Mini 1117 - Manhattan Special - [GAME OVER]

[Fugitive]

Sup bitches?

Will read thread tomorrow. Just checking in for now.

[Fugitive]

Okay, I've been reading this thread for just over and hour and I'm in the middle of page 5. This was more of an undertaking than I suspected. The amount of "family quarrels," over-analysing, and epeen rhetoric is making this a slow process. What this means to you guys is that you're probably/almost definitely not going to get a post of substance from me today as I have shit I need to do and can't devote 3 hours just to reading, let alone whatever time it takes to formulate a post on the players.

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In an attempt to make this post not worthless though (even though it probably will be since I've only read the first third of the game. I'm at the part where Shado just got 3 quick votes):

I'd like to say that I'm not seeing a CQ town. Seems like a lot of random questions to appear helpful and over-analysis to the max. I'm not really sure on the meta behind her, but I take it she's a fairly big name player, but I'm not understanding anyone calling her town. Not sure if this is a scum read necessarily, but definitely neutral / neutral-scummy.

IS is another big name, I suppose? I'm having problems reading that one. Like a lot of problems. We'll just call this a neutral read for now.

Shadow is someone I've played with a lot, and I'm not getting scum-vibe from his direction. He's playing his standard town meta. Granted, I've never seen Shado scum, but he tends to get mislynched a lot because he plays REALLY scummy town. I'm not trying to excuse his play, but I'd like that fact to be known and taken into consideration.

Grey seems town to me.

el simo seems to be playing differently from last game where he seemed pretty obv town, but then again, I was scum that game so I was looking at him differently. His posts seemed more genuine and helpful though, he just seems a little unhelpful this game.

Emp seems town too, but I'm more flexible on this read.

TL seems... ugh...

Substrike is a neutral read at the moment. I do appreciate the calm and helpful play, though.

Everyone else hasn't posted enough at the point I'm at to have a read.

[Fugitive]

Well, I'll definitely be caught up by the time Day 2 starts.

Also, Shado didn't just claim scum. You guys should check out Bawston Brawl. IP probably rages hard at posts formatted like that now...

[Fugitive]

@Emp - why yes, yes it is.

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EBWOP: I'd add though that it was very intentional empty rhetoric and probably nothing more than a null-tell.

[Fugitive]

Well, I was going to vote Empking today, but I feel as though that kill was almost to frame him. Or maybe I'm thinking too much into it. Probably am.

VOTE: Empking

[Fugitive]

UNVOTE: Empking; VOTE: Internet Stranger

I'll bite.

[Fugitive]

No protective roles? Or did you try to WIFOM a cop kill?

VOTE: Erratus Apathos

^ is me on a hydra. Sorry guys, this may happen a couple times because I'm a huge derp.

Quoting for Iso purposes.

[Fugitive]

No protective roles? Or did you try to WIFOM a cop kill?

VOTE: Erratus Apathos

What?

Navy was killed, so there was obviously no protective role on him. So one probably doesn't exist, unless the protective role tried to outguess the night kill and the mafia got lucky.

My vote was unrelated to my night action blabbering.

[Fugitive]

^Okay, what is it about then?

I don't find your interactions with IS favorable for a town read, nor do I like your play in general. I'll dig up some posts later but I'm not on my computer at the moment and don't want to spend the time building a case when I'll likely be interrupted.

Why did you ask a protective role a question, when answering it would out them?

It was clearly rhetorical, nice attempt at mudslinging though.

[Fugitive]

It was clearly rhetorical, nice attempt at mudslinging though.

No shit it was rhetorical. That still doesn't explain

why did you ask it?

Thinking out loud mostly. I tend to do that. Next you're going to tell me that's a scum-tell?

[Fugitive]

It was clearly rhetorical,

nice attempt at mudslinging though

.

No shit it was rhetorical. That still doesn't explain

why did you ask it?

Thinking out loud mostly. I tend to do that.

Next you're going to tell me that's a scum-tell?

No, I didn't find it scummy, I just didn't understand why you asked it.

I do find your "oh shit, he's attacking me" reaction (bolded) scummy, as I clearly wasn't attacking you, yet you preemptively assumed I was. Why did you assume I was attacking you?

Why are you asking so many questions about something you don't find scummy?

[Fugitive]

Why are you asking so many questions about something you don't find scummy?

So many questions? I asked

one

question about 440, which was why you asked it, and like I said, I asked that because I didn't understand why you asked it.

Nice sidestep of my question by the way.

So many questions = one in every post. You seriously thought I was asking why you asked so many question in reference to a single post? You speak in questions bro, and quite frankly, it makes me think you're feigning scum-hunting.

I don't need to sidestep a question that dumb, I blatantly chose not to answer it because I'm fed up talking to you.

