Cosmos Mafia (Postgame)

[Magician]

For good or for ill, I’m here for a lil. Your hopes, I’ll make no attempt to fulfil; but perhaps this game can be a thrill.

Welcome Magician!

No deaths again... worried about conversion

Nice to meet ya… I’m new to this site, but I think I can assure you I’ll be more active than my slot’s previous… three owners? Whatever, moving on. Shockingly enough, I have barely attempted to read up on the thread, but my excuse is that I barely know any (though not quite none) of you, I was only pulled in to play a short time ago, and anyway players hold a different perspective on the game than a spectator would, so I would surely appreciate if I was given the cliffnotes and your current readlists, and I’ll ISO a few slots and see what comes up.

[Magician]

¤

Bastardness

This game does qualify as bastard, but the bastard elements are kept to a minimum. Mod-given information is true.
¤

Limited Reveal

Factional abilities will not be revealed when a faction member dies. Role abilities and alignment still flip as normal.
¤

Solar Cult and Lunar Cult

- These are the two scum factions. They have nonstandard factional abilities and are not neccisarily identical. Although they are flavored as cults, conversion abilities are neither confirmed nor denied to exist.

Speaking of conversion… and multiball…
Lunar and Solar. Multiball games are hard, but there are still certain indications one can look out for. Have there ever been double kills in one night?

[Magician]

Oh welcome to the site! Explains why I didn't recognize your name
I can't fault you for not reading up much, I didn't either when I replaced in.
This game's mechanics are a bit dense, so it might be a bit difficult to get the hang of. Definitely trickier than in a newbie game
I can summarize what's happened so far to help you out, but if you have any specific questions feel free to ask!

I wouldn’t exactly call myself a newbie, I have a few years of Mafia experience under my belt and I’m actually fairly decent. But yep, I’m totally new here. Summary would be great.

[Magician]

Mechtalk is nice, but I’d like to hear your thoughts on a social TL;DR, and to hear the standards of town and wolf games on this site. Not because I’ll hold myself to those standards, but if everyone’s replacing in and out it’s safe to assume evils wouldn’t necessarily be trying their hardest to mimic their townplay, and might feel freer to push agenda, right?

[Magician]

Isn’t that fantastic, my ISO breakdown of Professotic’s slot didn’t seem to send. Whatever, I’ll just share my viewpoint.

I think Professotic is scum… they’re overly defensive in the earlygame about being scumread, they townread MMR, they scumread Radical early on but didn’t vote Rad when they were executed… their scumread on Meuh’s previous slot owner, Mastina, feels like Professotic was trying to scumread but not commit on a teammate…

Speaking of which, Meuh feels like a wolf as well. They didn’t share their social thoughts or anything when I asked them to, repeatedly dodging the question with mechtalk. The conversion fear felt performative. Meuh claiming wolves would be less aggressive, while valid, feels like light defence of Drapian’s early game.

Once again, I’ll repeat myself: what. Is. Your. Readlist?

[Magician]

There's no reason to stop her from targeting us if she just has an investigative role.

Unless her role is more than an investigative role.

The role is literally called “limited astrologer”, it’s in the name

I think the info of you/Mathblade being untargetable was something Mastina passively learned at the end of dusk 1? I can only act at noon, but I did get that information and it was learned at the end of dusk 1.

Oh, interesting. Have you claimed all of your info?
This isn’t a clearing role.

[Magician]

I am Town.

Oh, cool. I am also Town. Let’s just have every villager claim their alignment outright and we can solve the game right here.

[Magician]

People, aka T-Bone seems to have an issue with me voting Dingle since they town read them so much for a reason I don’t really see, plus Solar was pushing him which makes me believe they might have just been Lunar. But whatever there is still a partner and I still believe that the partner is CSF so that’s who I’m voting today.

I will also vote Dingle if people start a wagon there.

VOTE: CSF

What’s your case on your scumreads?

[Magician]

Who's Drapian?

Professotic is a hydra of Professordrapion and tictac. Thanks for your readlist, I’ll take it into account.

[Magician]

I am Town.

