Explosiva Mafia - GAME OVER

[the silent speaker]

Random Vote: Silent Speaker for defying the laws of logic.

This from someone who claims not to be carbon-based.

Looking over the playerlist,

alvinz95

caught my eye. It is obviouz that the Z is for zcum.

[the silent speaker]

Posting and running to weigh in that I support Max, Battousai and Coron as explosions, more or less in that order, for reasons all already stated (Coron is a clear third, because of the volume and content of his posts); and that I think BM and M4yhem and Armlx are probably all town. Tar I have no sense of whatsoever.

[the silent speaker]

I disagree with much of Tar's PBPA on forbiddanlight, but this:

Interesting. A shame though, I don't get to see the ridiculous playstyle of DGB in action because you blow up today . So is there actually a voting phase? Seems kinda counter intuitive.

contains a strong scumtell and is important to note.

I also strongly dislike Coron's response to TDC. It feels like a very sharp backtrack.

[the silent speaker]

The forbiddan scumtell was the "woe and alas" one.

As regards Coron, I felt that when TDC caught him out on acting in a way different from his previously stated position, Coron's response was an angry backlash of "No, that's not my previously stated position, my real position is the opposite of what it looked like on the surface, which I am telling you now that that is the convenient posture for me to take so as not to look like scum." The simple "acting according to his previously stated self-scum meta" as TDC noted it to be was a minor point at best, but Coron's chosen method of defense made me think VERY scummy indeed.

[the silent speaker]

vote:battousai, Coron, and 1/2 vote each on forbiddanlight and Max

[the silent speaker]

Reread forthcoming. I would ask Coron why me, but I suspect it has to do with my dereliction for much of last week. (As a side note, I don't think that the posts I

have

made have been contentless, though I believe that charge has been made. I have been taking stances on people; I have just been using other people's logic, and that's because when six pages can sprout in a day, the things I would say have likely been said.)

[the silent speaker]

Vote: DragonsofSummer

mainly

because

I haven't got much of a read on him, nad this is as good a way as any to get one. But also, I compare these:

Tarhalindur doesn't seem like a terrible choice to me either given that he has had two posts that were completely without content, and has made a baseless accusation because of, according to him, IIoA.

(This was DOS's third post of the game, btw, so there's a little bit of hypocrisy in complaining that Tar had made only two posts.)

FL: Do you not agree with IIoA? and for that matter who do you feel is committing IIoA that Tar is ignoring?

The first quote suggests that DOS doesn't think IIOA is a basis for an accusation, but the second implies that

he

adopts IIOA and is surprised that FL does not.

[the silent speaker]

Crazy, did you look at DOS's first two posts? Reproduced in full:

Vote Crazy between him and some of the other players in this game there is just too much craziness going around!

I don't get why so many people are trying to bring this game back to how the bomb works/ why the scum would give it to a certain person. It doesn't make any sense to me and I feel like it is hindering the hunting of scum.

unvote vote Max

A protest of "he was talking about content, not quality" does not, to my mind, create a distinction with a difference.

As for the second point, when I hear somebody saying, "Why, person, don't you believe in X?" I take as an inference that somebody believes in X and is mildly surprised that person disagrees. When somebody elsewhere says, "This is a piece of nonsense like X," I take as an inference that somebody doesn't believe in X. DOS made one statement essentially equivalent to the first and one statement essentially equivalent to the second, both statements concerning the same X, which was the value of Information instead of Analysis as a scum tell. I noted this as a seming contradiction. Is this a strong point? No. Did I say it was a strong point? Also no.

[the silent speaker]

Don't be so hard on them, Coron; they are, after all, Ohioans.

[the silent speaker]

Still here, still treading posts.

[the silent speaker]

Some quick-hit thoughts:
1. Pages 1 and 2 have an interaction between BM, Iron Man, and possibly Alvinz that looks strange and fake.
2.

I'm sure with this group, the scum have plenty of meta knowledge between them already.

This looks like inside knowledge about the scum.
3.

Fos: Battousai, alvinz95, anyone else who doesn't know how the bomb works.

Seriously, people, didn't you read the game rules before signing up? Noone is that ignorant, surely, I don't buy it.

