Mini Normal 2277 - Frog Images (Game Over)

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote redcardinal

She knows why.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Kinda surprised no one called out my "hmmm..." post as suspicious.

Anyways, VOTE: Galron. This is a non-RVS vote.

I don't see the "hmmm..." post as suspicious, but the post telling us how suspicious it was isn't doing you any favors.

Unvote, Vote: Seanzie

[Haschel Cedricson]

Kinda surprised no one called out my "hmmm..." post as suspicious.

Anyways, VOTE: Galron. This is a non-RVS vote.

I don't see the "hmmm..." post as suspicious, but the post telling us how suspicious it was isn't doing you any favors.

Unvote, Vote: Seanzie

do you figure that they felt they made a scummy post and wanted to pre empt it or something

No.

[Haschel Cedricson]

was somebody supposed to tell you it was scummy? what was your plan in that case

I was kind of hoping someone would, yeah. Gotta get the game going somehow, and I read people better when they push me. Since I know no one here, it would have been helpful to see how people reacted to me.

Fascinating. Does this make sense to anybody else?

[Haschel Cedricson]

I certainly hope that's not the extent of your analysis.

[Haschel Cedricson]

By the by, while I'm interested in everyone's thoughts re: my last question, I'm particularly interested in a response from redcardinal and hope that it is in her next post.

[Haschel Cedricson]

This is interesting to wake up to. I'm not thrilled with Seanzie or his explanation for one simple reason: Who starts a reaction test and then bails on it before even two hours have elapsed and nobody else in the game has even posted yet? There's absolutely no reason to say "Wow, I'm surprised nobody said I was scummy for this!" when nobody said literally anything about any topic. It suggests to me that he wasn't really doing a reaction test and I loathe it when people present arguments that they don't believe in themselves.

That being said, Seanzie's play outside of that does appear to be actual scumhunting which is more than can be said for a lot of players here. I'm not letting Seanzie off the hook but at the moment I don't want him to be today's elimination.

Unvote

.

We have a lot of players posting nothing of substance right now. Galron is an obvious one and people are talking about FancyPants, but EATEROFTIME had a terrible entrance to the game and apparently there is somebody named UltimateDetectiveKiriGiri in the game as well.

Galron, you're currently voting for Crescent. Crescent has been an active poster so far; what are your thoughts about her play?

[Haschel Cedricson]

what are your thoughts on crescent haschel?

Not answering this yet because I don't want to feed Galron answers.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Yes
He’s pretty goofy as town but he’s at least around as town
He’s a statue here.

Hi.

Hi.

Address this post.

[Haschel Cedricson]

It's an rvs vote. They haven't done enough for me to get a bead on but grh they're bull. I'd dispute your premise. I don't have much by way of reads regardless. What do you think?

What premise? The premise that Crescent has been an active poster? The premise that you haven't posted much of substance? The premise that Seanzie's reaction test was bad? The premise that Seanzie appears to be doing actual scumhunting? I would love to hear which of these premises you are disputing and why.

As for what I think, I think there is absolutely enough in the game for you to get some reads and I expect them in your next post.

[Haschel Cedricson]

As for what I think, I think there is absolutely enough in the game for you to get some reads and

I expect them in your next post

.

Lol

Vote: Galron

[Haschel Cedricson]

lol i warn u not to push me, i can get like a badger.

If anything this is a reason

to

push you.

Not a huge fan of how your take on Galron is basically "Galron is a land of contrasts", btw.

Gamma, you want to elaborate on why Seanzie is in your proposed scumtrio?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Unrelated to the game directly, Eiralox, what pronoun would you like me to use when referring to you?

[Haschel Cedricson]

was somebody supposed to tell you it was scummy? what was your plan in that case

I was kind of hoping someone would, yeah. Gotta get the game going somehow, and I read people better when they push me. Since I know no one here, it would have been helpful to see how people reacted to me.

Fascinating. Does this make sense to anybody else?

Isn’t what Seanzie did a thing that happens a lot?