Oh, cool. I am also Town. Let’s just have every villager claim their alignment outright and we can solve the game right here.

I already solved the game.
Get in Line.

I kinda townread the self-righteous, though.

[Magician]

Thanks Magician for letting us have a game again

Bella and I have had

thoughts

Bro honestly, I wanted the game to start so badly and I knew ALLOT of FM Players.

This guy is still terrible at reading me though lol.

Here we go.

I dare someone to call one of those 2 entrance posts I made wolfy and they can prepare for utter annihilation!

Starts messing around at the start of the game. I have a theory that wolves, having just randed an evil role, will feel more selfconscious upon entering the game, they might feel excited or jittery, and will joke around to offset their nerves. Not to call "jokes” AI, but this post wasn’t exactly a joke.

I dare someone to call one of those 2 entrance posts I made wolfy and they can prepare for utter annihilation!

VOTE: Professotic

Entrance posts wolfy

I take a look to see why someone voted our slot and this is what I see.

I dare someone to call one of those 2 entrance posts I made wolfy and they can prepare for utter annihilation!

This guy wants some utter annihilation!

VOTE: Furtive[/vofe]

Here’s the start of your defensiveness.
But really, I invite anyone else to look at your slot’s ISO and tell me you didn’t care about being suspected. Even now, you’re trying to discredit my scumread by saying I’m terrible at reading you. That’s not how solving works, it doesn’t matter whether or not I was previously right or wrong, all that matters is now. It’s not even really true, I usually find you as Town.

[Magician]

@Magician

Can you give an analysis/read on Dingle Slot please, I think they might be a Lunar Member.

Geez, this sucks. I’m not notified of new responses, or pings, or anything. What am I missing?

Dingle is a hydra, I’ll try to account for dissonance.

I am Mafia Goon.

VOTE: Enchant

I think you're legitimately more likely to make this post as a Mafia Goon than as anything else.

This post sticks out to me… as pointed out shortly after, "Mafia Goons" aren’t in the game. Under normal circumstances I might derpclear this, but… no, it feels like a random vote. Nothing more, nothing less. It’s not AI.

Both hydra slots seem to actively solve at the beginning of the game, and are fairly open about their differing opinions, which I find v indicative.

I'd give this more words and depth but I've gotta go into work
I've been wanting our vote here for a while but Bella has said 'not yet' a few times

Hate me for this, but I’m unsure whether a w!hydra would admit this, if one’s eager to throw their vote and see about getting someone executed but the other’s hesitant and wants to see what else happens.

Maid Cafe
Scarfmanship
Radical Rat
Radja
Enchant

Here are the people I want gone today

This POE looks alright to me. Maid Cafe’s slot (Toogeloo) doesn’t seem to be in the graveyard, but I gather they flipped scum from what Professotic’s saying? My slot must’ve been fairly inactive to be replaced this number of times, that’s fair… Rad was another evil, Enchant’s apparently still POE, Radja was killed…

Why was Radja killed, presumably via execution? Was it a valid case?

I don't think scarf is dominating as much as you think? I had them as nully scum until the middle of yesterday and then to me, along with unwind who was similar, they Townes it up.

We seem to agree about math.

There's the outstanding question about you being confirmable though, have I missed it?

Are those people you picked out town, or just easier to read? I think CSF is the most town from that list, with t bone, ydrasse and neuh on the 'id like to be town' list

B

P-edit sorry, you posted reads! Lemme go look

Actually, change what I just said. I haven’t read through it all, but it almost feels too correct? What did Toogeloo flip as?
Probably v, from what I’ve seen thus far. Open and honest.

[Magician]

ask something i would know

Hello Enchant, I’m new to this game. I haven’t had the opportunity to catch up on your slot just yet, so how does the game look from your perspective?

[Magician]

I know I’m not very invested in this game; I joined late, and reading through 300 posts doesn’t exactly appeal to me. I’m simply enabling the rest of you, and that’s terrible.

Here’s what I have noticed; reading through Enchant’s ISO, claiming Mafia Goon and joking about deciding to sheep another player via dice roll, I viberead them as a player who doesn’t really care about other’s perception of their slot in RVS. Enchant acknowledges their low activity, but still casts a few votes, even if they can’t remember why; as in the case of voting Mathblade.