This exchange has solidified my vote though.

[Fugitive]

Nice OMGUS.

[Fugitive]

So I guess I'm the only one that thinks CQ is pretty obvtown?

[Fugitive]

V/LA until Tuesday, Feb 15th

[Fugitive]

Back a bit early from my V/LA

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Started making a partial summary of day 1, but showed no interest in his own observations. I clarified about me, and he didnt even consider my answer. Day 2 and 3, he is changing his own views on players, since I was scummy and now I am obvtown, Empking seemed town and then he voted for him, Erratus was not even analyzed in his first summary.

I meant Erratus when I called you out for useless questions day 1, I had you two confused. Forgot to correct that later since day 1 ended so soon after and Day 2 was also quick. That should clear up the rest of your concerns in that paragraph, actually.

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Erratus' "case" on me is pretty laughable, but if there's anything anyone would like me to respond to or answer go ahead an ask.

[Fugitive]

I meant Erratus when I called you out for useless questions day 1, I had you two confused. Forgot to correct that later since day 1 ended so soon after and Day 2 was also quick.

Allow me to dig more, because your answer is QUITE surprising. Lets suppose you read all the messages by Erratus and me as written by "the same person". Well, if this is the case, by page 5, which is when you made your summary, Erratus had posted 5 times and I had posted 26 times. Hence, I am sorry for Erratus but probably I was the protagonist of our double-personality game with you. I had to be much more visible than him in your dreams. And consistent with it, you called us CQ and SHE, in femenine. One can easily read it in your summary. Hence, your summary there applies mostly to me (26/31 is really big, isnt it?) and your contradiction remains.

Went back and read the post and I think I understand what happened now.

I mixed you two up, name AND pronoun, in one part of the analysis. I think I mixed you two up because the analysis was fairly similar: Bunches of questions; but I recall you being generally more helpful. When I went back and read the post I realized I was definitly analyzing you to an extent, because I talked about over-analysis, but when I was talking about unhelpful questions I was definitely confusing you with Erratus. I'd likely attribute the mix up to reasons you mentioned, you posting a ton and Erratus just sprinkled through my reading. He was probably just incorporated into my analysis of you without my realizing it because he was very behind the scenes.

Not at all. First, your answer does not explain your switch on Empking. Second, you have not addressed how you promised a case on Erratus prior to your last discussions and right now, you are mostly calling him scum for the NEW observations after this promise.

Just following GreyICE. Seemed like a scum v. town argument and with Grey flipping town it was a logical vote. He's still second on my scum list after Erratus.

[Fugitive]

I'm getting town AtE from substrike's direction. Just thought I'd throw my read out in public since I hadn't mentioned him much yet.

[Fugitive]

I'll participate in an Empking or Midnight Sorrow lynch too should either wagon pick up, but I'm liking Erratus scum the most right now.

Moar activity please.

[Fugitive]

This is honestly (no hyperbole) the weakest and scummiest case I've ever seen, so if you're town you should be ashamed. I'll respond to it best I can.

Fugi: His reaction to my questioning earlier is fake.

How do I respond to this besides saying, "no." I'm not sure why you think you're privy to the knowledge of whether or not my reactions are fake, but it was definitely real.

So is his suspicion of me for that matter

See above answer, except replace "reactions" with "suspicions."

he's trying to appear like he suspects me but hasn't done anything to push a wagon on me.

Bullshit. I've called you out on useless questioning and misrepping. I haven't made a giant ass CQ-esque wall to "prove" that you're guilty, if that's what you mean, but I've definitely made it clear that I think you're scum and why. From now on I'll include a "push a wagon" sentence just so you can rest assured that I do, in fact, want you noosed.

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HEY EVERYBODY!! WE SHOULD LYNCH ERRATUS. MORE VOTES MORE VOTES MORE VOTES.

[Fugitive]

Fugi: His reaction to my questioning earlier is fake.

How do I respond to this besides saying, "no." I'm not sure why you think you're privy to the knowledge of whether or not my reactions are fake, but it was definitely real.

I already said why I believe your reaction is fake, but I'll quote it again:

This is why Fugitive is scum:

I don't need to sidestep a question that dumb, I blatantly chose not to answer it because

I'm fed up talking to you.

Townies getting fed up with conversations happens all the time... but only after it's clear the conversation is going nowhere! This was not the case when Fugitive said this, not even close. There's no reason for town Fugitive to be fed up with answering my questions, when it was only the third question I asked him.

Why did you ask a protective role a question, when answering it would out them?

It was clearly rhetorical,

nice attempt at mudslinging though.

No shit it was rhetorical. That still doesn't explain why did you ask it?

Thinking out loud mostly. I tend to do that.

Next you're going to tell me that's a scum-tell?

