NY 118 - BBM's Large Normal Mafia (Game!)

[Antihero]

Hey everyone,

55 pages!

I will read and comment on what sticks out to me (if anyone wants my opinion of something specific, you're going to have to ask).

-AH

[Antihero]

I'm going to kind of skim the RVS section, since there's 54 other pages of content here (if there's anything uber important in there, which I really doubt, let me know).

Page 3: Oh jeez, we're not actually arguing over UA's self vote are we?

Anyone who actually has to say that they're trying to start discussion is most likely faking it (looking at dana)

Page 4: This JDodge-Benmage thing looks like a red herring to me.

Page 5: Interesting Xite doesn't want to vote dana because she "doesn't want to get near L1", when it's fairly obvious that he's nowhere near L1 (there was a votecount near the middle of the 4th page).

Oh, and by the way, "gut" arguments don't fly with me. There's a reason why you have gut feelings. Find them.

I don't like UA's strawman of Furcolow. Scumpoints for UA.

The dana vote on Furcolow is aweful. The amount of OMGUS coming from dana is nearing absurdity at this point. And the strawman that soon follows doesn't help.

I'll post here once I find my big, big, bottle of ibuprofen.

Yeah, I feel the same way. I have to stop here for now.
I'll post again tomorrow.

[Antihero]

Anti: you know Deadline is in 3 days, right? Hurry the fuck up maybe?

I only had a limited time to make my last post. I'll get caught up by tomorrow.

Also, I'm not sure why you're under the impression that I like to be talked to this way, but I don't. Please stop.

[Antihero]

VOTE: Deadline extension

I know you all want to move on with the game, but a few extra days would be nice (takes away the time pressure from the already hard enough reread).

[Antihero]

I think I'm caught up now (hopefully).

The WIFOM content of the debate about dana not getting blocked or killed is reaching toxic levels. I agree with Xite on that issue; there are likely more power roles out there. That said, dana's play has been quite scummy; and even if he's telling the truth about the "cop" part, he might be leaving out the "mafia role-" part of it.

dana's "concern" about a framer seems faked to me. Wraith is exactly right about dana's logic if he's worried about a framer screwing with his results; and if dana is worried about a GF, then why doesn't that apply to every other investigation? Also, why he targetted Xite puzzles me a bit...

I haven't heard of a role called "lawyer" and I didn't find it in the wiki. Would that role likely be found in a normal game?

After my reread, my top suspects are Singer, Bunnylover, and dana. Why Bunnylover hasn't been wagoned yet is completely beyond me.

VOTE: Bunnylover

[Antihero]

@ Xite and Robbnva
Why are you so sure that scum has a Roleblocker? I don't know why anyone would assume this and then vote me because if it. As I mentioned above, there could easily be a busdriver instead.

OK, just so that everyone is on the same page:

Players Not Alive (6):
18) Furcolow - Vanilla Townie - Lynched Day One
19) Johnny Rotten DavidParker - Vanilla Townie Killed Night One
15) Nhammen - Mafia Goon - Killed Night One
8) Mysterio - Doctor - Lynched Day Two
6) Wickedestjr - Mason - Killed Night Two

12) Benmage - Mafia Roleblocker - Killed Night Two

[Antihero]

Sorry, I skimmed through that whole thing.

I don't see how danakillsu's claim a few days ago was OBVIOUSLY fake, especially after DP's flip. I can understand Reck's reasoning with that, but I don't necessarily agree with all of his reads. For example, I find Poro one of the scummiest people here, so don't associate him with Reck as far as reads go. However, I do feel like dana's faking it now that this WIFOM bullcrap has been going on.

So, yeah, you seem to know a lot about dana's role. This in particular stands out:

When dana flips scum, I'd like him to be lynched.

You seem to know a little too much.

Unvote, Vote: evilpacman18

This vote doesn't have much merit and seems pretty forced to me. It also reeks of OMGUS.

[Antihero]

Anyone who is voting dana just because he's not dead/hasn't been blocked is doing so for a really bad reason. There's too much WIFOM! Here's the "scumslip" by bunny I think Robbnva was talking about a few posts ago:

Actually no. I'm more then sure in this large game number their will be a mafia roleblocker, who could possible stop him from invistgating. I would suggest if we have a tracker to track him to see if he visits anyone, or if he is visit by someone, I think it works both way right?