A reaction test that ends after two hours for no reason with no reactions either way? No, to my knowledge it is not a thing that happens a lot.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Crescent repeatedly attempting to undermine the Galron wagon makes me think she could be scum, if Galron is but Sean/Eir isn’t

I also got this sense, bolstered by Galron almost aggressively refusing to give a substantial read on Crescent after an opening vote. Post 125 points out that Galron isn't doing anything of substance but then deflects with "I'm not being terribly exciting either" which has the effect of de facto excusing Galron's play.

Preview Edit: Galron's 175 is absolutely scummy enough to elicit a reaction like that given the context of my 174.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Does that mean you think Galron is town?

If so, why?

The wagon looks emotionally driven and the slot has attracted a lot of unwanted negative attention to itself.

So because the slot has been scummy it can't be scum?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Does that mean you think Galron is town?

If so, why?

The wagon looks emotionally driven and the slot has attracted a lot of unwanted negative attention to itself.

So because the slot has been scummy it can't be scum?

You've said so.

[citation needed]

[Haschel Cedricson]

I was asking if "and the slot has attracted a lot of unwanted negative attention to itself" being used as a reason for a professed townread meant that you were making the argument that because the slot has been scummy it couldn't be scum. I would never say such a thing myself because that would be an incredibly stupid thing to believe.

[Haschel Cedricson]

what are your thoughts on crescent haschel?

Very similar to yours; in fact your post 379 sums it up perfectly. The interactions between Crescent and Garlon are why I was pressing Garlon about Crescent in the first place.

Now, Crescent's post here:

I'm a pot stirrer, and my primary drive is to gather data because that is how I function. I think these votes need to be pressured sooner rather than later because it gives us the most accurate data, and doing it day 2 after a flip and 48+ hours to think dilutes the results.

[...]

But also one of the biggest reasons I barely vote is most people are so vote happy that I find my general lack of voting helps add balance to the game. I don't believe I need to place a vote to pressure someone, and I will dog people who dodge my questions.

...is exactly the sort of thing I enjoy because I play that way, so I'm certainly willing to see where Crescent is going with all this for now. But if she believes the wagon on Garlon is suspicious, then I certainly hope she increases the pressure because right now for all her talk it's not as much as I would prefer to see.

[Haschel Cedricson]

A lot has gone down and I haven't reread everything yet. I will be honest, it is so goddamn hot I am probably not going to read them tonight.

Promise tomorrow morning I'll have something.

[Haschel Cedricson]

The Crescent kill is an odd one, tbh; I was expecting to start pressuring her based on the Galron flip and I assume redcardinal was going to do the same,

[Haschel Cedricson]

Actually let's start here.

Vote: UltimateDetectiveKiriGiri

.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Actually let's start here.

Vote: UltimateDetectiveKiriGiri

.

why UD?

Crescent was wishywashy about the Galron wagon, but KiriGiri used her limited posts to try and stop the momentum on it.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I feel like UD genuinely believed her read there
Meanwhile I think someone like Seanzie is more sus for voting Galron and then immediately unvoting following the claim

It was a bad read, both with the hindsight of the flip and with the information as it existed at the time. She also didn't really address any of the issues with her read that were brought up at the time.

[Haschel Cedricson]

The Crescent kill is an odd one, tbh; I was expecting to start pressuring her based on the Galron flip and I assume redcardinal was going to do the same,

This wording feels awkward tbh
Wdym you EXPECTED to start pressuring her? Either you were going to or were not going to, why the need to qualify it?

I expected the day to start with somebody else dead and I clicked into this thread ready to go, and then it turned out I wouldn't be doing that after all because she was dead. My expectations were subverted.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Getting caught up now. The only posts I've read so far since I posted last are the ones from KiriGiri's ISO and they make me feel like my vote is fine sitting on her while I read. Post 760 is bad because the entirety of her evidence that the Galron wagon was emotionally driven is three posts made by one player back to back before the game had even reached 100 posts; it's incredibly disingenuous to frame that as representative of the votes on Galron.

