DBZ: Cell Games [Over]

[Bell]

Woah this started early.

[Bell]

So it sounds like we have voting phase where we select the two scummiest players and then they duke it out in the arena and with the power of friendship one wins while the other loses?

[Bell]

Oh my god, Fire taking the spirit of Mr. Satan and running with it is just the best.

FB is obv town. Even if their role pm is red. <3 <3 <3.

[Bell]

VOTE: BattleMage

Wheeee

[Bell]

No, it's just an ego out of hydra post before they post in game. Ego because they're projecting their individual egos before fusing into a kookiemonster.

Grats on the title Noraa.

[Bell]

Big theme xenoblade.

[Bell]

I demand that Noraa be town this game so that I can work with her for once.

No, I'm starting to realize my actual super townie posts only come after a scum flip or two for info and then the words get flowin'

[Bell]

bell scum with flea most likely

This feels like a new approach for you. But feels like old hat for me. Usually I do what you're doing minus the associations because associations are for the best players only with the best reads only.
I'm not scum partners with anyone this game.

@Noraa: it actually sounds like you did roll town this game.
That's fantastic.

[Bell]

VOTE: Guillotina

[Bell]

They sound like they're exasperated with how much they rolled scum and that they didn't roll scum here.

In other words, it has the *ring* of truth. Which I'm not disinclined to ignore. You can push them I guess, but to me you missed the context or the tone of the post in exchange for a more or less, less detailed analysis of her post. What you seem to see as a slip up, isn't.

[Bell]

...I'm inclined to think they're town because they sound like they're telling the truth. Is what I meant to say.

[Bell]

...I'm inclined to think they're town because they sound like they're telling the truth. Is what I meant to say.

So it's a gut feeling? and you are willing to buddy them up based on a gut feeling, correct?

1. Yes.
2. No, I'm not buddying them.

[Bell]

I'm not sure entirely what happens to the person that comes out.
It might be be a revolving door type situation or sunk cost fallacy. Or something inbetween.

We should definitely nom FB first just because that WOULD be the most fun.

[Bell]

No, I'm starting to realize my actual super townie posts only come after a scum flip or two for info and then the words get flowin'

I was digging the your entrance until I got to this post. I don't have the impression from any game of yours that I've read or heard about or spectated or whatever that you had trouble projecting town before a couple scumflips. Is that a recent development?

I just think it becomes easier. See my recently completed Guns and Roses game.
I became less of a target and became strongest non-confirmed TR only after we had 2 scum flips and I could start actually doing association analysis.
Maybe I should say it's simply easier, less work, less open for interpretation etc.

[Bell]

I have BM, Bell, Guillotina, and kookiemonster as town rn
VOTE: Dunnstral
I wanna push this for that FB vote on the first page, what was up with the fake multi-vote crap?

That is a lot of townreads in three hours.

Why do you have me as town?

How many townreads did you have around this point? How many do you think is reasonable?

I think asking why other people have you as town is a common scum tell

I do this all the time as town tho.

[Bell]

I have BM, Bell, Guillotina, and kookiemonster as town rn
VOTE: Dunnstral
I wanna push this for that FB vote on the first page, what was up with the fake multi-vote crap?

That is a lot of townreads in three hours.

Why do you have me as town?

How many townreads did you have around this point? How many do you think is reasonable?

I think asking why other people have you as town is a common scum tell

I do this all the time as town tho.

classic scum mistake

Just more proof I'm terrible scum.

[Bell]

That must be Mom posting. Because Nerocain would never vote me,
right?

[Bell]

My god if it's that easy though. It's practically a flea trust tell. XD

[Bell]

I just think it would be funny if you were scum this game and you just kinda post totally differently as different alignments.

[Bell]

I fucking knew it.

[Bell]

VOTE: Flea

Sure.

[Bell]

I am not a robot.

[Bell]

I was referring to akarin and DGB mostly who were pretty luke warm on me until the last day.
I wasn't talking about my reads being good or anything, merely that my position was more solid.

[Bell]

sounds about right.

[Bell]

iill lock nora as town now though final answer

I feel fine with my vote so far.

[Bell]

Eh, I disagree with Titus that Flea is town here.

[Bell]

I don't think how Flea is responding to pressure is very townie.
If they are town, I am bad at mafia.

[Bell]

Hmm to the Oil Tycoon intervention.
372
What about this post is obvious town?
It's asking for evidence, Stating what they're here for and then stating BM is scum with no real elaboration.

[Bell]

I don't think how Flea is responding to pressure is very townie.
If they are town, I am bad at mafia.

I am bad at mafia btw. So, take it with a grain of salt.

[Bell]

Expect me to have random quotes above my head at least once per game when I'm catching up.

[Bell]

I don't think how Flea is responding to pressure is very townie.
If they are town, I am bad at mafia.

Le gasp! Phone post!

How would you expect me to respond here?
That I am aware of I have countered the points made against me, expressed my feelings on the matter and formed a decent case of my own returning the pressure which is going mostly uncountered.

With derision.

[Bell]

Limited Access till Thursday.

Sugar cain seems like town to me! I'm sure somebody already said that but as long as I don't read it, ignorance-technically, I was the first to notice and therefore am extremely townie for noticing their townieness.

[Bell]

Hi Mastina!

[Bell]

see my scum experience with bell is hes lazy lurker scum, and what I get from those two bell posts is potential TMI that I'm town or that bell can't trust his own reads.

Bell did I do something to you? or one of your friends?

Ew.
No I have a bed bug infestation at my grandma's house.
I still think you're scum, sugarkain is town and
Guillotine's is disappointing regardless of alignment.

