NY 192: Game Shop Mafia (Over)

[Errantparabola]

Hey guys. There's a helluva lot of pages to work through so give me around 2 days.
Looking forward to playing with you all.

[Errantparabola]

Okay. So I'd like some answers to help me catch up. the more answers I get, the better.

Which people should I be paying close attention to while I catch up?
Which people, if any, have claimed?
What are everyone's reads right now?

I'd like answers before I catch up. I understand that this will prevent me from getting an organic perspective but I am confident in my abilty to avoid confbias, and the fact that I am posing this question to everyone really gives me context as to the progression of everyone's thoughts.

[Errantparabola]

Post 1 of the Grand Errant Catchup: What was the Scum Strategy?

Hey guys. There's a helluva lot of pages to work through so give me around 2 days.
Looking forward to playing with you all.

YES

I'm just gonna assume that this is because I'm an awesome person and mollie thinks I'm super cool even though we have interacted like never.
Speaking of people I've interacted with. I don't place very much stock in meta but I know that I'm WAY behind all you guys in how much content you have to sort me, so go ahead and check out my games on my wiki if that helps. I know that dwlee and pisskop probably have a decent picture of my scumgame. Fire and titus have seen both my town and scum play.

Context of this post: What I'm working with is JJD's synopsis as well as the quote below to make a few observations.

It makes me super nervous that rc generally hard busses her scim partners and went after jarjar and titus and keyser.

So, first about JJD's synopsis.
If there's only been one kill a night, then I'm just going to say DN is probably not SK, but that might be subject to change after I actually read the damn game.
The scum team have less resources and in return they have knowledge. This is a pretty obvious observation that I'm sure you're all aware of.
Now context going into D2. A chunk of those resources is now hanging from a tree. Nero claims Rolecop. RC decides he's gonna make himself a prime lynch target on D3 by claiming cop (at least that's what I'm getting happened from the synopsis? How fast did the RC lynch happen?)
So knowing that RC made this further resource sacrifice, would RC sacrifice EVEN MORE resources to grab some towncred from hard bussing that he's just gonna throw away later?
I personally don't think so.
Maaaybe if it was on D1. Dwlee, did RC go after JJD, Titus, and Keyser on D1 mainly or D2?

[Errantparabola]

Post 2 of the Grand EP Catchup: Everyone's Current Reads

I see why people think there's an SK now. RC was scumcop.

This post is for me because I want to see how reads now compare to reads earlier and see if I can catch that clear progression as well as transparency in thought.
I also want to see the context of interactions between folks.

Fire:

Town
Pisskop
Pirate Mollie
Everyone Else
Titus-Never know where she goes.
Death Note
RadiantCowbells
Scum

Thinks DN is SK
Early pushes on RC
Pisskop is town and Dwlee is neutral

JJD:
{Titus, Keyser, mollie}
{Errant, Nos}
{DN}
{Fire}
{pisskop, Dwlee}
thanks for answering my question

DN:
Expresses support on pisskop/Dwlee for a lynch
town on Keyser
That's about it for recent reads.

Titus:
pisskop > Dwlee
Thinks DN is also possible for lynch
keyser is town

Nos:

no one will lynch dwlee today. No one will lynch mollie today. No one will lynch Titus today. No one will lynch DN today. I don't want to lynch Keysor. RC will be lynched today. There is nothing short of a blatent-I-meant-to-post-this-in-scum-pt-scumslip that will prevent RC's lynch. The only thing that will happen is a delay of this lynch. Might as well just get the day over with.

voting pisskop so is apparently fine with that.

Dwlee:
keyser is town
proxies vote to titus (so he thinks is town?)
thinks DN is SK
uneasy about jjd and nos

pisskop (whose # of posts in this thread exceeds my total post count):
mollie can be scum
consider titus for scumteam B (I am not sure what this means)
other reads i cannot garner from iso

Keyser:
about dwlee: "THIS IS SCUM"
cannot see anything else but I am getting a bit lazy

mollie:
insistent that we lynch pisskop
"we are lynching deathy over my dead body"
thinks dwlee is just young hmm
not happy about fire

[Errantparabola]

shit. I said grand errant catchup and then grand ep catchup.
i'm disproportionately frustrated about that.