Since watcher is a normal role, it wouldn't be unreasonable to think that there's one in this game; a conservative scumteam could have been deterred by the thought of a watcher.

PS - I'm with Robb in that it's a little weird that Bunny is "more than sure" of a mafia RB. Yes, it is a fairly standard role, but the degree of certainty is a tad high.

[Antihero]

Also, think of it this way, if we keep the "cop" around a bit longer and he tells us his reads, we can get something from it when he does die whether he flips town OR scum. Oftentimes, if scum claims a cop and stays alive, he will inno a townie or two, then one of his scumbuddies, and then call guilty on a scumbuddy. A stronger form of bussing. Yes, this is VERY WIFOMY, but I'm just saying, it is more beneficial for us to keep him around right now.

I don't know about that example you gave... I've never actually seen that happen and I don't think someone would be reckless enough to actually attempt such a gambit.
But you're right that a dana lynch isn't the play for today.

*sigh* I hope flinter is proving to everyone that this WIFOM is fruitless and has "red herring" written all over it.

For once, try to take this game as a game of possibilities. It makes your scumhunting more accurate.

Please don't condescend.
And for someone who is preaching to Xite about taking everything into account, you aren't taking everything into account. Let me throw a couple of wrenches into your theory:

• A watcher kind of functions as a protective role. If dana is visited by someone, a watcher would probably conclude it was either a) a kill or b) a roleblocker (remember: the doc is dead). Since dana didn't die, that would immediately out the mafia RB.
  
• Godfathers are a fairly common role. If the scumteam had reason to believe the cop would most likely investigate their GF over the rest of the team, they might take a chance and let the cop "confirm" a possible GF.

That's the last thing I'll say about this stupid discussion. If I haven't demonstrated by now why this is completely pointless, I don't know what more to tell you.

This is faulty logic and a baseless accusation.

I'm not sure what you're referring to here...

[Antihero]

I don't think it's wrong to lynch dana at this point. Roleblocking a claimed cop for 2 nights would make sense if Benmage & nhammen are not aligned with dana. Xite's iffy stance on the matter is noteworthy, and could implicate him later if dana flips scum.

Fail quotient of this paragraph = 100%

D2, I mentioned that out of Mysterio and Wraith, Wraith was the likelier one to be scum, and also a viable bus for his scumbuddies. The combination of Benmage (known scum) and Xite (probable scum if dana is scum) on Wraith's wagon makes my little "equation" add up, so to speak. If I can run my mouth (err, fingers) for a bit, I think a reasonable lynch sequence would be dana > xite > wraith, if and ONLY IF the former player(s) in the sequence flip scum. It comes down to being one of those scenarios where there's no questions asked. Just do it.

Non sequitur
What makes Xite different from everyone else on the Wraith wagon?

Kise I think lynching Dana can be postponed one day,

I do like the fact you are looking for the godfather

.

lolwat?
What do you like about the fact that Kise is looking for someone who might not even exist?

I'm still waiting for DH to show up again and tell me why that earlier pacman vote is OK.

[Antihero]

Wow, I had no idea that function existed. *slaps self*

[Antihero]

@antihero - I have never been in a large game without a GF so thinking that it's possible isn't a stretch.

That wasn't my point. You said you liked the fact that Kise was "looking for the godfather" (whatever that means). What's there to really like about "looking" for a particular scum power role? If I told you I was "looking for a mafia framer" would you be impressed?

Whatever, I'm done with your shit for real

I won't be back til I'm prodded, Xite I'd you are town you fail

What, did you read Xite's post 1715 and decide to quit posting before the wagon formed?
...and you kind of added to Xite's point with your dana vote.

UNVOTE: bunnylover
VOTE: Robbnva

[Antihero]

While I do have a bad taste in my mouth from the WIFOM fest from yesterday, I think the Kise flip pretty much kills dana's credibility.

It also should be fairly obvious at this point that bunny is scum. preview edit - but I do hope your headache gets better, bunny

VOTE: danakillsu

[Antihero]

No, I believe Kise knew Dana was the cop.

