Mini 1137: Long Overdue Mafia [Game Over!]

[Nachomamma8]

So... it seems my posting in this thread is.

*puts glasses on*

Long overdue.

I'll have a catchup post up in a couple of hours.

[Nachomamma8]

Unvote, Vote: Voidedmafia

will make nice long convincing case in a while when i have sleep.
will not let havinfitz get lynched because he is being classic town-fitz; scumfitz cares a hell of a lot more about his own survival, and doesn't tend to piss people off.

[Nachomamma8]

well i remember when you played scum in my game everyone thought you were protown and glorious because you give analysis but you don't step on toes.
and here everyone hates you, you're not jumping on the easier wagons that they're begging you to, and you're not jumping on the easy target but obvtown, you're pissing people off, and you're bitchin about me lurking.

That's a town having fits if i ever heard one.

[Nachomamma8]

oh god i am tired i should really stop posting here.
but i gotta go to school so stay up for a night i will!
hooray!

[Nachomamma8]

fitz, rhino is givin me a deadline extension to do my thing because it was his birthday and we are friends.
i do remember thinking cecily was odd, so I'll glance at her tomorrow.

but i am about 100% sure voided is scum, enough to fake a guilty so.

[Nachomamma8]

Rather quick with that reveal, aren't you? Maybe YOU'RE worried about your scumbuddy instead?

But then, that raises the question: Why go after me, then, since I haven't really tried to go after you?

...wait...YOU DON'T SAY WHAT YOUR PM TELLS YOU, YOU IDIOT.

Voidedmafia's initial response to the claim, and what makes him confirmed scum.

First off, voidedmafia's already stated that he is not a miller. So, if he was town, he should have realized that there was absolutely no way in hell that pappum's could be telling the truth, and thus should have resulted in him doing one of two things: 1) calling it out as a gambit, or 2) calling pappums confirmed scum.

In voided's response, he does neither of these things. He tries to weakly defect attention onto pappums with the "maybe you're trying to protect your scumbuddy" (which makes absolutely zero sense), and asks "why would you choose me, pappums?". But the nail in his grave is the golden nugget at the end, where Voided clearly believes pappum's claim and tells him that he isn't supposed to quote Role PMs.

He's also afraid to vote pappums even though pappums should be confirmed scum to him. Even after pappums makes a "very suspicious" post, even after Voided is told paranoid/naive cops are impossible, even after all bits of doubt are systematically taken away, he still insists on abstaining from voting pappums. It's like he's afraid to get into a 1 v 1 with him because he knows pappums is going to flip town, and thus he's going to be lynched.

Then, there's voided's neighbor claim. He is told that his power is impossible several times, and yet doesn't back down or "check his role PM". Then, when Jahudo points out there is another "Neighbor" role that has that power, then he finally comes up with Neighborizer.

Then, when he finally DOES vote pappums, he has the following reasoning:

Because he thinks I'm scum and wants me gone. If you'll note, until he unvoted all his posts were about me being scum, and nothing else. I'm not counting RVS or anything before Idiotking confirmed to start the game, mind. After he unvotes me, he gets on Fitz and Jahudo for seeming overeagerness and the gambit suggestion, respectively. But other than that, it's been all me. Perhaps a case of tunneling?

Which still assumes pappums as town. After all, scum don't think that anyone is scum because they know the scum already...

And then, after pappums admits it's a gambit, THEN voided pushes for his lynch. It's like once reassured that pappum's isn't a one-shot cop with a guilty on him, then he's all gungho for the lynch because he knows he's not dead once pappums flips town.

[Nachomamma8]

oh, and fitz? I'm fairly sure that Cecily is a voided scumbuddy. I'll get into why later.

[Nachomamma8]

But, please trust me and vote voided today, so we can take care of Ceily tomorrow.

[Nachomamma8]

We still have three days left. But if we want to lynch scum today, it's important that we move now. I can almost guarantee that fitz and myself are town, and thus lynching either of us will result in a mislynch. I don't plan on voting havingfitz and I will not vote havingfitz because I've already caught scum in voided. We have to give the wagon momentum now; we don't really have time to wait.

