NY 118 - BBM's Large Normal Mafia (Game!)

[Gorrad]

*Dramatic entrance is dramatic*

Ok everyone, I'll be frank here. I'm moving for the rest of the month, and that's put a dent in all online activity. However, I'm not going to make my first, and possibly only game of 2010 end up in failure. Those who've played with me know my style. Those who don't, be in for a surprise, or hey- read my games.

See y'all after my readthrough!

[Gorrad]

Gorrad's note list

Right from the page 3 get-go, Hiphop's not looking that good. Vets, how many times has a townie who has been on for over a year said the phrase 'That does not help my win condition'? Especially regarding something as harmless as a self-vote in the RVS.

Oooh, and here's Wickedestjr siding with Hiphop against Kise. Noted and noted.

Danakillsu's 72: "Well it's funny to see the reactions I got from pretending I knew UA was scum." Bullshit. Those who bluff like that- especially a stupid bluff like that- don't back off after a measly amount of pressure is put on. You're lying about bluffing, though I'm not sure you're scum.

Wickedest pops on the Dana wagon without a single remark towards it in 80.

JD is being JD. This is a JDtell and when we're voting who JD is, I will vote him.

Man, I like Xite's style! Not really a towntell, but 103's citation made me chuckle.

Frank's 110 has some serious buddying going on. It's possible he sees Dana's sinking ship and is trying to distance as much as he can.

Ooh! And bam with the scum vibes in 112-114. Frank has, in these short posts, insulting, being sure UA's mafia, insulting, threatening a vote, insulting, and once more bringing up 'win condition as town'.

FoS:

Anyone who EVER says that phrase or a variation thereof.

Dana and frank arguing makes my head hurt with the accumulated scumvibes. Of the two, Frank's better, but neither are good. The more they talk, the more I want them gone.

Frank in 140: 'You are obvscum, as is reflected by the votecount.' uuuuuuuuuugh

Bunnylover's 167 is a wonderful example of early-game lurking.

Reck's meta on Dana being chronically scummy should be taken into account to a degree, but it's not a get out of jail free card.

Shanba and Reckoner have a few posts of thoughtful, respectful discussion. I think that's a record int his game so far.

Chaz is probably town

Nhammen too, though not as likely as Chaz

I accept 192 as a reasonable reason for Bunnylover's lurking. Still lurking.

Post 201 and Hiphop's still not improved

Wickedestjr's 215 makes me cry on the inside. If he's town, he's terrible at it.

Though his 229 and 230 have redeaming qualities

in 259 Furclow continues to dig his own grave

And Dana claims cop. Ugh. We'll see how this plays out, but to be honest? This is a Flameaxe game. I would be UTTERLY unshocked if he gave cop as a fakeclaim.

Chaz, being unhelpful doesn't mean being scum, and playstyle's a much better reason for lurking than denying it or apologizing, which WOULD be scummy.

See Frank dig his grave. Dig, Frank, dig!

Dang, Wraith. A 1/24 chance of hitting scum today? I'd LOVE to know where you got that statistic.

In 391, with very little comparitive pressure, Wraith says he'd make a good D1 lynch. The combined scumminess of a handful of players is ridiculous.

Robbnva's posts so far are useless. Worse than bunny's, that's for sure.

Wraith is directing the vig. More UUUUUUUUUGH!

Oh! And Frank's directing a cop he doesn't even believe in.

FLinter pings with 433, not as much as all my other suspects though

@Dana's 452- In middle school I did not comb my hair, nor did I wear deodorant. I wasn't very popular, but no one called me inhuman.

With 472, ConfidAnon makes a nice solid PING!

Frank's 505 adds WIFOM to his list of crimes.

Frank claims vanilla! Now he dies : D

Franks 556- Why will the town lose if you, a vanilla, dies?

Frank, no matter how much you caps, it won't make us this you REALLY ARE TOWN

David enters with a vote on the claimed cop, with no mention of the Frank wagon. I can see Dana suspicion easily, but I think Frank deserves mention.

.........And he claims cop. Joyous. This is a Flameaxe game. I would be utterly unshocked if we had two varying sanity cops.

And Wraith tries to direct the doc ><

Frank joins the Singer bandwagon as opposed to taking the obvious reason to vote Dana.

[Gorrad]

The TL:DR of it:
Scummy(In order)
Furcolow
Wickedestjr
Wraith
Hiphop
danakillsu
Robbnva
Flinter

I feel completely justified in putting the penultimate vote on.

Vote: Frank

[Gorrad]

I took the time during the night to do one of my favorite scumhunting tricks: VC analysis. The following are the people who were on both wagons (Dana and Frank):

Prozac, Mysterio, singersigner, Wraith, Benmage, hiphop, Reck
(Note: If Dana is scum, Prozac and Benmage can be removed from this because they were in the first three to vote him)

The following people were on neither wagon:

flinter, DavidParker, WickedestJr, Orochi, Sebguer, Kise

Now, it stands to reason that scum want a lynch quickly D1. If the person is town, they want them dead. If they're scum, they want the town-points associated with being on the lynchwagon for scum. That said, people who were on NEITHER wagon also stand a good chance at being cowardly scum who don't want attention drawn to them. I PROMISE. 100% Gorrad assurance. 2-3 people on the first list are scum. I'd also hypothesize that one of (Flinter, WickedestJr, Kise) are scum. Orochi and Sebguer were too inactive for me to be sure.

@.@ is full of BS on a number of different things, but the primary one is that there's a chance we're dealing with multiple mafias. If there were more, BBM would have put something other than 'mafia goon' as the role. @.@, I dare you to find me a counterexample. He's trying to look smart and powerful while making all kinds of shit up. I'm also getting progressively worse vibes from Reck.

For right now, though:

Vote: Wraith

. Wraith is the second scummiest alive person on my list from yesterday, and was on both wagons. I'm confident in this choice at this time.

[Gorrad]

If I push it now, it will devolve and distract from Wraith and others who should be lynched. I don't want you to be lynched today. If such a time comes, I promise you (and you can totally hold me to this) I'll come back here and point out specifics. One of the primary reasons why Wraith wasn't bandwagoned yesterday was that he was quiet with his scumminess, whilst Frank and Dana were loud and obnoxious with theirs. Not today. Today is spotlight: Wraithscum.

[Gorrad]

BUT right before DP claimed it was posted he fake claims often even when he is town, plus later he changed to say he breadcrummed Doc

That was Frank, not DP. DP was claiming cop until the end of the day. Therefore, Dana was right in investigating him.