Enchant laughs at how everyone’s surprise when they’re revealed Town, and apparently spots a lie with Yume’s claim. Yume, replaced by CSF, who’s still alive. Enchant voting Mastina after rising to Yume’s bait links back to the "I don’t care" mindset, which suggests consistency in their behaviour. Enchant’s been softing VT since the earlygame, and a wolf with this personality mightn’t care about doing that?

I don't care about multiball, let's kill atleast someone

As suggested. Enchant seems like an easy misexe here.

Enchant confuses Solar with Lunar, confuses the number of nightkills there would be per night… insistent on Solar having a factional arsonist… a Solar cultist wouldn’t need to say that. Which means misreading RR as Town or Lunar kinda means nothing.

Enchant claimed Jester as a joke… alright, question: is Enchant being suspected because everyone else is townier, because they’ve been incorrect, or is there something more tangible than that?

[Magician]

Magician can you claim next?

I am but a humble villager. Nothing more, nothing less.
Smoke and mirrors.

[Magician]

Fun!

unwnd is attuned with the sun

. Therefore not aligned with the lunar cult.
I vaguely recall people saying unwnd was weird with the wagon on the person who just flipped lunar? I saw that on the last page. I picked unwd cause of that + Mastina having unwnd low on reads.

Yup. Aside from that tidbit I got on dusk 1,

on noon 1 I checked Unwnd, who was lunar attuned

. On noon 2, I checked PPF, who is solar attuned (therefore not aligned with the lunar cult). That's the info I've got so far.

hm

VOTE: Meuh

I haven't read most of the thread, but that's worth a vote. Nancy can change.

VOTE: Meuh

~Titus

This vindicates my initial gutread.

[Magician]

Magician Slot is Socially Townie.

Don’t tempt me to claim wolf. You know I’ll do it.

[Magician]

…Yep, Professotic is Town-aligned. I am all for encouraging this behaviour, I think everyone should try being more confident in their readlists.

[Magician]

…Yep, Professotic is Town-aligned. I am all for encouraging this behaviour, I think everyone should try being more confident in their readlists.

Bro when you say stuff like this it makes me think I’m wrong on you being town.
Mainly the last part of what you said, what’s your “confident” readslist?

…Happy Holidays. This is an automated message.

I don’t have a readlist. I’m mostly real-timing. Something something zeal is Towny for you, FMPOV.

[Magician]

PPF what was your flavor?

You got flavour?

[Magician]

@Magician vote CSF with me or something.

I’m not really

at

that stage where I care about my vote yet, but whatever. Having a competing counterwagon is better for wagonomics.
VOTE: VOTE: Cat Scratch Fever

[Magician]

It’s actually painful trying to slog through that dumpster fire of an ISO. How it was not beyond obvious to me they were flaming obvscum on d1, I have no idea.

The illusion of transparency.

[Magician]

We had a few thoughts overnight

Our biggest point of discussion was that CSF is probably just town
I went through the beginning of CSF's ISO and it seems really clear to me that she's speaking from the perspective of a town protective role
She claims an extra element to her role almost immediately, and most importantly to me,

she's immediately and repeatedly suspicious of Radical Rat

(most likely because RR claimed a protective role and CSF thought that was unlikely to be true and town with her own role)

I showed this to Bella, she agreed that it was strong evidence for CSF town
I'd encourage others to do the same

We crossed Meuh off as town, yay we're right
We've also crossed Magician off as town. We both think Scarf and JunkoChan made themselves obvious town repeatedly. This doesn't seem to be hugely in contention but if it ever is we can hash it out.

PPF bothers me. I believe PPF is town by play. I think there are several valid reasons that make PPF unlikely to be scum. They're certainly not Lunar.

The MMR result and surrounding play is concerning. I still think the most sensible explanation for MMR's behaviour on D2 is effectively a guilty result on PPF.

I don't know how to feel more confident about PPF than I do and I'm concerned about that.

