Stars Aligned II - Game Over!

[VP Baltar]

Noise, but I warded someone. Kinda surprised that more people didn't actually.

And Amished, I've turned over a new leaf. I'm trying to take Vi's title of

Never

Scum

so she's forced to accept

Unlimited Day VIg

.

[VP Baltar]

It should be noted that if Amished and I are in game together we're either both town or he's scum. We should lynch him and find out.

Vote: Amished

[VP Baltar]

why is everyone claiming noises?

So we at least have some sense of who was targeted.

[VP Baltar]

VP, your logic fails as there's been two games that we've both been town. You know which ones they are.

You are!

I said we're either both town or you're scum (LOST). More Amished votes NAO!

[VP Baltar]

Well, it seems like we've already gone far enough down the road Adel. You should probably just claim now and if we want to reorientate our strategy from tomorrow on we can.

[VP Baltar]

And actually Night 1 is the best time to do the noises since almost all of the good actions (res, investigate) can't happen. I don't know about the ward thing so much and I don't intend on claiming my target at this time.

[VP Baltar]

Sajin's plan is the most appropriate route. I also don't think ani is anything other than town who wanted to become murderer down the line. Forcing him to rob graves prevents him carrying out any other action once we have two or more bodies at night. This will happen after N1 and probably every night after that if we have people go murderer.

Assigning him two people to rob the grave of 1) cuts him off at the knees 2) makes him verifiable via insanity count and/or failure to rob named graves 3) gives town much needed alignment information.

Additionally, forcing him to rob graves means that he has a big target painted on his back by the various scums since they do not want extra information flowing into the town's hands.

He's the perfect choice for this. Now, I know you're thinking that he can just rob the grave and murder Adel tonight (WIFOM: wasn't me!), but I'll stop you right there because I warded Adel last night and unless someone warded me Adel can rest easy that he's not going to die at the hands of Ani tonight.

If someone did ward me, then it may be a good idea to say so. Otherwise, Sajin's plan is far superior.

The people pushing ani's lynch as being the only choice today are a good place to start looking for scum.

Unvote, Vote: Ellibereth

Also, Adel, your info dump idea later isn't going to work because you'll be missing a ton of night actions from the dead. You won't be able to coordinate anything from your plan.

[VP Baltar]

I thought it said somewhere in the rules that all failed actions are not notified, but still take an insanity.

[VP Baltar]

Fair enough. If you're right, then I'll probably concede that ani should be lynched today.

[VP Baltar]

Can I get a list of all the players who warded from one of the people keeping count. Need to hear from each of them yes or no if they warded me.

[VP Baltar]

Ok, unless someone warded me, then ani is likely cult who was trying to get ahead of the insanity count.

[VP Baltar]

I can somewhat agree with Adel about the wards for now. Claiming before the lynch is probably fine, but waiting for as long as possible is important. If I didn't think my ward pointed out an apparent disparity in Ani's claim, I wouldn't have claimed it yet. The only person who needs to be claiming their ward target at this point is someone who warded myself or Adel.

[VP Baltar]

or we could just wait to see if my ward was broken. I don't think we need to grow this thread any faster than it is with alternate plans until we need to.

[VP Baltar]

ITT, people pout and should just be playing the game.


I'm not caught up at all (only skimmed) because you guys are posting ridiculous amounts about really trivial things. Has anyone claimed to have warded me yet?

[VP Baltar]

I'm confused about something.
Ani Stalked Adel, it failed, then it went through.
VP Warded Adel.
Noone warded VP.
I don't get it.

This is the primary thing we need to figure out. If nobody warded me, then ani is a liar liar pants on fire who was trying to get ahead in the insanity count (ie, he never stalked at all) and we need to lynch him now.

I think there are still a few folks out there who haven't spoken up yet though.

[VP Baltar]

SlySly, no offense, but I want to hear from the person who warded me. Assuming something like this took place is unnecessary.

Also, did Drench claim noises and if he warded or not?

[VP Baltar]

Why didn't someone just say that you guys tested his lynch already? Waiting for the ward is unnecessary I guess. Still catching up (on page 13 now)

Also

I really do not like dramonic, Eli, Star and Sea. Dramonic is scummy for reasons already stated. The other 3 all jumped on the Ani wagon for really bad reasoning.

Once again, I agree with Sajin. People who were flocking to the ani wagon early now that we know he's an investigator are likely scum. Elibereth is far and away the best choice, but I'd also go with seacore here too.

[VP Baltar]

Ok, fully caught up. Wicked needs to claim if he warded me.

As far as breaking strategies goes, I'm not good at them and probably won't come up with one. Adel's strategy wasn't really game breaking anyhow, so I don't know what people are up in arms about over it. If we did find some course of night actions that was beneficial to us, then we should follow it and try to win the game.

Even if Adel's plan carries off exactly as he said it would (and I somehow doubt it) the game would not be over and the town would still have to scumhunt to win, albeit with increased odds.

More Ellibereth votes plz.

[VP Baltar]

I like the idea of having Animorph being the Rob Grave, but the one problem is that players will be dying during the night too.

How do we determine which people to choose for the other rob grave actions? I don't actually understand why it can't be random. Could somebody explain.

Ani can grave rob up to two different people a night. Hopefully this would at least put a dent in the pile of bodies in the early game if people are smart and don't go murderer.

In terms of going random, that's a bad idea because then it messes up the insanity count. Scum should have a higher insanity count than town, so we don't want to give them the option of saying they have been randomly robbing graves to account for it.

[VP Baltar]

let the mods deal with it. More voting for the scumz.


People who were and still are adamant about ani being scum are scum. How is this not obvious now that we have essentially confirmed that ani is town?

More voting for these people please. There are very few of them who I wouldn't lynch.

[VP Baltar]

Unvote, Vote: Iecerint

[VP Baltar]

Fucking Christ. You guys need to stop posting so much. All you're doing is encouraging lurkers to lurk. Please say what you have to say in one or two decent posts and then just walk away for 24 hours. There doesn't need to be 10 pages added every time I come back to this game (and I try to be an active player). Most of the things generally being talked about don't even seem to be geared toward finding scum. /rant


Catching up sometime today.

[VP Baltar]

@wicked

Q: I'm a Cultist. What can I do on Night 0?
A: The first thing you should do is talk to your fellow Cultists in your quicktopic. On the first Night, you should be looking to perform Craft Fetish on multiple targets, as well as choosing Search to get Equipment that will help your side later on (such as a Resuscitation Kit in case you are threatened by Murderers). An important strategy will be faking claims - such as explaining your Insanities, what Night Actions you took and when and how you heard or produced Noise, so discuss this with your Cultist buddies.

[VP Baltar]

Catching up over the ten night pages (sigh). I apologize in advance if this is a mega post:

I also want to say that I really dislike Sly's discussion of "vigs" throughout the thread. Nobody should be taking insanities and taking the path of MURDERERS in an effort to "vig" for the town.

