Cosmos Mafia (Postgame)

[MMR]

Yoink!

Rumor has it that the first page top will always be claimed by scum.

VOTE: Scarecrow

-Measles

[MMR]

REJOICE! For your SAVIOR is--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi I am a maso--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi, I am town.

I laughed.

~Titus

Me too.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Ngl but I don't like how Bunny originally commented on how the mech spec seemed Town.
If anything, the mech spec was more likely scum-indicative than not.
61 feels all right though and it feels kind of minor for scum to comment on.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Ngl but I don't like how Bunny originally commented on how the mech spec seemed Town.
If anything, the mech spec was more likely scum-indicative than not.
61 feels all right though and it feels kind of minor for scum to comment on.
-Rubella

I agree, Bunny's read didn't really match up with the content in Angel's post. And I actually dislike post 61, I think professotic's thought process seems genuine and makes sense to me.

so, u arguing that or no?

yes

Not sure how much of a take we were meant to have in post 25?

I like Radjs, Titus and mastina for town, maybe std. Mainly vibes. Really didn't like the mech post from frozen angel and not sure how I feel about aisa knowing their take on it was 'l0 but also town!' tbf I also hate mech in general.

-b

Though this makes me think slightly +town for Scarecrow. The Bella head seems a bit tonally flaccid and defensive, which contradicts my meta knowledge of their scum play.

VOTE: Bunny is a stronger scum read to me, I think more people should vote here.

-Measles

[MMR]

Checking. No comments from me... Yet!
~Mumps

[MMR]

mastina, can you explain your read on Child of Fairies?
They've posted no content so far but you've put them quite high in your reads tier.
-Rubella

[MMR]

mastina, can you explain your read on Child of Fairies?

That's literally my null tier. I don't have a read there.

I see.
I thought that you had them as a weak townlean because the above was labelled Townleans.
It makes more sense now.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I'm probably overreacting.

Mastina is a slot I'd like to sort later. I think this is just what she does and if it's entirely random she's scum but if it makes some sense she's probably town. I am leaning toward the latter.

I don't think that you are overreacting.
138 definitely reads like shade, to me, coming from FA.
It's completely understandable and NAI to not understand the mech in a closed setup.
VOTE: FA
-Rubella

[MMR]

who should we elim?

I don't like this post because it is a filler question and reads to me as "Tell me who is scum so I can mindlessly sheep without making a decision for myself".

REJOICE! For your SAVIOR is--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi I am a maso--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi, I am town.

Scum.

VOTE: dingle
legit

How do you have a "legit" vote on Scarecrow based off a single post?

I dare someone to call one of those 2 entrance posts I made wolfy and they can prepare for utter annihilation!

Congratulations, your entrance posts were wolfy. But now that I've checked who is in your slot, I'm much less confident about you being a wolf.

REJOICE! For your SAVIOR is--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi I am a maso--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi, I am town.

(Okay but for real, I intend to be a BEACON this game, REVEALING the TRUE COLORS of all.)

shifty is patent protected btw.

I am Talia. Believe it or not, it's true. As true as the fact that Aegon the Conqueror had two wives.

Who is talia?

This is fascinating though and I want to say it loud what most probably thought about too:

Meg, is there any public information about Dusk/Dawn phases? Are they different?

Both Dusk and Dawn function as normal Mafia game eliminations, as well as Noon and Night function as normal mafia game night phases. They are functionally identical except they are distinct.

So it seems that Noon is the night phase for the Solar cult and the night is the night phase for the Lunar cult. In other words, based on flavor we can guess that the cults are even/off phase mechanically. But guess we'll see when we go

Anyways missed you, my friends. long time no see <3 been a while since I played a game here

VOTE: Bunnyonce

Nice to see you again Frozen Angel.

Both Aisa and I think Frozen Angel is town for this post.

~Greeting

Why?

Speaking for myself: the mechanical speculation and her enthusiasm seemed towny.

I guess you could argue that's a level 0 take, but whatever.

-Aisa

It is a level zero take, but it's acceptable this early in the game.

I am Mafia Goon.

VOTE: Enchant

I think you're legitimately more likely to make this post as a Mafia Goon than as anything else.

i don't buy this dumbtell given discussion of scum being cult themed+ ding awareness of postcount enough to steal pagetop.

No tell existed here...

1

2

3

4

This is an atrocious waste of posts! Speaking of post count, someone remind me. Is there a post limit this game, and if so, what is it?

VOTE: professotic

I can't really quantify it, but it feels like they're playing looking for someone to kill rather than looking for scum. Just the way they're engaging feels... Wrong.

Maybe, but this is professotic we're talking about.

VOTE: professotic

I can't really quantify it, but it feels like they're playing looking for someone to kill rather than looking for scum. Just the way they're engaging feels... Wrong.

I’ll be honest, Tictac is paying more attention this game then I am.
I haven’t really read much of anything but I noticed he’s talking a bit in our hydra chat about stuff and reads and what not.

This doesn't track with my perceived ratio of your posts versus your partner's posts.

VOTE: professotic
I can't really quantify it, but it feels like they're playing looking for someone to kill rather than looking for scum. Just the way they're engaging feels... Wrong.

I mean, you right!

VOTE: professotic

{Past Present Future} (most locktown of locktown)
{Save the Dragons, Yume} (basically most, but need just a

bit

more from both to be sure)
{Radical Rat, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow (may be one lower)}
{Maid Cafe, MMR}

TOWNLEAN:
{furtiveglance}
{Enchant}
{T-Bone}


{Child of Fairies}
{Radja}


{Frozen Angel}
{Bunnyonce}

SCUM:
{Korina}
{professotic}

(Yes I am aware that's too few scum since the approximate amount should be 6, so I'm townreading slots I shouldn't be, but for

now

, this'll do.)

Hmm, I think I disagree with most of these reads.

Hey mastina

the number of posts so far:

Save the Dragons: 2
Yume: 1

Can you explain how the two of these are in your almost lock-town slots when their game hasn't even start yet? Yume practically posted nothing so far (Who is Talia btw?) and save the dragons made a weird comment about "if the mechanics are difficult" acting like he doesn't know this is a closed setup?

I don't plan on learning the mechanics are they difficult

I actually found that alarming in different ways

mastina has apparently mastered an art for interpreting early game posts. I haven't seen it to be too accurate in practice, but she'll place extreme confidence in it. I don't think it's really alarming not to engage in mechanics. Scum have more incentive to be engaged because scum mistakes tend to be costlier.

Also no one told me if the mechs are difficult lol

VOTE: frozen angel

That's not really a slip of any kind. This is clearly a bastard-esque game with an unusual day cycle. That's enough to imply that the mechanics are more complex than average.

There is this minigame I like to play from time to time called "guess the head". I'm particularly intrigued by who is Mumps, who is Measles, and who is Rubella.

[...]
But that doesn't matter to me as much as how you contradicted yourself on tone there in a way later on, at first saying yeah its a town read and both heads of hydra fully agree and then falling back on the read and claiming its just a hunch practically without any other development in game to justify the tone switch. Like I don't hold people responsible that much for their page 2 reads but I'm looking for people developments from one point to another to judge if it was faked or not

I'm pretty sure it was just slightly unfortunate wording on Greeting's part. He could have said "FA is towny" instead of "FA is town" in the initial post and then we wouldn't be here having this discussion.

I realise this is an easy thing to say to cover up an apparent inconsistency after the posts have been made. I don't think there's anything more I can do to change minds at this point, so I'm gonna move on.

[...]
what are your reads besides that "level 0" town read on my slot from everything else that's being said?

Just from browsing the thread right now, and without having discussed with Greeting, I feel like the Past Present Future slot might be Town. Call it vibes idk, just feel like their posting is on par for the course so far.

I'm gonna take it slow I think, I don't really know how to handle a good chunk of the playerlist and I don't really know what to do with the multiball aspect of the game.

-Aisa

I'll give you a hint: it should be quite obvious who is who by now. I hope though that you'll keep your guesses to yourself so that it doesn't distract the players who cannot tell us apart.

would really help if some discussions would happen in this game. It's hard to make conversations and do inferences over "Yo" and stuff of that kind

There's already been discussion around your slot, mastina, professotic, and Bunny... What more are you looking for?

can everyone just post at least 1 read they feel more comfortable about based on past 6 pages and at least 2 sentences explaining it?

No because this is busy work.
~Mumps

[MMR]

I'm probably overreacting.

Mastina is a slot I'd like to sort later. I think this is just what she does and if it's entirely random she's scum but if it makes some sense she's probably town. I am leaning toward the latter.

I don't think that you are overreacting.
138 definitely reads like shade, to me, coming from FA.
It's completely understandable and NAI to not understand the mech in a closed setup.
VOTE: FA
-Rubella

Let me remember to not respond to why I find something alarming next time someone asks me about it then? the statement can be NAI on its own but I didn't like the attitude shown in it so it was noted. In no context I said I scum read the slot for that so this by you is shading not what I said.

I'm not against you answering Bunny's question but I can't see what's wrong with STD's attitude.
And sorry for misinterpreting you. I thought that you were implying a SR on STD when you suggested his line could've been faked.

[MMR]

I'm probably overreacting.

Mastina is a slot I'd like to sort later. I think this is just what she does and if it's entirely random she's scum but if it makes some sense she's probably town. I am leaning toward the latter.

I don't think that you are overreacting.
138 definitely reads like shade, to me, coming from FA.
It's completely understandable and NAI to not understand the mech in a closed setup.
VOTE: FA
-Rubella

Let me remember to not respond to why I find something alarming next time someone asks me about it then? the statement can be NAI on its own but I didn't like the attitude shown in it so it was noted. In no context I said I scum read the slot for that so this by you is shading not what I said.

I'm not against you answering Bunny's question but I can't see what's wrong with STD's attitude.
And sorry for misinterpreting you. I thought that you were implying a SR on STD when you suggested his line could've been faked.

Above was me.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I posted the line I find that post alarming in response to mastina's almost hard townread on the slot - implying that I don't see how such a thing could give her an almost locked town read on the slot when it can be easily faked. There is absolutely no context in which you could have misunderstood it as a scum read on the slot so I can't believe you with that.

STD's becoming hard defensive about it and not engaging with me when asked about other slots was in fact over reaction but yours attempt to create a wagon over it felt way more self-aware and intentional.

and again since its being questioned - what I find alarming:

- People chatting about some mech speculations in a closed setup
- Someone dropping a line with a I don't know and don't wanna know attidue like there is something to know to make it believable they are in a not giving a f state

The IDGAF state can be easily faked. Its absolutely not deserving for that townread and has to be monitored

I think that I get you now.
When I first read 138, I genuinely thought that you were trying to shade STD by accusing him of faking confusion when to me, he felt like he actually was lost.
I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.
I need to reaccess my reads.
-Rubella

[MMR]

VOTE: Radja
Mumps thinks that we should go behind this wagon so I'll just place our vote here until I finish reaccessing my reads.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@mod

I think that Child of Fairies needs to be prodded.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I am Talia. Believe it or not, it's true. As true as the fact that Aegon the Conqueror had two wives.

Yo

VOTE: professotic

@Mastina, are you still tr this?

I don't know Yume's Town meta but the posts that PPF attached don't feel Towny to me.
So I'm starting to think that the TR on Yume might've been gut-based.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I’m definitely going to be ignoring MMR’s reads. Seriously dafuq.

I said that Yume didn't feel Towny.
Do you disagree?
-Rubella

[MMR]

I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.

That's the thing tho.

STD's town/scum meta are night/day different. And this game STD is a beacon of light. This is his towngame through and through. He's literally radiating his alignment, a shining beacon of towniness. He is town, 100%. Like, genuinely top-tier townread, town. He cannot be scum here.

Frozen Angel also has a town/scum meta that are night/day different. The asterisk to my read on FA here is that I don't know which is which.

