Warrior Cats Mafia [Game Over!]

[the worst]

hi friends

i have something like,

duck
freedom
lukewarm (apparently dann disagreed p heavily with this bc he thought val's entire iso was ali-theatre)
ss
furtiveglance
cephrir

a like cursory glance tells me that cephrir is probably most likely (underwhelming action around scum wagons, poor reads on flipped scum), but i don't really trust Nor's contributions and furtive kind of feels like they're kind of just hangin out and i don't have a read on it.

can we jam about ss a little? i think this resembles his towngame and if anyone has a stronger read than me i'd love to hear it.

[the worst]

there's some weird magic going on where i don't actually think scum have really been bussing? flipped scum had decent theatre d1 w [fire,catboi] and [ali,everyone] but none of it has been

antagonistic

theatre. i feel like if val was theatre, it was almost like, deliberately bad theatre which doesn't really fit my vibe for this scumteam. consider, if you will for a moment, that scum have really not bussed in a meaningful way

FINAL VOTE COUNT

[10]

T3

:

Titus

,

KittyTacky

, Dannflor,

Datisi

, NorwegianboyEE, Charloux,

Mistyx

,

Marashu

,

Enchant

,

SCRRRDBEAR

[3]

Titus

: Cephrir,

PenguinPower

,

fireisredsir

[2]

KittyTacky

: Something_Smart,

Bell

[1]

Alisae

: Val89
[1]

Charloux

:

catboi

[1]

Mistyx

:

T3

[1]

Not voting

:

Alisae

FINAL VOTE COUNT

[8]

MathBlade

:

SCRRRDBEAR

,

Mistyx

,

PenguinPower

, Freedom,

flow trap

,

Bell

,

Enchant

,

MathBlade

[1]

Datisi

: Cephrir

[6]

Not voting

:

Datisi

, Toogeloo, Dannflor,

fireisredsir

, Something_Smart, boy next door

math was p caught out so i'm not sure this is super meaningful. interestingly while i'm rereading this i don't actually feel like toog's defence of math feels all that aligned? anyone feel like cross checking this?

FINAL VOTE COUNT

[7]

fireisredsir

:

Mistyx

,

Bell

, Freedom, Cephrir, Dannflor,

PenguinPower

,

Datisi

[1]

boy next door

:

SCRRRDBEAR

[1]

Cephrir

:

fireisredsir

[4]

Not voting

:

flow trap

, Toogeloo, Something_Smart, boy next door

FINAL VOTE COUNT

[5]

JunkoChan

: Lukewarm, Freedom,

Bell

,

JunkoChan

, Cephrir
[1]

Dannflor

: furtiveglance

[2]

Not voting

: Dannflor, Something_Smart

now that i'm thinking over this i feel like we're probably actually looking for a solitary busser who bussed reasonably well but i thought it was pretty interesting that both t3 and fireisredsir had 0-1 bussers!

one thing i'm really wary about w nor is that he had a wagon for most of d1, but then at the 11th hour the mastina wagon sprung up which has been revealed to be p heavily scum motivated. i'm on the fence about whether it's actually worth scum coming out to play this hard this early to save nor but it's got me thinkin.

FINAL VOTE COUNT

[11]

mastina

:

Shiro

, Dannflor,

fireisredsir

, Val89,

Bell

,

PenguinPower

, NorwegianboyEE,

Alisae

,

Titus

,

Marashu

,

Mistyx

[5]

KittyTacky

:

catboi

,

Datisi

, Cephrir, Something_Smart, Charloux
[2]

NorwegianboyEE

:

mastina

,

KittyTacky

[1]

Datisi

:

SCRRRDBEAR

[1]

Bell

:

Frozen Angel

[2]

Not Voting

:

T3

i'm kind of deliberating whether there was another scum on kitty or another scum on mastina, they were both pretty surreal wagons in retrospect so i'm not really sure.




sorry this is probably not the explosive start anyone was expecting, i'm washed up and this game is hard.