M4yhem speaks wisely hee. But WTF is up with forbiddanlight in the same post?
4. Max has the "woe and alas" scumtell in post 94. Also I agree with BM that Max's question in the same post rings alse; it's not, after all, like speculation over why DGB had gotten the bomb hadn't been made seventeen times in the last three pages.
5. Armlx wins the BM-armlx-myhem debate bottom of page 4 FLAWLESS VICTORY, which is odd because BM wasn't advocating a policy lynch at all. He said lynch a lurker

unless someone acts scummy

. Since no one points this out, it strikes in favor of both armlx and BM.
6. Coron post 105 inside knowledge scumtell.
7. Haschel speaks truth to power.
8. I do not like BM 118. Way to change the meaning of Max's post to its complete opposite, man.
9. The fact that M4yhem and armlx are still worrying the lyrkerlynch issue two pages after it stopped bein relevant gives me good feelings about them both; they feel like townies stuck on something (even though they shouldn't be).
10. Why does Coron feel that "reputation" would even be considered to cut any ice?
11. Iron Man and forbiddan pop in to the lurkerlynch discussion, which reads a little odd at this juncture, but a LOT less time had passed in RL than in thread time.
(11a. At the risk of beating a dead horse, this game has much less of a need to lynch lurkers than normal, since in a regular game, the lurker is hurting the town most with the absence of his vote. In this game, the absence of the lurker's vote does nothing, since it doesn't count anyway so long as he isn't the bomb. We still lose less future analysis by blowing up an all-else-equal lurker over an all-else-equal participator, but how often will all else be equal?)
12.

Finally, is no one gonna tell me what Information Instead of Analysis voting is all about?

It's called a "scumtell". Agree with it or don't, but Tar, who agrees with it, is voting on the basis of his scumtells. Since you know what it stands for, what are you asking here?
13. After reading BM and Coron trade insullts again, I still don't get the point of what they were trying to say. I know the words, but the sentences aren't creating a sensible causal chain. Was that whole thing staged?
That'll do for now, esp. with a CPU quote message...

[the silent speaker]

No one had SAID what it stood for or what it meant until AFTER I asked.

If no one had said what it stood for, then how did you know to ask about

Information Instead of Analysis

as opposed to "IIoA"?

[the silent speaker]

Limited access due to Jewish holidays. Fussbudget internet does not help.

[the silent speaker]

Am here, still backlogged, proffering apologies in full knowledge that same are insufficient.

[the silent speaker]

Alvinz comes out kind of badly on page 21, but I have an ugly vibe from forbiddan's posts. Lines like "It's alright to look at me, since I have naught to hide." are probably a big part of what does it.
Max 511 has completely misunderstood alvinz, but I think his outrage is not feigned. However Max 524 wants Killa Seven to die, which is inconsistent.
K7's counter-demand to Tar's blowup request feels false. Battousai and BM had curious reactions to it.
Note 544 for later.
Max 549 WTF?
I like Max 574. I don't agree, but I like the post. For interaction purposes it was Coron, forbiddan and K7, plus M4yhem, with Dragons opposing. I dout highly the first three are all scum, but two in the set of four is very possible. (M4yhem is not in the set.)
BM 578 chainsaw much?
Killa Seven 588 ugly, ugly post.
I'm liking Batt 590, especially first paragraph. His point 3 and onward is a little feh, though.
I begin to be predisposed against forbiddan, but I'm not crazy about 618. It would matter more if his vote counted, but there's an attitude there toward who she suspects I don't like much.
Max 621 is completely incoherent. Armlx 622 is remarkably forgiving of him.
Battousai 629 plus points, but I mind his reluctance to use names. Yes it was applicable to more than M4yhem, but it was applicable to M4yhem and that in itself is germane.
BM 649 is crap reasoning.
As Alvinz 650 immediately notes.
In fairness, a lot of people have reasoning that is not all that great. Haschel notes Twomz for this and he's not alone, either.
Alvinz 668: if you have multiple suspects you shouldn't

want

to attack just one of them. That way you get more reactions, you get associations among your suspects allowing you to refine your suspicions, and you get insurance against tunneling on the wrong one.
No one else comments on this, interestingly, though M4yhem chides Alvinz for it on other grounds. Armlx likes Alvinz around here, more than max anyway.
Battousai 709 dislike. Someone who asks to die

but is posting good scumhunting content otherwise

should live, and someone who is not posting good scumhunting content should have the same or similar scrutiny whether he asks to die or no.
Coron has gone DEAD SILENT. This is a HUGE flip from earlier, and makes me nearly sure that BM-Coron was a distraction on the part of at least one.

Vote: Coron

I think Batt is less likely to be scum but not ruled out. Forbiddan and K7 are two top choices for me. BM is much more minus than he was earlier. Max mystifies me.

[the silent speaker]

Coron should be on your death list. Not only has he suddenly gone silent, which is a significant change from the beginning of the game, but at one point he made his own meta regarding frequency of posting an issue (and engaged in a bit of doubletalk when called on whether his data supported his claim). The combination is the square of the scummy of the sum of its parts. Also, a lot of the contrived-looking exchanges have Coron as a common thread.