[Bell]

wow that post went weird.

i'm not super motivated for this atm, too much of the "I think you're scum but i'll never vote you coz i love you" crap alongside the "i am gonna rage and be a jerk to you" crap. I'm fine volunteering to be on the chopping block as long as I get to pick the opponent - does that sound fair?

This isn't fair to me because I'm town this game and I think you're town this game so 1v1ing is a 50% higher chance of miseliminating than both participants being scum.

I have a little time for this since I moved.

[Bell]

Wait is flea taking the votes on him personally?
That's concerning for my scum read of his slot.
though I don't know why he's just thinking that we don't like him or something.
I like Flea.

[Bell]

Wait is flea taking the votes on fae personally?
That's concerning for my scum read of faer slot.
though I don't know why fae's just thinking that we don't like faer or something.
I like Flea.

ftfy.

Thank you, sorry. I mean nothing by it.

Uhh, I'm not scum partners with anyone in this game so Oil tycoon is also not partners with me.
Also, please, for my sanity don't try to full solve the game. with partners before flips etc.
It never works.

[Bell]

No, we just throw one person into the ring then we throw anothr person into the ring.

It's one at a time.

[Bell]

Wait is flea taking the votes on fae personally?
That's concerning for my scum read of faer slot.
though I don't know why fae's just thinking that we don't like faer or something.
I like Flea.

ftfy.

Thank you, sorry. I mean nothing by it.

Uhh, I'm not scum partners with anyone in this game so Oil tycoon is also not partners with me.
Also, please, for my sanity don't try to full solve the game. with partners before flips etc.
It never works.

But I have maps

I checked my role pm and it says I'm town and I have no scum partners.
So your map is a forgery or you drew it yourself. With doodles.

[Bell]

Flea and then I dunno.

[Bell]

poking is too aggressive i prefer to whisper gently in their ears "are you scum"

I'm town. I hope this helps you on your journey!

[Bell]

Is the flea wagon not happening because fae's just semi-active or was there some other reason?

[Bell]

Fair.

[Bell]

About to go to the doctor's
and I noticed a push by noraa that pretty much solidified them into my town block even if they're wrong about guilotina because it's super off beat for Noraa to push like this as scum, imo.

[Bell]

What is guilotina at?

[Bell]

I was always solidly in the town block.
*kicks bell*

-nornorisobvtown

Your comfort is only my concern when I'm scum.

[Bell]

Sure,
would you like to claim Guilotina?
I'm pretty much just getting swept into their confidence plus a light omgus from my position honestly.

[Bell]

That's fine by me BM.
I don't have much of an opinion on Oil.
I'm not sure if Nacho would stomp on you like that as scum tho. though, drunk posts, maybe not the best way to interpret somebody.

[Bell]

Im going to wait for Guillo to flip but after he flips scum, im going to be looking hard into these defenders.

-norberabear

Nornor, demanding obedience is not nice I like to use my brain and I don't really like to sheep people unless I strongly agree with them.
It's day 1, I don't even agree with myself yet.

[Bell]

I had a few hot secs where I was certain flea was scum but faer's recent posting is not scum indicative for them ... AT ALL.

-norbirb

that's really not the same thing.

[Bell]

I actually don't agree that Oil is scum.
I just also don't disagree.
Because reading people is hard.

[Bell]

G has like 3 votes now. Dunno why we didn't just finish off oil first before we split the vote but not everyone can be competent

This hurts my feelings but is true so I'll let you off this time.
*shakes fist*

[Bell]

sigh, if you guys shut up about it I'll yeet oil into the arena.

[Bell]

Claims can come later. get people in the 1vs1.

oil vs guillo, lets go.

But Fae,
I wanted you to be in there.

[Bell]

I am voting you.
I tried convincing people, two whole times!

[Bell]

Bell, I'm convinced, but we also need a majority first, and Oil is closer.

Flea and Noraa are just posturing on a vanity wagon for no reason

BM, if there's one thing you'll learn about me, it's that I don't do sides good.
Nobody wagons people for no reason.

[Bell]

Doctor's appointment.
I know ya'll are excited to get the blood sport started, but I gotta do what I gotta do.

BBL.

[Bell]

I'm gunna do due dilligence on Oil and probably reach the wrong conclusion anyway.
My initial feeling of resistance just comes from the argument that the loudest voices are getting town read while Oil had a dip in activity due to their own stuff to deal with and Syrana is also dealing with stuff.
In other words, I'm fairly sure that the only reason their wagon is actually viable is because they're preoccupied.
If they were here, as either alignment they would shed their wagon.

Also, if everyne agrees they're scum their scum partner is als agreeing that they're scum. Though, that's not exactly controversial.
I guess this stance bites me in the ass if they actually are scum or if I choose incorrectly here but oh well.

[Bell]

K, I read all their posts and to say it plainly I see almost nothing that gives me actual pause.

[Bell]

Why are you reading Oil as scum?
What have they done, that to you seems definitively, like a scum post or a scum agenda?

[Bell]

@Everyone but me.

[Bell]

Can I change your mind on fae?
I'll get to reading your case against them.

[Bell]

I'm confused on Guilotine.
Sorry, you're seeing me catch up in real time.
I don't mean to be frustrating, that's just how I am.

[Bell]

I want to know what Guiltotina's plans are since they're all but claiming a valuable power role.
Unless I'm misinterpreting.