I also think the case on me is garbage and find it curious that the only post in the entire game where she decides to make a big case on somebody just happens to be on somebody pushing her, but I acknowledge my view of this is informed by information the rest of you do not have.

[Haschel Cedricson]

The Gamma/Seanzie interactions are a slog and while I think both of them are town I also think that they should both feel bad for making us all read that.

I don't think Gamma's 739...

Here’s the thing, Crescent dying imo suggests scum somehow still think I’m mislimmable. I fully expected to die Night 1, it’s not that rare for me these days! So Seanzie pushing against me here is a MASSIVE RED FLAG!
And like, I expect people to actually be able to use critical thinking to solve me. I specifically pushed out Galron as a litmus test for whether I had honed in on the tells another player had used to make an early call on a prior game scumbuddy of mine. If I was bussing, I don’t NEED to litmus test ANYTHING, I already KNOW Galron’s alignment!

...is a great point, which makes it weird to see KittyTacky cite it as one of the points he agrees with.

Okay that makes some sense
Who did you expect would be killed?

T3. T3 checked the boxes of 1) Reasonably active, 2) Decent posts, and 3) Absolutely nobody expressing any suspicion of them so eliminating them keeps the viable lim pool as wide as possible.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Oh hey Klick is in the game and also a lot has happened. Diving in now.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Prod received, and getting caught up for real this time.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Right now in order to stop from being overwhelmed I'm just starting at page 40 and posting thoughts from there.

like some of the early questions from haschel towards galron feel like they could be scum trying to get other scum to be more involved. something tells me if galron had said something about how seanzie was scummy haschel would have backed off, but the pressure turns into a bus at a certain point and reading back it feels a little awkward

I might have backed off depending on *why* they felt Seanzie was scummy but they didn't. And if I was trying to get Galron to be more involved I could have just fed him the answer I wanted to hear in the daychat.

lol i warn u not to push me, i can get like a badger.

If anything this is a reason

to

push you.

Not a huge fan of how your take on Galron is basically "Galron is a land of contrasts", btw.

Gamma, you want to elaborate on why Seanzie is in your proposed scumtrio?

haschel sees a reason to push eiralox but doesn't. leaves this here, and it's something I strongly agree with, but I don't feel like it was going anywhere and haschel certainly didn't take it anywhere

Where would I have taken it? I was already going in another direction. Supporting Seanzie pushing Eiralox doesn't mean I have to take up the mantle.

RC's 1008 on Eiralox is good, as is Klick's entrance to the game.

I had a thing typed up about how schadd directing the roleblocker was bad but then noticed he included the caveat that it was just in case Eiralox flipped red so actually that's good and so is the followup.

Incidentally, not a fan of KT positing that Crescent was killed to frame him. For all we know Crescent was killed so that scum-KT could defend himself by pre-emtively claiming he was framed. Weak Nightkill Analysis is basically the same as nothing at all.

I'm pretty saddened and actually discouraged by the last few pages. I see people who I lean town on being pretty happy to kill me. No other scumhunting is being done. The game has frozen cos "Eira Scum". There are so many other avenues of investigation rn, and no one is doing jack shit imo. Im tempted to just walk away from this shit, close this fucking forum and let ya'll launch me and let town reap the bitter rewards. cos im disappointed in the lack of drive in this game at this point. either scum is leading ppl around by the nose about me or theyre just sitting back and having a good luagh. im being honest here, like last night i also just wanted to walk away.