I don't think Enchant is scum. I think his content and engagement with the game yesterday looked a lot like town. I don't think this is concrete. If Enchant is still around at endgame, he's someone to reevaluate. But I'm not interested in eliminating him.

And now here's where my current team PoE sits:

Solar: {Firebringer, PPF}
Lunar: {professotic, T-Bone}

Enchant can in theory fill either team slot but I don't think he's scum.

3 Professotic - Lunar.
4 Dingle Dangle Scarecrow - Town?
5 Magician - Town?
6 Past Present Future - (Not Lunar)?
7 Cat Scratch Fever - Town?
8 Enchant - Town?
11 Frozen Angel Firebringer - Solar.
16 T-Bone - Lunar.

Your reads are consistent unto themselves and that’s a good look.

PEdit: I agree that Lunar should be priority today.

Specifically: Bella and I are heavily concerned at this point that the Lunar factional ability is Arson.

Factional arson isn’t so bad in a multiball. Your doused targets might die by other means, it’s just less reliable than a straight nightkill.

No, Meuh flip is harmful impact and gived us only fact that PPF is not Lunar.

Also unwmd's attunement post-mortem. Even though PPF is the only living player, I think information that is confirmed is valuable. It was also a bad kill for scum tbh. Magician and I are more optimal kills imo from a controlling information standpoint, Magician doubly so since they are townread a lot. Meuh's role is fairly harmless without the flip since they are the only ones in the town with evidence attunement isn't a made up fakeclaim.[/quote]
I should never be nightkilled, I’m hardly the biggest threat alive.

Reading back… I guess.

[Magician]

Magician didn't claim actually.

I claimed Vanilla.

[Magician]

I'm fine with putting Professotic in the pressure cooker, but I also want to see where Magician's head is at today

Hmm. Empty.
In all seriousness… ask me again in some time.

[Magician]

I have reasons to think Prof could be avoiding this game.

as in game reasons or rl reasons

I don’t know anything about Prof personally but just check under his main, ProfessorDrapion.

This is angleshooting.

[Magician]

I don't think Magician is scum at all. He particularly doesn't make sense as Solar, with how Junko handled the Porkens wagon. I thought there was a reason he didn't make sense as Lunar as well but I've forgotten it, I'll look back at that later. But like Scarf and Junko were both towny town town.

I love being cleared for no good reason.

[Magician]

Seeing how people are talking about Firebringer, I figured I’d chime in and fake being productive.

REJOICE! For your SAVIOR is--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi I am a maso--oh, wait, this is a cult game, I shouldn't open with that.

Hi, I am town.

(Okay but for real, I intend to be a BEACON this game, REVEALING the TRUE COLORS of all.)

shifty is patent protected btw.

I am Talia. Believe it or not, it's true. As true as the fact that Aegon the Conqueror had two wives.

Who is talia?

This is fascinating though and I want to say it loud what most probably thought about too:

Meg, is there any public information about Dusk/Dawn phases? Are they different?

Both Dusk and Dawn function as normal Mafia game eliminations, as well as Noon and Night function as normal mafia game night phases. They are functionally identical except they are distinct.

So it seems that Noon is the night phase for the Solar cult and the night is the night phase for the Lunar cult. In other words, based on flavor we can guess that the cults are even/off phase mechanically. But guess we'll see when we go

Anyways missed you, my friends. long time no see <3 been a while since I played a game here

VOTE: Bunnyonce

I don’t like this opening? It’s technically NAI, but given how wolves are probably more likely to try alleviating their nerves by messing around at daystart or overcompensating with their posts, Frozen’s opening seems to fit the bill.

I'm gonna say this in the nicest way possible

Mastina had the reins D1 and was wrong, bunnyonce was one of her scumreads

If people just let her repeat D1 I am going to afk

wait why would u guys listen to mastina
this is town.

mastina probably town too.
This is to the extent i scumhunt this game day.

No for memes

actually mastina could be scum. Wow that would be spicy.

I'm fine with playing along, but I'm not letting her pick the elim

Can I pick?

I don't want anyone to necessarily pick

But feel free to offer up some suggestions?

