Mini 2231: Radio Buzz | Game Over!

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VOTE: gamma

hi everyone

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8 is unfakeable

pedit: that'd be fun tbh

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The "busted radio" thing kinda implies to me that it's flavor

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You think that I with a red PM know that the word malefactors is not in the green PMs?

there's a sample pm? but also eh

Hmm that's actually townslippy

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am i allowed to townread rousseau for getting annoyed that no one is answering her discussion prompts fast enough

Yeah probably

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Yeah probably

mm, is there something you are expecting from ssbm wagon if you think ssbm possibly townslipped there?

Not sure what you're asking? I didn't vote her

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Not sure what you're asking? I didn't vote her

it just felt like you say 'i actually think this was a townslip' in your words of course but then...

pressure continues being applied there and you comment on cephrir asking if allowed to townread me (likely outsourcing due to unfamiliarity?, maybe)

but not on the wagon on the player you think townslipped?

I mean, I don't really have much to say about it besides that I think she may have townslipped and therefore that I disagree with the wagon

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I'm not quite sure what you're expecting of me besides repeating "hey bad wagon" which isn't my playstyle

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@infinity why do you think that was town-slip-y

I think scum was pretty likely to go back and look at the sample pm, especially once the "does town know scum's flavor name" conversation is brought up, whereas town can just check their role pm

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Yeah maybe, also I'm not sure if I get too much out of analyzing wagons so much as individual player narratives/emotion

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Possibilites for the 5th caller include "no alignment" (controlled by mod), a scum caller similar to a traitor that is unknown to the scumteam and scum caller, or town. Imo the verbiage, which seems carefully selected, rules them out as a scum that is known to the scumteam

Could have their own wincon too

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what the hell is happening

ignore them do u have reads

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ydrasse <3

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or they have valuable info

the now classic 'npcs have valuable info'

Does this have any sort of dealio on site it’s referencing of us it just a vidya game joke

In silent star 4, there were 2 NPCs that were suggested to have valuable info for town, but they didn't and their purpose was to give town benefits if the townies asked them specific questions. Flea in particular based most of faer gameplay around the "info" the NPCs gave until it was revealed to be unreliable.

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VOTE: skitter i think her thought process here seems much more geared towards finding someone to push than sorting ssbm

normally she's very sensitive to looking for limbait, here she doesn't really consider that scenario or really look into ssbm's mindset with much depth

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8 is unfakeable

pedit: that'd be fun tbh

Wth is that unfakeable??

I'm half joking. I do think that post is town-indicative for ydrasse because I think she'd be really happy to roll town and I don't think her first thought after she rolls scum is to think "I need to fake being happy I rolled town"

PEdit: I lightly townread gamma because scum!him has been very scummy even early on in the past. Although, I think he can be a decent scum player so that's why it's a weak read. I'm relatively confident I can read him correctly as the game goes on

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she*

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because she's said so in other games

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MT invited me to the game, I mostly play irl

Cool!

I doubt tweetie would make a setup that's easy for town. Also the game was reviewed.

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i'm not really sure why you think i ought to be viewing ssbm as flipbait? that's not how i view her and i'm not sure why that's relevant to the situation

to me, it doesn't seem like you considered whether ssbm could be limbait, or really anything about her mindset. if you did, i think you were uncharacteristically quick to jump to a conclusion based on shallow reasoning. i sort of understand where you're getting the idea that it's likely that ssbm approaches the "malefactors" thing this way as scum, but i have no idea where you get the idea that it's unlikely for her to approach it this way as scum. i felt her explanation was pretty robust and would've at least taken some doing to replicate and scum, and i actually feel like you recognized that too, but you brushed it aside because it didn't fit with your narrative.

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i also think you should know that omgus/reactionary behavior isn't actually scummy, and i see nothing in your reasoning that makes you think this is a special case.

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- ig reading it looking for a traitor could make sense but i'm still rather suspicious that you keyed in on the word 'malefactor', as i think it would stand out to scum more.

this part feels like "you're towny but i want to push you anyway" in scumspeak

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infinity i'm not getting good vibes from thus far

oh this is gonna be fun :)

elaborate?

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I just think it's weird to read that one of the callers is scum and then not go back and analyze the callers' posts. I came into the game expecting from the description there would be anonymous messages that were sometimes pro-scum, sometimes pro-town. This is different so after I caught up I went back and read the caller messages again, to see if there was any hidden message for scum because immediately the scum caller reminds me of a traitor. I was expecting them to try to signal scum in some way, so I was specifically rereading for crumbs when I noticed it.

@skitt again i felt that this mindset was pretty robust and i think you at least should be weighing it a bit more, or at least trying to poke a hole in it if you think there's a hole. i don't really think the explanation that the word malefactor didn't stick out to you therefore it wouldn't stick out to anyone else is how you think as town, you're normally very good at recognizing that people think differently from each other instead of going "i don't understand this and there could be a scum mindset therefore scum". your scum mindset here assumes that the flavor name for scum is actually malefactor (correct me if i'm wrong), which is a dubious assumption at best. you also mentioned the omgus and reactionary thing, which i think you know isn't actually scummy. i don't think any of your reasons to call ssbm scum are strong enough to jump to pushing her rather than questioning her town mindset and seeing if it holds up.

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i'm saying that in the universe it is, i don't think town comes into this game with the associative that 'malefactor' -> scum

sure, but if that isn't scum's flavor name, your reasoning kinda falls apart, no?

i'll wait for ssbm to answer about the traitor thing, but your first point is answered pretty well imo by 107, specifically the part where she says she reread the npc conversation after she realized one of them was scum. this also means she'd specifically be attuned to potential slips or traitor crumbs, so it makes sense that she'd try to read into those messages even though they may have been NAI. idk, i don't really see why you're that confident that town wouldn't be attuned to the word malefactor.

i also am suspicious of the "trying to get the game going explanation", given your tone and point-by-point responses i think you were at least trying to get a wagon on ssbm and potentially an elim.

i'm also suspicious of your scumvibes on me, normally you're very good at correctly townreading me and though i'm not 100% sure you should be townreading me here, i think it's likely that you would be as town

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i don't know? but my point is that skitt's reasoning relies on the assumption that it is scum's flavor name, which is not a strong enough basis for a hard push.