What's with this then?

I don't think it's wrong to lynch dana at this point. Roleblocking a claimed cop for 2 nights would make sense if Benmage & nhammen are not aligned with dana. Xite's iffy stance on the matter is noteworthy, and could implicate him later if dana flips scum.

D2, I mentioned that out of Mysterio and Wraith, Wraith was the likelier one to be scum, and also a viable bus for his scumbuddies. The combination of Benmage (known scum) and Xite (probable scum if dana is scum) on Wraith's wagon makes my little "equation" add up, so to speak. If I can run my mouth (err, fingers) for a bit, I think a reasonable lynch sequence would be dana > xite > wraith, if and ONLY IF the former player(s) in the sequence flip scum. It comes down to being one of those scenarios where there's no questions asked. Just do it.


I haven't forgotten about you, Poro. For the time being, there are other.. more interesting developments. I was wrong about Wicked, so, who knows whether I'm wrong with you. That would mean my Godfather-hunting skills are not perfected like I thought they were. BTW, I still need students to take under my wing

[Antihero]

I don't like the fact that everyone here died except for me:
Hiphop [3] (Dana, Lowell, Bunnylover)

Yeah, I don't like that either. But it can be easily fixed.

VOTE: Bunnylover

[Antihero]

That was... logical OMGUS... >_<

...is this referring to Shanba's post? Because if it is, you fail.

Bloody hell, how is it even OMGUS anyway? As far as I know, he's not yet expressed any suspicion of me.

---

MME, I am expecting a quick lynch on myself from viewing that alone to happen.

Yeah, bunny. A lynch today wouldn't be the result of a whole game of scumminess. We're just picking on you because of yesterday.

[Antihero]

I guess all my posts from now on will be boring and serious since joking is scummy.

I'm sorry, could you explain the joke? I missed it.

[Antihero]

In all honesty, this is all fluff. I just want Porochaz to stop lurking or for the mod to announce his V/LA or something.

"In all honesty" is a phrase that's pretty good at tipping you off that what you're about to read is a complete lie.

[Antihero]

Someone's going to have to enlighten me as to why Bunnylover is a bad wagon.

[Antihero]

Besides bunny, I think the person who's done the worst job of justifying her vote is singer. It looks like she took some time to go through the thread and pull out some of Xite's inflammatory remarks, but I don't see her backing up why Xite (or her playstyle) is scummy. Her push on Xite, in contrast to Wraith's, looks really forced. I also don't like the "too scummy to be scum" fallacy on bunny earlier today. And if Xite is scummy because of her "defense" of dana D3, why is bunny's behavior yesterday OK?

Also, Wraith, you're right about the WIFOM thing. It seems like he was doing plenty of both: calling dana "scummy as hell" but never fully accepting the wagon on him, THEN deciding he's innocent and using WIFOM. Thanks for pointing that out.

The clumsy buddying makes me lol.

...oh, and if you don't like Xite's inflammatory playstyle, I suggest you relook at some of the comments you've made.

Oh, and these are just some examples from the first half of his ISO. Keep looking at it. It's kind of...entertaining.

Sorry if that's not what you wanted to hear.

These don't seem to serve any useful scumhunting purposes, and are quite condescending.

[Antihero]

1. Xite asked for examples, so I gave them to him. That wasn't my case.

What is your case, then?

2. I agree with Wraith's case, only contributing more, in the overall scheme of things, of why I feel like I can no longer trust Xite's analysis of the game.

OK, after "only contributing more", the sentence ceases to make sense. Please elucidate.

3. Did I say Bunny's behavior was ok?

Well, you pooh-poohed his wagon.

4. Hmm...you didn't notice my "blatant buddying" with Wraith in my ISO#35? It makes me feel like you're grasping at things to make me look scummier now that I've actually put myself out there to make a case against someone.

1) you're pulling out a random quote that's not really buddying/piggybacking before I had to do my 50+ page catchup, so who's grasping at things now?
2) self-victimization is scummy

5. You're right, I let my emotions get the best of me sometimes, but that doesn't mean that I have to agree with the way others do the same.