[Nachomamma8]

I did? Are you talking pre or post-claim?

Irrelevant.

I've only been here, what, 2-3 months? With only two games completed? You miss that?

Nope. I've also read your two games, and you weren't a VI. You're smart enough to realize that if someone gets a guilty on you and you're town, it means they're lying.

No one has STILL explained why that's not just knee-jerk <_<

It is scum knee-jerk, and that's the problem.

Because I THOUGHT that saying you're a sane cop and not just a cop would be stating your role PM and therefore would be against the rules.

The point is that you believed it even though he claimed a guilty on you.

I've said this already: I'm not one to just lay a vote on like that. Besides, that still would've been OMGUS-y, voting him back, so I also wanted to get more than just an OMGUS to vote him.

So, you didn't vote what should've been confirmed scum because it would be OMGUS-y, and you didn't want to look scummy for voting him? And isn't claiming a guilty on someone you know 100% is town enough of a reason to vote for you?

Because I thought I read it correctly (multiple times. Yes, I did go back to look at my role PM a couple times, don't try to say otherwise). Once Jahudo pointed out the extra role, I super-double-checked the PM (specifically how my role was spelled), and realized I had neighborizer instead of just Neighbor.

I could see you misreading Neighborizer as Neighbor once, sure. But multiple times? Hell no. It's not that hard to read what your role PM says.

It does assume that? Where?

You quoted the explanation as well.

Well, because lying like that was certainly a good reason to lynch.

But him lying about getting a guilty on you wasn't?

1. Do you agree with Rat's reasons for finding me scummy? For finding Fitz scummy?
2. Do you think that rat's gambit was scummy at all?
3. Would you still consider me or Fitz scummy now?
4. If 3 is a no to both, who do you consider scummy?
5. Even if 4 is a yes to one to either, is there anyone else you consider scummy?

1. Already addressed.
2. No. Why would I?
3. Yes, you're scummy, Fitz isn't.
4. You and Ceily are scummy, I don't care about anyone else.
5. Pine is lurky, but no one else really stands out.

[Nachomamma8]

Goddamnit. I've got to learn to stick with my first instincts in this game, and not get swayed at the last minute.

VOTE: Nachomamma8

You're stuck with PR's legacy and massive scum pings. Add on top of that the fact that he nearly succeeded in getting a Townie mislynched, and you helped finish the job, this vote IS NOT MOVING without a compelling reason.

Right. So you're blaming me for "finishing the mislynch of a townie" when you're the one who hammered instead of providing that town case you promised? Here, why don't you do that, so we know it wasn't just a load of bullshit. Also, answer Voided's question. You never got around to it.

Intent to hammer here. But, for now,

Vote: Ceily

What makes you think Pine is scum?

[Nachomamma8]

Present for mike: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 53&t=13466
Sorry, night made me forget.

Present for Pine:

Unvote, Vote: Pine

Three full pages of posting elsewhere and you don't even bother to check here? Come on now, Pine.

Cecily, you leave me waiting with bated breath.

[Nachomamma8]

Requesting a pause on that hammer.

[Nachomamma8]

Rhinox, what result would a tracker receive if he targetted a PR who targetted player A, but that PR was roleblocked? No result, or...?

[Nachomamma8]

This is all hypothetical, neil. I am in no way referring to the game, or asking this question because of an influence of the game.

If it's a false claim, I'll expect Rhinox to say "No comment." or "A tracker would still see the report, or a tracker would see nothing." Most mods are aware of roles, and are willing to tell you how they would interact if they are in the game. For example, cops in my newbie games will always receive a "mafia/not mafia result", and I'd tell the players in the game that regardless of whether there's a cop or not.

tl;dr: Let me work

[Nachomamma8]

Okay, there's quite literally no reason to leave Pine alive anymore.
chkflip, you better hammer when you're all caught up.

Good shots:
Neil, Ceily, chkflip (who's posted less than I am, I think).
Listed in order of goodness.

