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[JacksonVirgo]

[JacksonVirgo]

Look at the first letter of each word!!!

I really hope to DETECT the mafia while I'm CHECKING if people look SUSPICIOUS in my JAIL that is also a GUNSMITH and that no one finds my illegal DOCTOR practice

Idcsjgd

U wot m8

[JacksonVirgo]

Oh my

[JacksonVirgo]

Okay.

VOTE: Dwlee99

So you ARE a simp for them.

[JacksonVirgo]

Can we flash wagon Not Mafia?

That's tempting, but I think we can also wait for him to be replaced out.

Alice, Uglyduck, and Jackson are the only three that came in and posted without giving a vote. Could it be that they don’t want anything to be traced back to them?

Not posted yet: Andres, Kyouko, Not_Mafia, and MargotRosa.

VOTE: Uglyduck[/c]

Discuss.

Imagine thinking first-post votes actually matter

[JacksonVirgo]

Nobody should publically CC. NM gets naturally resolved tonight. If he's true claiming then mafia deals with him. If he's fake claiming then the real Vig's bullet will be the CC.

Agree that if they are not Vig, then real vig should not CC.
However, the rest of it is not that simple.

I would normally say that vigilante should never counterclaim and just shoot them instead if possible, and I usually would not have an issue with an early likely-meme claim but in this specific setup, but with a mafia watcher and doctor that could very well be a play to get N_M shot and possibly healed to get the vigilante outted and kill them off early.

Not saying that's what I believe is happening, but it's one possible play that I do not want to have overlooked.

[JacksonVirgo]

Considering his track record I’m not inclined to believe N_M unless there’s no counterclaim.

This is obviously implying he has "done stuff like this before". Has he done this... stuff like this? Save me some time please, and just help fill in the meta for someone that does not know it.

NM is very much a chaos-based player.

[JacksonVirgo]

I personally find shooting early as town vig to be kind of a negative utility role use - am I alone on that one?

It

is

more likely to kill a Town, but so is by day-elims. Vigilante is essentially a town-controlled elim so not using it can also be seen as negative utility, again from my own standards.

[JacksonVirgo]

I personally find shooting early as town vig to be kind of a negative utility role use - am I alone on that one?

It

is

more likely to kill a Town, but so is by day-elims. Vigilante is essentially a town-controlled elim so not using it can also be seen as negative utility, again from my own standards.

In other words I like to think, if it's got more chance of killing scum than not at all, go for it unless it is super detrimental to the Town. Although, take this from someone who hasn't played in this sites meta in a while and in a different community.

[JacksonVirgo]

Shooting gives us two chances to get an extra town-controlled kill, so it's good

I said this :'c

[JacksonVirgo]

Did you mention that we can get an extra one though

Cause if you're on odds and you only get one shot it isn't another town controlled kill cause you use an elimination

You also get conftown though in a closed which is good

What do you mean another one? We get the day-elim and the night-elim. We don't get more than that no?

I am so confused by what you are saying.

[JacksonVirgo]

Okay let's no lim

VOTE: No Lim

After all, we are more likey to kill scum than town here

Is this a joke?

[JacksonVirgo]

Town than scum*

Difference between the vig shot and a lynch (are we still using lynch on this site here? sorry if not) is that it forces people to cast a vote. They are both more likely to find Town on Day 1/Night 1, but with the vig kill... it is just what that person thought, and they are confirmed town on flip so it gives us no re read potential. A mislynch otoh, especially on day 1, can be extremely valuable.

We use "elimination" here mainly iirc.

[JacksonVirgo]

Are you saying that Vigilante shouldn't shoot early-game because it will give us no information based on vote patterns etc?

[JacksonVirgo]

2021 and we're talking about how vigs work.

Shush oldie

[JacksonVirgo]

Oh my

[JacksonVirgo]

Based on fact that Jackson is active and didn't get prodded or replaced out he is very likely Town.

Activity doesn’t necessarily equate to towniness.

He just doesn't have games where he was active as scum. Maybe he doesn't like playing scum and replace out when he roll it.

Ummmm, please do not make this type of read on me because it's not true. Maybe my last few scum games from the site has me not active, but my scum games are my most active games, period. Compared to my Town games.

[JacksonVirgo]

JacksonVirgo is also probably Town in my mind. That one is early though.

I don't want to get pocketed here, mind explaining this?

[JacksonVirgo]

I actually agree with the Mozamis wagon, and I think Jackson is suspicious for similar reasons given his most prevalent discussion of the game thus far has been vigilante mechanics without scumhunting whatsoever. They're my top two scumreads, but I'm not going to vote there until Ugly answers my question.

u wot, nothings happened.

[JacksonVirgo]

*click*

Slide 3. Jacksonvirgo is a pinch suspicious. Why should vig shoot a meme claim? Yes sir. I haven't considered that .. it could be that Not Mafia was fishing for a cc but that is a little ridiculous. Mhm.
Uglyduck mentioned not having vig shoot. I've thought about it and disagree. Mhm. Yeah of course there are some benefits but I think before there are actual risks, there is no reason to hold back.

No elim? Dwlee has a nice frog hat though. Alright thank you sir.

*click*

I never suggested vig to shoot the claim. I normally would but not in this setup

[JacksonVirgo]

I’m contributing my fair share. Don’t look at me.

This feels slippy, like when you're posting what you're thinking but it betrays a scum perspective
VOTE: fua

JV's saying what I'm thinking but he said it in real time already so very +town there

Pocket accepted

[JacksonVirgo]

Apologies for not posting much. Haven't got much time between work and getting the first dose of the vaccine today.

[JacksonVirgo]

Apologies for not posting much. Haven't got much time between work and getting the first dose of the vaccine today.

That sounds more like scum Jackson.

U wot

[JacksonVirgo]

Actually.

