Mystery Mafia 2- Game Over! But who won!?

[elvis_knits]

I am here!

[elvis_knits]

Patrick, I notice you did not contemplate the fact that one of you and lord hur is probably scum when you first posted after the explosion.

This is what you posted:

Those arguments turned my tired brain to mush. I'm thinking VRK is on drugs. But now seriously, on looking at populartajo's posts, I'm surprised nobody seems to have mentioned the possibility that he investigated Greasy Spot. He mentioned that he was curious about Greasy, then voted him and refused to move it, whilst also setting up a future lynch for when Greasy turns up scum. That looks to me like he investigated him and got a guilty, or at least, it seems the most likely scenario.

I'm feeling kind of confused right now. Everyone except lord hur has a clean slate in my eyes, and at first I thought he almost has to be scum. (For a start, if lord hur is town, that means we had all townies throughout day 2. But BM has said that new players are introduced pre-determined intervals, so I guess this could be viable).

L_H and patrick, any reason you think you are still alive? also, Kison was scum? all it says was that he was a bomb but it's colored in red like the other scum are

As to why we're still alive, it's because we haven't been lynched or nightkilled or daykilled yet. Not sure what you were looking for. I'm currently assuming Kison was scum because of the colour of the role reveal.

I think it would have been natural for you to answer dahill's question with a discussion of the fact that one of you is probably scum. This didn't occur to you?

I find it suspicious that you didn't bring up lord hur right away, but when lord hur comes out with reasoning that one of you two is scum and it's not him, you immediately vote for him.

vote patrick

[elvis_knits]

Patrick, I notice you did not contemplate the fact that one of you and lord hur is probably scum when you first posted after the explosion.

Clearly not true. In the second paragraph of the quote, I did exactly what you're saying I didn't. I was feeling kind of confused because lord_hur didn't look especially scummy to me all game, but the circumstances meant there were only limited ways he could be protown (vengeful vig, or lord_hur himself causing a kill as a protown role). Did you somehow miss that?

Sorry but I did sort of gloss over it. I'm not really clear about the vengeful vig stuff or all the mechanics of this game.

Still, you didn't come out and say "one of me and lord hur has to be scum, vote lord hur". But when lord hur came out voting you, your voted him.

[elvis_knits]

Sorry but I did sort of gloss over it. I'm not really clear about the vengeful vig stuff or all the mechanics of this game.

So, you saw a potentially scummy post, and instead of reading it more closely than usual, you skimmed it. Noted. I also think you should try to get the vig stuff, because it's related to this entire discussion.

I saw that you only voted lord hur after he voted for you. Since you posted first, I thought it was significant. I'm sorry I skimmed your post a bit. But I am trying to catch up on a lot for this game.

Still, you didn't come out and say "one of me and lord hur has to be scum, vote lord hur". But when lord hur came out voting you, your voted him.

That's correct: I don't think that one of us has to be scum. I brought up the me/lord_hur issue in that post and said that initially I thought he had to be scum (and initially was going to vote him immediately), but I decided it wasn't as clear cut as I had first thought. Since it was past midnight, I decided to leave it for the night. Lord hur's immediate vote for me took out one possibility for him to be town because it meant he wasn't claiming responsibility for a kill as a protown powerole (not sure whether I'd have believed him, but would have been something to think about). I then decided to vote him.

So you think his vote on you makes him scummy?

[elvis_knits]

Patrick, what is the vengeful vig role all about? I didn't see ashmite claim anywhere or explain his role and I didn't find much in the wiki. If you've answered this before, please point me to the right post.

[elvis_knits]

Now though, like I've said, lord_hur's last few posts are all argued from a scum perspective.

I don't see that. What about his posting makes you certain he is posting from "a scum perspective"?

This seems like unsubstantiated slander.

[elvis_knits]

I did say it in the post before that, so even if you disagree with it, it can hardly be "unsubstantiated slander". Reposted:

By the way, that line of questioning makes it obvious you're scum. If you were protown, you wouldn't need any assurance beyond "If I'm lynched today as town Patrick is lynched tomorrow". The fact that you're trying to cover scenarios where you're lynched and turn up scum makes it clear you're scum.

I really don't see how the fact that he includes scenarios in which he is scum means he is scum.

Many a pro-town player will include that kind of scenario because they know from other POV's people can't be sure they are not scum. He's the only person who really knows, so he puts every situation out there to be unbiased.

[elvis_knits]

I really want everyone to confirm they have read the death scene's because if you haven't then you should. There is obviously a wolf character around and it is either Patrick or Lord Hur.

I agree there is a wolf. I think it's Patrick though for the way he has reacted -- first saying that the kill could have been a weirdly flavored vengeful vig, and then OMGUS on lord hur.

