Mini 1126 - Game over - Was Averagely Suspicious saved?

[Hiraki]

Guys. It's not December 18th yet.

[Hiraki]

FoS: BarryAllen

Vote: GreyICE

Die archenemy!

[Hiraki]

unvote: Ashblade

vote: Hiraki

For copying Bill's FoS, even after Barry explained his mistake and put his vote where his mouth is. Trying to appear townie by mirroring others is a definite scum tell.

Nice job on interpretation.

Actually no, let's not use sarcasm here. That was a horrible job.

There's no reason to vote Errant. His post was

OBVIOUSLY

sarcasm.

Also, the point that you're accusing me of copying is quite frightful. If I wanted to copy someone, I'd vote Errant. However, Errant is null at this moment, and shouldn't be voted. Someone on his wagon needs to die first.

I take back my FoS though. I didn't mean Barry. I meant Bill.

He needs to actually die.

Your admission that you didn't vote to start Day 1 was silly at best, given that the game consensus was that it was

likelier that scum players would want to delay the start.

I'm thinking there's a decent enough chance that you're simply ballsy, and thought you'd be able to deflect the resulting attention into pressure on somebody else.

Which doesn't bode well for you.

Bold: Nice job on Meta Telling

Italics: Decent Chance and voting. Ehehehemeee. No, this doesn't make any sense.

Wikkiden can die too, just because his vote sucks.

[Hiraki]

EWBOP:

Unvote, Vote: Bill McQuill

[Hiraki]

Hey.

If you're going to call my reasons stupid. You should at least explain why.

Y'know like I did.

[Hiraki]

If you insist.

Bold: Nice job on Meta Telling

I happen to think this particular meta interpretation makes a certain amount of sense. It was, in fact, to scum's advantage to delay the start of the game, and Erratus admitted that he didn't vote to start the game. I don't think this is damning evidence against Erratus, but it is a bit fishy, and a better reason to cast a vote than is usually seen at this point in the game.

Italics: Decent Chance and voting. Ehehehemeee. No, this doesn't make any sense.

I already said this, but I think feeling that a person has a "decent chance" of being scum is more than enough reason to cast a vote against them. I don't consider Bill's vote or use of the word "decent" scummy or nonsensical.

Are you honestly going to tell me that you're more than "decently" sure of Bill's alignment?

Why didn't you write out your reasons out when you first FoS'd Barry?

1) Alright seriously? Errantus didn't score to start the game. Whooptedoo. If you can honestly tell me that it's a

small

scumtell, I'm going to murder you.

2) You're missing the point. Bill's case wasn't even decent. His entire post was based off the motive of Errantus' actions. FFS. I could be writing this because I'm scum and want to live. This isn't decent.

3) To be honest, I was hoping I could find some idiot to accuse me of voting with no reasoning, since Bill's first post already sucked. Didn't happen though.

[Hiraki]

My bad, that should be rephrased. Point 2 stands as is.

I was trying to get someone to vote for me because the FoS. And I did decently answer the question. It was scumbait.

[Hiraki]

I honestly don't care if I please you anymore. Every mistake I've made I've gotten a "lol scum" from you.

[Hiraki]

RobCapone can die too.

Can I get a good case on subgenius? His play doesn't qualify as a good reason for me.

[Hiraki]

Barry, that's an interesting dance you're doing there. Must be some sort of native tribal thing.

Currently I support wagons on Bill, mockingjaye and subgenius (hail Slack!). If any of them were to dangle in the gentle spring breezes I'd be satisfied. Conditional to those flips I would support wagons on Rob and you.

All that said, I only have one vote. And I have it placed on the one I currently find most likely to flip red.

I'm really honestly not sure why I have to explain all this.

This basically.

subgenius - I am struck by several things in your posts. You kept after Hiraki for a number of posts for his mistaken FoS on me, continuing to press on why there wasn't an explanation posted with the FoS at the time. Then, you backpedal in some of your posts, while stating that Hiraki looks scummy for backpedaling. You accuse Hiraki of "rewriting history", and though I may be missing it, I don't see that point.

1) Don't call someone scummy because of accusations and pushing.

2) I'll agree with the backpedaling.

3) The rewriting history is more in the point of I changed what I said (Ex: I wanted to FoS Bill, rather than you[Bill])

It's a bit annoying that yo're voting Sub on that basis. I mean FMPOV, Bill looks much worse.

that is essentially what hiraki has done, I don't care if he votes you but he asks for reasons why people are voting you, when his reason for his vote is essentially nonsense.

Not really. But nice defense. Noted when Bill flips scum.

if someone calls me scum, I don't defend that person's wagon

Yeah that's not really smart. That's just getting butt-hurt really.

it seems like you are trying to stall the inevitable and hope something happens to get the attention off of you, the deadline means nothing in the grand scheme of things if people are convinced you are scum.

What's your point? You said this randomly and actually it's gotten me annoyed.

but you supported his wagon and now it is at L-2 you seem to be avoiding it, idk just doesn't make sense to me.

