Mafia 102: No-Frills Game Thread(Town wins!)

[hiphop]

I will /confirm fourth.

[hiphop]

vote X_~

no explanation needed.

---------------------

Super Accurate* Vote Count(as of post 50):

CSL - 2(mask man, crypto)
Sando - 1(SerialClergyman)
crypto - 1(EtherealCookie)
mask man - 1(Sando)
X_~ - 1(hiphop)

Not Voting:le Chat, CSL, X_~, muh316, Staple, Team Aether, Kaiveran, bigmc109, charter, Pomegranate

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

[hiphop]

Oh, that's right, I was voting for CSL.

Unvote: CSL. Vote: X_~.

So CSL must be scum.

unvote
vote CSL

[hiphop]

Er, not what I was shooting for. Expliquez?

Another random vote.

unvote, vote hiphop

For ignoring the idea before. I'd think if you were town, you'd have at least something to say when someone suggests a no lynch.

I'd think if I were scum, I'd have at least something to say when someone suggests a no lynch. What is the difference between the sentence you wrote, and the sentence I wrote? Why should I say something, if I didn't care either way? If the town wanted it, the town would get it. I saw several pros and cons both ways. One of the main ones is how would the cop know who to investigate. A good reason I didn't think of, until I read crypto's post (How long did it take you to write that?) is the town has an extra four people than a mini, which means the town has an extra two mislynches than a mini. Why waste them?

If I gave my pros and cons, without letting everybody decide their way, I would basically destroy all the pros for it, by creating discussion. Why would I want to do that, if I didn't care which way the town went?

Same questions go for everyone else, except Charter, because we all know he's pro.

Same question goes for you, even though you seem like a pro. 8 games on another site.

[hiphop]

I gave you a slice of pizza for answering so promptly. But then I had to take it away before you could sink your teeth in, because you said nil about anything that occurred on page 3.

Yea?
Yea?
Well, I'm not sharing any of my cookies with you.

You should still comment on page 3.

[hiphop]

Also, if the Jailkeeper can't block Mafia NK's, what kills are they protecting people from?

They can save, but they can't block nks. If they target the mafia member that sent out the nk, they can't block, but if they target a townie, who the scum targeted, they save that person. The only action they block is the cop's.

[hiphop]

What's there to comment on? Mafia seems screwed, honestly, with this ratio.

Are you admitting that you are scum?

[hiphop]

The odds of us lynching scum on Day 1 are very poor (18.75%). Night 1, the Mafia will almost certainly kill a townie (odds of a successful protection are less than 1%, so for the purposes of this, I'll say the Mafia is definetely killing a townie). If we choose to lynch D1, there is an 81.25% chance of losing 2 townies; if we no lynch, there's a 100% chance of losing 1 townie. I think the trade-off is worth the information.

Fine look at it this way, We have a 18.75% chance of lynching scum day 1, while 0% chance of killing scum in the night. I choose the lynch. However you can bring up the no lynch when we are ready to lynch. Until than, scum hunt, and don't talk about theory yet. If everybody expects a no lynch, than this day will be shot.

so if jailkeeper targets a person who is a townie, then the mafia can't kill the townie. And if jailkeeper targets a mafia member nothing happens. And if jailkeeper targets cop then cop can't investigate.

In this game yes, in other games no. Depends on the mod.

[hiphop]

What? . . . No, the town gets what the most players want, and the most players want the action that is best supported with a clear logic. Our average scumbag would probably go with the flow for a little while to see how things unfold. Sort of like what you did. Some scum (usually ultra-confident pros) might take a proactive stance, but not most.

What makes you an expert on what scum would do? You said go with the flow. If that was the case, I would of voted no lynch.

Why didn't you point out pros and cons before? Electing not to do so is anti-information. Plus, these two bits are both cons. Could you give a pro or two, for argument's sake?

Right here:

However, if we just straight no lynch for a few (2-3) days, without discussion, then I don't see how scum can kill the cop other than random, and that's an extremely long shot, whereas the chance of the cop investigating a scum or two is much better.

So basically me giving the cons would destroy the biggest pro, because people would argue, and that would be discussion. So it was best for me not to comment, because I didn't care which way the town went.

That isn't good enough, unfortunately. At this point in the game, keeping secrets "for the good of the town" is secondary to sharing information (unless of course you're outing role info).

So you would rather I ruin the gambit, than to remain silent.

Oh, and I've only played on this site. Two newbie games and two mini normals.

On this site it is best to look at my wiki. Links to all completed games.

How 'bout dem rapid vote switches, Scigatt?

Did you not notice the awesome sig he gave me and you at the top of page 3 and 4 respectively?

I agree with this. Why would I want to vote No Lynch in the first place? All it's going to do is prolong the game. Why not place some pressure on people, and see what we can get of them? Voting No Lynch and watching the scum kill one every night would be amazingly boring and slow, and wouldn't give us much to figure out who they are.

I answer this quote with this one. Contradicting yourself already.

unvote
vote EtherealCookie

If we no-lynch 3 times, scum have a 1/16 + 1/15 + 1/14 chance if hitting the cop. To me, looks like ~20% chance to hit the cop in one of the 3 nights.

If we lynch all three nights we have a 3/16 +3/14+3/12 of hitting scum. To me it looks like we have over 60% chance of hitting scum.

Discussion doesn't come out of a vacuum. If we KNOW we're going to no lynch, talking won't mean much. You need the threat of an imminent lynch to force the hunting. I'm happy with discussion, and I'm happy with lynching people, but discussing amongst ourselves if we all know the result will be a no lynch is just wasting time, imho.