[Bell]

Yeah, but I'm basically being told Oil is scum but don't see anything explicitly scummy in their iso.
I'm also town so my resistance is just me being me. I get the soft distancing argument but it's creating an explanation for a pheonomena that has multiple other plausible explanations.
Everything from favoritisism, to they seem kind of busy irl, to they don't seem super scummy to I have a much better scum read guyz-Nornor. etc.

[Bell]

Yeah I know, I wasn't being super clear.
I'm just pointing out that there are a lot of fairly obvious not scum-team coordinated explanations for an oil wagon stall.

[Bell]

Yeah, but I'm basically being told Oil is scum but don't see anything explicitly scummy in their iso.
I'm also town so my resistance is just me being me. I get the soft distancing argument but it's creating an explanation for a pheonomena that has multiple other plausible explanations.

Everything from favoritisism, to they seem kind of busy irl, to they don't seem super scummy to "I have a much better scum read guyz"-Nornor. etc

.

[Bell]

I don’t really see them relying on personal connections, it might be slowing their wagon down but I see very little like intentional connection pulling.

Inactivity is hard to place between just being busy and being scum. /:
For example, i’ Town but my activity is fairly low because my grandparents house has a bug infestation and I live with them so thayvtook a lot. Plus doctor visit for employee evaluation testing etc.

[Bell]

It’s hard to determine the difference between a soft distance and just genuine honesty but their reads confidence.
I feel bad and like I suck for being a nay sayer here.

[Bell]

Mastina, can you give me one game Day for old times' sake?

How is this not relying on personal connections, particularly when mastina unvotes for that reason?

Oh.
Yeah that’s blatant I missed that.

[Bell]

Mastina, can you give me one game Day for old times' sake?

How is this not relying on personal connections, particularly when mastina unvotes for that reason?

Oh.
Yeah that’s blatant I missed that.

Vote Oil with me?

It’s not actually scummy to connection pull.

[Bell]

[quote="In post 1091, Flea The Magician"]Yeah, and look how long it took to get something going for 1 wagon. there's 3 viable options, we got 4 days to work out an opponent if we get one locked in.

What do you think about the other two people voting you?

[Bell]

Oh he did.

Correctly too, I'm not interested in the fae not all not ever

Phone’s gunna die.
I’d just like to hear a lot about people
:
Opinions about flea tbh.

Waiting in line for a covid shot. (The line is literally half the length of the park. Literally a quarter mile.
Yikes.

[Bell]

Excuse me, they might be shitty reasons, but they’re MY shitty reasons.

@flea so you think that BM and I have or contain one scum while being the primary pushers of your wagon while the later votes are fine?

[Bell]

You said that you wanted to vote in a pool of four.
Two of these players have been pushing you.

I asked you, how you felt about the other two votes on your wagon and demurred. I did not put words in your mouth because I had a question mark attached. I was asking if my interpretation was correct.

[Bell]

I like this game tbh.
It’s fast and spammy but there are a lot of good things about it too.

I’m surprised flea got eliminated at all if this is how he posted in among us. I stopped reading the second I died because eternal shame.

[Bell]

If this is how fae*

Sorry.

[Bell]

i said I wanted to work with Noraa this game, not work for her. /:

[Bell]

My Head is in the game with a Titus tr, sugar kain tr, BM TR, Noraa TR.

I’m currently struggling iwith guillotine’s townie confidence in themselves if they’re scum.
Noraa almost swept me away with pure confidence.

I’m weak to flea aTE tbh.

I was going back and forth on whether Mastina was scum this game based on slight changes to posting style.
I wasn’t wondering if this might’ve been nacho lurkscum but I didn’t want to push.

FB is lovely.
I’m sorry that something bad happened syrana. *hugs*

In other words my head is everywhere.

[Bell]

IC = innocent child = a player confirmed by the mod to be aligned with the town.

[Bell]

Sure.
Gamma sounds fairly similar but is relatively inactive so I can’t get much of a bead there.

Sb9 is just on v/la so I have no opinion.
Dunstral is a quip machine of some kind this game. I have not played with dunnstrall I scum read him recently, but, nope he was still town.

[Bell]

I outright missed the mwnn rep out. So I haven’t thought about it.

[Bell]

what if mastina is one of the evil people.
a cell junior in disguise as krillin

Already scum reading them for the dumbest reason imaginable.
Because their posts look different and they seem to be reading people for slightly different reasons than I'm used to seeing them read people with.

[Bell]

Wanna talk out some of the others with me?

Noraa - certainly talks a lot. Not AI for her. Seemed happy at the start of the early game, not sure if she can fake that as scum now. Didn't like the doublevoting thing. Reminds me of Death Scroll fuckery.
Sugar Kain - No experience with either head recently. Your thoughts?
BM - Definitely different from both games I've experienced with him. Not sure what that says about his alignment this game. Nacho has a serious hate on (scumread) for him, but I'm unconvinced. Wouldn't mind having a conversation with him.
Mastina - have completely outsourced this read to Nacho for reasons. What's off to you?
Flea - Nacho has a hard townread here and I haven't seen anything from faer to make me want to effort disagreeing with him. Mind, last time I talked to him was last weekend. You're thinking town too?

Guillo - Everyone's got a hate on for this guy but I haven't seen a good reason why. He needs to let go of the Noraa thing and talk to cooler heads though.

1. okay.
2. I have recentish experience with both Nero and Mom, though Mom died pretty quickly after replacing in. I personally liked their push against me and TR it. Just seemed like a gut read or something.
3. Well, he's pretty available.
4. Literally, just post composition and the flow is different, they say they're just having a hard time getting good reads/scum reads, but I'm skepticalish. It wouldn't surprise me if I was wrong here though, I don't have much mastina exp because I tend not to read her posts fully or in depth analyze her positions. I also think my default position on her is to scum read her for tone and then town read her for her dynamic reads.
5. No, I think scum but I'm waffling due to Flea aTe.
Guilotina: Guilotina is just difficult for me in part because they're fairly performative and I can't tell what's going on under the hood really.