Great

6. You're pointing out the one thing that's condescending in my post, and completely overlooking all the other condescending comments of Xite's...who has consistently made them this entire game.

The difference is, Xite isn't pointing out everyone else's aggression and calling it scummy (which you have yet to explain, by the way).

I really don't like that you're doing that. It's called misrepping...or hypocrisy. You choose.

I choose... OMGUS!

[Antihero]

Wraith, I disagree with your assessment of singer's play.

[Antihero]

Wraith has tried to jump on Gorrad's, Xite's, and Bunnylover's wagon today. Appeasing everybody? Oh and singer so he sounds original a bit.

Wait...what about singer? All I got from Wraith was:

Singer has been pretty townie all game (flinter probably less so but that's not the point).

[Antihero]

I would say you are the one who are bussing. You keep bringing up the fact that you were pushing for Dana lynch, trying to earn townie points for knowing a person was scum.

Vote: Wraith

So let me get this straight. Your whole case on Wraith is that you

think

he's bussing. Not that he's actually done anything scummy? Alriiight...

While I don't think what Bunny is saying applies to Wraith, bunny's line of reasoning seems valid to me (:? did I actually just type that?). Super-mega-hardcore tunneling on a scumbuddy can in fact be a good scumtell. Also, I don't believe that was the "whole case." This pooh-pooh post by singer is active lurking. More scumpoints for you.

pacman's last post was pretty bad, especially the FoS on Shanba. What do you mean by "start a bus" and how is that label warranted? Also, if Wraith is trying to appease everybody, he's doing a really bad job.

[Antihero]

Um, Wraith, I'll join the chorus of people saying that you only had a few votes on you when you self voted. Why the self vote?

Also, how would you being town imply that Xite is scum?

[Antihero]

Also, how would you being town imply that Xite is scum?

Still waiting on this, Wraith.

Oh, and for everyone mindlessly saying "AtE" it's a nulltell; also, it's obvious, leading to...

Wraith, stop with the AtE.

more active lurking.

Gorrad, you're going to have to enlighten me as to where you're getting the townvibes from singer.

singer, can you tell me (in a sentence) why you're voting Xite again?

[Antihero]

I'm getting pretty disenchanted with the bunny wagon.
UNVOTE: bunnylover

Someone asked me to sum up my case on Xite in one sentence...

In response to that, I feel it's kind of ridiculous to ask someone to sum it up "in one sentence," but here goes:
I feel that Xite has been abrasive (anti-town) and somewhat hypocritical (when it comes to how people react emotionally-not the strongest part, but adds to it), and I don't buy his interaction with Dana this game, as it seems like he was only protecting his scum-buddy.

First off, the "in one sentence" thing was just so that I didn't get a wall of text.
One of the reasons you're voting Xite is for being abrasive? That's pretty hypocritical.
You also mentioned earlier something about Xite "defending" dana on D1 by "deferring to" the furcolow wagon, which is also also hypocritical since you were on the furcolow wagon yourself (after being on the dana wagon).

For someone going after Xite for "defense of dana", I didn't see you making any particular effort to ever question dana's claim. In fact, I found this:

This whole dana WIFOM thing is making me sick...we need a votecount...I just got engaged...that is all for now.

Congrats on getting engaged.
But still, doesn't the first part of your sentence kind of go along with Xite's logic?

VOTE: singersigner

[Antihero]

Well, that's simply not true (me attacking

everyone

except Xite).

I don't think there's any merit to the Xite wagon, quite frankly. Yeah, so she didn't like the WIFOM about dana a couple days ago, so what? Neither did I. I don't see how not going with the flow of "OMG, dana wasn't blocked!!111 SCUMZZZ" makes Xite scum.

[Antihero]

Actually

, the whole WIFOM thing I was speaking of was Xite's defense of Dana. And if you want to look at my questioning, find the post where I was very much questioning why he wasn't roleblocked, etc. I agreed with those questioning Dana's claim, but never with Xite's defense of it.

OK, so why didn't you say that at the time or vote accordingly?

Where did I say Xite's defense was in deference to Frank? I'd like a quote, please.