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@galron it would be an odd way to give that information to the town in a flavor post at the beginning of the game. i don't think tweet would write flavor to be scrutinized for in-game clues like that, i think it's much more likely that she used a fun word for flavor purposes.

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your'e saying that town *could* have those thought processes, and i agree. what i'm saying is that of the two alignments, i think these thoguhts are *more likely* to come from scum than town. you're kinda sidestepping that point by saying that i ought to recognize it *could* come from town - i do, but i don't understand why it comes from town *more often* than it comes from scum, which si the bit i need to negate the reasons i'm scumreading her for this whole thing.

to me the whole thought process of "i didn't know there was scum in the NPCs" is very level 0 towny and i guess i'm not sure at this point whether you just don't see that or you're brushing it aside because it doesn't fit your narrative. to be fair, the way you're treating this argument indicates that you don't see that post as surface level towny no matter your alignment, which is honestly pretty baffling to me. i thought that it was pretty obviously not the first thing that scum would think of when trying to get into a town mindset. if i'm pushing someone early on and they come up with an explanation like that, i take a step back and ask myself if i really want to be pushing there. not that you had to come up with the conclusion that she's town, but i felt like it should've at least been a thought in your mind.

at this point what i have the most problem with is the "omgus and reactionary" comment, which you later explained that it was the way in which she was omgus/reactionary that you had a problem with (correct me if i'm misinterpreting). if you had said that to begin with, i'd feel much better about it.

i don't think there's anything in particular that you should be townreading me for here, except perhaps for the fact that i'm pushing you right out of the gate, but you tend to be quite good at recognizing town!me

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for skitter i don't think she would have this wim as scum after getting it and getting kicked around like a soccer ball a few times over

ydrasse you were in perpetual melo? i used this exact argument to townread her there and she was scum.

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Tetrina gets a Yikes, an Alarmed, and a Ridiculous. Seems hyperbolic.

this is a good point, although my gut leans towards tetrina as scum here. but maybe that's just cause my brain is trying to do preflip associatives with skitt.

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but i think it's another thing to think "some people at this table might remember these things and be expecting me to react in some way" and then like, fake exasperation as she is if she is scum?

i think if skitt is scum she's probably genuinely exasperated rather than something like this

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literally either alignment could fail to realize this tho >.>
this is why i dont' get why you're ascribing town intent here, she could just as easily be scum who didn't realize this ...

ah fair enough. to me i think it shows a solving mindset though to immediately use the new setup info to try to go back and sort.

as far as the read on me goes, we can start with: why do you think i'm picking a fight with you right off the bat?

i don't think you should be townreading me necessarily, but i did say i thought it was likely you'd be townreading me as town here. i don't really think specific towny things i did are necessary for that because the things others townread me for are usually not the things i think are towny anyway.

@ydrasse sorry i missed that, i don't really agree but fair.

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no, the read on you is pretty you-specific (and it being the first post is important)

honestly i didn't even see where skitt looked exasperated but i don't necessarily see why she'd try to hide it as scum anyway

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also if it's about skitt being happy she rolled town then she did the exact same thing really early on in perpetual melo and she had had some pretty bad scumgames before that (at least divide and conquer, i think there was another)

pedit: i just don't get why the same logic would apply to skitt.

and fair enough skitt

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i feel like town her would be a bit more... willing to think about it or humor it instead of going "no, no, i disagree"?

i don't know if she'd feel obligated to keep on going because she doesn't wanna look flaky

to me it's an argument about how scum express their emotions, and i think it takes a lot of evidence to argue that scum would want to hide their true emotions because showing your true emotions is the easier thing to do. i've seen skitt have a similar tone to this arguing as scum too. i just don't think there's anything to your read really

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sometimes you're faking them and sometimes you do let them bleed through and in this instance idgi regarding exasperated on page 10 skitter letting that bleed through early as some proto-ate

quotes?

i may be too scared of skitt and just trying to shut down any reason to tr her that i don't like. for perspective, i'm probably not going to tr her this early almost no matter what.

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@ydrasse ah ok.

i still think it's a bit weak to townread skitt for. she may even think the exasperation benefits her, either because it makes her a bit harder to push, or because she thinks it'll be seen as a genuine response to pressure and less robotic. there's a few too many question marks here for me to put weight on your read, sorry

I am also cautiously townreading ydrasse. i'll make an effort to try to switch off of the skitt stuff for now, you can help by asking me about a specific read you're curious about

also, to people who aren't understanding the meta stuff, if you want me to try to summarize something, or engage you about something else, i'd be happy to.

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i don't think i said this earlier, i felt rousseau's early posts were pretty towny

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to be fair, you're first comment about that was 200 which could be "trying to be happy".

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@skitt sure, i'll try to stop myself if i notice myself doing that again.

if you think i wouldn't feel that way as town, i'm not sure what to tell you. that game kinda tore my soul out.

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i'm not sure how my push on skitter was white knight-y, i did it to push skitter

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yes

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how do you distinguish between a white knight and just me townreading you

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House truly null, Gamma and Pooky in null because they've both done things that are lightly towny and lightly scummy, and to me they feel balanced out.

tbh I think Pooky is slightly towny rn

huh why

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scumreading town!me is such an incredible experience, people couldn't resist for very long

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i'm not sure how to answer that. i could tell you what i think the towniest thing i've done are but you'd have no reason to believe me really. try to look at whether i'm saying things to look like i'm solving and have nuance or because i really believe in them (i tend to be more emotionally attached to my reads as town). also in the past i've had trouble keeping up my motivation past day 1 as scum so look out for that.

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i wouldn't feel bad about that, i think it's important to be able to do stuff like that as scum for the sake of game integrity.

