BooneyToonz XVI: Boons Ahoy! - [END]

[Klick]

Welcome to chill vibes klick world, enjoy your stay

VOTE: zoro

You won't fool me zoraster alt

[Klick]

rawr

~klick

[Klick]

Why is Frogs the chosen hydra Drew?

[Klick]

Same

[Klick]

Rrrrrrrrighty ho' then I believe I smell some stench coming from one of the twins

VOTE: Students of Prudence

Go on?

[Klick]

Peregrine are you an alt? Do you have sizable Mafia experience?

[Klick]

Peregrine are you an alt? Do you have sizable Mafia experience?

I have mafia experience!!!

You may make your own assumptions about me being an alt or not though!!

That's fine, no worries

Do you prefer town or scum? How confident are you as scum generally?

[Klick]

Rrrrrrrrighty ho' then I believe I smell some stench coming from one of the twins

VOTE: Students of Prudence

Go on?

4 posts all stinky last post scared to vote without partners thoughts for 0 reason because there’s not even a wagon on me and hydra dissonance = town anyways

If hydra dissonance = town it doesn't follow that non-hydra dissonance = not town

I think their posts have been fine

[Klick]

Can someone teach me how to iso on phone I click isolate users and click ranger and there’s no like enter button to go

Scroll the box all the way to the bottom, there will be a Go button

[Klick]

VOTE: WhemeStar

[Klick]

Wheme describe your scum game with three adjectives. Go

[Klick]

although i did promise myself that if i rolled scum this game id try to actualy talk and be active and not coast to try and mimic my town game but i dont know if that would actually have happened or not

I mean that fits exactly with what I think is actually happening in this game.

[Klick]

How are your solves going
Atm I have the game split evenly into 'town' and 'PoE'

[Klick]

here's a lead rist

[Town]

Firebringer - Very towny, very Firebringer
Doctor Drew - Very good at generating content and appearing trustworthy
NorwegianboyEE - A town mindset, this can be seen in 213
Peregrine - For some arcane reason I townread Peregrine
Klick - I quite like posts 228 and 314 though I do want to see the sorting soon
Enchant - Very weakly town, mostly due to me thinking Enchant is playing normally
Here There Be Dragons - towny vibes but not much else for me to comment on
Students of Prudence - I don't like the opening but I can see a town mindset

below this is what I'd consider the PoE

Malakittens - pretty much NAI
Ranger - No content, but effectively V/LA so hard null here
zoro - No content, hard null
Frogs - No content besides a scummy reaction of a vote on Here There Be Dragons (not having the game sorted is apparently scummy? what?), linked by associative to WhemeStar so if WhemeStar flips scum Frogs is very likely scum
Theta Alpine - Very good at blending in while not producing any meaningful content
WhemeStar - A quick ISO skim tells me scummy mindset, also defends (not pockets, defends) frogs and I still don't like post 300

[Scum]

My reads are going to look fake as hell because they are LITERALLY 100% a carbon copy of your reads, except I don't think Enchant is town.

[Klick]

I suppose I can tier them by strength to show they're real and original

I feel rather good about calling you, Peregrine, Norwee and Prudence town
Drew/Dragons/Firebringer are more vibes but I still like them

[Klick]

(@TL obvs)

[Klick]

Ceph TL cares too much about the details of their point of view to be scum
They are portraying really specific ideas and they aren't ideas that would be expected to make people go 'oh TL is towny' and they also aren't persuasive

The only sensible motivation I can see for TL caring about what they care about is if they're town posting actual thoughts

[Klick]

Ceph TL cares too much about the details of their point of view to be scum
They are portraying really specific ideas and they aren't ideas that would be expected to make people go 'oh TL is towny' and they also aren't persuasive

The only sensible motivation I can see for TL caring about what they care about is if they're town posting actual thoughts

it is possible to fake this as scum just sometimes risky to do so
especially with the amount of pressure that temporal has been under

One of the core tenets of my scumhunting in the past few years has been that there's a big difference between what scum CAN fake and what they will CHOOSE to fake

[Klick]

I am struggling to think of a way to explain my thoughts about this page in a way that makes sense outside of my head but!! I think that one of the people who just unvoted Temporal has a higher chance to be mafia!

It feels as if Klick’s post was a marker to unvote Temporal, and this is the part that is hard to explain! I think that the logic that Klick presents makes sense but it also has the assumption that all play that mafia might make is sensible, and I disagree with that idea as sometimes they are throwing things into the wind to see what sticks!! But the read itself is one that sounds “sound” to other players and is a way to disengage as someone else has now handed you the reason!

I will be honest that this is probably! Contingent on what I think of Temporal when I can read more, not being able to post as much in real time kind of sucks but I wanted to point this out while I was here because seeing a wagon fall off that fast is! Something!!

I am here for another few minutes if anyone wants to ask me anything and then I will return later!!

I find that the overwhelming majority of the time scum are attempting to do *something* overarching with their posting

It's something that differs from player to player obviously but I think it's fairly reliable as a tell

I also think when scum are just 'throwing things into the wind to see what sticks' it usually doesn't sound genuine and consistent like TL's takes do

[Klick]

VOTE: Enchant

[Klick]

I suppose I can tier them by strength to show they're real and original

I feel rather good about calling you, Peregrine, Norwee and Prudence town
Drew/Dragons/Firebringer are more vibes but I still like them

Why is norwee good to you?
They haven’t responded to me yet and that is in fact, scummy

& what about the doc is scummy

Norwee feels really confident and free with his thoughts and I don't read him as the type to be that confident as scum
I could be wrong about that but I don't think I am?

You're misreading the second half of my post, Drew/Dragons/Firebringer are lesser townreads

[Klick]

Not to get bogged down in semantics but if the player list is strong won't they be more likely to catch you as scum (anxiety inducing) or tr you correctly as town (not anxiety inducing)?