[the worst]

thanks for reading, basically

- if anyone has any strong reads on SS/[nor,bnd,lukewarm] slots i'd love to hear them. if i had to gamble the game on it on short notice i'd call SS town.
- if anyone feels like going over toog's comments around the mathblade guilty i also don't really feel like they look particularly aligned with mathblade. that feeling surprises and alarms me.

i'll be back later!

[the worst]

sorry, it's not easy having so many thoughts arm wrestling in my brain. i am interested in thoughts on both of your slots i suppose, i did mean nor/toog/furtive there tho.

[the worst]

How much of the game did you manage to read over the night?

er like, most of it, in disconnected chunks

any reason in particular for this question

[the worst]

How much of the game did you manage to read over the night?

er like, most of it, in disconnected chunks

any reason in particular for this question

It seemed odd that the basis for sorting my slot in your posts were revolving around Val's interactions with Ali instead of me, yesterday, single handedly stopping your slot from being eliminated and killing Junko instead.

Seems like the More Alignment Indicative Thing lol

So I was trying to see if you had read that part of the game yet.

i noticed that you were on point yesterday but didn't clock you being so significant, thanks for that!

i'm actually pretty wary of a busser atm so that isn't like massively helpful in keeping me comfortable abt you, sorry. a lot of stuff scum do late in the game is to try and squeeze through *just* enough elims to be the last person standing, so unfortunately i think that seems like a sensible thing to do regardless of your alignment (lest risking town chaining junko=>you, in a world where you're scum together).

that said i don't really think it's you anyway. hopefully this explains why i'm more focused on earlier in the game tho

[the worst]

If we think this scumteam decided to run weird_interactions.exe then furtive as scum fits best

Or we can go with this "weird interactions except we ignore cephrir entirely" option I guess

yeahhhh this is basically where i'm at

like, it's super easy to vote you and push you and assume you're scum. you've had some off associations and i can't really find anything clearing.

that said the more i drill down the more i just feel like it's kind of a default and i don't feel great about defaulting given how sneaky this scumteam has been >_>

[the worst]

VOTE: Cephrir

alright since i'm doubling down on pocketing ceph - i've seen that you think it's him or me, but can you talk thru why you actually think ceph is the last scum?

are you going for him first because it's easier / i'm a big scary duck, or do you think he's genuinely higher scum equity?

[the worst]

when/who was that?

[the worst]

oh interesting. 2243 is kind of paradoxical (like, over-justifying a null scum read on someone because they aren't really going anywhere is..very funny) in a way that feels like it actually has fairly limited cognitive load.

if you're scumbuddies those are really good posts

[the worst]

what's your take on SS?

[the worst]

i'm like, super washed up. he's definitely tired w this game so it's kind of hard to get a vibe check and i'm a fair bit less confident than i'd like to be >.>

who do you have down as town?

[the worst]

ss doesn't vote much, but he vote camped kittytacky pretty heavily - need to check to see how satisfied i am that he really really wanted that lim. unless nor is scum he's also exclusively voted town / nobody this game which is ... something to note, i guess, given i would regard his town game as better than random.

other than a vanity vote from shiidaji/t3 on d1 and the fake guilty shenanigans he's also hardly been voted (and basically all by town). i need to compile a list of who actually reacted to the fake guilty, flow trap did obviously but it was kinda whatever.

VOTE COUNT 6.2

[3]

Something_Smart

: Bell, PenguinPower, flow trap
[1]

flow trap

: Cephrir
[1]

boy next door

: SCRRRDBEAR
[1]

SCRRRDBEAR

: boy next door

[5]

Not voting

: Freedom, Datisi, Toogeloo, Dannflor, Something_Smart

VOTE COUNT 6.1

[3]

Something_Smart

: Bell, SCRRRDBEAR, PenguinPower
[1]

flow trap

: Cephrir

[7]

Not voting

: flow trap, Freedom, Datisi, Toogeloo, Dannflor, Something_Smart, boy next door

his reaction to the faked guilty was kinda towny as well

ruhuhgeuhg i'm trying to critique my nulltown read but i don't feel wrong

[the worst]

i'm town if that helps. freedom is my strongest tr for sure, i feel like furtive should be more readable than he is

any feelings about luke?

pedit: i do not blame you my brain is knots

[the worst]

and i've been here like 8 minutes !!