[Errantparabola]

Post 3: Page 1 to 20

Okay, Keyser's posting seems similar to his townposting in Bringer mafia
And also they look objectively town.
However nothing he's done so far early game is a particularly difficult position for scum to take. Jussayin

Considering this:

pisskop is voting dwlee now that he can not get away with deathtunneling on my slot

I'm going to take into account this:

Im approaching you like I would mollie. Which is to sit back and let you hang yourself if scum.

And try to look at pisskop's progression

who is hop?

lol

I'm liking DN's early game.

Well if it's not your meta to vote hop then it's scummy.

VOTE: Dwlee99

Except meta as you know is manipulable, and forgets that players do try new things regardless of alignment.

p. awful vote, tbh. This is literally the worst vote I've ever seen.

ugh. dwlee's reactive play is no good.
but i'll have to read more to see if it's actually scum indicative.

RC flip -> I think FA might be town -> I think mollie might be town.

pedit: mollie i made that post before I read the game. So I guess that answer to that question would be yes.

[Errantparabola]

Post 4: Page 21 to 40

Wicked caught davesaz's Dwlee post that I had similar feelings about. Of course, hindsight is 20/20 so I can't really say I read the davesaz post organically.

just realized wicked was dead.

So far Nos has sidelined a lot, same with cow -> fire.

Keyser has said a lot but doesn't give me those town feelings.
There's really little real pressure coming from Keyser.

572 thinking town mindset right now.

JJD is towny.

I dislike 700

I could see davesaz push on dwlee maybe being a bus. I don't think that the reason that he unvoted dwlee was good.
This could mean one of two things. Bus or bad fake case to make seem town

Reads of alive players as of page 32
{JJD}
{FA (mollie), pisskop}
{Zulfy (Titus)}
{DeathNote}
{Dwlee, Keyser, nos, cow (fire)}

keyser's response to JJD is good. I like it.

Zulfy's catchup is alright. doesn't ring any bells
Note: I understand that this is a really light catchup that doesn't go in depth. I might ISO some specific folks after I make a general catchup but don't expect too much.

I started liking keyser at around the same time as JJD liked. JJD continues a strong early game that resonates with me.

I'm taking a break for now but from now on I'm going to make posts about bigger sections of the game because otherwise i'd be posting a lot.

[Errantparabola]

Dont worry i will read this game if it kills me
I might glaze over some stuff but im only human
Does anyone have thoughts on my catchup
Btw when i said i was taking a break from mafia that meant playing more mafia

[Errantparabola]

pisskop, would you mind just stating your final reads?

[Errantparabola]

no.
but pisskop mentioned final reads and I went hunting for them and didn't find them.

[Errantparabola]

Ill try and do my best to finish catchup today.

[Errantparabola]

Post 5: 41 - 80

My reads list as of 41 goes a little something like this:
{JJD}
{Zulfy (Titus), Keyser}
{FA (mollie), pisskop}
{DeathNote} -> note I am not taking into account the neighborhood deal
{Dwlee, nos, cow (fire)}

Nos' 1008 is actually something I feel is textbook town. So this is also making me reevaluate my scumread there as well. I think Nos wouldn't actively push davesaz for a suspicious townread if they were buds.
1099 note that pisskop actively focuses on the davesaz wagon rather than the dwlee. But. I do think that RC sees dave as a lost cause, and if pisskop is the buddy, there's no harm in also jumping on that for some towncred since davesaz is getting lynched one way or the other.
dwlee counterwagon is 100% not scum driven. also taking note of that.

I'm actually wondering about an RC-dwlee-davesaz here, and RC evaluating which person has a better chance of surviving until the later game here and pushing hard on the other person.
I'm weighing that against the possibility of an RC-pisskop-davesaz, where pisskop and RC are both bussing davesaz knowing he's a lost cause (either a D1 or D2 lynch) and I think that the first one is more possible. We'll see how it goes (considering the current game state)
RC-pisskop-davesaz-dwlee? is that even possible? I have no idea with balance and I can see only 3 scum in a game where scum presumably needs a cop, meaning there's a non-groupscum

1203 hmm.
1204 okay davesaz at this point probably knows he's dead. scumreading dwlee less for this actually.
want people to weigh in on pisskop early interacts w/ dave? unless people have already done that. will continue reading.