VOTE: Jackson for contributing nothing beyond the occasional commentary on posts directed towards him.

I literally explained my situation dumbass

[JacksonVirgo]

Actually.

VOTE: Jackson for contributing nothing beyond the occasional commentary on posts directed towards him.

I literally explained my situation dumbass

And yet you still have time to pop in and make witty remarks every time you get shaded...

I pop in whenever I am able to pop in and usually that's just at the bus stop or right before going to bed , I am not going to stop work midshift to check a fuckin' forum game.

[JacksonVirgo]

Hey eveyrone, apologies for being so inactive work has me fucked. But it's my nights off now so Ill have time to properly read, thanks for waiting owo

[JacksonVirgo]

I’m contributing my fair share. Don’t look at me.

This feels slippy, like when you're posting what you're thinking but it betrays a scum perspective
VOTE: fua

JV's saying what I'm thinking but he said it in real time already so very +town there

I did make a joke about a pocket or whatnot about this post but in seriousness I think this style of a read they made is very similar to how I try to read early-on as Town so I'll give this a townpass.

[JacksonVirgo]

I've decided to make a wall, since the topic currently is vastly different to what I am "caught up" to.

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler:

That's wild and oddly self-conscious of you. I'm just stating the obvious.

I can actually see where they are "self-conscious" here, so this read doesn't have

zero

backing. Their false meta-read on me can also read three ways.

1) They have meta-read every player here, as to which I do not believe they have.
2) They have played with me enough in the past to know my meta. I believe I have played with them at least once, but never to the extent where this could be a town-tell for me (especially since it's false).
3) They are making a weak pocket-play to get me to side with them or for them to push that I am Town so when I flip it doesn't go against them.

Scums really like to focus me and I don't know why, can you enlight me?

I do not like this post, like at all but I can't place it outside of just lamist.

i get tvt vibes from alice and three but i'm not sure

@NM: Shoot Alice if town does some dumb shit again and votes me out first.

i hate this so maybe not

Active progression is weakly +town.

That sounds more like scum Jackson.

Now that I have come back to this, is this a anti-vax joke or generally going against your earlier town-read on me?

Actually.

VOTE: Jackson for contributing nothing beyond the occasional commentary on posts directed towards him.

Weak opportunistic voting which you then back out just because Dwlee said that mozam was caught without even asking for reasonings.

Don't put the onus on me to prove I'm town under duress. Any singular slot on my wagon could unvote and give me space to play the game under normal conditions.

It isn't normal however to rep in to a slot condemned and be told to immediately claim and bleed town or they're dead. So I'll give my reads and town can look at the weakness of this wagon and find who attacked the opportunity of a vacant slot.

This is much more effective than granting myself agency for nightplay in a game I don't have stable footing in. Do with that what you will as far as a claim.

The balls on this dude is unreal lmao.

Idk how close deadline is but if you're already worrying about it then there isn't much I can do about being elimmed.

Slots that can die - Andres, std, three, iluv....I think fua might just be miselim bait but that's not solid.

Ugly, Alice, Aaron town. Jacksonvirgo has been ok as well. The rest are mehh.

This slot needs to get executed. Like now. Not sure why we’re giving this slot any room to operate.

Not the biggest fan of this, like at all.

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler:

That's wild and oddly self-conscious of you. I'm just stating the obvious.

I can actually see where they are "self-conscious" here, so this read doesn't have

zero

backing. Their false meta-read on me can also read three ways.

1) They have meta-read every player here, as to which I do not believe they have.
2) They have played with me enough in the past to know my meta. I believe I have played with them at least once, but never to the extent where this could be a town-tell for me (especially since it's false).
3) They are making a weak pocket-play to get me to side with them or for them to push that I am Town so when I flip it doesn't go against them.

Scums really like to focus me and I don't know why, can you enlight me?

I do not like this post, like at all but I can't place it outside of just lamist.

i get tvt vibes from alice and three but i'm not sure

@NM: Shoot Alice if town does some dumb shit again and votes me out first.

i hate this so maybe not

Active progression is weakly +town.

That sounds more like scum Jackson.

Now that I have come back to this, is this a anti-vax joke or generally going against your earlier town-read on me?

Actually.

VOTE: Jackson for contributing nothing beyond the occasional commentary on posts directed towards him.

Weak opportunistic voting which you then back out just because Dwlee said that mozam was caught without even asking for reasonings.

Don't put the onus on me to prove I'm town under duress. Any singular slot on my wagon could unvote and give me space to play the game under normal conditions.

It isn't normal however to rep in to a slot condemned and be told to immediately claim and bleed town or they're dead. So I'll give my reads and town can look at the weakness of this wagon and find who attacked the opportunity of a vacant slot.

This is much more effective than granting myself agency for nightplay in a game I don't have stable footing in. Do with that what you will as far as a claim.

The balls on this dude is unreal lmao.

Idk how close deadline is but if you're already worrying about it then there isn't much I can do about being elimmed.

Slots that can die - Andres, std, three, iluv....I think fua might just be miselim bait but that's not solid.

Ugly, Alice, Aaron town. Jacksonvirgo has been ok as well. The rest are mehh.

This slot needs to get executed. Like now. Not sure why we’re giving this slot any room to operate.

Not the biggest fan of this, like at all.

[JacksonVirgo]

Might as well go against the crowd.

VOTE: Andres

[JacksonVirgo]

Jackson the game you played with Alice was Town!Alice I'm assuming? Was meta a part of their game there?

All I remember is possibly playing with them, that's all I am going off.

[JacksonVirgo]

Reads:

Town:
Dwlee
N_M
UglyDuck

Townlean:
Alice
Ythan and Iluvythan? Not sure about these slots.
StD

Null:
A50
Jackson
Andres

Scumlean:
RC
Aaron
Three

Lockscum:
Kyoko

There.