I KNOW that FA has a night/day difference in her town meta and her scum meta.
I'm PRETTY sure that this is the night half, that this is the scum half, that this is FA as scum. But the asterisk on my read is that I might be remembering it backwards. I'm PRETTY sure I'm getting it right that this is the scum half tho.

I see.
I think that I get the lock-TR on STD more after his interactions with FA, then your original TR before so.
Though, I 100% agree that STD has noticeable differences between his towngame and scumgame based of previous games.
I'm not sure about FA though because I don't know her towngame or scumgame. I think that I'll take your word though because you seem to know her better than me.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.

That's the thing tho.

STD's town/scum meta are night/day different. And this game STD is a beacon of light. This is his towngame through and through. He's literally radiating his alignment, a shining beacon of towniness. He is town, 100%. Like, genuinely top-tier townread, town. He cannot be scum here.

Frozen Angel also has a town/scum meta that are night/day different. The asterisk to my read on FA here is that I don't know which is which.

I KNOW that FA has a night/day difference in her town meta and her scum meta.
I'm PRETTY sure that this is the night half, that this is the scum half, that this is FA as scum. But the asterisk on my read is that I might be remembering it backwards. I'm PRETTY sure I'm getting it right that this is the scum half tho.

I see.
I think that I get the lock-TR on STD more after his interactions with FA, then your original TR before so.
Though, I 100% agree that STD has noticeable differences between his towngame and scumgame based of previous games.
I'm not sure about FA though because I don't know her towngame or scumgame. I think that I'll take your word though because you seem to know her better than me.
-Rubella

she said nothing there for you to sheep it. just some meta calls. not for std and not for me. she specifically said she has no idea what she is doing with her meta read on me and you intend to sheep it cause pushing me seems like a viable strategy and townreading std seems consistent with your stance from before? she didn't even explain the meta on std and how its similar to this game.

I missed the part where she said that she had no idea.
I don't think that pushing you counts as a viable strategy if I was scum, because I'm more likely to look worse by doing so. As for STD, I think that his tone during his interactions with you feels consitent with his tone from previous games where he was Town.
The last sentence is a good point, though.

like what is happening in this game.

Was this intended as a question?
Because I feel like a lot of reads for me in this game are based off interactions.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@Maid Cafe
Could you please explain what FA did to seem obvtown?
I get how that applies to STD but FA's alignment didn't feel obvious to me.
-Rubella

[MMR]

pedit: I think the engagement from Save/FA felt genuine on both sides but being genuine isn't what people should read that engagement off of (nor do I think it's a reason to TR save but the fact so many people are from the looks of it and what I'm guessing in my own head prob just spews him town because people see anger and think it can't be faked but we're in multiball and mafia are humans so lol.) I think wolf!FA had no favors to blow up and just keep the interact with Save up as long as she did, and while I know FA as a player who loves to distance with her partners, I doubt Save is a partner due to how their posting slowly elevated, so that just makes it seem villager to me.

This is a good point.
I guess that if FA likes to distance, then a TR on her and STD makes more sense, as their interactions didn't feel like distancing. Though, it could always be that they're T/S.
-Rubella

[MMR]

17 player game should have what? 5 Non-Town at most?

I think that there should be an even number of scum because of balance issues in that the larger scumteam is more likely to fare better than the smaller one, if the total number of scum was odd.
So, I would probably assume 4 to 6 scum in a 17 player Multiball game.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@mastina
I hope you don't mind but could you confirm if FA likes to distance as scum?
I heard Maid Cafe mention it but I don't know FA's scum meta.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I hope you don't mind but could you confirm if FA likes to distance as scum?

That I don't remember. I think she might, but this ain't the 100%, this is more like a 60%.

That said, multiball, so while we can safely say distancing is plausible, actual

bussing

is not.

I see.
I agree somewhat with the concluding sentence. Assuming that there's at most 3 scum per team, it makes sense that distancing is more likely to occur than bussing. The exception, I think, being the possibility that if scum realises that their partner is a lost cause and hammers them for the sake of it not being the expected.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Mathblade replaces Korina.

Confirming my replace in. I am working so haven’t read.

Anywhere I should read on my break?

If you have enough time, it is best to read the entire game.
But if you're short of time, read from Page 6 onwards. Some people have managed to accrue reads based off interactions in those pages.
-Rubella

[MMR]

How many players were in this game? There were two scumteams of 4 in it.

I think 23.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I liked most of mastina's reads but I 100% disagree on her read on Math.
He could be wrong in his reads but I don't think that it makes him scum.
-Rubella

[MMR]

No mastina is correct. That post and your most recent posts are indicative of scum MathBlade.
~Mumps

[MMR]

No mastina is correct. That post and your most recent posts are indicative of scum MathBlade.
~Mumps

Can all of you make it clear which one of you is posting? I think Rubella is probably RH9 and are you Ircher or Roden?

No.

Either you can tell us apart, or it doesn't really matter who precisely is signing as who.
~Mumps

[MMR]

VOTE: Math
~Mumps

[MMR]

VOTE: Radja
Going back to this because I noticed my partners' reads.
~Mumps

[MMR]

@MMR hydra — Is there severe hydra dissonance? What’s going on here?

It’s vastly weird to sheep a scumread like you did.

Mumps has said in our Hydra Chat that his vote on you was independent of mastina, as he believes that this is ‘Math's scum meta’.
He changed back because I'm not entirely convinced on scum!Math.
So, sorry for the hydra dissonance.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@MMR hydra — Is there severe hydra dissonance? What’s going on here?

It’s vastly weird to sheep a scumread like you did.

Mumps has said in our Hydra Chat that his vote on you was independent of mastina, as he believes that this is ‘Math's scum meta’.
He changed back because I'm not entirely convinced on scum!Math.
So, sorry for the hydra dissonance.
-Rubella

What does Measles/Ircher think about it?

Oops.
I confused things up. Ircher thinks that it's 'Math's scum meta' not Mumps.
But I think that the vote was for the same reason.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Actually, no.
I reread our Hydra Chat and I was right beforehand.
My memory's bad.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Measles didn't say anything about the vote.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@MMR hydra — Is there severe hydra dissonance? What’s going on here?

It’s vastly weird to sheep a scumread like you did.

Mumps has said in our Hydra Chat that his vote on you was independent of mastina, as he believes that this is ‘Math's scum meta’.
He changed back because I'm not entirely convinced on scum!Math.
So, sorry for the hydra dissonance.
-Rubella

It’s not a “sorry” thing.

It’s more a I wanted to see if scum opportunist thing.

Hydra dissonance does happen but it seems to be going on a lot if you look at the post I quoted and some later posts. If you’re town I suggest you smooth that out and find points of common agreement.

I'll try to talk to the others more.
The truth is that we aren't using our Hydra Chat often enough which has not helped in a collective SR.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Actually, no.
I reread our Hydra Chat and I was right beforehand.
My memory's bad.
-Rubella

So you and Ircher think Math’s town and Roden is the one who’s sr him. Got it.

I haven’t heard any self-pitying posts about popularly yet, so I’ll take that as good sign for now. No offence @Math but if you ever do that I’ll yeet you into next week.

eta: just saw MMR’s most recent post, Ircher hasn’t expressed a read.

@Math it’s fine. <3

Actually, after triple-checking, Ircher SRs Math for "scum meta" reasons and Roden is neutral.
The vote was mainly because of Ircher's SR but Ircher forgot that I didn't SR Math and so that was why Mumps unvoted.
So TL;DR, I have Math as nulltown, Roden has no explicit read and Ircher SRs Math.
And sorry for the confusion. Mumps and Ircher posted right after each other so I assumed that Mumps SRed Math.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@T-Bone
I don't see much hydra dissonance for PPF.
Can you list some examples?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Why are these quotes broken lol?

They weren't properly formatted.
-Rubella

[MMR]

That is so weird for it to be a non biased analytical mindset. you seem to be wanting to keeping everyone happy,

Thank you for describing my playstyle.
Literally the most analytical, I've been was in my best scumgame.
As for keeping people happy, that's how I get out of arguments.
It's literally NAI for me to backtrack out of arguments and scummy for me to be analytical.
-Rubella

[MMR]

How is knowing that will help you read my slot?

I was trying to see which part of your scum meta that mastina was using to SR you.
Because meta is easy to use as a basis for a SR if there isn't anything obvscum on the slot.
And ngl I still dislike mastina's reads on Math and Yume.
Both feel too OOG based as their content respectively don't feel like they connect with mastina's reads on both slots.
-Rubella

[MMR]

You guys are literally just settling for two wagons, which is poor IMO and only leads to miss execution and more wolf agenda.

I’m town and Radja is 50/50 so you guys are just sitting on two town.

You all need to be pressuring more and doing more please.
Wolves don’t just come around and be like “Hey! Look at me! I’m a wolf!”
You gotta do something about it.

We have days to do discussion and with it you can pressure slots and get more out of it.
Don’t just waste a day and let mafia linger around gaining little to no attention at all.

You think mine and tictac’s pressure on Mastina means anything? Lol.

To a wolf all they see is a town with 4 votes on them is voting them.
That’s it.


They don’t fear something they know they can miss execute.

Fact we have 4 votes meaning we are being suspected and if it’s only us voting a wolf chances are or at least the wolf thinks that no one else is going to pressure or jump onto them cause no one cares to follow the person voting them.

It’s simple mafia facts.

I already town read this slot but this is ++town, this feels like genuine frustration with the game state. I don't think you will be voted out today though, so while I understand the worry about your wagon I don't think it indicates that scum has so much influence that they can miseliminate you.

As far as voting out Mastina today, if I felt more confident in my scum read there than our current vote in Radja, then we might follow you there. All three of us in the PT have voiced concerns about Mastina, but we agree that Radja is more likely to flip red. Personally, it's a tonal read for me rather than content, Radja's posts sound like someone who's trying to sound townie rather than actually just be townie.

-Measles

PE: Angel's interactions with Rubella running parallel to a Mastina vote gives me bad vibes.

Wow.

My bad lmao

[MMR]

I wasn't paying attention to which browser I was on

I blame the wedding burnout + getting sick immediately after combo

[MMR]

I’m thinking if Yume is scum then someone else on the Prof wagon probably is also. I would like to see more content from that slot to test my theory but until then Radja really hasn’t done anything to convince me he’s town.

*holding my breath that someone will actually respond to this post*

I had similar thoughts actually. My read rate on Enchant is bad, but I think a lack of effort past D1 is typically scum-indicative for him, so that wouldn't be a bad place to look at tomorrow along with Mastina. Scarecrow is a bit all over the place, but I think they've gotten better as the day has progressed.

-Measles

[MMR]

Measles didn't say anything about the vote.
-Rubella

Since your hydra seems so splitted, I need to know something

was it the same hydra head that voted me and changed the vote or where they two different people/other people talked to them inside your hydra? I mean the vote after STD thing that was retracted after my response

We're actually not too split atm? Early on yes, but right now our biggest disagreement is probably what we think of Math vs Mastina. Mumps is a bit more aggressive of the three heads, so that's likely what you're seeing here.

FTR, I think Math is town here.

-Measles

[MMR]

VC 1.0.5




professotic (5) Mastina, Bunnyonce, Yume, Enchant, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow [E-4]

Radja (3) T-Bone, Past Present Future, MMR

MMR (2) Frozen Angel, Maid Cafe

Enchant (1) Mathblade
Dingle Dangle Scarecrow (1) furtiveglance
T-Bone (1) Radical Rat
Mastina (1) professotic


Not Voting (3) Radja, Child of Fairies, Save the Dragons,

With 17 Alive it takes 9 to Eliminate
Deadline: (expired on 2022-10-28 10:23:41)

Radja professor unaligned

I agree, but I don't see how you're getting that from the VC.