He's not really avoiding it though.

Yeah so RobCapone or Bill. Take your pick please.

Just to say, if anyone was wondering, here was my initial reasoning for wanting Rob as dead as Bill.

Subs, play more, read wiki less

those scum tells became invalid the moment they were posted

unvote, vote subs

I have been trying to tell if subs was just newbish cause he sounds alot like how I played when I first joined, but seeing he has been here since 2008(regardless if he "hasn't played in a while") he should not be playing like this if he is town, so I have to assume he probably isn't and just trying to play it off that isn't working.

But um.

You could press that name(subgenius). And you'd be able to go to his profile.

And search his posts.

And find that he's played barely any games.

Also, "he should not be playing like this if he is town"

What the hell is that supposed to mean? Are town people supposed to act like all town people? You're making no sense, assuming with no information, and you're voting him because scumtells from the Wiki apparently are invalid the moment that he posted in here. Does something not make sense here, or is it everything?

[Hiraki]

EBWOP: Meh. Fix Papa Zito's quote to Bill and Rob, rather than Bill, Sub, and Mocking.

Actually, not really sure why I put that in there, looking at it now.

[Hiraki]

not really isn't really a valid response, your reason is nonsense and if you are going to ask people to make cases, you shoudl be willing to do the same. so make a case on the person you are voting for

Well good thing I didn't ask you to make a case, and I did make a case. This is just a notation. I don't need to make a case for anyone really.

no it isn't getting but-hurt, I may not attack the person who is accusing me of being scum, but I am damn sure am not going to defend them. your defending subs makes no sense and you haven't provided reasons for why he is not scum. and again you have not provided anything valid for your vote. My reasoning may not make sense to you, but I don't have to convince you of my reason for my vote.

Person X calls you scum. Person Z says he has an innocent on you and a guilty on confirmed town, Person X. I do believe that you should defend Person X.

This is valid because you're ignoring and being anti-town. That's good enough for me to vote.

I didn't say this randomly, he brought it up like it actually means something. the fact that we have a long deadline means nothing and doesn't mean that if we suspect someone of scum, we should wait out the entire 2 weeks before lynching him

Great. You can think. Obviously we shouldn't quicklynch anyone. It's kind of already known that we're not.

um yes he said he supports a Sub wagon and now there is one, he wants to move focus off of it. that is scummy play, added that Zito hasn't really provided anything of value and hasn't scum hunted is yet another reason I pointed it out.

Right. Because applying pressure is now scummy. Noted. If you honestly thought he wanted to lynch that quickly, then I sigh.

I don't know how many game he has played on the old mafiascum site and you really can't check. plus I didn't think I had to check his game log when I saw he was here since 2008.

but back to the other question, town can act however he wants but to me he seems like he is trying to earn town points when he makes comments like this

1. Okay. But what's your point? Are you honestly going to lynch him on the basis of that?

2. The use of the word town makes me quite wary of a slip, me spies.

[Hiraki]

I'm glad we've all become buddies so quickly!

[Hiraki]

Question @ Zito: Why were you so quick to clear Erratus like that? It was a bandwagon that was pretty much guaranteed to happen with what was said pre-game.

Bullshit and you know it. Erratus wagon was opportunistic. Bill was the one who liked opportunity.

Rob is just being stupid at the moment. Bill was scummy, and he knows it.

And for the record, there is no possible way that I'm lurking. It's D1, 11 Pages. I've had no prod checks.

Here's a better question.

Rob. Why aren't you voting me?

[Hiraki]

I take back my FoS though. I didn't mean Barry. I meant Bill.

He needs to actually die.

Your admission that you didn't vote to start Day 1 was silly at best, given that the game consensus was that it was

likelier that scum players would want to delay the start.

I'm thinking there's a decent enough chance that you're simply ballsy, and thought you'd be able to deflect the resulting attention into pressure on somebody else.

Which doesn't bode well for you.

Bold: Nice job on Meta Telling

Italics: Decent Chance and voting. Ehehehemeee. No, this doesn't make any sense.

Wikkiden can die too, just because his vote sucks.

Whoops.

lurking is posting just enough to avoid prods or to stay off the radar

I doubt that I qualify for either.

2. I am voting for the person I think is the most likely to be scum, I haven't seen any reason to change my vote right now although I like that vote by Hayker on Zito, he is somoeone who could stand to have a little pressure on him.

So you don't believe I am scum.

Well.

[Hiraki]

I give up.

[Hiraki]

Oh. Oh boy. Nice catch. Damn it, subs needs serious rope today.

Are these two separate points, or am I somehow wrapped up with Wikki now as well?

Sadly scum come in teams

But, how did you get subgenius there too? Why subgenius rather than someone else?

[Hiraki]

All right, since I been gone:

Bullshit and you know it. Erratus wagon was opportunistic. Bill was the one who liked opportunity.