I don't really agree with you here. I mean, I think the town should use major discretion here, but spending lynches on every scummy distraction is not going to help the town win since there will always be a certain amount of very scummy looking townies in a large game. Cleaning house when necessary is likely to help the town better focus on finding scum. Plus, some players are very good with their guts (DGB, Porkens, et al) and can nail scum on the early nights to push the town ahead. I'm not saying that we need to get wild with it, but if someone has a strong scum read and can't get the town to go along with it vigging isn't the worst idea in the world.

---

I really don't like Chaco's reasoning for targeting dram. I don't believe he actually warded him.

It's Dramonic, everyone suspects Dramonic in a game like this as third party. I can see him getting wrongfully vigged in the beginning, so I warded him.

wtf?

---

Ell's idea seems fine. I think Adel wanted to randomize it because the background probability of the plan being net pro-town was high, whereas making a list like that could potentially allowed skilled scum to subvert group membership.

See, this is a MASSIVE problem with Elli's plan. Scum can day talk. Under no circumstance should be the town be hand selecting people to participate in this. It'd be massively easy for the scum to manipulate a town suicide with this.

Can anybody who feels like it mention their 12 picks for town?
I still think my idea would work.

Scumbag, seriously. DGB, you should back me up on this. Remember CT III and how the scum were awesomely manipulating the town into bad decisions thanks to their daytalking. You getting shades of that at all here?

The main "problems" with Adel's plan to some people (I think):
Using a generator to decide pairings.
Breaking Infractions on purpose.

I actually think both of those things are the intelligent parts of his plan. The twitch thing in particular is going to catch scum.

it's obvious that no plan that bears any similarities with a plan that Adel or I propose is going to happen in this game for fear of 'omg i don't want to break the game'

I disagree. The mod has clearly stated that he ENCOURAGES people to play the setup to their advantage. Adel's plan did not break the game as some people are insisting and I don't think you would either. However, if you have a plan that will help town win, I suggest you throw it out there so we can discuss.

Ok, fine then I'll set a precedent.
HI EVERYONE, I'M AN IDIOT WHO STALKED N1.

Stalked: Col_Cathart
Insanity: Taboo Launder

I did it while forgetting half the rules. yay me!

Lynch Nao, plz.

VP said 2, but it's a free action, so IDK, but only one person can rob each grave.

Yes, it's a free action, but I'm pretty sure the rules say you get one free grave rob plus one other action. You can select to rob a second grave, but then you get no more night actions.

@ Phate, I believe it's Sajin's plan. But OK. They could always both be graverobbers, if we're convinced we need more than one.

We probably will need more than one in future days, but as of right now there probably aren't going to be too many bodies than one can't handle the workload. People who are excessively protown probably aren't going to need to have their graves robbed since we will likely be able to infer why they were NK'ed. Only questionable dead need to have their graves robbed. We'll see after the first night how many bodies come up and if we need a second designated grave robber.

Theoretically I could still be Cult, so having Ani who's all but confirmed is better(cycled permutations is a pain....)

Regardless, I still feel my plan is the most effective way to win.

Wrong. Kneecapping players who are likely going to kill town players is exactly what we want to be doing with the graverobbing. It prevents them from carrying out other night actions. That is the whole point of having ani be the grave robber.

Oh lol, incomplete post. I will not be posting much between next Monday-Friday.

If the game keeps going at this rate, I suggest you just replace out. There is no way you are going to be able to keep up.

I am not participating in Ell's plan.

Do you have a good reason not too? I'm not taking advantage of rules, and finding town players and keeping them alive and killing off everyone else is fully within the spirit of the game.

It's the scummiest plan I've heard in this game. Allowing six cult members plus however many people want to go murderer dictate a large list of likely Investigators to die on night 1 is an idea that would only come from scum.

People who agreed with Adel's plan are assumed to agree with mine.

And why is that? It's not even close to fundamentally the same plan. His had the chance of working, yours is almost guaranteed to result in a town loss.

*Sorry in advance for my sailor's mouth SlySly. I don't mean to offend. I'm just a heathen. I'll keep it clean from here on out.*

I still don't really understand the plan... I will go back and try to figure it out but if someone could lay it out in terms that a monkey can understand, I would be grateful.

Elli's plan = town lose quickly. That should be clear enough. Let's lynch him.

---

People who need to be lynched soon

Ellibereth
Iecerint
Nicodemus
evilsnail

Need to keep a close watch on

Chaco
Phate
Seacore
iLord

Neutral

Everyone else except my private town reads



Again, sorry for the long post. Elli's plan is going to fail the town, I'm telling you right now. It fails to take into account any sort of scum manipulation. You have a block of six players that can daytalk and use their influence to fit the kill list to entirely remove themselves from it altogether. Just look at how people are already taking the proposed list hook, line, and sinker. How do you even know there are any cult members on the proposed list to get killed? You don't. Anyone in support of this plan is likely cult and needs deadening.

Also, why do I feel like I'm the only person who is trying to hunt scum here?

[VP Baltar]

EBWOP: So we have 6 days - 7 if everyone takes Avolition on the first three before they start going into the four, and everyone didn't take murderer.

Yes, let's cripple the town's ability to lynch. That seems like a great idea.

[VP Baltar]

Sajin, Ek, vikingfan....how about we lynch Iecerint now?

[VP Baltar]

VP, why do you want to lynch me?

You're scum. duh.

[VP Baltar]

I'm starting to agree that Elli's plan has too many problems. I didn't really consider the fact that scum can daytalk. I don't see how the people pushing the plan are automatically scum, though. It's not like townies never have bad ideas..

Yes, but townies try to figure out if the plan being pushed is bad or not. None of you really did, you just said 'hey, good plan. gogogogogogogogogo' because, you know, you're scum. duh.

[VP Baltar]

I mean, is there anything operationalizing your claim that I am scum, or are you just sort of making it up as you go along? For example, are you explicitly calling for my lynch because Sajin just took a confrontational tone with me (i.e. perceived vulnerability), or do you have legitimate reasons for doing so?

lol@ES.

Not fair! I voted you like 10 pages ago. Stop giving my thunder to Sajin.


But seriously, if you need reasons (and I shouldn't have to convince you that you're scum, you know this already...sheesh), they're quite clear:

1) You still want to lynch confirmed town ani
2) You're not scumhunting
3) You're a strong advocate of failplan despite all of the holes in fail plan being pointed out by the town

diescumdie

[VP Baltar]

EBWOP: didn't realize you moved your vote off of ani...but you were about it before. so I can give you some leeway on that one. not the other two though.

[VP Baltar]

But VP, I like your thunder. Besides, everyone was giving you my thunder for my grave rob assignment idea. Share and share alike!

heh, fair enough.

I haven't caught up yet, but I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that finds Iecerint suspicious.

you're town. Get that vote over here on this wagon!


Reason number 48 why Iecerint is scum: He tried to shovel mud on SlySly over the modkills before they would have happened and before any reveal had been made. Not to mention he said earlier that he could see Adel as scum!

[VP Baltar]

I disagree completely. Unless your assuming all the influential players are Cultists, the town on average has about four times the influence of the scum on this. People always run this argument on stuff like this (Like in Kingmaker), but it doesn't really make any sense.

