Mini 422 - Paranoia Mafia - Game Over

[chaotic_diablo]

Flavor-wise, I don't think his role makes any sense. If any of us has information that is inappropriate for our clearance level, then we're killed. I'm not quite sure how knowing the entire game set-up is proper green clearance. It should be ultraviolet or something. I'm not even sure why he would have information pertaining to higher clearance levels.

[chaotic_diablo]

Clearance has nothing to do with my ability. Extreme Luck is my mutant power. And yes, I was confused to.

Yet your ability obviously enjoys the benefit of revealing our clearance levels. The only plausible explanation I can think of is that your ability will list everyone as "townie", given that everyone should have received the townie pm. Being scum just means you received a different win condition.

I'm not getting a protown feeling from Peter's no-defense explanation. The "I don't like him so I hammered" is a really poor excuse to sound protown.
However, killajay did mistake his vote for the hammer, so I'm guessing he intended to hammer PWS without the claim. Then again, fonz mentioned that it was his first post on the site?

vote Peter Venkman

fos killajay

[chaotic_diablo]

Killajay, do you have any arguments against me that you aren't guilty of yourself?

The more you ignore me the more I think the answer is "no." If you really were town you would realize the nature of your mistake and apply it to someone who did the same. That you are content to see my lynch solidifies my opinion that you are scum.

The same partially goes for the players who are voting me and not Killajay.

Since you asked so nicely. Killajay isn't guilty of placing the lynching vote. There was a vote count three posts above the hammer. There was no deadline and plenty of time to ask for a claim or any other pieces of information. Even if you had voiced your feelings previously, you were the last one to place your vote. Voicing your opinion and then failing to follow through until the last minute is scum riding the bandwagon. This also contradicts what you stated earlier with killajay.

In fact, if you feel I am such a good candidate why aren't you voting on me? I already claimed. You won't even be accused of quick lynching.

Why didn't you vote PWS earlier if you had voiced suspicions? Is it because you didn't think he was a good candidate? If that is true, then why did you lynch him? I'm boggled at the moment of how crappy the arguments both you and killajay are throwing out without thinking.

So anyway, my votes on you.

Y'know, probably the ONLY reasons I believe PV are that I voted for PWS too, and that I'm pretty sure that he's smart enough to come up with a better excuse than that for lynching, if he was scum. But maybe not...

Crap logic.

the way i see it... it seems as if everyone is FOS on me so why should I have suspicions...

I have suspicions because you placed someone at -1 lynch. However, you regarded your vote as the hammer. Your excuse is nearly the same as Peter's. I feel that both Peter and you might be scum buddies together and are distancing from each other.

[chaotic_diablo]

@Chaotic> If we BOTH are scum, and we both know the other is on the chopping block too, why even bother with the pretense? It takes four to lynch, surely if we both were scum we would force a majority of the remaining players to achieve the lynch.

Good point. I'll think it over. The recent vote count is weird.

In addition, how do you feel about Mr. Flay and TCS voting on Killajay instead of myself?

Flay's vote isn't picking up as suspicious.

TCS's vote is strange. He placed another bandwagon at -1, thereby stalling and giving you an escape path. I've been in one game (I believe it was diablo mafia)when we had a -1 wagon on scum. TSQ replaced in and created a whole new bandwagon (which also caught up to -1) for us to discuss. Not only did it confuse us from lynching scum on our original bandwagon, TSQ turned out to be scum as well.

[chaotic_diablo]

I'm going to keep my vote on Peter for now. Fonz seems to know something or found a contradiction in Peter's role.

[chaotic_diablo]

Peter, Fonz called you a liar because you claimed something that didn't sit well with him. He did not call you out because "you were in a position to hammer".

[chaotic_diablo]

At that particular moment, you claimed townie. It is reasonable to assume that if someone has information that contradicts what you posted, they will come up. Let me give you an example.

All I received in my PM has been posted in the second post of this game. PWS posted it too.

You stated that all you received was what was posted on the front page. However, Maz Medias said something different.

OOC: Actually, not EVERY PC is a mutant. Just a whole lot of them. Every player character IS a secret society member, though.

Now, since you replaced Maz Medias, it is safe to assume that both you and Maz Medias are part of a Secret Society. In this way, you could not have received only the posts on the front page. Thus you're an instant liar.

This doesn't really prove you scum, so it's really useless to bring it up. Withholding information until scum can be caught is a viable strategy and not suspicious.

[chaotic_diablo]

I'm not quite sure what killajay means by "comes in near a lynch".

[chaotic_diablo]

I am neither. I am just a plain townie.