Rob is just being stupid at the moment. Bill was scummy, and he knows it.

And for the record, there is no possible way that I'm lurking. It's D1, 11 Pages. I've had no prod checks.

Here's a better question.

Rob. Why aren't you voting me?

Passcue me? Am I the only one being raked over the coals for "opportunistically" voting for Erratus in this post? And what's with the over-defensiveness about whether or not you've lurked? And how would Rob's answer to that question give you any information at all? Is there something scummy about... not voting for you?

I haven't taken a good look at the wagon, but you're the one that shows out the most. I haven't been overdefensive about it, because it's such a false claim, and the reason I asked the question is because it seems like Rob thinks I'm scum.

[Hiraki]

Or because no more townies want to get on the wagon.

That's probably it.

FYI: Ice posted today.

Zito posted yesterday.

Hayker posted yesterday night.

And bviogot replaced in yesterday.

Therefore, we can assess that. People do not spend every waking second on mafiascum.net and that everyone here should stop botching about lurkers. AKA: RobCapone

P.E.: See? Barry only got one "lurker". Good job there.

[Hiraki]

Bviogot.

Did you forget to comment on the elephant in the room?

You have nothing on Bgg.

That annoys me.

Barry: I want names of people who you believe are lurking.

[Hiraki]

Wow. I totally mixed up 2 games for one moment. Dunno why though.

[Hiraki]

And Hiraki, one more time in case you are still somewhat paranoid about being called a lurker - I don't think you are a lurker. I do think you need to be sure which game you're posting in, however. That doesn't make you a lurker, and doesn't make you town or scum - just a bit confused.

The problem is, is that I've only commented on people saying that I've lurked once.

I don't know who's lurking, I wanted your opinion. That's it. Just wanted to throw that out there, I'll see what your views are fully later.

[Hiraki]

No GreyICE. It has a town "skim".

You need to read it to see that he's scum.

[Hiraki]

Oh cool. You guys have finally realized who's scum.

Unvote, Vote: RobCapone

[Hiraki]

Oh cool. You guys have finally realized who's scum.

Unvote, Vote: RobCapone

See I was right about you lurking

p.edit - I have not given up, I won't be lynched today

Oh yeah totally right. You got me Rob. I'm lurking. Do you know it's hard arguing with a brick wall? The other side doesn't seem to understand your arguments very well.

He's setting up for a PR claim.

Sigh.

Meh. That would be annoying.

[Hiraki]

He's setting up for a PR claim.

Sigh.

Penpen what do you think of our friend Hiraki here.

I see Hiraki as the opposite of RobCapone.
I don't understand why he would make a post saying that he gives up for unless, he is scum.

Unvote

I think you may have missed http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 8#p2805908 post.

I really don't care what Rob says anymore. It annoys me, and 99% of what he says is wrong, is not a valid scumtell, and is stupid. You can take your pick on which one most of his posts are, but honestly. I'm not arguing with him anymore.

However, I'm bored, and I recieved an idea. Rob, is lurking a scumtell to you?

I wish Bill would post more.

Hiraki, Who do you think are town?

Myself. To be honest, no one here is showing me that they're 100% town, so therefore I can't really tell. I'll stick with scumhunting for now, and I'll get better reads down the road. For the moment, Rod and Bill are scum, and need to die. Everyone else is null.

[Hiraki]

EBWOP:

Yeah. I forgot to preview it.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 8#p2805908

Just pretend that never happened.

[Hiraki]

Yes lurking is a scum tell to me, see my sig duh

Really?

Interesting.

So, if that's so. Wouldn't you have more than 3 people being scum then?

[Hiraki]

How can you have Lurker Town, if lurking is a scumtell to you. That makes no sense. Also, how would you find lurking town? I'm intrigued in this.

To add on, if I'm scum, why would I buss Bill D1?

[Hiraki]

How can you have Lurker Town, if lurking is a scumtell to you. That makes no sense. Also, how would you find lurking town? I'm intrigued in this.

To add on, if I'm scum, why would I buss Bill D1?

Cause town lurk too and they may get wrongly accused, I've been dealing with lurkers for a long time, it's the biggest pet peeve of mine but it's the way they lurk

someone who is comletely clueless abou what's going on is lower on my scumdar than someone who shows up at certain times and seems to know what's going on

are you suggesting mafia won't bus their partner day 1?
Are you really serious with that question anywY when I have called you out that your case on Bill is nonsense because you haven't made a case in him. To which you said something about not having to make one.

So yes I think you are half/ass bussing Bill and yes mafia bus their partners day 1, day 2, , any fucking day they want.

I said I don't need to make a case. Not I don't need to make a case on Bill. I have made a case, and I'm sticking with it. Whether or not you like it, I really don't care.

I'm not suggesting that the mafia wouldn't buss their partner, I'm saying it'd be highly illogical on D1 for the mafia to do so. I don't see the point in it, therefore, I asked you the question. Nice assumption. (b")b

Also, what does "someone who is completely cluless..." mean? Are you saying if someone played the newbie card and didn't talk you'd label them as obv. lurk town?