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how do you distinguish between a white knight and just me townreading you

@ssbm

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White knighting is used to counterattack skitter here. Essentially the same words could be used to TR me in a different context, where I'm not being pushed by skitter, and that's the distinction. It's because it's tied into your push on skitter who was pushing me at the time. You were using a defense of me in your push on skitter, rather than just explaining a TR on me. It's the context of the words that distinguishes the wk from the tr

i mean, "i scumread skitt because she's not considering your town mindset" is different from "you're town therefore skitt scum"

if it helps, my scumread on skitt at the time was stronger than my townread on you.

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ydrasse people have "come together" to scumread me d1 in many games you've been a part of and every time i've been town. why are you deluding yourself into thinking it's right this time

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gamma is giving his natural towny observations i think

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ydrasse people have "come together" to scumread me d1 in many games you've been a part of and every time i've been town. why are you deluding yourself into thinking it's right this time

why are you saying it’s delusional :? the implication feels like as scum too people would never converge to wagon you which i don’t think is true

i disagree. i've had a serious wagon on me d1 as scum like twice.

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i think you're deluding yourself if you're confident i'm scum here based on that. of course you shouldn't be 100% confident i'm town here.

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i think you're deluding yourself if you're confident i'm scum here based on that. of course you shouldn't be 100% confident i'm town here.

its clearly not just based on that given we had a back and forth last night?

i’m genuinely confused where this sort of like... aggressive confidence is coming from over this when the things you’re saying don’t make sense to me

i never make sense to you ydrasse i don't understand why you think that's at all scum-indicative

what are you doing to try to sort me here

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Infinity what’s your thought on Yrdasse atp?

probably town

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...!? i’m talking to you like most of my posts have been at you so one could assume my conversation

hmm what did you get out of the conversation last night? cause you haven't really followed up since then

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Infinity what’s your thought on Yrdasse atp?

probably town

That’s pretty much what I expected
Can you elaborate why though?

i felt like her townread on skitt was good and especially that she expected me to put weight into it. that's a towny bias

I still think it's unlikely scum!ydrasse is like, i need to show i'm excited to be town in my first post

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Infinity who do you think is scums with you if you are scum?

that's a weird question, my first thought is gamma maybe since i townread him without a ton of depth? if it's important to you i can think about it more

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469 feels towny to me.

@ydrasse sorry i got snippy with you

i guess what's making me frustrated is that your reasons for scumreading me don't make sense to me (is it just that i didn't give weight to your skitter read? i feel like i had good reasons for not giving weight to that, and it's your read not mine idk). i do feel like the best way to sort me is probably to leave me be for a day phase and look at my motivation d2 on for example among other things but i shouldn't yell at you for going through your own sorting process

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Tetrina elevated to TR

this line of questioning from tetrina actually was A+ because like

the answer is 'i'm not scum'

but they both assigned a lot of words to things that were not that

and now the mind wonders

i tend to assume that people have a reason for asking things so i thought it was helpful to at least give some sort of answer

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gamma likes to answer hypotheticals

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Infinity, have you had a disproportionate number of scum on your final wagons? Including scum that suspects you but may be voting elsewhere for cover?

hmm i haven't kept track, i tend to look at individual reasoning more than things like this.

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galron is an ok wagon

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I think you, as town, should be annoyed by me posting about the callers if you really think they are a distraction. I would expect that to color your read on me.

more townposting

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...!? i’m talking to you like most of my posts have been at you so one could assume my conversation

hmm what did you get out of the conversation last night? cause you haven't really followed up since then

@ydrasse

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i got a scumread from it and clearly as we’re still going back and forth we are following up?

well ok but i started the engagement and this doesn't seem to be part of your sorting process or even helping you sort me at all

i guess my question was like, is your scumread strong enough that you want to elim me? and if not, how are you resolving it?

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why do you think i would engage you like this if it wasn’t helpful to me

well you stopped engaging at one point and since then i've been the one asking you questions

the whole way you've been treating my slot is very ? this game and is giving me some doubts on you but i'll let you do your thing i guess

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VOTE: ceph

galron's takes are pretty ok, skitt isn't really going anywhere but i agreed with galron? i think? when he said that ceph's posts towards tetrina felt a bit forced, to me if felt like he was trying to twist her newbie-indicative posts into something scummy. could be a playstyle thing

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i thought you didn't like the townread last night?

i didn't agree with the townread, but i thought it was town-indicative

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- rousseau i feel like you're inordinately focused on the callers, like more focused on them than the players of the 'main' game. why are is so much of your focus on them?

feels important to me/captures my attention

ok why more than like all the other things that are happening in this game. kinda feels to me like sorting the 'main' game is more important than sorting the callers; i feel like they're mostly a distraction

this is in-character for shiki

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i do feel like skitt should at least not be scumreading me here. unless others who played with me think i've much more shallow/pedantic than i normally am as town. i don't think that's true, i think if skitt was genuinely trying to sort me it's pretty likely she would see the emotional or solving purpose behind my posts. which is to say this is a BoP read

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infinity i've never seen you act like this as town e_e what have you done specifically that you think's towny enough to be townread for?

again what i think is towny is totally different from what others think is towny for me

skitt is usually good at picking up on stuff though. i think the emotion around my skitt read was really towny and some of my posts in real-time recognizing townposts from gamma, kyokou, and tetrina

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i do feel like skitt should at least not be scumreading me here. unless others who played with me think i've much more shallow/pedantic than i normally am as town. i don't think that's true, i think if skitt was genuinely trying to sort me it's pretty likely she would see the emotional or solving purpose behind my posts. which is to say this is a BoP read

Are you trying to guilt trip skitter :shifty:

no, no one should feel guilty about scumreading me. but she tends to be good at recognizing when i'm town

pedit: yes skitt is still a scumlean for me, partly for that reason

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infinity i still feel like it's some sort of double standard where you expect me to townread you but can't really describe what bits i'm supposed to be townreading

also i'm not liking ceph's posts just here that much

sure, you don't really have to get it. but the only times you've scumread town!me before is when you were scum so /shrug

i also don't think your reasoning really applies to my posting or shows that you're actually thinking about my alignment

VOTE: ceph

galron's takes are pretty ok, skitt isn't really going anywhere but i agreed with galron? i think? when he said that ceph's posts towards tetrina felt a bit forced, to me if felt like he was trying to twist her newbie-indicative posts into something scummy. could be a playstyle thing

how does this differ from just thinking those posts were scummy, which i did

it's a tone thing, but it's also just, i don't really buy that you think scum would not get a joke or pretend to not get a joke that town would.