I also don't agree with Patrick's recent assessment of lord hur. I don't think that including the possibile scenario of yourself as scum is a scum tell. I think people inculde that possibility because they know others don't know their allignment and are trying to be fair.

LITRAL -- Give me a reason to participate in your [quote="Litral]number[/quote] thing. I don't get it.

[elvis_knits]

I really want everyone to confirm they have read the death scene's because if you haven't then you should. There is obviously a wolf character around and it is either Patrick or Lord Hur.

I agree there is a wolf. I think it's Patrick though for the way he has reacted -- first saying that the kill could have been a weirdly flavored vengeful vig, and then OMGUS on lord hur.

I also don't agree with Patrick's recent assessment of lord hur. I don't think that including the possibile scenario of yourself as scum is a scum tell. I think people inculde that possibility because they know others don't know their allignment and are trying to be fair.

LITRAL -- Give me a reason to participate in your [quote="Litral]number[/quote] thing. I don't get it.

[elvis_knits]

Wheeeee for double posting... sorry

[elvis_knits]

As I thought yesterday, Patrick is a wolf.

[elvis_knits]

Elvis: Post 405 talks about just skimming the post that patrick made. I don't like this post. Skimming is lazy way to make someone look scummy, but in reality it's blah post.

I agree that I was lazy when replacing into this game. I saw in Patrick an odd treatment of the werewolf issue and seized on it. In particular, how he doesn't present that one of him or lordhur must be a werewolf (saying it maybe odd vig flavor), but then after lord hur makes hte "him or me" argument, Patrick immediately votes lord hur. If Patrick thought it was possible that neither him not lord hur were the werewolf, I would not expect him to OMGUS like that. So yeah, I didn't really pay attention to everything else Patrick was saying because I thought I had already found something crucial.

[elvis_knits]

I agree that I was lazy when replacing into this game. I saw in Patrick an odd treatment of the werewolf issue and seized on it. In particular, how he doesn't present that one of him or lordhur must be a werewolf (saying it maybe odd vig flavor), but then after lord hur makes hte "him or me" argument, Patrick immediately votes lord hur. If Patrick thought it was possible that neither him not lord hur were the werewolf, I would not expect him to OMGUS like that. So yeah, I didn't really pay attention to everything else Patrick was saying because I thought I had already found something crucial.

My issue with your play is actually consistent laziness and narrow mindedness. Virtually all your posts have involved attacking me whilst defending yesterday's scum, and I don't remember you commenting on any other player (and naturally, you've ignored ashmite breadcrumbing his role). I've outlined why I think potential scumbuddies of hur would have been eager to save him yesterday, but even aside from that, you're play looks like you've just found a safe point or two to continue bashing on, rather than scumhunting.

vote Patrick

[elvis_knits]

elvis is probably scum, and would be my recommendation for lynching tomorrow as things stand. I expect her to try to put the blame on me tomorrow for my lynch or to try to wash her hands of it somehow, but I still don't think she's playing in a protown fashion at all. Deflected the lord_hur lynch and has basically only attacked me all game (an easy target). I think she's trying to avoid antagonising other players to reduce the chances of being lynched and reduce the chances of being nightkilled by potential rival scum. Shows no apparent interest in a good portion of the arguments made (not just today, but all game) and generally not much scumhunting at all.

1) I take full responsibility for my vote on you and my part in your lynch, whatever it may yield. Why you are saying that I will blame others, I have no idea. I have no track record of doing that.

2) You always think I'm scum.

3) I've been attacking you "all game" because I think you're scum. "All game" for me has been since yesterday, which was a short day anyway.

4) One reason I haven't attacked others very much is because everyone else is new and there isn't that much to analyze.

5) I'm not trying to avoid a night kill. I welcome it.

[elvis_knits]

Patrick, to suggest I wouldn't buss lord_hur if I was scum... is absurd.

[elvis_knits]

I understand that a buddy might want to protect lord hur at the start of the day and push for another person's lynch (especially if they legitimately thought the other person would come up scum).

Except that the town swung the other way and went after lord hur. Why wouldn't a buddy switch tactics then? When lord hur's lynch was imminent, why not buss him? Lord hur even BEGGED for a hammer. Don't you think that's sort of like saying "Buddies please hammer me and make yourself look more pro-town!"

[elvis_knits]

So, really, this vote is much more signifcant than anything I did yesterday:

Ok, someone finish me please...

Anyone really, it doesn't matter.

Vote: lord_hur

[elvis_knits]

Also, this is the L-1 vote:

1

Because I ain't afraid to see where this rabbit hole goes.

After long and careful consideration of the arguments, I'm gonna go with

Vote: lord_hur

He says he took a long and careful consideration of the arguments, but can't bother to put any of his views down besides a vote.

It seems like a townie, unsure of the person's allignment might take more care putting someone else at L-1, and at least explain their thought process. Only a scum on buss would think they don't need to justify.