Aero died. Aero wanted to push dwlee. shrug
idk man i'm just really feeling dwlee > pisskop right now.

pisskop looking for scum in Keyser/JJD is nope.
I don't like Zulfy's logic, but it feels genuine
I don't think RC would over-bus based on trying to think about scumstrategy. I'll see how long the Zulfy push lasts.
To sum it up, basically 1523.
And looks like JJD my top townread agrees with it. Nice.

1572 does this happen in a world of pisskop/RC? argh I'm going to not rule it out but say unlikely
Is a scumFA world possible? I don't think this is FA's scumgame but I kind of do agree with 1614
okay RC going on zulfy pretty long.
1657 makes me think a scumFA is possible.
i don't think pisskop should be this confident about scumFA given the material he's working with. It makes me uncomfortable.
1699 and we're back to entertaining the possibility of townFA

i think i hate informed reads more than uninformed reads
next time i replace i'm going to read from top to bottom clean and simple

frogger mentions traitor. it's possible with the whole neighborhood shenanigans. Would AP put a traitor in the hood? Lookin at you DN. I'm not rulin' it out and I'm going to see where this traitor discussion suddenly stopped.
Like, why does no one follow up on this?
We'll see. Because there's a mafcop. And there's 1 kill a night.

i am unsure about mollie's entrance. I have decided it is ultimately null.

Page 80 list
{JJD}
{Zulfy (Titus), Keyser}
{nos}
{FA (mollie), pisskop, DN}
{cow (fire)}
{Dwlee}

[Errantparabola]

lol still 160 pages to go.

I will persevere.

[Errantparabola]

Like after Errant catches up and we somehow manage to get 2 replacements into this clusterfuck of a game, are we then gonna wait for their catchup too? How long do u want this day to last.

if pisskop is scum (i'm still not sure about how the flip is gonna go), i'm actually going to look carefully at titus/mollie for potential partner. I know I said 3 groupscum but 4 is imo definitely not out of the question
i don't see any reason why we need to extend the day for the replacements
but pisskop might want a buddy to catchup so they can make an informed kill.
will retract this if pisskop justifies his wanting to extend the day (other than his continued survival)

[Errantparabola]

but pisskop might want a buddy to catchup so they can make an informed kill.
will retract this if pisskop justifies his wanting to extend the day (other than his continued survival)

This line of logic is shit, fyi.

Hed hammer me if he was thinking this.

^^

of course it's shit. do you really think i'm going to take stock in preflip associatives?
I'm laying out a potential line of thought for tomorrow.

[Errantparabola]

Im glad you agree that youre posting garbage for the sake of looking townier.

if you think that the intent behind thought transparency is garbage then i don't know what to say to you, guy.

[Errantparabola]

Right. Thats why you went for the juggular and tried lining up ducks

Did you miss the part where I dont scumread you?
Did you miss the part where I said "i'm not sure how the flip is going to go?"

Its not transparency if you only post one line of logic and dont counter it with the other quite plausible scenerios.

Its simply narration and pooping in the thread.

No. Don't pretend I have an obligation to post the other "plausible scenarios" when it's implied that if you flip town then I won't be giving the two that replaced out extra attention.

[Errantparabola]

Im not having this discussion, it's pretty clearly a waste of time and this argument isnt going to divine anyone's alignment.
Feel free to keep accusing me though.

[Errantparabola]

Glad that we could get that bit cleared up. I'm not accusing you of anything, and I think I made that pretty clear. So I dont see how it's opportunist.
But if you are scum, then giving your partner time to replace up is clearly in your favor, considering if you do have a partner, they'll likely be the last of their team and there is no "filling each other in."

[Errantparabola]

oh crap. i already used that line.

im vt

[Errantparabola]

also,

mod, can people get some prods

How's the catchup going guys?

Sorry friends, i forgot to announce my vla
When i was here over past couple days i was dedicating time to other games because i didnt have hour blocks of time to catchup.
Today i will resume

[Errantparabola]

good luck with your interview, GR.
from the posts that i've seen after i joined this game, i can kind of tell why this game is 200+ pages.
lots of fluff.