Here it is:

Bunnylover's too easy right now. I think people are overlooking Xite's defence of Dana, on D3 AND D1

(D1 was more of a deterrence to the Frank wagon than a defense of Dana)

.VOTE: Xite91

I'm interested in seeing how he'll blow up at this one, since that's all I've seen him do this game.

deference was the wrong word, but the concept is still there.

[Antihero]

That was simply D1. The difference between me and Xite was that Xite was never on the Dana wagon,

Oh, yes. Because scum can't bus.

Let's go back to that vote:

@Nhammen/Xite's WoT: QFT.

At this point, there's not a whole lot of new information/questions I can bring to the table, but I agree with hiphop (/Xite's response) about the bandwagons. With this many people, chances are a mislynch (unless obvscumslip) will occur, so the best way to extort more reactions is by finishing a bandwagon D1, and seeing where that leads us in the next day.

From what I can tell, Dana's case on Frank is weak, and if they're a scum-pair, it's only to distance himself later, saying, "no hey, look what I did. why would I vote for my scum-buddy??" Unless Dana can provide a better defense of himself, or a better case on someone else, I'm going to VOTE: danakillsu, putting him at L-2 by my votecount.

@Xite...I find myself inclined to agree with your case on Frank, but for now I suppose we will have to wait and see what happens.


And damn you people, you couldn't have spread your responses a little thinner while I was at band camp all day?? That was a lot to catch up on! lol.

So, you agreed with the case on frank, and you're now using the frank wagon against Xite?

Let's take a look back at the frank wagon D1:

Frank

[13] (Xite, Prozac,

danakillsu

,

UA

, singersigner,

mysterio

,

hiphop

,

robbnva

, wraith, Bunnylover,

Benmage

, Gorrad, Reck)

You're relatively close to the front, singer. I don't know why being on this wagon would be any more incriminating for Xite as it is for you.

and I believe it's because he didn't want to bus his partner.

Do you have any evidence to support this?

D2 and 3 brought in more WIFOM defense.

This is a hackneyed argument that really doesn't have much merit. Try again, please.

I would've expected a better case for not lynching Dana at that point, and he couldn't present one.

What?
Why didn't you vote dana then?

I actually did say it at the time. But my votes don't come until I feel like I'm confident enough in them.

Say what you want about "not being confident enough to lynch Dana"

...but that's how I feel. I made a mistake with Mysterio, if you remember, but

I didn't think I made a mistake with Dana

, nor do I think I'm making one now.

Am I missing something here?

[Antihero]

You're missing the point about Xite not giving any attention to Dana's scummy play at all, but after his cop-claim, I didn't want to lynch. I explained exactly why I didn't have a problem potentially mislynching D1, and now I'm using the information we got from it later. Do you see how that sort of thing works?

No.

I actually don't have to convince you anymore, since I'm fairly certain you won't be swayed. If you don't agree, that's fine. We'll see what happens from there.

Wait ... what? Convince me to do what? Unvote you?

I did vote Dana (D3)...not sure what you're getting at...

*looks back at Flameaxe's vote count*
*looks back at singer's ISO*
I don't see you voting at all Day 3. Am I missing something? If so, please point me to it.

The last part, sorry, that was awkward...I was just talking about when I vote for someone. Frank was a null-tell->scum for me, but I felt it was more beneficial to finish a wagon, than drag the day on with people wondering who/what/when/where/why to vote after 40+ pages. I was wrong about Mysterio, but felt strong enough to put a vote on him.

By D3, I felt Dana's claim no longer added up, and felt no qualms about lynching him.

I feel the same about Xite. Aside from RVS, I won't just put a vote on someone unless I feel strongly about it (without implying that I was making a point for pressure).

Then why wasn't this feeling accompanied by a vote, like it is now? The point still stands unless I somehow missed a vote you say you made yesterday.

[Antihero]

OK, that's all I need from you singer.

Now, everyone.

Do you all see the epic backtracking singer is doing here to justify her flimsy Xite vote?

[Antihero]

Out of Wraith, Xite, and Bunnylover, bunnylover has acted the scummiest.

UNVOTE: singersigner
VOTE: bunnylover

[Antihero]

VOTE: singersigner

Continuation of my vote from yesterday.

[Antihero]

^scum

[Antihero]

^You're still scum

[Antihero]

VOTE: Wraith

Why?