Expanding on that, I find that scum often buss each other in a weird way, call out each other on somehting small or insignificant... or just vote each other in an odd way. Tony Montana falls into that category. Of voting a scum for the wrong reasons.

[elvis_knits]

I see what lawrencelot did as scummy, but actually the more I think about it, tony montana even more so. Voting the right person for the wrong reason (or for no reason) is a huge tell of bussing, IMO.

[elvis_knits]

Also from Tony:

1

Because I ain't afraid to see where this rabbit hole goes.

After long and careful consideration of the arguments, I'm gonna go with

Vote: lord_hur

He was the first (and maybe only) person not afraid of Litral or suspicious of the "quote a number for me please" thing.

If Tony is scum and knows litral is not on his buddy, he has good reason not to be afraid of litral.

[elvis_knits]

Who are you and what is happening?

[elvis_knits]

Well, it's sorta hard to know what is best to do, what to buy, etc, when I don't know what this is all about. Lawrencelot mentioned seeing this before? Does anyone know where or have a guess?

I would be fine with farside getting a shotgun, but not fine with lawrencelot getting one.

I like wine, so I am fine with getting that. But I don't want to commit to anything until I have some idea what is going on.

[elvis_knits]

Why do you want an empty glass?

[elvis_knits]

lol something just occurred to me... the double meaning of shot gun... i am now imagining farside with a gun loaded with booze, able to shoot into our mouths.

Give me wine!

[elvis_knits]

Guys, do

not

drink any alchol. Seriously . I fyou do I will die.

Seriously?

[elvis_knits]

Well, it's hard for me to know if I want you alive or dead, mafiassk. I'll have to see how you roll.

[elvis_knits]

Drink up boys! It's party time!

DO NOT DRINK. If you want me to claim I will.

I'd rather you not claim unless we vote you for scumminess. I'd like to see you get more involved in the game and comment on things as a basis of judging scumminess.

[elvis_knits]

Hey now, no need to get excited! Relax and enjoy my wares!

But alas alcohol is poisonous to my soul and anyone who drinks it shall kill me.

BONUS.

MafiaSSK never really contributes. We basically have the opportunity to policy-lynch someone whose very existence makes the site worse, until such time as he either adopts a decent playstyle or quits. Let's do it.

ROFL...

I remember when mafiassk self-hammered as town in Omod. Ah! The memories!

Also, having re-read Patrick, his play seems to make a lot more sense than it did reading along. I no longer intend to vote him. The vengeful vig theory really has a lot of evidence behind it. Besides, think. If he's trying to argue that that kill wasn't him, even if it was, he can't do it again all game or it gives him away. I'm fine with that.

I hate to say it but, I actually think Patrick may not be the way to go today. Tony Montana seems like a much better way to go for his behavior around the lord-hur lynch. Or lawrencelot. But I favor tony montana. And I wonder why he hasn't mentioned anything about my points against him.

[elvis_knits]

Patrick was hte only one alive when the first death happened... so if it happens again, it can only be him.

The rest of us are too new.

[elvis_knits]

He was the first (and maybe only) person not afraid of Litral or suspicious of the "quote a number for me please" thing.

If Tony is scum and knows litral is not on his buddy, he has good reason not to be afraid of litral.

I can see this, but at the same time I can see it cutting the other way too; if Tony is scum who knows Litral is not his buddy, he could very well be afraid of Litral's ability helping the town in some way, and might be hesitant to support it.

You're right. Still, for his position on the wagon, and his lack of a good/original reason, I think Tony was bussing lord_hur.

[elvis_knits]

Nobody is believing you because you have made several posts now promising better, but not actually DOING better.

Provide some analysis or die.

[elvis_knits]

Drink: Pint of Lager

Yay! Mafiassk dies!

[elvis_knits]

Which is exactly why I'm asking the town who I should smack. Or if I should just smack Patrick and get rid of the WIFOM, since I still feels the odds are him being scum. And this way we don't waste a lynch on him.

I would rather you use your own judgement. I thought you didn't think Patrick was scum anymore.

[elvis_knits]

I drank my wine, it wasn't a choice. I was just told I drank it. It did nothing.

Shouldn't mafiassk be dead?

[elvis_knits]

Damn...we were wrong...I'm sorry I wasted the vig :S.

Moving along, I'll do a quick reread either tonight or tomorrow to see who's scummy.

Why do you say "we" were wrong? You killed him.

Why are you trying to act like it was a group decision?

[elvis_knits]

I just realized deadline is in two days. I say we lynch Tony Montana, FL, or lawrencelot.

[elvis_knits]

Actually, I want MafiaSSK to explain why he's not dead.

OMG forgot about that guy. It's getting kinda late. We don't have much time to discuss people, so I think lynching mafiassk should be our default. He promised content and provided none, and he lied to us about dying if we drank alcohol.