All of the cultists don't need to be the influential players. It actually doesn't take that many influential players to muck up the plan. You only need one or two cultists who can logically get the list needed across and the you have the other mopes come in and go "I agree with so and so". I don't know why you think it would be difficult, especially early in a large game. People have a strong tendency to sheep in large games, particularly when they have a breakneck pace like this.

Ah, this shows why you're convinced of the daytalking scum's scary mind-bending powers. The scum won't be able to sway the entire town. They can't magically make people change their minds any more than you or I can. It's like saying that we shouldn't lynch because the daytalking scum could convince us to lynch a townie.

Killing half the player list =/= lynching one player. I don't know why you would even draw that comparison. Seriously though, if you don't believe me look at that game for evidence. DGB, Thok and Mighty Orbots (Zorblag/Papa Zito hydra) were scum in that game who could day talk. In the On Stage portion of that game, the town would have to make a decision every day that would have a good, bad or neutral outcome. Despite only having a few scum members On Stage at any given time, they effectively influenced the town toward the negative or neutral choices in almost every single scene. It does not take much effort for scum to influence these kinds of decisions and plans.



For the record, DGB did NOT invite me. hmph.

[VP Baltar]

Welcome, Katy. I like you're creepy avatar.

How did you know you were warded before I said so? This looks like somebody knows animorph is town.

Well, that is the logical conclusion to assume, is it not? If you read my posts, I was never all that taken with the idea that ani was scum, even though there was a chance for it. I'll say that when people kept claiming they hadn't warded me I started to wonder if he really was trying to get ahead of the insanity count, but for most of the time I just assumed him to be stupid town who thought he could flip murderer quickly. Turns out my original assumption was correct.

[VP Baltar]

Hey, did you know that CSL, Sarag, dramonic, Drench, Hayker, and startransmission are all in this game?

Fun fact of the day.

[VP Baltar]

Have you read the thread DGB?

[VP Baltar]

Have you read the thread DGB?

Yes, mostly strategy (not my forte) and little scum hunting. I'm trying to get some movement going in that direction, gah!

And you missed my Evangelionastically awesome Iecerint wagon? What about the budding Nico wagon?

[VP Baltar]

I find it very interesting that many of the replacement requesters are still very active in other games.

I don't. This game is probably going much faster than whatever else they're in.

In fairness, I think we've effectively slowed it down to a reasonable pace. I've been intentionally not posting for awhile now just to help.


In terms of game thoughts, I'm still pretty happy with my vote and I really think lynching someone soon would be a decent idea. We have a few decent suspects already (Iecerint, Nicodemus, Ellibereth and to a lesser extent starstransmission) and I don't think any of them would be terrible lynches. Starstransmission is probably the lowest out of that list because he seems to be more antagonistic than scummy to me, but I wouldn't cry if he was lynched.

I definitely want to see Nicodemus taking a more active role (ie, scumhunting) and now that the thread has slowed down he has no reason not to.

...or people can just help me lynch Iecerint.

[VP Baltar]

Unvote, Vote: Nicodemus

[VP Baltar]

I forgot Drench was even in this game!

Post or die. Same with Hayker.

[VP Baltar]

My spidey sense says Nico will flip scum.

reqw...I don't think we need your notes when the day starts again, just some it up and get to the part where you tell us who the scum are and win the game.

[VP Baltar]

Not too suprised at the Nico flip. My guess is that Katy and Sajin were both town. Iecerint is the flip out of that group I'm most interested in seeing. I'll need to take some time to review Katy and Sajin's suspect lists, since I think one of them were the likely target of the cult last night.

CSL not dying is well....irritating. Either the cult tried to set up Ellibereth last night by rezing CSL, CSL is cult, or Elli is cult who participated in the ritual.

I think I'm initially inclined to believe Phate about being the ritual target since he seemed townish to me yesterday, which means that Sajin and Katy were both murdered.

*twitch*

I'm robbing Katy's grave tonight.

I'm also caught up!

Why are you putting *twitch* in non-vote posts? Do you have an insanity? Why are you not dead? We'll wait to see if CSL's insanity infraction actually turns up or not.

rewq455 - I'd still like to hear your summed up thoughts now that you're caught up in the game. Who do you think are most likely to be scum and why?

Guys, Sly is scum. There's plenty of Nic defending Sly - I encourage anyone who's serious about winning this game to read Nic in iso - but the important bit is that Nik, a confirmed scum player, tried to influence the list of 'town' players Elli was making for the Texas-Justice style massacre in order to put SlySly on the town list. There is no motive for him to do that if Sly was town. Keep in mind that at this point Nic was not under serious suspicion, so WIFOM isn't even a motive. This link is damning.

I don't know if it's damning, but it's an ok point.

On CSL L+1'ing: The difference between L and his L+1 was 2 minutes. I would say that it's feasible that CSL simply didn't see Nico's self-hammer. Makes it more a null-tell more than anything.

Um, what? Everyone seriously needs to pay attention to this. Why are you defending CSL casting a L+1 vote? I don't even see what prompted you to do this.

I'm saying right now that Drench, CSL, SlySly could all very well be cult.

Vote: Drench

Good a place as any.

I do think we should be claiming noises today. I heard a noise and I did not ward (obv).

[VP Baltar]

Do you really think cult would waste a rez kit on CSL if he wasn't cult?

And town using one on him makes sense? Seriously though, they lost a member on day 1 and he would be an easy mislynch to push today if something weird happened overnight. Additionally, it puts pressure on Ellibereth.

Now that it has been confirmed CSL has an insanity, I don't think it's entirely unlikely, though I'm definitely not calling him town.

I think it could also be a good idea to look back at the ani wagon again today as well. I was correct that it was being pushed by scum (Nico), so we should look to see who he was directly agreeing with or who was agreeing with him. There was more than one scum on that wagon.

[VP Baltar]

It's only a possibility though. Drench coming in and defending CSL for no apparent reason makes me think that they're both scum.

[VP Baltar]

Also, Chaco is probably the designated lurker-scum for the cult.

[VP Baltar]

I don't understand how the last scenario is an explanation.

ie Ellibereth is cult who never had any intention of killing CSL, but said so yesterday to explain his insanity today.

[VP Baltar]

I must be missing something. If Elli is cult and therefore can't kill CSL, then how was he rezzed?

Eh, I guess you're right. They'd both have to be cult in that scenario.

[VP Baltar]

Why are EK and I the only ones here who see obvious problems with Drench? Scum intervention perhaps. More lynching plox.

[VP Baltar]

Hey SlySly, what do you think about the Drench wagon?

Things I would like:
1) Some semioldguy postings.
2) Hayker/CSL/Phate resuscitators to claim I simply find it incomprehensible that the three murder victims are the three resuscitators.
3) Someone with a forensics kit (who is not animorph) to claim, so they can check animorph tonight.
4) A Drench or dramonic lynch today. Animorph is a bad lynch, as he can be checked. Ellibereth isn't a terrible lynch, but I'd prefer to simply make her rob two graves tomorrow night for the time being.
5) Random forensic kit/occult book checks tonight.