I feel like your choice of the word strong may betray your alignment

No because people misread me constantly even good players
Also I'm not gonna respond to any more stuff until I'm done reading

-cake

????
Then they wouldn't be strong no?

I struggle to interpret this as anything but 'I don't have a good town answer to this question so I'm noping out'

I think you should definitely continue responding so this can be resolved if you're town

[Klick]

Not to get bogged down in semantics but if the player list is strong won't they be more likely to catch you as scum (anxiety inducing) or tr you correctly as town (not anxiety inducing)?

I feel like your choice of the word strong may betray your alignment

No because people misread me constantly even good players
Also I'm not gonna respond to any more stuff until I'm done reading

-cake

????
Then they wouldn't be strong no?

I struggle to interpret this as anything but 'I don't have a good town answer to this question so I'm noping out'

I think you should definitely continue responding so this can be resolved if you're town

I dunno, I don't know why they would enter the game like this as scum. I feel like they would have to know at least some people would respond like you have.

Not enough that it becomes the choice anyone actively chooses to pursue as scum

[Klick]

I normally don't go into the explanations of these kinds of tells because they don't feel intuitively good
But they are like one of the most reliably accurate forms of tell I know of

I'm on an arc of attempting to explain my thought processes logically and seeing the impact that has on the game against my better judgement

[Klick]

I'm feeling good about Drew being town right now for similar reasons to Norwee
There's a confidence here that feels more like that Mini Normal we were scum in Ceph and less like Demon Slayer
I don't think Drew is a confident scum player at all and they said as much in the Demon Slayer scum discord

[Klick]

I'm feeling good about Drew being town right now for similar reasons to Norwee
There's a confidence here that feels more like that Mini Normal we were scum in Ceph and less like Demon Slayer
I don't think Drew is a confident scum player at all and they said as much in the Demon Slayer scum discord

I don't know what it is lately but ur takes have just not been jiving with me at all.
I feel like im going to be arguing with u endlessly in this game.

I don't think drew is scum but this reason to townread just feels so....weak sauce.
I wouldn't characterize drew scum game as lacking confidence. I would more or less describe it as echoing other players opinions with confidence.

Ok so we don't disagree then

[Klick]

It's fine if you don't agree with my takes Firebringer I'm only trying to convince town

[Klick]

With regard to Temporal themself, I am null on them! While I have my qualms about the accuracy behind Klick's post (and I will clarify it wasn't to shade Klick I was just sharing some of my philosophy about the game!!)

Don't worry about it, sharing your thoughts is much appreciated on this end

[Klick]

I think Theta looks towny tbh

[Klick]

I basically locktowning Theta

This is a good post!

[Klick]

Fire Norwee Drew Klick Flippy
Peregrine
Theta
Mala Students
Ranger Enchant Wheme Lich
Dragons

This is a good reads list

This is about where I'm at

Doctor Drew
Theta Alpine
NorwegianboyEE
TemporalLich
Peregrine

Frogs
Emperor flippyNips

Firebringer
Students of Prudence
Here There Be Dragons

Ranger
Malakittens

WhemeStar
Enchant

[Klick]

I've missed a few questions but I'm feeling pretty shit. If you could ask them again if you particularly want them answered that would be awesome.

[Klick]

So obvious that you should be able to explain why and get me limmed today y/y

[Klick]

Regardless of your alignment your approach is really fucking annoying

[Klick]

the most obvious wolf in the game right now is cephrir

Teach me your ways
What makes Ceph scum

[Klick]

I'd love to back and forth but lunch break is over
I'll mull it over tonight

[Klick]

You know nothing at all about how I'm approaching this game
I find both you and Wheme suspect independent of the hood

[Klick]

I agree that there does not necessarily have to be a scum neighbor

I think there is because neither Enchant nor Wheme are towny

[Klick]

I thought you didn't talk to scum

[Klick]

I'm grumpy for several complex reasons both related and not related to mafia

I didnt think I'd been grumpy in this game in particular though except towards Enchant who is intentionally trying to get a rise out of me

[Klick]

My tolerance for intentionally being a nuisance is low right now

[Klick]

If you want to be mad, be mad on those who rumored than hood must contain mafia because ALLOWING TOWN TO COMMUNICATE PRIVATELY IS SO POWERFUL!!!!!!11111

No one did this

[Klick]

So Klick and Enchant in a hood, that could explain a bit i guess.

@Klick, You don’t scumread any of the other unknown players in the hood? Just Enchant?

The fourth member of the hood is obvtown

[Klick]

I find it sus that Enchant thinks I'm scummy for 'thinking he's scum because there must be scum in the hood' when 1. that's not what I think and 2. they do not actually think the hood is all-town so it's not a point they actually have any investment in other than to shade me

[Klick]

Your reasoning in hood was simple that you assume hood MUST contain mafia and therefore it's one of us because "other is obvtown".

So I went back and looked and I did basically say this last night. I forgot I did, but yes I did.

It was fairly empty reasoning and I agree that it's not really a given that there's at least one scum in the hood intrinsically. But I also think it's a good assumption to make if you have zero reason to townread any particular member of a hood. Like with you.

[Klick]

I never claimed hood is all town, i said assuming one of hood is mafia and making assumption only based on that is silly

Your reasoning in hood was simple that you assume hood MUST contain mafia and therefore it's one of us because "other is obvtown".

It was a good enough assumption for early game

A better reason for thinking there's scum in the hood is that many players in this game are towning it up and you and Wheme aren't

[Klick]

Anyone wanna talk about how Malakittens has made posts but basically isn't playing?

I have been thinking about this and think it is a slight scumtell!

[Klick]

I think those posts are again intended to get their very specific true worldview out in the thread

[Klick]

Fair

I don't want you to be scum but it is on my mind currently
If you are town I think this game should be really easy?