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i thought the pbpa was weird but i didn't get anything ai from it.

pedit: lol you don't have to townread me! i just don't like being scumread so early

something i should work on probably

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post-by-post analysis

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Wait lmao the pbpa was a serious response to Rousseau's joke about the triangle wtf

I started to lean into it, but then I figured since I was going through the iso I'd just document it.

I think the "let's use this opportunity to sort tetrina" is a bit +town

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i have a strong tr on gamma btw

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VOTE: skitter for some reason the fact that skitter decided to make such an obvious statement really pinged me and suddenly i want to kill her again

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skitter is scummmm

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skitter is scummmm

Do you town read Gamma? Or Kyouko? You just got accused of being scum but you've got nothing to say about that? This half-hearted re-attempt to call Skitter scum without actually casing her reads like you're trying to steer the wagon off of Gamma by memeing.

i'm not memeing

i have expressed my townreads on gamma and kyokou a couple times now

skitt accused me of being scum but we've hashed that out to death

i have a strong gut feeling that skitter is scum and i think we should eliminate her

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is it problematic for you that one townread of your is scumreading another towneread of yours on the basis that they're partners with you

well it's annoying, but it doesn't really mean anything about their alignments? pretty sure kyokou is just wrong

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i can't explain my gamma read in a way that will be convincing to anyone at the moment, so there was no productive way for me to respond to that post

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is it problematic for you that one townread of your is scumreading another towneread of yours on the basis that they're partners with you

well it's annoying, but it doesn't really mean anything about their alignments? pretty sure kyokou is just wrong

What do you think of skitter’s take on the case

i actually agree with it, but the way skitter expressed her thoughts on it felt scummy to me for some reason.

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i figured out one of them (skitter)

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i have a lot of experience with gamma, and i think the way he's letting his observations flow instead of feeling forced is very towny for him.

i didn't give my reasoning since i didn't think it'd be convincing/useful to anyone else.

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i think kyouko's post "makes sense" in the sense that yes, me being scum with gamma could possibly be a narrative from her perspective, but i think there's a pretty clear town motivation that she's missing/doesn't think is likely for whatever reason. i.e. that gamma simply didn't have much of an impression of me early on so he didn't really engage her about me since he didn't have much to say. the galron part is a little +scum but i believe that gamma believes in the reason to tr galron, weak reasoning isn't really a strong scumtell

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i have a lot of experience with gamma, and i think the way he's letting his observations flow instead of feeling forced is very towny for him.

you said this earlier immediately after gamma emerald townread pooky for doublevoting gamma emerald and i am still confused about this from all non-pooky parties involved even though gamma emerald said application of vibecheck towny

yeah, i didn't really agree with gamma's townread on pooky either, but the way he took a small observation and used that as the basis for his read is exactly how gamma plays mafia. the way i interpret it is, a lot of posting is noise to him but one little thing will stick out and strike him as especially ai.

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it feels like she could just be white knighting Gamma.

How do you differentiate white knighting from an honest town read?

Having an actual basis for the read would help. But not only does she not give a reason for the town read, she doesn't do anything to dispute the case against him or even herself. If Gamma flipped green, I wouldn't doubt at all that the reason she's blankly town reading him is because she TMI'd it.

now that i gave the read and the dispute, what did you think

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I think you probably should've said it was a meta read from the start tbh.

ok, would it help to give examples of town!me townreading gamma for similar reasons in other games?

@tetrina i'm not sure, most people are sort of ignoring the fight. it's possible dgb is taking advantage of things in order to pocket me (get me on its side) based on 896 , but i have a slight lean town on it overall.

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Subject: Micro 983 | The Council: Student Council Edition! | The End!

I like gamma’s casual-ness to approaching reads, whereas he tried to look town more in haunted village. I have some paranoia wrt uncrowned and haven’t solidified my outworlder read, so I’m actually most comfortable with gamma as my second strongest TR.[/quote]

Subject: Micro 983 | The Council: Student Council Edition! | The End!

I have a soulread on gamma this game somehow. Gamma is never scum here.

Subject: Micro 983 | The Council: Student Council Edition! | The End!

Spoiler: gamma

u know I've heard the term beetlejuice but never experienced it before

:igmeou:
I really feel like Dk is shading me and Infinity out of a place of need rn

Say it. A need of what.

A need to put us down now before something else resolves.

We were all in bending together which was ongoing at the time, and while I don't agree with this take, it feels towny to point out.

idk about flea as scum, kinda thought they've been towny
but beyond that your reads and your thoughts seem good on a "yeah this makes sense as a thought process" level

What do you think has been towny from them? Honestly its possible I just missed something

A certain level of inquisitiveness I've seen. It's probably me who's being surface-level here honestly tho

This feels like how I approach light townvibes a lot. People's posts give me a good feeling, but it's hard to pinpoint and I doubt myself.

I think I probably won't be able to find you if you are scum so i decided to just act as if you are town. It gives me a starting point for the day at least

probably a town mindset (for MCat specifically)

I agree, good take

ftr my scumvibes on dk were waning before they replaced out, ali has reduced those vibes to a speck practically

Kind of a silly reason, but talking about vibes as a "speck" feels like a genuine way to approach a read.

That Purple Heart post, after fully reading it, feels towny. The base sentiments are NAI, but it seems unfiltered in a way that makes it towny

Scum would probably post similar sentiments in a way that comes off as frustrated, that one seems legit distraught.