And things just keep getting more absurd. I don't knwo what the fuck ya'll are thinking. Only Schadd_ has solid reasons on me, their D1 analysis of where i was at is spot on. just sad that they cant step out of their tunnel.

but im sorta decent i guess. i wont replace out and ill give more solid thoughts on the game, cos im making the time for it today. ill stick with it and play to my win co. if ya'll still decide to mob me then, well you're fucking loss. i wont shed a fucking tear but i will be hollowed of heart.


i'll post my shit don't kick me while im tryin. Town's become lazy after D1 galron flip and D2 Kitty claim imo, some elements at least. i'm not liking this, i think ive made it pretty clear, but ill try not to let my emotions boil over and show yall how ultra wrong your tunnel is rn, and where i think scum's at.

cos honestly one of the reasons im so slow with my reads here is i see scum in a lot of places. ya'll being very hard for me to townlean or read tbh, only Schadd_ is giving off the right vibes. T3 has suddenly become a scum option for me again. So i only got one player i feel is town rn, if that ain't good enough well fuck me. i'm not here to make friends. i'll find the scum for ya'll. cos rn it seems that none of ya'lkl seems so inclined.

This may be the worst post of the game so far.

One of the earliest games I played on this site had an exchange I loved so much it was in my sig for a long time:
Player 1: I feel like the only way to avoid being [eliminated] is to A) prove I'm town or B) find scum.
Player 2: The only way to do A is to die, so I'd get started on B.

Here we have Eira similarly lamenting how close he is to elimination, with an emotional appeal because this game is so goshdarn hard. However, the whole "I see scum in a lot of places" isn't backed up by his play. He isn't doing B, he's just telling us that he's doing B. The line about "Only Schadd_ has solid reasons on me" suddenly ignores when he said that T3 also had valid reasons to vote him, only now T3 is a scumread with no reason given for that. It also smacks of the "I've been caught for the wrong reasons" attitude that scum get when they face pressure they don't feel like they deserve.

Gamma keeps making arguments about player metas, and I plan on ignoring all of them.

Eiralox's "analysis" of the Galron voters is less an analysis and more of a recap with the occasional mention of gut pings.

Not entirely sure I agree with T3's case on Schadd but I understand it.

I disagree with almost everything Haschel says which makes me sad. I feel like I should be able to read him easily atm but so far I've got nothing. I'm really hoping that changes

Anything specific you disagree with?

All in all the Eiralox wagon is the best one, although Klick hasn't done anything to improve my stance on Kirigiri.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Why target Schadd?

[Haschel Cedricson]

I did. Why target Schadd?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Gotcha, so no reason then.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Like, I already know what I think. I want to know what you think.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I'm not sure where the votecount is right now so I'm not going to move my vote but in spirit it's on Eiranox until they answer the question.

[Haschel Cedricson]

As PR i mostly do "Because i wanted too", do you really expect big explaination on every move in the game?

Yes.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote: Eiralox

. His play doesn't explain why he targeted Schadd, he hasn't been playing today in a way that suggests he knows Schadd is vanilla, and he's aggressively refusing to give any explanation that could reconcile those.

[Haschel Cedricson]

In theory Schadd is the one person that Eiralox has extra information about but he doesn't interact with Schadd in a way that tries to leverage that information to do anything. Instead we see a self-admitted OMGUS vote, some fluctuation about whether or not he townreads or scumreads him, and finally the whole appeal directly to Schadd where he talks about how townie Schadd is even though Schadd's conclusion (i.e. that Eiralox is scum) is wrong.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Before anything happens we need to know who KT blocked.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Right now I'm doing a dive into the specific wagons. Klick is a good choice for scum but I'm not voting yet until I finish my current project.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Typing up a big thing; please do not hammer anybody.

[Haschel Cedricson]

There have been two eliminations so far, and we can make a few assumptions about what the scumteam wanted:
1) In general, the Galron elimination was not what they wanted;
2) In general, the Eiralox elimination was what they wanted.
Obviously bussing/"deepwolving" exists so this isn't foolproof, but I wouldn't be surprised if the remaining scum had at least one person taking these stances. So I've dived back and looked at how everybody felt about those players as their wagons were happening. Before you ask, the one from Schadd is more detailed and has quotes because that's the one I did first.

redcardinal
GALRON: Third on Galronwagon (although unvotes later and then rejoins later), is suspicious of me and Galron together, is convinced Galron is scum and focuses on finding partners.
EIRALOX: Doesn't start push on Eira but likes it, debates between KT and Eira, continues to actively look for partners.