[Hiraki]

He doesn't post all day and swoops in to bandwagon, not a misrep

He posted at 1:34.

He posted again at 3:30 to change his vote.

2 hours != 24 hours.

1. I never said 24 hours
2. Learn to not misrep yourself cause it was 1:34 AM so it was 14 hours

in that 14 hours lots took place, did he care to comment? No he pops in right when the votes pile on to throw his on very opportunistically. The votes came on me super quick.

Thus he proved his scum lurkyness IMO

Once I'm dead and flip town all I ask is he get lynched as my dying request.

A day is 24 hours.

Sorry, I didn't realize that 1:34 AM that it might be night.

And I might need something.

Like sleep.

[Hiraki]

Yeah Rob. Like you've commented on

every

post in this game.

Your logic pisses me off. And it's not because it's right, mind you.

[Hiraki]

Someone give me a rundown on the Rob case plz. I'd like to see it all in one place.

Are you that lazy.

[Hiraki]

Hmm.

Rob is at L-1, but there's no self-hammer.

Hmmzorz.

I'll be a good boy, for now.

Unvote, V/LA: Until Late Friday

[Hiraki]

See if hiraki was so set on me getting lynched, why unvote?

Glanced at Subs post and it's mostly butt hurt for me calling him scum and twisting me trying to get hiraki to explain why he defends his accuser as trying to drum upvotes

if someone calls me scum and I'm innocent, I'm not going to defend that person if they are being called scum. It's retarded logic

if anything it means I'm wrong on subs but right on hiraki

Or, I have a policy where we shouldn't lynch claimed PRs until they can be proven to be scum.

If you were at L-2, why did you claim?

Btw. you're thinking the scum-innocent logic wrong. If someone has valid proof that you're scum(report) and you're innocent, then the investigator is scum. However, if someone suspects you to be scum, and you're innocent, there is no scum motive to defend the person that accuses you, so it'd be town.

To note: I have a spare 20 before I leave.

[Hiraki]

That's a terrible policy. Explain why you are unwilling to lynch Rob.

Let me rephrase my last statement. I'm not going to lynch a PR on D1 without poof that he must be scum. Even though I think that Rob is extremely scummy, I'm willing to allow him to stay alive.

To go on, let's talk about Rob.

Hey Rob. If you really want me dead, you should try making a convincing case. The statements that I've been lurking, and that I have no "real"case on Billy being scum aren't working well. Mostly to the point that you're the only one who believes I'm lurking, and that I do have a case on Billy's first post, you just don't agree with it. I could add onto it, but I'm not focused on him, at least not anymore.

[Hiraki]

Then you won't get a lynch out of anyone. I wasn't focused on Billy at that moment, and I didn't feel like making a case, therefore I didn't.

You make this refusal of making a case a huge scumtell, when it's really just me being lazy and not caring to do something big.

[Hiraki]

yeah I don't want

town

to vote me but I am trying to point out your behavior over the last 2 or 3 pages is sketchy

Oh, so scum is already bussing you?

Hmmzorz.

Vote: RobCapone

[Hiraki]

again are you retarded hiraki? i used the same wording penpen used, I don't want town to vote me cause I am town also.

and way to go against your own policy, so now you contradict yourself.

I am sorry the rest of town can't see what I see

That was enough to push it, however I see your point. Therefore, I'll take the vote off.

Unvote

No one can see your case because you haven't posted one. You expect me to defend your shitty vote with the fact by me saying town. AKA: Your defense throughout the entire game.

Hiraki, we get it. You think he's scum. Try taking the tunnel vision off for two seconds and realize that we don't even have to worry about it right now. You said it yourself you don't lynch PRs unless they can be proven to be scum and I'm pretty sure Rob can be proven to be scum later on.

Fine. I wish there was an ignore button though, to make this plausible.

[Hiraki]

I have posted a case throughout the thread

your ACTIVE lurking
your refusal to make a case when asked yet you ask others to make a case
your opportunstic swooping out of nowhere when my bandwagon starts to vote me an put me L-3 I believe
your defending your accuser (see my rapist or baseball card analogy, they both fit)
you purposely trying to turn things I say into a scumtell or scummy aka strawman

now where the fuck is your case on Bill, if you don't post a case on bill in your next post than it is an admission of guilt and we can lynch you.

1. No.

2. I asked you, this is just you getting butt-hurt. What do you think of Bill?

3. Oh like I haven't suspected you at all.

Oh wait.

Just to note, your BW started to pick up when I was asleep, therefore I had to join with it.

4. This isn't baseball or rape. This is mafia. I can defend someone accusing me, and still be town or scum. It is null.

5. Oh yeah totally.

Your case sucks and there is no valid proof. Just tells that apply to certain people. Admit it. You're sure someone else is scum, rather than me.