-Measles

[MMR]

VC 1.0.5




professotic (5) Mastina, Bunnyonce, Yume, Enchant, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow [E-4]

Radja (3) T-Bone, Past Present Future, MMR

MMR (2) Frozen Angel, Maid Cafe

Enchant (1) Mathblade
Dingle Dangle Scarecrow (1) furtiveglance
T-Bone (1) Radical Rat
Mastina (1) professotic


Not Voting (3) Radja, Child of Fairies, Save the Dragons,

With 17 Alive it takes 9 to Eliminate
Deadline: (expired on 2022-10-28 10:23:41)

Radja professor unaligned

I agree, but I don't see how you're getting that from the VC.

-Measles

I would not expect two wagons on players from the same scumteam this early.

Ah, I get that reasoning.

-Measles

[MMR]

I'm probably overreacting.

Mastina is a slot I'd like to sort later. I think this is just what she does and if it's entirely random she's scum but if it makes some sense she's probably town. I am leaning toward the latter.

I don't think that you are overreacting.
138 definitely reads like shade, to me, coming from FA.
It's completely understandable and NAI to not understand the mech in a closed setup.
VOTE: FA
-Rubella

I posted the line I find that post alarming in response to mastina's almost hard townread on the slot - implying that I don't see how such a thing could give her an almost locked town read on the slot when it can be easily faked. There is absolutely no context in which you could have misunderstood it as a scum read on the slot so I can't believe you with that.

STD's becoming hard defensive about it and not engaging with me when asked about other slots was in fact over reaction but yours attempt to create a wagon over it felt way more self-aware and intentional.

and again since its being questioned - what I find alarming:

- People chatting about some mech speculations in a closed setup
- Someone dropping a line with a I don't know and don't wanna know attidue like there is something to know to make it believable they are in a not giving a f state

The IDGAF state can be easily faked. Its absolutely not deserving for that townread and has to be monitored

I think that I get you now.
When I first read 138, I genuinely thought that you were trying to shade STD by accusing him of faking confusion when to me, he felt like he actually was lost.
I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.
I need to reaccess my reads.
-Rubella

I just wanna know if there was a chat between heads for when this vote was casted, between the vote and unvote and when vote was uncasted or not

its kinda important to me

Had to double check the time stamps for this, but I wasn't around when that vote happened, just Rubella and Mumps. The unvote happened before I could comment on it, though I'd made it clear my suspicion was on Bunny at the time. Mumps didn't seem to have a major opinion about you yet, but suspected T-Bone and Radja and wanted to vote there instead, before Math then caught his attention sometime later. Rubella did want to reassess, and the unvote timing coincides with his "reassess" post in our PT.

If it matters, no one's really talking about you atm. Mainly just discussing Drapion revealing that he's TSE and how that affects meta reads/explains a few things.

-Measles

[MMR]

VC 1.0.5




professotic (5) Mastina, Bunnyonce, Yume, Enchant, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow [E-4]

Radja (3) T-Bone, Past Present Future, MMR

MMR (2) Frozen Angel, Maid Cafe

Enchant (1) Mathblade
Dingle Dangle Scarecrow (1) furtiveglance
T-Bone (1) Radical Rat
Mastina (1) professotic


Not Voting (3) Radja, Child of Fairies, Save the Dragons,

With 17 Alive it takes 9 to Eliminate
Deadline: (expired on 2022-10-28 10:23:41)

Radja professor unaligned

I agree, but I don't see how you're getting that from the VC.

-Measles

I would not expect two wagons on players from the same scumteam this early.

Ah, I get that reasoning.

-Measles

I do not.

This is multiball. If this was the same team I would agree tenuously at best

I think that's the point PPF is making. Since it's VCA I'm assuming it's the Titus head, and Professotic vs Radja being TvS or Solar vs Lunar is a read I kind of expect from her, and I don't really disagree with that idea. I don't think it's likely at all to be TvT, Solar vs Solar, or Lunar vs Lunar.

-Measles

[MMR]

I'll let her clarify then, since I interpreted her saying that they're unaligned and not on the same scum team as either TvS or Solar vs Lunar. If she's excluding Solar vs Lunar, just calling it TvS would've been the more accurate description.

-Measles

[MMR]

How is knowing that will help you read my slot?

I was trying to see which part of your scum meta that mastina was using to SR you.

Because meta is easy to use as a basis for a SR if there isn't anything obvscum on the slot.
And ngl I still dislike mastina's reads on Math and Yume.
Both feel too OOG based as their content respectively don't feel like they connect with mastina's reads on both slots.
-Rubella

If you found that out let me know as well please

yet still doesn't answer my question. why you specifically asked about distancing and what would knowing that do to sort my slot out for you without any other flips in game?

Distancing was the only part of your scum meta that anybody was mentioned so I asked mastina about it.
If I had known anything else, I would have asked mastina about them to make sure that she isn't just trying to get a easy read on you and then if you don't flip scum, use meta as a reason to weasel out.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I DO think that at least one scumteam TMI'd there being a scumteam of 3 tho--in part because of the reactions to my post, and them thinking "oh mastina scumslipped she's one of the other scumteam".

Looking forward to this.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I'm probably overreacting.

Mastina is a slot I'd like to sort later. I think this is just what she does and if it's entirely random she's scum but if it makes some sense she's probably town. I am leaning toward the latter.

I don't think that you are overreacting.
138 definitely reads like shade, to me, coming from FA.
It's completely understandable and NAI to not understand the mech in a closed setup.
VOTE: FA
-Rubella

I posted the line I find that post alarming in response to mastina's almost hard townread on the slot - implying that I don't see how such a thing could give her an almost locked town read on the slot when it can be easily faked. There is absolutely no context in which you could have misunderstood it as a scum read on the slot so I can't believe you with that.

STD's becoming hard defensive about it and not engaging with me when asked about other slots was in fact over reaction but yours attempt to create a wagon over it felt way more self-aware and intentional.

and again since its being questioned - what I find alarming:

- People chatting about some mech speculations in a closed setup
- Someone dropping a line with a I don't know and don't wanna know attidue like there is something to know to make it believable they are in a not giving a f state

The IDGAF state can be easily faked. Its absolutely not deserving for that townread and has to be monitored

I think that I get you now.
When I first read 138, I genuinely thought that you were trying to shade STD by accusing him of faking confusion when to me, he felt like he actually was lost.
I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.
I need to reaccess my reads.
-Rubella

I just wanna know if there was a chat between heads for when this vote was casted, between the vote and unvote and when vote was uncasted or not

its kinda important to me

Had to double check the time stamps for this, but I wasn't around when that vote happened, just Rubella and Mumps. The unvote happened before I could comment on it, though I'd made it clear my suspicion was on Bunny at the time. Mumps didn't seem to have a major opinion about you yet, but suspected T-Bone and Radja and wanted to vote there instead, before Math then caught his attention sometime later. Rubella did want to reassess, and the unvote timing coincides with his "reassess" post in our PT.

If it matters, no one's really talking about you atm. Mainly just discussing Drapion revealing that he's TSE and how that affects meta reads/explains a few things.

-Measles

I think your heads differences of opinion is hurting the image I'm making about your slot in my head as the multiple inconsistencies I'm detecting at some parts of your play were between different heads of your hydra or could be influenced by different heads of the hydra

I still don't get neither the vote nor unvote there by Rubella however. Felt too opportunistic on the vote and felt too fakely progressed of a thought with unvote to me.

I hadn't read the Hydra Chat when I made the vote.
I had greatly disliked the way you interacted with STD and I didn't wanted to look like I was shading you so I placed the vote.
When I read the Hydra Chat and after your latter interactions began to feel not so bad, I decided to unvote you so that I could reaccess my read.
I think that your latest posts are actually pretty good and I liked how you still tried to interacted with my slot instead of shutting down like I would've expected you to do as scum.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Math says things and I don't believe he actually thinks them

He feels kind of genuine to me.
Ngl but mastina repeatedly saying similar things on FA doesn't feel like much of a progression.
I'm going to talk with my hydra partners first but I could potentially be down for a vote on her.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Math says things and I don't believe he actually thinks them

He feels kind of genuine to me.
Ngl but mastina repeatedly saying similar things on FA doesn't feel like much of a progression.
I'm going to talk with my hydra partners first but I could potentially be down for a vote on her.
-Rubella

Your slot is probably my most confident tr in this game. Can you please elaborate some more on both of these things?

Math felt genuinely annoyed at mastina during his interactions with her. This could be scum!Math being annoyed at being caught or town!Math being annoyed at being falsely accused. I just feel like his reaction to mastina and ensuring interactions don't feel faked to me.
As for mastina's FA read, it feels like she hasn't made any effort to sort FA other than that she could be in her scum meta and that due to this one thing, FA has to be scum. It feels too confbiased and this might become a liability for us later.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Math says things and I don't believe he actually thinks them

He feels kind of genuine to me.
Ngl but mastina repeatedly saying similar things on FA doesn't feel like much of a progression.
I'm going to talk with my hydra partners first but I could potentially be down for a vote on her.
-Rubella

Your slot is probably my most confident tr in this game. Can you please elaborate some more on both of these things?

Math felt genuinely annoyed at mastina during his interactions with her. This could be scum!Math being annoyed at being caught or town!Math being annoyed at being falsely accused. I just feel like his reaction to mastina and ensuring interactions don't feel faked to me.
As for mastina's FA read, it feels like she hasn't made any effort to sort FA other than that she could be in her scum meta and that due to this one thing, FA has to be scum. It feels too confbiased and this might become a liability for us later.
-Rubella

I don't believe that she is confbiased. I just dont think she intends to solve my slot and is pretending to show her read more than what it is to act like she is confbiased.

if that makes sense.

I think that you might be right.
As PPF pointed out, mastina has made a case on Math but not on you.
I've talked to my hydra partners and they both think that mastina's meta read is scummy.
VOTE: mastina
-Rubella

[MMR]

Same story here.
I know FA has a night/day difference between her towngame and scumgame, same way StD did back then.
I am pretty sure that I know which is which, at 90%, same as back then for StD.
But I haven't had the time to do the research YET. It took weeks, closer to MONTHS, for me to find the time to do that for StD.

And here, it hasn't been weeks closer to months for FA, now, has it?
So, I WILL do the research. When I have the time. I just haven't yet, because, y'know.
Too much rl shit.

I'm pretty sure that this is the scum half for FA tho.

I see. Thanks for explaining.
But why have a meta read before the research?
I mean why SR FA based off meta that you're not sure on and say that you're 90% sure.
I don't really get why you've based a read on FA off this when you could've waited for the research and read FA on her content until then.
But then, maybe this is just a playstyle clash.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And if you truly think she is wrong, then explain WHY you think she is wrong. Like, list all of the reasons each and every player she called scum aren't scum. You think none of them are actually scum? Prove it!

And I know what your next post will be 'I am not gonna do that because I am right and I don't have to prove anything to you or anyone else yadda yadda yadda'. Which would be the exact shit you're accusing her of.

Okay the simple answer:
1) I have been working to build a town block with people since the start of the game. It’s incredibly important I do.
2) My meta read on FA is in direct discrepancy with Mastina and it’s that she’s likely town.
3) I have been collaborating with TBone throughout the game phase and I like what I am getting back.

Mastina’s reads are unexplained where you can see I have been desperately trying to back seat this game and note agreement constantly.

Her scumreads are literally all my TRs.

I called professor town and the wagon would dissolve and I was right.

Like the game is literally matching every expectation I have if my reads are correct

Mastina is a bunch of “cuz I said so”

Not good enough for me. Explain why you townread each of them, and explain it thoroughly.

And by that, I mean that I want at least one reason you think each of them is town, not this broadsweep shizz.

What I mean is, do a '[name] is town for X, Y and Z reasons'. Can you do that?