Scum is more likely to post readlists than Town like this as it's content without actual content

[JacksonVirgo]

Reads:

Town:
Dwlee
N_M
UglyDuck

Townlean:
Alice
Ythan and Iluvythan? Not sure about these slots.
StD

Null:
A50
Jackson
Andres

Scumlean:
RC
Aaron
Three

Lockscum:
Kyoko

There.

Scum is more likely to post readlists than Town like this as it's content without actual content

Do you disagree with any placements? What do you need clarification on?

Oh my, what an elegant comeback to my shade. Serious O.O

Could you explain the Kyoko read? And how you're reading N_M as you are. The rest I couldn't care less about tbf, for now anyway

[JacksonVirgo]

I am actually done shook by fua with that comeback. Did you do that on purpose?

[JacksonVirgo]

If so that's impressive as fuck

[JacksonVirgo]

How should I have responded?

My Kyoko read is pretty simple. It feels like they're widening the lim pool by casting suspicion only on the easy slots (Myself, Dwlee, Not_Mafia) without actually providing any reads of their own beyond 'this looks town' or 'this doesn't look town', which is strange and doesn't feel like an attempt to solve so much as them already knowing peoples' alignments ahead of time. I really want this slot in particular to die.

N_M's alignment will be revealed anyway, and he claimed vigilante so I'm inclined to believe he either is vigilante or a VT trying to bait the NK, which are both town. If he's still alive later into the game he should probably be checked out.

And on second thought, I think both instances of the mozamis slot trying to pocket/TR me with flimsy reasoning is actually scum-indicative? Obviously I'm not

that

widely townread to begin with so it feels like they know my actual alignment and want to avoid detection by having the most active player on their side.

That doesn't inherit a lock-scum status though, not by a longshot. By saying it so, it's inherently discrediting the slot in a sense.

That is also not a reason to put N_M in your top town bracket. N_M would do that claim as any alignment, they're a chaos player. Your entire description does nothing but give me the signal that they should be in your null bracket.

Could you back up that mozami slot stuff with quotes I'd like to see them.

[JacksonVirgo]

Ignoring anything about the previous slot. Enigma has been townie, not really caring about dying when they were so close to it upon replacement. It could be a big brain play but honestly they're not going all the way with the "I dont care if I die" but rather subtle compared to how I would see scum do it to be rash and avoid needing to claim.

Does that make sense?

[JacksonVirgo]

Eh. They're the one I'm most confident is scum, and since they're not going to pop in to change that opinion today, that's my view on them. Maybe lockscum is the wrong word.

That makes sense, but I don't want to put EVERYONE in null-scum and N_M is easier to deal with if you assume he's town right off the bat. This is also kind of similar to his town play anyway. I'd be willing to put him down to townlean but not null just yet unless we get deeper into the game. Give me a bit and I'll find quotes.

Lockscum is most definitely the wrong word. Also you should never place people on a readlist differently because you don't want too many people in a bracket, that defeats the whole purpose of a readlist and makes it overly fabricated.

If you do them at all, place them where you actually feel they are so that people can gauge where you stand.

[JacksonVirgo]

wow normally these large games are mental, this is really quiet.
fua prvisional town read for his good spot about people posting without voting.

(In response to me pointing out people aren't participating in RVS, which is pretty weak reasoning.)

I'm going back and forth on Aaron/Jackson both just being town or being partners. Fua's read there is probably town indicative regardless of those two slots alignment.

There are a few more posts about why he townreads me, but it's not enough for me to put him deeper within the scumleans. Just that I don't have a very great feeling about that particular thought process. If we start running low on time I'll vote him though.

It could also be that both of the "instances" (as you put it) of their slot just town read you.

[JacksonVirgo]

Fair point. I'm just not the type of player who likes bloating the lim pool because that helps scum. Generally my way of going about it is to decide to townread players and make up my mind early on so I can just get on with checking out the players I'm more suspicious of without second-guessing myself all the time.

And that's a little confusing to me? Especially because nobody else is really putting me above null. Again, RC isn't my top choice here, but I'm not super opposed to limming him to the point where I'd stick my neck out or anything.

The elimination pool being too large isn't necessarily a bad thing, as if it's small it has less chance of actually having scum in it, especially early-game when we have barely any mechanical information. Mid to late game you should start to focus on shrinking that pool, but definitely not throwing people in the TR just because they'll be sorted later, that's asking to get cucked in the ass.

You're more than welcome to make your read while assuming they're trying to pocket you, but if you want to actually try and solve the slot try and think from their perspective in different ways such as if they were scum trying to pocket you or simply just town that town-reads your slot, if you think one is more likely than the other, feel free to use that as a case against them. Personally I don't think their TR on you means anything in particular.

[JacksonVirgo]

How should I have responded?

To anybody that needs clarification on this, they used a psychological tactic that essentially uno reverses a negative "attack" into one that makes them look better.

In this specific example, I called them out for having a read-list which is inherently content without the content. Instead of actually defneding themselves, they instead make themselves look better by NOT addressing that fact but instead "proving" that they aren't contentless by asking for clarification or if I disagreed.

This was so seamless it blew my mind, and it makes me cautious around their slot.

[JacksonVirgo]

How should I have responded?

To anybody that needs clarification on this, they used a psychological tactic that essentially uno reverses a negative "attack" into one that makes them look better.

In this specific example, I called them out for having a read-list which is inherently content without the content. Instead of actually defneding themselves, they instead make themselves look better by NOT addressing that fact but instead "proving" that they aren't contentless by asking for clarification or if I disagreed.

This was so seamless it blew my mind, and it makes me cautious around their slot.

I scum-lean their slot for this fwiw, not because they did it terribly but because it was so perfect it's hard to think it happened accidentally. Take it as a compliment

[JacksonVirgo]

I think that's how I always respond to that stuff hmm

Natural sociopath ey?