But for sake of not evading your question, I'll say that Wraith has been under scrutiny almost since the beginning. It's time to see who was right.

Notice how singer doesn't say anything about how she thinks Wraith is scum.

Would you like to start fumbling around for reasons for this crappy vote, like you did with Xite yesterday?

Well, Im glad your quoting this post.

The dana wagon was a good one. However classic scumtell alert "HEY EVERYONE LOOK AT ME PUTTING SOMEONE AT L-1 ONE"/"HEY LOOK EVERYONE HE IS AT L-1 NOW!" "IM NOT GOING TO UNVOTE HIM MYSELF JUST IN CASE, IM JUST GOING TO TELL EVERYONE ELSE NOT TO VOTE, BECAUSE IM SO TOWNIE LULZ". You see what Im getting at? Someone hammers then you can be a ll like

I told you not to vote

and try and look all townie. When in the end the onus was on you because you didn't unvote in the first place.

Also you said "let him speak" I was giving him that chance. Argument = void. I think so.

As for the other post, lets say you are in a small locked room with a very hungry crocodile. You have a stick which you may hit him across the head with. You hit him once, he ignores you. So you think "this is fun, I'll do it again" well inevitably the hungry croc will stop ignoring you and eventually eat you. Its the same thing here. You did it in an ongoing involving both of us, and its the second time you have done it here, and I have no doubt you have done it in other games as well. There has to be a point where you think, "huh, this seems to have people second guessing about me. Maybe I could use this as scum". I admit I have seen you do this as town as some fucked up idea that its in the their best interests. Your readiness to flip onto that idea is whats now making it suspicious. You do it too often.

... may I please have the summarized version of this post? I don't know what point you're trying to make here.

[Antihero]

VOTE: Wraith

Why?

Not asking Poro the same thing? Hmm...

"Why me and not Poro.....?"

Classic scum reaction

[Antihero]

Classic scum reaction IF I didn't actually respond to his question.

Ummm, no. This isn't true. But that's a matter of my personal opinion.

You're also twisting my words.

orly?

The connotation is not the same, and it's funny that either 1. you think it is, or 2. you're purposefully doing that to make me look bad to anyone who isn't smart enough to realize what you're doing. You choose. I don't mind.

What did I say about self-victimization being scummy? And why are you debating this isolated point and not addressing the larger issue of your crappy wraith vote?

You're gunna have to try harder than that if you want to really accuse me of anything scummy.

All I had to do was read the thread. It really wasn't that hard.

My case may not have been the strongest...but what are you building

your

case off of? The fact that my

one

case was weak? That's not scummy; that just means that my initial gut was wrong.

Not only weak, but

very

hypocritical.

[Antihero]

I never said anything about someone killing someone. Holy poisoned wine, Batman!

Oh wait so you're voting singer just because she had an incorrect read on Xite?

I know this was directed at DH and I don't know about DH's reasons, but I have to say that this certainly isn't the reason for my vote. If anyone wants to know the reason for my vote, I first invite you to go back and look at singer's reasoning for the Xite vote yesterday. This is a good place to start.

[Antihero]

I never said anything about someone killing someone. Holy poisoned wine, Batman!

Oh wait so you're voting singer just because she had an incorrect read on Xite?

I know this was directed at DH and I don't know about DH's reasons, but I have to say that this certainly isn't the reason for my vote. If anyone wants to know the reason for my vote, I first invite you to go back and look at singer's reasoning for the Xite vote yesterday. This is a good place to start.

I don't have any scumread on you at all but isn't an unnecessary defense the exact same way Dana's D1 started?

My post isn't a defense of DH. I'm trying to get you all to really look at singer's motivations throughout this game (I don't think anyone's done so). She's been under the radar up until yesterday, when she emerged to jump on the Xite wagon.

I'm also looking forward to how DH will answer this, by the way.

[Antihero]

The lack of singer votes is making me rage.

[Antihero]

The lack of singer votes is making me rage.

Probably because not everyone agrees with your oh-so-amazing-case.

...which is so bad, you don't have a response to it. I think that's pretty telling.

I think you're just bitter.

At least I got a good chuckle out of that.