[the worst]

this gamestate is so weird too, like

you're burned out and unsure where to go
ss seems burned out and largely surprised we hit scum yesterday
furtive seems burned out and has largely decided it's you or me

luke seems engaged and obviously influential in hitting scum yesterday which is.. significant, i think
freedom is just rly towny i think

pedit: are you saying we should clear you for pushing junko through?

[the worst]

that is a small point against u ;p

[the worst]

honestly, i don't think scum!you has a responsible action plan

other

than bussing junko.

i also happen to just think your slot is town though so like. i think this is largely moot.

[the worst]

interesting - i'll bump my d7 reread up the priority list. i think assuming that dannflor of all people rolls over and that you can pull off another miselim without losing junko seems kind of ill-advisable. i think losing junko without correcting associatives a bit makes it very hard for you to survive endgame.

mostly just a thought exercise tho it just didn't seem like a great reason to lock you in the first time around

[the worst]

cool, we're of like minds

you don't seem upset rn cephrir, so i'm going to say it then move on: this setup sure has a lot of hoods.
i think regardless of the solution there's an asymmetrical element which is really cool, etc., etc.
i do think there's a better than random chance of at LEAST the leader chat having scum influence in it, being [me, freedom, furtive].

that's all. this is a stupid argument and in no way useful for finding scum or damning. i'd just feel remiss not saying it ever.

[the worst]

Spoiler: only open postgame

FREEDOM IS SCUM AND WE ARE ALL DOOMED

[the worst]

if i had two bullets right now i guess i'd shoot furtive then myself. or honestly weirdly probably ss. this game is very surreal.
@luke hbu?

[the worst]

I am really struggling to see how anyone has me anywhere other then their single highest town read right now tbh, so seeing both of you not have me there is pretty shocking ngl

You replaced into a slot that needed rehabilitation and you rehabilitated it but I haven't shaken yet the idea that you were in a spot where you had to do this

Then you and I have wildly different views of the game state, because a Melo with me and junko both alive, needing 1 miselim inside of you or SS to seal out the game seems like it would have been a cake walk of a game lol

i disagree with this but i think that you believe it and i think you're creeping up in my reads lool

[the worst]

reverse-reverse-reverse psychology strikes again

[the worst]

money where my mouth is, i guess.

VOTE: furtiveglance

pedit: aw u <3 get in here

[the worst]

mmhm mhm that's really validating because i was kind of wondering about windclan interactions given my fear of scum density in there

[the worst]

@Lukewarm, thanks I did feel like it was fake interaction, maybe because i'm missing what happened in their hood

(I haven't read my hood btw) that shit is 30 pages long but I'm guessing from expereience that if something iomportant happened there it should be a reference to it in the OT so I'm not reading there for now

did you feel like junko really cared all that much about your response?

[the worst]

not a loaded question - reading back i don't really have a solid read on junko's tone. how much she cared can be an indicator of being opportunistic or being relieved etc.

[the worst]

yeah. i do think that's within the realm of s/s interactions and is probably slightly more likely to be s/s than what i was considering.

that being saiddddd i don't have many choices other than indulging you, so using freedom as a sanity check is a solid idea. lol.

pedit:

that

is interesting. i was also very wary that catboi hand-waved nor pretty early as "returning player, likely to be less excited if scum" without addressing the fact that nor was clearly having an absolute party itt.

[the worst]

sigh,.... what if i'm just assuming val is town because i'm a lazy human and i don't want to outguess the one and only alisae.

like, i think freedom is advancing the game in a constructive way, i think.

the world that makes the most sense to me rn is [furtive,junko] and furtive was not banking on needing to solo through 3 miselims

[the worst]

gotcha. i'll change my mind at least 180237 times before this game ends, but right now i'm respectably confident that ceph is town fwiw.

