I've read everything, but am not ready to vote quite yet.
So far, I'll point
Agreed, but I think it depends not only on whether MG is town, but if he true claimed. Also, has anyone considered taking MG's offer to use his vig?Nai wrote: If MG comes up town, PBuG is one of those I'd look at. While I've been against MG from the beginning of this wagon, PBuG has been pushing for it hard. And no, I don't think they can be the same alignment.
Me too, but I'm always worried about that, which is why I don't do much analysis of potential future lynches until we find out the results of the current lynch...it's possible that we're completely wrong, which could change everything.Nai wrote: I just wonder if we're being set up for a double-bad lynch?
Agreed. Your idea mirrors mine, but I thought I'd ask to see if anyone had any other ideas.Elias_the_thief wrote: on who? besides our case against MG, we dont really have a strong case to kill someone else without further discussion. so if MG's claim is true, we'd essentially be making a random lynch, and since there are more town than mafia, the odds of hitting scum as opposed to town are very slim. i dont think that's a risk i'm willing to take right now.
These are not the droids I'm looking for? O RLY? Thanks for the advice, but I'll leave my vote where it is.Thestatusquo wrote: I won't be getting lynched today whether you vote me or not, so I would advise you put votes somewhere that they are useful.
Your behavior is not “no benefit to the town.” It is detrimental to the town. The two are not the same, even though you would like them to be. As has been pointed out multiple places, it is quite possible that your behavior is not as a result of you being scum...but that is not the same as your behavior not being scummy.Thestatusquo wrote: There are a lot of things which have no benefit to the town, and yet are not scummy.
Protown people lie for aPBuG wrote: TSQ - Damn, you're good.
All - TSQ lies, both as town and scum, get used to it. LAL is not a valid argument, protown people lie all the time.
Well, aside from my pointing out that adding noise makes it more difficult to detect signal and also pointing out that while townThestatusquo wrote: Explain to me how it's detrimental to the town. No one has been able to do that.
Wrong yet again. Even if you were town, which I doubt, you’re a mindless distraction: spam, piffle, claptrap. You add nothing and muddy the waters. It would, therefore, be quite wise to lynch you.Thestatusquo wrote: If I do it both as town and scum, then it would be really dumb of you to lynch me for it, so dealing with it is pretty much your only option.
And your wisdom is truly a credit to the board. Thank goodness you’re here.Thestatusquo wrote: Don't you tell me to leave a site that I've been playing on for about 234234x as long as you.
Not sure why I seem too eager. I got here at the start of the MG wagon, and I never jumped on, because I thought the claim was slightly more plausible than not. Turns out it was good, so I looked at who was pushing the wagon, and PbuG and TSQ looked a little scummy, as did Panzerjager’s hammer.Elias_the_thief wrote: Stuff bout Jingolaw: im not keen on how you've acted since you've jumped in. you seem too eager to lynch.
Answer (in the very next sentence!):PBug wrote: Not-quite-claiming? Where the hell did you get that?
I’m still chuckling about that one!PBuG wrote: The last time I said anything about my own role was my first post of the day where I suggested I claim.
Not exactly. It does look like I’m saying that, though, so my fault for not being clearer. I meant that you drew my suspicion by defending TSQ for a bad reason, then after I had re-analyzed your posting history, it made more sense that you were SK rather than scumbuddy to TSQ.PBuG wrote: You're voting me for a connection to TSQ when you think you've got me pegged as an SK. Wha?!?
I think you’re right, here…he’s posted other places. Could be he forgot about the game, though.PBuG wrote: bird might be lurking on purpose since he hasn't been replaced.
That’s all well and good, but remember I think (and you suspected at one point) that PbuG is SK..so we don’t need a rational relationship between FoS and kills. SK wins by staying alive no matter which side would otherwise win, so literally random kills benefit SK early on.CoG888 wrote: As for pbug, I did not mean that I expected to see one of his FOSes die, but that I expected some logical connection between the dead and those he called out on day one. I guess what I am saying is I am trying to rationalize the deaths and I don't see motivation for pbug killing either Nai or IH... And not because they were not good targets, but because their were others that seemed more likely targets....
agreed.Panzerjager wrote: ...you can be scum no matter where the kills goes.