81 - 110 lets go

Reads as of 80.

{JJD}
{Zulfy (Titus), Keyser}
{nos}
{FA (mollie), pisskop, DN}
{cow (fire)}
{Dwlee}

Frog suddenly drops the whole traitor idea and moves back to DN SK.
So. I guess the answer to my previous question is that the traitor thing was dropped by frog cause he doesn't go back to it.
Which is a shame and I am reviving that discussion right now because traitor is a real possibility.
So there.

I've scoured the Pisskop vs Mollie and struggle to find something that indicates TvT or TvS. Or SvS. but i doubt that shit. There is a higher chance of pisskop being town the way i see it.
Why does JJD suddenly dismiss the possibility of pisskop-dwlee team just because of things that pisskop said about dwlee being scum?
That's actually weird. not enough to flip my read because JJD's early play excuses (if something is plausibly coming from town then I am more inclined to consider that possibility regardless of the probabilities in a vacuum) But I will look at JJD with more scrutiny.

JJD's 2125 push is solid and I like it.

mollie says nero is a better vote than dwlee.
nero -> no content. dwlee -> scummy content.
By saying dwlee's content is net better than no content mollie implies that dwlee's content is town but no justification.

I'm here to find scum, and not waste time telling you that I'm town.

another something coming from a town read that i don't like.

I feel legit interaction between RC and zulfy
IF frog were still alive I'd totally ask him why scumread on zulfy. I'll go back and check why.
okay asks if zulfy's ridiculousness is towny or scummy. And frog thinks the FA ridiculousness is scummy (I think?!?). I disagree.
okay now RC's speaking about one scum in zulfy, dwlee, FA, PK. I could definitely see scum hiding in that list becaue there's no associatives from a "scum in a list" tactic.
okay 2283 RC votes zulfy and the intent I see behind that is "everyone has been talking about this one guy that MIGHT be scum but no one's started a serious wagon. So time to start that shit!"
conclusion- zulfy townier.
I distinguish this from RC pushing on davesaz because dave was already under a lot of pressure and was a serious wagon contender.
actually, considering the speed at which RC left zulfy and the lack of conviction in the push... i'm not ruling it out yet.

okay i am seriously not liking DN's sidelining on mollie. I had zero problems with mollie's game replacing in but i'm not a fan of her reactions. something tells me that the reactions might be what pisskop is looking for.
and now DN says mollie's town. I don't see any progression.

Youre as shallow as my taste in women.

*thumbs up*

Dwlee's 2518 is interesting. Cow has gone relatively unpressured despite doing basically nothing. The fact that in this case Cow is sliding by means that the people I feel like are controlling the direction (frog, RC, pisskop or something like that) of the game are steering the game away from cow. This is all non-align indic but we'll see where it goes, especially if we do get a cow flip sometime in the future.

2519 oh god
no

Your recent behaviour just screams 'don't give a f**k about finding scum' aka SK/scum or bad-town. Which one is it?

This is another one of the things that I don't like. I'm entertaining the possibility of them being just keyserisms but I'm not townreading keyser as strongly. But like i said before with JJD's thing, since I have a decent townread on Keyser I'm entertaining that possibility more strongly.

The whole thing that wake said about DN in the hood i really have no idea.
It doesn't change much. I still think that DN might be a candidate for non-group scum in my traitor theory. The whole "SK claim" might be just traitor strategy.

holy shit the replace threats.

Trolling? I'm still playing to my win con

this is one of those things that town sees as "lol whatever"
and scum sees as "we probably shouldn't kill this guy during the night"
frog was def onto something.

RC, you said you wanted to kick my ass coming into day 2. That was before my case on Frozen Angel and the whole fiasco with that.
You also suspected me back in day 1 but never really said anything about it.
Explain yourself.

Okay this makes it probably that RC isn't bussing zulfy. Because if zulfy and RC are buds, then this is RC bussing zulfy but displaying a lack of conviction about it (which would indicate bus) and zulfy literally pointing that shit out for town to see.