[Antihero]

Ok, so I can be convinced on to a singersigner wagon. There's a couple of things that strike me the wrong way, both of which are related to dana. Firstly, during day 1, singer (like a lot of people) gets drawn into the dana vs frank dichotomy thing. But she calls them both scummy and stupid and repeatedly tries to intimate this is some kind of bussing play. At the time she was doing this, it looked like dana was the one going down, so linking dana and frank would be a pretty smart move as scum. Combined with the fact that I don't really see how it looks like bussing at all, that's a serious question mark frowny face thing.

Ok, I thiiink I can see where you're coming from. The only thing that strikes me as odd with this statement is that you very clearly understand a lot of people got sucked into the same thing...but I still fail to understand how my situation was so different.

Why would you even say this? Shanba said why your situation was different right in the quote. "But she calls them both scummy and stupid and repeatedly tries to intimate this is some kind of bussing play."

Uh...what? Reads change. I gave him the benefit of the doubt (JUST LIKE XITE) on D2, especially given that we hadn't had a legitimate CC.

Oh, so now that it you think it might work in your favor, you start comparing yourself to Xite and how she acted towards dana.

I skimmed MME's ISO and one thing that struck me as weird was the complete 180 he did on Xite when dana "got an innocent" on her. I'll look into it further tomorrow when I don't feel like I'm about to .... *falls asleep*

[Antihero]

/slaps self

I forgot the last time I posted was on Friday.

As a person? I dont think thats relevant.

On her play.

Not her wagon or the cases against her.

I would also like this, please.

[Antihero]

Unvote, Vote: Flinter

. We lynch EPM after this, but I like the pressure on Flinter now. There's no way that you can try to flailingly back up such a bad case and be pro-town in the least.

OMGUS much? And how is flinter flailing?

Way to be opportunistic. Did you even read my case on flinter?

It's hard to read stuff that doesn't exist.

Both flinter and Wraith look townish to me. I'm not a fan of EPM, though I did find JDodge townish. That leaves DH and MME. Besides the aweful EPM vote a couple days ago and this OMGUS on flinter, I didn't have much a problem with DH's play, but reck didn't give me any warm and fuzzy feelings.

Nobody hammer yet!

MME needs to get in here and post something. Now!

[Antihero]

Damnit Antihero. Outposting my prods.

Hey, you're the ninja here.

Also, the link takes us to nowhere. I'm also curious as to what Wraith is referring to when he says "kingmaker."

[Antihero]

Oh, I forgot to claim.

I'm a VT.

[Antihero]

Another quick night.

Prozac - Vanilla Townie - Killed Night Six

Shanba - Mason - Killed Night Six

That leaves six alive, which makes it 4 votes to lynch, and 3 votes for a no lynch.

Deadline:

Nov 11th.

I wonder, would Porochaz be able to replace? Shanba obvious can't because there might be a third mason. Porochaz would have to reread less of the game if he agreed. Would any of the players be opposed to this?

I'm cool with it, but the mod and/or Poro might not be.

MME, please, please, please, please come back.

[Antihero]

Welcome, Ether/Yos!

I've got to go now, but 1 thing that stuck out to me.

Confirmed information
1. DH is scum and will be lynched today.
2. Ether can not be the SK and could only possibly be scum if we have more than one scum left.
3. I'm town.
4. The player count is either 4 town, 1 scum, 1 SK or 3 town, 2 scum, 1 SK.

I'm not sure how any of these (maybe except #4) are "confirmed."

Preview edit: OK, I see what you're saying on #2; I did a quick search on MME's posting sitewide and saw that his last post on the entire site was his last post in this game. However, that relies on the assumption that he didn't log in without posting anywhere on MS.

That still leaves #1 and 3.

[Antihero]

flinter's wrong about me being SK (my pick for that at this point would be EPM), but I think she has everything else on lockdown.

[Antihero]

@EPM: Etherdent is a yos/ether hydra.

[Antihero]

VOTE: DemonHybrid

Alright, while I'm dropping the hammer, I might as well drop the act.

Yes, I'm the SK. (And Wraith is right, I ambulletproof; so if you try to kill me, scum, I promise you

will

fail)

If DH doesn't flip scum, I will a) be surprised and b) kill EtherDent tonight.