As I said before, his reaction to my questioning is scummy, because I wasn't attacking him at this point, yet he was acting like it. Scum are more likely to be nervous that they'll get attacked, because they know they deserve it.

You never said my reaction was fake, you said it was scummy. Get your story straight, boy.

This is completely false. You started the day by vaguely hinting that my interaction with IS was scummy, then you popped in every so often just to remind everyone that you're still here and you still think I'm scum. It makes you appear that you want me lynched, but it does nothing to actually achieve that task, and the fact that you've been making empty posts about me all day just shows your true feeling is ambivalence.

Thanks for reminding me, I totally forgot about your less than towny interactions with IS. I knew there was something I was forgetting that pinned you further as scum.

Obligatory:
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HEY EVERYBODY!! WE SHOULD LYNCH ERRATUSCUM SCUMMY-SCUM SCUM. MORE VOTES MORE VOTES MORE VOTES!!!!11!!1!1

[Fugitive]

I said it was scummy because it was fake.

Really? Point out the word

fake

in there for me if you said that. In fact, point out where you even

implied

it was "scummy because it was fake." You can't because you never did either. kthxbai

You weren't really "fed up" with my question, you just didn't have an answer to it.

I usually try to stay out of ad hom territory, but you're an idiot. Seriously, if you're scum you're making the weakest fake case ever, but if you're town then whenever I learn your alignment I'm going to rage so fucking hard at your play. You're basically trying to find scum-tells on baseless assumptions about

why

I do things rather than just deconstructing my play for what it is. I wouldn't mind so much if you said it was scummy because I refused to answer (at least then you'd be speaking truth), but you're saying it's scummy because I couldn't answer, which is something you've created entirely in your mind, and there's a huge difference between the two. You really need to stop assuming and learn how to actually scum hunt, even though it's quite clear you're scum just trying to fake it. Stop making up shit and use concrete facts at the very least.

Obligatory:
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VOTE: Erratus Apathos
VOTE: Erratus Apathos
VOTE: Erratus Apathos
VOTE: Erratus Apathos

I'm voting you so hard that if I were a hat I'd be ready for construction.

[Fugitive]

I said it was scummy because it was fake.

Really? Point out the word

fake

in there for me if you said that. In fact, point out where you even

implied

it was "scummy because it was fake." You can't because you never did either. kthxbai

There's no reason for town Fugitive to be fed up with answering my questions

You seriously think that "There's no reason for town Fugitive to be fed up with answering my questions" = He's faking his reaction.

LMAO. That's pretty dense, bro, even for you.

You're basically trying to find scum-tells on baseless assumptions about

why

I do things rather than just deconstructing my play for what it is. I wouldn't mind so much if you said it was scummy because I refused to answer (at least then you'd be speaking truth), but you're saying it's scummy because I couldn't answer, which is something you've created entirely in your mind, and there's a huge difference between the two. You really need to stop assuming and learn how to actually scum hunt, even though it's quite clear you're scum just trying to fake it. Stop making up shit and use concrete facts at the very least.

"YOU'RE VOTING ME FOR THE WRONG REASONS!"

Misrep +1

Keep going man, at this rate I should have the entire town convinced by the end of the night.

Obligatory:
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HEY GUYS CAN WE PLEASE JUST LYNCH FUCKING OBVSCUM RIGHT NOW?!

[Fugitive]

a) Erratus plays better table tennis logic. He wins both sets.

I resent you now.

But seriously, can you explain why?

Fugitive said he was fed up talking to me, but then he participated in the back and forth between 533 and 540. That is clearly not the action of someone who is fed up talking to me.

Trust me, I've been fed up talking to you since your useless question spree at the beginning of the day.

[Fugitive]

Can't argue with that rock solid logic.

[Fugitive]

I guess I should post so I don't get prodded.

So... can we lynch scum?

[Fugitive]

The deadline is on Sunday, February 20th at 5PM EST.

The rest is dreaming with divine gifts.

He's at work. He'll probably deadline this shit up when he gets home tonight.

[Fugitive]

Who the hell is Nexus? Oh... TheLonging.

+1 scum point to everyone who pushed that slot for pushing an easy mislynch.

VOTE: Erratus Apathos

Let's actually lynch scum today.

[Fugitive]

Definitely expected Erratus to go with the "well I wanted to see if the vote would go through anyway" excuse rather than the claim of ignorance.

@AGar - town basically just couldn't decide on a lynch fast enough and the deadline snuck up after some confusion with the mod.

Could someone sum up for me why Sapo is getting voted? Especially when both votes came with not even a bit of other text, let alone reasoning, (and from my top 2 suspects).

[Fugitive]

Oh cool, this game got interesting.

