Mini 925: Umineko No Naku Koro Ni Mafia: GAME OVER!

[RayFrost]

/refusal to confirm

DOWN WITH THE OPPRESSOR!

RISE UP AND TAKE MATTERS INTO OUR OWN HANDS!

/spartacus?

[RayFrost]

Leech and CC are sheep being led by the wolf into death!

Rebel fellow townsmen and strike before all is lost!

[RayFrost]

Vote: The Mafia

[RayFrost]

Vote: The Mafia

I don't know, I think we should kill the town instead

^--- obv scum for not voting mafia

[RayFrost]

Vote: The Mafia

I don't know, I think we should kill the town instead

^--- obv scum for not voting mafia

obv, because we can totally kill the whole mafia with one vote

obv I can't kill them with one vote.

But we can do it with one lynch!

[RayFrost]

4a) Anyone or anything that reaches lynch count will be lynched, regardless of whether they are actually in the game or not.

unvote vote MafiaSSK

why aren't you voting the mafia and just voting a mafia?

[RayFrost]

what does RFG mean?

Also, tar, I do believe I am, but the games that would give you examples are ongoing.

If it bothers you so extremely, then I'll be more serious-ish starting now, though I doubt you'll get many posts from me during the first 5 pages because of it.

[RayFrost]

protip: lynching the mafia is a good idea

[RayFrost]

there's no point lynching the mod when it has a completely unknown effect, especially when it's likely to just be a nolynch trap anyway.

this is true.

[RayFrost]

DisCode, I would like to request you don't act arrogantly in your next and all future posts.

You haven't earned it yet, bub.

[RayFrost]

I'm agreeing with cobalt here.

Voting the mod on D1 seems less useful than waiting until further in the game where the town has more information to analyze whether the mod is even in the game.

What if lynching the mod causes rocks to fall and everybody to die? :/

Seriously.

Man, that'd be really bastardly, wouldn't it?

[RayFrost]

I'm agreeing with cobalt here.

Voting the mod on D1 seems less useful than waiting until further in the game where the town has more information to analyze whether the mod is even in the game.

What if lynching the mod causes rocks to fall and everybody to die? :/

Seriously.

Man, that'd be really bastardly, wouldn't it?

I like how this neither confirms nor denies that result.

[RayFrost]

Yeah, yeah, I can't post if nobody is posting.

So...

unvote, vote: navycherub

reaction to leech's vote seems scummy.

'why are you voting me? I'm agreeing with you, so I'm obv not scum!' :/

[RayFrost]

unvote, vote: navycherub

reaction to leech's vote seems scummy.

I didn't vote for Navy.

I meant DisCode.

[RayFrost]

cobalt is voting CSL, leech.

[RayFrost]

^---- OMGUS

[RayFrost]

x.x

I keep mixing up leech and discode.

[RayFrost]

~drum roll~

[RayFrost]

^----- bad post, scum post, bending to pressure once again sheepily post

[RayFrost]

How is it scummy to bring up a topic for discussion? How is the "first post" specification you made relevant at all? It obviously started discussion, and brought forth a subject that we should be thinking about in this type of game.

Yes, you're right, it's not.

Unvote

.

I'm sort of getting the feeling you just made this vote because people were pressuring you about not voting. Can you dissuade me from this feeling?

I mostly did it for reaction purposes. If I had voted because I was pressured I would have done it right away.

first, caving in to pressure and trying to be appeasing

second excusing the vote as a 'reaction fishing' vote and doing a self-meta of sorts

overall, not a good post

[RayFrost]

You just went 'yes, you are right' and didn't respond to the rest of what leech said.

it's an easy out.

[RayFrost]

Wait, so you're voting Leech for... a random vote? Care to explain?

Leech's vote wasn't random, as he's defended it. I'm also not voting for him right now.

so your vote wasn't a reaction vote cuz you are defending it (same argument, diff. wording).

awesome defense there.

awesome defense on the 'not voting anymore, so you can't use it against me'

[RayFrost]

Voting for me because I'm scum? Cool.

fixed

[RayFrost]

2) Since I managed to draw a role that should claim Day 1, I should probably do that now.

I'm a Bomb. When I am killed or RFGed, the killer (hammer vote if lynched) dies at the beginning of the next day.

So, dearest Mafiosos: Assuming that we don't use my ability as a second lynch, you're kinda screwed. Either you let me survive to endgame and screw you over during massclaim or you kill me and lose one of your members. Your choice!

3) RayFrost, are you this silly at the beginning of the game in EVERY game you play? (I'd total read, but search seems to be down at the moment.) If yes, please send links. If not, please tell me why you're being silly right now.