schadd:
GALRON:Floats the idea that Galron is "town punishing everybody for voting for a low content slot" but doesn't press. Says he thinks Galron is scum, does not vote for him.
EIRALOX: Votes on D2, lots of shade with minor reasoning given at first - "i think there's a lot missing from your reads, especially those on me, which seems like it could be motivated by a desire to leave yourself options based on what i do / favor statements that are argumentatively convenient. i also can't help but notice you simply start to play the game once you're a top wagon and the competing one claimed pr"

there's two things about casing eiralox for me here. the first is that i'm just a person trying to make deductions here and i have an unavoidably huge chance of being wrong regardless of how convinced i am (which i kind of am). this means that i have to confront this chance that i somehow convince people to go with eiralox today, it turns out that they've been doing all this stuff while town, and then i have to play maybe the most grueling d3 of my life, in which everything i write here becomes fuel for not only the obvious eager wolves but also townies that wanna let the outcome of the game be someone else's fault. that day almost surely ends in me getting executed but i still have a responsibility to play it out, which i will hate doing so much its unreal

Foreshadowing on purpose? Later starts to tie Eiralox to Galron.

Seanzie
GALRON: Starts things off with RVS vote, later puts Galron at L-1, believes claim, characterizes Galron's play as more null than town, puts Galron at L-1 again.
EIRALOX: Doesn't mention much on D2 until Klick replaces in. Starts pressuring Eira in response to Eira's statements about him, supports Schaddwagon but thinks one of KT/Eiralox needs to go, pushes to end day because the town is going in circles.

Enchant
GALRON: No mention at all.
EIRALOX: Sees as town, tries to shift wagon to me albeit half-heartedly. Finally hammers after peer pressure from other players.

Malakittens
GALRON: Early vote, no reasoning. Galron makes single post saying Mala and Kitty aren't being objective.
EIRALOX: Hardly any mentions at all.

KittyTacky
GALRON: Sheeps Mala, suggests RC is chainsaw defending Galron, never lets up.
EIRALOX: Does not mention on Day 1. Votes/Unvotes due to trolly reads list from Eira. Suddenly starts casting suspicion of Eira, no details.

Kirigiri/Klick
GALRON: Actively tries to derail Galronwagon.
EIRALOX: "Doesn't have a problem with" Eiralox wagon but wants to wait to commit. Lists Eira at the very top of his Null rankings. Says RC is scum but doesn't lay out a case until the next day.

T3
GALRON: Early suspicion, ties Galron to KT as possible S/S pair, has opportunity to slow down Galron wagon and does not take it. Hammers after meta dive.
EIRALOX: Early TR, applies vote/pressure to Eira after the latter refuses to answer questions, turns around into thinking Eira is town after Eiralox starts posting longer posts. Reverses with second vote after Eira seems to be expressing fake emotion re: schadd

It's harder to draw conclusions based on the Eira elimination because by definition a lot of townies also wanted the same thing as the Mafia, but in general I would summarize things as follows:

Did not want the Galron elimination, or tried to remove pressure from it:
Kirigiri/Klick
Enchant
Seanzie
Schadd (sort of)

Actively wanted the Eiralox elimination:
Schadd
KittyTacky
redcardinal
T3

Passively wanted the Eiralox elimination:
Seanzie
Klick

Based on this Schadd/Seanzie/Klick don't come off as great in regards to their positions on both eliminations.

I can definitely get behind a Klick elimination here. However, there is also one possibility that I didn't notice until I went back and reread all of this: What about a KT/Schadd pairing? This would require KT bussing Galron but otherwise fits. Nobody ever bothered to ask this for some reason and it's kind of too late now, but

why did KT roleblock Schadd

? Redcardinal was KT's big pick for Galron's partner; he accused her of chainsaw defending Galron. Why not block her? In a KT/Schadd pair KittyTacky can easily claim that he blocked Schadd knowing that Schadd won't contradict him. The two of them don't have a lot of direct interactions in either direction on Day 1; Schadd seems like a weird choice of target for a town roleblock.