[Nachomamma8]

UNVOTE: TO

Pine was indeed suspicious, but it has since the beginning, and still is sounding like a townie that may have messed up and is now getting called out on it. Pine's defense did nothing to sway my opinion, but rather furthered it. I'm not sure exactly where to go from here, and I think I have a lot to be rereading on now. I apologize for my lack of activity.

/inb4 lock.
Neil is seriously waffling on Pine at this point.

TO TAKE THE SHOT. FOR JUSTICE.

[Nachomamma8]

Vote: Cecily

She waffled on the Pine wagon yesterday A LOT, which suggests that she was unsure of which position to take on her scumbuddy's wagon. We go from Pine is an inevitable lynch and will die anyways here, to attacking havingfitz for rushing the wagon here. I find this a bit more damning that chkflip's play because he at least was consistent.

PT Barnum, havingfitz, and mike are pretty much confirmed town at this point.

[Nachomamma8]

That's a bad reason to vote, Setael. Why are scum more likely to respond emotionally like that?

Chkflip better be getting replaced, or I'm lynching the hell out of him.

[Nachomamma8]

Bub, I would pretty much prefer your vote being ANYWHERE but there. I seriously just can't see PT being mafia in this situation.

[Nachomamma8]

Okay, so I've done a little bit of recalibrating, and mike really isn't confirmed town. The safest person to claim a tracking result on would be a scumbuddy, so I can't yet rule that out.

Honestly, I'm about 90% sure that our scumteam lies in one of chk and Cecily, then another one out of P.T. and mike. Right now, I'd be inclined to say Cecily and P.T., but I'm sure that will change during ISOs.

[Nachomamma8]

Note: I would much rather lynch from those off the wagon instead of from those on it; Cecily is more obvscum to me than anyone right now. The P.T. votes and mike vote are really things we can take care of tomorrow, and will probably be a good idea to take care of tomorrow.

[Nachomamma8]

ISO'd Cecily. She's town.

PT or chk should be lynched today.

That's an absolutely terrible way to gauge alignment, considering we have flipped scum.

[Nachomamma8]

Going to be back later.

Fitz's response to a tiny bit of pressure sucks.

[Nachomamma8]

By tiny bit of pressure do you mean my being called Faraday's 2nd suspect? What about my response sucked? I don't think my response was any different than it has been to anyone else who has insinuated I'm scum.

"You should know that I'm not scum because you modded that one game." That part of your response sucks.

I'm offline in a few minutes and will not be on again until late Tuesday night at the very earliest. But I'm not interested in switching my vote from Cecily unless it's close to deadline and I don't think the potential lynchee is town.

well deadline is on the day you're back so, that's what I mean. what do you think of chkflip?

Move it from chkflip?

I happy to see the chk wagon growing. So far based solely off of who's being pushed chk/fitz seems like a good pairing. While I don't like judging completely off of who's sticking up for whom I do not see chk as being anything other than aligned with Pine because setael's case was honestly that strong and not going with it was a rookie scum mistake.

And now fitz is pushing me, and I'm still not completely certain what his case is against me and I'm sad he won't be back until deadline to fill me in. It just seems like a perfect grouping of three and since that's the number of anti-town people we've agreed on for this game I'm fairly certain those are the remaining two. And at the very least it's chk and someone who's playing the last role very [and I mean very] cleverly.

Faraday so far has done a good job of putting a pro-town vibe on the slot that PT scummified, although maybe that's just the accent.

So, all of those promises and THIS is the big delivery?

[Nachomamma8]

chkflip, can you explain why you won't post your mythical cecily case until I've posted why I read her as town?

In a nutshell, I had a town read on her from the beginning. She is not at all careful with what she writes in her posts and

has often said things that I think scum would be careful to not say

. I've never gotten a scum read from her posts.

Examples?

[Nachomamma8]

Mod, did you note Faraday's V/LA?

Chk, self-hammering yourself because of shitty play is worse than getting lynched for shitty play. In fact, self-hammering for shitty play is something that seriously pisses me off.

No hammers until Setael comes.