1)indeed...where the hell is he?
2)Yep
3)Um, what's to prevent that person from then being murdered after claiming? I think not on this one.
4)Yes, why aren't you voting for Drench?
5)Agreed, everyone should use their best judgement and make good choices.

[VP Baltar]

I am thinking that Ani is the scummiest player atm. This is because I see his lying as COMPLETELY anti-town. This now discredits everything that he said. I realize that this is from the early game, but it is still valid. Also, stalking is a preparation to kill, and preparing to kill someone night0, without reading any posts, is very scummy.

Cult can't stalk, so if you believe he did that he at least started the game as town. Further, I don't think he took the psychopathy insanity so probably isn't murder yet.

[VP Baltar]

*headdesk*

[VP Baltar]

rewq, I'd preferably like to know more than one person you think is scummy. We have five cultists left and as many as five murderers....it's like hitting the side of a barn with a shotgun.


Hey DGB, give me one good reason to not think you're scum this game you lurkery lurkerstein.

[VP Baltar]

*sigh* rewq please try to focus here. ani is very unlikely to be scum. If you're town, we want to lynch scum today. Therefore, voting ani is a waste of time an effort.

[VP Baltar]

Unvote, Vote: CSL

This should be self-explanatory.


@Ellibereth - we'll have four bodies to rob tonight, so there is no need to overlap. We definitely need to declare before the day is out who should be robbing who though.

[VP Baltar]

Uh, question. Was the wagon on me because of my predecessor, or policy before post 1263?

Because you're scum. And quite bad at it. I fully expect your team to bus you now.

[VP Baltar]

Don't lynch CSL to quickly, we still have a decent number of people to hear from and need to arrange night actions and what not.

I'd like to hear Drench's take on CSL.

[VP Baltar]

*too

[VP Baltar]

bus began from DGB ftr.

I still want to hear from the non-posters before this day phase ends. I think tonight's graverobbers should be Ellibereth and DGB.

[VP Baltar]

Who said we're positive as a group that Phate is town?

I need to think about the insanity plan.

[VP Baltar]

Yeah, Drench I have definitely seen posting elsewhere. I'm in support of incapacitating a couple scummy players a night for now while we have decent numbers. I don't want anyone to get modkilled and I most certainly do not want to get blacklisted from a future Percy game, but I think using the rules to our advantage is most certainly not "anti-town" or "anti-game".

[VP Baltar]

I don't like when people suggest flimsy reasons for not lynching a player they see as scummy. Don't vote for a secondary suspect, vote for the primary one. Despite your activity today, you haven't placed a vote on anyone yet, why is that?

I do agree with this. CSL should be the lynch today if he's your main suspect. Crippling players should be reserved for secondary scum targets if we go that route.

[VP Baltar]

Why should I place a vote?

Why should you not be voting? Voting shows accountability. Get to it.

Ordinarily that would make sense, but we don't have a limit on how many Insane players we can cripple. We also have non-insane players that we can't cripple - the lynch should be saved for those.

Why would we want to be lynching non-insane players? Seems to me like they would be the least likely to be scum. As SOG said, we don't win by nullifying scum night actions. We win by killing them.

[VP Baltar]

I heard no noise and did not ward.

Vote: Ani

I'll have some more thoughts later.

[VP Baltar]

Unvote, Vote: kunkstar7

[VP Baltar]

And I agree that grave robbers should be cross robbing to maximize how much we are limiting night actions.

I'm not as sure about the not claiming noises and such thing. On the one hand it DOES tip the cult off in some ways, but on the other hand it also gives those town members with rez kits a better chance at successfully protecting a target if they choose to use one.

[VP Baltar]

VP, I'll admit I don't understand your kunkstar vote.

I wasn't completely caught up and wasn't buying his story about knowing drench was going to go murderer, since he couldn't have known that if drench had just killed once. Now that he has claimed to have changed the insanity, that obviously makes me less sure about him being scum, especially if there is precedence for this.

However, I do want to ask SlySly, however, if you only got to change because you replaced the same night the player took psychopathy.

I can understand Percy allowing a player to change in that circumstance, but I don't think it is likely he would allow a player to change well after the fact just because being murderer is difficult. I also don't like that kunkstar claims to have the insanity Taboo: Launder. Why in the hell would a would-be murder choose that as one of his first insanities? Seems kind of counter-intuitive to the goals of a murderer.

My guess is that he has *twitch*, Psychopathy and possibly taboo launder as his insanities (though the latter one he could have just said so he didn't have to waste night actions laundering when he could be stalking and killing).

That could be seen as helping a scum buddy.... Are you?

Do you consider this scumhunting?

Don't pretend this is anything more than an inactivity vote. When I do post, I do contribute. And point out where I'm parroting, please.

Not really. You're lucky you were so early on Nicodemus or I'd be giving you more attention right now.

several people attacked his Nico vote

Which people?

Is there any good reason we shouldn't be lynching Hayker today?

How about we just replace him and not worry about it?

Mod, please prod or replace Hayker since he's clearly not playing the game. Thanks!

I like Viking's vote on DGB. She'd be my second choice for a lynch right now behind kunkstar.

[VP Baltar]

EBWOP: "However, I do want to ask SlySly,

however

, if you only got to change because you replaced the same night the player took psychopathy."

Also, this was answered already, so my point stands.

[VP Baltar]

I don't see how DGB's play is unusual.

My general experience with her (either playing or reading) has been less lurky than this.

re:kunkstar - Take a second and consider what options he would have if drench took psychopathy on night 2...what other option would he have but to claim that? I mean, drench was under heat already for being potential scum and it didn't let up today. Also, if drench was going to go murderer, why would he wait until night 3 to do it? It seems to me that the key to winning as murderer is to kill as quickly as possible. I mean, I guess you don't technically have to be a murderer until your second kill to win as it, but taking psychopathy early if you're going down that route seems optimal since it's an insanity that would cause no harm to your eventual goal.

[VP Baltar]

Also, I dig what EK is putting down about kunk possibly being cult. If one of the cult members was in SA1, they definitely could have advised him to claim he switched back from murderer. The pieces just don't add up for him.

[VP Baltar]

Plum and Hayker. Wickedestjr also has yet to post anything relevant to the current game state.

[VP Baltar]

Another thing I don't like about the kunkstar story is that he says Drench took Taboo launder N0. But Drench never voted his whole time in this game which seems like evidence that he had a voting insanity he was trying to hide. And it's hella convenient that kunkstar is bloody and will continue to be bloody because he can't launder. Cover story much?

Am I being paranoid?

No, I don't think you're being paranoid at all. The launder thing makes no sense whatsoever for a town to take (unless they had no intention of ever being bloody). It is, however, an excellent cover story for potential murderers, who as I said would not want to be wasting night actions laundering. Also a good cover for cult who rezzed their buddies and don't want to launder.

Drench's not vote is indeed highly suspect and I think I called that out much earlier in the game. He could have very well have been hiding *twitch*, which he could have taken as his first insanity.

kunkstar lynch sounds better and better.

[VP Baltar]

Yes, you have to have the asteriks for the twitch to count it seems.