This is an absolute bonkers demand from someone who didn't start playing the game until ten minutes ago. You get the effort you give.

-Measles

[MMR]

VOTE: professotic

Well, as for why I voted, I am sheeping mastina, plainly. Because while I still feel somewhat betrayed, at the end of the day, I still respect her skills.

Vote prof.



The Hypnotoad compels you to.

We have a mountain of conversation to look through regarding Professotic's alignment, but none of it gets addressed. Instead we get "sheep Mastina with me or I'll get mad".

But Math has to thoroughly case every single one of his town reads or Yume will "disappointed".

Yume is not actually playing or solving, this just feels like a desperate attempt to save a scum buddy.

-Measles

[MMR]

Look idc how much you discredit your own wolf games, it doesn’t stop you from being a wolf using any excuse you can find to justify how you “aren’t a wolf”


Your entire meta shit this entire game is fake and wrong.

I'm a bit curious. How does this differ from mastina's other games? It seems like she does this kind of stuff every game.

A few thoughts:
1) I like this votecount format, the lines between the wagons helps a lot.
2) 4 of my townreads are on Mastina but I don't think it's a good vote still. Pre-empting the 'why wouldn't scum get on' argument, I feel like they don't really need to.
3) Radical Rat's vote for T-Bone may be worth following because both slots seem to be null/scum for a lot of people, and they aren't on a team.
4) I was/am assuming 13/2/2 in terms of the numbers, maybe with a recruit or something. 11/3/3 seems too scumsided if both teams have a kill.
5) I would like more votes on Maid Cafe, but I'm also happy to lend traction to other wagons by voting: Radical Rat/T-Bone (preference T-Bone), Bunnyonce, Yume, Child of Fairies, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow or Enchant.

A voice of reason in a storm of conflict. Town.

Clearly /sarcasm (obviously sarcastic)

Can you explain what role Mastina thinks you're crumbing? Do you know? Is this something I 'wouldn't understand'?

No I can’t.

I can however know she is incorrect in my role due to some posts she made.

Without outright claiming and explaining, I can’t explain more.

So you two definitely know each other are scum but can't say why.....and you both have the same mysterious and OP power role.

I have said why Mastina is scum. Several times and the fact there’s a wagon means I am doing a decent job.

And no. Mastina is arguing we have similar roles in order to try to get me to claim.

If we actually had similar roles she wouldn’t care and the problem takes care of itself.

Based on what she had said I find it highly unlikely we have the same role.

What if Mastina is a different power role and has misinterpreted your cryptic crumbs?

Possible but I find that unlikely.

She’s hyper focused on me to almost the exclusion of all else.

If she was a town power role I don’t think she plays this how she has.

This is a bad assumption.

am on my phone exhausted after an extremely long day.

Post 18 doesn’t imply a 1-2 cult member team.

I don’t get why you’re highlighting it in bold. It’s a joke you sometimes do where you open as scum/town or a random alignment.

The 6 is considered weird because it’s oddly specific as previously explained

I am quoting this because this is a shorter post but know my next comment is in response to #729 and not Mathblade.

#729 is absolutely bonkers.

VOTE: Mastina

I might change it back to Radja as I catch up but this bad deed cannot go unpunished.

I don't disagree with this.

Well, as for why I voted, I am sheeping mastina, plainly. Because while I still feel somewhat betrayed, at the end of the day, I still respect her skills.

Town.

REJOICE! For your SAVIOR is--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi I am a maso--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi, I am town.

(Okay but for real, I intend to be a BEACON this game, REVEALING the TRUE COLORS of all.)

shifty is patent protected btw.

I am Talia. Believe it or not, it's true. As true as the fact that Aegon the Conqueror had two wives.

Who is talia?

This is fascinating though and I want to say it loud what most probably thought about too:

Meg, is there any public information about Dusk/Dawn phases? Are they different?

Both Dusk and Dawn function as normal Mafia game eliminations, as well as Noon and Night function as normal mafia game night phases. They are functionally identical except they are distinct.

So it seems that Noon is the night phase for the Solar cult and the night is the night phase for the Lunar cult. In other words, based on flavor we can guess that the cults are even/off phase mechanically. But guess we'll see when we go

Anyways missed you, my friends. long time no see <3 been a while since I played a game here

VOTE: Bunnyonce

I like this post from FA here. Seems incredibly honest. Whether honest town or honest scum tbd but willing to give honest town for now.

Here you go.

I townread FA for getting into what I feel is mech spec that makes sense. It’s clean and concise and well laid out. It’s clear that it’s a hypothesis and not absolute. I can follow the premises made directly and I feel like I am in FA’s shoes.

Wow, this is a bad take!

Like I get you think Mastina is a good player and you like her on a personal level or what not.

But what inspired you to want to vote me and why do you believe I am a wolf?

I have none yet. If you knew me as a player, you would know this.

Why did you post a hypno wolf to vote prof unless you scumread prof.

If you do why?

The answer is obvious.

VOTE: professotic

Well, as for why I voted, I am sheeping mastina, plainly. Because while I still feel somewhat betrayed, at the end of the day, I still respect her skills.

Vote prof.



The Hypnotoad compels you to.

We have a mountain of conversation to look through regarding Professotic's alignment, but none of it gets addressed. Instead we get "sheep Mastina with me or I'll get mad".

But Math has to thoroughly case every single one of his town reads or Yume will "disappointed".

Yume is not actually playing or solving, this just feels like a desperate attempt to save a scum buddy.

-Measles

This is typical from Yume. If anything, it's very slightly +Town for Yume.

I'm pretty sure most of my reads are in contradiction with my hydra partners' reads, which is fine, but I'm putting that out there. I'm not going to be overruling them because I'm not paying as much attention.
~Mumps

[MMR]

And I have seen her pull this as scum

And no it’s not worth effort to find it

Because I am pretty convinced you’re scum defending scum so any reasoning won’t matter

Why isn't it worth an effort?
Wouldn't it be helpful for us to know?
-Rubella

[MMR]

And this is similar to what mastina was doing but she's explained why and if I'm not misinterpreting, promised to do research.
Though, I still dislike the formation of the meta read before she did research.
As for Nancy, I feel like she could be pocketed rather than scum defending a partner. I remember that she behaved similarly when she was pocketed by Taly in LOST.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Catching up.
Happy scumdays, FA and Scarecrow!
-Rubella

[MMR]

I have a kill list. It's Maid Cafe, T-Bone, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow, Enchant mostly.

Why is Maid Cafe and T-Bone on the kill list?
I get the others but those two don't exactly seem that scummy based off what I've read.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Can we please stop making this game a miserable slog to read through

Do we really need 20+ pages of AtE back and forth that's literally getting us nowhere

-Measles

[MMR]

I envy your power.

-Measles

[MMR]

POV: We will let Yume check mastina and Yume claims "I am RBed by mafia, mafia doesn't want me to clean mastina" and we will repeat it again and again, before everyone die.

I predicted future. Now let's give mastina one day and look at my oracle powers.

I somewhat disagree with this.
We're risking too much on hoping that Yume will follow through her plan.
However, I don't know Yume well so if somebody who does says that Yume can be trusted, I'm OK with the plan.
Though, I think that it would be good for us to at least have an elimination so that our solving can be aided.
-Rubella

[MMR]

POV: We will let Yume check mastina and Yume claims "I am RBed by mafia, mafia doesn't want me to clean mastina" and we will repeat it again and again, before everyone die.

I predicted future. Now let's give mastina one day and look at my oracle powers.

I somewhat disagree with this.
We're risking too much on hoping that Yume will follow through her plan.
However, I don't know Yume well so if somebody who does says that Yume can be trusted, I'm OK with the plan.
Though, I think that it would be good for us to at least have an elimination so that our solving can be aided.
-Rubella

This is 99.9999% Yume!town here and I don’t see why they’d make this claim unless they were intending to follow through with it.

I obviously want Mastina limmed if they’re scum. I just don’t think they are but considering Yume has a way of determining Mastina’s alignment and considering she claimed some important tpr role, I don’t see how it hurts us? But don’t take my word for it. Ircher also knows Yume can be trusted.

I see now.
I guess that we can trust Yume then.
-Rubella

[MMR]

TBH I'm liking Yume's latest posts.
I don't think that scum would just change their mind like this, when not doing so feels more beneficial.
-Rubella

[MMR]

By "everyone claiming to be able to read" you, are you referring to the people on your wagon that are strongly SRing you like Math and professotic?
By the way, why is Bunny in the same tier as RR in your readslist?
I don't feel like Bunny has been that scummy unless I missed some of their posts in my skim-through of the thread.
-Rubella

[MMR]

By "everyone claiming to be able to read" you, are you referring to the people on your wagon that are strongly SRing you like Math and professotic?

You apparently didn't read very well.

everyone claiming to be able to read me

thinking I am scum

, is either scum lying their asses off or town that was delusional. Because

the people who actually

can

(the likes of PPF, Yume, DDS), have me as one of their strongest townreads

.

I don't see how that can be more clear?

The people claiming to be able to read me who have me as town are right, and accurate.
I believe those four players to be credible in their claims to be able to read me well. (Notably, you may note that furtive is not on that list in spite of him townreading me, because he lacks that credibility.)

I don't know the alignments of the people claiming to be able to read me who have me as scum--but since I am town, those claims are wrong. That leaves exactly two possibilities for them. They're scum lying their asses off or town whose metrics on how to read me were just outright wrong.

I've stated which players I feel to be which.

I get it now.
I read the part on thinking that you were scum but I forgot to write that in my post, by mistake.
Sorry for making you bold your post.
-Rubella

[MMR]

By the way, why is Bunny in the same tier as RR in your readslist?

Because both are likely scum, and probably partnered at that.

I see.
Could you link some of those posts?
I feel like RR and Bunny haven't interacted that much that could point to them being partnered.
Though, Bunny's vote on RR might need a bit more explaining.
-Rubella

[MMR]

What's the current voting at? Can we get a counter wagon going or are we just done?

I don't think that much counterwagons have taken off.
I guess that either people want the Day to end or they are SRing mastina the most.
-Rubella

[MMR]

why t-bone has to face consequences of a mastina mislim if its a mislim hypothetically?

That's a good question.
I'm not mastina but I think that T-Bone has been somewhat vocal and mastina doesn't have him as scum like with you, or nullish-scum as with Math.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Because to an outsider perspective, T-Bone's hop-on looks "weak", and "opportunistic".

What makes you think this?
I feel like you're one of the first people to describe his vote as this.
I get that T-Bone claimed to be the tipping point and that might draw attention to him but from my POV, T-Bone's vote doesn't feel like the description of what an outsider would think.
-Rubella

[MMR]

What's the current voting at? Can we get a counter wagon going or are we just done?

I don't think that much counterwagons have taken off.
I guess that either people want the Day to end or they are SRing mastina the most.
-Rubella

I do want this day to end, it's boring and no one's listening to me.

It's still the first day and I think that a lot of people's attention has been placed onto Math and mastina. Hopefully, Day 1 will be different.
-Rubella

[MMR]

By the way, why is Bunny in the same tier as RR in your readslist?

Because both are likely scum, and probably partnered at that.

@Bunny
What do you have to say about this?
-Rubella

[MMR]

I feel like RR and Bunny haven't interacted that much that could point to them being partnered.

That's

exactly

why they ARE (likely) partnered.

No seriously.

This is a multiball game.

"haven't interacted that much in ways that can point to them being partnered" is exactly what scum in multiball strive for.

Individually, I think both have decent odds for being scum;
Neither of them look like they're not scum with the other;
With neither as being a particular point of pressure, that kind of interaction suggests both scum together. Bunnyonce's vote on RR is fairly halfhearted especially given the wagon on me and no real effort from Bunnyonce to dismantle it. So the RR vote is fairly performative. Bunnyonce wasn't voting RR while there was a more competitive gamestate with multiple wagons, when RR votes had a chance to gain traction. Bunnyonce's vote on RR happened only after my elimination gained enough momentum to become almost an inevitabilitBree.