Exactly. So why wouldn’t the SK nail a suspected townie for the possible win?CoG888 wrote: We could be at lynch or lose today, depending on the number and type of killers.
Or, of course, that with a one-shot vig (who becomes town thereafter) we can get a free shot at scum...if we miss, we at least have a better idea that MG is, in fact, vig (and now town), and therefore stay even. As a vig who claims to save himself, one would have to expect some proof would be demanded by the town, no? I wasn’t asking to personally direct the vig...that WOULD be scummy. What I did was open the possibility of allowing town to benefit both by proof of the one-shot vig’s veracity and also by having the option to nail more scum (or at least put additional pressure on suspected scum).CoG888 wrote: The first thing that jumps out at me is your desire to direct MG's one shot kill. That really sounds like you wanted another kill for the night: MG's vig, your own kill, and the scum kill.
My reasons for voting Shea are well documented (despite the crash), as are my reasons for unvoting. I don’t vote because of the possibility of successful lynches; I vote because of the possibility of successfully lynching scum. TSQ looked scummy (as you agreed), so I pounced hard to see his reaction...I think it worked out well. TSQ has a plausible role, and is at least partially confirmed. I think TSQ is town. If I just wanted a lynch, I would have kept my vote on. I’m not sure how jumpingCoG888 wrote: Next up is you joining the first TSQ bandwagon and hopping off when it was apparent that he wasn't going to be lynched (yet).
I brought it up because I think I’m right. I think you said the same in a post lost in the crash, but I’ll let that line of reasoning die, as I think it’s too easy to lie about the crash. Fair enough?CoG888 wrote: Then you vote for pbug, and when I semi-defended him, you claim that I proposed he was the serial killer (in post 307). I never said that. In fact, you have brought up the topic of serial killer in 3 of your posts prior to that, while the only time I ever mentioned it was in post 241 when I was considering different alignments that TSQ might have.
Huh. I’m seeing less of a PbuG-Panzer link, and more a PbuG-CoG link.CoG888 wrote: Jingolaw: I have a hunch that pbug is not one of our killers. Mostly based on who he was voting and FOSing yesterday, and who turned up dead this morning. Of course I could be wrong... I could be blind to something obvious, but pbug is seeming pro-town to me... aggressive, but town none the less.
Panzerjager wrote: Jingo, I would like you to answer this before you even think about anything else. How am I scum and How am I remotely related to PbuG?
This is almost certainly a lie. Everyone, please examine your roles. Do you see Skruffs as the sort of mod who would give out a vanilla townie role in this game? No ability at all, PbuG? You dig your own grave deeper and deeper with every post, PbuG.PBuG wrote: I'm fairly useless, and thus, have no ability.
Yup. Pretty much.PBuG wrote: ...but that's what happens when scummy people claim townie.
That’s pretty much it; I did, in fact forget that this was a “normal” game. Think about it: there was a one-shot vig, a one-shot blanket immunity, and at least one hint that powers change or evolve from day to day...that’s not “TSQ wrote: ...as he seems to have forgotten this is a normal game (or forgotten it on purpose.)
I think you’re misinterpreting what was asserted. If you reread the whole paragraph, I think you’ll see that my position matches yours. I was defending against CoG’s argument that I seemed scummy because I placed a vote on a player who would almost certainly not be lynched. I defended, arguing that I place my vote on someone who I think is scum, regardless of whether I think that player will, in fact, be lynched. I think we’re on the same page on this, Fircoal.Fircoal wrote: Even if they look like they aren't going to be lynched but they are the scummiest why not vote for them? that sounds scummy to me. IF you don't vote for who is scummy, how can we lynch scum?
Because I don’t buy PBuG’s claim? I’m “far” scummier? Please. You’re looking worse every post. Not, of course, nearly as bad as PBuG, so I won’t knee-jerk a vote for you, CoG, because that would be...you know...CoG888 wrote: Jingolaw is far scummier then anyone else to me right now.
QFT.PBuG wrote: Okay, I'll give you that, I've played like shit and SHOULD have been lynched already.