[VP Baltar]

I think I see what you're saying there - it would've made more sense for murderer Drench to turn on Night 1 rather than Night 2, and you don't think Percy would allow a replacement to retcon that decision one day afterwards.

Yes, except Drench would have turned Night 2 and kunk replaced Night 3. What I am saying is that if drench sent an insanity choice of psychopathy and then replaced out the same night, I could see Percy letting kunk change it. But if drench was intent on going murderer from the start of the game he would have likely taken psychopathy night 2. To me this means that kunk is either trying to conceal that he's murderer (why claim in this case?) or he's cult who's trying to hide insanities and/or blood from rezzing his buddies.

[VP Baltar]

I agree with you VP. Here's my question. At what point would percy say once couldn't change it? What if this was Day 3? Day 4? Day 5? Day 6?

There has to be a point where Percy would say, "Nope, this is the hand you've been dealt."

Well, my opinion is that one wouldn't be allowed to change on ANY night after psychopathy was chosen. I don't think it matters if it's Day 2 or Day 6.

[VP Baltar]

Yes, except Drench would have turned Night 2 and kunk replaced Night 3. What I am saying is that if drench sent an insanity choice of psychopathy and then replaced out the same night, I could see Percy letting kunk change it. But if drench was intent on going murderer from the start of the game he would have likely taken psychopathy night 2. To me this means that kunk is either trying to conceal that he's murderer (why claim in this case?) or he's cult who's trying to hide insanities and/or blood from rezzing his buddies.

Well, technically we haven't gotten to Night 3 yet .

Otherwise, I see what you're saying.

Yeah yeah. Nights 0, 1, and 2.

[VP Baltar]

Okay hold on stand back

Vote: Drench

. This should go to show my Insanity for y'all. This looks like it might be a bussing case of 'Oh crud, my buddy did something ridiculously scummy better hop on right quick'.

I don't understand what you are saying with this last sentence.

Cross robbing is a bad plan.

I disagree. I think most players would have some kind of equipment by now and even if they didn't there is no way for a potential murderer to know this. I think it's an effective plan and a murderer not participating is engaging in VERY high risk behavior.


As a note in this game, I do want people to not auto clear someone because they are on a scum lynch. I was thinking about it a bit and it would be extremely easy for scum to just up and decide they want to power bus a buddy because they can daytalk and coordinate it. I think we need to be looking at scummy behavior overall and make connections somewhat secondary to that. Just my two cents.

Thanks for the work on the table EK. I think there are things missing, but that can be added back. I also think we should add an Insanity Count column. I really want everyone to claim the number of insanities they have so they can be checked by Occult Books more accurately. I currently have zero. Everyone should claim in their next post.

DGB claimed that she's tried rezzing EK twice, presumably the last two nights (night 0 would be stupid).

Wait a frakking minute! DGB could not have rezzed EK two nights. She could not have searched twice and rezzed twice in three nights.

Unvote, Vote: DGB

Scum confirmed. This has to be today's lynch.

Should I ward or rez you tonight? I may or may not do the opposite.

lol, infinite equipment DGB. This is one of your biggest fails, I must say.

Hayker....why do you have an insanity?

[VP Baltar]

Oh, I didn't realize the rezz kit stayed if you failed. Sigh.

Unvote

Should have known it wouldn't have been that easy.

[VP Baltar]

I have 0 insanities EK. I said so earlier, but it must have been missed.


Catching up in a few.

[VP Baltar]

Do we have a list of rez-worthy players?

Magua, iLord, VikingFan, Semi.

I'm going to have time to reread the thread later today. More thoughts will come.

Shouldn't I be on this list as well? It's if you heard a noise N0 or N1 and aren't dead, correct?

[VP Baltar]

SlySly - why would you take compulsion if your intention was to go murderer? You have already freely stated that it's a difficult role to win, so wouldn't taking compulsion make it that much more difficult? It would take you until what, Day 8, to win that way. I'm confused.

[VP Baltar]

I don't buy SlySly's explanation, but DGB bugs me more. She says Sly's town, but votes him? and she's been lurking too.

She's implying that Sly never looks townish, which is somewhat true. He's a bit of a scummy player naturally. However, what bothers me a bit more about his is his laying back a bit as the game has worn on. My general experience with him is a bit more fire in his belly, but I don't know if this really means anything or not.

I didn't put in enough forethought to determine the earliest possible time for a murderer win. I figured taking compulsion would take some unneeded complexity out of my thought process and I didn't want to hinder my voting abilities in any way. I never really expected to be a murderer and win anyway, I just wanted to be a murderer, however, D1 changed my mind about that.

How much forethought would it really take? I mean, you played in the other SA as well, so I'd think you'd at least have the basic understanding that to win as murderer here you need to do it as quickly as possible. Not sure if I'm buying this reasoning.

[VP Baltar]

Oh yeah, I'm not voting atm.

Vote: SlySly

[VP Baltar]

Magua, Dramonic, Elli, VP, DGB, and wicked still need to claim insanities?

Apparently leaving for a few hours equals pages behind in this game, so I'm not caught up and I'm only skimming right now.

I definitely agree that EK's chart should be fully filled in before the day ends and I would unvote to make sure that happens.

Now, iLord, I've claimed my insanities twice actually, but I'll go again.

I have 0 insanities

[VP Baltar]

It's cool. I wasn't really being angry about it or anything. I just genuinely wanted to make it large so people didn't miss it because you're not the first person to ask me about it even though I think it was my idea to start.

[VP Baltar]

I'm good with the grave robbing plan.

For the people who are questioning WHY SlySly would claim what he has as scum, I'll just say that he was somewhat backed into a corner with it. By starting the insanity claims now, I helped to force people be truthful or face being outted tonight as liars. I do believe that SlySly took Commune and Hallucination because neither of those are that likely to hurt him if he's cult. The only way he's going to get bloody is by rezzing a buddy, which is easily avoidable and hearing noises shouldn't mean all that much to a cult I guess. I am still very much fine with his lynch.

[VP Baltar]

announcing targets is a bad idea.

[VP Baltar]

Later he votes Nicodemus right after Nicodemus makes a post. So I'm assuming that the post was the reason for VP's vote, and I have to assume because VP didn't give any reasons. In fact, if you read him in iso, he never does bring up any reasons for voting Nicodemus. I find this scummy.

How is that scummy? You have enough experience under your belt to know that every single vote doesn't need a stated reason. If I think he's scum and my vote is going to be sufficent to further his wagon toward a lynch, then I have no reason to write an epistle to justify it. In fact, I think scum are much more likely to write out reasons to justify their voting if they are bussing because some joker always proposes this very same attack.

In fact, VP's play here seems different from his play in previous games I've played. He seemed more serious in previous games I played with him, but I haven't verified this yet. I do suspect him the most now.

So....meta that you don't have a solid grounding for is the scummiest thing you have seen all game? Play better.

2. In addition to ward preventing anybody from doing anything to Adel, it also causes Adel's night action to be unsuccessful. Maybe cultVP wanted to roleblock a good player.

What? lol. No offense, but that'd be a pretty poor strategy for the scum to take on N0.