Pretty much all I can find to actually respond to this this:

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Fugitive also made a post pre-deadline on the 20th. Said post. Sapo declares V/LA in her post, here. Fugitive doesn't post here, but has no V/LA declared. Which of these looks less likely to be a "skim" and more likely to be an "avoidance"?

Which is kinda funny considering you expected me to hammer someone I thought was town? None of my three candidate I was willing to lynch were even close (Erratus, Empking, MS). Also, it's a tad insulting you think I'd be stupid enough to intentionally avoid a thread and post somewhere else, when I avoid something I do it like a pro.

Who the hell is Nexus? Oh... TheLonging.

What was the purpose of this statement?

I dunno, just talkin to myself. Nexus wasn't in the game long.

Are you emulating Erratus?

What slot?

I'd have to go back and reread, which I don't have time for atm, but there were definitely a couple people pushing his lynch really

really

hard for no real scum-tells, more just a lack of content / weird play. (if memory serves me el simo was one, but don't quote me on that because I might be wrong.) I'll come up with a concrete and definite list when I can, but you just read the thread so you should know better than me.

Oh hey, look. The replacements are actually doing work.

[Fugitive]

Which is kinda funny considering you expected me to hammer someone I thought was town?

To avoid a no lynch, yes.

I'd rather no lynch occurred than a townie lynch. Common sense, bro.

Also, it's a tad insulting you think I'd be stupid enough to intentionally avoid a thread and post somewhere else

Then why didn't you post?

No reason to. Why waste space with fluffy useless posts?

[Fugitive]

Also, it's a tad insulting you think I'd be stupid enough to intentionally avoid a thread and post somewhere else

Then why didn't you post?

No reason to. Why waste space with fluffy useless posts?

So you act offended at the accusation that you intentionally avoided the thread when

that is exactly what you did.

No, I'm offended that I'm accused of being scum for doing something that's not a scum-tell.

[Fugitive]

Explain to me how a dead townie benefits the town.

[Fugitive]

V/LA until Tuesday night

ಠ_ಠ

@AGar - I guess that makes sense, I just never feel right hammering a town read. What's done is done.

[Fugitive]

The "I hate being caught for the 'wrong reasons'" tell.

Lol - tells where you have to first assume the person is scum to the action scummy are inherently flawed.

I'd really love to see more activity in this game...

But yeah.

Fugitive needs the lynching. 631 reads like he's trying to suck up now that he realizes he was wrong.

Sucking up? I don't respect you enough to suck up to you, or anyone here for that matter. Hell, read all my games as town and scum and find once were I sucked up to anyone. Protip: You can't.

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Probably going to get lynched so I'll give my list from Scumminess to townieness:

SCUM

Erratus Apathos
Empking
Midnight's Sorrow
AGar
saporovirus
Substrike22
LynchMePls
Fugitive

TOWN

I'm a

Vanilla Townie

if anyone cares about a claim.

[Fugitive]

The "I hate being caught for the 'wrong reasons'" tell.

Lol - tells where you have to first assume the person is scum to the action scummy are inherently flawed.

*to find

[Fugitive]

Only a fool would hold fast to his position when it's wrong. I'm sorry it seems to be beyond your intellectual capability to ever admit you're wrong, since you seem so baffled by the concept, but open-minded and mature individuals have no problems with it.

[Fugitive]

Sorry, it's hard to not insult the mentally handicapped sometimes.

And no, I said I was wrong because I was wrong. Nice try twisting my actions though.

The fact that you're pushing this mislynch so hard is probably a town tell. I don't see scum gunning after me this hard. I could be wrong, you are doing an awful lot of misrepping, which can be a scum-tell, but it could also be over eager newb town. The scum, though, are probably silently on my wagon or avoiding it (Erratus, Empking, or possibly LMP but I think he's still probtown). There's probably two remaining in a 13 player game, and I doubt both are on me at the moment. That fits in with my Erratus and Empking theory as well, so I'm favoring that possibility even more.

Looking forward to Substrike's review he promised today, and I'd like to hear more from LMP.

[Fugitive]

Prodded like cattle.

Why'd you even sign up for this game?

[Fugitive]

Someone just hammer, this failtown is depressing. I've literally lost all motivation to stop you guys.

At least take my list on the previous page into account after I flip town if you guys feel like doing anything right this game.

[Fugitive]

EBWOP: totally didn't realize Emp was on my wagon. That was my bad for not checking, I didn't remember his vote.

I maintain that there's still probably only one of two scum on my wagon atm. Just take that into account too once I die. I'll leave my list as is because they're still my top two scum suspects no matter how contradictory that seems, I'm like 90% sure at least one is scum.

[Fugitive]

EA's play was pretty good, though.

EA was scummy as fuck, far from anything I'd call good.

That was honestly some of the worst town and scum play I've ever seen. I wish there was a way both sides could have lost.