[the silent speaker]

I think the case on Coron is a bit stronger than

that

, JDodge. His most egregious contrived-sounding exchange was with Battle Mage, around pages 4-10, though there were others; in fact, I don't offhand remember a single time he got into an argument with armlx. Furthermore, I think that when a player makes the frequency of his own posting an issue and then displays inconsistency both in what he claims the frequency of his posting indicates and in the actual frequency of his posting, this warrants more than a passing mention.

Additionally, he earlier attempted to get people to literally blindly follow him on the basis solely of his reputation as a good player on Mafiascum; and he made this post for his first of the game:

I suspect the scum are made up of people who have been around for around or under 2 years, but with at least one person with a good amount of experience. I could be right or wrong, but this is my general feel so far.

Max, please explicate the contradiction between your posts 511 and 524.

[the silent speaker]

514, my mistake.

[the silent speaker]

I prefer a Coron or forbiddan bombing to an Alvinz one. Since I think Coron just got replaced,

vote: forbiddan

.

[the silent speaker]

I'm game to keep going.

[the silent speaker]

Of the players listed:
I think Max is town. Don't bomb him.
I have a pro-town vibe on Alvinz. I think he's a townie who's done a few scummy things.
I have a faint pro-town vibe from Twomz.
Battle Mage has done some deeply scummy things, and some deeply townie things. I recommend keeping him alive until we know more about Coron/ortolan.
Iceman and spring, probably one is scum and the other is town. There's some interactio there, which leads me to think this.

Iceman

for preferred lynch, because spring comes over (reading her posts in isolation) as spring seems to be very pushy-jumpy but that pushy-jumpiness is a playstyle rather than an affectation. The last sentence probably made more sense in my head.

My preferred lynch is still ortolan, but that is not an option. He's the last of my initial set of suspects still alive, except for some suspicion of DOS and that is only a small thing but unopposed, which means reread time.

[the silent speaker]

Is there a good reason not to bomb ortolan? Because I don't think there is one. (Note: this is not advocating an explosion without a hearing, only an explosion

after

due process of lynch.) For the other scum, it's obv not Max and it's obv not Haschel, which leaves Twomz, Dragons and spring. I reckon Dragons

>

spring>>Twomz but could be persuaded to shift the first two.

[the silent speaker]

I say give ortolan a dice spot if he hasn't already got one.

[the silent speaker]

We are now in bomb or lose.

Dragons, my choice is solely between you and spring. Persuade me to bomb him and not you.
Spring, my choice is solely between you and K7. Persuade me to bomb him and not you.
K7, my choice is solely between you and Twomz. Persuade me to bomb him and not you.
Twomz, my choice is solely between you and Dragons. Persuade me to bomb him and not you.
Max may present a case against any two players of his choice, but like all players, he is required to submit at least one.

Additionally, any player may at any time present a case why any two specific people are both scum.

Any player may refute any other player's arguments, if they feel that those arguments contain a logical fallacy. I encourage all players to do so. However, please note:

said refutation will be contrued to imply that the player doing the refuting believes that the player who made the argument is scum,

and

that he believes the player about whom the argument was made is town. If you do not wish to leave this implication, say so explicitly.

[the silent speaker]

That's correct, Max. I want each player to present their case as though only they and their named other are eligible for the explosion. You are an exception because I like you, but I still insist on a case on

somebody

from you, and at least the name of the other person you thnk is scum.

In addition to the mandatory case, all players are encouraged to make a case that any two people of their choosing are specfically scum.

[the silent speaker]

After a week, only Max has done as commanded (halfway, as he has not said who his other suspect is). I am Displeased.

[the silent speaker]

Mod, please prod those players who have not posted on this page.

Max, please present your other name by Sunday whether the player has posted or not. (A case would also be appreciated if possible, but the case presented on DOS is acknowledged as substantial compliance.)

[the silent speaker]

I have put in a second request for a modprod. This one to all players.

Final warning.

[the silent speaker]

Then you know what to do about that, don't you, killa seven?

[the silent speaker]

That's your whole case? I should bomb Twomz/Silverphoenix because Twomz lurked? We are WAY too late in the game for a lurker lynch. Do better.

Speakinawhich, Silverphoenix, it's later. Make with the content or suffer my wrath.

Max, you do realize you highlighted Dragons attacking scum, right?

[the silent speaker]

My last final is Monday. All cases must be in by then. Max, you owe me a name, don't think I forgot.

[the silent speaker]

Bomb: Springlullaby

[the silent speaker]

He didn't. Haschel did, mostly. I figured at the end there was a decent chance of it, him or Max and more likely K7, because I couldn't fathom why I would have been the bomb otherwise; but I decided to punt on that because if they weren't both scum (which I didn't think) I had good enough odds picking out the scum from the other players, even more so if neither was scum, and if they

were

both scum, they deserved to win and the town deserved to lose.