Don't sue me that's a joke.

[JacksonVirgo]

It was beginner’s luck.

I don't believe that for a second lmao

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: fua

I did have Andres as a tier above fua, but the reaction to kyouko where they needed to just blatantly throw shade at their slot once the heat pushed up against them is a failed vibe check.

I'm vibing here now. Andres a close second.

[JacksonVirgo]

Bruh.

VOTE: Andres

[JacksonVirgo]

Don't expect me to wagon with you just because you claimed PR, I don't think they're scum so I aint voting there.

[JacksonVirgo]

If you're not an option, Andres is the shank I want.

Can you explain why they're obvscum?

[JacksonVirgo]

They’re obviously scumming though. No townie would ever use their thought process to catch scum because it’s such an inherently flawed mindset to go about things with.

Just because it's flawed does not mean it's scummy.

[JacksonVirgo]

Their most recent post against me says ‘I didn’t read why Fua called me scum and I ignored it, but them saying a joke in response to Jackson’s statement means that they’re claiming scum in public’.

Quit the shade, it's baseless.

Unless you think I’m dumb enough to openly admit that I’m scum and have no self control when it comes to my thought process whatsoever than that is the completely wrong approach to reading me. Keep in mind that they’ve been doing nothing but handing out town or scumreads with no basis and putting sus on the easy targets (Me, Dwlee, N_M). If they aren’t scum they’re incredibly anti-town.

Scumread me too then because I followed that train of thought as well, up until you claimed PR,, which by all means could still have you scum but that's doubtful. What have they done that's particularly scummy rather than lacklustre as a town?

[JacksonVirgo]

Also if Kyoko is scum it clears Dwlee, N_M, and potentially RCE whereas Andres is a low-info flip.

How does it clear these? I don't think Dwee or RCE is scum anyway, so the flip is useless. I doubt it clears N_M at all.

[JacksonVirgo]

I’m not even shading, I’m just paraphrasing what they said.

And I know you follow that train of thought, because you’re not respecting me as a player or considering my point of view. And I just told you how their mindset and approach to pushing me is scummy and grasping at straws.

Anyway, you’ll see when I die tonight regardless that I’m telling the truth.

No, you

are

shading them.

And now you're shading me for not respecting you? What bullshittery is this.

You're not even countering my points, you're ignoring them and then throwing shade.

[JacksonVirgo]

1. Just because I do not follow your reads, does not mean I am not considering them.
2. In what way am I not respecting you as a player? Just because I don't want Town to die, you are taking that personally? Sorry bud but that's not how it works.
3. I thought you said scum wouldn't kill you -_-

[JacksonVirgo]

You literally just admitted that you were following the mindset of thinking I’m stupid enough to openly claim scum and have no filter or self control at all, so I should scumread you for the same reason I scumread Kyoko?

And scum wouldn’t kill me

if I didn’t claim

, since prior to this I was such easy miselim bait while Kyoko wasn’t getting any traction whatsoever.

I’m not going to argue with you. Vote Andre if you want, but Kyoko is obvscum.

I think you're taking what's being said completely wrong.

I don't think you're stupid enough to open-claim, because you didn't. You had a perspective-slip if anything, which again doesn't confirm you as scum regardless just makes you look scummier. Slips have nothing to do with intelligence hun.

If you scum-read that aspect of them and if I am doing it as well, then obviously scum-read me as well? Isn't that obvious?

What the fuck my dude. I am asking these questions because I want the game solved like everybody else, you're not helping by getting upset and then just blatantly shading and ignoring literally any point that counters your mindset.

[JacksonVirgo]

Like. You can see how this is frustrating for me right?

Sure, but is that why you're just ignoring what doesn't fit your thoughts? That's blind tunnelling

[JacksonVirgo]

Clean slate. I'll ask a few questions and you can answer them to the best of your ability, good with you?

What about Kyouko's alleged general underwhelming content scummy rather than just underwhelming Town (I also am not saying they're underwhelming I am using your case on them).

[JacksonVirgo]

I don’t know. On my end it feels like I’ve been trying to be patient and reasonable but then you change the subject immediately without addressing my points. I think it’d be best if we both took a moment and stepped away to clear our heads and look at the bigger picture/calm down.

What points do you feel I am ignoring, as I feel I've been responding to yours, apologies if this is the case.

[JacksonVirgo]

And being direct is better than leaving it temporarily and then still not getting it lol

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm sad because I knew Fua was pr and if they weren't night killed I could have been like "I kill Fua for being a PR but I didn't so I'm town"

You don't want to actually talk about the content that's just happened? Just useless self-image stuff?

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm sad because I knew Fua was pr and if they weren't night killed I could have been like "I kill Fua for being a PR but I didn't so I'm town"

You don't want to actually talk about the content that's just happened? Just useless self-image stuff?

Yea

Like how you changed your profile picture

What a lad you are ahaha.

[JacksonVirgo]

Dwlee now a null-town.

[JacksonVirgo]

That's from a TR btw

[JacksonVirgo]

Kyouko just isn't scum, or if they are the current reasonings I am hearing is nothing scummy in particular and feels awfully like scum pushed bullshit or cannot be backed up because it holds no actual weight.

[JacksonVirgo]

If Andres is scum and we flip Kyouko here I'm putting this exact post in my sig.

[JacksonVirgo]

I don’t know why Jackson’s was quoted.

I am just

that

cool ya know

[JacksonVirgo]

I don’t know why Jackson’s was quoted. But I’ll respond to it anyway. Kyoko is scum because their push is limited to one person and is incredibly opportunistic in addition to them not addressing any of my scumread on them at all. They’ve felt very dismissive and lurky and I would be incredibly surprised if they flipped green.

Being tunnelled is not scummy by any means, I used to just hard push one person to the death. It was a bad habit of mine but didn't make me scum.