{Zulfy (GR), JJD}
{keyser, nos}
{pisskop}
{mollie (Cabd)}
{cow (fire), DN}
{Dwlee}

[Errantparabola]

At least Errants game has improved, gold star to you there

thanks, guy

[Errantparabola]

does anyone actually have anything to say about my catchups?
i mean, i guess it makes sense if you don't, because you wouldn't go back and read the early game.
but it'd be nice to get some bouncing of ideas here.

[Errantparabola]

okay. i feel like i'm talking to a brick wall right now.
here might be a better question.
what about frogger's traitor theory?
thoughts on that?

[Errantparabola]

i've decided it doesn't matter if my catchup has no impact on the game, although it is frustrating.
it probably at least gives me some feedback on my scumhunting when flips happen.

111 - 160: Seriously?

{Zulfy (GR), JJD}
{keyser, nos}
{pisskop}
{mollie (Cabd)}
{cow (fire), DN}
{Dwlee}

if you vagina out I will totally make fun of you.

good start to this segment of the catchup.

So let's get this straight.
Dwlee fakehammers mollie
Mollie gives a VT claim
Nos fakehammers mollie
Mollie gives a similar reaction
Despite being fakehammered literally on the same page, mollie doesn't go back and check nos' iso to see if it was a fakehammer?
what.

And RC stalls the momentum on the wagon.

I do not like Keyser's interactions with Mollie at all. If mollie is town then key might be scum here.
wait RC points out that very thing. hmm. yeah I'm still going to stand by that.

Okay JJD and I are growing apart and I am no longer resonating with him.
JJD's vote on pisskop is... what. Like seriously what. that boils down to a playstyle vote.

And why should I care about looking townie?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I'm glad Nos is still in the game. Thanks for being alive nos.

Nos.

Who are we lynching today?

Top 3. Go!

Mollie
DN
Dwlee

Oh god people are just going to lynch pk just for being a dick. This is why we can't have nice things.

Nos actually doing the lord's work right now
top townread status is a go
Nosianity new religion is a go
seriously though nos i want to play games with you

Not a fan of 3465.
very little to comment. it's just people saying the same things over and over again.

Happy new years dudes, going to go party. And by party, I mean show up, eat the food, drink a drink, then bolt because social situations are hard.

i feel

here's my feelings on kop v mol
kop's original push on mol was meh. i think mol's entrance was fine.
but mol's reaction to that push was super meh. terrible.
i see very little reason for kop to cling on to a weak case to try and squeeze out a mislynch as scum

happy new year wicked plz don't be lurkey scum this I am out of mind with paranoia right now

gods no.

note that dwlee wants to lynch DN. shelving that fact in my mind.

looks like i'm going through 10 pages without finding anything to say

{nos, Zulfy (GR)}
{JJD}
{pisskop, keyser}
{cow (fire), DN}
{mollie (Cabd)}
{Dwlee}

pedit- hold on i think i might have to actually look at the traitor wiki page.

[Errantparabola]

after thinknig about it, add JJD to the top tier.

[Errantparabola]

is Mafia-aligned
knows the identities of the Mafia team is
identity is not known by the Mafia team, although they should know a Traitor exists
cannot be recruited to join the rest of the Mafia team, and is killed if shot
is endgamed if all other Mafia are dead
gives a "guilty" result to Cops, an "innocent" result to Gunsmiths, and a "Traitor" result to Role Cops

Dwlee, then why hasn't the sk been killing?
Pisskop, if they find the traitor then they know not to nk them. there's no recruiting, and it looks like leaving the traitor alive means that they're one closer to endgame, just no groupscum.

[Errantparabola]

Okay so Frozen is good at scum pm is good at scum they can obvtown as scum so I am just going to focus on cabd and cabds catchup was garbage.

1 -> FA and mollie were nowhere near obvtown
2 -> why is cabd's catchup garbage

speaking of catchups, my own continues. wish me luck, folks.

[Errantparabola]

161-200

{nos, Zulfy (GR), JJD}
{pisskop, keyser}
{cow (fire), DN}
{mollie (Cabd)}
{Dwlee}

Dwlee's continued flippancy is at least consistent.
At this point I'm just waiting for the shit to hit the fan. Not a lot of stuff here.

Although I do think RC - zulfy still feels a bit contrived but I'm willing to excuse it based on zulfy's reaction to RC's push on him.
I think I placed Zulfy too high.