Somebody give this guy some cake.

[hiphop]

meta me if you think I am scum. That is the way I am. I gave an original reason. Did I not show where I was drawing my conclusions from? When I started that post, SC had not voted.

[hiphop]

Yeah, a defense of 'meta me' and I'm extremely happy with my vote.

I would comment on your case, but crypto said some people, referring to me I believe, are quoting more than they should, and I really value the guy's opinion. You are strawmanning me on the case against me, you don't even argue against the main reason I didn't comment on the no lynching. You argue against my sarcasm.

[hiphop]

Hiphop, are you still satisfied with your vote on Ethereal?

Who are your other major suspects?

At the moment yes. Will I push for his lynch no.

I don't like to give a scum list until everybody has posted. That might not be until Sunday night.

[hiphop]

If you insist.
1.SC- I have found that scum usually attack with a solid reason, while town take more risks.
2.Team Aether- said he was eager for the game to start, yet hasn't posted.
3.EC-Looks more and more like a VI. Can't be sure.
4.Charter- same as SC.

Looks the same as yours, but without me and with TA.

[hiphop]

I know this is a bit hypocritical coming from me since this is my first post, but the rest of the issues in this thread have been debated by others and each time I log in they are already addressed, no lynching is a stupid idea and will always be imo. Does not help the town at all and information is what the town wants. Anyone who supported no lynching seems suspicious to me, its just not a smart way of going about things.

Proof that town doesn't comment on everything. This is different from me how?

@crypto- Did I say pros of the follow the cop plan? Listing the cons would ruin it. If it was the pros than it was the pros of the plan against it.

mod:please prod Team Aether

@X_~Directed at your reason for voting muh. Have you ever heard of voting someone for pressure?

If I was in EC's place I would at least have FoS'ed back or just called you guys stupid for concentration on me and not the real scum. But he hasn't. Everyone is scum until proven otherwise, EC hasn't done this.

This does not make sense. First of all you are asking him to OMGUSing Second of all nobody can be proven innocent unless the cop say so. A little pressure never hurt anyone.

[hiphop]

bigmc109-Keeps saying he will scumhunt. Makes two or so posts, and goes back to the theory of no lynching. Pays more attention to theory than scumhunting so far.

charter-Townie points for coming up with no discussion, helps cop not to get killed. Scum points because it hides the scum. There are more scum than the one cop. So it would help the scum more than the town.

crypto- Still thinking about him. Clearly the backbone to this town.

CSL-May need a replacement for him. He is going to be V/LA every weekday. Which means he will not post for five out of the seven days of the week. If he will only post on the weekend he can do better than one post.

EtherealCookie-Clearly a newbie. Still want to see how he will post throughout the game.

Kaiveran- So far has been following the town, and talking about theory.

le Chat-Opinions are ok. So far...

mask man- Still thinking about this guy too.

muh316- So far hasn't done any attacking or scumhunting.

Pomegranate- Only real post at the moment was the last one, and the only part of that comment that wasn't following the town, was the last point. Pomegranate, you need to explain why on your last point.

Sando-waiting for him to scumhunt.

SerialClergyman-TV on EC

Staple-extremely scummy even for a newbie. Hypocrite. Says he didn't say something because everything he wants to say has already been addressed, and yet he says his views anyways. Bad vibe on him so far.

unvote
vote:Staple

Team Aether-still waiting...

X_~-He thinks EC is scum, just because he doesn't attack the people who attack him. Your argument against crypto imo is invalid. Why shouldn't a townie discredit an argument that is scummy? You should try attacking everybody that appears suspicious. You would be surprised how informative it is. Also until you provide those links, it will only be an opinion and not an experience like you claim.

I'd like quick player-by-player analyses from EtherealCookie, SerialClergyman, Staple, and Hiphop.

Same from you please.

[hiphop]

Sup. Prod is 72 hours, and I have 5 games, some of which are at more critical junctures than the 9th spammy page of D1. So relax, I'll get here soon.

What in another 72 hours?

[hiphop]

Lessons in activity.
1) 48 hours is not unreasonable to wait for someone to post.
2) Look at people's sigs before you accuse them of being inactive.
3) Count how many posts someone has before you accuse them of being inactive and compare that number to (off the top of my head) kaiveran, sando, charter, le chat, CSL, Team Aether, X_~, staple, muh316 and probably more. I'll even let you take off the last couple of posts which are clearly placeholders if you like.
And the most important lesson of all:
4) Having 60 posts in the 9th page, literally 1/4 of all posts in a 16 person game not including the mod, is

seriously anti-town

. You are spamming the thread, making re-reads and scumcatching harder.
5) Please check out the /invitational game here if you feel my activity on D1 here so far is a problem.

1. But 49 like you did is.
2. How do you think I knew about csl?
3. Lame. I can post 100 posts day one, and then not post in one week, and still have more posts than crypto in that week.
4. It just shows he is contributing to the game.
5. From where you linked

16.Players are expected to make a substantive post at least once every 48 hours (but are encouraged to post at least every day).

I believe the "at least" means in between, or not more than.

[hiphop]

Votes staple, not one of the 4 he listed previously, on Oct 12th.

Let me think about this.*wait 3 seconds* OK done. Apparently you don't realize is that he didn't make his first post until after I listed the four. Crypto wanted me to give my list before they posted. If you read, you might have caught that.

[hiphop]

edit: 5. From where you linked

16.Players are expected to make a substantive post at least once every 48 hours (but are encouraged to post at least every day).

I believe the "at least" means not more than 48 hours, and up to one post.