Your scum-read on them seems very confusing to me, and your explanation of it for when you actually explain it doesn't really explain why they're scummy in comparison to just Town with a different playstyle to you.

[JacksonVirgo]

It was beginner’s luck.

Wait actually what? This completely betrays a scum mindset - you wouldnt think of this as beginner's luck if you were town. Beginner's luck is when you do something accidentally that helps you succeed. The way JV describes the response as being like, suave (?), like intentionally tricky I guess, and the for fua to say it is beginners luck is like, betraying that fua benefits from that kind of manipulation. They perceive that kind of response as something that is beneficial.to them that they did accidentally, and attribute it to beginner's luck.

Idk, I also might have missed whatever fua had to say about me but I felt when reading about why they say I'm scum, like this doesnt make sense?

I'll vote RCE for deadline if needed but until then I feel good about VOTE: Fua

I just don’t see this post ever coming from a townie. If you look at my pattern from this game (as well as the game that

they hosted

, you’d know that I tend to be very sarcastic and witty. I don’t ‘slip’, especially since I’m not scum.

Slips aren't purposeful and thus you can't say that you wouldn't ever slip, and even if you did that does not make both my own and their read on you to be not based in logic, as it is and if you weren't a PR claimant I would still be pushing you for it.

You cannot just assume people view you a particular way, yet here you are doing exactly that and then basing a read on how you assume people should be viewing you. What

[JacksonVirgo]

Fua I believe you're tunnelling too hard and that never helps anybody, except scum of course.

[JacksonVirgo]

Yeet

[JacksonVirgo]

Jackson what's your case on Andres besides the reaction to being scumread?

Overall opportunistic nature from what I am seeing as well as wanting to flat out push the agenda harder once people started backing off of you. Instead of giving even a thought to maybe your slot was town, just straight up pushing an agenda.

[JacksonVirgo]

Here's me submitting a motion eliminate Andres, on the condition that if he flips Town we insta elim both JV & ssbm next. JV is damn too sus (in addition to ssbm) for outing the JK AND still not voting ssbm after that. How say the TOWN??

What goes on in your head to make this a post.

I am scummy because I accidentally outted the JK? Nice

[JacksonVirgo]

If Andres flips green, then JV does look like he has been pushing away from the ssbm wagon.

That's because I have been as I haven't been given a valid reason as to why I shouldn't.

[JacksonVirgo]

If Andres flips green, then JV does look like he has been pushing away from the ssbm wagon.

That's because I have been as I haven't been given a valid reason as to why I shouldn't.

In which I asked and then fua just dipped

[JacksonVirgo]

Oh but it's easier to just not use your brain and actually try and explain the read, nah just wagon and then anybody that goes against it is also scum.

Very smart

[JacksonVirgo]

Jackson what's your case on Andres besides the reaction to being scumread?

Overall opportunistic nature from what I am seeing as well as wanting to flat out push the agenda harder once people started backing off of you. Instead of giving even a thought to maybe your slot was town, just straight up pushing an agenda.

Why does Kyoko get a pass for this when their case on me was forced and grasping at straws?

Also: Jackson didn’t necessarily out me? It was my choice to claim early.

Where are they grasping at straws.

[JacksonVirgo]

Also: Jackson didn’t necessarily out me? It was my choice to claim early.

This should be obvious, but obviously not according to a50

[JacksonVirgo]

They grasped at straws in the post I’ve quoted multiple times where they didn’t refute any of the points I made against them and instead called me out as scummy for two sarcastic responses posts. They also haven’t tried to solve for anyone else besides Dwlee who is almost certainly town.

You haven't refuted any of my posts for them not necessarily being scummy, does that make you scum too in your eyes?

Stop using the sarcastic response posts because, as I have said many times, it did not appear to be so. If anything that's a comprehension (if that's a word) issue rather than them blatantly using obviously sarcastic posts.

[JacksonVirgo]

I could not care less if they flip scum and I die next, if that happens fine. But I will not regret my actions here today as nothing that I have seen is necessarily scummy and I am standing by that.

[JacksonVirgo]

I will switch to kyouko if that means enigma survives.

I value enigma over kyouko

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm fine with either and lowkey think they're just competing SvS wagons. RC trying to split the votes across three wagons at EoD looks bad, and Kyouko shaded both Mozamis and RCE but never voted either and is currently not voting, even though she said she would vote RCE at EoD if Fua's wagon didn't go through.

You honestly actually feel this confident in BOTH top day 1 wagons? Sounds like a formula to just flip two town

[JacksonVirgo]

Three has felt a lot more standoffish than he did in the other game I played with him and A50 is doing one of his scumtells right now.

A50 far-reaching to scum-read me in one of those previous posts hit me the wrong way super hard but that's all I have on them. What's the scumtell for them?

How would you describe the standoffish change thing for three?

[JacksonVirgo]

One scum in Andres/A50 I could see. At least more likely than both of the top wagons currently.

[JacksonVirgo]

Three has felt a lot more standoffish than he did in the other game I played with him and A50 is doing one of his scumtells right now.

A50 far-reaching to scum-read me in one of those previous posts hit me the wrong way super hard but that's all I have on them. What's the scumtell for them?

How would you describe the standoffish change thing for three?

His tell is not creating any real association with other people so if he is caught as scum then he won’t be traced back to anyone else. He did say he TRed Three though, so I’m not entirely sure on that note.

Three’s reaction to Alice’s sole vote on him seems kind of overblown and too defensive compared to his more passive playstyle in the game we played together. This could be him giving an AtE (The ‘Town is dumb and I was treated unfairly last game so don’t let it happen again) or even scum theater with Alice since he ended up unvoting her without any reasoning and she’s had her vanity vote on him the entire time.