[Haschel Cedricson]

But i didn't do anything with Galron, i literally was not here.

Fair, I thought you replaced in earlier than you did. Your predecessor also didn't mention Galron, although I suppose they didn't really mention anybody except their RVS vote.

This feels like a really odd justification for not including Enchant in your set of people who actively or passively wanted the Eiralox elimination. Enchant did hammer Eiralox

It just doesn't feel like something Enchant wanted. I don't put too much stock in hammers, especially when other players are begging the rest of the game to hammer. If you want to put them on the passive list that's fine.

Do you have any confident reads Haschel?

I have confident townreads on T3 and Seanzie. After Eiralox flipped green despite scummy play I'm not comfortable saying anybody is

definitely

scum, but my gut says it's two of you/KT/Schadd.

Speaking of which, you completely ignored the last thing I said about KT. So,

Vote: KittyTacky

.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Speaking of which, you completely ignored the last thing I said about KT.

I didn't really have anything to say about it
I don't agree that schadd_ is a particularly weird choice of roleblock target

Elaborate on that.

[Haschel Cedricson]

However, I do give the conclusion weight for a different reason; Schadd being vanilla AND not submitting the kill makes them on the lower-probability side of possible scum, unless of course both remaining scum are vanilla, but I kind of doubt that's the case.

A KT/Schadd team is still on the table, in which case Schadd could have submitted the kill because he wasn't actually roleblocked.

Preview Edit: If you are a town roleblocker, then it's reasonable to assume that the scum have power roles of their own. In that case you block your top scumread because either 1) You stop the kill, which hurts scum, or 2) Somebody else submitted the kill but it's likely you stopped the mafia from using one of their other powers, which hurts scum.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Preview Edit: If you are a town roleblocker, then it's reasonable to assume that the scum have power roles of their own. In that case you block your top scumread because either 1) You stop the kill, which hurts scum, or 2) Somebody else submitted the kill but it's likely you stopped the mafia from using one of their other powers, which hurts scum.

I have my own thoughts on this, but I'd like to hear KT give a response to this post first

Yeah I don't think blocking someone scummy but who could expect to be RBed is that bad. They could be a scum PR.

Oh man who wants to guess what I’m about to post?

[Haschel Cedricson]

NB: By “about to” I mean “some time tomorrow” because I’m in bed right now.

[Haschel Cedricson]

So we have a town roleblocker, a town rolecop, and an implied town regular cop?

[Haschel Cedricson]

So we have a town roleblocker, a town rolecop, and an implied town regular cop?

is there a need to know what seanzie's role is

Not specifically, although under the circumstances I do want to know if KT is actually clear or if Seanzie is just implying that because he either townreads KT or is doing a reaction test or something like that.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I'll bite.

Unvote, Vote Klick

[Haschel Cedricson]

Actually, thinking this through, I believe I can do something useful here.

Unvote

[Haschel Cedricson]

I'm gonna claim as well. I am a Non-Consecutive Night Doctor. I am not going to reveal if I used my power last night or not so the scum will have to choose between either killing me or taking a shot at taking out the cop.

Is a Nonconsecutive Doc, Rolecop, Roleblocker, and Regular Cop too much for a Normal Game? To be honest I have no idea these days since this is my first game in a long time. But either KittyTacky and Seanzie are partners, in which case one false move sinks both of them, or they are telling the truth and we can start doing some PoE stuff with me removed from the pool as well.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Yes.

[Haschel Cedricson]

If I were to have used my power on Night 1, I would not have targeted Crescent.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I do not know what a doc dodge kill is. If you are saying I would have guessed that Galron would have known a doc was in the game and therefore targeted somebody else then no, I would not have guessed that.

[Haschel Cedricson]

For the record, Galron's flip was the first time I have ever heard of the role "Informed" so I have no idea what it would or wouldn't have been conceivable for him to be informed about.