[Bell]

Bell go make a real read on me and stop blaming my "AtE" otherwise you'll have been ATE by me!

I'm weak to aTe though, i'm not actually trying to discred you with this line. I'm stating that when folk start gettin' mad, Bell town starts gettin' sad and starts to waffle.

Eh, I find it really difficult to read Dunnstral when he's UTR but he's often UTR as town too, so I don't actually think much of it.

[Bell]

Oh, I'm definitely fence sitting.
I'm pretty much playing Devil's advocate and trying as hard as possible not to budge for no more reason than because, I think that's a good idea inexplicably. I'm honestly not sure how I'll catch scum this game if I ever do.
What I'm saying is that I roughly agree with FB.
I'm not taking a hard stance on either Oil or Guilotine for previously stated reasons. For Oil, I just don't see anything horrifically scummy.
For Guilotine, soft claim+Townie confidene in themselves+confusing playstyle pretty much leaves me stuck.

[Bell]

I am however sitting on a fence in the middle of highway traffic, which I don't actually think I'd do as scum here.
Rather, I'm making myself pretty available when my instinct would usually be to lurk, be passive asf and then die for playing like shit as scum.

[Bell]

I am however sitting on a fence in the middle of highway traffic, which I don't actually think I'd do as scum here.
Rather, I'm making myself pretty available when my instinct would usually be to lurk, be passive asf and then die for playing like shit as scum.

i am not paranoid of u yet. But u do seem hyper self aware. Which is weird.

This is my normal state. I am always self-aware and usually have to stop myself from creating paradoxes.

Twice I have started writing about the fact that I checked to see how many scum are in this game only to find out that there isn't a clear number (prolly 2-4) and that Unwnd didn't rule out third party roles.
I also know that people get extremely pinged when someone starts bringing up 3-P because scum are or tend to be more focused on it and I've had to stop myself from making such posts before as scum because it actually seems to be a temptation to share and speculate about 3p as scum more often than town do it.

So I didn't write about it because why include it and create unnecessary confusion, get myself sucm read for mentioning it, and pretty much have no evidene that it's the case.
But you see, I just wrote it but would I write it out and submit it if I were scum because it would draw suspicion and ping people likely if I submitted this post?

And that's hyper-self-aware-town-Bell.
I'm also hyper-self-aware as scum, but because I try to get town read as town I'm usually just pretty self-aware overall.

I probably wouldn't send this if I were scum. But I'm just feeding you context.
Also, please don't discuss 3P until there's like, a reason to.
Which I have no idea when if ever there's a good time for that because I'm a noob.

[Bell]

gnight, take care of yourself Fae.

[Bell]

For a game this active with this many posts, targeting people who are having a hard time keeping up as scum seems really misguided.

-j

Could you reword, I don't understand what you mean.

I should probs mention that Fb's recent posts have tilted them into my town pile.

[Bell]

I think im gonna pull a titus and play from like a few pages back each day

Im trying so damn hard to save ur scummy ass. Please stop being dumb like this. You're on the chopping block cuz of dumb stuff like this -________-

1) you better be town otherwise im going to be mad
2) you better get into the game

-hmphydoodles

OMG there is hope, she is starting to see it.

This is a stretch.

[Bell]

also, Gamma wagon out of nowhere, classic.

[Bell]

I'm on weekend V/LA until evening of 11th Jan

A scum claim(this is a joke, don’t @me mod)

[Bell]

I don't like you treating me like a child, drunk or not.

fuck....how old are you?? I'm not your dad. if you get drunk and act like a fool, that's entirely your responsibility

Classic battle Mage post.

[Bell]

How do I arm twist the entire town to get my way without the arm twisting part which is violent and I frown upon violence.
Also I like that there have been four wagons. Which is good info for later.
Maybe.
If the scum team are bad, maybe.

[Bell]

It isn’t a very good one. But yeah.
I don’t like it because it’s a vague wagon.
I iso’d him, But his posts aren’t spectacular. Not enough for me to go wild and yell at people for it. dunno his game load tho.

[Bell]

I respect guil’s effort if they’re scum this game.

[Bell]

Oh, I dunno what you expect from me in rvs. I’m basically gunna read people for whatever’s available.
Part of it is just to generate discussion.

It’s not like she’s town forever because I thought she was town at the beginning. Reads are fluid. Did you think my reads wouldn’t change later? I don’t see your reason for umbridge/suspicion for an early read.

[Bell]

That she’s starting to “see it” or anything really. Asking for activity isn’t really an indication of mind changing.

[Bell]

Is anyone even scum reading me anymore.

Pedit: ah, but he’s vacation chill posting. I really don’t expect content until he gets back from it.

[Bell]

Ah shit. I scum slipped @dunnstrall: have mercy.

[Bell]

There's to much to read. Maybe if everyone stopped posting

I can do this. But only if you promise to town read me and never stop.

[Bell]

nah flea, i'm not interacting with you because you're making the game a complete chore for me, and I'm respecting the request from other players that I don't continue to indulge your behaviour at the expense of any other slots being looked at. your approach to me is objectively bad-faith, and anti-town, and if there's a majority of players bad enough to sheep you on it, I'm fine with dying. I'm only continuing playing in the vain hope that eventually you'll give it a rest and do something useful.

Amazing post if scum.