I did not have sexual relations with that woman.

good

It looks like RC wants keyser/zulfy dead.
I originally thought the names he names right now are pretty crucial because RC knows he's a dead man at this point. But thinking about it more, I think RC is just being consistent with the things he's been touting before he claimed cop.

Nos' taste in shirt color is good.
(future edit: Also your sig is from a VN?)

Question- why isn't pisskop pushing scumRC harder? Pisskop, were you entertaining the possibility of cop + rolecop?
You seemed pretty confident in a Nero townflip.
Oh. Okay, this is me coming back to this statement and realizing that, yes, pisskop was indeed entertaining the possibility of cop + rolecop.

RC is being so wishy-washy with Zulfy right now.
No good.

RC/kop/mol all pushing on keyser to some extent. This is interesting because there's not a lot of conviction in that push. I don't think i've seen a single vote on keyser, even before the Nero deal.

now we reach the Titus/FB era.

4574 anyone who points out that nero scumread RC (which would seem like it gives RC more of an incentive to counterclaim, and RC strongarming a lynch on a townflip PR that thinks RC is scum is likely to eject him from that "near univerally townread" status that RC held) looks more towny in my eyes. let's see who those people are. (follow up. looks like no one did?)

Don't hastily vote someone who is obviously town if you don't want to be called out for not reading.

Yeah, you aren't obvious town RC.
You claim cop all the time, and you make ridiculous claims all the time.

You are ridiculous regardless of alignment, and I am voting you because you are likely scum.

Seriously awkward.

@Mollie, He was scum where he faked in 2. He had us thinking he was town bus driver.

@Pisskop, Scum Mollie let's me wait on VCA and murders or discredits me in the meantime. She doesn't push for it.

I'm looking at Mollie/Titus right now

Don't like keyser's reads list (other than scumRC)
Oh, neither does pisskop. Good on you, pisskop.

I don't think at this point RC says about scumbuddies "I'm positive they're town."
RC does this with pisskop.

RC keeps asking everyone "how this play would benefit scumRC" and no one points out the state of the game when Nero was still alive. I'm still waiting for someone to do that. Obviously I'm looking at this game in retrospect but I still believe that this is a pretty easy observation.

Hmm. I think I like nos' vote on mollie.
Even more after that Titus vote. The timing, reasoning, and context of that vote are all bad.

Little things bug me about JJD's posting but his early game was so on point.
Example: The dwlee "oh, I saw scum post that exact same thing in another game."
I'll have him as weak town.
Actually that RC case is solid.
I keep fluctuating on JJD but it's always been town so I'm going to say town.

READS AS OF 200

{nos, JJD}
{pisskop, Titus (GR)}
{FB, keyser}
{DN}
{Dwlee, mollie (Cabd)}

and straight onto the next catchup post. It'll be the last one too.

[Errantparabola]

So all BP claims that a scum cop claims a guilty on are sk????

Assuming RC is not lying - Pretty much

Okay so Frozen is good at scum pm is good at scum they can obvtown as scum so I am just going to focus on cabd and cabds catchup was garbage.

1 -> FA and mollie were nowhere near obvtown
2 -> why is cabd's catchup garbage

speaking of catchups, my own continues. wish me luck, folks.

I already explained..
they went through RC's d1 ISO and found "associatives" that point to me and PK when really they're just bs things. They say RC and I could be scum together because RC defended me but then when RC defended FA it is "white knighting".

1. What reason do you have to assume that RC is not lying
2. Hold on let me look again at cabd's catchup.
3. Okay. back. where's the scumPK point that cabd is driving home?
4. I thought Cabd made it pretty clear that you were not explicitly vote-able because of that.
5. Judging from your reaction, it looks like there's one town in my top two scumreads. I want to see which it is and I think your response to this will help.

[Errantparabola]

201-my entrance: the final stretch. aka the most relevant catchup.

{nos, JJD}
{pisskop, Titus (GR)}
{FB, keyser}
{DN}
{Dwlee, mollie (Cabd)}

here's why I still don't buy PK scum.
Titus argues that RC hard defends PK. At this point though RC knows that his life is on a timer.
He knows he has no credibility whatsoever. Why go through all those means to put PK in the spotlight when it's not going to be effective?
It's not even close to optimal. But we'll see.