(@Ceph)

[Klick]

You've said yourself that you're really good at emulating your town game as scum and I think I agree
I can't develop a confident townread on you without thinking 'well I suppose scum!Ceph might opt to post that anyway' even if some of your content is towny in a vacuum
I don't think that's true of most players at the table

[Klick]

I like enchant scum I think

I also like theta scum
I also like lich scum
Frogs recent posting has been good
Dragon posting has been good
Fire is NAI
Noreweigin town Klick town doctor town
Prudence prob scum

Oh wait. I made a read list in the neighborhood that NO ONE USES

Excuse me, I think I've been at least as active as you in it!!

[Klick]

I got a lot of feelings on Klick posting.
SO much to be desired
I feel he is trying to make up really weak reasons to townread/sort people that isn't how he would actually sort people here. Like I want to grill him on this because i also think he is a bit upset about rolling scum

Ask me about themmmmmm

It's hard for me to believe this as a take from you because this is pretty consistently what I do in most of my town games: form reads, post them without much of the reasoning attached, and see who asks why and who votes without asking

I suppose my last few games have spoiled people with too much explanation but I did explicitly warn in my first post that I was going to be trying not to do much early

[Klick]

Do you want to say why you think that or do you just want to fucking shade me again

[Klick]

Fuck off

[Klick]

Regardless of the color of your role PM no one's job is to actively try make the game a miserable experience for anyone

[Klick]

I am bored also hoods sucks anyway.
I am in hood with 4 ppl which include Klick and only reason i am scumread by Klick is "HOODMUSTCONTAINONESCUMBECAUSE"

You know why Klick another topscumread Whemestar also in list with me?
Spoiler: Guess.

Klick while shitted long read lists about i don't care commenting, actual amount of effort they invested is zero. I also can put all my hood mates in topscumread and then vote them. Yet Klick calls me annoying for me basically mirroring what Klick themself doing.


I will bring this weeb conspiracy to the end.

I think that this! Was the moment I could actually get something of a read on Enchant because their previous posting was just a little irritating to me if I am honest, because I like when people play the game in a more serious manner but that is my preference!

This feels like a shoe drop moment in Enchant's posting that while I think is... kind of spiteful maybe? I do not know if that is too mean, but is definitely weaponized against Klick! But it is an important moment for Enchant who has floated around and given sparse content, and one that I think they would have to ride out more if he was mafia, if that makes sense? When you do something out of the norm from what you have done previously, it gets people's attention! And I am unsure if Enchant would get this annoyed if they were mafia.

I think this is a fair point in Enchant's favor

UNVOTE:

[Klick]

VOTE: Malakittens

[Klick]

Why is Students of Prudence scum

[Klick]

These current wagons are in that awkward tier where i don’t feel comfortable calling them scum but i don’t have a for sure reasoning to townread them.
I thought Frog’s reaction to my unvote seemed a bit townie, but then again scum!Alisae could probably fake it?
Then again, i think that ironically scum!Alisae might put in more effort into this game than what we are seeing here so maybe that slot really just is town.

I agree with this logic for Frogs being town

I'm fairly ambivalent towards the Prudence wagon. I feel like furtive makes his alignment really obvious with time and I'm not quite at a conclusion with them yet. But maybe I'm just behind on them being obvscum or something.

Fine with a hammer whenever, gonna do some background solving but I don't really care to push the game in any particular direction atm.

[Klick]

VOTE: Students of Prudence

Scum claim

[Klick]

My list of absolute town that should never be limmed is currently at:

Frogs
TemporalLich
NorwegianboyEE
Doctor Drew
Peregrine

[Klick]

It's okay you're town and we have time

[Klick]

VOTE: Students of Prudence

Scum claim

Yes, you did.

This game has been a frustrating one for me. It felt like certain players had a problem with us as users. You know you don't have to be rude to players you're claiming to scumread. Thanks to FL for modding and thanks to RH for inviting me. Sorry I seemed to poison our slot.

-F

I'm not sure who did this and if you're claiming I did this then, uh, no I didn't?

[Klick]

I think kuribo has made the Mala slot significantly townier

[Klick]

Irrespective of Prudence's flip here's where my reads currently stand

Frogs
TemporalLich
NorwegianboyEE
Doctor Drew
Peregrine
Kitty Trauma Team

Firebringer
Ranger
Theta Alpine

Emperor flippyNips

Here There Be Dragons
Enchant
WhemeStar


As per usual none of the bottom tier are like particularly strong scumreads but the top town are never scum and the tier below it is probably also 0-1 scum

[Klick]

I am tracker, Klick visited Whemestar.

This is not true

[Klick]

oh my god that is a tracker guilty

I thought Klick was obvious town...

pedit: because I scumread whemestar

but the flip and tracker claim equals a freaking tracker guilty

Seems logical that Theta was killed by Wheme because Theta submitted the Mafia NK? Unless there's another explanation for the Theta death that seems like the obvious explanation.

[Klick]

as for enchant... idk

I still think emperor flippynips and here there be dragons is scum

I think these are both very high equity scum flips

[Klick]

well alright if we're going to start making those noises

we and flippy are theta's neighbors. i think he could still possibly be scum, but we aren't both scum

id like to argue that my pointing out in hood that theta's worrying about being vigged was weird is town indicative but you do you i guess

also can we like chat today or something klick instead of whatever you're currently doing with us. idk im not good at real time interaction but im just sort of confused by your talking exclusively about me rather than to me.

-c

Hello! What would you like to talk about?

I'm in a place where I feel rather good about a large amount of townreads. The Theta scum flip was affirming with my end-of-D1 reads. Namely, the players I'm most interested in right now as potential suspects are you, flippyNips, Ranger and Enchant.

More generally I don't do that great at talking to people in order to get an accurate read on them. I'm too willing to believe what people say in direct conversation. I find I do best with a more removed lens when it comes to reading individuals.

I just don't really have a reason to think you don't fit nicely into one of the available scum slots left.