Looks he's trying to really sort between fake vs. real emotion

Gamma I liked uncrowned’s engagement with me on the last page, what do you think

@Infinity eh I don’t know about all that, I’m forming my own thoughts here rn

Idk how to explain this, but this felt super +town to me. Gamma does like to do his own thing, and his response of being mildly annoyed with me kinda getting in the way of him pushing on uncrowned felt very genuine.

I remember you making to tsow comment before PH came in
But you didn’t cling to that take so it’s not suspicious at all probably.

He keeps noticing things like this and not using them to push anything. I don't see why scum would do that.

I'd first like to apologize for being a sook D1 and for how I interacted with Noora. I don't come into games intending to cause issues. I had a stressful couple of days and shouldn't have overreacted and tried to use the game to vent my frustration. That was wrong.

Now for the game. Flea is an interesting selection. Surface level NKA points to Purple potentially wanting that slot dead judging by end of day interactions between the two of them, I think? Will have to peep into that ISO a little more.

Kinda wanna TR this. Feel like scum in this position might be more contrite? There'd be more spectacle about apologizing about bringing RL in imo.

I agree and this feels like town trying to explain a gut read

why so down on gamma? Didn't you vote him onto the council?

no, the only person i voted for council was you. well other than myself. gamma emerald behaviour change with purple heart entrance feels not right to me.

again, bad timing. I had been operating on some meta re: my Dk read and had started to rethink it just before Dk replaced out

Consistent progression from 659 and 744. He clearly had koba's meta at the back of his mind but didn't say too much about it. This is a strong towntell for me.

the lazy part comes from you also writing off purple/noraa as TvT like you did, as well as saying you "solved" the game. I KNOW you didn't solve it, so you're just lazily tossing out a set of reads that make SOME sense and calling it a legitimate solve. So that should also answer why I can think your read on me is reasonable but also think you're being lazy, too. The "change" is pretty much me focusing more on your read on me vs. you're overall solve.

This and the whole interaction with uncrowned felt pretty genuine

here's my read on gamma from student council, eventually i got to a post-by-post explanation but it was really hard for me to articulate at first.

i feel like there was another game where i read gamma similarly (do you remember, gamma?) but i can't find one

[Infinity 324]

ahh

Subject: Micro 983 | The Council: Student Council Edition! | The End!

I like gamma’s casual-ness to approaching reads, whereas he tried to look town more in haunted village. I have some paranoia wrt uncrowned and haven’t solidified my outworlder read, so I’m actually most comfortable with gamma as my second strongest TR.

Subject: Micro 983 | The Council: Student Council Edition! | The End!

I have a soulread on gamma this game somehow. Gamma is never scum here.

Subject: Micro 983 | The Council: Student Council Edition! | The End!

Spoiler: gamma

u know I've heard the term beetlejuice but never experienced it before

:igmeou:
I really feel like Dk is shading me and Infinity out of a place of need rn

Say it. A need of what.

A need to put us down now before something else resolves.

We were all in bending together which was ongoing at the time, and while I don't agree with this take, it feels towny to point out.

idk about flea as scum, kinda thought they've been towny
but beyond that your reads and your thoughts seem good on a "yeah this makes sense as a thought process" level

What do you think has been towny from them? Honestly its possible I just missed something

A certain level of inquisitiveness I've seen. It's probably me who's being surface-level here honestly tho

This feels like how I approach light townvibes a lot. People's posts give me a good feeling, but it's hard to pinpoint and I doubt myself.

I think I probably won't be able to find you if you are scum so i decided to just act as if you are town. It gives me a starting point for the day at least

probably a town mindset (for MCat specifically)

I agree, good take

ftr my scumvibes on dk were waning before they replaced out, ali has reduced those vibes to a speck practically

Kind of a silly reason, but talking about vibes as a "speck" feels like a genuine way to approach a read.

That Purple Heart post, after fully reading it, feels towny. The base sentiments are NAI, but it seems unfiltered in a way that makes it towny

Scum would probably post similar sentiments in a way that comes off as frustrated, that one seems legit distraught.

Looks he's trying to really sort between fake vs. real emotion

Gamma I liked uncrowned’s engagement with me on the last page, what do you think

@Infinity eh I don’t know about all that, I’m forming my own thoughts here rn

Idk how to explain this, but this felt super +town to me. Gamma does like to do his own thing, and his response of being mildly annoyed with me kinda getting in the way of him pushing on uncrowned felt very genuine.

I remember you making to tsow comment before PH came in
But you didn’t cling to that take so it’s not suspicious at all probably.

He keeps noticing things like this and not using them to push anything. I don't see why scum would do that.

I'd first like to apologize for being a sook D1 and for how I interacted with Noora. I don't come into games intending to cause issues. I had a stressful couple of days and shouldn't have overreacted and tried to use the game to vent my frustration. That was wrong.

Now for the game. Flea is an interesting selection. Surface level NKA points to Purple potentially wanting that slot dead judging by end of day interactions between the two of them, I think? Will have to peep into that ISO a little more.

Kinda wanna TR this. Feel like scum in this position might be more contrite? There'd be more spectacle about apologizing about bringing RL in imo.

I agree and this feels like town trying to explain a gut read

why so down on gamma? Didn't you vote him onto the council?

no, the only person i voted for council was you. well other than myself. gamma emerald behaviour change with purple heart entrance feels not right to me.

again, bad timing. I had been operating on some meta re: my Dk read and had started to rethink it just before Dk replaced out

Consistent progression from 659 and 744. He clearly had koba's meta at the back of his mind but didn't say too much about it. This is a strong towntell for me.

the lazy part comes from you also writing off purple/noraa as TvT like you did, as well as saying you "solved" the game. I KNOW you didn't solve it, so you're just lazily tossing out a set of reads that make SOME sense and calling it a legitimate solve. So that should also answer why I can think your read on me is reasonable but also think you're being lazy, too. The "change" is pretty much me focusing more on your read on me vs. you're overall solve.