@@.@: Simply put, your case on bunny has nothing to do with bunny being scummy. I honestly cannot see an experienced player acting like bunny does as town OR scum, and if you look at bunny as a newbie your case on him can EASILY be attributed to ignorance. Wraith, on the other hand, just pulled the self-vote to see who votes me then OMGUS trick. Classic scum play, in addition to past infractions.

Flinter, are you honestly suggesting we lynch one of the more experienced players solely on the fact that they're an experienced player? Protip: Experienced townies are usually a lot better than newbies. Sure, experienced scum are often a lot better than newbie scum, but the odds are that there's going to be a lot more experienced town than experienced scum, and experienced town can catch experienced scum. Lynching based on experience is a, to be honest, shitty way of narrowing down who to lynch. Especially early game.

Also: 713- possible Bunny-Flinter connection. Noted for later.

[Gorrad]

I'm not sure which would be worse- the usually terrible plan of directing the cop, or trusting your reads.

[Gorrad]

Flinter, are you honestly suggesting we lynch one of the more experienced players solely on the fact that they're an experienced player? Protip: Experienced townies are usually a lot better than newbies. Sure, experienced scum are often a lot better than newbie scum, but the odds are that there's going to be a lot more experienced town than experienced scum, and experienced town can catch experienced scum. Lynching based on experience is a, to be honest, shitty way of narrowing down who to lynch. Especially early game.

Lol, no. Dana asked who she should investigate, those were my answers. If you catch experienced scum that way, you've lost a big problem. If you confirm experienced town that way, the positive effect is much bigger then that you would have confirmed an unexperienced player.

Aha! That makes more sense. Thanks : )

IGMEOY = I got my eye on you

AtE = Appeal to Emotion

[Gorrad]

AtE also = Active Time Event. When the ATE window pops up, select an active time event to watch. This lets you see what's going on in the story in multiple places at the same time.

[Gorrad]

I don't think Wraith is scum. I don't agree that the shift on position on Frank is particularly scummy - if you read my posts you'll notice a similar thing happening with my read on dana (though in the opposite direction). More to the point, though, that kind of repositioning requires a degree of bravery, and hence is more likely to come through conviction of belief than desire to jump on a lynchwagon.

The rest of the Wraith case is not overly convincing.

I'm quoting this so when I reread my posts later on I'll be reminded of it. It stands out to me as important.

[Gorrad]

Wicked's deduction that there is a SK doesn't sit well with me.

Unless this is a Mafia and Werewolves setup, which isn't a possibility I orginally thought of, then it only makes sense for the nhammen kill to have been from an SK.

Please tell me you don't ACTUALLY believe this. That kill could have come from:
SK
A second kill from the same mafia (I've given specific mafia members addition one-shot kills in the past)
Vig
PGO (for those unfamiliar with the role, kills those who target it at night. All in all unlikely given that the deceased is vanilla, but possible)
In a previous Flameaxe game, when two cult recruiters targeted the same person, that person died. Though I'm not suggesting a cult in this game, there could be two such counteracting roles.
Inventor
Reflector
ANY OTHER ROLE that Flameaxe could have made up. Even though this is a normal, BBM is far from your traditional mod. If we don't have some downright extraordinary roles this game, I will be shocked. By Science.

All that said? Probably SK or Vig. But do not make the mistake of thinking that it could only be a SK.

[Gorrad]

Hey, how about you flip me and find that I'm town before you start lynching the only sane man in this town.

This and Xite's counterposts have completely nullified any town vibes I might have been getting from your ISOs. Those vibes mostly being 'Wow, Wraith's made two posts that weren't stupid and/or trying to get himself lynched.'

Shanba, you miss the point of Xite's latest posts. The case against Wraith has been made repeatedly by multiple people. Heck, I made one in my readthrough. Xite's posts have been adding to it- the, as you put it, snarky comments and calling him out as scum with scumtells? That's him countering any pro-town vibes people (see above) may have gotten from such an undeniably scummy character. I just woke up, so I'm not sure that makes as much sense on paper as it did in my head. Ask if I need to clarify.

Bunny, what was your alignment in the aforementioned mafia game?

[Gorrad]

So you are admitting that you're saying to be lynched so that we won't lynch you? Awesome.

Confirm vote: Wraith

[Gorrad]

@Everyone, but mostly Shanba

Did no one else see 869? That's him practically spelling out that he's saying 'lynch me' so he won't be lynched. Seriously! I'm agog that no one else has commented on that.

[Gorrad]

Maybe agog is a wrong choice of words. I'm shocked and appalled that no one else has commented on it.

[Gorrad]

See? See? Shanba- I have a lot of respect for you as a player. PLEASE tell me you see what Wraith is saying! Refusing to claim this early on in his wagon is fine, but he's saying that he will not claim at ALL before his lynch. That's actively anti-town behavior.

[Gorrad]

DAYKILL HELL YES! I love BBM games.

[Gorrad]

Bravo, Xite. Well done indeed. While a funny play, you've managed to COMPLETELY derail the very wagon you've been pushing all day. This includes the fact that you yourself have unvoted said wagon and not revoted. Do you honestly believe Wraith's reaction is so bloody protown that it absolves him?

Porochaz, you claim Wraith's acted like this as town? Links or it didn't happen.

Wicked, I just wanted to argue the point. You seemed rather certain of something that should not be a definite.

Robbn's 945 grants major scumpoints.

All three of the wagons- Wraith, Robbn, and Mysterio- are decent ones. However, Wraith has done absolutely nothing protown other than MAYBE those two posts a few pages back all of the days, and has done significant work to detract from the town's effectiveness. Robbn is a poor player regardless of alignment, and that pings scumdars. Mysterio, though a follower, has at least ATTEMPTED to contribute to the town much more than Wraith.

[Gorrad]

My

problem

is

that

bold

phrases

are

annoying

and

distracting

. They make people focus only on the bold, and not the post as a whole. Please, when writing emphasis, use some other means than fancy formatting.

[Gorrad]

@Wickedest, just glancing at his iso, isos 3-6 are contributions, or at the minimum attempts thereof. Also, I'd like to point out that the only reason I was second to last on Frank's wagon is because that was when I replaced in.

[Gorrad]

Also @Wickedest: You should also note that Reck voted Dana after the votecount but before the claim.

[Gorrad]

Wicked: No, it was in response you your asking me to point out posts in which Mysterio attempts contribution.