Vote: Bill

You want a case on Bill? Fine. I'm done with you, and you deserve it. Not for being a good boy though.

First, I go with his EA BW.

Second, post #148 was definitely not AtE.

Third, post #157.

He basically groveled for the town's forgiveness after an L-1 vote that approximately two players even commented on. He invoked being a newer player and apologized profusely for "ruining" the game after a more experienced player asked him why he skipped the Newbie game queue. He's trying to be deferential and cover his bases all at the same time.

You easily made this into something it didn't need to be. He's only explaining his stance, and apologize for what he's done. I've done that as town and scum. While I can't speak for Wikki, I don't see scum in this. Call this a difference in opinions, but I think he's trying to stretch the truth to get a lynch.

Hey, I can even use Bill Logic to find Billscum!

Attacking bad play may not exactly equate to finding scum, but the idea is that certain patterns of bad play are bad because they tend to reveal scum to be scum.

(b")b

Anyway, fourth. This isn't really scummy, but it ticked me off.

Another tendency of scum is to come to the early defense of players perceived as new, since they're more likely to make mistakes later in the game and make easy mislynch targets, so your defense here is also noted.

But the problem is Wikki is new. So, um, wouldn't this not apply to the current situation at all, except that Wikki is new? I guess you could call this fruitless crap, but I don't care about it that much to be honest.

Fifth. Most of his opinions don't take a firm stance on the situation at hand. They just talk about it. ISO 8 is a good example of this. Especially at the end where he names Mocking his #2 scum read for being null. Not only does that look opportunistic, but it doesn't sit well with me.

I will admit his recent posts have gotten better, so I may take a better look at him, but he's my #1 scum read at this point.

P.E.

so I will stay on Hiraki and you guys can do what you what, as i said if hiraki flips town you will never see me play another game on this site again.

Good riddance.

[Hiraki]

I always love when someone says there is no proof they are scum, of course there is no proof day 1 but that is such a mentality of scum, only scum would say prove it.

you think I am scum, but I don't tell you to prove it, because I know you can't. you either believe it or you don't and I die by lynch or by NK, but regardless I will flip town

thanks for admitting you are scum, but you want us to prove it first

Sorry, I really just can't understand this post. At all.

[Hiraki]

EBWOP:

1-4, acceptable answers.

You know that Zito is going to pick 5 now, right?

[Hiraki]

scum say prove it

town could care less because they know it can't be proved

you say

Your case sucks and there is no valid proof

aka PROVE IT

simple enough for you or do you need a remedial english course first?

No, actually you're misinterpreting my post.

You have no valid proof from my posts of any real scum tells. All the tells that you posted can be seen as null or scummy to other players.

Oh, and P.M. me, even though you'll supposedly leave after I flip town, if anyone takes that english course from you.

[Hiraki]

interpretation is always going to be different, everyone can make up their own mind, I am find with you. it's not like you have actually done anything worthwhile in this game, I mean you already admitted to being to lazy to make a case and you haven't scum hunted for shit either.

you are no better than furclow or drmyshotty at this point.

That's why I showed you case up there.

I guess PapaZito and I get to be ranked there. Do you feel special about that Zito?

[Hiraki]

Fuck you Rob.

#548. I made it just for you, and you blatantly ignore it.

I'm done with your bullshit, and I can't stand reading your godawful posts.

If you're going to complain to me that

I'm

being lazy. At least have a fucking decency to check your facts, instead of making yourself the all-knowing RobCapone.

[Hiraki]

Hmm.

I never saw that in penpen.

I'll need to ISO everyone else in the game so far then. Then I'll have your scum team.

Sound good?

[Hiraki]

I'd be proud of it. You're just a whimp ICE!

Penpen: Do you have any reasoning why? Or was it just a vibe?

[Hiraki]

Hiraki, please explain why GREYIce is your archenemy?

You do realize how pointless this is? Do you think I'm scum, yes or no?

If so, make a good case, and let me defend against it.

[Hiraki]

Yeah, actually the only time that I'll really have Limited Access would be tomorrow. I put the V/LA up just in case I wouldn't have any access from my hotel. However, I definitely won't be around for a good part of tomorrow.

[Hiraki]

No flavor love it seems. I'll post deeper later.

[Hiraki]

But you do realize that if you targeted me, and we lynched you, assuming you got a scum report on me, that I'd be lynched the next day, right?

[Hiraki]

Good point. Forgot you were a tracker. I'm going to be busy for the next few days, but by the weekend, I should get my view on this game straight.

[Hiraki]

Vote: Erratus

His vote on Bill is crappola.

[Hiraki]

ISO post 39 says Haiiiiiii~

[Hiraki]

I will admit his recent posts have gotten better, so I may take a better look at him, but he's my #1 scum read at this point.

at this point.

I told you that I wanted an ISO of everyone in the game. Because I don't have a computer right now, as in right now of 6:42 AM, I'm unable to give you the full specs of my vote.