This and the whole interaction with uncrowned felt pretty genuine

here's my read on gamma from student council, eventually i got to a post-by-post explanation but it was really hard for me to articulate at first.

i feel like there was another game where i read gamma similarly (do you remember, gamma?) but i can't find one

[Infinity 324]

oh i though it was after

i could be getting confused cause i've had a similar read on norwee

[Infinity 324]

ah yeah, i think i probably read you similarly there, but i didn't really explain my reasoning

[Infinity 324]

Spoiler: I found it

Still think gamma is being very towny this game while not trying to look town

That's kinda my point too, those posts weren't meant to stick out and look towny but they're still there

I have a soulread on gamma this game do not touch him.

I’m scumreading gamma too

Can you explain how he’s different from panic room? because I made a comparison thinking he was similar

- lilith

He's different in, like, every way? In panic room he was awkward and all over the place, here he's calm and treating the game like an intellectual exercise

You said his defense of cakez was like his defense of murder in panic room which again, I don't see the resemblance at all. In panic room there was way more desperation and the reasoning didn't justify the strength of the read, here he doesn't feel compelled to justify himself. Umlaut's reason for TRing gamma was related to this and was a very good one.

[Infinity 324]

i don't recognize you pooky

[Infinity 324]

fleet seems to be rping

[Infinity 324]

he's not posting cause of rl...it's probably not gonna help to pressure him

pedit: hmm ok, he was pretty capable as scum recently in draft mafia though.

[Infinity 324]

i must have misunderstood, carry on

i think she was talking about the specific elitell of posting during other ongoing games but not this one

pedit: i'm not sure the game where i was basically a jester is really relevant to this?

[Infinity 324]

hi gamma while you're here i want to run by you my perception that you are grumpier as scum do you think that's true

i've not played with you enough to have a satisfying sample size yet i have that perception

i think this is a decent take

[Infinity 324]

cephrarr

cephrawr

cephrarrwr

[Infinity 324]

ydrasse i relate :)

[Infinity 324]

idk if that’s supposed to be passive aggressive infinity but i’m not in the mood

i'm sorry

but also i legitimately relate

[Infinity 324]

the most interesting part of this game is how to fit cephrarr and cephrawr into one name

[Infinity 324]

gamma can you link the posts you're referring to

[Infinity 324]

@shiki

i think kyouko was saying that galron's scenario assumed that she was town and it's tmi simply for that reason

if galron had included a scenario where kyouko was scum in the question then i don't think it would've been a problem

i think it's an overuse of tmi

[Infinity 324]

ah yeah i still feel like that's the type of thing people call tmi often but we can see what kyouko says

[Infinity 324]

i think this conversation needs a mediator so

@kyouko i think rousseau's point is that, dgb was the one assuming/thinking you were town (at least from galron's perspective) because dgb voted skitter for what galron thought was her push on you. galron was simply questioning the skitter-scum you-town narrative.

[Infinity 324]

galron

[Infinity 324]

gamma is town

[Infinity 324]

ok except i know him better than anyone else

[Infinity 324]

the longer you keep saying this the less i buy that

[Infinity 324]

i like tetrina

[Infinity 324]

I'm sheeping Kyouko because y'all won't fucking stop hyper posting. I can barely attempt to play with how fast the game is going and the best I could do was follow along with my strongest town read.

sorry :/

i feel like a lot of games nowadays have two different groups of people that are going different speeds. i will try to compromise

[Infinity 324]

the longer you keep saying this the less i buy that

You've still done like nothing for me to townread u for

ok but why am i scum

[Infinity 324]

I think if she were town and scumreading me, she would be trying to get me flipped. instead, she's just kinda lightly calling me scum and not really doing much abt it. There's no 'oomph' to the read, it feels like something she's clinging to to brush off my scumread of her

please give an example of when i've pushed anyone more than this as town, besides like in divide and conquer.

or like, what i could even be doing to get you elimmed here. i highly doubt if i just kept saying "elim skitter because gut" that that would go over too well

[Infinity 324]

Like i don't really think she's being assertive much at all

was i ever assertive in jk9++? pyp? did you have trouble townreading me in either or those games?

you're gonna need more than this

[Infinity 324]

Oh I was Q+ing in Infinity's ISO, trying to figure out if she's actually placed a SR on anyone but skitter this game

i don't believe i have, that's not uncommon for me d1. sometimes i have 0 srs

[Infinity 324]

friends and foe: gamma, kyouko, skitter

i am confident in these reads and you can yell at me postgame if I'm wrong

acquaintances: rousseau, galron, tetrina, ydrasse

these players seem town to me but i'm not 100% sure. part of it with rousseau is that i recently townread her wrong and i'm not very familiar with her scumgame. a lot of the reason galron is here is because of his last post which i thought was quite towny. ydrasse i need more from but what she's posted has felt relatively town to me

strangers: dgb, pooky, roden, house, ceph

these players i haven't given most of my attention to, haven't posted enough, or i'm not sure how to read. if people have a strong opinion on these i'd be happy to hear it (gamma you'll have to summarize your dgb read i haven't seen much that convinces me here tbh)

dgb, pooky, and roden seem kinda towny to me but i have a lot of trs

[Infinity 324]

yep

[Infinity 324]

yep

can you explain that line?

what is the read on those three players?

Do you see skitter as mafia?

i townread gamma

i townread kyouko

i scumread skitter

[Infinity 324]

I read it as “I know these people well enough to be confident on my reads on them”

i've never played with kyouko before, but regardless, i am confident in my reads on those three players. that's why they were grouped together.

[Infinity 324]

idk if infinity is actually this entitled to being tr as town which is where i’m going ? on my read on her

you don't have to tr me i just wanna be left alone

[Infinity 324]

I dont have any examples offhabd but i feel like you usually are more proactive wrt your scumreads

Are you aiming to get me flipped today?

i don't really think there's much hope of that at this point

[Infinity 324]

idk if infinity is actually this entitled to being tr as town which is where i’m going ? on my read on her

you don't have to tr me i just wanna be left alone

the game doesn’t really work like that but uh okay i won’t interact ig

i'm not really being serious but i do hope you'd put a little more into sorting me before wanting to elim me d1 given how many times you've seen me wrongly suspected on d1

i hope you feel better

@skitt i'm trying to find that out. most likely i'm going to try to protect my trs and join the biggest non-tr wagon. but i may do some more sorting of ceph and roden if they're here.