[Gorrad]

Allow me to clarify: A second scum kill could have been redirected by any number of means to kill the second person last night.

[Gorrad]

[Gorrad, ConfidAd]

An explanation and/or reminder to those non-programmers/mathematicians in the audience: When two values are placed in brackets and separated by a comma, it represents the inclusive list of values from the first to the second. As I'm the first vote on Wraith and CA is the latest, Kise is saying that this block represents everyone who is voting Wraith as of the last VC.

Took me a sec to realize what you meant, Kise, so I figured others may have the same issue : )

[Gorrad]

@Gorrad: No, I'm including you and ConfidAd as the two I feel are possible mafia on Wraith's wagon. No one else voting Wraith is a scummer in my eyes.

I'm calling Porochaz as Godfather right now.

Oh! My mistake.

Wraith, I'm voting you because you have not only contributed next to nothing this entire game, but your attitude has actively served to detract from actions in the town's benefit IE scumhunting. If you were town, you would spend less times saying 'woe is me lynch me guys' and more time scumhunting. The one brief time you attempted to do so, the two isos a little while back, was not only not enough to make up for the considerable amount of detraction, it was also was quickly and neatly refuted by Xite.

[Gorrad]

K guys, I got the day off of work tomorrow partially for this game (feel loved) I plan to be spending at least 2 hours on the post(s) I will be giving you which will probably include
1) A case on robbie
2) A case on wraith
3) An analysis on my gambit
4) A case on those I find scummy enough based on said analysis
5) A possible VC analysis if I deem that there's enough change in votes to do so (but probably not because we haven't gotten enough flips)
6) A TL;DR type scum/town/neutral list and maybe even the key points of everything
7) And maybe even a full reread analysis if I feel up to it

I'm telling you this for 2 reasons.
1) If you want to see anything else from me with this/these masspost(s), let me know and I will include them
2) If I leave anything out (I tend to forget things ) then let me know after my huge post(s)

This preview has been approved for all audiences.

[Gorrad]

Wicked: I only READ his first few posts. I didn't go through all what, 17? The first few were contributions, and you said you wanted me to point out an example. There's an example. And yes, I think four posts of contribution are worth more than Wraith's many posts of detraction.

[Gorrad]

Xite, the person you've been pushing all day is at L-3 and you swap wagons? Gods above and below, if I didn't think you were town I'd see scum bailing from vote count analysis. Stop being an ADD fruitcake and finish off one scum before going to another.

[Gorrad]

1) When a scum doesn't claim, he doesn't have to fakeclaim. When a townie doesn't claim, the ONLY REASON is if he has a power role that he feels for one reason or another cannot be revealed until his death. The latter is not only extremely rare, but scum use it as a way to fakeclaim without fakeclaiming (though that does not seem to be the case this time). It also, of course, is keeping information from the town. The more information we have, the less confused we are. The less confused we are, the more scum we catch.

2) Robbn is a poor player. Poor town or poor scum, either way pings people's scumdars. Wraith is not a bad player, I believe. I believe he is a remarkably scummy player.

3) Making assumptions about night actions, unless one is a power role and has other information, is useless at this point. It detracts from scumhunting by muddling up the thread with worthless speculation. My posts were meant to combat that speculation by showing its futility.

4) Anti-town is, in fact, the definition of scum. They're the anti-town faction(s). They are against us. If scum weren't anti-town, we wouldn't have a game. We'd have a town full of happy, contented people.

[Gorrad]

You're putting the FIRST vote on your first choice of scum, leaving a wagon of eight on your second choice of scum.

Does anyone else find this illogical? Is it just me? Because I don't follow.

[Gorrad]

Protip: When writing an iso, write who the person in question is in the topic with the iso.

[Gorrad]

Considering rereading Wraith's ISO I'm not as positive Wraith is scum?

First I've heard of this. Explain.

[Gorrad]

Xite, what of that ISO says town? I see the majority, though not all, of your comments pointing at Wraithscum.

[Gorrad]

Also, I just realized I hadn't made this point yet, which is odd because I usually do in such a situation. All those posts where Wraith's only point is to try for townpoints? Hey, guess what- TOWN DOESN'T NEED TOWNPOINTS. Town needs other people's scumpoints. Scum need townpoints. A townie goes into a game of mafia saying 'Hey, let's find the scum'. A scum goes into a game of mafia saying 'Hey, I'm gonna try to not be lynched'.

To everyone: Of those two categories, can you REALLY see Wraith in the former more than the latter? If he were honestly town, if he sooooo didn't want to play the game he signed up for by scumhunting, which is what town do in a mafia game, he'd have left by now.

[Gorrad]

3. I can easily say you are wrong when you say I am scum, cause YOU ARE WRONG. I am not scum,I am pro-town. This is not my opinion, this is FACT. only way to prove it though is at the end of the game, or when I am lynched, or if I am killed.

*SNRK* Ok. Yeah. You have a point, Xite.

[Gorrad]

As stated above- Town don't need to prove they're town. Town need to find scum.

[Gorrad]

How could it be biased? I don't think I've played with either of them. If I have, it's been months and I don't remember. This is my first game of 2010.

[Gorrad]

In my experience, Shanba, yeah. It's scummy. It's been my opinion since the first game I played that a town player's main focus should be on scumhunting. Defensive posts, posts proclaiming one's towniness, all those take a back seat to, I dunno, trying to win.

[Gorrad]

I'm liking a Mysterio wagon less and less.

[Gorrad]

I'm liking a Mysterio wagon less and less.

What based on a terrible post?
Or is it because he agrees with you?
Explain plox

Because he at least LOOKS like he's trying to scumhunt. I can see his posts far more from noobtown.

Wraith's posts don't even have internal consistency. He's tired of being lynched as town, so he tells the town to lynch him repeatedly? The hell?

[Gorrad]

I'm liking a Mysterio wagon less and less.

What based on a terrible post?
Or is it because he agrees with you?
Explain plox

Because he at least LOOKS like he's trying to scumhunt. I can see his posts far more from noobtown.

Wraith's posts don't even have internal consistency. He's tired of being lynched as town, so he tells the town to lynch him repeatedly? The hell?

1. looking like he is trying to scum hunt =/= scum hunting
2. I agree with this

It's still better than a good number of people here ><

[Gorrad]

I asked to be hammered several times because I figured the cause was lost (especially since everything I said was being turned against me) and preferred not to spend any more attention on a lost cause. I wanted the town to quit focusing on a massive distraction, get the definitive info they needed, and start lynching the real scum.

but you started this when there was barely any attention on you

Yeah dude. You kinda started before you were even brought up as a candidate.