Not to mention, let's face it. My case on Bill was pretty crappy. I'm annoyed that no one said much about it, but I guess that's why a wagon didn't rise from it.

[Hiraki]

btw I saw you lurking Hiraki

Yes, looking at the thread for two minutes is totally lurking. Especially-- I'm done talking to you.

Here's why EA is scum.

He voted Bill for the reasoning that he posted just barely. Apparently, he can keep that vote until L-2, which is incredible to me.

What's also incredible to me, is why you voted Bill. You voted Subgenius and Hayker, but apparently they disappeared by the beginning of D2.

GreyICE didn't like bvi or penpen. I want to look at both later.

[Hiraki]

GreyICE didn't like bvi or penpen. I want to look at both later.

GreyICE also didn't like Rob or me. We also have two other confirmed townies dead who had their own suspicions. Why focus on bvoigt and penpen in particular?

Do you think we'd be better off lynching EA than whoever it is that replaces Bill? Why?

Because Bill honestly wasn't that bad. The only reasoning I can see for half of this wagon is that he's inactive. That's not a very good reason at all. EA, on the otherhand, just randomly sees Bill as a target. Scum bells should've rung long ago.

[Hiraki]

OK, this is getting ridiculous. Your top suspects for all of Day 1 were Rob and Bill

I stopped reading there.

Wow, it's like reads change over time! What an amazing discovery Magellan!

The problem wasn't that your reads changed, it was how drastically your reads changed. Did anyone that you voted D1 do anything drastically different D2?

I voted Bill for posting low content. Bill hasn't posted any content at all since then. So, uh, fuckin' obviously I'm keeping the vote.

See? Here's a problem. This, to me, is a horrendous reason to vote someone. Town could have a motive not to post content, and scum could just not post content. It's null. While I'm not sure what motive Bill has for being lazy, I don't need to care about that.

[Hiraki]

1) This shows that you've

really

been reading the thread.

2) Have you ever heard of a reaction test?(On iPod so no quotes.)

The problem with mine is that no one reacted.

Rob. FFS. Sorry I'm not such a post whore like you with having the constant need of looking at the thread 24/7. It's really annoying that you're going to call me out on, rather than anyone else.

This is why I hate talking to you. Every fucking action I do is scummy to you. This not an overreaction. You are just that god damn annoying.

[Hiraki]

the lurking isn't as much of a scum tell to me

the defending the person calling you scummy and deciding to attack a person who is voting a person who was your scum read day 1 are bigger

also you admitting you made up a really weak case on Bill doesn't make sense if you are town. if you are town you don't make up a fake case on somebody, you make a case you believe in and if you don't believe in it than I have to conclude you are mafia.

I can't think of a time where I ever made a case I didn't believe in as town.

So now you're admitting to the attempt of instigation, basically.

...

OH

MY

GOD.

[Hiraki]

1) This shows that you've

really

been reading the thread.

2) Have you ever heard of a reaction test?(On iPod so no quotes.)

The problem with mine is that no one reacted.

1. It's pretty unreasonable to say that the only people you voted weren't actually your main suspects.
2. So, your reaction tests lasted the entire day?

1. Can you read the thread before I rage?

2. Not sure what you're trying to get by this question. I don't think Bill is scum, but I made the case and vote as a test. No one said anything, which is

quite

alerting. Could you really call my case on Bill good?

[Hiraki]

EWBOP:

the lurking isn't as much of a scum tell to me

the defending the person calling you scummy and deciding to attack a person who is voting a person who was your scum read day 1 are bigger

also you admitting you made up a really weak case on Bill doesn't make sense if you are town. if you are town you don't make up a fake case on somebody, you make a case you believe in and if you don't believe in it than I have to conclude you are mafia.

I can't think of a time where I ever made a case I didn't believe in as town.

So now you're admitting to the attempt of instigation, basically.

...

OH

MY

GOD.

I said it isn't AS MUCH of a scum tell, but to me it still is so I am not instigating anything. All I am going to do is attack you until you finally concede and admit you are scum or we lynch you and reveal you are scum.

At this point, I'd ask about your case on me again, but I find it stupid to ask because my logic stands inadequate to Rob's large E-Penis.

[Hiraki]

Hiraki, chillax.

Take a deep breath.

Because it'll probably be one of your last.

It was a good try.

I have three votes on me. I'm doubtful I'll be lynched

that

fast.

Unless you want to shoot me or something.

No, I'm lazy. Just spell it out for me, please.

Perfect. You just need to stop assuming and start looking.

#34 of my ISO should be satisfactory.

Not really, but it wasn't lousy enough to comment on. Still, once you realized that no one was commenting, why did you hold onto the vote for a long time, and even come back to it late in the day?

Because I wanted to see if someone would be alert. Notice. Y'know that kind of stuff.

[Hiraki]

No, but you're flailing around right now in a way that doesn't make me feel all warm and cuddly inside.

No I'm not...