[Infinity 324]

i'm not really being serious but i do hope you'd put a little more into sorting me before wanting to elim me d1 given how many times you've seen me wrongly suspected on d1

i hope you feel better

well, you weren't really trying to eliminate me. but i felt you jumped to a conclusion too quickly and i didn't like your reasoning. I'm sorry i snapped at you :/

maybe we should engage about other things

[Infinity 324]

@skitt i'm trying to find that out. most likely i'm going to try to protect my trs and join the biggest non-tr wagon. but i may do some more sorting of ceph and roden if they're here.

I think i'm actually rethinking my scumread of you >.>
I dont know who to vote tho rn

i still feel like you never justified the read sufficiently in the first place

can you at least find quotes that you felt were the scummiest? or can you elaborate on it at all

[Infinity 324]

hi

me, galron, and your slot have been wagons but none of them are sticking i guess

gamma and dgb recently got into a mini 1v1

ceph turned into a pirate and beat pooky in battleship

we got some messages from the callers but no one has really made much of them yet i think

that's pretty much it

[Infinity 324]

@shiki i do start from the assumption that i'm town yeah, but that's not really something that's changed about my playstyle

it was kinda a bad summary of the game but it's a hard game to give a summary of

[Infinity 324]

@shiki i do start from the assumption that i'm town yeah, but that's not really something that's changed about my playstyle

i think i did not explain that well, i did not mean from your perspective, of course we all do, but i meant the expectation that everyone starts with your numbers placed

i think my expectations here are gonna be different for skitt, who has a history of correctly reading me, and ydrasse, who has a history of incorrectly reading me

i don't expect everyone to townread me, especially not at the beginning of the game

[Infinity 324]

its interesting that the things infy retained in her memory of the game were the things that didn't matter at all

what were the important things to you

[Infinity 324]

a) what is your expectation with regards to my read of you

b) how do you think i am currently reading now

a) don't really have one

b) somewhere in the null range

[Infinity 324]

the farthest that goes is trying to appeal to people (being "conciliatory") and putting more effort into explaining my reads clearly than i normally would

[Infinity 324]

sorry i was gonna respond

i feel like even if the "look for town motivation" thing isn't true, i definitely used it against you in dnc

can you give links with examples of you pushing people early similar to this?

also can you elaborate on what felt white knight-y about my defense?

[Infinity 324]

i'm willing to go there, can you elaborate a bit?

[Infinity 324]

ceph has posted so much but he hasn't town told

pooky's takes are good enough this game that i wanna just tr him. besides townreading skitt.

[Infinity 324]

ok well my readrate on skitt is 100% besides perpetual melo so there

VOTE: ceph

[Infinity 324]

what are you on about she was in her final form in that game

[Infinity 324]

did you not read Tweetie's brilliant breakdown of the scum team?

that was pHd dissertation level super Tweet.

it's true i was too smooth brained to listen to tweet

[Infinity 324]

i'll accept your criticism. i'm lazy.

i'm only gonna vote roden at deadline since i got a few townvibes from him.

[Infinity 324]

i accept that she's calling me scum for it but the real explanation is that i'm lazy

[Infinity 324]

yes i'm claiming scum

[Infinity 324]

i may wait until 1-2 more transmissions to try to read the callers cause it's tough with so little content

[Infinity 324]

locke and monarch are towny

[Infinity 324]

I gotta sleep but if you iso me and rousseau early we both talk about the verbiage of the rules post - it's possible the 5th caller could be anything depending on how you interpret them imo

its my belief that the 5 radio callers are also going to be playing a mafia game of sorts.

in my theoryland:

we have 3 town radio callers, 1 mafia radio caller, and 1 jester radio caller.

eventually there will be an elimination vote on the radio caller side as well, probly on day 2 and day 3 and 4.

this feels like a very pooky theory, i think pooky is uninformed about the caller mechanics which is a bit +town. though scum could be uninformed too obviously

[Infinity 324]

"that setup"?

[Infinity 324]

Infinity, How important do you think the callers are?

my guess is that they're probably pretty important, but we can't really know in what way yet.

[Infinity 324]

mostly the idea that there will be an elimination vote within the callers

[Infinity 324]

VOTE: enchant

[Infinity 324]

but also if anyone wants to tell me which way galron's confusing mini-run at pooky leans

it felt towny to me

[Infinity 324]

skitter you're back to scumreading me again? lol

[Infinity 324]

Excellent pagetop.

Skitter, you don't like my entrance as in you find nothing to like about it? Or you actively think it's scummy?

Dislike the focus on the callers, i think they're a distraction and that it's easier for scum to talk abt them than the actual players in the game

this is not how skitt sorts someone she has a lot of experience with

a lot of people put some amount of focus on the callers. skitt isn't pushing shiki who started this whole thing so it's pretty ?

is pooky scum for the same reason or do you actually have something there

[Infinity 324]

that's e-1

[Infinity 324]

it's not too late to elim skitter

[Infinity 324]

how about

shiki

[Infinity 324]

no one was really putting a lot of effort into sorting the callers until shiki asked them to and shiki asked people like pooky and the replacements specifically

i don't really see how this is anything except an excuse to scumread some people and not others

[Infinity 324]

idk when skitt will have more time for this game but it would be nice to see her post when that happens

[Infinity 324]

how about

shiki

What do you see there? What's scum!rousseau's motivation for not mis-characterizing posts, engaging with everyone, not cherry-picking, etc. Unless this is a long con, I don't see mafia there.

i don't believe shiki is scum

in case i wasn't clear enough:

skitter scumreads ss for focusing on the callers

skitter scumreads pooky for focusing on the callers

why doesn't she scumread shiki for focusing on the callers because she's focusing on the callers more than anyone? and she was the whole reason those people were focusing on the callers to begin with?