[Gorrad]

Because you should totally just lynch the guy who wants to be lynched. That's smart in any game. Whatever, I've made my cases, lynch me now so I don't have to waste anymore time here.

This is you pretty much admitting that the only reason you've wanted to get lynched is for townpoints. Once more, guess who needs townpoints. Hint: Not town.

[Gorrad]

Because you should totally just lynch the guy who wants to be lynched. That's smart in any game. Whatever, I've made my cases, lynch me now so I don't have to waste anymore time here.

This is you pretty much admitting that the only reason you've wanted to get lynched is for townpoints. Once more, guess who needs townpoints. Hint: Not town.

Wickedest, look at this. This is my response to you, Bunny, and all the others. Wraith here is admitting that the only reason he's been self-sacrificing is so that people WON'T lynch him.

[Gorrad]

Dana, if you're really the cop, investigate me tonight. Now that people are actually realizing that my wagon is bogus, and that I'm being given a chance to post freely without everyone jumping on me for being scum, I might just be able to live today.

Ghkt! This has to be what it's like for someone with sense in the DC universe. "Dude! Superman is Clark Kent! Can't you tell? I mean, he just puts on glasses!" People who aren't voting wraith, read these posts he makes!

[Gorrad]

I don't like commenting on a WoT attack on a specific player until they make a counterpost.

[Gorrad]

No.

[Gorrad]

Yes.

[Gorrad]

A bad player tries and fails. He's not trying either way. Therefore, he's not bad. He's just scum.

[Gorrad]

Wow. Just...Wow.

Xite, I agree with you. Robb is pretty bleedin' scummy, and I would not hesitate to lynch him. However, I feel the same way about Wraith. I honestly have seen no compelling reason, from you or anyone else, to swap wagons. If you can convince me of your reasoning behind Xite being town without saying 'Read his Iso and see how it feels' for I have and it feels like obvious scum, I'm willing to swap.

[Gorrad]

He's already said he's not going to claim. I think now would be a good time to do so, if he was so inclined.

[Gorrad]

And also, I agree with Robbnva about potentially investigating Xite tonight, if only to confirm he's town. He posts the most beefy stuff of anyone, and I'd like to know if the people who agree with him are agreeing with town, or their scum-buddy. We can go from there.

No directing the Gorram cop! D X

[Gorrad]

Actually, I do have a friend in Seattle who I need to go visit.

Quoted for truth.

I want a hands up of anyone who is not voting Wraith and thinks they will be able to get everyone they need on another wagon before Friday. If anyone even THINKS the phrase 'no-lynch' without they predecessor "we don't want a", I will vig you so hard your brains pop.

That is by no means whatsoever a claim in any way, shape, or form.

Size increased because of the sheer number of people who don't read the bloody thread.

[Gorrad]

The following people were on all wagons:

Singersigner, Wraith, hiphop

The following people were on no wagons:

Eek, Kise

I can see the Mysterio wagon as NOTHING but scum trying to bail out one of their own. He's been on all three wagons, he's actively detracted from the town, and it's high time he finally bit it.

Vote: Wraith

Also: I apologize for being inactive the last few days of D2. My power cable overheated and broke.

[Gorrad]

Pre-emptive

IGMEOY:

The first person to speculate on the night actions.

[Gorrad]

Shanba, I don't see your case, to be honest. Frank played poorly, and everyone was on his case. That's why we lynched him. I see iso 15 as more an attack on him than a defense of Porochaz. As for 20, are you seriously saying that's defense? You decided to put a vote on someone with no case whatsoever. I don't see how reacting to that adversely is scummy or defending of Poro at all.

You've been tunneling on Porochaz for ages, with what I see as a sequence of poor cases. Today's kill is going to be Wraith, and I'll tell you why. Because, IF Wraith is town, no mafia in their right mind would NK him. He's a scummy claimed vanilla who has come very close to lynch. And if our mysterious second killer was going to do the honor, he would have last night. The only way Wraith is going to die is by lynch, and if we put it off we're only delaying the inevitable.

So sure. Robb's scummy. Maybe Porochaz as well. But either of them could could still be, for one reason or another, killed off at night. There is no good move today that I can see that isn't a Wraith lynch.

[Gorrad]

Holy crap did I just get accused of tunneling by the guy who has done nothing else for the last day and a bit but tunnel on wraith?

Let me put this simply. Wraith is a terrible lynch. Frankly I'm simply astonished that you are so convinced by it - I literally cannot understand your viepoint. Like, at all. Frank was not a great lynch either. Both are simply players playing badly. Prozac is a player comitting scumtells. This is a

clear and obvious difference

. And you're a good player, so what in the name of Woden's Beard is going on?

He's a scummy claimed vanilla who has come very close to lynch. And if our mysterious second killer was going to do the honor, he would have last night. The only way Wraith is going to die is by lynch, and if we put it off we're only delaying the inevitable.

And this? Clear bullshit. We should lynch him because scum won't kill him? Seriously? Are you even listening to yourself any more? ARGH this game.

1) Yes. You're tunneling. I'm doing some as well, sure, but I'm also looking hard at Robb.

2) I don't see these scumtells. I honestly don't. I see Wraith, who has actively detracted from the town since D1. If he was bad town, he'd be like Mysterio (and yes, Frank) and trying to contribute.

3) Bunny has it right. As long as he is not lynched, he's going to be a scummy distraction. He's going to continue to be a detriment to the town. There is no way short of cop confirmation that he will be cleared. If he's not lynched today, he'll be a distraction tomorrow. Repeat ad nauseum. Way to misrepresent me, dude.

[Gorrad]

Wraith: I really like how you're starting to contribute. It almost makes up for your not doing so earlier, except for the fact that you only started doing so after I constantly called you out for it.

Dana has serious strikes against him, but I have to disagree with

tbh only scum would refuse to look at the death writeup imo since they are already know who is dead.

Scum died N1. Therefore, scum know they're not the only kill. Therefore, they'd read the gorram opening post.

I think the fact that Dana's still alive is a huge load of WIFOM. I'm not going to fall for it.