[Nachomamma8]

So instead of waiting and calling for the case, Mike hammers?
Are you kidding me?
Tomorrow, it will be LyLo. Meaning that we'll have to lynch scum back-to-back for the town win.

[Nachomamma8]

Anyways,

@Fitz: To clarify, my top three are PR, you, and Cecily, in that order.

There's exactly one scum in that group.
At this point, I'm about 90% sure it's Cecily, especially when chkflip flips town.
Cecily's scumflip clears fitz.

[Nachomamma8]

Voidedmafia (6) - Jinxx, pappums rat, havingfitz, P.T. Barnum, Xalxe, Cecily

{Faraday, Pine, Cecily} is not a scumteam.
Neither is {havingfitz, Faraday, Pine} a scumteam.

And since there's most likely a scum in Cecily and fitz, this means that Faraday is town.

[Nachomamma8]

Noticing that there was a hell of a lot of block voting between Cecily and Pine, so Cecily's town aswell. Scumbuddies aren't eager to continuously vote next to one another, or even in the same place.

[Nachomamma8]

Oh hai, nacho. Sorry you got stuck with about-to-be-lynched scum. I'm tempted to back off just because I enjoy playing with you.

But I'd rather get down to a one scum game.

UNVOTE: pappums rat
VOTE: nachomamma8

Scum

Xalxe/Pine
jinxx/TO

Leaning scum - (maybe traitor?)

P.T. Barnum

These quotes look pretty incriminating side-by-side.
And I have to say, I don't really like Setael's play after his first post. Pine's self-vote made it seem like he was getting bussed, and Setael fits the perfect definition of someone bussing for towncred.

[Nachomamma8]

On the off-chance chkflip DOES flip scum, then havingfitz is confirmed town.
Those two are NOT scum together.

[Nachomamma8]

Andrew, fitz, and pine were in the not voting column together for a while. Doubt the scumteam would make a party in the not-voting column for that long, especially since it was near the end of the day.

Two scum theory seems stupid to me, especially with a one-shot vigilante.

[Nachomamma8]

Oh.

Unvote, Vote: havingfitz

then.

[Nachomamma8]

What hours are you at school?

[Nachomamma8]

So it's like 9 pm over there right now?
Can you post that Cecily case?

Bub, that doesn't necessarily clear her. Pine's self-voting guarantees that there's at least one scum on his wagon, and I really wouldn't be surprised if they decided to bus during the night. Also, she wasn't really instrumental in getting him lynched after her first pine post. Reread her ISO, and point out where she commented on Pine after the initial post.

Fitz being scum is a new thing for me so you'll have to give me a little bit of time to make a case. But the thing that irks me most is his response to Faraday, where he says "you should know I'm town because you modded my only scum games". There's also the pine-fitz interactions, which look pretty damn scummy to me.

[Nachomamma8]

Whoops, went the wrong way.
But I'm going to build the havingfitz case now, and I suggest you build your Cecily case. We don't have much time to change things around if you don't want to be lynched today, unfortunately.

[Nachomamma8]

Well, there's 8 alive right now.
I'm decently convinced that chkflip is town.
I would much rather no-lynch, but the numbers at 7 alive, and then get my fitz lynch.

I'm sure we could drum up enough support, but I'm not quite sure how I feel about lynching him without a claim.

[Nachomamma8]

My assumptions aren't ignoring that possibility at all.

Have you looked at the latest stuff on fitz?

[Nachomamma8]

Why not?
Do you believe that chkflip is scum still?

[Nachomamma8]

Cecily, I knew you were town

[Nachomamma8]

Rhinox, this was a fucking beautiful setup. Although, I feel it would've been pretty damn hard to find a goon buddy by neighborization.

NEIL I AM SORRY I HAVE BEEN PARANOID OF YOU LATELY AFTER THAT BLITZ.

Faraday
You calling Setael bestfriend was </3

[Nachomamma8]

With an innocent on havingfitz? No.
With an innocent on anyone else? Yes.

I'd like to think I would've caught that three one-shot powerroles and no real town powerroles would be something odd, but I honestly doubt I would.