VP, what did you do last Night?

collected equipment.

Wicked, what do you think the odds are of scum having 0 insanities right now?

[VP Baltar]

collected equipment.

Okay, then. What did you do Night 1, then?

Same

[VP Baltar]

@wicked - I'm pretty sure that iLord is right. That's how I read it anyhow.

I don't find it scummy that you didn't post reasons when you voted. I found it scummy that you NEVER gave a reason for suspecting Nicodemus.

You're missing my point. Why should I take the time to give a reason when a vote to further pressure him and advance his wagon will suffice? I'm a busy person and while I'm more than happy to get talkative when neccessary to make a lynch happen, this game is moving plenty quick and clogging it with repeated reasoning or insignificant points isn't going to help anything and gives people an excuse to lurk. Call it an executive decision toward the health of the game if you'd like.

No it isn't. The other points were enough for me to suspect you the most. The meta was just an additional point which I found noteworthy.

What is noteworthy about it? In fact, you haven't even explained it as far as I can tell.

Why? What do you think cult are doing?

Well, I haven't given too much thought as to what the optimal cult strategy is, but my guess is that crafting fetishes, passing them and carrying out the ritual are pretty high priority as opposed to blocking wards.

[VP Baltar]

Same

Thought process?

I won't reveal the specifics of what I got and how they fit into my plan, but the gist of it is that gathering equipment on early nights is going to 1)keep my insanities at 0 while the scum rack up theirs (separate the curd from the whey basically) 2) gives me the tools to catch those scum on later nights and 3)if I happen to die I have the potential to give a bonus to a town member who robs my grave or help to out scum who decide not to rob my grave if so ordered.

[VP Baltar]

I won't reveal the specifics of what I got and how they fit into my plan, but the gist of it is that gathering equipment on early nights is going to 1)keep my insanities at 0 while the scum rack up theirs (separate the curd from the whey basically) 2) gives me the tools to catch those scum on later nights and 3)if I happen to die I have the potential to give a bonus to a town member who robs my grave or help to out scum who decide not to rob my grave if so ordered.

Do you think this is a good strategy for town members?

Personally, I don't think every town member should engage in the same strategy. Obviously if everyone spent the early nights gathering equipment it could make the town vulnerable in the sense that no one would be rezzing or warding or whatever.

However, I'm a long game type of player and I personally believe that some people should be doing work to secure a better Day 4, 5, 6, etc. for the town.

Do you think it's a bad strategy for town members?

[VP Baltar]

I'm not saying it's a bad strategy - it makes some sense.

So do you believe that only one town member should do this?

How does being a long-term player and collecting equipment mesh with Warding N0?

Well, whether I believe people should do it or not is beside the point at this juncture. They either already are or they are not and I'm not too interested in dictating what anyone should do with their night actions. The action phase of my strategy is beginning soon anyhow, so someone following in my footsteps is going to be a bit behind the curve.

As far as warding, that was before I decided to go this route. When the game first started, I wasn't quite sure what the best course of action was and taking a chance on protecting Adel seemed like a good idea because if he was town I figured he'd be a major asset. I guess in some sense that still fits with a long term strategy, but not specifically with the items portion I came up with later.

[VP Baltar]

In terms of who I'd want to grave rob, I'd say DGB, dramonic, ellibereth, and kunkstar7.

[VP Baltar]

In terms of who I'd want to grave rob, I'd say DGB, dramonic, ellibereth, and kunkstar7.

But there not dead. If you were to rob a grave, this night, whose grave would you rob given a no-lynch?

Are you on crack?

Take a breath, go back and read again.

[VP Baltar]

If you sub Elli for Kunkstar, I'd be fine with that list iLord.

[VP Baltar]

I don't get what Kunk was upset about - was he upset that he had accidentally "lynched" SlySly?

I believe so. If SlySly flips town somehow, I'd certainly say it was suspicious at best.

[VP Baltar]

That's the extent of your reads in this game Sly? You have nothing to say about your imminent lynch?

[VP Baltar]

Well you just talked about your insanities as far as I can tell. I'd like your thoughts on the wagon itself.

Better yet, I'd appreciate if you could give everyone a town, townish, neutral, scummy, or scum.

[VP Baltar]

EBWOP: ranking

[VP Baltar]

lol, will do chief. Someone hammer.

[VP Baltar]

I approve this plan.

[VP Baltar]

I mean, part of me is inclined to say leave it as the list on the front because then we know for a fact that someone isn't messing with it trying to gap the scum. However, the other part of me thinks that clumping them together is going to produced better odds of hitting scum than just the random list.

I'm probably less inclined to think Magau is cult at this moment, so I'd probably put him a bit further down, say after DGB, but other than that I think it's pretty much fine.

[VP Baltar]

Well, since this plan is mostly a one shot deal, I don't think it's going to be hiding all that many night actions. Sure they might get one free one, but hopefully our prospective murderers are still going to get handicapped by graverobbing.

Getting two cults would essentially cripple them to the point that they are a non-threat (unless a lot of people die tonight) and we can focus on finding our murderers then.

[VP Baltar]

Yer, that makes more sense probably for the long run.

[VP Baltar]

@wicked - I really get sick of these burden of proficiency arguments being brought up in games where I intentionally don't take a leading role. The last time I saw someone use this, they were scum and it turned into a very annoying and drawn out argument.

My main response to it is 1) see my sig. Frankly, I don't have a lot of time to play mafia right now because I'm very busy at work lately and lack the time to put in lots of reading. 2) Games where I go full on scumhunting and start really pushing people around usually result in me dying very quickly.

Because, aside from joining the wagon you didn't do anything! If you really wanted to advance his wagon, why not try and convince people not on the wagon to join it. I don't see why you couldn't have at least stated which reasons you agreed with or what people had convinced you.

Why did I need to? Not stating reasons can actually put a lot more pressure on a player. I think my vote did just fine and whether you believe it was effective or not on the Nico wagon, I think it was.

Secondly, I don't believe either of those excuses. Being busy shouldn't be a problem.

You're right, RL doesn't take priority over an online forum game. Further, your "state one or two sentences" argument would have changed what exactly? I'm staying up on this thread, but if I don't need to get in a quote war with a scum I'm not going to. If I don't have anything new to add, repeating others is equally useless.

There are two things that seem different about your playing here as opposed to games I have played with you in the past. The first thing is that you seem to be less serious in this game than you were in Mafia 96 and Mafia 104. The second thing is that unlilke in Mafia 96 and Mafia 104, you seemed to have been playing from the sidelines. In Mafia 96, you were the one that brought up the case against Mastin which ended up getting him lynched. In Mafia 104, you and Amished made a case against Exalt and tried to lynch him. In this game, you don't seem to have brought hardly anything new to the table and have been playing from the sidelines which is scummy.

Problem numero uno is that you don't have a scum meta of me. I assure you I'm plenty active as scum. Do your research.

Second, every game requires a different touch. Mafia 96 definitely needed someone to come in and kick ass because the town was extremely clueless when I replaced in. Same for Mafia 104 to a lesser extent, though I don't think you can even cite that game since I was playing in a hydra there.