Dwlee calling himself obvtown is laughable. Keyser's Let's Lynch RC is pretty solid from a skim.

I will admit though, your cop choices are balls bad rc. That concerns me

This is sincere.

Actually. You know what I don't like keyser's Let's lynch RC that much. I don't like going after both pisskop and dwlee it's INCREDIBLY unlikely that BOTH are scum when you look at it from keyser's stance on RC. If they had a lick of sense they'd be able to assess the situation and see that the odds of RC living today are low and the odds of RC surviving long enough to actually put a clock on town are zero.
So no, they're not both just going to cast their disguises off and valiantly save RC. bull.

Titus/Mollie/a side of Keysor.

Im really torn on him. He has some good stuff, and then some godawful stuff.

pisskop resonating with me.

I agree with the majority of keyser's zulfy towncase and I anticipate the Dwlee scumcase.

@Pisskop, I said your push on Mollie has been shit like 5 times now.

Although I agree with this, it's not like mollie's reaction to it was top notch.

5131
okay.
okay.
okay.
DID NO ONE CATCH THIS AS THE MOST DELIBERATE MISREPRESENTATION IN THE FUCKING GAME
SURE PISSKOP THOUGHT THAT NERO WAS TOWN
AND SURE PISSKOP VOTED NERO AFTER HIS CLAIM
But there was a whole 'nother claim between those and it's obviously not townindicative that pisskop voted nero but you are not convincing me that it was scum indicative when there is perfectly plausible town intent in believing RC's claim
Bad.
Terrible.

Given pisskop RC are highly likely buddies, you are damn near conftown.

oh helllllllll no

keyser's pretty green n' red list: oh hellllllll no
to use titus' words, there's one scum in pisskop and dwlee MAX.

We have zero evdence of an SK.

Your motivation to lycnh for an SK instead of a scum is interesting.

good stuff

My Dwlee read has oscillated quite a bit. I'm not sure where I read him.

I like the fact that he's defending me now though :S

so... we're lynching dwlee today.

Fire posts so little alignment indicative stuff that I have no idea how to read that pesky dragon anymore.

The fact that both RC is pushing on keyser and Dwlee is now suddenly also pushing on keyser...

AGAIN NOTE THAT NEITHER PISSKOP AND DWLEE HAVE THE TOWNCRED TO DISSOLVE A LYNCH THAT HAS BEEN AT LIKE 4 VOTES MINIMUM FOR THE ENTIRE DAY.
TELL IT TO MY FACE THAT BOTH OF THEM ARE SCUM.

Also nos townposts are being diluted based on that total noncommittal stance on RC but I'm willing to forgive a lot based on that davesaz push.

If youre town youre gonna feel p shitty after I flip.

needs to go

and now nos says RC is fine for a lynch. Bleh.

1) davesav wasn't even confirmed mafia at this point. Dwlee99 knew though.

This is actually a good catch.

VOTE: Dwlee

Whyd you unvote.

HAH! GUESS WHY!

There is nothing short of a blatent-I-meant-to-post-this-in-scum-pt-scumslip that will prevent RC's lynch. The only thing that will happen is a delay of this lynch.

and this is the type of observation that is why there's no way that pisskop and dwlee are both scum.

okay. I can KINDA see why dwlee would think that RC was telling the truth about DN nongroupscum
BUT it is equally, if not more, plausible that RC is lying through his teeth. I believe that there is far more scum intent behind the latter.
It's seriously disquieting that you don't agree.

Oh and remember how dwlee was like oh yeah keyser's three scumreads are obvtown
GUESS WHAT TIME HE CHOOSES TO SAY PISSKOP LOOKS SUSPICIOUS
THAT'S RIGHT. WHEN THE TWO OF THEM ARE ON THE FUCKIN CHOPPING BLOCK


OKAY I'M DONE WITH THIS INFERNAL CATCHUP

IN THE WORDS OF THE WISE MOLLIE:

YES

Will give final reads in a separate post just in case you guys just glaze over walls.

