Mini 456: Ultimatum Mafia - Game Over!

[VanDamien]

I'm pretty suspicious of the whole nominate plan, and this is why. If we're nominating the challenger, especially this early, we're effectively giving either scum team a pass to challenge. If we're nominating the challengee, there's no reason for scum to jump on the challenge for safety, but they happily can with the majority already having stated who they prefer to be voted out through the nomination process.

[VanDamien]

The scum don't want to either offer or receive challenges -- as both give scum a chance of dying that staying out of the limelight Van Damien's post is nonsensical. I don't know that it's scummy, but I'm happy enough with my vote anyway.

The same coould be said for the townies, especially with two scum groups that could be cross-challenging. I find it nonsensical and WIFOMy to say that scum will act a certain way. What, make everyone belive they'll keep their heads down so that if you go on the atack and do bing the spotlight in your direction that it must mean your town? That's a line of thinking I don't think I'll be following.

[VanDamien]

If you did have to challange, who would you challange, and why?

I believe everyone answering this question would provide as much, if perhaps not more inormation that this silly nominating plan.

For me, it is curently a tie. One is mneme for adopting the atitude that information must be put forth in his way alone, and that no other opinions on the matter have any validity. The other is Sparks for acting so unbelieveable scummy and attempting to cast a cloud on me with his flat statements that I must be town.

Seriously, if you have something to say, an opinion to give, a viewpoint to share, than do so.

[VanDamien]

If someone could code a online sparks to english translator, my brain would thank you.

Regardless, I am more than willing to issue the first challenge; but will not do so unilaterally with more than 24 hours left to go before deadline can possibly hit.

[VanDamien]

First, Rules FTW:

Roles

You are

the liberal mafia with AAA and CCC.

You may talk with your fellow mafia until the game starts. The game will start 24 hours after the last confirm is in. I will notify you when this occurs. You may

NOT

PM your fellow mafia once the game begins.

Win condition: The liberal mafia is alive and outnumbers or equals all others still in the game.

Please confirm by PM

.

You are

the conservative mafia with XXX and ZZZ.

You may talk with your fellow mafia until the game starts. The game will start 24 hours after the last confirm is in. I will notify you when this occurs. You may

NOT

PM your fellow mafia once the game begins.

Win condition: The conservative mafia is alive and outnumbers or equals all others still in the game.

Please confirm by PM

.

You are a townie candidate from a minor political party. You are not allowed to communicate with any of the other players outside the thread.

Win Condition: You win with the Town when all evil is gone.

Please confirm by PM

.

I'm highly suspicious of experienced players not reading the roles in an open set-up, but that's for day 2.

I dislike dylan's newbie defense, although it gave me a chuckle given who he's challenged by. Vote-fishing I don't like either.

Sparks; well, Sparks is probably scum. But so is dylan. And as personally annoying, grating, and semi-incomprehensible as I find sparks, at the very least, he's sparked a lot of discussion.

[VanDamien]

The Fonz makes a valid point. Anyone who makes a challenge straight off the bat - in the first two RL days of a day - should be eliminated. From now on, I will always vote to save anyone challenged in the first two RL days of a day.

I'll then be nominating dylan first thing Day 2.

Contradict yourself much?

Beyond that, still waiting to hear more from Dylan - he's been posed several questions, and I'd like to hear the answers.

[VanDamien]

Camenbert and Brie?

Anyway, this line

Fonz, I really don't know how else to convince you but to say that later in the game you won't regret keeping me here. I can promise you that.

Reads to me like someone trying to alude to a pro-town power role. Except, well, they don't exsist here.

Vote: Sparks

[VanDamien]

No there is no chance Dylan is liberal, because I am.

Here's the deal; I know I have no chance of winning now. There's too much suspicion on me already, and I've made some bad choices. My side might have had a chance if Carrot hadn't gone and gotten himself modkilled, but there's nothing I can do about that.

So, I've been thinking whether I'd rather help the town or the conservatives win, and I've decided to help the town. That involves outing myself and offering myself to be used.

Town: you now have an opportunity to conduct lynches as normal if you desire. Nominate who you wish before deadline, and I'll challenge, giving a clear choice to all those who would vote: hunt conservative or not. I know I'll have to be lynched eventually, but that's the breaks.