This is debatable, but my point is that just because you claim to have warded night 0, even if you are telling the truth it doesn't mean you are town.

And what is the real benefit for scum to take that action? What gain would I have garnered by claiming to Ward? Do you think I was trying to get a mislynch?

[VP Baltar]

My main response to it is 1) see my sig. Frankly, I don't have a lot of time to play mafia right now because I'm very busy at work lately and lack the time to put in lots of reading. 2) Games where I go full on scumhunting and start really pushing people around usually result in me dying very quickly.

Ironically, 1) would be very nicely solved if the end result of 2) became true .

And what is the real benefit for scum to take that action? What gain would I have garnered by claiming to Ward? Do you think I was trying to get a mislynch?

I for one can say that you warding gave you a lot of town cred in my eyes.

1) I think me staying alive in this game is a net benefit to the town at this time.

2) I suppose. I doubt it would be any sort of long term benefit though.

[VP Baltar]

lol, god I'm slow.

[VP Baltar]

I don't see how Aversion is going to affect lynching.

At deadline, whoever has the majority of votes will be lynched. If there is a tie, whoever received their final vote first will be lynched.

We dont' have to achieve the full majority to lynch. Only foreseeable problem, imo, is bad distribution of aversions requiring town to vote quicker than scum. That might be enough to make me not want to do it, but I think I should just point out that the required majority to lynch doesn't mean much.

[VP Baltar]

Yes, I already pointed out the speed voting flaw....just was making a technical point.

I see another way town could potentially still win in that situation, but I generally agree that it's too risky and not worth pursuing.

[VP Baltar]

SOG - Was your unvote solely related to the Aversion Plan being hashed out?

[VP Baltar]

I agree with SOG on this point. It's not damning evidence on its own, but it can certainly be corroborative imo.

[VP Baltar]

Eh, I guess both scenarios could be indicative, but even then it depends largely on playstyle. Most people in this game appear to just don't care/like to check plans and like to just leave it up to other people to perfect/find mistakes. For our game, the only people that are still alive would be me, Magua, Plum, you, and VP.

Ah, the Adel sheeple philosophy. Probably true. Out of curiosity, why is Plum on your list? Seems to me she's doing a pretty good job of saying a whole lotta nothing.

[VP Baltar]

Sly, please post your scum list.

I tried that already, but he's scum so don't expect him to state his reads endanger his buddies.

[VP Baltar]

* and endanger

[VP Baltar]

You guys are too much into breaking the game and not enough into playing it <_<

Don't stun us all at once with your amazing insights. How is this helping find scum?

@Aversion Plan:

No. Not good. I know it's been said before, but I wanted to make sure I posted that.

See above.

Another thing that seems to have slipped everyone's mind is that I have heard noise the last 2 nights in a row. The best idea is to lynch scum and force the murderer that has me targeted to follow through with their work, that way they won't be free to target another investigator.

Really? You want to put this supposed murder closer to their win condition rather than forcing them to stalk elsewhere, which causes no harm to the town?

I don't really disagree with you that DGB looks quite scummy with her lurkerfest, but saying things like this just really makes me want your lynch more.

[VP Baltar]

If I'm beginning to think SlySly is town, who is the second lynch choice?

You're my second choice.

If SlySly didn't keep begging to be lynched, I probalby would have switched my vote already.

[VP Baltar]

I guess the good thing about DGB is that she's going to die due to insanity infractions sooner or later.

Anyone not voting SlySly: What's the dealio?

[VP Baltar]

I think we've finished planning night actions. Town should do their best to not get insanities and the prescribed persons should rob the graves they have been assigned to. Anyone not understanding this needs to speak up.

[VP Baltar]

Magua or kunk should sub

[VP Baltar]

Did DGB DQ?

Yeah, the mod hasn't come around yet to dish out the third one yet, but as far as I can tell she did.

[VP Baltar]

I have one insanity. I used Occult Books on semioldguy last night and found that he is not more insane than me, so that makes me feel a lot better about him.

I took twitch as my insanity.

Vote: ani

I think vote count analysis is in order today big time. Didn't it say somewhere that there were six cultists from the start? If so, we're sitting pretty right now and a good VC analysis should all but seal the cult's death.

Someone definitely needs to take over EK's chart today, as that scum kill was clearly intended to put a stop to it. I don't know if I have the time to do it at the moment, so I'd prefer someone else to, but as a last resort I will take up the cause.

I'm not bloody and I heard no noises last night.

Insanity Infraction

[VP Baltar]

Have no insanities, am not bloody, did not hear noise. Should we also state night actions?

Only if it helps to clear or condemn someone. If you aren't sure, just keep it to yourself for now because it might be useful to catch someone in a lie tomorrow.

Still no takers on the chart?

[VP Baltar]

@evilsnail - How did you forget about your noise? Didn't you look at your Night PM?

I'm all for lynching vikingfan today, and eliminating a murder may be optimal, but let's make sure we have the chart filled out before we do. The good thing about finding vikingfan is that he is probably the stray murderer who did in EK last night. The lack of other murders seems to indicate to me that our last ones could be among those who robbed graves last night.

Another question is if any of you grave robbers received equipment last night.

[VP Baltar]

I'm all for lynching vikingfan today, and eliminating a murder may be optimal, but let's make sure we have the chart filled out before we do. The good thing about finding vikingfan is that he is probably the stray murderer who did in EK last night. The lack of other murders seems to indicate to me that our last ones could be among those who robbed graves last night.

I think that DGB is more likely to be a cultist than vikingfan.

Yes, but at this point eliminating murders should be a priority as well since they would be closer to their wincon than cultists. If we determine someone is highly likely to be cult at this point, we could always have one of our really protown players stalk and murder (vig) them.

[VP Baltar]

To prove my insanity obviously. And I voted you because your name was there. Stop being so paranoid.

[VP Baltar]

haha, yer. lynching viking today.

Orders of business to be completed beforehand:

1) Fully updated chart
2) Votecount analysis


Should we designate graverobbers tonight or should we let the bodies linger until tomorrow?

[VP Baltar]

Investigator

Cultist

Murderer

I've also taken the liberty of updated all of the replacement names so it will be easier to see continuity. I will be treating EK as confirmed Investigator as well. I could probably do the same for Wicked, but there is a very outside chance he's Cultist I guess.

Peak of the ani wagon

:

I basically view ani as confirmed town at this point, so i am going to put him as an investigator. I don't think much can change this at this point for him since he's been crippled so bad.

Vote Count

animorpherv1

- 10 (

elvis_knits, startransmission

, iLord,

Iecerint

, vikingfan,

Nicodemus

, Ellibereth,

animorpherv1

, dramonic, Furcolow)
dramonic - 2 (Magua, rewq455)
Adel - 2 (Wickedestjr,

SlySly

)
Ellibereth - 2 (VP Baltar,

Phate

)

Not Voting - 9 (

CSL

, kunkstar7, DrippingGoofball, evilsnail, Plum, semioldguy,

Sajin

, Chaco,

Katy

)

Competing Nicodemus and Iecerint wagons

:

I think this wagon is important to look at because you can obviously see from the revealed cultists thus far that they were making a concerted effort to derail Nico's wagon.