<no random vote>

Needs moar flavor supportz

[RayFrost]

I'm not really buying the Tar wagon.

The only thing that bugs me is the lack of flavor.

Other than that, I don't have any real problems with it.

From Tar's PoV, as I understand it, claiming now was a good idea to avoid death, as Tar knows his own alignment.

So him keeping himself alive as town or scum is viable, which makes it a null tell overall, meaning that the attacks on him are bad.

[RayFrost]

bad gut vibes
also tarh looks slightly town for some reason

not good enough reasoning.

[RayFrost]

Not only do we have an activity problem, the vote count indicates that we are not in agreement as to who's scummy. I know I'm not scum, and I highly doubt that the mod, Cobalt, Snow_Bunny, TheLonging, and NavyCherub are all lynchworthy.

game needs moar activity

Shorter deadline, shorter prod rate. Where did I go wrong, my dear players?

[RayFrost]

Shorter deadline, shorter prod rate. Where did I go wrong, my dear players?

Inviting the wrong kind of people to this otherwise awesome game.

I find it hard to say no to people who are so interested in my modding and games that they want to pre-/in for them. None of these players are really invites.

[RayFrost]

~lurks~

nah, just kidding.

I don't really have anything to add, as nothing has really happened.

I want cobalt to put a thelonging case up.

unvote

I also want everybody that is voting to explain why they are voting who they are voting and everybody that is not voting to explain their

lack

of vote.

I also want those of you that are voting the mod to explain why you think the mod is

the best

lynch for the day when there is no guarantee that the mod is even in the game at this point.

I'm not voting because I feel this game is going hella slow and I dunno who I want to vote right now x.x

I might just go with a policy lynch on CSL <3

[RayFrost]

PAGE BUMP FOR VOTECOUNT JUSTICE

lol‽

Fixed

[RayFrost]

What's the likelihood of scum having fakeclaims in a UK

bastard

bitch

awesomely insane ( ) mod game?

[RayFrost]

What makes you feel that way?

[RayFrost]

JOAT and Bomb are both roles that I would expect to be in this game and JOAT is fairly confirmable. False claims generally are not confirmable.

like miller?

[RayFrost]

Miller's a bit of an exception. What's your point, though?

I'm trying to find your definition of 'confirmable'

If the JOAT claims repeatedly blocked, we can't really say anything about that, can we?

[RayFrost]

And I hardly think a bomb will be 'confirmed' in any real way.

Valid excuse for not dying for a long period of time.

[RayFrost]

If the JOAT claims repeatedly blocked, we can't really say anything about that, can we?

I don't know about you, but I think depending on the JOAT's abilities, he or she could be very dangerous for scum to keep around.

True, but what if the scum have a RB? JOAT becomes worthless then, yes?

[RayFrost]

If the JOAT claims repeatedly blocked, we can't really say anything about that, can we?

I don't know about you, but I think depending on the JOAT's abilities, he or she could be very dangerous for scum to keep around.

True, but what if the scum have a RB? JOAT becomes worthless then, yes?

edit - by worthless I mean unconfirmable and not a NK target

[RayFrost]

Yeah, we'd just have to have all the PRs claim that they were RB'ed amirite?

Even if there is no kill, it doesn't guarantee that fakeclaiming JOAT didn't just have his faction not kill.

So how is it confirmable, again?

[RayFrost]

True, all the power roles in the town can confirm the global RB, but nobody else can.

[RayFrost]

walls of text x.x"

I don't get the whole debate.

Can somebody explain it to me in a few sentences without any win/loss displays?

It's way too early in the morning for me to be dealing with this kind of thing.

[RayFrost]

I don't have a cell phone.

I just feel that succinctness > verbosity, even though I am verbose. >.>

plus, I'm tired and haven't eaten breakfast yet.

[RayFrost]

I was mostly joking, I just don't know how to summarize it.

oh.

well, I'll be awake after I eat breakfast.

Gimme about 10 minutes. x.x

[RayFrost]

okay, I find that I agree with M_O more than cobalt here.

[RayFrost]

Yeah, you just got slapped. Sucks to be you.

[RayFrost]

You.
Are the slapped one.

So you are the buff shirtless guy in a loincloth that slapped me?

I didn't know you had such an interest in showing off your 'manly biceps' to the guys at work.

[RayFrost]

RayFrost and Cobalt, what is the point of the current conversation?

It's for the lulz.

Sometimes, SC, you gotta learn to just cut loose... foot loose...

[RayFrost]

RayFrost and Cobalt, what is the point of the current conversation?

It's for the lulz.

Sometimes, SC, you gotta learn to just cut loose... foot loose...