I do recall playing with A50 before but that was a small while ago so my meta-reads on them would be weak. Do they not do this as Town as well?

That

could

be something with Three but overall I have not been pinged by them and that by itself doesn't seem like it's something that warrents being pushed on, at least for now. Alice is likely Town imo so that theatre argument is lost on me personally

[JacksonVirgo]

If we want to not lim Andres/Kyoko/RC or at least save them to be resolved at night I would be okay with compromising on A50 and letting that sort things out. His pop-in here was incredibly shady.

I'm okay with A50/Andres or if none of those can work. Kyo only to save Enigma as I would rather a null-read of mine dead than a townread.

[JacksonVirgo]

No, his thing is specifically not connecting himself to anyone and sheeping town on the most suspicious wagons without much reasoning of his own to back it up.

Eh. I think if A50 does flip scum it’s going to put some heat on Three. I don’t want him dead today at the very least, but I think someone should keep an eye on him.

To clarify, you don't want three dead today? Or a50?

[JacksonVirgo]

Okay, let’s do that then.

VOTE: A50

Welp that answers my question lol.

VOTE: A50

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait there's no fuckin' way I already got to the second highest poster status.

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait there's no fuckin' way I already got to the second highest poster status.

Soon you’ll be the highest.

[JacksonVirgo]

Lmaooooo,

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler:

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm not the one who outed two bloody PRs on D1` you fucking morons. Either the whole town is playing really bad, or the two fucking PRs' play has been pathetic it got them both wagoned. Get a fucking clue.

Oh grow up.
You're always the sad sap that blames everybody else in all the games I play with you.

[JacksonVirgo]

Gottem

[JacksonVirgo]

So? It's not "voting me" that set me off. It's LYING about having a meta tell that doesn't even exist. Like I did that in ONE game. ONE LOUSY GAME in SIX YEARS.

I do feel this

[JacksonVirgo]

Yo why are we not lynching a50 when they even claimed scum

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait did I misread

[JacksonVirgo]

From the last few pages I think A50 is scum with Three. His vote on Kyo was basically "a confirmed Town is voting Kyouko so I will vote her as well".

Three's reaction around A50 wagon was also suspicious. Jumped on with "whatever" attitude to unvote few posts later. Looks like a clamsy way to distance himself. If that's the case it would lock RC, Jackson and Kyo as Town. Along with N_M(possibly) and fua.
VOTE: A50

Indeed it woquld clear all those. But I am not sure if I'd pair with Three just from associations here

[JacksonVirgo]

End of Night 1

fua has died.

They were:

Spoiler:

Welcome, fua. You are a Town Jailkeeper.

Each night you may jail a player, protecting them from all nightkills and roleblocking them.

You win when the Mafia have been removed and at least one townie remains alive.

RCEnigma has died.

They were:

Spoiler:

Welcome, RCEnigma. You are a Vanilla Townie.

You have your voice and your vote.

You win when the Mafia have been removed and at least one townie remains alive.

Lowkey expected to get shot here lmfaooooo.

[JacksonVirgo]

I am fairly disappointed N_M shot RCE over one of JV/AliceK

VOTE: JV

Can we kill this now?

Lmfao

Nobody wanted to actually explain the read to me, so I didn't reciprocate it. And because nobody wanted to explain it, I am scum for not pushing it.

Stop your stupidity

[JacksonVirgo]

Stop your stupidity

This one earns an explicit FUCK YOU

Love you too <3

[JacksonVirgo]

Lowkey expected to get shot here

I am actually shocked that I wasn't shot.

Need I say anything more?

How about use your brain

[JacksonVirgo]

Less confident on my Andres read. A50 likely Town as well.

[JacksonVirgo]

Lmao fun times

[JacksonVirgo]

Nobody explained it to me and that's not anything you can refute. I asked many many times. But whatever lets you sleep at night

[JacksonVirgo]

End of Night 1

fua has died.

They were:

Spoiler:

Welcome, fua. You are a Town Jailkeeper.

Each night you may jail a player, protecting them from all nightkills and roleblocking them.

You win when the Mafia have been removed and at least one townie remains alive.

RCEnigma has died.

They were:

Spoiler:

Welcome, RCEnigma. You are a Vanilla Townie.

You have your voice and your vote.

You win when the Mafia have been removed and at least one townie remains alive.

Lowkey expected to get shot here lmfaooooo.

You thought you would be shot over a claimed jailkeeper??

Why would the vigi shoot the JK

[JacksonVirgo]

But if you're not scum then you might want to look for them instead of complaining about getting rightly scum read for hard defending flipped scum.

I am dumbass

[JacksonVirgo]

RCEnigma - 4: Save The Dragons, Andresvmb, Ythan, ILUVYTHAN

+ Almost is where I am at today.

Uhh this looks like it was meant for scum PT
VOTE: Ugly duck

No it doesn't. Usr your brain it was the town counterwagon to a scum lynch.

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait my andres retract was becausr something I was wrong about. I want that dead today

VOTE: andres

[JacksonVirgo]

RCEnigma - 4: Save The Dragons, Andresvmb, Ythan, ILUVYTHAN

+ Almost is where I am at today.

Uhh this looks like it was meant for scum PT
VOTE: Ugly duck

No it doesn't. Usr your brain it was the town counterwagon to a scum lynch.

Or, it was a list of people they thought would shoot RCE

This is a stupid discussion.

[JacksonVirgo]

Or maybe you jump to conclusions without thinking. Definitely hasn't happened before. Nah never

[JacksonVirgo]

Why would the vigi shoot the JK

What???!!? You think the vig shot fua and scum shot RCE?! I completely take back my townread on you.

What in the world are you thinking I am saying? O.O

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

I’ll put my vote here for now. I do want to actually re-read in light of the fact that RCE was shot and flipped Town. I have been somewhat off thus far.