What I meant Diablo is everytime someone is close to being lynched you show up. I speed voted and will remove it for now.

UNVOTE

FOS: Chaotic Diablo
Peter Venkman
Stark

That doesn't seem like a case to me. I'm not even sure if it's a true accusation in the first place, so whatever.

I think Coron is more than capable of getting himself killed with any role.

[chaotic_diablo]

I have to agree with Peter.

[chaotic_diablo]

Peter, can you give us the name of the person you replaced? You made a fake name earlier in order to go with the flavor. Frankly, I don't even believe you received the same townie pm as everyone else. The name mechanics can be found in one of the links on the front page.

[chaotic_diablo]

I'm not sure what you're asking for. If you are too lazy to look at the title page I'm not sure why I should do the work for you. Earlier I was signing my name based on my understanding of the naming conventions. Other than quoting my role PM directly I don't know how I can give you the information you are asking for. I've already provided it in various forms.

I'm sorry, I didn't make it clear enough. Please reveal Maz Media's code-name. That isn't a violation of the rules.

[chaotic_diablo]

My sig from earlier used the exact same convention that one would use to get Maz's code-name. I feel there is a fine line here between what constitutes a quote from the role PM. Being that the ONLY place I could get Maz's information would be my Role PM, I feel it would be against the rules to tell you directly. Still, you shouldn't have much trouble replacing Maz's name into my own.

The Fonz already revealed his code name, DA-G-EN-2. Line is now nonexistant. Stop the stalling.
What I want to know is if you received the same townie pm as the rest of us. The front page does not give us a gurantee and insteads gives us a

should have

. If you have received the pm, then you should have Maz's code name. If not, then you have no choice but to fake one.

The reasons why I don't believe you is because of your excuse and earlier name convention. Your excuse for not receiving a win condition is because your role has some "special power". Now, let me summarize it: you're a power role that has no alignment. That's what you're telling us, and I don't buy it.
Your fake name earlier leads me to believe that you didn't receive Maz's code name and opted to make yourself one. While you may state that you found the naming conventions simply by looking at Maz's code name, it also holds true that the front page has information on how to understand the naming convention.

What do you think about the rest of my post?

I think the rest of your post is BS.

There is a deadline, and Killajay will be lynched. I assume from your vote you think I am the scummyest player. Why than would you sit back on the sideline with a parked vote and let another player get lynched? Why aren't you talking to the town and presenting your argument? Do you think it is okay to let a lynch happen with less than a majority?

What argument do you want me to present? That I find you suspicious for reasons already presented earlier? Its obvious that I have to find a new argument to work with. I found one, so I'm here. What's your argument?

[chaotic_diablo]

Your excuse for not receiving a win condition is because your role has some "special power". Now, let me summarize it: you're a power role that has no alignment. That's what you're telling us, and I don't buy it.

Quote me making those claims. You are not being truthful.

To my knowledge I am vanilla town. I did not receive anything

after

the vanilla town PM, including a win condition. I know my role PM was missing information, as to how much I do not know. I have said so repeatedly.

I'm frustrated with this game, and I'm sure that is apparent. However, please do not put words in my mouth. You are mistaken, and an admittance would be appreciated.

-Peter

I've been led to believe you had a power.

That is an astute point. I agree with you and it explains a hell of a lot about my confusion.

For full discloser, all I really did receive was the very first part of the "townie" role PM. I didn't even get a win condition. I asked Thesp if part of my role information had not been sent to me, and the answer I received was yes, but no further information was given. I thought it was flavor of the game.

You attempted to confirm your claim by having someone who isn't playing the game to confirm it. If the mod knows you were missing information, then why doesn't he just give it to you? If it was due to flavor, then why did the other replacements have no such occurances? It's obvious the mod is withholding it because of role abilities that you claim to not know about.

This leads me to have doubts.
1. Why are you using the mod to confirm your defense?
2. Why would the mod tell if you were missing information. Couldn't he have told you as he pmed you your role?
3. Is this a piece of information he really intended you to have?
4. Why did you bring attention to yourself and state that you had no win condition? Why would you go through with the "extra mile"?

I have more, but I'll wait.

So Mas and I very well could have received different role PMs. I have no idea, and it makes my own defense meaningless. I'll learn my role with the rest of you when this game is over. What complete and utter garbage.

Your next paragraph states that you could have received a different role pm than Maz. If that's the case, then what assurance do we have that you really did receive the townie pm? Is this really a townie role? Are you sure you have no special abilities?

Peter, give us Maz's code name. Stop avoiding it. I want to know if you received the townie pm or not.