[Bell]

heh, what is it if town?

It makes sense.

[Bell]

There's to much to read. Maybe if everyone stopped posting

I can do this. But only if you promise to town read me and never stop.

Wish I could, our experience together was too brief. I can see some play parallels though

Pedit: I know what I have seen, and what my partner has told me. I also saw you removed yourself from the tunnel like titus had asked. I did see the initial post where you scum read him and I do remember it being super off base for someone you apparently know inside and out

That’s fine. It’s hard to contain my enthusiasm and posting when I roll town tbh. I was busy when the game started. I haven’t been eliminated during a day phase as town since I got back. I don’t think this game is gunna be different so i’m pretty much just gunna be a poa for the scum team unless my reads are super bad.

I kinda compensate lately by making a notes PT. Maybe I should make one for this game so I slow down a bit.

[Bell]

I hoped flea,
But i’m not a psychic.

[Bell]

Ideal world: flea > get two extra days push gamma, dunnstral. Read oil, Mastina, Noraa more closely to solidify reads better.
Then decide on contender number 2.

Ideal world is not the world I live in tho.

[Bell]

And hope SB9 isn’t scum because I can’t really do anything with him until he gets back except blind yeet him.

[Bell]

1. I think you're a good player as either alignment. Have you rolled scum yet since you got back?
2. DGB scum once accurately stated I was needy for town reads as town. It was true. I like being town read I try to play like town when I'm town etc. It's a playstyle thing. But it's also a positioning check/occassional trap for players to hand me a TR too easily or fight hard against a Town player being correctly recognized as town by other town. It sort of generates information that can be useful later.

4. It's a perfectly constructed, believable, explanation that is in line with a town POV. Recognizing their own proclivities/bad posting habits and/or unproductive behaviors and then writing it out clearly and plainly when explaining themselves is very townie imo.
I even have a little meta experience with fed up BM and this is him directly recognizing some of his problem behaviors and going against them to the favor of a town win con.

It's just a very neat emotional post. It's almost tidy in its perfection.
I could also be, dead wrong!

[Bell]

I also think the juxtaposition between his position on Flea and his interactions with you on an emotional level is him back sliding and contradictory in a way that I'm not sure BM would do as scum.

His interaction with Nacho is pretty classic BM, almost everyone has a bad first(ish) impression of BM and engages them as such with a negative interaction it's remarkly similar to how I first engaged them the first time I met them in which we got into a spat.
The other games you've played with him you were only really tangentially engaged/weren't being actively pushed by him.

I wish I could write like this as scum. This sort of posting is what is going to ensure I never play a good scum game. How do I even begin to make up this bullshit as scum?

[Bell]

If I get a vote for who you wiggle a wand at and can make them an IC or whatever can I have a market share.
You think I'm town anyway and there are definitely players that I could drive myself insane trying to figure out that I could save myself the trouble on.

[Bell]

Bellllll please be careful with my pronouns, it's happening a lot this game Please use fae/faer or they/them for me

I apologize.
I will make an effort. I absolutely mean nothing by it.

[Bell]

Okay gentle arm twisting here.
Please push flea into the arena. *gentle twist*

@syrnana: got it. I’ll look at it later. Ty.

[Bell]

I read the game you linked earlier in the day phase and I can see where you’re coming from.
@oil. I’m processing it. It’s good to know that BM can project a sort of relaxed, confident demeanor as scum. There’s a lot to process because his scum game has quite a broad tool kit.

[Bell]

We're not flipping, we're threatening to flip.
Please vote Flea there is one day left. This is not life or death.

[Bell]

Bell, did you answer why you were voting Flea? I don't think Flea is scum. You've been pushing them all game. I don't remember you forming significant suspicions anywhere else.

Vague pattern recognition.
Coincidentally my second strongest scum read this game is Mastina.
For daring not to post exactly the same.

[Bell]

It's sad how badly I want to send Fire into the arena every day phase, but never actually eliminate FB. winning the tournament single handedly is my canon ending.

[Bell]

Bell, did you answer why you were voting Flea? I don't think Flea is scum. You've been pushing them all game. I don't remember you forming significant suspicions anywhere else.

Vague pattern recognition.
Coincidentally my second strongest scum read this game is Mastina.
For daring not to post exactly the same.

This is awful.

I respect it.
Also, I'm reisoing you and maybe possibly changing my mind.
So hold still.

[Bell]

UNVOTE:

Thinking.

[Bell]

So pretty much, I felt that Flea was spending too much time arguing their perspective of absolutism or objective reality that they were town and not enough scum hunting underlying it. They laid out how they would play in their playstyle and started to follow through on it in a way that actually points me more toward them being town. I have no clue why they spoilered 750 as it reinforced this point. I felt their votes and positions have been relatively opportunistic. Flea showed curiosity toward the people voting them that weren't directly voting or pushing their wagon. While their attitude and approach to me and BM felt different in how they approached us in terms of asking questions etc. It might just be their political stances or how they play socially/argue socially.

Their posting style in among us was significantly different to how they played in death curse. Their initial tone and approach in this game adhered more closely to their scum game from my limited experience. They've departed from that posting style. The first time I had given myself pause on their alignment was when they asked if I didn't like them, which I tend to associate with a somewhat subtle town thought process. Looking back I realized I missed a lot of posts where they were more consistent than I thought.
To be clear, this isn't a strong reversal into obv town flea. It's more of moving them from a scum read to a slight town read.

I do not like that I'm reading them in part or entirely based on emotional tells. But I feel I need to think more carefully about them and examine their analysis or somewhat lack thereof and stances in a better fashion.