Ah yes. I expect nothing less than omgus

[JacksonVirgo]

Town y'all stupid. Thats all from me, have a good one

[JacksonVirgo]

JV you're not giving us anything to work with. You hard defended scum and you're not doing anything to town tell or scum hunt. It's not like we picked your name out of a hat, this isn't a random wagon.

No I totally understand the wagon at it's core, just looking even two seconds into why I "defended" kyouko would actually reveal I only "hard defended" them because I didn't reciprocate the scum-tells everyone else seemed to see from them, and nobody gave me reads that I could vibe with so I am not going to just blind wagon somebody just because everyone else does, that would be stupid.

I am scum-hunting but it's not easy to feel the game when you're the one most likely to die.

[JacksonVirgo]

Why would the vigi shoot the JK

What???!!? You think the vig shot fua and scum shot RCE?! I completely take back my townread on you.

Sorry this was totally my bad. I understand what JacksonVirgo means now.

Lol allgd

[JacksonVirgo]

I don't really want JV to endgame though, so am fine killing him now

Scaredy cat, live a little

[JacksonVirgo]

And to whoever said that RCE was a bad shot - screw you. The guy was defending Kyouko by calling them aimless Scum and joined that wagon super late when it looked inevitable. Yeah I though about shooting JacksonVirgo but I read them as Town and their reaction here makes me think they’re Town still.

It was a bad shot sorry my guy

UNVOTE:

You would have shot Jackson who is Town so haha

Yo are you not wanting me dead?

[JacksonVirgo]

Fuck me I keep scum-reading the heckin' PRs

[JacksonVirgo]

STD is... in this game?

VOTE: Save the Dragons

I am going to hold off my brain for a second, anybody have a particular viiiibe about this post?

[JacksonVirgo]

Going on a whim.

VOTE: Dwelee

[JacksonVirgo]

Y'know we should have just wagoned JV because instead we outed the vigilante and JV feels the need to just wagon town. Literally doesn't matter what alignment they are we should have yeeted them

1. They would not have claimed if the wagon did not pile on them, do not throw the blame onto me, you dd not have to wagon them.
2. You're deliberately shading me here because I voted you in order to discredit me and to push your image in a better light.
3. You're constantly saying you should yeet me, yet you're voting an inactive just because "oh they're in this game" just because they're being wagoned rather than you're scum-reading them opposed to someone you're obviously scum-reading, me.

You're scum bro

[JacksonVirgo]

Where is your vote. Vote me.

[JacksonVirgo]

Sniped

[JacksonVirgo]

Since when should you ignore a scum-read because of your own self image.

[JacksonVirgo]

It isn't about my image, it's about consolidation wtf

The way you voted was not about consolidation, you would have said something along those lines when you voted but nope you shaded STD instead.

You are opportunistic and it's sad.

[JacksonVirgo]

JV you literally called us all stupid for voting you and now you're calling Dwlee scum because they're no longer voting you.

I called y'all stupid just because I was venting, not that I disagree with the read on me as I did push against a scum-flip technically but that does not excuse that they're not even consistant with their "reads". They want me dead so bad but nothing points to that.

They even say that if they were vig they would not have even shot me, like u wot m8.

Spoiler:

I don't really want JV to endgame though, so am fine killing him now

I could see it be frustrated scum kind of just throwing in the towel.

But eh, we can do this

VOTE: Andres

I wish I had vigilante powers

I would always shoot scum smh

And to whoever said that RCE was a bad shot - screw you. The guy was defending Kyouko by calling them aimless Scum and joined that wagon super late when it looked inevitable. Yeah I though about shooting JacksonVirgo but I read them as Town and their reaction here makes me think they’re Town still.

It was a bad shot sorry my guy

UNVOTE:

And to whoever said that RCE was a bad shot - screw you. The guy was defending Kyouko by calling them aimless Scum and joined that wagon super late when it looked inevitable. Yeah I though about shooting JacksonVirgo but I read them as Town and their reaction here makes me think they’re Town still.

It was a bad shot sorry my guy

UNVOTE:

You would have shot Jackson who is Town so haha

I probably would have shot alice, actually

STD is... in this game?

VOTE: Save the Dragons

Where's the consistency.

[JacksonVirgo]

Albeit I also said it's stupid because I have information y'all don't, my alignment. It's more of a "I am telling you that I am disagreeing with you all" kind of thing.

[JacksonVirgo]

Or maybe you jump to conclusions without thinking. Definitely hasn't happened before. Nah never

This is now relevant.

Could you explain why now of all times?

[JacksonVirgo]

I think I know I just don't want to give you ideas as to what to put lmaoo

[JacksonVirgo]

Or maybe you jump to conclusions without thinking. Definitely hasn't happened before. Nah never

This is now relevant.

Could you explain why now of all times?

I think I know I just don't want to give you ideas as to what to put lmaoo

I think you're jumping to conclusions without thinking things through.

Maybe, maybe not it doesn't change my read.

[JacksonVirgo]

I don't have dying wishes. I haven't any strong scum reads that didn't immediately claim pr shortly after I pushed them and the scum that I was on I didn't even scum read so I'd rather not leave an incorrect list of scumreads with a town flip. I'm willing to vote jacksonvirgo though I seriously think this flips town because I know Andres is town and I'd rather let town lead a wagon than scum no matter the flip.

Push this once I die actually. Thanks gut feeling

[JacksonVirgo]

Jackson has the bad fortune of having pushed two PRs and away from flipped Scum

Im v good at this game

[JacksonVirgo]

It’s part of the reason I think I should just shoot JV and we should let wagons actually develop around other players. Because that way we can actually gather more information.

Yall are alwayd lynching me in lylo if Im alive so kill me early thx

[JacksonVirgo]

Apologies.forusing the l word again. Force of.habit

[JacksonVirgo]

So you think im scum if JacksonVirgo flips town and if they flip scum? Because you said that if they flipped scum, you would shoot me.