[elvis_knits]

vote mafiassk

[elvis_knits]

Unvote

Maybe we should take a second to talk about the lack of kills tonight?
Could it be that the drunkards were out of play throughout the night, and that explains it?

Possibly. Who was that? lawrencelot? Who else?

Also could be a RBer or doc or something.

[elvis_knits]

Woah with the quicklynching, people.

I'd support a hypo today, I think.

You realize you supported mafiassk lynch yesterday but didn't vote him.

[elvis_knits]

Bit late, but what's a JFK?

It's an airport... ¬¬

Also, a dead president.

---

I've never heard of hypoclaim before. From what Litral says, it seems there is a downside -- narrowing down the possible docs or RB's, giving scum better chance of hitting them. I'm not a very good strategy person... is there a way around this, while still getting the info? It sounds like hypocop claim would be better and less dangerous. I would be up for that, possibly up for the whole hypoclaim.

[elvis_knits]

Okay, hypoclaim sounds good.

lol @mafiassk being first.

[elvis_knits]

I targetted Tony Montana... or did I?

[elvis_knits]

I suggest anyone who doesn't show up and hypoclaim by deadline be vigged or lynched ASAP.

Also, mafiassk is a good lynch today. I will vote closer to deadline or when everyone has hypoclaimed.

[elvis_knits]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY FARSIDE!

vote mafiassk

Since I think everyone has hypoclaimed. Pretty sure landlord is BM.

[elvis_knits]

Not really since I don't see him voting for anyone or doing much of anything.

[elvis_knits]

These are the hypoclaims from yesterday about N5 where we had no death:

TM: lawrence
FL:SSK
farside:litral
EK:TM
lawrence:landlord
fonz:TM
litral:farside
SSK:nobody


If we look at the list, a number of them can be eliminated as being responsible for the no-kill.

TM: lawrence

(has said that fonz didn't stop him from killing because "there was nothing to block" which means he has no night action or is lying)

FL:SSK

(SSK dead town)
farside:litral
EK:TM

lawrence:landlord

(landlord is BM)
fonz:TM
litral:farside

SSK:nobody

That leaves us with the following people who could have been blocked/protected to prevent the kill: litral, TM, farside. Either one of these three was blocked from making a kill and is therefor scum, or was protected as town and prevented the kill. I'm not sure any of those would have gotten a doc protect, but I guess it's possible.

[elvis_knits]

Vote Count

TonyMontana 3 (Forbiddanlight, Lawrencelot, Landlord)

What? Landlord's vote is now counting??

I really thought landlord was BM screwing with us.

[elvis_knits]

Also, elvis_knits logic is horrible.

TM: lawrence

(has said that fonz didn't stop him from killing because "there was nothing to block" which means he has no night action or is lying)

FL:SSK

(SSK dead town)
farside:litral
EK:TM

lawrence:landlord

(landlord is BM)
fonz:TM
litral:farside

SSK:nobody

How does SSK being town eliminate FL as doc?
Why is Litral not striked, for being dead?
Whether landlord is BM or not, that doesn't mean lawrence couldn't have blocked a kill (The fact that Lawrence was absent does, tho)

So the possible reasons for the lack of kills: (In no particular order)
1. No kills made.
2. Lawrence out of play.
3. Forbiddanlight protecting SSK
4. Lawrence protecting landlord
5. Elvis protecting me
6. Farside protecting litral.
and to be fair to the uninformed:
7. The fonz blocking me.

So I don't see how Tony thinks he got set up in this case when Fonz flips townie.

Only time i mentioned a set-up, was when I said how I didn't think a set-up was possible.
All I'm saying is that fonz blocking me stopped no kill, and it's only 1 out of 7 possible explanations for the lack of a kill.

I guess I did make some mistakes... I always screw up strategy stuff. I don't know why I didn't stike litral... I forgot he was dead I guess which is stupid... I was only thinking of the fonz being dead.

Okay, so you say the possibilities are:

1. No kills made.

( I don't think this is likely.)
2. Lawrence out of play.

3. Forbiddanlight protecting SSK

(Not likely... why try to kill ssk when he was likely to be lynched?)

4. Lawrence protecting landlord

(Do we really think landlord is a player?)
5. Elvis protecting me
6. Farside protecting litral.
and to be fair to the uninformed:
7. The fonz blocking me.

To me, the only real possibilities are:
1)Lawrence is scum: too drunk to make the kill
2)I protected a kill on TM
3)Farside protected a kill on litral
4)Fonz block TM-scum.

[elvis_knits]

I think landlord is a player though, whether he's controlled by BM or not. He can vote (at least today) and he appears in the player list. If he's BM and also a player, he's probably here to screw around, as it would be unfair to any faction to have the mod on their side. Maybe he's some sort of survivor?