Post preview Edit: A) Don't speculate on NKs. B) As SK, I would want to be able to fakeclaim vig due to there only being two kills N1. Therefore I'd target those much higher on my scumlist than Benmage. While this IS WIFOM, it's the kind I'd have to setup beforehand and tell me, which would be better- me setting up this as WIFOM, or me with a vig claim? The answer's obviously the latter. And Claim: Not a Vig

[Gorrad]

Noted and appreciated.

[Gorrad]

Yeah. Well, Xite, seriously, ISO yourself. Compare the length to War and Peace. Did you expect that I read every word of it?

Xite's iso: Roughly 3,000 words.

War and Peace: Roughly 560,000 words.

I'm helpful : )

[Gorrad]

I just got engaged...that is all for now.

Awww congrats!

Ditto this! Many, many grats!

[Gorrad]

Wanna know why it was scum trying to bail out their own? Because never ONCE did someone ask Mysterio for a claim. If I was, hypothetically, on that wagon and it reached that L-1 without anyone so much as mentioning a claim, I would have bailed so he'd have a chance to. If I hadn't had a blown power cable, I would have brought it up too.

[Gorrad]

@Flinter:
Dana is obviously #2 on my scumlist, but so far all the scum in this game have been on the sidelines, only talking enough to not be prodded or seem scummy. Like, for example, you and hiphop, neither of which I like. I don't see any ties between Wraith and other people, but I don't really look for those. I tried that one game and it utterly failed for me.

[Gorrad]

Clarification: In the game in question, I did NOTHING but look at ties. I'm not saying that looking for them isn't a valid form of scumhunting, it's just one I don't generally do any more.

[Gorrad]

Bleh. It DOES seem likely they'd RB him, doesn't it. It just seems like a boatload of WIFOM, and we could very well be lynching a cop right after we lynch a doc. I'm getting CRAZY bad vibes from it, but I can't see why they wouldn't RB him. It's my own argument used against me by myself- Which would help them more: Setting up WIFOM, or not getting caught by the cop.

I reserve the right to change back if I manage to counter my own logic. Wraith still needs to be lynched tomorrow if not today. And I really don't see Xitescum.

Unvote, Vote: Dana

Also, late EBWOP: 1650 should read obviously ROBB is second on my scumlist.

[Gorrad]

Dana, working off a theory, I want to confirm:
1) Your role name, no variations, is 'cop'
2) You can investigate one (1) person a night to see if they're _____ (fill in the blank. Scum? Anti-town? Evil? I don't want you to quote)

Basically, is there ANYTHING in your role PM that would suggest you are not a normal cop who finds scum? If you're telling the truth and you're lynched, this will likely be important.

[Gorrad]

Tell me, what do you make of Gorrad?

Gorrad has a good head on his shoulders. He doesn't post as much as others, but the times he does, they usually make good points. He was absolutely right to call us out for lynching without a claim, which I shoulda done on my L-2 vote but forgot. The only thing I find wrong with his play is bits like

Pre-emptive IGMEOY: The first person to speculate on the night actions.

If memory serves, he made a similar post Day 2, refusing to acknowledge 2 scum teams.

Overall, A strong player, whose bits that I found off or scummy aren't enough to counteract his overall aura of townlieness

Thanks : )

Do you think that possible information gained from speculation is worth the distraction it provides from scumhunting?

[Gorrad]

While it does have the potential to be valuable, I agree, I've been in too many towns that got completely derailed by speculation. I find that attempting to stop it entirely at the very least will limit it to an acceptable level.

But enough on that : )

[Gorrad]

Votecount 3.2

Dana [4] (evilpacman, Wraith, Prozac, DemonHybrid)

Prozac [2] (Shanba, Lowell)
Wraith [2] (Gorrad, Dana)
Rob [2] (Xite, hiphop)
UltimaAvalon [1] (UltimaAvalon)
Bunnylover [1] (Antihero)
Hiphop [1] (Rob)

Not Voting [4] (Kise, Singersigner, My Milked Eek, Bunnylover)

With 18 alive it will take 10 to lynch, and 9 to no lynch.

---

Deadline:

Not currently in place.

Activity Check: My Milked Eek will be prodded.

I'm voting Dana 8 D

[Gorrad]

What makes Wraith's WIFOM more believeable than Dana's WIFOM?

Is this targeted at Robb, or can I answer?

[Gorrad]

Because what scum would gain from roleblocking Dana is more than they'd get from setting this up as WIFOM.

[Gorrad]

I think Dana is a terribad Cop. I think Scum are counting on him being a terribad player, and using their powers on other, better targets, while they wait for his crappy play to get him killed. I'm willing to give Dana one more night before putting him on the chopping block

They have a roleblocker. You think they'd use that roleblocker on some random person at night when they could use it on someone they KNOW it would effect who could possibly investigate them?

[Gorrad]

Uh-huh. And they'd risk Dana hitting one of them at night? Remember, none of them had died going into N1.

[Gorrad]

Plus, Dana was top of my scumlist until the claim. Read my WoT when I entered.

[Gorrad]

Uh-huh. And they'd risk Dana hitting one of them at night? Remember, none of them had died going into N1.

Okay, I'm done.
I have an idea

Dana-cop-targeting discussion ends now

It's just diluting the thread and keeping us from scumhunting altogether.
If someone has something ELSE to add about Dana that has nothing to do with him being a cop (Unless it's a counter-claim, but please don't be dumb) then I would LOVE to hear it. But if they don't, tell me your top suspect based on their play, or on analysis, not on WIFOM

For a case on Dana that has nothing to do with him being a cop, read my WoT upon entering the game.

UA, you think one more day will change jack squat? Why? I'm willing to listen. Right now the three people I'd lynch, in order most to least: Dana, Wraith, Robb. I could be convinced on Hiphop or Flinter.

Hiphop, what's all this 'last scum' bull. Do you have any reason to think that there's not more than three scum in a game this large? Also, BBM is kinda notorious for crazy setups. Cop-doc is not precisely his MO.

Pacman, go to the bottom of the page where it says 'Display posts by user', select who you want to iso, then press 'go'.

[Gorrad]

Ah! I misunderstood.

He didn't post for the majority of D2, and all his defensive D3 posts are him speculating on obscure, rare roles. Admittedly this is a BBM game and I'd be far from surprised to see one of those role, but I doubt that's his train of thought.

[Gorrad]

UA, you think one more day will change jack squat? Why? I'm willing to listen.

Maybe it won't change anything. Maybe it will. I see that the last two nights he made horrible choices for investigations. I'd like to see a 3rd investigation from him before putting him on the block. Besides, lynching him means we don't lynch robb. If we don't lynch Robb, then Robb keeps posting. And I don't think I can handle that.