[Klick]

Happy to talk about other reads as well. I'm feeling confident in the following players being town, in about this order:

Kitty Trauma Team
Frogs
TemporalLich
Peregrine
Doctor Drew
NorwegianboyEE

[Klick]

Enchant is an excellent place to end up today but I'd like to see if there's anything more appealing

[Klick]

Explicitly yes
Outside of the six players I have completely shut down as options, I would like to leave my options open

[Klick]

Don't know how much we're allowed to discuss Team Mafia yet if at all so I'm going to abstain from that for the moment.

I don't have a reason I believe in to think you're town. And this is different than from what I've seen from either you OR Fen in games where you've both been pretty obvtown! I know you're capable of making me see your alignment so I'm not sure why I'm not seeing it yet. Sitting strangely in a pile of null is a scumtell. It's not just 'I don't think there's anything Ceph couldn't fake,' it's 'this energy isn't giving me the impression that these players are town when I know they are capable of giving that energy as town'.

[Klick]

I'm not in a headspace to hack my mind for the details of exactly why I've come to the conclusions I've come to

Over the last few months I've played a few games with Alisae and we're friendly, and a lot of my current town game is inspired by watching Alisae play and hard agreeing with how e obtains reads, so I'd say I understand how e plays as town fairly well even if I can't explain it very well

Alisae's posting in this game feels authentic. I feel like e is giving real genuine thoughts on the game the way I would expect from eir as town. I think e cares about the right amount about the thoughts e is giving for it to be authentic town posting and not driven by a scum agenda.

[Klick]

Drew has made quite a few posts that have made me immediately go 'well that's obvtown' without a ton of further thought
It has happened enough times that I have not evaluated it further and am just assuming its correct
I realise that has room for error and that's why he is towards the bottom but I also don't believe it's a wrong read at all

[Klick]

If there's scum on both wagons and if Frogs is town, this would mean scum went from one mislim wagon, to a different mislim wagon, to a

third

mislim wagon on Students. (Not accounting for there also being a WhemeStar wagon.)
Largely as a group.

Scum generally don't act in that manner. They

can

, if they want to strongly be unified, end the day early, or if they want to save scum. Usually, the answer is something else.

Can you back up that assertion

[Klick]

The wagon evidence presented in Ranger's 1848 just makes me think scum in {Ranger, flippyNips, Dragons} is even more likely than before

[Klick]

VOTE: Ranger

I think Ranger/flippy and Ranger/Dragons are both very viable

[Klick]

So you're going to make the statement but have me go back it up for you
I'd rather you demonstrate it if you want to convince me

I have very little problem with the specific scumteams of {Theta/Ranger/flippy} or {Theta/Ranger/Dragons} behaving the way they have specifically here with their votes regardless of general trends across the entirety of MS

[Klick]

The wagon evidence presented in Ranger's 1848 just makes me think scum in {Ranger, flippyNips, Dragons} is even more likely than before

It's possible.
Emperor flippyNips certainly is no beacon of towniness. Dragons I briefly thought scum, and even now at null they could be.

However, there seems to be a focus on the wagons as evidence.

I've much stronger evidence.

I've believed Frogs scum by play the entire game.
I believe Frogs' role is a scum role.
I believe Frogs fits the profile of a Theta Alpine scumbuddy.

I truly believe if you want scum dead, the best chance is Frogs.

You're wrong. I have stronger evidence than you that Frogs is town

[Klick]

What you're saying isn't convincing to me and I think you're scum

[Klick]

I'll have to reread Day 2 apparently...

Ranger is being wagoned and idk why

Because she fits as scum better than anyone else

[Klick]

I don't really understand your argument for Enchant's thing making me conftown either TL

[Klick]

Firebriar you vastly overestimate my scum game

[Klick]

Why do you think Klick could be scum?

40% for how he is interacting with ali
20% for his given stances/progression
and other 40 because i need to make this up to 100%

I'm curious about details of both of these

[Klick]

Why do you think Klick could be scum?

40% for how he is interacting with ali
20% for his given stances/progression
and other 40 because i need to make this up to 100%

I'm curious about details of both of these

You are too attached to alisae and i think that its either informed or your buddies. I am less so on the second where I go one of you two is scum.

As far as second its more of extension of some of our arguments day 1 and i don't think ur positions are what they would be as town here.

Talking with Alisae is giving me motivation to care about this game to the extent that I do
I am filling a similar role for Ali (ref: the neighbourhood)

We solve very similarly and I am talking with Ali because I think it's a good way to arrive at an accurate solve

[Klick]

I also had most of my takes on the game before I did any engagement with Ali and they've stayed largely consistent
I'm not using Ali as a way to have realistic reads or something, if anything it would make more sense to assume the opposite

[Klick]

Talking with Alisae is giving me motivation to care about this game to the extent that I do
I am filling a similar role for Ali (ref: the neighbourhood)

We solve very similarly and I am talking with Ali because I think it's a good way to arrive at an accurate solve

This isn't new to this game day.
It was going on day 1 too

Sure that doesn't really change anything
I don't feel heavily invested here rn but I like solving with Ali

[Klick]

Klick put it pretty eloquently in the wolf PT.

How brazen

[Klick]

DAMMIT I should have posted green m&m

[Klick]

Talking with Alisae is giving me motivation to care about this game to the extent that I do
I am filling a similar role for Ali (ref: the neighbourhood)

We solve very similarly and I am talking with Ali because I think it's a good way to arrive at an accurate solve

This isn't new to this game day.
It was going on day 1 too

Sure that doesn't really change anything
I don't feel heavily invested here rn but I like solving with Ali

cool that's super unhelpful for the rest of us and ali's thought process will remain as opaque to me as it has been the whole game

-c

Show me what helpful reads and takes look like Ceph. Teach me how to play like a good townie

Is it by debating logically the exact reasons why I have come to the conclusion that {Ranger, flippyNips, Dragons} is the most likely place for scum to be?