[the worst]

ayy fingerguns
my goal is to find a solve that doesn't *necessarily* require me to be alive at endgame (aka. hard mode)

if this is one of those games that town wins by vibing into f3 then voting their townread, it's probably not a game that town will win.

[the worst]

what ?? i thought i had you pocketed

[the worst]

gosh i know right, luke has this... voice, which is both commanding but also so soothing. i stand no chance.

[the worst]

290

im not like super confident on it but i think he feels like town val to me

spewed town

I find this more convincing than your quote post above. Val likes a big spam contest with scumbuddies

@furtive would you mind expanding on this a bit too please? you've got it stuck in my head lol
you seem very comfortable with freedom as well, do you think this is explicitly unlikely to have come from scum!val? bc this seems like it should kind of be a red flag?

[the worst]

VOTE: Cephrir

alright since i'm doubling down on pocketing ceph - i've seen that you think it's him or me, but can you talk thru why you actually think ceph is the last scum?

are you going for him first because it's easier / i'm a big scary duck, or do you think he's genuinely higher scum equity?

The defeatist stuff fits with JunkoChan self-voting more

how so?

[the worst]

Lukewarm replaced Val right? They seem town by play now, but they didn't yesterday.

yeah look i get wires crossed REGULARLY, i meant to say you seem quite comfortable with luke town lol

can you expand on what you were talking about re. val a bit?

[the worst]

VOTE: Cephrir

alright since i'm doubling down on pocketing ceph - i've seen that you think it's him or me, but can you talk thru why you actually think ceph is the last scum?

are you going for him first because it's easier / i'm a big scary duck, or do you think he's genuinely higher scum equity?

The defeatist stuff fits with JunkoChan self-voting more

how so?

Gamestate, some games have a real sad vibe in the scum PT

Do you think the scumteam are just like, folding? I think you're probably the only person who thinks that - do you have a read on Ceph otherwise?

[the worst]

i'm not sure i know how to solve while assuming mafia have given up. if they have i think it's you lol

[the worst]

The flipside is I don't think ceph's fatigue is a symptom of being defeated scum. I think it's similar to SS' fatigue. It's just a fatiguing time around here.

[the worst]

Actually, I see you mean because he voted Dann first.

But like. Bell's solve was Dann + junko

Still realistic, theworst could just be efforting as scum. But I'm sick of Cephrir's air of doom

i'm concerned this is more of a tonal issue than a game solving issue, and i think cephrir (plus probably you) can be engaged by, like, communicating with whole real sentences and shit.

i find it really hard to align myself with your view of "scum have folded, ergo the second-lowest energy player [let us not forget SS] is scum" when, like
scum have shown nothing but effort and intent to win this game

junko self-voting means there's a slightly >rand chance that scum was already on her wagon. that's all. self-voting because you think you're going to lose is getting eerily close to "playing against wincon" space and i don't think it's responsible to solve on the basis that scum got to f9 and abandoned their wincon.

i'm not even sure that you're scum if i'm being brutally honest?? i just can't align myself with your world view at all and that means you're either defeated scum or lowkey a liability



sorry this post is really harsh. if you are town & can like, just press a couple of levels deeper and un-tunnel on cephrir i think town is drastically more likely to win this game. you can still scumread cephrir, if you want. but i need something other than your disjointed gamestate read if that's real.

[the worst]

yeah what ceph said but with more words

[the worst]

just to re-state: if we want to lim someone for freezing in f7 when scum are in a precarious spot, we should let SS live to exactly 0% of endgames.

[the worst]

@Everyone

Can everyone please take a moment to tell me your thoughts, given this set up, if it makes more or less sense for there to be scum in the council?

more, but [fart noise]

[the worst]

starclandammit let the record show i tried to engage with furtive

[the worst]

furtive glance is such an aptly selected username i literally can't tell if this is scummy evasiveness or just, like, vagueness as a personality trait combined with *waves at 217 pages of migraine*

[the worst]

Actually, I see you mean because he voted Dann first.