And you think tonight he'll make a better choice? Definition of insanity.

[Gorrad]

Here's what I don't want: I don't want it to be day 6, ten people alive if we keep progressing at this rate, and still have [Robb, Dana, Wraith] alive and distracting the town with crazy scumminess and/or inactive stupidity and/or regular stupidity. With every person we put off another day, we're not getting someone else's lynch that day, and there will ALWAYS be people who get more scummy and added to the lynch list for one reason or another (See also: Dana).

Right now, I don't care which of those three we lynch. I feel better about Dana, but any of them could EASILY be scum. And I want the three of them lynched over the next few days. I want our endgame to not have distractions, not have idiots, and NOT have a scum fakeclaiming cop.

Those who disagree with lynching Dana today: Are you with me on lynching him before D6 if nothing changes regarding him?

[Gorrad]

Here's what I don't want: I don't want it to be day 6, ten people alive if we keep progressing at this rate, and still have [Robb, Dana, Wraith] alive and distracting the town with crazy scumminess and/or inactive stupidity and/or regular stupidity. With every person we put off another day, we're not getting someone else's lynch that day, and there will ALWAYS be people who get more scummy and added to the lynch list for one reason or another (See also: Dana).

Gorrad, are you seriously suggesting 3 policy lynches in a row? Wow, I knew there was some reason I thought you were scum.

Where did I say policy lynch? I hate policy lynches. You are incorrect in your interpretation.

Unvote, Vote: Robb

Especially in light of recent posts, happy to change over. This is the SIXTH vote on him.

UA, you know your vote's still on you?

[Gorrad]

I'm proposing lynching them because they're scummy as hell!

[Gorrad]

I'm proposing lynching them because they're scummy as hell!

Okay, just had to make sure.

You certainly have an aggressive way of double checking : P

[Gorrad]

UA, you know your vote's still on you?

I am. I'm waiting for a vote count, which I've been promised is coming soon. Expect my vote to switch after it happens

You shouldn't need a vote count for a vote. You vote on whoever you think ought to be killed the most, needing a vote count to decide for you means you're probably gonna hop on a wagon with no reason why, which is lazy or scummy.

Or he's trying to avoid the same situation we had yesterday, with a lynch before a claim.

Speaking of which! Robb, as soon as that VC confirms my count (you being at L-3, I believe), I expect a claim.

[Gorrad]

Those pictures look ridiculous X D I post with the space everywhere. It stops the stupid filter from replacing them, and looks less cramped.

[Gorrad]

Eh, I don't see it so much as flip-flopping because I still thought he was scum, but not as much. But if Dana turns up scum and you feel the need to lynch me, go ahead. That's your prerogative, but at least help me lynch obvscum first (which by the way isn't dana)

I don't plan on that any time soon, you're still very pro-town imo and yes, it is dana.

It's Robb AND Dana.

[Gorrad]

Dingdingding! And there's the scum found.

Vote: Dana

[Gorrad]

Shanba: Have you made a case and I missed it?

[Gorrad]

Gorrad, no case yet. I'm debating whether to bring one today or tomorrow. I'm worried that if I do it today, it'll get swallowed up in the quicklynch and the impact will be dulled. But I'd like to get it out before I get nightkilled. I dunno.

If it's all the same, I'd prefer one today. That way I can work on addressing it during night phase.

[Gorrad]

@singer: I think he means "read the topic and analyze Shanba's reads while it is locked and he has nothing to do."

Yes, but my question was alluding to what makes him think it will matter tomorrow (i.e. he will make it through the night, etc)? And please don't ever answer for someone like that again.

Wraith is correct. Why wouldn't it matter tomorrow? Either A) I'm dead and the matter is moot or B) I'm not dead and respond to it.

[Gorrad]

Did I withhold suspicions? I don't believe I did.

[Gorrad]

Guys what are ya'll opinion on the reason their is two deaths.
Is it because their is a Vig or a SK role?
I am leaning on their been a SK role due to the kills that have been made at night.

IGMEOY: Bunnylover

Debating on Wraith. He's been a lot better recently. Still, his early game was unacceptable.

[Gorrad]

Bunnylover, I want to know your reason for speculating on SK or Vig.

[Gorrad]

Speaking of which! Shanba, I look forward to your promised case.

[Gorrad]

There is no chance whatsoever that Hiphop will be lynched this game.

[Gorrad]

There is no chance whatsoever that Hiphop will be lynched this game.

Because Hip-Hop was replaced and is already dead?

Exactly.

[Gorrad]

If he won when the mafia was dead, he wouldn't be a SK. He'd be a vig.

It's more important to kill the SK off. Assume with me that there's two more mafia left (1/4 the town is standard). If we kill One mafia today, we'll be down to 9 tomorrow. If we kill the SK, we'll be at 10. If we kill the mafia and mislynch tomorrow, then we're at 6 in two days, if we kill the SK and mislynch we're at 8. Either way works (there's always a chance of crosskills), but I'd rather choose the one that gives town more time.

[Gorrad]

Thanks! I understand where you're coming from and will try to explain what I can.

1. Yes. I hopped on the easy lynch. What you're overlooking here is that my second choice of lynch at the time was at L-2. Obviously Wraith wasn't going to get lynched that day, and Dana had claimed cop. I was happy to lynch someone I found scummy D1.

2. I repeatedly told you. He actively detracted from the game with his posts. Town have no reason to act the way his did. And I daresay I made more of a case on him than anyone else. I can understand that you may not understand my case on him, but it was MY case.

3. I don't look at connections. It's really not something I trust. They're SO EASY to fake, and when I'm scum I go out of my way to do so. Porochaz is lurking, yes. I accept that. But I don't see anything else to your case.
As for your tunneling: I have made cases on Dana, Robb, Wraith, and Frank, and mentioned multiple times my dislike of Flinter and Hiphop. Other than Porochaz and Myself, who do you suspect? I have no bloody idea. Maybe you aren't tunneling, but you certainly aren't expressing that in thread.

I don't go for the easy lynches. I start the wagons. I don't hop on for the ride, I make cases. The reason the lynches are easy is because either Xite or I push them and everyone else agrees. Look at every wagon I've been on- how many of them have me not in the first few votes? If I hopped on at the end parroting, I might believe your case had more merit. As it is, I think you just don't understand what I've been saying, and that paired with OMGUS (in response to the tunneling accusation) is the root of it.