I often have reasons that do not sound persuasive to a general audience of Mafia players (some of whom are scum whose job is to deconstruct the correct narrative), but nonetheless have fairly accurate reads. This is something we discussed about a week ago in this thread. You said you found it relatable.

If it's not that, then what do I do to be a good helpful townie for you?

[Klick]

Ali is town because e cares about this game at basically the right level of motivation for being vaguely-disinterested town. It's basically the same level I'm at.

All Ali is really doing right now is attempting to solve the game with the little attention e is devoting to it. When Ali makes a post, it's to make an observation e has noticed, and there's no discernable agenda outside of that. E is a fairly open book with eir thought process in the right mindset.

I'm making this post and it's not going to seriously impact anyone's read on the Frogs slot and yet it is reasoning that makes me 99% confident the slot is town.

[Klick]

I have role reasons for this.

I tried to send norwee something
I got disabled while doing so and thats because my action redirected to Wheme

and scum also tried to kill Norwee

Norwee is town 100%

Norwee was already 95% town but ty

[Klick]

Norwee kill makes a lot of sense

[Klick]

Emperor flippyNips [4]: TemporalLich, Enchant, Peregrine, Doctor Drew
Ranger [4]: NorwegianboyEE, Klick, Frogs, Firebringer

these are both all town wagons btw

Haha I thought this as well

[Klick]

you (and ali) could solve in the main thread where i can see it instead of hiding where i can't and treating each other like masons

-c

I've been doing a lot of solving in the main thread
You've even engaged with it!

I can specifically recall three times D1 where you went 'I don't think X is town' and then I went 'here is why I think X is town' and then you went 'oh'

[Klick]

Ali is town because e cares about this game at basically the right level of motivation for being vaguely-disinterested town. It's basically the same level I'm at.

All Ali is really doing right now is attempting to solve the game with the little attention e is devoting to it. When Ali makes a post, it's to make an observation e has noticed, and there's no discernable agenda outside of that. E is a fairly open book with eir thought process in the right mindset.

I'm making this post and it's not going to seriously impact anyone's read on the Frogs slot and yet it is reasoning that makes me 99% confident the slot is town.

how does this differ from what anyone else is doing

-c

Meta

[Klick]

would scum!ranger really be trying to obfuscate scum kill by going "ohh its obvious it was TL" when it was really Norwee. Probably?

That sounds about right

[Klick]

What I'm confused about is why Wheme didn't really hint at all in the neighbourhood that they were targeting Norwee

[Klick]

Looool

[Klick]

Why should I vote for flippy over you or Ranger?
Or otherwise who should I vote for?

Be the change you want to see in the world
'Show me how to be a good townie' was slightly tongue-in-cheek but seriously if you want people to explain their reads more openly, I'm confused why you're not opting to push your own view with reasoning more.

[Klick]

(That was @ Ceph)

[Klick]

If Ceph was in a place where he's one of the leading wagons and is likely to die today then I could understand his perspective a bit more
But he's not. The wagons are Ranger and flippyNips.
Realistically if one of them dies today and they flip town there's a decent chance the gamestate is different come D3 anyway
And if one of them flips scum that's a good thing

I don't understand Ceph's defeatism from a perspective that isn't 'one of my buddies is in trouble'

[Klick]

Why should I vote for flippy over you or Ranger?
Or otherwise who should I vote for?

Be the change you want to see in the world
'Show me how to be a good townie' was slightly tongue-in-cheek but seriously if you want people to explain their reads more openly, I'm confused why you're not opting to push your own view with reasoning more.

i am vla. i don't have reasoning or time to create any.

you should vote for me. because you are either scum or someone who needs to kill me to get your head screwed on straight.

What's your read on Ranger?
What reason do you have for thinking my head isn't screwed on straight in any way other than thinking you could be scum here?

[Klick]

actually yeah I do believe Dragons/Ranger would be a great scum team now, considering that Here There Be Dragons really tried to make Klick who is pretty much confirmed town look like scum with a gambit and that Ranger's recent posts have a scummy mindset

pedit: yeah let's wagon Here There Be Dragons

I kinda prefer Ranger. I think Dragons is making real bad posts right now, but not the type that would convince anyone so dunno if it’s scummy.

Sheep the conftown

And I agree that Ranger is a more likely scum flip than Dragons

[Klick]

actually yeah I do believe Dragons/Ranger would be a great scum team now, considering that Here There Be Dragons really tried to make Klick who is pretty much confirmed town look like scum with a gambit and that Ranger's recent posts have a scummy mindset

pedit: yeah let's wagon Here There Be Dragons

hmmm i think that would be the worst scum team of all time actually but go off king

Neither of you were in hot water until relatively recently

[Klick]

Frogs is just town, that's non-negotiable

You can try convincing me to care about reconsidering on Drew

[Klick]

If you're not enjoying posting don't feel obligated
Do something more fun and come back another time

[Klick]

Norwee kill makes a lot of sense

It doesn't.

Norwee wasn't widely townread by the vibes yesterday.
WhemeStar was.

WhemeStar being confirmed to target Norwee is confirmation WhemeStar was directly killed, and confirmation Theta Alpine was vigged by Kitty Trauma Team.

Completely backwards take

[Klick]

Frogs is just town, that's non-negotiable

And you wonder why I'm not negotiating with you.

I trust my scumread more than I trust your mysterious townread.

Ali is town because e cares about this game at basically the right level of motivation for being vaguely-disinterested town. It's basically the same level I'm at.

All Ali is really doing right now is attempting to solve the game with the little attention e is devoting to it. When Ali makes a post, it's to make an observation e has noticed, and there's no discernable agenda outside of that. E is a fairly open book with eir thought process in the right mindset.

I'm making this post and it's not going to seriously impact anyone's read on the Frogs slot and yet it is reasoning that makes me 99% confident the slot is town.