I see.
I think that I get it now.

Because to an outsider perspective, T-Bone's hop-on looks "weak", and "opportunistic".

I feel like you're one of the first people to describe his vote as this.

Sure, because it wouldn't happen on D1.

It'd happen in the D3-D6 range, thereabouts. Someone would go back to the mastina mislim, note T-Bone's presence there, compare that to others, and think those things, with the time removing the clarity from the wagon I have now.

Currently nobody might say that, but down the line they would.

I see, though why would people want to do this?
It feels pretty obvscum to me to deliberately return to a Day 1 wagon to get T-Bone eliminated over voting you.
Also, would you say that scum would be more likely to attempt that?
-Rubella

[MMR]

By the way, why is Bunny in the same tier as RR in your readslist?

Because both are likely scum, and probably partnered at that.

@Bunny
What do you have to say about this?
-Rubella

I did read

mastina

's reasons for suspecting our slot and I think it has more to do with me than Aisa.

Mastina

seems to believe that scum me likes to play it safe and reserved, which isn't necessarily true. It's not as easy to predict my alignment. In my last scumgame, which I lost, I went for a rather proactive approach (Newbie 2100). I am more reserved in this game than usual, because a) work; b) very high volume of posts. Nonetheless, I do talk with my hydra partner daily and we exchange info on the gamestate all the time, so sometimes we speak for one another.

I still think that town!

mastina

could have gotten that meta read and it doesn't look contrived for the purpose of shading our slot.

~Greeting

I see.
I do remember your scumgame as being pretty proactive, but I think that you're usually proactive in general, so that's NAI.

If I ever host a Theme game, I am doing post caps.

For the record, that wouldn't actually impact me.

I have less posts than you would assume. T-Bone literally has more than me. 6/16 players have higher post counts than me. I'm literally only the seventh-most-active poster in the game.

I just always SEEM like the most active poster because I'm like a signal boost for activity in games.

Every game I am in causes the actual top posters to post more, and there's a night and day difference in posting activity between pre-mastina-death and post-mastina-death; activity drops off a cliff after I die because I am a source of activity in spite of it not being reflected in post count.

That's one of the reasons I like being mastina normally. That's the mastina affect. mastina's approach makes people be forced to be more active, basically. I just can't keep being her right now.

I agree with this.
I feel like Math's posting increased after your initial interactions with him.
(By the way, is it NAI for him to do this?)
-Rubella

[MMR]

If we are scum, why wouldn't we want to yeet you out of the game instead? At this stage of the game more attention is given to the players who are not voting you rather than your wagon. As scum we have little to gain by defending you, I just really believe that this matches your town meta. Aisa might be townreading you less than I am, but you're probably a townlean for her at least.

I agree.
By the way, what do you define as mastina's town meta? Based off my skim-through, it seems that people have somewhat different interpretations of what town!mastina is supposed to look like.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Wait, furtive, can you get back on Scarfman?
I was going to vote them to make a mini wagon. I have, like, a mini gut townread on DDS.

VOTE: Scarfmanship

Also: Ydrasse you legend

-Aisa

That's super weird

Yeah cause bunny is desperately trying to save their teammate Mastina and MathBlade needs to realize this fact.

Why does scum!mastina draw attention to scum!Bunny though?
It doesn't make sense, considering that she's the leading wagon.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I see, though why would people want to do this?

Have you played in a mafia game's midgame?

People don't necessarily

want

to do it, they just DO it. In the midgame. At a time people are beginning to look back at the earlier sections of the game to try and improve the town's fortunes, either clutching a win or staving off a defeat. In the midgame, there is enough distance from the original events to forget current feelings on the subject, and to forget the context around a situation, and to make it easier to accidentally take things out of context and view them too hard in isolation, which makes nuances to situations become harder to detect.

Lack of nuance, lack of accuracy in reading T-Bone's alignment, because to read T-Bone as town from his push on me requires a LOT of nuance. Nuance lost in the midgame thanks to distance from D1.

Also, would you say that scum would be more likely to attempt that?

Situationally? Sure. But in general it's usually town.

Town players in the midgame go back to review the earlier sections of the game.

D1 is currently the current game, but during the midgame, D1 will be "the earlier sections".
So in the midgame, they will go back and look.

It's not like players are immediately on D2 going to instantly gun for T-Bone--of course they wouldn't. D2 has D1 still fresh in their minds. They wouldn't have forgotten the nuances yet. But come ~D4 or so, and with how goldfish town players' memories are, yeah, they'll have forgotten the nuances behind T-Bone town. And it's at

that

point they'd see it as opportunistic and weak. Even though it's neither.

I have played in a midgame before but in my experience, Town hasn't done what you described.
This might just be that in general, I play in games with too much guilties and everybody seems to be focusing on that sort of thing, instead of reviewing D1's wagons. Or maybe it's because my memory's just bad.
I get your point but I still don't get why Town will specifically look back onto the tipping point of a D1 wagon.
(Especially, since the game may eventually progress and T-Bone hasn't felt scummy at all, in this game.)
-Rubella

[MMR]

What did Mastina do in this sequence of events to draw attention to Bunnyonce?

In 1595, she deliberately brought attention to scum!Bunny by commenting on how their interactions with RR, could be aligned.
Most players at that time, apart from I think, prof, weren't SRing Bunny that much and if mastina was scum, she could've just left Bunny in the dark and put her focus elsewhere.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Like professor FA and RR are my ride or die towns
TBone is probably town but I get paranoid

Everyone else I can sort with the block tomorrow.

Why do you get paranoid of T-Bone?
He feels genuinely like he's trying to solve the game.
It feels kind of inline with his play in LOST.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Like professor FA and RR are my ride or die towns
TBone is probably town but I get paranoid

Everyone else I can sort with the block tomorrow.

Why do you get paranoid of T-Bone?
He feels genuinely like he's trying to solve the game.
It feels kind of inline with his play in LOST.
-Rubella

Good question. It’s more a gut thing.

My brain agrees with you.

Like I am absolutely 100% scumreading Mastina and am very confident in the solve.

I just have a bit of “what if I am wrong feelings”. I don’t think I am wrong to be abundantly clear.

Like all my research and everything indicates such.

Dealing with work fires atm so slow to respond if anyone else asked me something I will try to get to it later or poke me.

I see.
TBH I don't SR mastina as much now, especially after her latest posts. I'm mainly keeping my vote on her because I think that one of my hydra partners feel more strongly and I feel like it's better for an elinimation to happen, then none. Also, I don't really SR Scarf.

And regarding lost I barely could read that game

I’d read a post then reread it and each time it felt something different

I was in such a sick haze that game that I eventually replaced out but then kept up with it.

Sorry for reminding you about LOST.
I thought that you played very well and you probably were one of the scum who I TRed for the entirety of while you were in the game.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Wolves hard defending each other.

Nancy was pocketed by Taly and you thought that they were scum together.
Are you certain that this is scum!PPF and scum!mastina, not town!PPF being pocketed?
-Rubella

[MMR]

@prof, no? Here is my current list. Greeting is the expert on his opinion so he can tell you about his reads when he is online.

Townread

MathBlade
Yume
furtive

Townlean

STD/Ydrasse
Scarf
mastina

Everyone else is sort of a shrug. Yes, I know I said I had a mini gut read on DDS as town, I don't feel like it's based on enough evidence to move them officially into the townleans.

-Aisa

Wait.
Is most of the others null, then?
Or am I missing your SRs?
-Rubella

[MMR]

It’s fine to remind me. I just don’t think I will be much help in using lost as an accurate meta source or agreeing with anything.

You could tell me someone posted 500 times and pigs flew and I’d be like yeah okay sure

Tbh her latest posts only reinforce the scumread so *shrug* she doesn’t feel very solvey at all.

I agree with most of this.
But, I don't get the last sentence. I feel like while most of her reads seem still somewhat "set in stone" (this is what Measles said when I asked about placing the vote on her), she seems to have finally placed her attention off you and that's an improvement.
-Rubella

[MMR]

(By the way, is it NAI for him to do this?)

Oh certainly!

There's basically five MathBlade models.

1: MathBlade is scum, and tries to convince me he is town. This is the least-common of the five, which is ironic, because it's the most effective at deceiving me. But as scum, MathBlade genuinely doesn't think to do this most of the time. Mostly trivia tho because we're not in this world.
2: MathBlade is town, and tries to convince me he is town. When this happens, I tend to think it's the first model, which is ironic because the first model is something he almost never does. Mostly trivia tho because we're not in this world.
3: MathBlade is town, and is convinced I am scum. He becomes irrationally certain of it and will not budge.
4: MathBlade is scum, and panics at my suspicion on him.
5: MathBlade is scum, and pretends to be the third model--he knows how irrational his town self is, so he plays into the bit, exaggerating it slightly and embracing the push.
(4 and 5 tend to go hand-in-hand, but are not fully one and the same.)

Objectively I realize the third has a quite high likelihood of being true.
But like--by gut, I feel like the fifth is the actual truth because it

feels

like MathBlade is exaggerating.

Yes, I know that anything "MathBlade surely couldn't think this as town", actually MathBlade can.
But it's like--it's not so much that MathBlade can't think those things, so much as it is, I feel like a town MathBlade wouldn't.
That there's a chance he did, but everything he does is just that: a chance of being MathBlade-town, but feeling statistically unlikely.

The statistical unlikelies pile up.

Say something was 40% from MB town.
A different thing is 40% from MB town.
A different thing is 35% from MB town.
A different thing is 45% from MB town.

Those begin to add up and create a world where in order for MB to be town, you have to believe that MathBlade did them

all

as town, rather than just one or two.

And those things are quite numerous. MathBlade's posts feel like he's aware of his meta's worse aspects and deliberately exaggerating them for the towncred and to get away with being anti-town. That he's aware he could do all the things he is doing as town, so is doing them, even though if he were town he wouldn't actually be doing them.

That's what he feels like.

Please explain how a read wall of statistics about me is moving away from me?

I missed this post in my skim-through.
Though, I think that it was because she was responding to me or I feel like she might've moved away from you, completely.
I might move her down in my reads a bit but I feel like most of her other posts had been not about you.
So, it's still an attempt and I think that she has potential to fully move away, even if she hasn't rn.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Bunny does this sum up your readslist?
Mastina - PPF (Lock Towns)

I'd like to know why you thought this was a worthwhile post.

Wolves hard defending each other.

Assuming this is directed at us, how exactly does your theory fit into my latest unvote?

-Aisa

I think that Drap (who I'm assuming to have made those posts) is confbiased.
He's done that before to me and Mumps, in LOST, whch eventually lead to him faking a guilty and getting us mislimmed. (All's forgiven, though.)
So I would expect that it is going to last for a while.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Wolves hard defending each other.

Nancy was pocketed by Taly and you thought that they were scum together.
Are you certain that this is scum!PPF and scum!mastina, not town!PPF being pocketed?
-Rubella

This isn’t the same at all. I have had very little experience playing with scum!Taly. In Labrynth they were aggressively over-confident, so I thought they had to be town because they were the complete opposite of that. Perhaps scum!Taly is most likely on the two opposite ends of that spectrum?

Anyway, Mastina is a completely different case. Unlike Taly, I have played numerous games with Mastina as both alignments and as I already stated and proven by my post from Doubles that I am extremely good at tone reading her. It’s extremely frustrating that I’m not getting believed because of my wrong reads on Taly and OtH in that game. :/

I'm not trying to criticise your read on mastina.
I just feel annoyed that Prof seems to be ignoring that you could be pocketed and that you defending mastina doesn't make you partnered.
Sorry for your frustration.
I'll try not to be influenced by LOST in my future reads.
On another note, I dislike prof's vote on Bunny.
He's using Greeting's SR on Math to attack Aisa's TR on Math.
It's not like hydra heads must all have the same read.
Either that or he hasn't been reading Bunny's posts.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Actually my comment about the Math/Mastina read thing might not completely hold.
Since Greeting’s was the one who said they TR Mastina higher and not Aisa.