[hiphop]

To be perfectly clear, hiphop is now arguing (in what looks like an attempt to make us suspicious of SC) with SC because he isn't adhering to the activity rules of another game. In that game SC didn't adhere to them strictly (who does ), and was town.

He's also arguing these other points that have no bearing whatsoever on SC's alignment.

He's also trying to use things that don't have any bearing on SC's alignment to cast suspicion on him (I believe).

You are right. When I linked into that and saw mith's avatar, I was thinking that it was the newbie's rules.

[hiphop]

@ crypto First look at what the ideal spot for scum to be on a bw. Near the middle if not in the beginning. Why, because the L-1 and hammer vote are the most looked at. So there must be a townie willing to hammer. Therefore the townie would take more risks. Even EC in this game said he looked at people who didn't provide a good reason to bw. Possible scum trying to get on the bw early.

In this game redcoyote casts, what some people said was a random vote because he gave no reason, a vote in his first post when everybody was out of the rvs. While scum stayed with the rest of the town in the bwing. I will show another game, but it is on going, and the roles have not been proven yet. Why should scum cast gambits like this one, when it is easier to follow the crowd?

[hiphop]

Crypto- Are you willing to push all the way for Staple's lynch, or is this one of those votes that only lasts a couple days like the rest of yours have so far?

Empking- We seem to be attracted to the same games.

Rayfrost- welcome. The last time we were in the same game, you were killed, before you said a word.

le Chat- What happened? You said that you were going to get an analysis up today if it kills you.

As much as I don't like EC, your reasoning fails. What would YOU do if everyone attacked you? Prove them right by getting lynched?

In the last mini I played in, the first two lynches, and a third person asked to be lynched when everybody started to attack them. The first one said he wanted to martyr for the town, to prove he was right.

muh316- I don't know how you can become lost after playing in two newbie games, but that must change.

Here I will help you
What do think of the case against Staple?
What do you think of Staple's excuse for not posting in the beginning?
Who else is suspicious in any shape or form?

Your opinion is vital to the game, and becomes even more important as we near any lynches. You don't have to perfect, but you do have to participate. You have had two newbie games of stuff to look back and see the type of questions you should be asking. Just start with the three questions I have posted above and answer them. Don't give us one liners, but your thought process.

If you believe that any or all of us are full of bs than say so. If you read something and think that is a bunch of bull, than you had better post and say why it is so. Shooting holes in one logic will only help them by refocusing their efforts, abandon the questioning and maybe have them realize they are tunneling, or expose a possible scum (you or the person you are questioning.)

Come up with your own theory (you should have one by now), but do something besides posting fluff. You are not helping your team out (whichever one that is) If you are scum you are making yourself a target by lurking, and if you are the other you will be an easy mislynch. So start writing your opinions down

Yes. Even in smaller games I lurk D1, but not as much.

What we need D1 is discussion.

Please tell me how both of these sentences can be true.

Staple- What I wrote for muh, goes for you too. Posting nothing when you are being attacked, does not help your case.

X_~-Flaking. Not a good idea. Especially when you have people staring at you.

[hiphop]

We lynched scum with our next post, but scum won in lylo. I was nk'd the last night.

[hiphop]

EBWOP We lynched scum with our next lynch, but scum won in lylo. I was nk'd the last night.

[hiphop]

Because the "I give up, lynch me if you want, but I'm just a townie" doesn't seem likely for scum to do, especially on Day I.

I think we should still continue looking around for scum, instead of being content on lynching him.

bold = wifom. Nobody said anything about not scum hunting. The last sentence is awfully close to defending. You should let Staple defend himself.

---------------------

Super Accurate* Vote Count(as of post 350):

RayFrost - 1(mask man)
Staple - 6(le Chat, hiphop, crypto, bigmc109, muh316, Pomegranate)
crypto - 2(X_~, Empking)
X_~ - 2(EtherealCookie, Sando)
Pomegranate - 2(SerialClergyman, charter)

Not Voting:Staple, Kaiveran, RayFrost

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

[hiphop]

I already gave one example of one game. Do you want me to do all the games? I can do that if you guys really really really want me to, but that will be spamming the thread with unrelevant words that don't have anything common with this game. Read me in iso if you don't where I explained it. I didn't give anything specific, just a generalization with one example. If you want me to find a more specific example I can do that to. Like I said it is unimportant, but that is my opinion.

Muh- your last post is a scumtell.

[hiphop]

Can you tell me why?

Simply put, you were lurking, but now that people have attacked you (ie your cover is blown) you say you are more active. If that was the case, why were you not in the beginning of the game? What is the difference between now and then?

[hiphop]

You are right I was being anti-town. But like I said what is the difference between now and then? If this was her first game I would understand, but this is her third game. Surely someone would have mentioned something about lurking and flaking to her in the other two. Maybe just maybe she won't go back into her little shell and lurk again once everybody leaves her alone. I have seen people do that. And since I know you will ask for a link. Here it is. Look at Hohum. He is scum. I have a better one and a more recent example, but it is on going.

Besides the content of her post was about activity.

---------------------

Super Accurate* Vote Count(as of post 375):

RayFrost - 1(mask man)
Staple - 6(le Chat, hiphop, crypto, bigmc109, muh316, Pomegranate)
crypto - 1(X_~)
X_~ - 1(EtherealCookie)
Pomegranate - 2(SerialClergyman, charter)
muh316 - 2(Empking, Sando)

Not Voting:Staple, Kaiveran, RayFrost

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

[hiphop]

And like crypto said, even if I was not interested in this game anymore, I do not feel like replacing out since this is one of my first games here. However I do want to play.