Btw, I was only absent during the day. I went home during the day to sleep it off. Does not mean I have a night action per se, this is what my pm said.

Are you saying you could perform night actions or not?

[elvis_knits]

My reason for leaning to Tony is I know what a role blocker does and I know a role blocker targeted Tony.

Not even I

knows

for certain that fonz actually blocked me.

We actually do know for certain that fonz blocked you since he claimed it before he died and we know he was a blocker.

So... yes. He blocked you.

The thing we don't know for sure is if fonz's block is responsible for the no-kill night. But he did most certainly block you, and you saying it's not certain makes me very suspicious of you.

[elvis_knits]

Nooooooooooooooooooooo

My perfect record of never being lynched is ruined.

I'm a miller, btw... Ironic, since I was worried being miller would be my downfall.

Hope you people consider Lawrence a little more seriously now... not to mention that everyone who voted me are a bunch of scums in my eyes.

*mourns his first lynch*

Not really believing this...

[elvis_knits]

vote lawrencelot

[elvis_knits]

Also, elvis_knits logic is horrible.

TM: lawrence

(has said that fonz didn't stop him from killing because "there was nothing to block" which means he has no night action or is lying)

FL:SSK

(SSK dead town)
farside:litral
EK:TM

lawrence:landlord

(landlord is BM)
fonz:TM
litral:farside

SSK:nobody

How does SSK being town eliminate FL as doc?
Why is Litral not striked, for being dead?
Whether landlord is BM or not, that doesn't mean lawrence couldn't have blocked a kill (The fact that Lawrence was absent does, tho)

So the possible reasons for the lack of kills: (In no particular order)
1. No kills made.
2. Lawrence out of play.
3. Forbiddanlight protecting SSK
4. Lawrence protecting landlord
5. Elvis protecting me
6. Farside protecting litral.
and to be fair to the uninformed:
7. The fonz blocking me.

So I don't see how Tony thinks he got set up in this case when Fonz flips townie.

Only time i mentioned a set-up, was when I said how I didn't think a set-up was possible.
All I'm saying is that fonz blocking me stopped no kill, and it's only 1 out of 7 possible explanations for the lack of a kill.

I guess I did make some mistakes... I always screw up strategy stuff. I don't know why I didn't stike litral... I forgot he was dead I guess which is stupid... I was only thinking of the fonz being dead.

Okay, so you say the possibilities are:

1. No kills made.

( I don't think this is likely.)
2. Lawrence out of play.

3. Forbiddanlight protecting SSK

(Not likely... why try to kill ssk when he was likely to be lynched?)

4. Lawrence protecting landlord

(Do we really think landlord is a player?)
5. Elvis protecting me
6. Farside protecting litral.
and to be fair to the uninformed:
7. The fonz blocking me.

To me, the only real possibilities are:
1)Lawrence is scum: too drunk to make the kill
2)I protected a kill on TM
3)Farside protected a kill on litral
4)Fonz block TM-scum.

1)Lawrence is scum: too drunk to make the kill
2)I protected a kill on TM
3)Farside protected a kill on litral

4)Fonz block TM-scum

2 and 3 not looking viable... which leaves 1

[elvis_knits]

The wine had no effect on me. You can tell by how I was posting and active while lawrence was passed out from his bottle of alcohol.

[elvis_knits]

The wine had no effect on me. You can tell by how I was posting and active while lawrence was passed out from his bottle of alcohol.

In order to keep my theory alive I would point out With Lawrences case we all witnessed the effect, in your case we only have your word. Just becuase we couldn't see anything happen, doesn't mean it didn't.

Also theres a possibility the wine made you inactive at night and the rum made lawrence inactive during the day. Then again... maybe the Vodka made someone inactive during the day, and the rum made them inactive during the night AND day. It may account for the price difference.

You're saying that maybe wine had no effect on me during the day, but then later, prevented me from night actions? Delayed drunken stupor? It's never worked that way for me in real life...

Also, it has to do with quantity. One glass wasn't enough to make me pass out like one pint of beer didn't make those people pass out and lose day or night actions/activity. Lawrence drank a whole bottle, which could kill you or at least prevent you from doing anything (completing night kills).

[elvis_knits]

If we don't lynch lawrence, I say forbiddanlight for her irresponsible day-vigging and then trying to shift blame to the whole group rather than take responsibility for her actions.

[elvis_knits]

i wonder if lawrence gets that power over day events, like lynching, or just night actions. I would think night actions, but who knows.

[elvis_knits]

Okay.

I wonder if actions even work on landlord... that's who lawrence said he targetted right?

[elvis_knits]

The list from the no-kill night and how it oculd have happened:

1)Lawrence is scum: too drunk to make the kill
2)I protected a kill on TM
3)Farside protected a kill on litral

4)Fonz block TM-scum

Updated:

1)Lawrence is scum: too drunk to make the kill
2)I protected a kill on TM

3)Farside protected a kill on litral

4)Fonz block TM-scum

So either I protected a kill on TM, or lawrence is scum and was too drunk to kill.