I am not making this day 'let's kill mastina', I am saying 'please hold mastina

accountable

'

almost makes me want to read day 1. not gonna go there.
do u want to elim mastina and think she scum or not

Contrasting Fire’s opening after replacing in, which is harder to read. I could call it opportunistic if I squint really hard, but in all honesty it doesn't really mean anything.

There are three pages between Frozen and Fire, reading them both shouldn’t take long.

[Magician]

Can you really afford to policy execute a villager at this time in the proceedings? At F7 with two scumteams alive?

DDS is probably Town; putting in high effort, demonstrates early hydra dissonance which is villagery due to suggesting each head having legitimate different reads over fabricating reads; puts in each reeval to suggest uncertainty which suggests uninformed, none of this is news to any of you.


The start of PPF’s ISO feels slower, almost like they don’t want attention drawn to their slot. They’re defensive around #221, and they ask others a lot of questions which draws attention elsewhere, without expressing themselves early on. It’s kinda odd for a high-poster.

Enchant just feels villagery, that’s my viberead.

I couldn’t really reach any conclusions after reading Firebringer’s ISO, because I’m missing out on a lot of context. My bad.

T-Bone felt kinda hedgy during realtime to me? I don’t know about that.

[Magician]

Killing someone because they’re quiet instead of killing someone for being suspicious is a textbook policy execution.

[Magician]

Which post is 221? Why no comment about my FA/STD read? I don’t understand why you made no mention of that?

Here you go.

What specifically do you not like about our posting @Dangle? Most of our posts have been made by Titus including the most recent ones. I made the one to switch our vote to Radja.
I’m really not happy that you are making general comments about our posting but not referencing anything specific you dislike. I disagree with Titus wrt to Professor, since I think he sounds similar here to LOST.

~Nancy

Klick here to make quips about things that randomly interest him while Bella does sensible posting

I’m really not happy that you are making general comments about our posting but not referencing anything specific you dislike.

Why, specifically, does this make you unhappy?

Global warming. I want to know what your issue is with any of our posts, so that we can address them, more specifically the head who made them and we obviously can’t do that if you won’t explain what your issues are.

It’s also helpful in my attempting to determine your alignment. If you just make comments like you dislike our posting, it tells us pretty much nothing but if I can hear your actual reasoning, then I can determine if I think it’s reasonable as coming from a townie mindset or not.

If I didn’t comment on your read, I either didn’t see it or didn’t care to respond. As you would expect anyone to say when they don’t respond to a post. I never had a chance to interact with FA or STD, who am I to judge whether or not anything you say about their respective behaviours or whatever were towny or scummy?

I couldn’t really reach any conclusions after reading Firebringer’s ISO, because I’m missing out on a lot of context. My bad.

Have you read all of the posts since you replaced in? It might be easier engaging in real time.

I’ve tried reading through in my free time. I’m not actually notified of new posts, so sometimes I get distracted. Other times the posts start to blend together. I’m personally used to infinite-scroll, and seeing ~300 posts is admittedly demotivating.

I couldn’t really reach any conclusions after reading Firebringer’s ISO, because I’m missing out on a lot of context. My bad.

Have you read all of the posts since you replaced in? It might be easier engaging in real time.

Killing someone because they’re quiet instead of killing someone for being suspicious is a textbook policy execution.

It's not a policy lim, it's more of a lack of solving energy.

What do you make of the difference between Dangle and T-Bone wrt Magician?

So I haven’t really read into either of their slots in-depth, but I’m generally getting better vibes from the former. Not that it means much, effort shouldn’t be inherently townread, especially from a surface level perspective like mine, but that’s it.

Ehh.

[Magician]

Oh, cool. The formatting didn’t break this time.

[Magician]

Okay question for everyone but PPF.

Did MMR have a real result? Gut reaction yes or no?

What was MMR’s claimed result?

[Magician]

Dangle’s definitely flipping scum here, I bet the game on it.

If they were town, they would not be ignoring 8624. There’s 0 reason to do that if they’re town.

these back and forths between dangle and PPF.
Yes, good stuff.
THis is why i play mafia. For these silly back and forths.