I look forward to your reply : )

[Gorrad]

I don't believe I have been going at Shanba this game. In fact, I'm quite leaning town there.

[Gorrad]

Godfather. Like the movie.

[Gorrad]

Vote: Bunnylover

It looks like you just skimmed Shanba's posts and decided to hop on. I've been debating between you and Wraith today, and you just tilted the scales.

[Gorrad]

Does the town not need to know whether there is a SK or Vig?

This is correct. The town does not need to know if it's an SK or vig.

[Gorrad]

He put himself, time and again, on the 'martyr' block while not scumhunting at all. IF he's town, he

actively tried to not have scum be caught

. He then later on admits that the only reason he put himself up to be martyred is so that he'd seem protown and not be lynched.

[Gorrad]

Yes. To Wraith.

Right now I can only see Wraith doing what he did as A) Town helping Mafia B) Mafia trying to look town. The latter seems far more likely. Shanba or anyone else (including Wraith), if you have another reason for him acting as he did, I'd LOVE to hear it.

[Gorrad]

Evilpacman: In pure speculatory terms, do you believe a hypothetical SK in this game to have NK immunity? This is relevant.

[Gorrad]

It does!

[Gorrad]

It's far from uncommon. It's to give them an edge- so they don't follow the town for ages just to die at night.

[Gorrad]

EBWOP: fool the town

[Gorrad]

Ok.

[Gorrad]

Ok.

Why? This is relevant.

It was in relation to your idea that Xite was SK. Because you didn't know about how frequently NK-immune they are, nor have strong feelings on the matter, the matter is moot.

Shanba, I think you're falling into the classic trap of thinking someone's scum because they're vocal. I'll address your points better tomorrow, but consider the possibility.

[Gorrad]

Bunnylover is another bad wagon.

He put himself, time and again, on the 'martyr' block while not scumhunting at all. IF he's town, he actively tried to not have scum be caught. He then later on admits that the only reason he put himself up to be martyred is so that he'd seem protown and not be lynched.

Actively tried to not have scum be caught? That's a pretty huge leap from "tried not to be lynched himself."

Precisely. Hence why I think he's so unlikely to be town. He only actively tried to not have scum be caught IF he's town, which his later actions contradict.

But anyway, with tells like these I always feel the fudge factor is too large to take them particularly seriously - there's a large chance that the player doing it is just new (OH NO DONT LYNCH ME is a pretty common new player reaction) and hence although there's a particular advantage for scum such that rational scum will perform said act more often than rational town, the irrational town/scum factor is much larger than both and swamps any potential utility from the scumtell.

He didn't say OH NO DONT LYNCH ME. He said OH NO LYNCH ME in an attempt at reverse psychology. He says this himself later on. Reverse psychology doesn't seem to be to be a newbtell to me.

Thanks! I understand where you're coming from and will try to explain what I can.

1. Yes. I hopped on the easy lynch. What you're overlooking here is that my second choice of lynch at the time was at L-2. Obviously Wraith wasn't going to get lynched that day, and Dana had claimed cop. I was happy to lynch someone I found scummy D1.

?

Do you mean wickedest when you said wraith? Also, dana was much lower on your scumlist than that - d1 it wasn't just wraith ahead, it was wickedest and hiphop, too. What's more, your day 2 vc analysis didn't dig any dirt on dana. From this section it looks like the reason you weren't voting dana was because he had claimed cop, but in reality he was a long way down your list.

Yes, I meant wickedest. /facepalm. Sorry, I was tired. The only reason Dana was low on my scumlist was because of the claim. He WAS a long way down my list because I believed the claim! He was an uncountered cop! You know the whole 'one town for one scum is always a good trade' thing? Well I figured if Dana was lying he'd have been countered!

2. I repeatedly told you. He actively detracted from the game with his posts. Town have no reason to act the way his did. And I daresay I made more of a case on him than anyone else. I can understand that you may not understand my case on him, but it was MY case.

I know I've partially addressed this, but I don't feel it's true. For starters, there were a number of players who had expressed suspicion of Wraith before you had, and a number of cases had been made against him - for example, confidanon. I struggle to call what you added a case at all - it covered a lot of the same ground other cases did, and what's more parts of it came after your vote on Wraith. In fact, the reason you are stating here as your primary one (the "martyring") didn't happen until well into day 2.

But that's not what really gets me. It's that everyone you've attacked (seriously attacked, that is, not throwaway remarks in your vc analyses) have been players already on the town radar. Take robbnva. Xite pointed him out to you first. Wraith, similarly - other players got there first. I think if you were properly scumhunting, you'd find many more players who were under the radar and attack them.

The martyring started D1. I distinctly remember reading it in my WoT. And no one else had really mentioned it at all, unless my memory completely fails me. I agreed with some of the other cases, yes, but my main point was new.

Really? This is your scumtell? You want to know who ELSE has attacked only people on the radar? The vast majority of the town in every game. But that's beside the point. Let me explain my logic to you (I've mentioned it before but shall repeat).

People on the town's scum radar, as backed up by actions so far, are not ones that will get killed at night. Scum would be utterly stupid to do so. The majority of NKs have been lurkers, and for good reason. Once someone reaches a certain threshold, the only way they will die is by lynch or by the scum running out of others to lynch. If we lynch people below the radar when there's still people on it, we end up with an endgame full of people who have been scummy for ages but never lynched! And I, for one, don't want to see that. This is not me advocating we lynch someone just because they've been run up. It's me advocating we lynch scummy people on the radar before we lynch scummy people off the radar.

3. I don't look at connections. It's really not something I trust. They're SO EASY to fake, and when I'm scum I go out of my way to do so. Porochaz is lurking, yes. I accept that. But I don't see anything else to your case.

Well, for a start there's the stuff I posted day 2 which you totally ignored. The thing about benmage was a sidepoint. Regardless, you're wrong about connections. Maybe you fake them, and I agree that it's good scum play to fake them, but I think the vast majority of scum players don't - and an even smaller fraction fake them when under no pressure (notably, they only start thinking about these things when they realise they're going to be lynched.) What's more, that particular type of connection - attacking a weak case on a partner - is a scumtell I'm particularly happy with. When scum see a strong case on their partner then they might well know there's little point defending him, but when the case is weak there's no reason not to try and shut it down instead (after all, a good townie shuts down weak cases). At the time, all I had said about prozac was that I thought he was scum. The fact that benmage found this practically the only thing worht commenting on in practically the entire game day is significant.