Why do you want to play Staple? Is it because you want to read how other people play? You can read any current game and read as it develops without being part of the game. Is it because you want to hide from the town and win as scum? I have news for you, you are now doing a great job. Is it because you want to find scum and win as town? Prove it. What is your plan to find scum? As a new perspective to the game, I am sure that you must have had some idea when you joined this game to how to find scum. Actions speak louder than words, so show us.

[hiphop]

I also think the sooner one of them gets lynched, the better.

why?

[hiphop]

I'm not sure what more you want, this is a really solid reason. And since I'm defending someone of whom I'm not positive of their alignment, I'm not sure what else I can do.

Why are you defending him? Can he not defend himself? I am looking at three possibilities.

1. You are scum defending scum buddy.
2. You are scum defending townie. Knowing when he flips you will be right.
3. You are town defending someone for no reason other than you think he is town.
A townie should not defend anybody, unless that person is guaranteed to be innocent.

I am likely to believe the first two.

vote: Charter
unvote

[hiphop]

EBWOP
I am likely to believe the first two.

unvote
vote: Charter

[hiphop]

What? A townie should never defend someone else?

The best way to find scum is to analyse their arguments and find faulty logic within it. If someone makes a faulty argument against someone else, I'm going to point it out. To merely analyse the attacks on yourself limits your scumhunting abilities to a huge extent.

Think about what you just said. Isn't there a difference between defending someone and attacking someone for their argument? Being that Charter admitted he was defending staple...

Are you defending charter or attacking me?

[hiphop]

And for anyone who thinks defending others who are obvtown is scummy, this game just finished where I single handedly derailed a lynch on someone after he was at L-1 AND claimed vanilla solely because I thought it was pretty obvious that scum were voting him and he was town. I see the same thing in this game, and I'm doing the same thing.

I defended scum as a townie, because the town didn't have a case on him, but the bw wasn't derailed and he was lynched anyways. I have done it as scum too, which is why you shouldn't defend, especially on day one, because as you yourself said the alignment is unknown.

I JUST DID IT AS TOWN.

So are you trying to say that because you did it as town, then every time you do it you will be town?

@ Sando When you defend yourself that is different, but when someone places an argument against you in which some of them are good points, and another person tries to get

all

the points dismissed. You wouldn't think that is scummy? SerialClergyman calls staple a vi, is that what charter is using to say Staple is not scum? Calling someone a vi, tells everybody that the person has good points against them, but serialclergyman can’t explain them. A vi can just as likely to be town as scum.

[hiphop]

I'm saying it's obviously not a scumtell, since I do it as town, but oh wait, that's why you're voting me. And you still are.

It is because you try to say all the points against him are bad, when only a few points are weak.

It also appears that you are trying to use your town meta, to say you are town. Which you could be playing to it.

[hiphop]

hiphop, if I do it as town as well, it isn't a scumtell, hence not a reason to vote me. Obviously I could still be scum and doing it, but you can't vote me for that reason since I do it as town too (you can, but it's a really bad/scummy vote).

In case you don't know I was lynched both times I did it, so I guess it is. Besides if you are comparing it to when you did it, are you not playing to your town meta? And that is a scumtell.

Yeah, this is suspicious and is a scumtell. It's hard to believe you've been doing this in every game and no one has set you straight.

A scum tell is an action more likely to be taken by scum than town. It doesn't matter who does it more often. It matters who stands to benefit more from the action.

Your words can be applied to my case. This last quote contradicts the first one I posted.

Another contradiction in post 418 and now.

I think the opportunistic votes he

quickly

garnered make him very likely to be town, and those voting him very likely to be scum.

And yet you want to have a speedy wagon on Bmc. Tell me, what is the difference between the speedy wagon on staple, compared to if you had got what you wanted (a speedy wagon on Bmc)?

Where is staple on your scumdar? Closer to townie, neutral, or scum?

[hiphop]

im not very good at scum hunting, i dont want to mislynch and kill a fellow townie :/

First part-Try. What is the worst that is going to happen? You being lynched? You are probably going to be killed sometime in this game anyways.

2nd- You as an individual, do not mislynch by yourself. The town is ultimately responsible.

3rd- Would you rather go the whole game with scum picking us off one by one? I don't think they will make it easier, just harder, because they choose who dies.

[hiphop]

@WW page 2

@Scigatt-Why wait until after the move? Why not now? The game should be just as active until the move. My other games everybody is just as active. Nobody is absent. The move will happen when it happens. Until it does lets play mafia.

[hiphop]

mod: I will answer the vote count with this

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

Pom is voting for staple who is now WarWound. Do you really think that the flakers really should get 48 hrs, when that have already not posted for over 96?

not to mention a willingness to turn on someone who voted with you on the wagon if you were wrong. That's scummy.

Is that not what you are going to do if you are wrong?

@muh here Directed at you. Since Bmc seems to be the topic replace staple for bmc. How about a scum list.

@charter Why have you not responded to me yet?

@malp- What is the reason for your vote?

@EC if someone believes someone should get lynched, should they not push hard? Look at Bmc, crypto, and Sc. They can't all be scum, yet they all have pushed hard for a lynch at one time or another.

@Bmc- when you do get back, do you still find Staple's spot scummy?

[hiphop]

There's a difference between pushing hard and pushing too hard. There's not a good enough reason to lynch him, yet he keeps acting like the choice is an obvious one and tells people to hurry up with lynching him.

Let me guess Sc didn't do this?

People pointed at this while I was waiting for the move to get the hell on. Nobody really said flat out that it is 100% incorrect though, just how scummy the statement was. I think you are experienced enough to know that MANY scum (although frustrated newbies also do it.) will do this. If you want, I can find some proofs.