@Flea: requesting feedback, I tried to control for how I addressed you in this post. Did it meet standards? If I failed to address you appropriately let me know and I'll adjust until I get it right.

[Bell]

My vote's here if needed to get somebody in the ring.
RN my invisible vote is on Mastina. But I know that's not happening. Until next choice minimum

[Bell]

VOTE: Mastina

Normally I wouldn't justify a vote like this face first so to speak. But I also don't think pressure is the correct way to engage with Mastina.
In general I think their reads and opinions are very straightforward and easy to understand this game. There is an emphasis on being understood.
In the other games I've played with Mastina they were utterly domineering, generating their own opinions almost in a bubble. There was less emphasis in being clear and communicative than here, or maybe I should say her communication style is decidedly different.

I think her most recent post is strange, off or mildly difficult to be believable. Spending 30 minutes to check if they really ever have misread Nacho seems like a tremendous waste of time. Her emphasis on explaining her process over the result is also strange. I am well aware Mastina wall posts that they are usually not concise, but usually it's packed with opinion and meaning in a way that these posts aren't, they're less dense.

Yeah, I know. I really am just singling her out because she's posting different. Which sucks and isn't a great way to vote folk. But I also, I guess in the simplest terms, think she is off. Is the best way to describe it.

[Bell]

I think however that her reads make a lot of sense. Almost too much sense, I find myself nodding along to their reads, while recognizing that she's pretty much pushing at lurkers and not having genuine scum reads.
I find nothing or little to object to with her reasoning or opinions. To the point, it's actually strange in itself.

I am not articulating myself well here.

[Bell]

Huh, that post sort of recontextualized some thoughts related to my differing perspective. It could just be that because I'm town and I don't know her alignment she comes off differently.

Still, *points directly to 1606* The differences as I see them are in the paragraph. If you disagree with my comparison or the statements made, say so.

[Bell]

@Bell You if i understand correctly. Mastina is usually opinionated with her read and you think she is off because she is not here?
Town!Mastina can’t legitimately be hesitant about her reads?

This is very accurate. Or in the accurate ball park. The nuance is how she comes off.
Based on prior meta,

She doesn't show doubt until she is doubted to reassure others that she isn't tunneled or whatever complex thoughts and coping mechanisms are behind the habits of somebody playing mafia for 10x as long as I have.

It's silly because I'm basing this off, like 3 games and not properly compensating for not knowing her alignment this game. I think i'm just being overly confident because when you see somebody effort a lot as town three times and you see slight variation you know there's a difference. But I shouldn't feel this confidence about what it means, but I'm propping it up with some very basic empirical stuff that doesn't have anything to do with her posts underneath it (i'm not going to talk about the basic empirical stuff that just statistically makes someone more likely to be scum) Rather they're disassociated and, arguably one of them doesn't apply.

Also, my read of Sugar Cain just whip lashed from lean town to hard town bin to paranoia spiral based on their last 3 posts. They directly touched upon a lot of topics that are townie asf to touch on with townie asf reads.

[Bell]

VOTE: Firebringer

Shhhh don't tell Noraa

-j

Sorry is this a FB is secretly a town PR with benefits to going in the arena so let's send them vote or
is this a I scum read this vote?

[Bell]

*ahem* question mark.

@gamma, you busy? I didn’t defend you because you were pretty tight lipped at the end of the day phase. Did real life get in the way?

[Bell]

Poo.

[Bell]

Why is it that all the people who haven't obvtowned have personal troubles? Not shading but it leaves us nowhere to vote.

I’m not sure what you mean.

[Bell]

When I said mildly difficult to be believable I didn't mean you didn't do it. I meant I found it hard to believe it was coming from a town mindset.
It was, filler something to do other than hunt in the here and now.

I feel mildly guilty that my lack of clarity led to you efforting on something I didn't disbelieve in the first place.

Woops.

That was me.

[Bell]

When I said mildly difficult to be believable I didn't mean you didn't do it. I meant I found it hard to believe it was coming from a town mindset.
It was, filler something to do other than hunt in the here and now.

I feel mildly guilty that my lack of clarity led to you efforting on something I didn't disbelieve in the first place.

Woops.

That was me.

@Mastina.

[Bell]

I don't get Noraa's confidence or conviction on her reads at all.

[Bell]

Noraa can you take off your roleplay mask for a bit and talk to me a bit about your confidence? what your experience and reflections on when you miseliminate someone have led you to believe about your reads, your own reads accuracy and how you take that under consideration in the future for new reads?

[Bell]

You do realize I have no idea what your read accuracy rates are right.

[Bell]

Though, almost no one should be above or (much above) 20%ish.
I'm trying to understand you. Because you think they're both scum while I have them as probably town (with a dash of paranoia) Sugar, and weak lean town (guilo).

Oh, we only have a day left.
Great.

[Bell]

Awesome.

I think this game is fascinating (great game unwnd!) so I apologize to Fire for taking you out so fast, but never in my mafia career will I miss a chance to do this:

VOTE: Firebringer

swarm:Firebringer

swarm:Firebringer

(using "Talented" perk)

And that's one challenge target for today, as far as I'm aware.

For the next one I'm thinking we get Oil Tycoons, mostly because they voted for me. It might be interesting to put one of superbowl or Battle Mage though.

*boops*

Wat.

/:
I'm skeptical Flea believed this or thought it a possibility.
Seriously wat.

[Bell]

I fucked up the quote. my comment was simply that I was surprised that Fae just kind of froze and didn't know whether to believe Dunnstral just hammered FB on page 1. It stretches credulity.