I thought I would let you know that actually do not have protective powers. I could not have protected TM from a kill. So the only option is lawrencelot is lying scumbag.

[elvis_knits]

Oh VC was reset...

vote lawrencelot

[elvis_knits]

I think this post by farside might reveal a little bit:

Okay I looked into what bugged me and I was wrong. I would like to hear from those who haven't posted since entering the game there thoughts on what and who. BM seems to have 1 or 2 scums in each new installment of people and No I am not going to say "Oh there was only one kill" that just could mean a forgetful scum or someone trying not to get caught.

The last sentence seems like she may have intentionally not turned in a kill.

If she actually did forget to send in the kill or choose not to, why breadcrumb it?

If she's scum and chose not to kill, she WANTS us to think mafia was active so that we keep following the results of the hypoclaim. She wouldn't want us to give up on the hypoclaim.

[elvis_knits]

You didn't update the newest theory, that you were too drunk to make the kill. I'd vote you but see below.

I don't think that theory makes much sense even if you're not me (and I know that the wine didn't have an effect).

Now that farside is dead, is it not possible she normally killed but couldn't because of the drinks? What did she drink anyway? And what the heck is a bookie?

Farside got a shotgun, but no drinks, I think.

[elvis_knits]

Maybe the amount of coins had something to do with the bookie. I mean, bookies handle money and stuff.

[elvis_knits]

Also, I'm at L-2 now. Don't hammer, there's enough to discuss still. Like, who I should target. Somehow, I don't feel like killing Elvis, she makes too much sense even though she's wrong about me.

I felt pretty comfortable with a Law lynch up until I read this. Then I was convinced. Law-Town should have seen solid logic with a bad conclusion as intentional misinformation and town-misleading. Instead he buddies up. I don't think it matter who we have him target, because I think he's lying, but it he isn't, I'm not sure of the best pick, I'll look around.

I also thought it was weird that lawrence didn't want to kill me. Barring some weird game mechanics (which is possible with BM), then either him or me is scum. So yeah, if he's town I would expect to get killed.

[elvis_knits]

I didn't choose to drink my wine, BTW. I was told that I drank it... it wasn't a choice.

[elvis_knits]

What are you talking about? After N5 where we had no deaths, we did a hypoclaim. The only two possibilities left are that lawrence was too drunk to make the kill or that I protected TM. I'm telling you that my night action (if I have one) could not have protected TM from a kill.

If Lawrence were town, he would think I was scum, so he would want to kill me. The fact that he doesn't want to kill me is weird. Is it buddying, I don't know. I tend to think that he's just not thinking like a townie who would think I was scum if he's not.

[elvis_knits]

I didn't think it likely that scum would want to kill SSK. He was almost lynched the day before if not for deadline. He was lynched the next day. The town wanted to lynch him.

1)Why would a doc protect SSK?
2)Why would scum need to kill him?

[elvis_knits]

What are these many possibilities? Other than Forbiddan protecting SSK, what are the other possibilities?

[elvis_knits]

What are these many possibilities? Other than Forbiddan protecting SSK, what are the other possibilities?

You are focusing on the no kill (you are also forgetting that landlord did a EBWOP to say he targeted everybody). If it was not a result of Lawrence being drunk, then it could have been anything from Farside not killing intentionally to a mod inflicted no kill meaning the no kill is no longer a source of information. This means that Lawrence would have no idea who scum would be (if town) and have no reason to automatically assume it is you. Nothing in what you have said makes Forbidden not scum.

Bionic, sure there are some weird possibilities, like scum decided to no-kill or sent the kill in late, or BM forced them to no-kill for some reason we don't know. But these things have very low chance of being true. I see no reason why we shouldn't follow through on finding the reason for the no-kill. This seems like the best lead we have, and an important source of information. I don't know why you want to throw it away over these one-in-a-million scenarios.

And as for forbiddan being scum... if she's scum, why did her kill not go through? Because we know from the hypoclaim that nobody targetted her to block her, and nobody was successfully protected that night either.

[elvis_knits]

Why is it her or Lawrence? Why is she so sure somebody else from D3 is mafia?

Do you not get it? Because we have eliminated everyone else in the hypoclaim from being blocked or protected.

[elvis_knits]

My point is that farside could have been the only D3 mafia.

IF she was the only mafia, why didn't her kill go through? Nobody blocked farside and none of the players were protected -- unless you think farside tried to kill SSK and was stopped by forbiddandoc. If that were true, forbiddan should not be voting lawrence now.

[elvis_knits]

And however unlikely it may seem Farside could have been the first stabber, and we may have a new stabber that just joined.

Weird.