But like. Bell's solve was Dann + junko

Still realistic, theworst could just be efforting as scum. But I'm sick of Cephrir's air of doom

i'm concerned this is more of a tonal issue than a game solving issue, and i think cephrir (plus probably you) can be engaged by, like, communicating with whole real sentences and shit.

i find it really hard to align myself with your view of "scum have folded, ergo the second-lowest energy player [let us not forget SS] is scum" when, like
scum have shown nothing but effort and intent to win this game

junko self-voting means there's a slightly >rand chance that scum was already on her wagon. that's all. self-voting because you think you're going to lose is getting eerily close to "playing against wincon" space and i don't think it's responsible to solve on the basis that scum got to f9 and abandoned their wincon.

i'm not even sure that you're scum if i'm being brutally honest?? i just can't align myself with your world view at all and that means you're either defeated scum or lowkey a liability



sorry this post is really harsh. if you are town & can like, just press a couple of levels deeper and un-tunnel on cephrir i think town is drastically more likely to win this game. you can still scumread cephrir, if you want. but i need something other than your disjointed gamestate read if that's real.

not really a question but i did explain why i'm finding it hard to get anything out of our interactions. i was sort of hoping this might be a call to reevaluate or something.

[the worst]

[the worst]

hardclaim libra but my reads this hour are like,

tw
lukewarm
cephrir
freedom
ss
you

i don't see what you're seeing and i don't think cephrir makes sense as scum. i do think you're tunneled on that gamestate read, which is different from being tunneled on a single slot, but is similarly not very helpful for other people trying to solve the game.

i'm not really trying to roast you, just trying to highlight a flaw in our communication. can you explain to me why you're locktown on freedom?

[the worst]

idk it's like a gimmick to try and earn pity?

but like. when does this ever work.

do you think he's scum trying to use a pseudo-AtE strategy to win, or scum who's kind of abandoned winning and is just groaning his way through endgame?
those are two super different things

[the worst]

i feel like i have a really warped view of this gamestate, might be recency bias or something thanks to replacing in. wild.

VOTE: SS

at this rate i do think furtive is the better lim today buuuuut
i want this to flip red so once again ydrasse can glare from the sidelines, unable to post (legally not connection-wise this time) while i steal all the glory

[the worst]

general like, vca thoughts (sorry (i'm not sorry i'll never learn)) - scum are much more likely to self-vote in game-critical situations if they've been correctly bussed.
not sure if that really counts for junko's situation tbqh but i'm just like the tiniest bit wary of freedom today :I

[the worst]

for the record i think i'm a fine, albeit very far from ideal, lim today. keep me alive til f3, crossvote and i'll nail this game. i'm an ELO god and i've never misvoted once ever, not even once.

idk it's like a gimmick to try and earn pity?

but like. when does this ever work.

do you think he's scum trying to use a pseudo-AtE strategy to win, or scum who's kind of abandoned winning and is just groaning his way through endgame?
those are two super different things

They sound similar to me, you could be pessimistic and still try to win via being willing to die so people think you're town. I don't get why you think they're towny

here's the thing... that doesn't actually win sympathy in mafia games. like, ever. ceph has been around a long time and has a high level of social self-awareness and i really don't think he's someone who would expect a (sorry if i'm wrong and this is mean) super phoned-in AtE attempt to get him through to endgame against this plist.

i don't think he's likely to anticipate someone with my kind of upside-down world view to replace in and white knight the strategy either

i kind of understand where you're coming from but please look at who's flipped scum again. this scumteam has been absolutely dancing on the town for at least 4-5 phases. do you really think cephrir, a capable scum player who has just utterly non-engaged with the entire damn team, actually makes sense as their last partner?