RayFrost might be scum (remember, joking is a HUGE scumtell!), but given how he's interacting with Cobalt I'm guessing he's just being an idiot. Not sure about that, though...

I've yet to have a game withn my recent history where I

didn't

joke around at some point in the game.

[RayFrost]

unvote, vote: tarhalindur

I'm on M_O's side with this.

[RayFrost]

Neto's looking for something to do battle with.

Wait until he gets a reply on that.

[RayFrost]

Yay, I'm back!

So, we either have a third party (maybe a SK?) somewhere or another mafia team, right?

I still think lynching the mod is a good idea. Who knows, maybe that's a third party we're looking for.

Welcome back, explain what happened to you.

Eeehhh, I wouldn't trust that to be true, as there may be a vig with just one maf group.

Assuming more than one mafia right off the bat isn't exactly healthy.

[RayFrost]

Also, I really dislike your belief that we should lynch the mod.

FoS: Snow_Bunny

[RayFrost]

Reasoning for SC suspicion?

Also, why the assumption of one maf group?

Spoiler 2:

[RayFrost]

I have no idea what happened. I just got removed from the game, and I have no idea why or why I returned.

I support a massclaim as well.

RF: Reasons of why you dislike my belief that we should lynch the mod?

I dislike your belief that we should lynch the mod because there is no support that the mod is even in this game.

[RayFrost]

2. RayFrost (1)

3. StrangerCoug (0)
4. DisCode (0)
5. Snow_Bunny (0)
7. Kairyuu (0)
9. Leech (0)


Not Voting (6): RayFrost, DisCode, Kairyuu, StrangerCoug, Leech, Snow_Bunny

Is this correct? O.o

That particular votecount reflects the truth

[RayFrost]

Guys, I reeeeaaally dislike how there's a mystery vote on me from who knows where.

Anybody care to explain / speculate for me on this, cuz I don't get it.

[RayFrost]

spoiler 6, combined with neto's post, makes me rofl.

Also, I think whoever got motivated should claim that during the MC.

As it is, I've got one vote on me already from a mystery patron, so one more vote would allow a maf QL

[RayFrost]

I will comply with Kairyuu's desires that I claim first and am Sakutarou, vanilla townie. I had the Witch's Friend ability last night, too, which leads me to believe that Netopalis neighborized me. Either ill-targeted or ill-timed, if you ask me, because even though I'm on almost every day, I am away from home a lot five days a week. I made

ONE

post in the whole thing, and I wish I had the time to make it more useful.

Snow_Bunny, you're next to claim.

wut?

netopalis is a

townie motivator

, not a neighborizer.

wtf.

[RayFrost]

What is the difference then? I see no other way to explain my temporary ability.

I don't fully understand your ability.

and motivator gives somebody a double vote.

Shit, really? Oh Goddammit

[RayFrost]

That's the problem with having an amazing town reputation. People hate on you. With bullets.

haters gonna hate

*salute*

[RayFrost]

I just thought of something. We've got 2 confirmed townies. Scum (and SK, if there is one) were EXTREMELY stupid not to off me last Night.

Reason I'm confirmed town:

I saw RayFrost target Navy N1. Since CSL is the mafiate who both killed and redirected Navy N1, neither I or RayFrost can be mafia. Also, since we targetted Navy, and not magnus, we also cannot be the SK (assuming there is one).

So Ray and I are confirmed town.

@Ray: I believe you should be given the final position on the massclaim, as you're a confirmed town power role, but you might still be able to CC a scum claim for type.

You forget the possibility of multiple killers targeting the same person.

I am in no way confirmed town. Technically, neither are you, but I'm willing to bet that you are town by virtue of your role being confirmed.

All you know about me is I'm somebody that targeted Navy. I could be a mafioso to an opposite group or a SK, so you can't dismiss me as confirmed town.

[RayFrost]

dude... your logic is confusing me... x.x

I'm like... seriously unable to figure out your thought process.

[RayFrost]

Also, complimentary spoiler.

[RayFrost]

First, multiple killing groups did NOT target anyone, because a) there would have been multiple kill flavors per death, and b) the kill flavors would likely have changed between N1 and N2, unless you're arguing that there are 3 killing factions and that the same 2 picked the same target 2 Nights in a row.

Second, the mafia are down to a roleblocker, who targetted me N2 (by virtue of my action failing). The ONLY way for this to be you is if the scumgroup was stupid enough to send a kill, a redirect, AND a roleblock to Navy N1. Considering that magnus was in the group, that is HIGHLY unlikely, and only possible if he predicted the exact role I have targetting Navy, and then the owner of said role reacting EXACTLY as I have.