@hiraki
I, for one, am not a fan of justifying crappy play as "just testing to see if you all were paying attention." What conclusions could you draw if somebody called you out on it at the time?

Both scum and town have reasons to draw attention to poor play, so it's not ever going to give you a viable read.

I didn't ever think that it'd be taken that way. It was more the reasoning that I wanted to see what would happen, rather than what people think about it.

Um...what? That post expresses suspicion of Rob. I'm saying that you've ignored your top suspects (Bill and Rob) from D1.

Yuck. I meant 35. My bad.

If you didn't believe in your Bill vote, it doesn't seem pro-town to hold onto it for so long. Obviously, we have to lynch scum to win. It doesn't look like that was your main priority.

I'll laugh, and take this one as a joke. Or, perhaps this means you really need to read.

if you are going to tell people to read the thread, you could too

I am. It's quite sighable, but meh.

basically you aren't playing pro-town. There is nothing you have done this game that I can rationalize a townie to do. And yes when I find scum, I tunnel them into submission. Tunneling =/= scum tell.

Dramatization, and Opinion. Average retarded Capone post.

@ hiraki

can you show me a game you played as town where you did the following

1. defended the person calling you scum
2. refusing to make a case on your biggest scum read
3. making a purposely weak case on someone to get them lynched.

thanks

I can, will I? No. I'm lazy.

[Hiraki]

You know you don't gain any credibility by insulting my playstyle.

Being to lazy to defend yourself? You realize with 2 potential nigh kills, town is very close to a mylo situation and you don't care to clear yourself. If you are town that's wreckless cause a mislynch is deadly IMO.

You're questioning if I'm town, even though you said that you'd quit this site if I was town.

Hmm.

If links to games are

really

going to clear me, I'd rather play with a monkey, then again I'm questioning myself if I am playing with one.

Ah, you're just ignoring him because he's a claimed PR?

For the time being, also because he's

quite

annoying.

You voted Bill for a while, and then you said that he "honestly wasn't that bad." Explain to me what I've been missing.

You realize that if you're a cop, and you make yourself look scummy, in the end, it's more pro-town then anti-town, correct? Apply that same logic to my situation, and boom.

unvote

VOTE: Hiraki

I don't like "reaction tests" as an excuse for poor cases.
I don't like the nonchalance of your defense.
If your Bill case wasn't serious, and you're not willing to lynch Rob, then you haven't done anything all game.

I believe that's L-2.

1. Excuse. Sigh.

2. So you don't like my tone. Hmmzorz.

3. Can you re-read that sentence? You sound like a whining baby. I have done things all game, and just because I haven't done things that you've wanted me to do, doesn't mean that I have done absolutely nothing.

[Hiraki]

I don't question you are town, I feel it in my core you are scum, but in your mind if you were town, you would want to prevent your lynch because a mislynch would be bad.

you don't even care to

and yes other games is tied to your meta, if you act like this as town,

than that goes to helping clear your name

if you never played like this as town than it doesn't really help.

get it or you still just going to be a troll

I don't question you are town, I feel it in my core you are scum

than that goes to helping clear your name

I don't question you are town, I feel it in my core you are scum

than that goes to helping clear your name

I don't question you are town, I feel it in my core you are scum

than that goes to helping clear your name

THIS IS WHY I DON'T WANT TO TALK TO YOU. THIS IS FUCKING RETARDED.

I can't be a troll if when I defend myself, you come up with the same bullshit, and no real case. According to you, I'm scum because I've never done anything pro-town. OH WAIT, IS THERE SOMETHING IN BETWEEN SCUM AND TOWN? I DUNNO LOL HE'S SCUM ANYWAY.

I'm going to take troll, and quietly never make this mistake again.

P.E.

3. It's got nothing to do with what I do or don't want you to do. You spent all of day 1 defending yourself from Rob and only gave your admittedly half-ass case on Bill after pages of obnoxious exchanges with Rob. You had something of a case on Rob, but it was even less than what you had on Bill. This all might add up to slightly more than nothing, but not much. I'm not seeing where a serious effort to scum hunt figured into your D1 plans.

I guess EA was nothing then. Not like, any point to it.

Not to mention, I've said multiple times now that I wanted Bill to be a reactionary case. It didn't go boom, but it's still a light of my work.

[Hiraki]

Earlier in the round, I frankly took a lot of the Rob v. Hiraki back and forth and a lot of noise that signified...well very little D1. The fact that this continued D2 was a bit annoying...except that I'm becoming more and more annoyed with Hiraki in this regard. If you call this a "defense" Hiraki, I certainly do not. If you would like to take a breath, calm down and actually defend yourself instead of throwing insults you might find us willing to listen. If you can't do that, I'll be more than happy to add my vote...

I don't question you are town, I feel it in my core you are scum

Doubtful. Also, I only throw insults at Rob because he won't stop spitting them at me.

[Hiraki]

I guess EA was nothing then. Not like, any point to it.