[the worst]

alright ydrasse has probably had enough time to put a curse on me

VOTE: furtiveglance

[the worst]

excuse u furtive i banter with

EVERYONE

[the worst]

calling my personality scummy rude

[the worst]

i thought one of them said that

guess i could be misremembering

i was misremembering it the same but i can't see anything that affirms it is the case

[the worst]

VOTE: SS i am a whim personified

[the worst]

Would someone mind unvoting to get us off e-1, I am working on a wall post >.<

I already flipped guys I'm town D_D

just verified for safety's sake this is not remotely true

[the worst]

Wait are you drafting a huge case against me? Why did I unvote to help you what is wrong with me

[the worst]

I feel quite tepid about them
jokes aside me too

[the worst]

I subscribed to the thread so I'd know when these dropped I hope you know him thrilled I am.

[the worst]

Conversely, if they do have a member on the council, then they suddenly gain:

Knowledge of how the warrior ceremony works, and 25% control over its usage.

Knowledge of 3 additional townies, who are not-traditional PRs. Both to help with finding a doc, and with shooting the leader who most wont let them get abilities

That member can later angle for the scum to stop being goons at some point

broadly agree, not having scum on the council is a massive agency loss which feels counter intuitive. That said I'm not sure it's essential given the setup already rewards quality day play. still would prefer flips in council where we can.



otherwise I think you're just looking for linear trajectory which I'm....not motivated to produce, sorry, my thoughts occur in abstract ways and I'm town here so I'm not really rewarded for pretending that they're happening in a fluid way which is easy to follow.

that's ab all I've got, I don't really think a rebuttal is necessary. I'm going to go for who I think is scummiest. I also agree there's a respectable chance of scum in the council and I think furtive is the correct way to go today.

[the worst]

Now die

oof. hard pass.

if it helps any, my flopping Freedom read happened when I realised how much work they're doing in leader chat vs. how little they're doing in the thread snd then realising charloux was kind of just a read I did because everyone else was doing it and I'm kind of hard pressed to point to a single reason I had them as hard town

[the worst]

The furtive thing is interesting and is kind of why I'm developing cold feet too I guess. He's objectively a better flip than cephrir as far as easy wagons go and has a respectable chance of being scum (+ resolves council flips) but lord do I feel unmotivated.

BTW I don't think anyone could have not shot bell last night lol, leaving him alive any longer would point to his reads having mistakes

[the worst]

If you want more mechanical wonkiness, T3 and Alisae have already flipped scum from the same clan as furtive -- fmpov either freedom's scum equity is way higher than I gave it credit for, or this setup is a roller-coaster.

[the worst]

if i had two bullets right now i guess i'd shoot furtive then myself. or honestly weirdly probably ss. this game is very surreal.
@luke hbu?

So, I guess you and I have the same two targets for those 2 bullets lol

ayy fingerguns
my goal is to find a solve that doesn't *necessarily* require me to be alive at endgame (aka. hard mode)

if this is one of those games that town wins by vibing into f3 then voting their townread, it's probably not a game that town will win.

This isn't super helpful to finding the last scum, but y'all may need to eventually play in a world without me, so I'm just making it abundantly clear so that this game doesn't fall into complacency again. I make a lot of sense as scum. I'm also not scum. On the balance of probabilities, scum is somewhere kind of unexpected / hard to anticipate.

I'll always play to entertain different ideas, esp in a gamestate like this where I'm actively concerned that complacency is going to lead town into a chain of miselims (going by leader chat overnight I'm pretty sure people will default to killing both me and ceph if people don't change their mindsets, and I think that hits two town).

so like yeah do your worst, collectively, I'm not un-limable here, I just want to make sure you're not going to do that then immediately stop trying to question the gamestate.

[the worst]

VOTE: theworst

haha yeah

this is like, the crux of the problem. it's not a furtive problem, it's a fatigue problem because this game has been really rough for town. this kind of "shrug sure" thing is necessarily coming from at least 2-3 townies, and will lose town the game in f3.

[the worst]

Oh jesus tomorrow is f4. I'm not sure why I thought we were in f7.

