the cop can counterclaim.

[Cobblerfone]

Well there goes the backup plan.

Hmm...

Woah, I just realized if Xalxe's the cop we have both scum then. It's almost too good to be true. I have to think about this.

UNVOTE:

In case Mist IS scum.

[Cobblerfone]

Hey gaiz.
What if they're both scum? It might just be me, but this seems like something a scumteam would come up with.

But then they're both counterclaimed by the cop and it's a 2/3 chance of hitting scum.

[Cobblerfone]

VOTE: No-lynch

There's little difference anyway.

[Cobblerfone]

UNVOTE:

I can't figure what's wrong with No-lynch. If Xalxe's the cop we're in the same situation with one less possibility if Kondi's the cop he can know who both scum are through POE at the very least, assuming his innocent and the seer are not the same person or if his innocent and the kill are the same person. Yes it isn't perfect, but it's about the same as it is now. Unless he's killed. In which case we definitely have Xalxe as scum.

[Cobblerfone]

I'm not the seer. That's everyone.

Well, this whole no-lynching thing was kind of pointless.

VOTE: Xalxe

[Cobblerfone]

It's L-2. Kondi needs to switch back.

[Cobblerfone]

Dude. You and DonJosh are obviously not the seer, I'm not the seer, Kondi and Xalxe both say they're cops, there's nobody left. And if you or DonJosh were the seer there'd be no reason for mist to claim so and out herself as mafia. There's also little reason for either of you to not claim seer if you were.

[Cobblerfone]

UNVOTE:

I just want to hear from DonJosh before Xalxe can quickhammer himself.

Saulres' stalling edged him ahead of DonJosh for me.

[Cobblerfone]

VOTE: Xalxe

I'm ready now.

[Cobblerfone]

If we pursue a lynch today, we have a 25% chance of catching scum and winning, and a 75% chance of losing the game altogether.
If we No Lynch today, we have a 33% chance of winning and only a 66% chance of losing, plus we can do more analysis based on the NK.
A No Lynch is the only logical thing to do.

Not with the confirmed Seer. It's exactly the same, except Mist is a safety valve of sorts. How convenient of you to not realize that.

I've got to learn to reread during the night. Expect something tomorrow.

[Cobblerfone]

UNVOTE: Mist7676
VOTE: No Lynch

I suggest Mist for investigation.

Xalxe sounds good I guess.

Still would prefer Mist, though

I'm finding Xalxe's sudden disappearance scummy beyond [earth].

Actually, scratch that. Since a potential advantage is clearing someone, I want one of the more active players investigated.

And Whiskers going along with this plan, an enhancing it, makes me think he's town.

Let's investigate Xalxe.

I had my doubts about Saulres after yesterday, but I'm glad I ISO'd them. DonJosh is scum. It isn't until he's set to be investigated that he decides Xalxe is extremely scummy. While Saulres was actually the one to suggest Xalxe be investigated. This is good enough for me:

VOTE: DonJosh

[Cobblerfone]

Wait no, I think it was Mist.

Still, Don looks worse.

[Cobblerfone]

In post 360, Cobblerfone wrote:
Wait no, I think it was Mist.

What do you think was Mist? I don't follow.

I think it was Mist that suggested Xalxe to be investigated instead of you, but you were more willing than DonJosh anyway.

[Cobblerfone]

I'm just noting that Saulres is confirmed town and DonJosh is confirmed scum.

[Cobblerfone]

You and Mist are confirmed town. I'm town, DonJosh is scum.

[Cobblerfone]

From your POV, nothing.

But I was talking from what I know.

[Cobblerfone]

Cobbler, what makes you say that?

I'll say at the end of RVS. Now, some questions:

@Whiskers: I briefly read a couple posts of one of the games you were in. You seem to have a delightful posting style. How do you expect to do this game?
@Kondi: I checked a completed newbie game that you replaced in and saw that your very first vote was for scum. Do you expect you'll do as impressively this game?
@Xalxe: I saw on your wiki page that you prefer to be a pro-scum player. What do you like about being scum? Do you feel you do poorly as town?
@Saulres: What is your experience with mafia? Have you played much off-site?
@DonJosh: I remember playing some marathon games with you, but I couldn't find any normal ones to research. How would you describe your play?