[Infinity 324]

i don't remember you scumreading her? if you are then that's fine

still don't think it makes sense to scumread pooky/ss for doing caller stuff when shiki specifically asked them to

[Infinity 324]

process of elimination

[Infinity 324]

Do you scumread the slot?

not really, but i don't have great vibes from enchant's posting

[Infinity 324]

i wanna wait for SS to give reads and stuff, but roden did feel towny to me at points but i'm too lazy to go back

PEdit: skitt knows that SS is an easier read too

although he has tricked her before

[Infinity 324]

ceph do you have a read on galron

[Infinity 324]

ydrasse same question

[Infinity 324]

i think that coming off of silent star its more likely that people will focus on these mechanics as important + want to engage but it hink people without that context arent going to be as understanding

it just feels like, too binary?

like skitter thinks x is scummy, therefore she should scumread rousseau because rousseau is doing x

what i have a problem with is like

pooky and ss literally only mentioned the callers because you specifically asked them to. how is it scummy to comply with your request? it makes zero sense to me unless she isn't reading the game. it would at least be more consistent if she scumread you, but of course i would have questions for her if that was her position

[Infinity 324]

ceph do you have a read on galron

Yeah, scummy

why

[Infinity 324]

it would at least be more consistent if she scumread you, but of course i would have questions for her if that was her position

oh this makes sense; like it was middle step of stairs not the one before the landing

yeah, also part of how i scumhunt is like, i don't care as much what you believe as long as it makes sense from a town perspective to believe it (or doesn't make sense from a scum perspective). i would strongly disagree with her scumreading you for the caller stuff, but i could see it coming from town at least

[Infinity 324]

which other viable wagon should i prefer

[Infinity 324]

enchant? unless you've played with enchant a bunch and i don't know about ot

[Infinity 324]

And why is ss easier to read than enchant? I find ss to be someehat hard to read

oh nvm then

also i said i got slight townvibes from roden multiple times? and i disagree and think that ss is somewhat easy to read? so why am i supposed to be voting ss again?

[Infinity 324]

- galron is fairly obviously town

this is the first good thing you've said like all game

pedit: more the latter

i think ss could be scum but i want to give him more time

the "cop out poe" vote is absolutely correct, but no one else cares about you or ceph so your expectations make no sense

also i gave a readslist a couple days ago so

[Infinity 324]

Uh curious that that's the only part of that paragraph you chose to respond to?

i responded to everything in your post directed at me

will get to the roden stuff tomorrow

[Infinity 324]

- i'm more trying to understand why you're willing to cop-out poe enchant and not ss when your read on the roden slot apparently amounts to vague townvibes and willing to give ss more time

i'm not really sure why you're expecting in-depth reads from me on slots that have very little content

also you wanting to elim ss is not helping

[Infinity 324]

Does scum-skitter push me this hard if Enchant is her partner?

i don't see why not, i think she can get her way out of an elim if enchant flips scum

[Infinity 324]

That's kinda what I'm wondering about.

In my experience skitter is much stronger at avoiding pressure as scum than at deflecting pressure once she starts receiving it.

huh maybe you're right

not gonna think too hard about this yet since it's preflip anyway

[Infinity 324]

does SS play in a confusing manner when he is a scumbag?

not that i've seen

[Infinity 324]

though tbh he is kinda giving me scumvibes

[Infinity 324]

not really i wanna see him try to solve first

[Infinity 324]

ceph is meh but leaning scum cause he hasn't towntold yet

[Infinity 324]

ceph is meh but leaning scum cause he hasn't towntold yet

Hmm you dont know why I'm scumreading galton and you also haven't seen any town posts from me

I feel like the theme here has more to do with your reading comprehension than me.

if they were towny posts i would've remembered them

[Infinity 324]

I mean they are towny from an objective standpoint and it is actually not on me if the town fails to read me correctly

lmao

[Infinity 324]

No mislimmed player is ever to blame unless they like, blatantly lied

ok but like "objectively" towny is just...no

[Infinity 324]

i think we should redistribute the charisma evenly

which means i get the most

[Infinity 324]

probably galron :)

[Infinity 324]

Is SS normally this like, chill about his potential elim as either alignment? I think I'm interpreting it in a positive way currently

it's probably NAI?

[Infinity 324]

vibing with dgb tbh

VOTE: skitter

i don't really have a good narrative for what she was doing yesterday but that doesn't matter because i have my GUT

[Infinity 324]

Yep. I was wrong on enchant and changed my mind

oic. You thought it wasn't S/S simply because you thought Enchant was town.

man this is actually towny for skitt isn't it

if she knows enchant is scum she'd at least think ahead a bit, but her posting indicates that she didn't actually think about enchant being scum and really her read on ss was independent

argh

UNVOTE:

[Infinity 324]

i like ceph too now

morning tweet's avatar is too cute to be town

[Infinity 324]

i didn't spot it

[Infinity 324]

hope this helps

Spoiler:

[Infinity 324]

these are tvt but i'm gonna shut up cause i have no idea who scum is

[Infinity 324]

why?

[Infinity 324]

i think it's pretty reasonable when deciding between inactive slots to go based on vibes/recency bias and not explain your reasoning. you were on me for similar reasons @skitter

[Infinity 324]

no i mean i voted enchant over ss for "vibes"

[Infinity 324]

idk what would be best ss but maybe you can read a certain iso or section of the game and give your thoughts? i don't need a scumcase but i do need to see solving

[Infinity 324]

i love being scum

Like wtf where did this come from?

this was a response to me saying ydrasse didn't like playing scum

[Infinity 324]

not gamma ssbm or galron

[Infinity 324]

scumreads are overrated

[Infinity 324]

can't we all just get along

[Infinity 324]

are we sure skitter isn't scum

her case on ssbm is pretty bad