[the worst]

One more thing I should talk about -- we should activate SS' ability and no elim tomorrow.

[the worst]

SS told me that Bell was like 99% clear bc of the vig shot, that wasn't an original thought. I can be hazy but have expected the vig to have been shot. Are you planning to engage with me or attempt to bury me? One of those is going to make d9 very hard.

[the worst]

you expect to be alive to honour the posterity thoughts? interesting.

i'll vote SS in leader chat now, if you could think about that as a minimum (doesn't rly involve interacting with me) that'd be great.
second thing i'd ask if you can is just to post who you think it is failing me

[the worst]

i suppose on that basis my preference is probably
VOTE: Freedom and praying

not feeling scum!SS rn

[the worst]

sorry to keep talking while you're fired up about my doom but has anyone compiled claims? i've tallied flips and am mid-way through noticing something deeply funny

[the worst]

actually i guess yours is the only role i don't know.

[the worst]

Code: Select all

5x [LEADER] VT
2x [MEDIC ] Doctoring Masonry
1x [LONER ] Conditional unibackup
1x [APPREN] 2-shot announcer
1x [APPREN] Delayed tracker
1x [APPREN] 1-shot watcher
1x [APPREN] 1-shot motivator (shot replenisher kitty)
1x [APPREN] 1-shot cop
1x [APPREN] 1-shot bulletproof
1x [APPREN] 1-shot vig

claimed:
1x [APPREN] odd-night roleblocker
1x lukewarm

---

1x [??????] ??? (suspected leader)
1x [APPREN] 3-shot rolecop
1x [APPREN] Messenger
1x [APPREN] 2x strongcat
1x [APPREN] odd-night bulletproof even-night roleblocker

what are the odds that furtive is just right about scum burnout, but it's SS, and that's a really spicy fakeclaim instead of a really spicy role

[the worst]

wait there's 4 leaders what's cephrir

pedit: thanks. do you know cephrir?

[the worst]

Code: Select all

4x [LEADER] VT
2x [MEDIC ] Doctoring Masonry
1x [LONER ] Conditional unibackup
1x [APPREN] 2-shot announcer
1x [APPREN] Delayed tracker
1x [APPREN] 1-shot watcher
1x [APPREN] 1-shot motivator (shot replenisher kitty)
1x [APPREN] 1-shot cop
1x [APPREN] 1-shot bulletproof
1x [APPREN] 1-shot vig

claimed:

1x [APPREN] odd-night roleblocker
1x [APPREN] 3-shot neighbouriser
1x [APPREN] fruit vendor


---

1x [??????] ??? (suspected leader)
1x [APPREN] 3-shot rolecop
1x [APPREN] Messenger
1x [APPREN] 2x strongcat
1x [APPREN] odd-night bulletproof even-night roleblocker

[the worst]

so one weird role is still alive but SS' feels bizarrely overpowered

[the worst]

i think odd-night roleblocker is a reasonably natural spicy fakeclaim and, if a town role, disproportionately powerful.

[the worst]

if there is a town roleblocker i'd expect it to be one-shot balance wise. if it was meant to be powerful, odd-night makes more sense than anything else. i guess it's not *crazy* outlandish that they coexist it's just very weird.

[the worst]

i still kinda think, irrespective, we should do SS' warrior ceremony and try to go into d10 f3

[the worst]

not feeling scum!SS rn

What changed between here and 5429 and 5445?
I setiously don't get how you go from voting S_S to suddenly going 'not feeling scum!S_S'.
VOTE: the worst

i voted SS as an artistic statement then re-voted furtive
then re-voted SS as a placeholder because i was asked to move my vote

[the worst]

probably town?? but i could see him being scum
god help us all

[the worst]

what's your read on him, where are you at?