Noraa has made a case for both of them being scum.

I actually can see it as being shade or trying to push at them for humility. It wasn't the intended the effect, or rather the effect was to see how they'd respond to it so I could try to understand them, but from a presentation perspective where others are watching the accusation is not unfair.

[Bell]

Flea, could you tell me what you were thinking on page one when Dunnstral swarmed FB? When you made your post in response to it?

[Bell]

Flea, could you tell me what you were thinking on page one when Dunnstral swarmed FB? When you made your post in response to it?

Before I do, what make you think I thought it was a hammer?

The post in which you responded to it, by saying "wat, seriously, wat"

[Bell]

"Seriously -> I am serious.
What just happened, somebody explain this. "

Is how I took it.

[Bell]

Okay, so you're saying you didn't believe Dunnstral had multivoted.
And you didn't try to help sell that perspective if you didn't believe him.

You thought it did something else and wanted to find out what exactly his ability did.
But you did not use a question mark when writing it out nor did you pursue it further.

[Bell]

Okay, so you're saying you didn't believe Dunnstral had multivoted.
And you didn't try to help sell that perspective if you didn't believe him.

You thought it did something else and wanted to find out what exactly his ability did.
But you did not use a question mark when writing it out nor did you pursue it further?

is this correct?

[Bell]

Why not push Dunnstral for other stuff to see if he behaved suspiciously?

[Bell]

Because Noraa mentioned that somebody had called her scum for the multivoting VC acknowledgment when Perfect Cell made a mistake and didn't delete a vote. I went back to find out who it was and thought about what your response to him meant as it seemed intentionally vague.

[Bell]

BM is V/LA during weekends.
It's the weekend.

Did you suspect Dunnstral more than other players this game Flea?

SB's vacation ends tomorrow which is great. But that's at deadline so I dunno what to do with that, it would pretty much be a coin flip fmpov.

[Bell]

My experiences are more in line with FB on aggression.
I have fake tunneled as scum before and gotten into spats in order to be town read or ignored. Or to come off as if I really believe what I'm saying.
I have also never won a scum game since I got back 0/6.
So, it doesn't work very well lol. But I have a lot of terrible flaws as a scum player.
Aggression can substitute for solving, belief or bullying another player to leave you alone by being unpleasant. If you have blurry vision. Which lots of town do.

[Bell]

Cool SB!
Uh, pretty sure that we need someone in the arena by then though. But that's life.

[Bell]

I'm backsliding into neutral on Guilo, for not fully considered reasons/thoughts.

[Bell]

15 hours SB. I think the one with the most votes gets sent to the arena. with some tie breaking involved.
I forgot about that.

[Bell]

I believe that the two people selected get to talk.

And everybody else can only vote one of them, but say nothing else.

[Bell]

Why’d we do gamma?? Did they obvscum because I’m trying to give them a fair shake after SRing them like 80 games in a row

It wasn't me. Also, same. Also, he can town it up if he's town but also, he had life stuff.
Which made me not step in hard.

I want Mastina in the arena!

That rhymed. so cool.

Also, I would be extremely happy with a Conf town Mastina *hints at titus*
*nudges titus's elbow*

[Bell]

Also, I want to die.

[Bell]

Yeah, Dunn's town.

Hey, Flea?

VOTE: Battle Mage

It was a good step in/counter Jab to any counter-counter Jab mastina could make.
he's right that the TR was too easy.
Though, also, Mastina comes up with stuff for everybody and that's tough to do with a sterling innovative take for everyone.

Mostly, I sort of kind of maybe sort of kind of have to say that Mastina says she's had a hard time emulating her town game lately as scum (or maybe I'm misrepresenting that position).
Maybe this game is an example of that self trend.

[Bell]

I assumed that Titus's ability was some kind of IC-wand waving, rather than a cop thing because of how she approached it.

[Bell]

Ya know, maybe I shouldn't speculate on role abilities when I'm ass at it.

Regardless, I am scum reading Mastina.
But I also hold her town game in some esteem and would vastly prefer she live and help me solve than die as town.
So If I reach a world where I'm wrong On mastina and she is confirmed as town, great.
If not, and she flips town and Titus ability wasn't what I thought, sucks for me. Add it to my list of bad pushes into eliminations on town.

[Bell]

That...That's the first time I was ever right on anything regarding roles.

I need a minute.

[Bell]

Well, you're not living to day two with a role like that.

Go with somebody you think would be the most helpful to have as confirm town. Sort of obvious and not helpful advice, but there you go.

[Bell]

Okay.

[Bell]

UNVOTE:

[Bell]

Naturally, the coolest character in the series, Tien, dies first.

RIP.

[Bell]

First the most important thing.
I thought it said solar flare and not Final flash.

Vegeta is not the coolest character.

SECOND.
I did not read that the day would end if she missed.

[Bell]

So, I'm an idiot.

[Bell]

If titus can no longer post it means she missed.
Sorry for the misread.

[Bell]

let me correct myself.
She was right that Mastina was town so she landed accurately fhpov.
I missed.
I am a waste.

[Bell]

I did not notice any bread crumbing.

[Bell]

I mean, I'm just freaking clueless in general when it comes to crumbs. You can hit me with the loaf hard enough to knock me out of the sky and I still wouldn't notice it

Same.

[Bell]

yeah sad to see Titus go...if she did go?

It's final flash, she dies when she uses it if the player hit by it is town.

[Bell]

This is problematic.

[Bell]

Is an area of effect mass cancelation ability like that, that does not stop the scum team from performing a night kill a scum role or a town role usually?