[VanDamien]

Alternative possibility. If we let things get too close to the wire, we're opening up the possibility of Van changing his mind.

Huh? You thnk anyone will believe me if I try to retract? I'm a safe lynch at any day in the future.

VanDamien -
While I appreciate your offer to help us, I feel like your proposal is more for your own benefit to stay in the game. If we know you're a mafia, why shouldn't we lynch you?

I have guaranteed my own lynch, and the complete removal of the liberal mafia. In doing so I have given the town the opportunity to never have to have two townies challenging each other, as well as given them the ability to focus on finding only three other people, who are connected.

Furthermore, I have solidified the nomination process, enabling the town to get out as much information as possible.

I never said I shouldn't be lynched. I'm saying I shouldn't be lynched as long as I'm useful, which I don't expect to last more than one to two days.

[VanDamien]

So I've been challenged. Should I defend myself now? Tell you all how I am not scum?

Yeah, right.

To my claim being a conservative gambit: that is pretty ridiculous. With the win conditions as they are, the remaining conservatives have every reason to try and protect all three of their members. I have guaranteed my eventual lynch, whether it ends up being oday or over the next couple of days.

If nothing else, Sparks obviously fingered me as one of his scumbuddies, and I very obviously attempted to distance from him. Like I said before, Carrot was our side's best chance of winning, and he was modkilled. I'm not proud of my play in this game day one, to say the least. But lessons learned.

BM's move was insanely anti-town. Even if I had ended up today's lynch regardless, much more could have been done to find the cons, with a town nomination and my challenging.

My gut tells me that the cons are Fonz, dylan, BM at this point.

[VanDamien]

This is a strange post for me to write.

First, dylan's vacation notice smacks of a "don't lynch me while I'm gone" appeal to emotion, when it looks like he's going to be challenged today. With the case as presented, as well as his refusal to answer the Fonz's question - he seems highly likely to be a Con.

That said, and here's the strange part, I'm going to be out of town from Sunday through Thursday. I hereby proxy my challenging power to the consensus of the town. That is, if a majority nominate one person to be challenged, and that I should do it, consider me to have issued the challenge.

[VanDamien]

Ok, my end has been sent to the mod. If we hit deadline, I'll be challenging dylan. I had been hoping I could use the nomination system to become the tool of the town I have offered to be, but rules are rules, and this seemed the most likely consensus. See you all when I get back.

[VanDamien]

Okay, back from my trip, and recovered from the illness it caused.

First of all, Dean, as I clearly reminded everyone earlier, scum cannot communicate in this game after it started, we could only discuss strategy before it actually started. Unfortunately for me, my side didn't get many messages back and forth to do that.

Secondly, I am liberal - as I stated earlier. At the time I came out, such a gambit would have been completely idiotic, and would have gained nothing. If I had waited until the game was in the situation it is in now, then maybe there would be reason to suspect otherwise.

I really am beginning to think we saved the wrong person during the last challenge.

[VanDamien]

This will be my only chance to vote before deadline, so

Vote:Albert B. Rampage

.

Honestly,. I'm not entirely sure mneme is scum, though I do remember thinking early on that it was possible the mneme was a rival, nothing concrete, but I'm fairly confident Al is town.

[VanDamien]

Well, not that it matters, but

Vote: Mr Stoofer

[VanDamien]

Bah!

Vote:Mr Stoofer

[VanDamien]

Van Damien -- Surviving so long and voting quite impressively, imo, was an accomplishment after you partners slacked on you day one. In a 1-1-1 situation, if I was town I would definitely have thrown the game to you .

Props to the Cons, you played well - but the above situation was exactly what I was hoping for when I came out, so yes, in a way, I was playing the only tactic I had left at my disposal, that if we got to a prisoner's dilemma the town would give the game to someone who had admitted to being scummy very early. Gotta give it to Albert, there, because it was headed in exactly the right direction until I became convinced he was town.

[VanDamien]

The ultimate point here is, howwever, assuming subsequent lynches had occured as they did - your lynch over mine, BM, mad no difference in the way the game ended.

Beyond that - going against the status quo is exactly what outed both me and sparks.