[Antihero]

Well tomorrow, the town is choosing who gets to win: me or mafia (assuming scum don't endgame us all first).

Actually, my gut isn't really liking Wraith either right now (or EPM for that matter, but JDodge makes up for that I think).

FTR, all my NKs (besides Gorrad) have been attempts at crosskills. Sorry about Kise, but it

did

out dana as scum. I just NKed Gorrad because I was trying to be nice to flameaxe and save him the trouble of finding a replacement.

[Antihero]

Wow.

I'm a complete failure.

GG town. VOTE: Antihero

[Antihero]

Thanks for trying to reassure me, flinter, but I

am

a complete failure.

80%, right? He killed the cop, too, directly leading to Danakillsu's lynch.

-Ether

At least I can take comfort in knowing that I screwed over the mafia.

No Dana, you can take full credit for the loss tho.

Actually, me killing you didn't have anything to do with dana. Your posts contained nothing but active lurking and self-defense for the first two days; it looked like you were really trying to stay in the background (and you did a good job, too).

As for dana, I was buying the claim up until Kise's flip (I thought he was scum, BTW).

Reck actually gave me the exact same vibe, but my read on DH prevented me from killing him too.

To be fair, danakillsu caused me to falsely confirm JDodge/pacman as town. Dunno if it was intentional, but hey, it worked.

JDodge had me

completely

fooled. I hope to actually get to play a game with him sometime.

As for pacman, I

was

aiming for town. I was trying to choose between Wraith and pacman (I had a town read on flinter, but she was going to let me win, why would I kill her?), and naturally my low IQ led me to the wrong decision. So pacman, you/JDodge should have looked scummier, you might have had a chance at winning.

Additional thoughts:

• I think the game was pretty well balanced. However, 1 thing I might suggest: Let the Mafia GF decide if he wants to be investigation immune or NK immune each night.
  
• Mafia Docs are broken; I wouldn't use one (I think someone else suggested that).
  
• Personally, I don't really like the role of SK. I love the fact that I have a nightkill, but I hate the fact that I'm not protown. When I'm not protown, I tend to really censor myself and it's almost more stressful than fun for me to play a game as non-town.
  
• This has to be one of the best modding jobs I've ever seen. BBM was always on time w/ votecounts, prods, acknowledged night actions, and in general kept the game running very smoothly; considering this is a large game, I think BBM deserves kudos for that.

[Antihero]

EBWOP: reck gave me the exact same vibe as benmage, not dana

[Antihero]

Also, CA, if you're reading this:

• First off, I'm sorry.
  
• Second off, you're going to have to tell me how you spotted nhammen as scum.

[Antihero]

Reading the Mafia QT:

1) Damn, I've never seen anyone post WoTs in a QT until @.@
2) Demonhybrid on N2 in the QT:

Let's keep the SK alive for a while if we ever do find out who he is; he can help us kill town twice as fast.

[Antihero]

Actually Ether just said that... they... would have voted Anti. So with my vote, Ether's, and Wraith's on Anti, I would have won.

This. I was convinced Ether was the last scum. flinter was willing to let me win, and Wraith came off as indifferent (also more likely to let me win), that led me to kill EPM.

[Antihero]

The reason I claimed was because I thought mafia was going to claim SK in the endgame and try to AtE the town into letting him win.

[Antihero]

Yeah, Antihero shouldn't have claimed there, and it would have been bad play for mafia to claim as well--when someone claims scum, you lynch them. Could have been messy for me to argue that in LyLo, since I was at the top of a couple people's lists.

Well, if I didn't claim, the endgame would've just been a huge AtE slapfight, which I don't have the energy for.

[Antihero]

^lol

That's going in the sig.

[Antihero]

A lot of people say they like being town better than any other alignment but I don't get that. I think it's so much easier to be scum. I've always wanted to be a third party though.

It depends on if you like acting and lying or deducing. I suck at both acting and lying, so I like town better.

3rd party roles, like SK and jester (both of which I've played), sound really glamorous, but are actually ridiculous. But that's just my opinion.

[Antihero]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 7#p2610927

^Cool people click on this link.