Also... what do we think distorter role does... like a framer?

Also...

vote lawrencelot

[elvis_knits]

I'd like more input from surye and K7 because I feel like they're the new people who have talked the least. But I really don't want to encourage us to slow down the lynch since we've failed to lynch twice now because of people being slow.

[elvis_knits]

I still don't think landlord is a player.

Do you guys want me to roleclaim today?

[elvis_knits]

I still don't think landlord is a player.

Which is why I think he's a good choice.

In the event lawrence is not scum and landlord is not a player, lawrence would waste his kill.

Do you guys want me to roleclaim today?

Why?

Because landlord says he copied me last night. I know he says he was RB'd though.

[elvis_knits]

Re: new players, I'm not having much of a read on them. Surye or K7 would be good kills though since they aren't trying very hard.

[elvis_knits]

I really don't think it's landlord's fault we keep no-lynching.

[elvis_knits]

So, if lawrence was roleblocked, does that mean the roleblock could have come from him copying me and I was roleblocked?

[elvis_knits]

I find it very interesting that Lawrence was apparently targetted for RB, yet that doesn't actually block him, but allows him to copy the block and block someone else.

I do not know if I was RB'ed or not.

[elvis_knits]

The problem I see with killing K7 or Landlord is, we still wouldn't get rid of the stabber if it was indeed someone who joined D3. I would prefer killing forbiddanlight.

No... you will not kill forbiddan... The game just wouldn't be the same without her... *cries*

Are you starting to think lawrence is telling the truth and is town? If so, we shouldn't lynch him.

[elvis_knits]

vote lawrencelot

[elvis_knits]

I still think landlord is BM, but he's been hanging around for a while now, supposedly as a player. Which is confusing.

I agree Surye is scum.

[elvis_knits]

Massclaim?

I'm willing to go first.

[elvis_knits]

So why did you say this at the beginning of the day?

Korlash is also on the definite pro-town list.

Should I still claim in light of this?

[elvis_knits]

Hmmm, well I think I believe you Korts...

Even if I don't claim today, I do want to say that:

I am not Forbiddan's mason buddy.

I don't know what's up with that... if BM made a buddyless mason or the mason joined the next day, or WTF is going on with that. But I am not a mason.

[elvis_knits]

Why do you need me to full claim?

[elvis_knits]

Looking back, it does look like Korlash made some breadcrumbs about forbiddan... not suspecting her and agreeing with her and such... and this:

No... you will not kill forbiddan... The game just wouldn't be the same without her... *cries*

Forbiddan doesn't seem to refer to korlash at all, but still, looks like Korlash was crumbing pretty well.

[elvis_knits]

You will know if I am lying? Not sure how you would know...

I'm a miller. I think I had some sort of name to go with that too. I think it said "dalek."

[elvis_knits]

Also, you will notice I didn't believe Tony's claim of miller because I thought the idea of having more than one miller was silly. But BM is silly, I guess

[elvis_knits]

I didn't know what a dalek was... it's a robot?

[elvis_knits]

So... korts is scum?

[elvis_knits]

Also, elvis, off topic, but Daleks are what I quote in my sig, EX-TERM-IN-ATE!


http://www.daleklinks.co.uk/media/40007 ... gh-res.jpg Don't let the plunger eye fool you.

They're like sexy R2D2's.

[elvis_knits]

Also,

vote korts

[elvis_knits]

I don't think iceman's hammer should count...

unvote

Korts... seriously... how are you not scum? Just that you got a guilty on the GF? Is that possible?

[elvis_knits]

Korlash made more than one breadcrumb, I believe...

[elvis_knits]

Korts... seriously... how are you not scum? Just that you got a guilty on the GF? Is that possible?

I believe he is trying to say he is insane. But then he also needs to explain why there were 4 scum that joined in my block. I mean if Surye and I are a scum pair, then town got screwed with that last block of join ins. 4 scum and a vanilla town. seriously...

I believe Korlash and surye are town in light of their claim.

[elvis_knits]

The nameclaim is actually a bit fishy, though. I don't really gather how a Dalek could be part of a town unless the whole town is Dalek. And I know I'm not (lemme check--no, no metal shell, no toilet pump arms, although my voice is a bit rusty lately)

Don't you remember when I pushed to lynch lawrence, saying him or me had ot be scum?

No reason for me to do that if I was scum. If he was my buddy, no reason for me to throw him under the bus when nobody wanted him dead. If I was on another scum team, I wouldn't know HE was scum, so I wouldn't want to go into a "him or me" situation when I'm scum.

[elvis_knits]

^^ korts said that... screwed the tags...

[elvis_knits]

I'm fine with lynching landlord instead, although some things are making me worry about korlash. The way he is hanging onto improbable things... like that I would really buss lawrencelot like that when nobody was following the hypoclaim results and didn't seem to care. I had to fight hard to get people to look at the hypoclaim at all. No reason for me to do that as scum if it puts more pressure on me.