However, even so I think they should have had a similar read in that regard or have talked about it?

Hydra dissonance is a thing.
For example, rn I don't SR mastina as much as Measles while Mumps doesn't SR mastina as much as me.
Also, previously both of my hydra partners didn't SR FA when I did.
This could equally apply to Greeting and Aisa.
Greeting could SR one thing but Aisa TRs that.
The result is that their reads contradict and sorting them based of their reads becomes harder.
Which is why I'm finding their dissonance NAI.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Wolves hard defending each other.

Nancy was pocketed by Taly and you thought that they were scum together.
Are you certain that this is scum!PPF and scum!mastina, not town!PPF being pocketed?
-Rubella

This isn’t the same at all. I have had very little experience playing with scum!Taly. In Labrynth they were aggressively over-confident, so I thought they had to be town because they were the complete opposite of that. Perhaps scum!Taly is most likely on the two opposite ends of that spectrum?

Anyway, Mastina is a completely different case. Unlike Taly, I have played numerous games with Mastina as both alignments and as I already stated and proven by my post from Doubles that I am extremely good at tone reading her. It’s extremely frustrating that I’m not getting believed because of my wrong reads on Taly and OtH in that game. :/

I'm not trying to criticise your read on mastina.
I just feel annoyed that Prof seems to be ignoring that you could be pocketed and that you defending mastina doesn't make you partnered.
Sorry for your frustration.
I'll try not to be influenced by LOST in my future reads.
On another note, I dislike prof's vote on Bunny.
He's using Greeting's SR on Math to attack Aisa's TR on Math.
It's not like hydra heads must all have the same read.
Either that or he hasn't been reading Bunny's posts.
-Rubella

Well you’d think he’d be recessing that read considering he wrongly deathtunnelled me in LOST. Anyway, I feel pretty damn confident that I’m not wrong. I would be really shocked if Mastina didn’t flip town here because to me it’s just so extremely obvious that this is her towngame.

Can you link/quote the post where Greeting srs Math?
I just ISO’d them and I couldn’t find it.

I do agree with you that it would be expected for Drap to reaccess.
I'm pretty sure that it was in 1048.
P-Edit: On a reread though, I missed part of his post. Greeting thinks that Math is scummier than mastina, not Math is scum.

[MMR]

To be clear the P-Edit was a continuation of my original post and not addressed to Math.
Also, above was me.
-Rubella

[MMR]

To be clear the P-Edit was a continuation of my original post and not addressed to Math.
Also, post above Math's was me.
-Rubella

EBWOP

[MMR]

By the way, what is everybody's opinion of prof's pivot to Bunny?
-Rubella

[MMR]

I still don't get why mastina and Bunny are partnered.
It feels like a lot of the reasons are based off Bunny's posts, ignoring mastina almost completely.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I probably missed it but could anybody explain which parts of mastina's posts feels partnered with Bunny?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Look at Bunny’s response to Furtive’s read on Mastina or whatever.

Also look that Bunny defended Mastina a little bit by saying they town read them more then math to discredit math.

Could you link the first one?
I don't exactly think that SRing Math more than mastina counts as discrediting.
It's like me saying I SR mastina more than Math. Am I discrediting mastina now?
I think that you oversimplified Greeting's post. The main problem in his post was not the SR of Math but his belief that mastina's actions made sense and that Math's interactions with mastina were therefore concerning to him.
-Rubella

[MMR]

At least, this is how I interpreted his post as saying after my last reread.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@Prof, if Mastina flips town, which I’m extremely confident she will, what will your solve be then?

I’m hoping people will actually trust me on this and while I really appreciate MMR defending me as a possible pocket, I honestly don’t believe history is going to repeat itself because I strongly believe I’m right on Mastina.

I hope that you're right.
TBH I'm talking with my hydra partners rn on moving our vote off mastina. Mumps has agreed to it but I'm still waiting on Measles to confirm.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I don't want to see mastina fall through here.

If we must, we must, but this really does look like a clear cut case to me, and moving seems to be mostly performative at this point

I understand but I feel like the way that the game is going, every wagon that has been formed keeps on falling apart.
I think that there are too many vanity wagons and I feel like nobody's willing to sacrifice a TR.
That's why I'm not moving my vote rn but if the wagon on mastina falls apart, it'd be good for us (in reference to the hydra) to reach a compromise on a non-mastina wagon.
And a main reason for me wanting to move off mastina in the first place, is because I have a stronger read on another slot now while my read on mastina is becoming weaker.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Observing where people vote for now.

I'm not against doing mastina today because I want to see what Yume will do in absence of mastina, and it frees up mathblade's shot. Keeping mastina alive feels like a waste because no matter what Yume says mastina is marked for death by mathblade, and it will be a shitshow if the check comes back as anything but guilty.

I somewhat agree on the last line.
I feel like most people have expressed a read on mastina by now, and an innocent could cause a lot of discussion.
Which is good, because discussion is helpful for solving the game, and solving the game will help us win.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@Prof, if Mastina flips town, which I’m extremely confident she will, what will your solve be then?

I’m hoping people will actually trust me on this and while I really appreciate MMR defending me as a possible pocket, I honestly don’t believe history is going to repeat itself because I strongly believe I’m right on Mastina.

I hope that you're right.
TBH I'm talking with my hydra partners rn on moving our vote off mastina. Mumps has agreed to it but I'm still waiting on Measles to confirm.
-Rubella

I'd rather keep our vote on Mastina. This Day should've ended awhile ago but got frozen because of replacements, and in that time there's been a pretty blatant desperation to take advantage of that to counter wagon Mastina. Like if everyone had just become apathetic and settled for a Mastina elim then I'd think it's suspicious, but the amount of kicking and screaming over her wagon just makes me think that this is the right wagon to push through. Especially since every single defense of Mastina has been pretty awful and based on meta that isn't even accurate.

A Professortic counter wagon would likely be high info, but if they somehow end up getting flipped first I'm gonna be really annoyed. I don't want Mastina to wiggle free and cause another 70 pages of pointless arguments and AtE spam tomorrow when I'm much more confident she flips red than Professortic.

[MMR]

@Prof, if Mastina flips town, which I’m extremely confident she will, what will your solve be then?

I’m hoping people will actually trust me on this and while I really appreciate MMR defending me as a possible pocket, I honestly don’t believe history is going to repeat itself because I strongly believe I’m right on Mastina.

I hope that you're right.
TBH I'm talking with my hydra partners rn on moving our vote off mastina. Mumps has agreed to it but I'm still waiting on Measles to confirm.
-Rubella

I'd rather keep our vote on Mastina. This Day should've ended awhile ago but got frozen because of replacements, and in that time there's been a pretty blatant desperation to take advantage of that to counter wagon Mastina. Like if everyone had just become apathetic and settled for a Mastina elim then I'd think it's suspicious, but the amount of kicking and screaming over her wagon just makes me think that this is the right wagon to push through. Especially since every single defense of Mastina has been pretty awful and based on meta that isn't even accurate.

A Professortic counter wagon would likely be high info, but if they somehow end up getting flipped first I'm gonna be really annoyed. I don't want Mastina to wiggle free and cause another 70 pages of pointless arguments and AtE spam tomorrow when I'm much more confident she flips red than Professortic.

-Measles

[MMR]

Observing where people vote for now.

I'm not against doing mastina today because I want to see what Yume will do in absence of mastina, and it frees up mathblade's shot. Keeping mastina alive feels like a waste because no matter what Yume says mastina is marked for death by mathblade, and it will be a shitshow if the check comes back as anything but guilty.

I somewhat agree on the last line.
I feel like most people have expressed a read on mastina by now, and an innocent could cause a lot of discussion.
Which is good, because discussion is helpful for solving the game, and solving the game will help us win.
-Rubella

I legit do not trust Yume having a check is the problem. Like that’s how much I feel Mastina is scum.

Is anyone actually taking Yume's claim seriously? They broadcasted to scum that can green check two players, why would scum not roleblock or kill/recruit Yume tonight? Their result is useless.

-Measles

[MMR]

By the way, since everybody knows now, I was annoyed with prof before, over Bunny being a mastina partner.
I disliked how Drap based the solve off Bunny's posts while not commenting much on mastina's.
It felt similar to his PPF read, which I also disagree with being in the solve.
But I'm open to be proven wrong.
-Rubella
P-Edit: Recruting/killing isn't confirmed.

[MMR]

At least one of recruiting or killing has to exist, the set up says that scum have factional abilities.

-Measles

[MMR]

For example, if anybody can explain what

mastina

has been doing that makes her scum with

Bunny

and

PPF

, then maybe I could be enticed to change my mind.
But from reading through the previous cases, I hard disagree with that part of Drap's solve.
The other part seems plausible.
-Rubella

[MMR]

At least one of recruiting or killing has to exist, the set up says that scum have factional abilities.

-Measles

I'll reply in our Hydra Chat but for a summary to the others;

¤ Solar Cult and Lunar Cult - These are the two scum factions. They have nonstandard factional abilities and are not neccisarily identical. Although they are flavored as cults, conversion abilities are neither confirmed nor denied to exist.

This means that the scum doesn't have to have the conventional killing/recruiting type of thing.
-Rubella

[MMR]

¤

Each non-town faction

wins when they make up half the remaiming players, and the other scumteam is all eliminated.

This makes me heavily doubt that scum have zero killing power in a 17 player multiball game. Otherwise there wouldn't be a need for one scum team to eliminate the other scum team in order to win the end game.

Though the main point I made of "Yume still gets roleblocked tonight for publicly claiming an alignment check PR" doesn't really change.

[MMR]

¤

Each non-town faction

wins when they make up half the remaiming players, and the other scumteam is all eliminated.

This makes me heavily doubt that scum have zero killing power in a 17 player multiball game. Otherwise there wouldn't be a need for one scum team to eliminate the other scum team in order to win the end game.

Though the main point I made of "Yume still gets roleblocked tonight for publicly claiming an alignment check PR" doesn't really change.

-Measles

[MMR]

Like professor FA and RR are my ride or die towns

Funny those are the slots topping my kill chart.

Are all the names there scum?

I'd like to think so!

But there's no world where they're all town.

I agree.
I dislike prof's push off a Bunny/PPF/mastina scumteam.
-Rubella
P-Edit: VOTE: prof

[MMR]

she is purposefully refusing to engage with me to avoid giving more context for the logical case/reasoning I have for my vote on her and to not have to drop her fake confbiase

there is absolutely no other reason not to.

I'm not moving away from her until I find something even more promising or if I get something actually promising from her

I dunno.

Every other post isn’t Math scum and it’s content.

So she is delivering something readable and it isn’t the scum tunnel and quit she’s done in the past

Granted that content

might

be scum content

But it’s loads better than what was previously done

I think that this fits with my opinion of mastina right now.
Her content has improved and I think that this might be either town!mastina letting go or scum!mastina changing her play.
I'm leaning towards the former, though the main thing that I'm still a bit annoyed about is that we haven't seen the results of the FA meta research.
But I'm probably just impatient, given that if mastina was to do that, I'll probably feel more convinced of town!mastina.
But then, I can't read mastina and I have to admit this.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@FA
Why am I scum with mastina?
-Rubella

[MMR]

@FA
Why am I scum with mastina?
-Rubella

well I scum read you for other reasons

"with mastina" part is not what I'm comfortable saying

but that post gave extremely distancing vibes. math unvotes "you agree but you want her to meta case me but you have doubts but you cant read her well but you still scumread her" just doesn't feel genuine to me. its more like you want to have options based on how things go there

I said that I'm leaning towards town!mastina, which is intended to be interpreted as nulltown.
I genuinely can't read mastina well.
I've literally TRed scum!mastina and SRed town!mastina before.
So you're half-right that I'm adapting. As I read more, my reads change.
-Rubella

[MMR]

DDS, what is your opinion of prof's 1742?
-Rubella

[MMR]

whats your main scum read right now?