"""""" Mysterious """"""

[Klick]

First Ranger was pushing that Norwee couldn't be the kill
And now Ranger is positing a worldview where Norwee was the kill and it must be myself or Frogs
This also runs counter to the townread that Ranger has expressed on me that specifically doesn't change in the event that Frogs were to flip town

Ranger is peddling BS and needs to get limmed

[Klick]

Yeah because I investigated Theta Alpine last night.

Paraphrasing a Role PM takes seconds; fabricating a fakeclaim takes an eternity.

[Klick]

I think Klick would probably want to push Ranger through and I understand why they want to do it.
I see reasons why I'm hesitant but even if Ranger flips town i'm ok with that but I really would like to just kill a wolf today if that's possible and I think that should be very possible.
I would probably have higher confidence in Dragons flipping wolf > Ranger because like even Dragons is posting in way that makes me think things are going not good at all for them.

If Dragons doesn't think things are going well doesn't that imply exactly Dragons/Ranger in this situation?

[Klick]

I'd be pretty happy if I were scum!Dragons and town!Ranger was about to go through under the current logic

[Klick]

I'm interested in all three of those slots claiming as a concept

[Klick]

In the end I'm satisfied if today ends with any of Ranger/flippy/Dragons getting limmed and the difference between them in terms of who I think will flip scum isn't strongly defined in my head

I just don't want today to get away from that trio and I also want to reduce scum influence so that the lim isn't specifically guided towards the town in that group
Because I think even if we've got say 2 scum in that trio, eliminating the townie in that group makes it a lot tougher to power through

[Klick]

The only answer I can come up with is wolf!Ranger is so out of touch with what they think people will actually do and their reads that they think I'm a viable elimination

My read was that Ranger was trying to create more potential mislim options because right now their options are really poor

[Klick]

anyway idunno but my most of my other townreads are just so powerful that like I'm willing to kill Ranger because I can see why it could be a wolf, it makes sense to me, its the best place to look, in general a really good flip for me.

This is also where I'm at
If someone wants me interested outside of {Ranger, flippy, Dragons} they are going to need to put in some effort to make that case

[Klick]

The only answer I can come up with is wolf!Ranger is so out of touch with what they think people will actually do and their reads that they think I'm a viable elimination

My read was that Ranger was trying to create more potential mislim options because right now their options are really poor

That is technically what their play looks like, I agree. I see this. But it's not working and they're doubling down on it?

I think Ranger is aware enough of the optics of trying something that seems to be failing making the players in this game be inclined to reconsider

Like the 'I am solving the game.' projection she was doing at me earlier felt like she was fully aware of that

[Klick]

ig to really figure out the answer of that question you have to like, flip the chessboard around and think of what votes they could possibly play to and if they're playing to those votes.

I think there's a minority of people who are still in the mindset that you're scummy and the hope is to appeal to people with less WIM that Ranger is making the more reasonable case and that the townreads on you are not sufficiently founded

[Klick]

I think running a lawn mower through Rangers -> Dragons -> Flippy probably is a winning line

It sure is for the scum.

This is someone who was making a point of claiming ambivalence towards both Dragons and flippyNips about a dozen pages ago

[Klick]

This is me explicitly not getting into a back and forth correcting moonlogic with Ranger

[Klick]

flippyNips made one pop-in and activated their Superstar but didn't really do anything of actual substance

[Klick]

Superstar Fruit Vendor should mean literally nothing for alignment here and any attempts at trying to make it mean something for flippy's alignment are fruitless

[Klick]

Wow I am the worst

[Klick]

I disagree

[Klick]

OMGUS lmao

[Klick]

Now's your chance to post anything resembling content flippyNips

[Klick]

here's a late day 2 lead rist as I sense the day is ending soon

[Town]

Klick - Pretty much confirmed town, also towny mindset
Enchant - Unlikely to be scum, however late Day 2 posts are pretty much NAI
NorwegianboyEE - Thoughtstreaming town mindset still, obvious town
Peregrine - quite towny indeed actually
Firebringer - Even townier than early Day 2
Doctor Drew - Day 2 posts still good
frogs - Late Day 2 posts are good actually...
Kitty Trauma Team - I want to scumread here for the Enchant interaction but I want to townread here for the genuine emotion, no posts since the early D2 lead rist
Here There Be Dragons - Same upward trend in towniness, currently reading as null
Emperor flippyNips - Theta Alpine flip suggests emperor flippynips is scum, not much content and the Day 2 posts are strange, No posts since the early D2 lead rist
Ranger - Lockscum, scummy mindset and scummy explanation for claim

[Scum]

This person most likely targets Klick and flippy, no? They could go for me I guess, but that doesn't seem the most likely scenario with the Ranger flip in play.

I'm not seeing clear indications of what he could have done night 1. Frogs seems like a possibility, except that he arrived to Day 2 still calling Frogs scum which would be contradicted by what amounts to a result on them.

Of course, this player is ridiculous, so trying to divine their actions may be a fruitless endeavor.

My initial thought was that TL was trying to clear me and had targeted myself and Wheme
I don't think it's a given but I'm surprised it's not coming up as a possibility for you at all using just this post as context

[Klick]

To be completely fair the counterargument to me being clear is 'TL went through an in-thread thought process to come to the conclusion that I'm conftown and previously tried to say there was a guilty on me'
So it's not clear-cut

I'd talk about it more but 5am

[Klick]

Going to look at this game with a clear mind tonight. My focus is going to be on solidifying a town bloc and finding a sensible vote from there.

[Klick]

Also I still think that Emperor is a good vote but!! I have the feeling I am missing something because no one has jumped on voting him despite his end of day hammer and if there is a reason I shouldn’t vote him, I would appreciate it being shared!

I do sort of agree, I'm just nervous about it - something feels off

-c

I do agree with the sentiment that something feels off fwiw.