[the worst]

what did i miss?

what are your other reads

[the worst]

I don't have a good track record of reading Dann or tw. I did feel that tw and I didn't really connect in the hood the way I was hoping when he repped in, partially my fault for not continuing the conversation, but it could be that he was nervous about having a prolonged 1-on-1 interaction with me.

er
you posted like twice
I threw some vca and speculative thoughts out and a couple of questions and you never responded
our disconnect here is not on me - and I'm pretty quick to self criticise.

this is a decent part of why I'm still wary of you btw, going strictly by the thread I think you're usually town, I'm just quite stunned that you didn't put the energy into us clicking.

[the worst]

y'all, it's freedom

[the worst]

do me a thought exercise and split characters into two categories

- having conversations, digesting information, evaluating reads
- trying to look like they're solving but not really caring about what anyone says

account for burnout
I get 4.5 to 1.5

[the worst]

Actually he's missing the obvious thing maybe his perspective is closer to tunnelled-warped and further from malice-warped

[the worst]

I think breaking furtive's wagon to prompt a wagon against me (while giving furtive a free reason to switch their vote off cephrir, who wasn't happening), has probably made it impossible to get anything further out of that slot.

pedit: valid, you kinda got my first raw unaimed thoughts just after replacing in. leader chat was a bit more engaging so I kinda just gave up on posting @ you. I was sort of assuming you'd know I need a bit to get fired up.

[the worst]

What's your read on this gamestate - particularly cephrir & furtive? I'm wary that, as I said more than once, me => cephrir is probably a free town loss, so im keen on people reevaluating pretty quickly. :p

[the worst]

I'm asking you to evaluate freedom and furtive, because you'll have to choose between them tomorrow. to which you respond by becoming more tunnelled because my thought patterns are unnatural.

interesting choice Luke.


pedit: good!!!! as they should !!!!!!

[the worst]

i don't feel compelled to get into 'em. i know breaking hiatus by replacing into this game was probably a wild decision holistically but i am very tired.

there have been some like, tonal disjunctions from duck that haven't sat right with me, but i wonder if that's coming from my desperate hope that lukewarm will lead me to a victory i cannot find myself

maybe. good luck on d9. i genuinely think you're town and will need it.

and their reads have certainly been a bit all over the place

yes. unfortunately they are real thoughts about a difficult subject, and are therefore fluid.

I'm asking you to evaluate freedom and furtive, because you'll have to choose between them tomorrow. to which you respond by becoming more tunnelled because my thought patterns are unnatural.

interesting choice Luke.


pedit: good!!!! as they should !!!!!!

You are trying to frame it like my issue is that your thought process is unnatural. Which is vague, and generally something that comes from players thinking about the game differently.

That is not my point.

My point is that your stances seems to change along with the gamestate towards which ever stance would be more likely to let you win as scum.

Changes as a point of tactical necessity.

scarcely - my thoughts are erratic. they're also sometimes valid. and i'd argue that my opinions have changed like 7x as much as the gamestate has shifted but go off ig.

the issue i'm outlining is that you're getting harder to interact with & more tunnelled. you're probably not going to be here to make a decision tomorrow, so i'd suggest evaluating your legacy.

i also think we're kind of done with each other so i'm going to leave it at that.

[the worst]

aha didn't know you still had two hood buddies - that does explain it a bit

[the worst]

i'm sure i knew that at an intellectual level but

my thoughts are erratic

[the worst]

i love the flavour design of crowfeather leaving a trail of broken hearts

[the worst]

gg all! thanks for modding & designing ydrasse!

[the worst]

Val's slot was confirmed town. i'm not really sure why Luke was the one used for hammer testing, but they were flipped while hammer testing, not because of reads.

i don't have an answer for the rest, sorry, i'll leave that to the hosts

[the worst]

GG!
TBH I was going to push for a scum!Ceph narrative multiple times but I ended up giving up on it because pushing on a scum!ducky world was better.
Though, I genuinely think that S_S shouldn't have gotten activated on an even Day, as it greatly reduced the usefulness of his role and effectively left Town defenceless and the game a lot easier to win for scum.

i did think your thoughts around my suggestion to give SS a warrior ceremony felt informed. i wish i'd pushed that harder. :p

well played.