Not that it matters; even if the Mafia didn't have an informed any game has the possibility of a doc and so scum always have to decide if the person who is the most obvious target to them is worth taking a shot at anyway.

In this particular game my post about Crescent dying was particularly less surprise that Player X survived and more about surprise Crescent was targeted at all since at the time I felt her and Galron were feasible partners.

[Haschel Cedricson]

It's Cunningham's Law, by the way.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Consider this intent; I only unvoted to make sure you couldn’t be hammered before I could claim.

[Haschel Cedricson]

In fact, I am currently in the car. I will hammer as soon as we pull in the driveway if I don’t see a claim when I get home.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Well, if KT followed the plan we can clear Mala.

[Haschel Cedricson]

gonna have to disagree with seanzie here my poe is enchant -> hasche -> mala

I would go Enchant -> mala -> I guess RC or T3? -> Seanzie is pulling some insane gambit.

Speaking of Seanzie, at this point I assume he has other results to report?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Oh this probably goes without saying but I'm not going to say if I protected anybody last night or not.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I did indeed not protect KT; if I had I definitely would have opened with that.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Actually go Hascel>redcordinal. I will explain why.


Hascel claimed when Klick was not already dead. While there are two mafia, roleblocker is not really threat (well threat, but manageble), but while one, he NEED to be disposed off.
He not claiming targets, not to confuse mafia (if so, he would plainly say "Oh yeah, i healed person n1/n2" without actually healing or idk what he did, to REALLY get heal or force mafia on choice, there's no harm in lying about target for him).


Don't believe his claim. He made his claim useless on purpose. Afterwards he will tell "Oh yeah, i could't heal Kitty, because night before i used heal", but it's simple failsafe on case, he needs to explain why he didn't heal Kitty, but doesh't know when to kill him (exactly after death of teammate, before that roleblocker can wait to remain as passeble elim).


Also. Claim is simple loud "Don't roleblock me pretty pwease or you can die and fuck up!", so he claiming that before Klick execution WITHOUT ANY PROMPT should be telling. Again, if he "Wasted" his heal, he is fair game for roleblock, so he have incentive to lie, to not be outed.

Of course it's still possible Haschel is town, but then i don't understand his motivation. On other hand, he exactly have all motivation to do it as mafia.

You can choose to follow my word, or not (most likely you won't, but please consider it), that's all, see ya.

If I used my power last night, it would have been to protect Seanzie as the investigative role is more important to keep alive. A roleblocker gives less information when there is a missed kill if a protective role is in play, as then it becomes a debate of "Was there no kill because the scum was blocked or did the scum target the protected person? We had stated that if Klick was scum then KT was to block Mala so a KT death still would have given the town information.

Claiming when I did forced scum into the position of having to make an awkward choice of either killing me for sure or gambling which one of the power roles was unprotected. Not claiming means KT likely blocks me and then both power roles are unprotected, one dies, I get mislimmed the next day, and then the other one dies.

If you want to know my earlier action then I protected T3 on either N1 or N2.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Any scenario where I’m scum has to involve me thinking my claim will let me ride to the end and also assumes that I bussed Galron and then immediately also brought a bussing case onto Kirigiri/Klick when I didn’t have to.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Do you honestly think my interactions with Galron, Kirigiri, and Klick are bussing?

[Haschel Cedricson]

If you'd like I can put Enchant at L-1.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I protected T3 on night 1 and Seanzie on night 3.

Schadd is clear because we know he's vanilla thanks to Eiralox; I don't see the mafia having just an informed and two goons when the town has a roleblocker.

Mala is *probably* clear if KittyTacky did indeed block her like he was told to.

[Haschel Cedricson]

and in any case seanzie had a place to be like: hi, you should block mala. so ok i'm pretty comfortable with that part at least.

This is a fantastic point.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Yep, that checks out. RC and Schadd are locktown.

I do think mala is more likely than not to be cleared but I think mathematically we've won this no matter what.

Vote: T3

[Haschel Cedricson]

Woooo

Glad I caught on to two scum right away, but you did great at avoiding suspicion, T3.