[Bell]

So you think it's TVS. I felt like Flea escalated/engaged and BM tried to disengage after BM(and I) initially pressured Flea.

[Bell]

VOTE: FB

Mr-Satan = FB = The mass canceler.

[Bell]

Also not sure how that gamma wagon happened, sure he's not obvtowning but his posting has been good so far

He replaced out. He just had life stuff but his inactivity got pushed pretty hard.

[Bell]

Is an area of effect mass cancelation ability like that, that does not stop the scum team from performing a night kill a scum role or a town role usually?

What are you talking about?

Sounds like a scum role though, like usually scum power roles just counter town power roles, and town roles are much more powerful

All actives have been temporarily disabled for tonight!

oh, I missed this. This makes sense. Yeah this seems scum

Sigh. Wifom.

[Bell]

Nah, I meant you not noticing it is a town slip that I have to wifom myself into knots without ever getting closer to you.

I'm pretty sure FB flavor claimed Mr. satan.
and when the no active skills started the flavor text explicitly pointed toward Mr. Satan.

That's pretty much my scum case on FB RN.
They've been pretty chill and towny but scum often are.

[Bell]

They did not claim Mr. Satan, they just role played as him.

Every 5th post.

[Bell]

Man, I'm exhausted.

Mr. Satan was the world champion of the (earth) martial arts tournament goku and company usually fight at he is actually quite strong and is a martial artist, but by the time DBZ rolls around everybody else is bullshit and can destroy the planet with their thumb.
Mr. Satan can break rocks with his fist.
He's a bit of a conman and coward/poser. But he is a fighter and he does fight at the tournament as well.
The ability as written in the flavor text points directly to Mr. Satan having used it.

[Bell]

Yooooo my boy was born today. (Technically yesterday) so I'll be spotty. That said I'm in support of all the same shit I said yesterday. I was already townreading mastina and taking her reads into consideration. I think the kill was entirely because she was IC, not necessarily because of the veracity of her reads

Congratulations.

[Bell]

I have two more pages to read, but I am relatively in shock that anybody could read me as scum ever this game.

Also, scum reads out of line with majority -> Higher chance of being town ->Higher chance of being miseliminated for having against the grain reads.

I would like Finral to lay out why he thinks I'm scum this game.

[Bell]

@Bell - I need to talk to you.

Hi

[Bell]

Okay, a little busy. got a new phone, last one had its port misaligned suddenly so I couldn't charge it.

From what I'm gathering your position is that you are Mr. Satan, but that the scum team can write out flavor text to point to you as scum while using their ability?

[Bell]

I think it would be really funny if you were scum and you spent the entire game playing posting reverse psychology.
There really needs to be a better word for statements made that imply guilt in jest or are designed to bait people, amuse oneself etc.

[Bell]

Would anyone else like to counter claim that they're Mr. Satan?

[Bell]

i don't think mr satan matches to what happens. it sounds more like a ring announcer disqualifying actions? like news caster guy.

Eh, they can't all be winners.

Gohan as a universal back up and Vegeta as a desperado is very on point tho.

I'm not sure who exactly would fit with a diet regimen.
Or why someone would come up with that.

[Bell]

It would make sense to be a cell ability since he has that draining ability with his tail.

[Bell]

Ironically, I only ever open wolf as scum when I'm town.

[Bell]

No, it's extremely obvious it's referring to Mr. Satan.
Whether the scum team wrote it or not is up for debate. FMPOV.

But that the flavor is connected to roles seems pretty much undeniable.

[Bell]

You make a good point actually.

[Bell]

it was not obvious to me.

I felt that that the mod was saying hey, this flavor is relevant and is related to their ability.

But it also makes sense that the moderator would call attention to a post where the have the ability to write something out.

I actually don't remember Mr. Satan ever saying that line.

[Bell]

That's just the thing though,
they like reverse psychology.
That's really the only reason I entertained it.

(well, that or they didn't realize there would be flavor attached to the ability until after rping as mr. Satan).

[Bell]

I don't feel confident in anything right now.

[Bell]

Thanks.
I'm mentally exhausted, so it's taking a bit.

[Bell]

Why am I blanking in how to proceed here.

[Bell]

VOTE: Superbowl9

[Bell]

I think oil makes the most sense in game context as scum but I liked the other head (not nocho)'s posts. If I'm honest though I just don't see oil chainsawing that hard for scum flea early like that

pedit luv u 2 bby <3

Could you explain the game context that makes Oil seem likely to be scum?

Oil, Guillo, Flea?

Now THAT is scary

Why is that scary?


@Unwnd, np.

@Flea: Are you joking? Literally nothing I've done this game makes any sense for scum me to do.

[Bell]

You're.

I can't keep up that activity all the time flea. It's just out right not healthy.

[Bell]

UNVOTE:

This vote really isn't necessary. His iso is just barren, and is still relatively barren post vacation.
I don't disagree with Finral that there is a temptation just to town bin him.
But his scum game is, to my 2nd hand knowledge quite a bit weaker than his town game.

[Bell]

VOTE: Superbowl9

-.-

Hey there buddy.

[Bell]

Sb, noobish how. He's clearly an alt.

[Bell]

It is fairly one way, I'm relatively neutral on them and I'm not scum partners with them.
I wonder if Flea was given advice on how to push at me this game all of a sudden.

Saying I lurk as scum is actually very true.
Except when it's not and I'm just busy or depressed, or tired, or doing something else.
(I am a: Tired, b: doing other stuff too for a multitasking bonanza.

[Bell]

Oh, that was referring to oil.

For Flea and BM, I'm just hilariously conflicted.