Yeah this is scum.

[JacksonVirgo]

Lynch me
Shoot Aaron.

My proposition

[JacksonVirgo]

Fuck.I said it again sorry

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Self

[JacksonVirgo]

Also I was partially holding off on voting you midway through today was because I thought you were softing Gunsmith, but your self vote just dunked that theory in the trash can.

If you had any suspicion you shouldn't have brought it up even now, as this could also be a play

[JacksonVirgo]

You’re not really standing in the way of a JacksonVirgo execution even though you think the slot is Town, you’re afraid to put any more reads out there since it’s now becoming very obvious that you’ve been pushing Town for a while in my slot, so why should I think you’re Town exactly? Because you voted for Kyouko on the same page they got executed? Outside of NM who was pushed by Scum and is in my opinion not that likely to have claimed Vig as Scum (but rather as VT), why should I trust any of those last few votes (like yours or Alice’s after hammer vote)?

I don't care if you trust my vote or not. I thought you were scum and was the only person who actually strongly pushed against a JacksonVirgo elim. As shown by the scum doctor day 1 elimination, scum are not people who are guiding the discussion in this game otherwise that would not have happened. It is far more likely for scum to not comment and weakly defend their buddy here than jump out and face you head on like I did. I will not stop this wagon because I was certain they were town if you were scum. I have no strong opinion on them if you are town.

I hav pushed all town this game and I admit to it. However, I also have only had around 3-4 reads total this game. It's not that shocking that there is town in there.

I appreciate this response. It does make me feel a bit better about your slot. And I agree that more often than not the defending of Kyouko would have been done weakly or with a push elsewhere while ignoring Kyouko somewhat. It’s why I have some stronger suspicions of AliceK and think the slot should get executed. JacksonVirgo was way too strongly on people’s faces. But the pushes are also egregious and the flips just make it impossible for anyone to trust them. And there are some players that will hard defend their buddies. So there are exceptions. I just don’t know JV well enough to decipher it.

Bro Id be carrying as scum.

[JacksonVirgo]

Scum is my only skill

[JacksonVirgo]

Like you carried mini 2232

jk

What game was that?

[JacksonVirgo]

Like you carried mini 2232

jk

What game was that?

2 scum game, you were my scum partner and replaced out pretty early I think. Was just teasing

I carried too hard I had to yeet out

[JacksonVirgo]

You can check my wiki for meta stuff. Dont think its updated completely but yeah I havent played in a small while tho

[JacksonVirgo]

I don't do meta

Then it wasn't aimed at you then

[JacksonVirgo]

don’t know JV well enough to decipher

It was mainl6 towards this

[JacksonVirgo]

Andres tell us what we are doing

If you need a conftown to guide you, you're doing it wrong

[JacksonVirgo]

Imagine thinking scum play this black and white to just straight up defend a buddy that was very likely going to die.

[JacksonVirgo]

It has come to my attention that I know alice from another forum mafia site, no idea where no idea who but they know me from a time when I actually played decently as town.

So that probably is how they think me talking = town. Not talking = scum. OwO

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Aaron will stop gamethrowing now.

[JacksonVirgo]

:O

[JacksonVirgo]

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Aaron will stop gamethrowing now.

What made them more skummy than yourself all of a sudden?

It's not all of a sudden, and I wasn't voting myself because I think I'm scummy can you cut the pointless shade and actually be good. Thanks

[JacksonVirgo]

I have already explained my Aaron read, not repeating myself because

1) You only asked me to shade/discredit me
2) If you actually read the game you would know

[JacksonVirgo]

I dislike JacksonVirgo's read on me but don't know if that's partly because I feel they "owe" me for casing them as town. I understand they don't but internally, I feel that way and I wonder if my scum read there now has to do with that.

Yo what, read me all you want it's not changing shite and that shouldn't affect your read either because otherwise you fall into pocketing territory

[JacksonVirgo]

I am v detached from this game so don't expect me to case a single soul. Doesn't matter when Andres is bop bopping me in the noggin' tonight

[JacksonVirgo]

I have already explained my Aaron read, not repeating myself because

1) You only asked me to shade/discredit me
2) If you actually read the game you would know

Why would I try to cast shade on you?

Because you did lmao

[JacksonVirgo]

I actually think it must be a lim/shot on Alice/JV here.
JV's attitude towards the game is just awful if they are town (no offense, just peacing out, self voting, and then returning at eod doesn't leave a lot of inspiration to be had).
Alice's reads list leaves JV as town and STD as the only skum read. And now there are people pivoting to STD/Alice instead of JV/Alice.

No offence taken, not my greatest game.

[JacksonVirgo]

Let's consolidate onto Alice or Aaron please. We have less than 24 hours and need to make sure a wagon goes through.

Yes let us kill Aaron OwO

[JacksonVirgo]

If I don't hear anything new from Andres in 2 hours exactly, I'm voting AliceK and letting Not_Mafia hammer. I think this flips town but no elim doesn't sound like our best option.

No-elim is a shit option. We'd waste the vigi opportunity and just force alice/myself as LyLo lynch bait so no.

[JacksonVirgo]

Fuck me again

[JacksonVirgo]

I claim PR

[JacksonVirgo]

Since that's hammer.

VOTE: AliceK

[JacksonVirgo]

Nobody talk.

[JacksonVirgo]

Lel I saw the final mofai and had to be repalced but died so didn't need to be replaced

[JacksonVirgo]

My play with claiming PR was the steal the scum shot, and direct Andre's shot elsewhere but I only succeeded in one of those. Worked out well though regardless, only thing I could have done with the bullshittery I was put in (and acted) this game

[JacksonVirgo]

Game would have been better with Alignment flip only.

Would that have been eligible for a normal tho?