Take a look at this game We had three townies in a row. First one I will take matyrdom, second one Lynch me I dare you, third one I wouldn't mind being lynched, and only the second one was a newbie.

Pomegranate is so blatantly scummy that I'm more than content with leaving my vote on her all day.

I doubt it. You get bored too easily. Your scum reads seem to change too. In the beginning of the game you said EC is scum, and than about halfway thru, you said you have a null read. The problem with changing your vote all the time is nobody thinks you are sincere enough to follow you.

I am not going to comment on the bmc case like you asked, because you don't believe it yourself.

The question I have is why did she comment on only half, when she has town, null, and scum reads in the half. Why not comment on all?

And post 606 is her catchup post? One comment on crypto, that she undid, in her next post.

Last two paragraphs pom should answer.

[hiphop]

Actually, I more or less dumped interest in EC after RVS.

Rvs ran at least to page 11 and no further than page 16? Interesting. And here I thought it ended somewhere around page 2. All those votes up to page 11 were rvs? There goes all of my scum reads.

No, 606 wasn't a catchup post. I wondered why crypto never actually voted for me, and commented on it. He voted while I was reading and composing 606, which made it null (the post). 609 was an incomplete post, because I'm not entirely caught up. I didn't mention everyone because I need to reread a lot of players in iso.

So the analysis was a catchup post. That I find hard to believe being you didn't comment on anything in between of where you left off, and your last post besides the FOS and unFOS posts, just an analysis overall. Do you think everything we did in between was fluff?

Bmc- hmm. Talked about theory for a while, but once he found someone scummy he attacked. Null read there. Town or scum attack scummy things. Yes, I believe staple's play was scummy. The part about setting up lynches- if you guys want to make a case from one sentence, instead of the play overall, than go ahead, but don't expect me to agree. As for the meta- I hate meta unless you guys have a game he is a scum, and a game he is town, I won't read it. Otherwise I am bias, when I read it. So I like to have a game from each to compare to. His play resembles several town players, that I have played with. So slight town read.

If you have a big enough case on someone, people bw. Look at the staple wagon, or bmc wagon. Therefore more connections are made.

[hiphop]

Hmm. Maybe I didn't word it properly. I lost any remotely strong scum read on EC by the end of RVS.

Iso 74, post 285, page 12 found here. Major suspicions towards EC.

[hiphop]

I would like to

fos bigmc

for abusing staple. anti-town=/=scummy. Also saying crypto is obviously town.

Also scummy doesn't always equal scum. Do you think saying someone is obvious scum is any better?

I plan on looking over my posts later.

When is your best guess?

@warwound- haven't you finished reading the thread yet? What are your thoughts on the game so far? Here is an east one. What do you think of crypto? I would suggest you reading staples post and give us your opinion on them too. You may not know what he was thinking, but you have one piece of information that none of us have. That is whether you are town or not. Therefore you can read them in a different perspective. Just give me something.

Also as evident by your last post, are you even keeping up with the game? That is a must.

------------------------------------------------

Crypto doesn't post for an entire day, and then we get three I am busy posts. Strange.

@charter- What are you really waiting for? For me to invote you? I don't buy the fact that you are truly waiting for replacements. What do they have to do with you posting? What is the difference between now and the beginning of the game? You posted then, why not now?

@malp and Pyro- Did you see the "if forced to" in the empking question?

@Bmc- Put your vote back on.

@Empking- Do you play that way, because that is the best way to catch scum, or because it is the best way to hide when you are scum? If you were one of us, what would be your opinion on your play overall in this game?

[hiphop]

---------------------

Super Accurate* Vote Count(as of post 650):

malpascp - 1(mask man)
WarWound - 3(Pyromaniac, muh316, Pomegranate)
crypto - 1(Ojanen)
muh316 - 1(Sando)
bigmc109 - 5(WarWound, charter, Empking, SerialClergyman, malpascp)
charter - 1(hiphop)
Pomegranate - 2(Kaiveran, crypto)
Empking - 1(EtherealCookie)

Not Voting:bigmc109

It takes 9 to lynch, 6 at deadline.

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

Good thing you put the bottom part in. Pomegranate is voting muh316.

Best way to hunt scum.

Obv town.

How so? Explain.


Who here agrees with Empking's second statement?

I believe it is about time that the town starts to bw someone to lynch. So for all the one person bws, please move to a larger bw. We can't lynch everybody.

Pomegranate is obv. scum.

Ok, if you say so.

unvote
vote Pomegranate

[hiphop]

So I accidently clicked view next topic at the top of this page, and it takes me to a game that has over 80 pages, in which warwound replaced in 3 days after this one. Unbelievably, he actually made comments about the game unlike this one. WW- what is the difference between this game and that one?

[hiphop]

I reread SC's case on Bigmac, and found it convincing. For instance, like the way he tunneled a newbie as scum, which he did in this game too. Of the lynches that seem probable, his is the best.

As charter said did you not do this too? Did you not attack a newbie? Are you not accusing Bmc of doing the exact same thing that you did? Did you not hint that that was scummy? Are you not admitting that you did a scummy thing? As Crypto said, you just admitted that you were scum.

WW hasn't done anything. Staple acted scummy.

Is this supposed to be the answer to charter's question? If it is, it doesn't fly with me. Why can't Bmc claim the same thing as to why he voted for staple? Oh wait, he did. It looks to me the only reason you are voting for bmc is because his bw is the only other large one, that isn't yours. Admit it.