Ok. Other points noted. I still think we're going to have to agree to disagree on the connections part, though. It just opens up too much of a can of WIFOM for my taste.

As for your tunneling: I have made cases on Dana, Robb, Wraith, and Frank, and mentioned multiple times my dislike of Flinter and Hiphop. Other than Porochaz and Myself, who do you suspect? I have no bloody idea. Maybe you aren't tunneling, but you certainly aren't expressing that in thread.

Where are these cases then? I've seen a few points, but never anything solid. It seems like smoke and mirrors to me.

As for me tunneling - yes, I've had prozac and now you as my top suspects for a while. Day 1, you may note, I was the first vote on dana and then started the pressure against hiphop. On later days? Day 2 I mostly pushed prozac (the push on flinter was for a reason I'd rather not reveal yet - but I didn't have any particular feeling s/he was scum), but that was because I didn't think my prozac attacks were getting the attention they deserved. I've repeatedly named hiphop as a player I'm worried about - simply because his contribution level has been unacceptable and that's prevented me from getting a read - and until he died, UA was my third (after you and prozac - although tbf you've only really crystallised as scummy in my mind since about mid day 2 when some of your posts on wraith started to ring alarm bells). But he was a pretty damn distant third.

Regardless, I've also been very vocal about other issues. I take offence to your use of the word tunneling, as it implies that I'm not looking elsewhere. I am, but the cases I've seen elsewhere haven't been appealing. I've made it pretty clear I think wraith is town, for example. The fact is there's a core of active, self-destructive players who keep attracting wagons (wraith, dana, robb, frank) that frankly, I don't think are very strong (dana obviously being an exception when the rber failed to rb him and the real cop died - even I have to admit that's a pretty decent case ) and then there's a plethora o shadowy, half-there, fade into the background types who've been happy to pretty much coast along all game (UA, Lowell, Benmage, Prozac etc.) As such it's been hard to read, but I'm pretty sure most of the core group, players like xite and wraith, are town. I have strong townreads on those two, in fact. Which means that given I have a scumread, and that scumread is on one of the god damn lurkers, I'm pretty certain he's scum. The lukewarm response I've had has only fuelled that - my case is fairly strong, I know that, so I'm bemused as to why it's pretty much fallen flat.

I'm too tired to dig out post numbers, and to be honest if you're read my Iso as thoroughly as you claim, you'd probably dismiss them offhand.

I'm not going to go into a semantics argument about what tunneling means to me, but you're taking it far too personally. I haven't read you in Iso- I don't think you're scum. As we have played the game, the only things I have heard from you have been things against myself and Porochaz. If there was more, it was enough of a sidenote that it didn't register as notable.

[Gorrad]

For three, he's active lurking like crazy, and this late in the game, he's either scum or detrimental.

I laugh at the irony.

[Gorrad]

You're going against the grain. You're posting cases on people who aren't remotely on the radar, referencing obscure tells. You seem to be off in your own little world of scumhunting while the rest of us are going after other people. Other than you, people aren't talking about me. The same thing happened with the start of your case on Porochaz. It doesn't matter how good or bad the cases are, they're distracting from what the majority of the town is talking about and therefore shoved aside.

The only reason Porochaz is on the radar now is because of your constantly pushing him. We cleared enough of the other distractions away that we can now pay attention to your case on him. Keep pushing this case on me, and I promise people will look at it once I eventually reach the public eye.

[Gorrad]

Gorrad's play is looking worse and worse to me. First:

"Wraith is accusing someone of lurking while 'lurking' himself. I'll suddenly fall back on the case against him that I discarded yesterday."

Then:

"I'm not scum, Prozac is. FOCUS ON PROZAC"

Really, really not liking this.

1) Heh. Yeah, right. If this was true, I'd be voting you. I was just pointing out the irony.

2) How are you getting this from the quote you cited? Seriously. I can't understand it.

[Gorrad]

Yes. To Wraith.

Right now I can only see Wraith doing what he did as A) Town helping Mafia B) Mafia trying to look town. The latter seems far more likely. Shanba or anyone else (including Wraith), if you have another reason for him acting as he did, I'd LOVE to hear it.

I want Wraith and Shanba to please respond to this.

[Gorrad]

EBWOP: Wraith first.

[Gorrad]

EBWOP: Wraith first.

I did respond. Look for it, please, I don't have time to dig around.

Just Iso'd you. Can't find it.

Also, correct me in I'm wrong, but it seems to me your case on Xite is based on him not wanting to discuss night actions because of WIFOM. Did he do this D4? Or just D1-3?

[Gorrad]

I can understand D3. I felt rather similar to him D3. D4....yeah. Defending Dana D4 would have been bad.

[Gorrad]

Finally getting around to reading the posts I couldn't.

Shanba, I like your case, it makes a lot of sense but it all broils down to mostly VC analysis. Do you have more from his posts that make you think he's scum?

2. I repeatedly told you. He actively detracted from the game with his posts. Town have no reason to act the way his did. And I daresay I made more of a case on him than anyone else. I can understand that you may not understand my case on him, but it was MY case.

4) Look at every wagon I've been on- how many of them have me not in the first few votes?

2) *cough cough*
4) That can also often be a classic scumtell.

Still got two more to go, but now it's time for food and jobhunting...

Ok, yes, you made a significant case too. I won't compare their sizes, that's just epeen.

Really now? I've been playing for a good while, and I've never had 'votes at the beginning of wagons' mentioned as a scumtell. Citation needed.

Good luck with your tests, SS!

[Gorrad]

Yes, but I was on them before they were obvious. It's a scumtell if someone says 'Oh, this person has a big wagon forming, I should join it'. It's not if someone's one of the first people starting the wagon.

[Gorrad]

Work has scheduled me stupidly. LA until probably Friday.

[Gorrad]

Quick post (more of a reminder to myself than anything)

Xite91- Town
evilpacman18- Leaning town
Wraith- Scum
Singersigner- Leaning town
Shanba- Town
Antihero- Undecided
Flinter- Scum
Porochaz- Leaning scum
My Milked Eek- Undecided
Bunny Lover- Scum
DemonHybrid- Undecided (scumpoints for replacing Reck)

I'd be happy with a lynch of any of the three labeled scum, I won't lynch anyone town or leaning town. That's all for me tonight. See y'all tomorrow evening after the final killer shift.

[Gorrad]

HA!