@PPF why are u solely focused on lunar?
U said im possibly solar so i don't get why u are so adamant to fight dangle. Just lim dangle tomorrow imo.

I know it’s weird. I know it’s probably wrong in this context, but I’m used to these scuffles coming from V/V. Both sides sound convinced they’re right, they both have that self-righteousness you expect from villagers. As a level 0 viberead.

I am a town beloved princess and that will be proven after I flip, so no not fake anything.

"I’m Town and I don’t need to prove anything to you." Villagery.

[Magician]

Is anyone opposed to voting Firebringer? Especially Enchant/Magician - I don't know who you're planning on voting. I might not be here closer to deadline tomorrow morning unless I set a very early alarm, so if this isn't happening, I'd like to know sooner.

I’m not a prolific voter. If I’m not voting against the leading wagon, that either means I agree with or don’t disagree with it. I’ve been known to intentionally vote

with

my leading suspect on a counterwagon as Town, because it’s better for wagonomics.

That doesn’t really give the scene justice, actually. This is a terrible performance from me as either alignment, and nowhere near how I’d expect myself to play as either alignment. But I digress. I have no complaints.

[Magician]

I think voting PPF tomorrow is optimal

I kinda wanna go Enchant -> PPF and then I think the game will be over

Maybe PPF first.

I could see this from a villager who wants to see the game through to the end… I can more easily see this from a wolf with nothing to lose. If I recall correctly, Enchant was on the block a couple days ago, but was lifted because

towny

.

[Magician]

I need both T-Bone and magician support.

Any chance i persuade you?

Of course there is. I lost a recent game in F3 because I didn’t expect a wolf to intentionally sabotage their team, so I’m happy to reevaluate better this time.
…Not that I want to survive until F3 this time, with this amount of activity, but ehh.

[Magician]

That said, if mastina is scum, then one of her 'townreads' should have been killed. The fact that none of us were is a point in her favor.

That only applies in singleball.

The bigger question is why prof died?

That flip actually clears me because you should know from Heroes’ that scum!me never kills Prof here.

And I only think one scum team can kill a night.

So I’m half cleared for now, the other half will come later if I live long enough.

Scarf still voting me when I am already half clear and will be fully clear later is hella suss. If I somehow get miselimed today, remember that.

Scarf still voting me when I am already half clear and will be fully clear later is hella suss. If I somehow get miselimed today, remember that.

When hypothetically would you be “clear” by? {read I doubt this}

Possibly next day phase, I’m hoping.

T-Bone, can you help me work out why these posts happened please?

@ T-Bone & Magician

On another topic entirely, I'm interested in hearing what you both think about these PPF quotes in the context of PPF's actual claimed role.

It’s mechanically unsound to clear anyone off a venge claim, but let’s take PPF’s claim at face value for now. Assuming these posts were made before PFP publicly claimed, it reads to me as though PPF’s (if town) was hoping to bait a kill by softing innocent child, or just any confirmable power role, which is a weird decision for a wolf to make. The push on Scarf for voting you when you

aren’t

confirmed, and acting like you already are, is weird, but I can’t objectively talk about pushes onto my slot when I wasn’t there.

MMR and Meuh’s roles weren’t really similar, outside of having investigative properties. Fire and PPF’s roles are way closer aligned, what with changing phases… I dunno, this could go either way. I’d like to hear PPF chime in.

[Magician]

By the way, @Enchant, thanks for post #8150. That was a helpful recap.

[Magician]

What I don't want is for PPF to flip town and then Magician goes at 3. I either need confidence that that's not going to happen, confidence that PPF is just the last scum, or a complete change of reads.

It sure would suck if my slot had been converted a few phases ago. Hypothetically.

[Magician]

I have an idea.
@MegAzumarill can you confirm this phase is continuing?

(Could be a Senator kind of thing, or a negated or reduced vote thingy.)

[Magician]

Town actually wins on this site? Even winning a multiball?

Woah.

[Magician]

All the replacements were amazing, even those who didn’t quite *want* to be here but did it anyway to help out.

Way to out me here.

But in all seriousness, I respect the hustle. Thanks for bringing me in, even if only for a comparatively short while.