@Everyone: What's so bad about Mist?

This post is an example of the two most WIFOMy things scum can do.
1. RQS
2. Pre-game research

Debunk: Look on my wiki for Newbie 1123.

Okay, kondi still hasn't responded. So I'll just say I have a townread on Whiskers and a weaker one on Saulres. Whiskers, because pony asked for my favorite alignment then put some extra thought into it and asked for my favorite role. Saulres because of the L+3 thing and redoing his post.

Random town-reads.

Debunk: Those are not random at all. The reasons are right there.

VOTE: DonJosh

For claiming he's trying out a new playstyle.

Clearly RVS. BUT WAIT...

Actually it was serious. To explain, "trying out a new style" can be an excuse to avoid comparisons to previous town-meta. It's not much, but it's early. With my townread posts I felt we were out of RVS but still in RQS, so... yeah.

...NO! now it's a serious vote.

Debunk: It doesn't say at all that it's random.

UNVOTE:

I just want to hear from DonJosh before Xalxe can quickhammer himself.

Saulres' stalling edged him ahead of DonJosh for me.

Unvoting his scumbuddy before he "quick-hammers himself"???

Yes, he was confirmed scum at that point and could have quickhammered himself to end discussion.

Wait no, I think it was Mist.

Still, Don looks worse.

LOLOLOL

Debunk: LOLOLOL

[Cobblerfone]

Must've been deleted along with the one about the seer/confscum talk. I've touched it up:

Scumspects: Mist for #101 (mainly the copycat cry of "Whiskers stop vote hopping" rubs me wrong) DonJosh is relatively only leaning scum for previous reasons. Xalxe is getting scummier by the post. Examples of my posts without content please? The only reason I'm not voting you right now is because I'd expect scum acting like you are to be more competent than this. And I don't see a Mist/Xalxe scumteam as likely.

VOTE: Mist

Makes Xalxe seem like his top scumspect, yet votes Mist.

Debunk: Yeah, that's not at all a copycat of one of my arguments against you.

[Cobblerfone]

They're lazy comments 'cause they're lazy accusations.

[Cobblerfone]

Cobbler, if you're the scum, then good job.

Thanks

Though to be honest, I think Xalxe connecting himself to DonJosh was the more important part. I just had to survive.

[Cobblerfone]

I love how you didn't get it when I posted the thanks for your complement.

You and Whiskers were the stronger town players, IMO.

Xalxe was obvscum but made up for it in the end.

[Cobblerfone]

I did enjoy this game, and wonder if my No Lynch suggestion which Whiskers superbly expanded on serves to somewhat break this setup. Even though we still had decisions to make, it says this setup can be reliably duplicated by starting with two less players, only one scum, and no cop/seer.

I don't think it's quite a

broken

strategy since there were so many ways it could go wrong (mostly if the investigated is a power role). And if you guys had lynched him in the first place, you could've afforded this mislynch without giving away the cop. Unless, I had no-killed.

I think this game is balanced pretty well though. Maybe just a

little

townsided.

[Cobblerfone]

Cobberfone wrote:
there were so many ways it could go wrong (mostly if the investigated is a power role)

They wouldn't have been revealed, they'd just show as "yes scum" or "no scum".

They would've been killed.

[Cobblerfone]

I knew you couldn't catch Cobblerfone even though he scumclaimed foolishly.

Yeah, how's that a scumclaim? Kondi hadn't claimed cop yet. yeah, it's pretty artificially worded, but it doesn't use any information that only I as mafia could know.

[Cobblerfone]

Oh. I see. From my point of view as town, Xalxe could've been the cop and the seer could've counterclaimed Kondi.

How observent of you, mod.

[Cobblerfone]

Scum QT: http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/9L6meutai8d

[Cobblerfone]

MWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Ahem.

So, did you guys have a dead thread?