Bigmc seems to be setting up mislynches and attempting to lynch staple, who seemed more like n00b town. Though I'm not sure about WW.

First of all Staple seemed like a noob. Townie I doubt it.

2nd of all, I would think that replacements would carry the same feeling if they haven't done anything, because they are playing the same spot. Their roles don't change.

I dont want to read the whole thread then get my ass lynched, if you still want to lynch me do it now and do not waste my time, thats why i havent been posting

If that is the case you should never of replaced in, and you should do us all a favor and ask the mod for a replacement. If you don't care about this game you should not be in it. Besides you have had over a week, plenty of time to have read the whole thing. Not only that, but you can learn from more experienced players on how to improve your game.

Also you said you read the past two pages. How do you know if any of it is true? What if I said that crypto voted for himself, would you believe it?

[hiphop]

You should not lynch someone solely on the actions of the past player.

Exactly, but you can't completely diminish the actions of the other player either.

You said he seemed like a noob town. This means he must have spit out a few towntells (I don't know where, your the one that said he seemed like a townie.) If that is so, are you willing to throw them out the window, or put them in the cabinet for use later? Like I said they have the same role. If staple is town ww is town and the same goes for scum.

[hiphop]

Crypto, you are like a man with many faces.

[hiphop]

No, it means that I think a townie is more likely to break down in such a way then scum.

What is you definition of a towntell?

Either way it doesn't matter. If a certain action is most likely done by town, wouldn't you say that person is town. And the same goes for scum. Back to my point, once scum always scum. Now for me personally, I prefer to lynch a replacement on his own actions, with a little help from the previous person.

I agree. And considering that WW HASN'T POSTED ANY CONTENT...

DEFLECTING...

maspacp- anything to add.

unvote

i think pom isnt lying maybe we should hammer someone else :/

Seriously? It looks like somebody is rolefishing. Now that we have one role out, which narrows the PR list, you want more. This gets a

major FOS WW

Pom+WarWound. Only one spot left! Who wants to claim it?

Based on your argument that is a scumtell.

fos charter

Ojanen- as an add on to sc's post, why didn't you cast a vote?

[hiphop]

mod- please prod Muh

[hiphop]

Pom+WarWound.

Only one spot left! Who wants to claim it?

Yesterday, we get this post. No Bmc in sight, and now we get this post.

Empking, reasons for WW? I don't know what they are, sorry.

vote bigmc

Still probably scum.

So if I understand this correctly, based on these posts, WW would only be scum if pom were scum. In fact he wouldn't even have a case on him. Also bmc suddenly becomes scum again, now that pom is town. I am not understanding your logic. Please explain.

[hiphop]

in this new day of ours

So you can't use the info from yesterday to figure out who is scum? You know people don't change their roles everyday. Why do you refuse to scumhunt, when it is day 2? I would think you would have more info than day one? Have you even read day one yet? As a matter of fact, you deserve to be lynched, replaced, or even mod-killed, if you don't start taking this game seriously. I don't think bmc calling you a vi, is harse at all. You certaintly are acting like one. I am surprised you didn't shape up. What do you propose we do start the rvs over again or sing a song?

Bmc- what changed your opinion of ww? Yesterday you wanted the lynch, and now you don't.

[hiphop]

@crypto- what are you trying to do? Muh votes for you, you vote muh. Bmc votes for you, you vote bmc. Here is an easy one for you

vote:crypto

. Now vote me. It seems to me that you are overreacting for just a couple of votes.

@ww- when you asked the question, "What is there to post content on?" Everybody could pretty much assume that you wanted to excuse yesterday.

[hiphop]

crypto just testing.

unvote

Now down to business

Crypto. Your looking like a scum. All this pushing for a lynch thing. It seems as if you know everybodys roles. A clear scum tell.

Yet we have posts like these

And no I am not bandwagoning with BMC because all he said was vote.

So charter you seem to be pushing ALOT for BMC lynch. Seems pretty scummy to me.

Why are you pushing so much for a BMC lynch?

directed at sc.

Is this your list? Yet we know that sc is town. Maybe just maybe, your list is not as accurate as you think, being that townies(SC) do the same thing. Based on these quotes muh doesn't want a lynch, but that was before he made this quote.

Everyone. Whats with you. Lets get on with the crypto lynch. Hurry hurry.

I believe you would call this a scumtell. A clear one at that.

vote muh316

---------------------

Super Accurate* Vote Count(as of post 875):

crypto - 4(Sando, muh316, malpascp, bigmc109)
bigmc109 - 3(charter, crypto, WarWound)
WarWound - 2(Empking, Pyromaniac)
muh316 - 1(hiphop)

Not Voting:Trumpet of Doom, Ojanen, Kaiveran, mask man

It takes 8 to lynch, 6 at deadline.

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

[hiphop]

Same reason that you are voting for bmc. "When you guys push for a lynch, it is a scumtell, but when I do it, it isn't." Just because bmc does the exact same thing as muh, doesn't mean that muh should get off the hook.

[hiphop]

No, I am not saying that. You are. With your posts you admitted that you were scum.

[hiphop]

@muh- if you don't understand, than I won't even bother explaining it to you.

[hiphop]

Your pushing crypto's lynch for pushing other people's lynch.

I am glad somebody is following me.

you see i already explained that I did it just to prove that when crypto does it he never gets attacked but when I do it everyone attacks me

No, when crypto does it, he has a legit reason for it. You are pushing for his lynch, because he did it. Did crypto call that a scum tell? No. Did you call that a scum tell? Yes. Are you calling yourself scum? Yes. Do you not see my point? And for bmc to say that you have a good point is completely ludicrous. It is buddying as well. The way you both left the WW is awfully suspicious. And with that I would be happy to lynch muh, bmc, or WW. Looks like right now the town wants bmc, so

unvote
vote bigmc109

[hiphop]

Agreeing with mod; I'm bored.