[chaotic_diablo]

I think I'll also go for Mr. Flay's claim. A pressure vote at -1 wasn't necessary at that point. Especially when all Peter had to do was reveal Maz's code name. That's just the short reason.

Something just occured to me. There's the issue with Peter's role. Was he really bastard modded? I don't really believe that is possible since Thesp would have made amends for it. Someone's role ability set Peter up. Probably another Mutant like Sefer. Machine Empathy? Afterall, Thesp is playing as the "computer" for the theme. I think there's another scum group.

[chaotic_diablo]

Could you elaborate on B a bit more? I don't quite understand it.

[chaotic_diablo]

Venkman stated that he only received part of his role. If he was a mutant, then he never received the pm he was supposed to receive stating what power he had. In otherwords, if Peter was a mutant, he wouldn't know.

Who the hell is CO?

[chaotic_diablo]

Bah, and I'm guessing you have an explanation?

[chaotic_diablo]

My guess is that Flay is searching for unregistered mutants.

If you received an Enemy of the Computer from Sefer, then it's because Sefer had machine empathy. In the theme, Machine Empathy is highly intolerable and the person would be killed once discovered.

I don't have an explanation if it was Sarcastro.

[chaotic_diablo]

I'm DIAMOND-R-AWK-1 with red clearance. I am a member of the Anti-Mutants. My mutant power is the power to morph into a bunny each night. I'm a vanilla townie.

[chaotic_diablo]

Next? Fonz and killajay claimed townie, you claimed redirector, and flay claimed an investigative role. That's everyone.

[chaotic_diablo]

Bah, and I'm guessing you have an explanation?

Killajay did not NK last night. I trust TCS, and am more inclined to trust Flay than you. Therefore, it follows that you likely performed the NK.

Vote: Chaotic Diablo

I fail to see why you would trust Flay more than me. So I'd like an explanation.

[chaotic_diablo]

Yes, that's right, Flay, there's so little reason to vote for the guy who's barely registered on my radar for good or ill, all game, over the guy who has consistently given me the impression that he's viewing the game from a similar perspective to mine, (see your replacing in and appearing to spot the same kinda thing in PWS as I did, amongst others). I could be wrong. But I believe TCS, therefore Killajay did not NK, and I find your claim stronger, and your general play townier, than CD's. Hence, the vote.

What exactly makes Killajay less suspicious than me? TCS's result simply states that Killajay didn't perform the kill. It does not say that Killajay isn't scum. This is a perspective that Flay himself brought up. This leads me to doubt whether you trust Flay as much as you do. Your vote is based on the level of "trust" a player has. Therefore logically Killajay should be much higher on your suspicion list than I and earn your vote. Since that isn't the case, we can look into your statement that "cleared" Killjay: TCS's result. But wait, Flay already argued that statement.

Then you have the statement that Flay's claim is "stronger". Flay claimed an investigative role that doesn't work. How is this any different from claiming a townie? It isn't stronger at all.

[chaotic_diablo]

I have read back through and I am thinking we can live with...

VOTE: No Lynch

My reasoning for being quiet... PC issues

I'm not following the no lynch rationale. Please explain a bit more.

[chaotic_diablo]

I'm no sure why this game is so inactive. That it is makes me somewhat afraid that there are actually two scum left, lurking to kill us all at lylo.

But if you guys don't care about this game, neither do I.

Vote: The Fonz

Alright, neither do I.

vote Mr. Flay

[chaotic_diablo]

If we all vote for one other person, do you think the Computer will just kill us all?

Why are you voting me, c_d?

Fonz is voting me because he doesn't trust me, not because he can find anything scummy off me. TCS is voting Fonz without an explanation. You're out to get Killajay yet haven't made a reasonable case other than his two quicklynch scenarios. Killajay is voting no lynch for reasons he hasn't explained. If everyone else gets a crappy vote that doesn't do anything, then I get one to.

Just kidding. To me, your -1 lynch on Peter really bothers me. Apparently you stated that it was "mercy killing" and you needed to find the "truth". I took that as a sign as though you were desperate and accepting enough to let Peter get lynched. When Killajay obliged and you jumped on it, it bugged me. You also stated in a previous post about the risk of going -1.

Hammering is placing the lynching vote. A risk of being at lynch-1 in the vote count is that scum (or anyone) can lynch you before you have a chance to respond.

I really want to hear from The Fonz, if that was an ability claim.

Using that logic, you risked placing peter at -1 so that he wouldn't have a chance to respond when quick lynched. I'm sure this probably isn't the case, but as I said, it bugs me.