[Klick]

Players that have very towny energy today:

Kitty Trauma Team
Enchant
Peregrine

[Klick]

Dragons is there a fairly good reason flippyNips shouldn't full claim today?
(I am assuming from context that they have full claimed to you in hood but that could be wrong)

[Klick]

I feel like your assumptions are unfair!
You're not there because, again, I have the same high confidence in your scum game that you have.

[Klick]

Yeah I want flippy to explicitly full claim ASAP.

[Klick]

Hint: my Drew townread is stale and I want to reevaluate it. I feel like teams are starting to not make sense without him.

[Klick]

I've not paid loads of attention to what FB was doing, what did he claim to do?

[Klick]

Ohhh the thing early D2 let me go back and see it

[Klick]

Can you full claim please?

[Klick]

I think flippy's town and that means Frogs is like 99% town as well

[Klick]

If we trust the setup info that's in front of us and assume flippy town, these are all town:

Klick
Frogs
NorwegianboyEE
Emperor flippyNips

Leaving:

Kitty Trauma Team
Here There Be Dragons
Enchant
NorwegianboyEE
Peregrine

[Klick]

I think flippy's town and that means Frogs is like 99% town as well

What's the connection?

-c

Flippy's Weak
Flippy targeted Frogs
Flippy didn't die

[Klick]

Dragons did flippy claim to you that they were targeting Frogs overnight?

[Klick]

I think I have given town!Dragons some confidence to push a scumread
I don't think I have given scum!Dragons confidence to make a case on a townie

[Klick]

If we trust the setup info that's in front of us and assume flippy town, these are all town:

Klick
Frogs
NorwegianboyEE
Emperor flippyNips

Leaving:

Kitty Trauma Team
Here There Be Dragons
Enchant
NorwegianboyEE
Peregrine

Am i schrodingers slot.

Whoops, Drew in second list, not you lol

[Klick]

Flippy what hints if any did you leave for who you were targeting?

[Klick]

I’m gonna give a frog some fruit

...fair point!

[Klick]

If we trust the setup info that's in front of us and assume flippy town, these are all town:

Klick
Frogs
NorwegianboyEE
Emperor flippyNips

Leaving:

Kitty Trauma Team
Here There Be Dragons
Enchant
NorwegianboyEE
Peregrine

Why Norwegianboy is in conftown?

Wait a second I think you're right that Norwee isn't confirmed.

We know that Wheme targeted Norwee because of FB's redirected action. We DON'T know that Norwee was the nightkill, I believe?

[Klick]

If we can get away with it!! Later is always better when it comes to claiming so I would prefer tomorrow!!!

I disagree with this on a philosophical level fwiw
Early massclaims are legit

[Klick]

Also, I was wondering when Ceph would actually try to case me after just yelling 'scum!' at me all game whenever someone townread me. Guess they were just waiting for someone to 'give them the confidence' as Klick put it(which seems a bit manipulative by Klick as well).

Take a stance.

What's your read on Ceph
What's your read on me
What do you think is happening.

[Klick]

VOTE: Drew

[Klick]

You want to insist on positioning in the high ground to disguise the fact that you know you can't give honest answers. You're waffling on pushback.

Yeah this feels right

[Klick]

Fabricated depth

[Klick]

So you think flippy has chosen to clear town!Frogs for lols? Someone who in that world was probably one of the most viable counter-eliminations to flippy coming into today?

[Klick]

So you think flippy has chosen to clear town!Frogs for lols? Someone who in that world was probably one of the most viable counter-eliminations to flippy coming into today?

I don't think they thought it through tbh.

They are just worried about self preservation.

And Flippy you are making my point, you arent actually clearing Frogs, but just saying to try to 'clear' your name.

I don't buy 'they didn't think it through' as reasoning for flippyNips clearing a townie. This feels more like you need it to be reasonable to you than you actually thinking it's reasonable.

[Klick]

I have a theory but I also have work

[Klick]

Q: What are scum doing right now
A: Nothing at all (as that is what everyone is doing)

Q: Why

I think there are a few possible solutions to this and finding out the answer could lead to scum

If Drew is scum I find it likely that his partner (definitely assuming 2 scum left) is someone with very little WIM because they're literally just letting this wagon happen.

If Drew is town I think the scumteam are probably just incredibly comfortable with the current situation.

[Klick]

You spend all game shading the fuck out of me and you think you're going to tell me what I should and shouldn't post about?

[Klick]

I agree with that fully as an elim pool

[Klick]

If I take claims at face value, the 'ethos' of this setup is a bunch of janky somewhat investigative stuff that is balanced out by a combination of some of the roles killing themselves and a decent amount of action-blocking power

[Klick]

I want to be motivated to solve this game this game should be ez donezo but I can't make myself push for it

Is that just because it's like Drew/flippy or is there something else going on

[Klick]

If it's Drew/flippy wtf are they doing

[Klick]

I can't help but feel that scum is either comfortable or completely checked out

[Klick]

doesn't that narrow them down to like, everyone

-c

I don't think Enchant is scum rn by this criteria
You feel town from it
I think Frogs stasis is town-indicative, scum!Alisae likes to do things

[Klick]

I think {Drew, flippy, Norwee, Peregrine} contains all scum

[Klick]

Mech annoys me
I really want to understand what the hell is going on with Peregrine being Ascetic and receiving fruit

[Klick]

My theory for this a couple of days ago was that Peregrine is scum, fakeclaimed Ascetic, received fruit, and claimed to receive the fruit out of some sort of concern of whoever sent the fruit knowing their action went through

But it feels kind of crackpot out loud

[Klick]

Welcome,

TemporalLich

, you are a self-aligned

Kraken

.

Spoiler:

Abilities:

• You are a Kraken! At night, you must target 2 players. You may target a recently deceased scum player. (If they were just executed).
• You are unkillable during the night and if you are ever faded, you will stay alive and have a Night Action the following night before retreating.
• You will leave the game at the beginning of Day 3.
• This is a

Variant

Role.