Unvote. Vote: muh316.

I'm at the point where I'm willing to just see where a wagon takes us. We haven't seen enough pressure/reactions this game, in that sense. All the lurking and lack of concentrated scum hunting is going to result in a loss for the town.

Crytpo don't do that. You are contradicting yourself. The best thing for us to do is get on one wagon. You asked me this, now it is my turn, why muh instead of bmc?

Everybody who isn't voting, place you votes.

[hiphop]

unvote

catching up soon

You are going the wrong way. The idea is to place your vote, not take it off.

Empking- what is the news?

We will be right back after this bit of news from Scigatt:

Have fun; don't be an ass;

participate

!

Do you guys remember that one?

[hiphop]

No news. I just think you're scum.

meta? no. Scumtells? no. Pure Gut? yes. Excellent case.

crypto- good point, but not today. Today is Bmc's day. We can lynch other people, on non-bmc's day.

@pyro- Just because we are not lynching your scum #1, doesn't mean you can't help us vote off his buddy. So place your vote on bmc. If all the townies voted equally on the scum, scum would never be lynched. We must unify and pick one at a time. Not only that, but this game is dragging, let's end today and hope the sun is shining tomorrow.

[hiphop]

prod bmc, kaiveran, mask man, muh, and anyone else who I missed.

This game is a complete bore. 4 out of the 14 are flaking? Tell me why are they still signed up. Do me a favor and replace out, if you are not willing to post.

[hiphop]

We get an unvoter to vote, only to have crypto unvote.

charter- do you really think that we should, ponder who the partner is today, when we don't know if he is scum yet? Most likely he is scum, but we should get that lynch first.

Trumpet- Have you finished reading the game yet? Also explain, why bmc does not make a good lynch.

[hiphop]

Empking- Why did you take your vote off of me?

yes maskman, muh is scum, but we can't lynch them both. One at a time. I don't think that you can say, baased on your case that if one is scum, the other isn't. Your first quote on muh:

Crypto. Your looking like a scum. All this pushing for a lynch thing. It seems as if you know everybodys roles. A clear scum tell.

bmc makes this quote referring to muh's post:

BTW, crypto, muh has a very valid point.

If he agrees with it, he is basically saying the same thing. So yes they are both scum, and not just one. You saying that one isn't and the other is, is a bit fishy to me.

Crypto- why is WW town?

He can defend himself if he wants, but if he does try to defend himself, he will most likely contradict himself. We will see. I still am pushing for a bmc lynch.

[hiphop]

I know. Pick Muh. Pick Muh. Okay I will

vote muh

Let's get the next obvious scum out of the way.

[hiphop]

What is all this, Muh doesn't have any connections with bmc. Look what I found.

Vote Staple

And no I am not bandwagoning with BMC because all he said was vote.

Now about the part that I said i wasnt bandwagoning with BMC about staples vote was because in the beginning of the game people were suspicious of me because I went with charter's plan to No lynch. So i said just to be on the safe side I said that I wasnt bandwagoning with BMC. Even if I didnt say that I guess I still would have had FOS's on me.

So charter you seem to be pushing ALOT for BMC lynch. Seems pretty scummy to me.

Why are you pushing so much for a BMC lynch?

Now for bmc-

At this point, the two people I'd put my vote on are muh or Pom.

Interesting how he never actually voted muh. Classic scum move, to put scum second in line.

However this quote here is why I voted for bmc in the first place

BTW, crypto, muh has a very valid point.

Not only do they have connections, but muh is scummy too.

For all those who did an iso of bmc, did you notice he did not mention muh's name until the end of day one. Tell me, that you didn't have your mind made up about who had the biggest connections, before you got to this point. Let's finish the job and lynch muh. Muh is scummy, muh has connections, muh needs to be lynched.

[hiphop]

One of muh and the inquisition is scum.

Which? put your vote somewhere.

He doesnt want to put me up at L-1 so the mafia can just come up and hammer me.

Than we know they are scum (that is bussing )

You don't have an excuse, where is your vote?

As for pyromaniac- the inquisition is right, put your vote somewhere.

[hiphop]

I choose not to vote yet. I am a slow reader and it will take me some time to get some reads on people so for now my vote is on hold.

It is the third day. Surely, you have the first day read already. Looks to me like fence sitting.

[hiphop]

vote the inquisition

because I don't feel like hammering.

How can you hammer?

[hiphop]

so, now what?

[hiphop]

Now we all lynch Peanut or Sando.

When they each only have a vote on them. Nice. Let's stick with the muh lynch.

[hiphop]

I am telling you all, muh is not going to flip scum. If you want to lynch him anyway, that's fine, as long as in the coming days, we make it our mission to lynch scum (Sando and Peanut).

Sando and peanut are next on my list.

However, not only is muh scummy, but a policy lynch, I want out of the way. It is better that we lynch him now, than later.

[hiphop]

Why not lynch Trumpet?

mod: how about a prod on Trumpet?

So even if Im not scum its better off for the town to kill me? I think not. Its better to kill the unknown (for more info and for a narrower list) rather than to kill town.

True, except for the fact that you are scum. It is always better to lynch scum, than to lynch who I think is scum.

Still waiting for that vote.

[hiphop]

You seem to be starting to try and remove any potential blame for a town-flip...

I doubt there will be any blame.