Then your claim comes in. Your role does absolutely nothing. You also refer to ideas that others have brought up to support your claim. Bastard moddery from Peter and player interference from me. In addition, I'm not quite sure what's the purpose of searching for mutants. Even if you could determine who is a mutant or not, how exactly does this fit into the theme or benefit town for that matter? Even when you investigated Sefer who had "Machine Empathy" a definite scum mutant power listed in one of the paranoia links, you didn't catch anything. Let me quote the sentence.

Mutations include abilities such as invisibility or pyrokinesis, ranging to largely harmless ones such as a constant runny nose, to more exotic ones such as machine empathy (the only mutation that invariably leads to termination when discovered).

You are a townie with a glorified power that doesn't do anything.

Those are the only things I have to support my vote. Other than that, I'm just sitting here twiddling my thumbs.

[chaotic_diablo]

You're right, my role does absolutely nothing, as far as I can tell. So far no one's role has been proven to do anything, as far as I can tell. If someone knows otherwise, they damn well better speak up!

unvote, Vote: chaotic_diablo

- that was the weakest case for an endgame vote I've ever seen.

Actually, your role is a role that has no use even if it did work properly. Even if you succesfully look for mutants, what exactly does your role accomplish? How does it benefit town? So you find someone to be a mutant, now what? We get nil, zip, nothing from your "investigative role".
Even Stark has claimed that if his role worked, then we would find scum. He even listed the details and specifics.
Just because there hasn't been a role proven to work succesfully, it doesn't mean there aren't any. It just happens that your role doesn't provide in any way, which causes me to believe it's a fake claim.

In addition, you put me at -1 when you are suspicious of killajay, who freakin hammered Peter. You either want me to get lynched quickly or refuse to take the time to discuss.

[chaotic_diablo]

No one else is voting killajay. I'd move my vote back there in a heartbeat if someone would, but this game was going NOWHERE for more than a week with my vote there. Either we're not at lynch-or-lose, or the major lynch targets have been scum, because there's been more than enough time for a quicklynch in the last two month. I'm willing to bet the former.

So because my role would do nothing, it must be a fake claim? Riiiight. If I was fake-claiming, why the &*%&^$#% would I claim a role that does zilch?? stark's claim was equally improbable from the other direction, but we'll never know because of his death.

It goes with the same reasoning as why Peter would claim he would be missing parts of his pm.

Faking a role that does zilch makes it more believable to some people. Since Peter just claimed a role with missing elements, it's possible a fake role can be made to take advantage of it. Which brings me back to what you said when your role probably didn't work because of "Bastard Moddery," and "Player Interference".

[chaotic_diablo]

Uhhh? If the first post can be trusted (and if it can't, I'll vote myself right now), Peter was Pro-Town. So presumably he was telling the truth.

Which also means it's a viable method to get people to believe it a second time.

I don't even understand what you're trying to say here. Either the role doesn't work because of "bastard moddery" (since at least one dead pro-town player claimed a mutant power) and I'm effectively naïve, or someone's interfering. I don't know what it would do if it worked properly, because to date I haven't gotten any useful information out of it!

Since Peter supposively experienced Bastard Moddery, it's also possible that scum can use this reasoning to support a claim that cannot be proven or "cleared". When you stated the reasoning to why your role wouldn't work, it seemed like a very viable scum strategy to me.

[chaotic_diablo]

I don't consider Missing Role PM Information to be Bastard Moddery, just Incompetent Moddery (no offense, Thesp). And it still doesn't explain why you think I would,

given a choice

, craft a fake roleclaim that would do nothing useful. Why not use my cleverness to craft a way to obtain a mislynch, for example?

A fake claim of townie would do nothing useful, that causes suspicion on those townies endgame. It is more likely that a "potential" power role would escape suspicion. Our list of lynch candidates only consists of townies.

Crafting a claim to mislynch is risker and more difficult than crafting a claim to look innocent. Would you be clever enough to convince us not to observe your actions and results closely?

[chaotic_diablo]

Crafting a claim to mislynch is risker and more difficult than crafting a claim to look innocent. Would you be clever enough to convince us not to observe your actions and results closely?

In a word, yes. Have you read my prior games as scum??

Your logic is still shaky, but I'm not convinced you're the play for today.

Vote: killajay

No I haven't read any of your prior games. It would be helpful if you pointed me to the right direction.

[chaotic_diablo]

I've just thought of a better way to explain my point. I'm not saying that your roleclaim is fake because it does nothing, I'm saying that it's fake because it's a power role that can't be confirmed. Confirming a role reveals you as scum, so claiming an investigative role with useless results prevents us from confirming if your role is real or fake.
I think that's the best way to make my argument more clear.

I'll read your prior games when I have the time.