I thought that you could tell from my vote.
It's prof. I explained it in 1791, 1794, 1811, 1813 and 1843.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Can someone please do a VC? We should be careful about immediately hammering.

There have been a lot of votes.

I think that rn prof's at E-3, and the leading wagon.
-Rubella

[MMR]

VOTE: professotic

I'm wiling to try it. I haven't liked their weird confidence, plus someone else said they were mafia based on the meta of which heads were posting.

Someone(MMR?) said earlier that we don't know if there are two scumteams or if it is just flavor. Judging by the rules post, which says that the scumteams (plural) win condition requires the other team to be dead and that mod given information is true I'm thinking there are 2 teams.

I don't remember who but I don't think that it was us.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Assuming prof.
-Rubella

[MMR]

VC 1.0.15




professotic (6) Mastina, Bunnyonce, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow, Past Present Future, Scarfmanship, Yume [E-3]

Mastina (5) Frozen Angel, MMR, T-Bone, Radical Rat, Maid Cafe,

scarfmanship (1)furtiveglance,
Frozen Angel (1) Radja,
Bunnyonce (1) professotic,


Not Voting (3) Enchant, Ydrasse, Mathblade,


With 17 Alive it takes 9 to Eliminate
Deadline: (expired on 2022-11-01 13:00:17)

@mod

The VC is wrong.
We're voting prof, not mastina.
-Rubella

[MMR]

VC 1.0.15




professotic (6) Mastina, Bunnyonce, Dingle Dangle Scarecrow, Past Present Future, Scarfmanship, Yume [E-3]

Mastina (5) Frozen Angel, MMR, T-Bone, Radical Rat, Maid Cafe,

scarfmanship (1)furtiveglance,
Frozen Angel (1) Radja,
Bunnyonce (1) professotic,


Not Voting (3) Enchant, Ydrasse, Mathblade,


With 17 Alive it takes 9 to Eliminate
Deadline: (expired on 2022-11-01 13:00:17)

@mod

The VC is wrong.
We're voting prof, not mastina.
-Rubella

Probably best to PM Meg with the game speed

Thanks for the advice!
-Rubella

[MMR]

@mod

I'm going on V/LA until 4 Nov
-Rubella

[MMR]

Has prof explained what mastina did to be aligned with Bunny, yet?
I'm not unvoting until I know that the push on Bunny wasn't just focused on Bunny's posts.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Has prof explained what mastina did to be aligned with Bunny, yet?
I'm not unvoting until I know that the push on Bunny wasn't just focused on Bunny's posts.
-Rubella

Maybe try reading instead of faking cause I already stated my opinion on that long before I voted Bunny.
Me and Math were talking about it, where were you for that interaction? Clearly not reading it.

I was offsite for the past three or pages.
You never mentioned what mastina did, or if you did, you could've just pointed to it instead.
It's been Bunny for like your entire push.
It's clear that you think that Bunny is making mastina partnered with them.
And no I'm not faking, I genuinely don't get why you're not trying to work with me.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And if you are actually Town, which I don't think, it is especially good for you to collaborate because Mafia isn't a game with one Town player.
-Rubella

[MMR]

That'll be the last thing from me until my V/LA ends.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I don’t think Prof is scum anymore but I would like to ask tictac why Mastina’s recent posting hasn’t affected his read on her at all.

UNVOTE:

for now

cuz she's mastina.
she's fully capable of looking town if she chooses to.

Nah. She can fake it for a while, but she'll slip up eventually.

Has prof explained what mastina did to be aligned with Bunny, yet?
I'm not unvoting until I know that the push on Bunny wasn't just focused on Bunny's posts.
-Rubella

Maybe try reading instead of faking cause I already stated my opinion on that long before I voted Bunny.
Me and Math were talking about it, where were you for that interaction? Clearly not reading it.

This is overly aggressive and flat out rude.

They say a picture can say a thousand words but MathBlade has already used half of them. Instinct tells me to read that as a positive for him being town but shrug

MathBlade always spam. I don't see how that's a +town thing for him. In fact, I think the opposite.

My own rule of thumb is that highposting bodes well for more townies barring a highposter having some sort of value beyond just well, posting

I understand this take is without context, but you play enough of these games and you start to notice patterns. Does anyone believe that the notated users have any scum equity? Open question

professotic's post count is too low to be town considering they are a hydra.

Yume on the other hand is clearly town given her post count.

Pls don't freeze the deadline again this day has been far too long lol

I don't believe it is fair to a replacement to have less than 2 days to assess the game before coming to a deciscion, in general, especially considering today's length. The freeze at 4 days was only because of a player completely being absent from the game for so long (due to me overlooking their absence on accident). Any future freezes will occur with 2 days left and not before. It's the most fair way I know how to handle it.

Just update the deadline if you get a replacement before it expires. Otherwise, let the deadline keep trickling down.
~Mumps

[MMR]

Can anybody catch me up?
I know that I said that I wasn't going to post anything until my V/LA is over but I noticed that mastina is the leading wagon again and there are way too many pages to read.
Also, is Drap still confident on a PPF/Bunny/mastina solve? TBH I think that his other solve has a higher chance of being correct than this.
-Rubella

[MMR]

RR claimed burn doc.
So it’s back to either Mastina or someone pick and push a wagon.

I am trying to get apathetic slots to push someone but I am dangerously scared of no elim at this rate.

People aren’t caring to push anyone.

Ah. Cool.
I hope that an elimination happens.
I still somewhat SR prof but Drap's curtness makes me think of LOST and tictac seems all right.
(Though, tictac was pretty agreeable and helpful as scum in NQNM II.)
I'll talk with my hydra partners and make a decision, once my V/LA is over.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Well, I see no reason to continue. We'll all be rehashing the same argument, unless one side gives in.

VOTE: mastina

I am sorry, but sometimes sacrifices need to be made.

Yume is officially locktown now.

~Mumps

[MMR]

UNVOTE:

I'm going to look over all this with fresh eyes tomorrow. MathBlade's role apparently being complementary takes away from my suspicion it's a scum investigative, though I do still think mastina's play has been scummy... I don't know, but I'm not going to figure any of it out without sleep.

Wait.
Is there another Investigative now?
Both me and Mumps are really behind.
Measles also seems kinda busy so I have no idea what happened since my V/LA began and what Math told me yesterday.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Also, PPF lied about selling apples.

Really?
We tried to investigate them last Night and we received no result.
Measles think that this could be due to our Loyal modifier.
-Rubella

[MMR]

? Can you explain your post to us more?

Assuming that you're talking to us, we're a Loyal Rolestopper.
-Rubella

[MMR]

? Can you explain your post to us more?

Assuming that you're talking to us, we're a Loyal Rolestopper.
-Rubella

Why would you protect us over claimed prs?

Mumps and Measles wanted to see your reaction.
We're actually Loyal Neapolitan.
I guess that your reaction means that you're Town.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Also, PPF lied about selling apples.

Really?
We tried to investigate them last Night and we received no result.
Measles think that this could be due to our Loyal modifier.
-Rubella

? Can you explain your post to us more?

Assuming that you're talking to us, we're a Loyal Rolestopper.
-Rubella

Why would you protect us over claimed prs?

Mumps and Measles wanted to see your reaction.
We're actually Loyal Neapolitan.
I guess that your reaction means that you're Town.
-Rubella

Wait hold up.

You're Loyal, got a no result, and decided that makes PPF Town?

That's a scumclaim isn't it?

It isn't a scumclaim.
It isn't impossible for PPF to Town Ascetic or if we got blocked.
The Loyal modifier doesn't make PPF scum unless it can be proven that the above was false.
-Rubella

[MMR]

MMR’s claimed target doesn’t make sense either.

Can you explain why PPF?

Mumps and Measles wanted to investigate PPF after it was confirmed that your role was related to the scum.
Don't ask me about why they decided to do that.
-Rubella

[MMR]

TBH I don't like RR's immediate response of ignoring blocks.
-Rubella

[MMR]

It isn't a scumclaim.
It isn't impossible for PPF to Town Ascetic or if we got blocked.
The Loyal modifier doesn't make PPF scum unless it can be proven that the above was false.
-Rubella

Shouldn't the most obvious solution be pursued first?

That's what my hydra partners think.
-Rubella

[MMR]

VOTE: MMR

Hypothetically possible you were blocked, but in that case why claim at all?

If you're not sure your check went through, and you townread the target enough to discard the maybe-guilty on those grounds, why wouldn't you just try again later before claiming?

I wanted to see everybody's reaction.
And I think that mastina slipped having a similar role.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Also what makes you think my role is “confirmed” to have something to do with alignments?

Meg's announcement that you would've vanillaised the Solar Cult if you had been eliminated in the place of Bunny.
PPF's D1 push means that it's unlikely that they're Solar.
I know this doesn't make them conftown or confscum.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And, when did mastina claim?
I missed pretty much everything that happened in D1 since my V/LA began.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Also, why are there people assuming that we're mech whizzes?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Oh you mean that announcement…that’s a stretch :/

It was mostly the idea of Mumps.
He wanted to see if PPF was Town or Lunar. (He strongly believed that PPF couldn't be Solar.)
-Rubella

[MMR]

I hope that this makes it more clear why we ended up targetting PPF.
T-Bone would've been my pick for a target.
-Rubella

[MMR]

What did unwnd do?
Also, your previous post was direct towards Mumps, right?
-Rubella

[MMR]

So confession time... I've read very little of Day 1 and do not intend to read it.

As to why PPF, it's because it is the sensible choice. Like if I was being selfish and thinking only in terms of my own reads, I would check MathBlade because he has a very high chance of being scum, but checking MathBlade is not the practical choice. He is not practical because if he is scum, we don't gain any new insight. Past Present Future on the other hand is 1) unlikely to get killed if town 2) hard to scum read as either alignment 3) a constant presence in the thread. Understanding their alignment allows us to understand the overall game state.

~Mumps

[MMR]

There is no guilty check, right? Someone clarify that for me.

The slot won't clarify.

Yes, MMR seems to be quite deliberately avoiding fullclaiming the specifics with an entire paraphrase of their role.

I wonder why?

What do you think that we should do, then?
Each night, we target a player to see if they're VT or not. If they're not Town or our action doesn't go through, we get no result.
Though, I did forget one thing.
We're informed that at least one of the scum has a role almost identical to us.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I’m rolefishing now but that sounds like not a good response to loyal neowhwyeber

Yeah neither is MMR not voting for PPF

It’s why I wanna elim one and vig the other.

What happens if one of us flips Town?
I think that you should save your vig shot on mastina if you eliminate us today.
Because, once we flip, it should be obvious that mastina's role has a high chance of being scum's equivalent of our role.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Tl;Dr I don't think that PPF should be vigged over mastina.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Current mastina wagon definitely contains teammates of MMR and/or PPF. If we hit scum today, that's where I'd recommend a dayvig go, were it up to me.

What makes you think scum won't bus?
Last time, I saw scum bus, Town ended up losing.
Surely, scum might do that again?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Why is everyone continuing to ignore the obvious elephant in the room. MMR is saying they and Mastina can’t have a similar role if I’m understanding this correctly?

Unless there’s an unknown scum role that is similar to their claim and I would like more discussion about that because I don’t know what to make of it if no other role should exist.