There is definitely scum on Muh's wagon. It's going too easily and too quickly, with too little discussion. Any movement away from the wagon is violently rejected, and selective reading seems to be prevalent.

All the discussion took place day 1 and day 2. Why do we need anymore?

Muh has done nothing to erase my suspicions of him D1, in fact quite the opposite. But I never thought both him and Bigmc would be scum, and this wagon is so terrible, I can't think that he's scum.

Muh is scum, muh has connections. See post 1070 Also notice the voting pattern from muh.

Votes no lynch. Bmc supports this afterwards.
Votes Staple after Bmc. (Muh notes that he is not bwing with bmc.)
Votes SC- Because he was attacking bmc.
votes cryto- Bmc agrees with this point and also votes crypto.

Also Sando- charter does have a point. You are strawmanning. It doesn't matter who you were attacking, you were still defending bmc day one. The difference between you and crypto is crypto went after bmc day 2, while you didn't. You and bmc went after crypto.

Kreriov- Have you read day 2 yet? Also is your attack on crypto based on ad hominem or because he makes the most logical lynch? If it is the former, than you are not aiming for your win condition.

Crypto- If you had to choose between Sando and muh for a lynch, who would it be? Also if Trumpet is replaced, will you attack his replacement from his first post?

[hiphop]

unvote
vote Sando

[hiphop]

Sando- I believe you don't have a leg to stand on.

Attacking charter is not a good thing, because charter is town.

[hiphop]

Since that lynch didn't go as planned. Let's look at possible scum on sando's wagon. Trumpet of doom, dramonic(kaiveran), and kreriov. We should not let people lurk to end game. We should lynch Trumpet of Doom.

Trumpet of Doom

[hiphop]

vote trumpet of doom

Thanks mask man.

Is that all you that you will say?

[hiphop]

peanutman has a point, and all you can say is a strawman effort of the second quote.

unvote
vote Pyromaniac.

[hiphop]

Sando didn't turn out so well, and peanut is built on the same foundation. I want to try something new.

[hiphop]

@hiphop - Is there a reason you do not list charter as a suspect from the Sando wagon? You list everyone BUT charter (and yourself of course) other than Crypto (who is now confirmed town.) charter has been on every single wagon, as has dramonic (Kaiveran). So what gives?

Have you read day 2 yet?

[hiphop]

Kreriov- I would rather push for a lynch, of someone who was not a big pusher of the bmc lynch. So imo charter is town.

Having isoed pyro and trumpet of doom, I find trumpet to be scummier.

unvote
vote trumpet of doom

Not only was he not on the bmc wagon, but he was on the sando wagon. Pyro, was the opposite.

Looking to replace Empking.

Good. At least we will get rid of a lurker.

[hiphop]

I'm just saying I thought we were getting somewhere with Pyro. We should look at Trumpet as well, but if we switch between players, then we lose momentum and they can slip through the cracks. With many votes being put on Trumpet of Doom right now, Pyro doesn't have much incentive to post and bring attention back on him. Does that make sense, Inquisition?

We will decide what to do with pyro later. Right now I want a claim from trumpet, being he is at L-1.

[hiphop]

I am with Kreriov. Here is my innocent
dramonic

[hiphop]

Yes, Captain Nitpicker, because he isn't posting content.

Nice lynch candidate, however that is not how it is done. Like this

mod: prod mask man

Now can we get back to business?

[hiphop]

Hiphop

- I can't quite explain why, but I do get an off feeling about him with things he says sometimes. Will look into it further but just wanted to put it out there. One of his recent quotes that really bothers me is this one :

Sando- I believe you don't have a leg to stand on.

Attacking charter is not a good thing, because charter is town.

The way he states as fact that charter is town is quite unsettling. To be honest, I didn't bring it up at first because I thought he was breadcrumbing (though quite obviously) that he was cop, but then he lists his hypo-investigation list with Dramonic. Therefore, the only way he could be sure of Charter's alignment is if he was scum. Just this isn't much, I know, but I'm trying to wrap my brain around why he would say that as if it was a well-known fact to all.

Did you read day 2? Shall I quote crypto's (confimed town) defense against me? Do you find that charter is town? After day 2, I do not plan on attacking charter. If he pulled a fast one on me as scum, well... good for him, but right now, there is no one else( besides crypto) that I would want to advance into tomorrow with me(assuming that scum doesn't self kill).

Also hammer away. Just to let you know, (depending on the flip, also assuming I don't die) I plan on coming after you or pyro tomorrow. Maybe even Rockatansky. We will see.

[hiphop]

Leaning scum (i.e., scum if dramonic is town): peanutman.

Scum: dramonic.

I would rather switch these around, but we will see.

[hiphop]

^No, forget that. Peanutman moves way up on my list. Still reading.

[hiphop]

---------------------

Super Accurate* Vote Count(as of post 1225):

Trumpet of Doom - 4(charter, hiphop, The Inquisition, danakillsu)
Pyromaniac - 3(peanutman, Trumpet of Doom)
The Inquisition - 1(Pyromaniac)
mask man - 1(crypto)

Not Voting:mask man, Kreriov, dramonic

It takes 6 to lynch, 4 at deadline.

*Not guaranteed to be accurate.

mod I believe it only takes five to lynch

Charter cop should claim if he has at least three of the same result. That will give town the majority.


The reason I don't like a peanutman lynch is because of ec and x's exchange in the beginning of the game.

[hiphop]

vote peanutman

[hiphop]

If you put a godfather in, and make it so scum's kills can be rb, than I think it would of been a more fair game. It would make townies think, instead of saying confirmed, but that is my opinion.