Win condition:

You win when you successfully target 2 players in Private Threads from different alignments before Day 3.

Game thread is here. . Confirm by replying to this PM with your role name.

You have to assume this has somewhere near a balanced chance of winning, right?
What kind of scum setup would make this balanced?

[Klick]

I feel like there aren't scum around who want to collapse on a Drew vote because Drew is just scum.

[Klick]

If Drew was town I don't think Dragons and myself would be the only two slots voting him.

[Klick]

Drew what have you done in this game that I should be townreading you for

[Klick]

Right, I've had dinner, I've sufficiently chilled myself out, I'm all alone on a Friday night, let's crack this game open.

[Klick]

Sausages and root veg, pretty simple!

[Klick]

Okay so I fell asleep while trying to crack the game wide open
I will now continue the quest

[Klick]

I've just done a meta dive on Doctor Drew. My suspicion was correct, his town and scum games are completely night and day. As town he's very free and confident, significantly more sarcastic, comfortable, and has his filter off. He isn't afraid to upset.
His scum game is watered-down. On the whole he gives much more straightforward content. He projects the reads he wants to be seen by the thread before committing to them, giving a sort of trail to see his progression from. He isn't comfortable, he is much more reserved and tries to be friendlier.

UNVOTE:

This is his town game. If he's scum here it's a massive deviation from his usual pattern of play.

[Klick]

I also think his progression on Theta doesn't happen if they're partners. He's properly pushing Theta. Drew!scum prefers to shade and distance while developing natural-looking discussion between himself and his buddy. Here Drew just... has a suspicion.

[Klick]

FlippyNips have you literally ever been scum lmao

[Klick]

The last games I can find, one was Wake's 50p Large Normal and the other was like 3 years ago
I don't feel like I can get that accurate of an impression of your scum play

[Klick]

Traitors are really confusing in that they often look quite a lot like town

[Klick]

If I die today I’m not taking the blame for “playing bad” that’s on y’all playing bad. Don’t blame me for not being town enough when I’ve laid everything out in front of you minus who to kill. I’m in the same boat as the rest of the town. I got one person who’s conf town to me and they’re still out here saying I’m sus, ain’t that bitch

Who is saying you're playing bad???

I just can't decide if you're town or not

[Klick]

Wait a second we're dumb we should be directing flippy's target tonight and not flipping them.

[Klick]

No matter how I slice it I'm down to {flippy, Dragons, Peregrine} as my PoE

[Klick]

Proposal:
Vote Peregrine
Flippy targets Dragons tonight

[Klick]

Can frogs be scum yet? Please?

VOTE: Flippy and if it's drew I'm not taking the blame for the L

-c

My gut response when reading this is to feel like you have no feelings on whether Drew actually IS town or scum, but you're annoyed that he is now being considered less.

I feel like a viable response you could have made as town here would have been to have a quick skim through Drew's meta yourself and confirm whether what I was saying was true or not.

I feel like the response you've given, while still possible as town, is kind of the response you'd need to give as scum because you want to come back to Drew as an option later.

[Klick]

I don't understand what's going on with Peregrine's role at all. The receiving fruit thing is baffling all around.

Maybe we just lim Dragons for being more likely scum and leash flippy onto someone else just in case there's a deepwolf in like Mala/you/Norwee.

[Klick]

I don’t undersrand why we would give Flippy a break so he can "target someone", what would that achieve for us?

If Flippy is town he clears someone by targeting them and not dying
He guilties them by dying

[Klick]

If he's scum he has to clear someone from our pool as well

[Klick]

I will overtly claim that I do not vend fruit.

[Klick]

Well if they are weak they could theorically die.

Oh they are weak?
Ngl i forgot they even claimed modifier.
I might be ok voting Dragons, maybe Peregrine then.

UNVOTE:

I also forgot Drew's entire role claim lmao

[Klick]

Has anyone posted a full list of role claims?

[Klick]

Whatever happened with Peregrine is bonkers regardless of Peregrine's alignment

You either have to assume scum have some sort of Fruit Vendor role and decided to target ascetic Peregrine with it, AND it somehow went through

Or you have to assume that Peregrine is scum, claimed Ascetic, and then also claimed to receive a fruit

These are both silly and I think trying to conclude either way based on our current info is fruitless
Therefore we should throw the whole thing out of consideration for now until we have better grounds for making a judgement there

In the meantime, Peregrine is one of the few players left who is viable scum and we'd be within reason to flip them on those grounds.

[Klick]

Enchant is never scum
Norwee is never scum
Frogs is like 99% never scum, and if they're scum it's with exactly flippy
Mala and Drew are very very towny

Flippy/Dragons/Peregrine.

[Klick]

Wait a second with the roles we have left we should have a very very busted night tonight especially if we hit scum

[Klick]

Mala has a 1-shot Tracker left
Flippy has Weak modifier

Okay not that busted but still we get quite a lot of info in theory

[Klick]

I think this game makes the most sense if the Ascetic is scum
Regardless I think we get the most info if we eliminate the Ascetic

[Klick]

We lim Peregrine
Mala tracks flippy
Flippy sends fruit to Dragons

Seems like a good use of night actions? I'm not sure if it's a good idea to direct Dragons' Stickyfruit?

[Klick]

I think Dragons gives Stickyfruit to Enchant is good

[Klick]

The problem is there's no one that actually feels *good* as scum

I fully agree that if I'm going off vibes Peregrine feels more town than scum

But there's not a player in this game I feel I could say otherwise about atm

That's why I'm trying to raise my bar for towny behaviour and discount the rest as potentially fake

The PoE I land on is flippy, Dragons, and Peregrine

[Klick]

People with towny vibes can be scum and kind of have to be in this circumstance at least for me