Also, are we sure there's two scum left? We've had so many scum die lately, I'm not sure there's two left.

[elvis_knits]

If Korlash dreamed up this masonizer claim with surye and dead mason FL, then it's pretty awesome and I wouldn't be mad losing to that awesomeness. I'm willing to believe it, or lose on the chance I'm wrong.

[elvis_knits]

Also, are we sure there's two scum left? We've had so many scum die lately, I'm not sure there's two left.

That all depends on what you think American mafia and Italian mafia mean...

Do any of the scum names match up? I don't know how you can predict anything from all the different scum names we have.

[elvis_knits]

If Korlash dreamed up this masonizer claim with surye and dead mason FL, then it's pretty awesome and I wouldn't be mad losing to that awesomeness. I'm willing to believe it, or lose on the chance I'm wrong.

Can I quote you on this? Having my name associated with Awesomeness doesnt happen every day...

It's only awesome if you're lying... are you?

[elvis_knits]

Your investigations don't line up with reality, so you try and justify it with wild stories.

Take a moment to actually

think

. What motivation, for fuckssake, would I have to claim a guilty on Lawrence

after

he turned GF?

This makes me think to lynch landlord.

[elvis_knits]

YES!

[elvis_knits]

Ok, so the problem is that Korts says he has an innocent on korlash which really means korlash is scum because korts has to be insane... amirite?

But I don't buy koorlash-surye as scum because of the claim. So korts gotta be lying about his investigation, whic makes him scum.

Am I missing something?

[elvis_knits]

Should I drunk-hammer?

[elvis_knits]

Do you feel you'll change your opinion when you sober up?

No. That's why I was talking myself through it. Korts investigation would mean that Korlash and surye are scum. I believe the claim, so I don't think they're scum. Also, if they're both scum then this is lylo and korlash could have quicklynched korts this afternoon when me and surye were voting korts. Iceman/landlord tried to hammer, but korlash did not. No reason for him not to if he's scum.

vote korts

(You don't know how much I am confusing the two K-names in my drunkenness... I've had to keep re-checking who is who...)

[elvis_knits]

How would we be going to night if you're not scum? IT would be game over if I chose wrong. If you're town, surye and korlash are scum.

[elvis_knits]

Do you feel you'll change your opinion when you sober up?

No. That's why I was talking myself through it. Korts investigation would mean that Korlash and surye are scum. I believe the claim, so I don't think they're scum. Also, if they're both scum then this is lylo and korlash could have quicklynched korts this afternoon when me and surye were voting korts. Iceman/landlord tried to hammer, but korlash did not. No reason for him not to if he's scum.

vote korts

(You don't know how much I am confusing the two K-names in my drunkenness... I've had to keep re-checking who is who...)

Excellent catch for a drunk girl

:drunk kiss:

[elvis_knits]

If Korlash and Sury are lying, who the hell is FL's mason buddy? I really think they're legit.

[elvis_knits]

Madness...

What time does BM wake up?

Yeah I would be really pissed if Elvis is the last scum and got away by claiming "Town sided dalek"... *laughs* Talk about Awesomsness...

Claiming evil robot is hardly a good move for sucm to make.

[elvis_knits]

I wouldn't be drunk posting as scum... I'm always afraid of slipping.

[elvis_knits]

300...That was a good movie... all the guys were hot and naked...

[elvis_knits]

I always think it's funny how guys like that movie. I mean, I guess they like the fighting and there are boobs in it. But there's like one million buff guys dressed only in banana hammock, heavily outweighing the few boobs (no pun intended? Maybe I did intend).

[elvis_knits]

I wonder if BM will mind I said boobs.

[elvis_knits]

OMG I will totally take this win even though it was through no play of my own! Sorry Korts. And how funny was it that you guys didn't think a dalek was scum? I mean, I wasn't... but if I weren't me, I wouldn't have believed it. I wouldn't have even claimed it if I even knew what it was. Town-sided miller killer robot FTW!

There were so many things in this game that were crazy and mysterious and there was no way to figure out that you just had to sort of go with the flow and try to rely on your gut. Which was really awesome! I had a great time, thanks BM.

Also, mislynching Patrick was good times. It... just... feels... so... good.

Good game. And thanks Iceman for helping me survive so long. For the record, me and farside were mafia with Landlord, but we also thought he was BM.

ROFL...

BM... you evil, evil man!

[elvis_knits]

Also, mislynching Patrick was good times. It... just... feels... so... good.

Wasn't that me vigging? Totally not a mislynch .

UR RIGHT!

Good job!

[elvis_knits]

Also, mislynching Patrick was good times. It... just... feels... so... good.

I resent this.

I'm sorry. I don't know why it feels good but it does.