[Errantparabola]

{JJD}
{nos}
{pisskop, Titus (GR), FB} (From most willing to least willing to lynch: FB < GR < PK)
{keyser, DN} (would be more willing to lynch DN)
{mollie (Cabd)}
{Dwlee}

so if you guys want a pisskop lynch you'll have to drag it the fuck out of me.

[Errantparabola]

@Errant

IDK how you can read everything that happend w/ the RC lynch and not have Keysor and Mollie as conftown.

Like pisskop is scum that has been deathtunneling mollie the whole game and even HE wont touch her wagon.

Dwlee is the ONLY acceptable alternative to pisskop lynch today.

1. RC's lifespan after the twoshot claim was severely limited.
2. RC's wagon did not dip below 4-5 votes once it gained traction.
3. It is an entirely reasonable belief, from mollie (less so keyser) pov, that they don't have enough towncred to affect that gamestate, and even if they did, preventing a lynch for one more day is simply not enough to put town on an actual clock since RC is eventually going to eat rope anyway in this alternate universe. This also extends to Titus (I am townreading Zulfy-slot for reasons independent of pushes on RC).

So if I'm wrong about the whole traitor deal then there are certainly 4 groupscum. If I'm right then there still might be 4 groupscum.
I think there is a decent chance I'm wrong but traitor is still very plausible given lack of SK kill and mafcop.
If there are 4 groupscum, then there is one scum in pisskop-dwlee (and I think I've made it clear who I think is the scummier) and one scum in FB-keyser-mollie.
It just doesn't make sense for 2 groupscum to hard defend someone who's life is on a timer. It just doesn't make sense for 2 groupscum to hard defend scum knowing that neither of them have the towncred to seriously divert a lynch off of RC, and when RC eventually dies, their lives will be at stake. I could see one groupscum doing it, sure. But two is just ridiculous.
That's why I'm not ruling out FB-keyser-mollie group. Because there's a fair chance that we're looking at a 4 person scumteam.

[Errantparabola]

and by the way JJD.
just because pisskop deathtunneled mollie and then flipped to thinking she was town postflips doesn't mean that pisskop is the end-all be-all for mollie reading.

[Errantparabola]

ignore that last post. I just remembered you thought pisskop was scum and it makes sense in that context.

[Errantparabola]

VOTE: Dwlee
that's L-1 yo

[Errantparabola]

you're a good guy Dwlee
bit fluffy but good guy

[Errantparabola]

one of pisskop/Dwlee99 is likely town.

Right. So anyone who doesn't agree on this, say why. Anyone who does agree on this, say who.

[Errantparabola]

This doesn't change the fact that pisskop is town
Phoneposting so give me like 3 hours and I'll be back

[Errantparabola]

Im going to iso fire later today because i remember cow being someone i wanted to lynch.

[Errantparabola]

you're probably right. zulfy slot is town by RC interaction as well.
i see no reason for cabd and Keyser to be lynch immune.

[Errantparabola]

I'm not sure what your point is? RC was going to get lynched so pushing on him and creating a large case isn't that hard. I'm glad he was so adamant about it but I would have bussed the shit out of RC as soon as that cop flipped town.

Basically this. Due to the nature of the game state I think interaction tells on RC post Nero lynch don't swing alignment either way. Town can easily be convinced RC is town and scum can easily hard bus RC based on believing that RC's life is on a timer and the other way around too. That's why I'd only really take stock in tells pre RC claim to influence a read.

[Errantparabola]

Pk, is your read on gr based on titus?
Because i agree that i got no town vibes from titus, but i forgave it because zulfy was rather town to me.

[Errantparabola]

Sorry i let this game kind of slip my mind for the past week or so. I was incredibly busy and right after that, incredibly sick. But i'm back now, and so i'll be able to make more than short posts.
You're right to assume that i didnt put my time and energy into making sure pk survived the day, pieguy, cause i didnt have any of that shit to begin with lol

[Errantparabola]

VT

[Errantparabola]

my issue with the Zulfy interactions is more that his read on RC looked really really strained - i think he was going for a distancing play there and not realizing just how forced it was coming across.

really? zulfy's interactions are the one thing that redeems GR for me. Titus/GR are nowhere close to town.

[Errantparabola]

I blame myself for the loss sorry rob and scumteam
what was i thinking when i claimed VT