Anyway, I don’t like unwnd who understands mech is not commenting on that at all.

I'm saying that mastina has a high chance of being scum with a similar role.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@MMR, what is the specific name of your role? You claimed loyal neapolitan, correct? So where then is the informed part of it?

I forgot to include that in my original claim.
We're

Town Astrologer

.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Ideally a person both Mastina and MMR TR so then they’re both incentivized for the townfirm but not me. Someone who has longevity.

Got that.
And seeing that mastina also claimed Astrologer (I missed that.), I guess that she could be Town because it wouldn't make sense for scum to receive a fakeclaim which is also a TPR.
I'll talk with my hydra partmers before we decide on a vote.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Ideally a person both Mastina and MMR TR so then they’re both incentivized for the townfirm but not me. Someone who has longevity.

Got that.
And seeing that mastina also claimed Astrologer (I missed that.), I guess that she could be Town because it wouldn't make sense for scum to receive a fakeclaim which is also a TPR.
I'll talk with my hydra partmers before we decide on a vote.
-Rubella

Didn't you say you were informed scum had a near identical role? Why would your conclusion be mastina's Town because she isn't fakeclaiming instead of her being scum because she's you? Also Loyal isn't in your name, but Limited IS in mastina's. That discrepancy seems important to me.

It really does just look more and more like you don't believe your own claim...

It's because Loyal is embedded in the role.
And yes, I said that scum had a near identical role, but that doesn't mean that only mastina can be it.
I just doubt scum claims a CCable flavour.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Who are your TRs? Outside of Mastina and PPF and me?

I wouldn't say that PPF and mastina are TRs; both are nullish.
RR could be Town because they seem to genuinely want to solve the game, even though they're not right.
I think that T-Bone and Enchant can also be Town.
I don't really have a read on most of the others.
-Rubella

[MMR]

MMR, you are able to check someone tonight, right?

Would you be willing to do someone like tbone/myself/enchant tonight? Or like, ydrasse?

I only noticed these posts now.
I can check somebody tonight. I'll probably go with a TR.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Each night, we target a player to see if they're VT or not. If they're not Town or our action doesn't go through, we get no result.
-Rubella

I can check somebody tonight. I'll probably go with a TR.
-Rubella

I meant SR.
It was a slip of the tongue.
-Rubella

[MMR]

VOTE: Mathblade

Is this a serious vote?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Hey I'm on page 153 and I am currently unable to play for circa 4-6 hours. (I can be around at around midnight tonight.)

But MMR's claim is definitely not a real one here.

MMR is NOT an Astrologer.

Based off of my role, I know they're bullshitting.

How do we know that this can't also apply to you?
Either way, I definitely agree with Math that at least one of us should be vigged tomorrow.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And actually, I think that we should target each other if we both survive today.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I've been lightly skimming, and this seems to be the right play simply because MMR's claim actively conflicts with both mastina and PPF?

It doesn't.
It only conflicts with mastina.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And actually, I think that we should target each other if we both survive today.
-Rubella

Nope

Both should target same person. Don’t care who besides me.

Then both should get same results. Claim in first post,

I think that we should target DDS then.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I've been lightly skimming, and this seems to be the right play simply because MMR's claim actively conflicts with both mastina and PPF?

It doesn't.
It only conflicts with mastina.
-Rubella

You're Loyal and your action didn't work on PPF

What reasonable explanation do you think makes PPF potentially not scum?

We could've been blocked or PPF could be Ascetic Town.
-Rubella

[MMR]

PPF has already claimed not ascetic unless I'm misremembering
You're not a sensible roleblock target when there are already powerful claimed PRs, and even if you were, that explanation should be much less likely than 'the Loyal part of my role worked as intended'

I see.
The TR on PPF was only testing reactions.
I thought that it was obvious that I wouldn't TR a slot just from their response.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And I don't TR them anymore.
-Rubella

[MMR]

DDS, what is your read on Toog?
Something about them voting Math and then instantly unvoting when asked if it was serious, feels somewhat off.
-Rubella

[MMR]

By the way, mastina, why are we scum with furtive?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Hey, uh. I kinda checked out late Dusk 1, but I saw that we had a guilty result last night and figured there wasn't much to say today. Fully intended to stay checked out until I saw Rubella mention we were probably getting mis-elim'd in the hydra chat. I asked why and started skimming and uh...yeah idk why we aren't voting PPF. I thought we had a guilty, since it doesn't make sense for scum to block us instead of a claimed PR, and an unclaimed Ascetic modifier from PPF would still just be a scum claim.

VOTE: Past Present Future

-Measles

[MMR]

Why you didn't say you was informed

I made up the Informed part based off information inferred in our role PM.
I thought that claiming Informed would make people pay more attention to it and think about it if we got flipped.
-Rubella

[MMR]

But I'm not Roden.
So your point is void.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Anyways, I never consulted Roden with the claim.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Why you didn't say you was informed

Because we're not. I gave the ok to do a reaction test but I had no idea what the reaction test was actually going to be. I cannot reiterate enough that I don't understand what the fuck happened here.

[MMR]

Why you didn't say you was informed

Because we're not. I gave the ok to do a reaction test but I had no idea what the reaction test was actually going to be. I cannot reiterate enough that I don't understand what the fuck happened here.

-Measles

[MMR]

I'm not here to discuss claims. What else would people like from our slot?
~Mumps

[MMR]

So confession time... I've read very little of Day 1 and do not intend to read it.

As to why PPF, it's because it is the sensible choice. Like if I was being selfish and thinking only in terms of my own reads, I would check MathBlade because he has a very high chance of being scum, but checking MathBlade is not the practical choice. He is not practical because if he is scum, we don't gain any new insight. Past Present Future on the other hand is 1) unlikely to get killed if town 2) hard to scum read as either alignment 3) a constant presence in the thread. Understanding their alignment allows us to understand the overall game state.

~Mumps

Interesting why do you think I have a very high chance of being scum?

I mean you’re wrong but why?

75% of it is how you played on replacing in. The other 25% is the night 1 reveal.
~Mumps

[MMR]

PPF has already claimed not ascetic unless I'm misremembering
You're not a sensible roleblock target when there are already powerful claimed PRs, and even if you were, that explanation should be much less likely than 'the Loyal part of my role worked as intended'

I see.
The TR on PPF was only testing reactions.
I thought that it was obvious that I wouldn't TR a slot just from their response.
-Rubella

testing reactions from who

Rubella can elaborate better, but my understanding is that we were mainly testing PPF's reaction.
~Mumps

[MMR]

So this is where I reveal my shifty eyes: MMR, you said you are able to check someone tonight. When you roleclaimed you can check one person each night.

The next phase is not night. It's noon.

It's per night. We are used to normal mechanics where night is every other phase; we cannot target this upcoming phase.
~Mumps

[MMR]

Intent to vote MMR which will likely result in hammer as people said they are sheeping me will move

Get last thoughts in soon. Probably 30 minutes ish til I vote

This hardly qualifies as intent to hammer. Standard protocol is generally 24 hours.
~Mumps

[MMR]

Intent to vote MMR which will likely result in hammer as people said they are sheeping me will move

Get last thoughts in soon. Probably 30 minutes ish til I vote

This hardly qualifies as intent to hammer. Standard protocol is generally 24 hours.
~Mumps

What

What I am saying is that this is merely MathBlade posturing. If he truly wanted to give us time to give final reads, he would give at least 24 hours.

Anyway, my reads (which are totally not vetted by my partners) is something like PPF, mastina, and MathBlade are all scum. Yume, furtive, Dingle Dangle, Enchant, and T-Bone are town. No opinion on everyone else.
~Mumps

[MMR]

I'm pretty sure someone else claimed to be astrologer as well but don't remember who/when

That would be us.
-Rubella
P-Edit:
What Enchant is saying.
-Rubella

[MMR]

What do you think then about Mastina also being an astrologer, MMR? That was her claim on D1 and I don't know if she modified it because her posts are very difficult to read lol

I didn't read mastina's claim until we claimed.
It would be odd if Astrologer was a mod-provided safeclaim so if she made up the flavour, she probably did it by herself.
However, I don't know her well.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Imagine you are Town Astrologer informed about fact there's scum with role you have, you see someone claiming Limited Town Astrologer and you doing nothing with it.

I didn't see her claim until way after our own claim.
-Rubella

[MMR]

I find it unlikely that two roles exist on the same faction with same utility

I see.
So, you're suggesting that at least one of us is not Town?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Can't wait to lim MMR and find out they flipped scum as a reaction test in the dead thread

You're being sarcastic, right?
-Rubella

[MMR]

Just to be clear: does anyone think Mastina/MMR could both be their claimed roles? I don't.

I don't either. I'm inclined to believe mastina more because she gave more info, was consistent about it, and did it first, but there's no way both of their roles exist as claimed.

Ok but why would MMR, as scum, fakeclaim the same role as someone else, forcing them into a 1v1? Surely they would claim a different role?

I didn't know that mastina claimed Astrologer.
So it's NAI as even if I was scum, I wouldn't have claimed a different role.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Not sure why my vote is on PPF.

It was on MMR when I left

I think that Meg doubled counted.

I don’t have time to read anything that happened

Can anyone tldr me?

In 4102, mastina asked you to ISO Firebringer and if you SR him, vote him.
Then, unwnd upset her and things got heated.

T-Bone made a great point on how roles aren't AI in 4164.
T-Bone continues to be a beacon of light in 4165.
-Rubella

[MMR]

An elim on anyone else leaves the game in way too toxic a state imho

Can you expand?
-Rubella

[MMR]

id rather not vote MMR if for only reason it was what mastina wanted. And mastina had her way yesterday

mastina preferred an unwnd elimination or yours.
-Rubella

[MMR]

That was one of the last things she said.
-Rubella

[MMR]

@MMR why would you call the player who’s suggesting you botched your fakeclaim “a beacon of light?

And why bother mentioning the Mastina/Fire thing unless you have an actual opinion about it?

The first thing is that T-Bone is displaying a Town mindset. He is making observations and working from there.
The second thing was because Math wanted a summary and I decided that he needed to know mastina's request.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Elimming PPF was acceptable earlier.

We really need to elim MMR.

May you enlighten me?
I don't get your logic.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Elimming PPF was acceptable earlier.

We really need to elim MMR.

May you enlighten me?
I don't get your logic.
-Rubella

Mainly I think you’re scum.

There’s worlds (I don’t agree with) that PPF can be town and Nancy is trying to cooperate

I think you’re all three scum and PPF elim is you don’t elim cops before guilties

So either is good.

I see.
But if we're all scum, do you think that we are on different scumteams?
-Rubella

[MMR]

And eh.
I feel like DDS chaging votes could be an attempt to create a stalemate.
-Rubella

[MMR]

And eh.
I feel like DDS chaging votes could be an attempt to create a stalemate.
-Rubella

You express a negative view of our slot any time we do something against yours

I'm pretty sure that you said that you were against stalling the day.
However, your votes don't seem to align with your view.
This gives off the impression that you're could be trying to create a stalemate.
-Rubella

[MMR]

Why is unwnd scum with us?
-Rubella

[MMR]

My priorities are

Accurate elimination > not stalling > waiting for replacements

Just because I want the day to end doesn't mean I stop caring who the elimination is

I get it now.
-Rubella

[MMR]

By the way, Math, what makes you think that we're unaligned with DDS?
-Rubella

[MMR]

So my guess is that you’re a scum astrologer who hit Mastina and got Solar

What makes you think that we targeted mastina over PPF?
Otherwise, why would scum!us even bother claiming a fake result on a fake target?
-Rubella

[MMR]

So my guess is that you’re a scum astrologer who hit Mastina and got Solar

What makes you think that we would target mastina over PPF?
Otherwise, why would scum!us even bother claiming a fake result on a fake target?
-Rubella

EBWOP