Following from that, because both of us are CONFIRMED to have targetted Navy N1, we could not have targetted magnus. If the person who killed magnus is an SK, that means we CANNOT be that SK. This leaves no question that you and I are town.

Okay, I'm going to attempt to prove you wrong here...

1. you dunno if multiple kill flavors would show up, as there are very aggressive kill flavors (i.e. moved to a deadly kakera) that would likely override others.

You argue that one mafia exists only, but there could be two in which we also have a SK, or there is a vig, that aids. (i.e. deadly kakera being mafia, sk/vig being arrow) Two mafia groups

may

end up targeting the same person.

So let's assume that I'm mafia group B.

CSL from mafia group A. redirects the JOAT to themself to avoid any kills or somesuch and also kills the JOAT

Me from mafia group B goes in to kill / RB the JOAT.

Note that I may also have done a RB / kill on the JOAT while doing a RB / kill on somebody else at the same time, depending on the moderator's rules on this.

There is the possibility of a vig having been roleblocked at some point, meaning that the lack of three kills was caused by this (or one of x number of mafia groups being blocked), so your viewpoint is highly skewed and based off of the assumption that

I would have to be in the same mafia

as CSL, which isn't necessarily true.

With two mafia groups, I could be one of x number in the group (likely two, but may be more), which means that my partner could have done the kill, not me. So I'm confirmed not to have killed magnus, but I'm not confirmed to have not been mafia.

Your reasoning is flawed.

[RayFrost]

I mean seriously, who would have thought it would be this difficult to convince a player that he's confirmed, when he KNOWS HE'S A TOWN POWER ROLE. Honestly, just accept it already. Let the scum try to pick apart my reasoning. I know I'm right, and you know you're town, so I suggest you just leave it at that.

If I don't like your logic, I'm still going to pick at it. I'd rather people think I'm town

for valid reasoning

, but I concede your point now that you've broken it down more clearly.

[RayFrost]

Also, leech didn't say who should be next to claim.

[RayFrost]

Leech just claimed because he felt like it apparently.

Uh, no. I claimed because there was so much talk about the second kill, that I felt the need to explain what actually happened. Should I seriously have waited while you guys came to all sorts of incorrect conclusions? I saw reason to claim, so I did. Considering we all were going to eventually, I figured that I might as well get mine out there considering there was talk going on about my night ability.

This makes sense.

[RayFrost]

"But I can beat Bernkastel! So I'm like SUPER PAPER!"

Welcome to Umineko No

Na

ku Koro Ni Mafia,

RayFrost

. You are

LambdaDelta, Townie Rewarder

. You have the following abilities:

Passive Abilities:

You have no passive abilities

Active Abilties:

Witch's Gift

: Target a player at night. If that player is vanilla, they will be given a one shot ability. If that player has a passive or active ability, you will learn their role.[/i]

Win Condition (Town): You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated.

I targeted navy n1, obviously (this would either confirm Navy's role or damn navy, as I wasn't completely certain on the likelihood of navy being town). On n2, I targeted leech, and he's not lying about his role. I targeted leech because he had very few posts, and I felt his contributions were very limited and had little actual scumhunting relative to what I'd expect from previous experience with him.

Also, I am not informed about the actual details of the one-shot ability I give out.

I don't know whether I'd give a mafia goon of some sort an ability if I targeted them, but I'd assume that I wouldn't, as they have the ability to kill thanks to their faction.

I, having gotten the role from leech & navy, do know that I do not get alignment in my results, only the role. Though the mod (oh so helpfully ) provides a small comment saying that the win con and side are both removed.

Spoiler 4:

[RayFrost]

'ey kai, why, exactly, did you say you thought I was claiming scum RB?

and why, exactly, would I claim scum?

[RayFrost]

And you believe that I out and out revealed my hand for... what reason?

[RayFrost]

So, wait... is that tar?

[RayFrost]

contradiction

much?

[RayFrost]

Really need DisCode to post/claim.

And SC / leech to post.

I really have no idea on this.

I'm lost and need some peeps to talk to.

[RayFrost]

Umm Ray. Discode is conf-scum. All signs point to it.

Claims are important information.

Dis' claim may point to who his scumbuddy is, capiche?

[RayFrost]

I'm thinking that relates to SC somehow, but I dunno why.

[RayFrost]

Eeeehhhhhh, I'm leaning kai, but... x.x

[RayFrost]

then I'll go with my gut

vote: kai

mod: the post made through you includes a kai vote, but the vote count does not represent this. is this an error?

The votecount is (now) correct

[RayFrost]

You can see how I was freaking out at Glork replacing in and stressing over the high likelihood of him crushing me in the palm of his hand if you want