Considering the fact that you appeared perfectly happy to park your vote on EA with the remarkably sparse case of "crappola vote" until you took several pages of pressure, I'm not entirely impressed by this example.

And so therefore, I didn't go the easy way and buss Bill because um.

Well umm.

Dunno.

[Hiraki]

Guys. It was sarcasm showing that if I was scum, how bad of a play that was. Only an idiot would actually slip like that. Notice the extra spacing.

[Hiraki]

Yeah. Because I haven't been doing the same thing all game.

[Hiraki]

Guys. It was sarcasm showing that if I was scum, how bad of a play that was. Only an idiot would actually slip like that. Notice the extra spacing.

bussing your partner as scum isn't bad play it's actually smart play, when a person pushes for a wagon on someone and that person flips scum, they almost always earn town cred.

Not really on D2.

Why does your sarcasm indicate that you know Bill is scum as well? Your point would have worked just as well if you replaced "bus" with "BW", but you didn't.

It did? I didn't really get that.

[Hiraki]

It did? I didn't really get that.

You're being intentionally obtuse now. You can't bus a townie, and you specifically said "bus". A townie would have said "BW", because he doesn't know if Bill is scum or not.

No, I wasn't talking about that. I don't really get the deal what one word that would've intentionally looked scummy for the sake of sarcasm, but I don't see how it made it look like I knew Bill well. Unless by "well" you meant his alignment, in which case, it was being used for sarcasm.

[Hiraki]

Losing a scumbuddy is always worse than losing town cred.

I have a one offside game that's a major example of this, but it's over 100 pages. It's a good example because I could've won, being scum, if I hadn't pulled a buss.

[Hiraki]

Losing a scumbuddy is always worse than losing town cred.

I guess that's why you decided not to bus Bill.

I was thinking of using sarcasm here, but I realized the ill effects it had last time.

So there's no doubt in your mind that I'm scum now?

[Hiraki]

I think it's pretty obvious that Bill is pod. But here's my question. What's the point.

[Hiraki]

@Hiraki
So you've concluded that Bill replaced himself, and you have no theories about why or how it might be worth thinking about? That seems extremely implausible to me.

For the record, the idea of Bill replacing himself seems absurd to me, but if it were proven to be true, I'd want him lynched asap.

Do you have any reasoning why someone would randomly start an account in Feb. and join this game, randomly?

Not to mention, he replaced. Do you see newbies replace? How often do alts. replace?

Thinking about it more, I do believe you make a valid point. I was thinking of a different reason for secrecy, but I'm becoming ever so increasingly doubtful of it.

Unvote, Vote: Pod

[Hiraki]

Tbqh, I was almost 99% sure that Bill used most sorry, or something of that nature.

You can't call it pro-town for someone to do this anyway.

[Hiraki]

How am I null? You just called me scum a moment ago.

Mozamis: There's a defense? This is the classic bull that I've attempted to put up with during this game.

[Hiraki]

I'm asking what defense Rob is presenting. The only thing I see is, "lmao. im town tracka. no more defending from this point forward because im town."

[Hiraki]

Missed that one, I'm going to ignore Rob for now because I'm tired.

I was thinking of a town motivation to try and clear his role. I mean he was playing a meh game until then.

Fuck it, I'm going to talk about Rob for two seconds.

1) I never asked you to restate a case on you more than once. AKA: Whenever I have asked you for one, you supplied it, and I tried to talk about it.

2) I've already told you about my Bill case reasoning, but it seems you've missed it or something.

3) I really don't care how fast your wagon gained speed. Using that as a defense is sighful to me.

4) Where is this crap about Subs? I have never seen you once talk about him.

tl;dr: Rob still annoys me.

[Hiraki]

Pressure. I answered the other one somewhere. I'm still sure that it's Bill though.

[Hiraki]

Pressure. I answered the other one somewhere. I'm still sure that it's Bill though.

what i don't understand is why you are voting for pod when you seem convinced Rob is scum?

Head Desk.

Rob:
3) Others do not equate to me.

4) You're bringing stuff from Page 10 up? Seriously?

[Hiraki]

I'm a VT.

That's all.

Pod. You called me scum, then null. So apparently I did something scummy in between that. I wish to know what.

Adios mi Capone.

Sub. I had no tine to answer that question, therefore I didn't.

Here's my conclusions about this game.

Bill/Bill is still scum.
PZ is leaning scum for that vote.
Rob is town because I can't see scum being this anti-town, however it'd be a good, but annoying scum claim.
Bvi is leaning, coming closer really.
AGar is obv. town. I don't really care about Penpen.
mozamis is leaning scum.
Sub, and Barry are town.
And EA is still scum, especially after that awful reaction to my vote.

Btw. leaning scum is more null than anything, I just can't care to edit it out.

[Hiraki]

Nice. I'm calling confirmed scum on Moza now.

[Hiraki]

No, because town would never ask the town their thoughts. Only scum do that.