Believe it or not, I’m leaning that way, too. If PBuG comes up SK, I’ll be less sure, but if he comes up scum, I’m increasingly convinced that CoG is scum, too. CoG’s doing way too much PBuG-defending...much more than PBuG, himself, actually. CoG’s also way too anxious for a claim.TSQ wrote: TBH I do not like the cog-pbug-jingalo interraction at all. I think there is at least 1 scum in that group, and I find it very likely that there's 2.
Wow, a defense of CoG,PBuG wrote: Jingolaw, it was a reasonable to request a claim, you're 2 from lynch.
OfPanzerjager wrote: Um, At this point I think either PBuG is scum or Jingo is scum, and I'd like a claim from jingo, and why do I look scummy now, because I'm on to you?
You’ll notice that I predicated my suspicion of CoG on his link with PBuG. It seemed that GoG was defending PbuG unduly, making me think he was a scumbuddy...this, of course, requires PbuG to be scum, and he turned out not to be, so I’m considerably less sure about CoG now. If only I had said something like that a week ago. Oh, wait, I did!panzerjager wrote: I find it funny Jingo is not saying anything about you after ,just a week ago, thinking you were scum.
Next sentence:Jingolaw wrote: If PBuG comes up SK, I’ll be less sure, but if he comes up scum, I’m increasingly convinced that CoG is scum, too.
There are, in fact, plenty of reasons for my vote on you. Many have also been expressed by others: your eagerness to vote (or hammer, even) and your baseless flip-flopping, for instance. I’ll direct you to posts 421 and 478 for my earlier, clear, and unmistakable accusations of you. It comes as no surprise that you “don’t like” my vote on you, but saying that “there is absolutely no reason for it other that I placed it quickly” is, indeed, a bit of a surprise.Panjerjager wrote: I also don't like his vote on me because there is abosolutely no reason for it other then I placed it quickly.
Except for the detailed and specific defenses I offered in posts 431 and 471, you mean. Granted, you may have missed two earlier posts of mine lost in the crash wherein I defended against Elias_the_thief’s suspicions, but I think 431 and 471 should be sufficient to show that you are in error.Panzerjager wrote: He never offered a defense to us thinking he was at all summy [sic].
I’m not sure how apparent it is to everyone, but many could suspect your links and not yet have expressed their suspicions. We don’t need to ponder that, however, as Elias, Nai, and PbuG have all openly expressed their concerns that you had links to players other than CoG (posts 192, 157 & 202, and 141, repectively). This doesn’t count suspicion of links to CoG, and keep in mind that we lost a lot in the crash.Panzerjager wrote: He accused me of being linked with PBuG when it's apparent to everyone in this game that the only person I've been remotely to is CoG.
Panzerjager wrote: After that the thing I'm connected to is logic.
Immediately? It was so immediate, that it actually occurredPanzerjager wrote: After TSQ came was revived, He immediately came off him which is suspicious because he was so convinced that TSQ was scum before the revival.
Sorry, this is too tedious to do sentence by sentence, but let me try to explain this. Retrospectively, we know PbuG was the Serial Killer. Earlier in the game, when I suspected him, I said that logic would dictate that the SK should kill townies. PbuG told us how (much like O.J.!) he was not the SK, but if hePanzerjager wrote: Another cute thing I noticed, He said that he assumed that PBuG is trying to win by nailing a townie after PBuG clearly stated "If I were SK I'd be aiming for mafia." The guy doesn't seem to be following along quite well, which to me is scummy. Why would someone who isn't scummy miss something on his suspect? He is lynching people on halfassed suspicions which is only good to do as scum.
Panzerjager wrote: Jingolaw has acted proscum all game.
BINGO.Jack wrote: pj and cog contradict eachother. One of them has to be scum. They have both claimed, so what purpose does mass claim serve? None.
I saw PbuG, andSkruffs wrote: To be honest, I am both perplexed and understanding of Jingolaw's play. He saw PBug - and pbug alone - target Nai night one, but barely mentioned it - and helped lynch TSQ day two instead.
Why, Jingo? Why??
I'm assuming that you were afraid of being nightkilled - however, you could have helped town a lot by outing yourself for an even trade.