Iecerint

- 6 (VP Baltar,

elvis_knits

,

SlySly

, dramonic,

CSL

,

animorpherv1

)

Nicodemus

- 5 (iLord, vikingfan,

Katy

, DrippingGoofball, semioldguy)

startransmission

- 4 (

Sajin

, Ellibereth,

Iecerint, Phate

)
Furcolow - 1 (Wickedestjr)

animorpherv1

- 1 (

startransmission

)
Ellibereth - 1 (rewq455)

Katy

- 1 (evilsnail)
evilsnail - 1 (Magua)

Not Voting - 5 (kunkstar7, Plum, Chaco, Furcolow,

Nicodemus

)

Day 1, Final Vote Count

:

Nicodemus

- 14 (iLord, vikingfan,

Katy

, DrippingGoofball, semioldguy, VP Baltar, dramonic,

Iecerint, elvis_knits, animorpherv1

, Ellibereth, Chaco,

Nicodemus, CSL

)

startransmission

- 2 (

Sajin, Phate

)

Iecerint

- 1 (

SlySly

)
Hayker - 1 (Wickedestjr)

animorpherv1

- 1 (

startransmission

)
Ellibereth - 1 (rewq455)

Katy

- 1 (evilsnail)
evilsnail - 1 (Magua)

Not Voting - 3 (kunkstar7, Plum, Furcolow)

Day 2, Final Vote Count

:

CSL

- 11 (DrippingGoofball, vikingfan, rewq455, VP Baltar,

Phate

,

SlySly

, Ellibereth,

elvis_knits

, semioldguy,

startransmission

, dramonic)
kunkstar7 - 2 (

CSL

, Magua)

Not Voting - 8 (

animorpherv1

, Chaco, kunkstar7, evilsnail, Furcolow, iLord, Plum, Wickedestjr)

Day 3, Final Vote Count

:

SlySly

- 10 (Plum, DrippingGoofball, iLord, VP Baltar, Chaco, vikingfan, dramonic, evilsnail, rewq455, kunkstar7)
DrippingGoofball - 2 (Ellibereth,

SlySly

)
kunkstar7 - 1 (

elvis_knits

)
Wickedestjr - 1 (Furcolow)

Not Voting - 4 (

animorpherv1

, Magua, semioldguy, Wickedestjr)

---

I'm going to post this now. I don't have much time left before I have to go work this afternoon, but it's probably best to get it up so people can at least look at it.

I see these as the most relevant votecounts so far in the game. Unfortunately, I find that even if we assume Wickedestjr is Investigator, it doesn't change much of anything. Same with assuming vikingfan as murder.

I haven't really done the analysis part yet, but my initial reaction just from looking is that Ellibereth and dramonic have the a very high chance of being cult out of everyone. Chaco is a possible third for me, but his general absence complicates that read.

DGB is almost certainly not cult, but stands a chance of being a murderer.

I'll try to do some actual indepth analysis later when I have the time.

[VP Baltar]

I really don't want to see this day end without serious discussion about the vote counts I posted and who everyone thinks are likely cultsists/murderers. Viking is basically a foregone conclusion at this point, but we should still try to gather info, particularly from people who have lurked unrepentantly this game.

[VP Baltar]

Furcolow's voting is odd. Often not voting at the end of the day and off every cult-wagon thus far. It could be due to the general inactivity of that player slot (which is a problem in itself)

Yeah, I mean the general non-presence isn't so great, but the fact that SlySly did his best to discredit Adel I at least feel that the slot was Investigator from the start.

[VP Baltar]

And Furcolow needs to put his actions out there last night. At least noise and if he gained any insanities.

[VP Baltar]

@Dram and Ellibereth - Any comment on the vote counts I posted? Who do you think is cult? Who do you think is murderer? How do you generally explain how bad you look because of them?

[VP Baltar]

Whenever you're done in the gay sex thread, dram. Take your time.

[VP Baltar]

I'm a bit perplexed at the accusation you are launching at me. Wha would be my motive as cult to lynch my buddies three days in a row?

You mean the buddies who were going down in flames anyhow and you were late on their wagons so you could say you were on their lynches?

Do you bus as scum, y/n?

[VP Baltar]

You don't know for sure.......


I know you didn't when we were buddies, but I was basically never in trouble that game so you really wouldn't have had to consider it. I'll look for myself later when I have time. In the meantime:

Any comment on the vote counts I posted? Who do you think is cult? Who do you think is murderer?

[VP Baltar]

What is "everything" that is pointing toward DGB?

Why do you want to lynch any of your three if viking is "confirmed scum"?

Why do you think Ellibereth is a "villian"? Does that mean cult or murderer?

[VP Baltar]

Elli is town.

So was SlySly, remember that?

What do you think of the vote counts DGB?

Who have you murdered thus far in the game? If you've only killed once, now would be a good time to claim so.

[VP Baltar]

I'll com back with names later.

Good thing I wasn't holding my breath.

Aside from some last minute wavering, I had him pegged as scum for most of the day.

I was refering to you throughout the game calling him town. You did indeed change your tune for his lynch, but I guess that's irrelevant anyhow. The main point is that I don't think you reads or participation this game have particularly been anything that someone should follow on clipped statements such as "Elli is town".

Wagon analysis is Gospel.

I agree. In the game of mafia, it's one of the things that come closest to a "fact". Given that, what is your personal interpretation of the vote counts I posted? How do you read Elli town out of those?



What are people's thoughts on a near town member stalking and murdering dramonic (or a decided upon scum suspect) over the next two nights? By my account, iLord, SOG and myself all are highly likely to be town and using pro-town players as vigges is a good decision in my opinion. Thoughts?



Hey, Chaco, you still playing this game?

[VP Baltar]

So you believe him to be cult then? He's absolutely not murderer.

[VP Baltar]

Why can't he be murderer?

I communed him last night when I had 0 insanities and he was not more insane than me.

I'd need to look back at your PoE and see how likely I think SOG is to be there. Behaviorally, I don't like how quiet he's been, which was the main reason for me investigating him last night.

Who do you think is cleared from being Cultist? I don't need reasons necessarily at this point, I'd just like to see your list.

SOG raises a valid point about murderers hiding actions...though if we can cripple them with grave robbing that could at least someone counterbalance the effective, especially if vikingfan flips as our leading murderer.

@vikingfan - speaking of which, where are you? You have nothing to say? You want to be lynched today?

[VP Baltar]

Also, I disagree that we should have people who are confirmed, or near confirmed town members commit murders on selected targets. I think that we should have our grave robbers, who will have to be lynched eventually due to their high insanity counts, should stalk and murder. Later on we could have the people with low insanities stalk and murder.

Eh, I don't think so. Our graverobbers already likely have one murder under their belts and could be working toward more, so giving them another one free seems like a really bad idea. None of the people who are likely investigators this far in the game are going to turn murderer, since it would be a near guaranteed loss, so they are the best to make the kill imo.

Additionally, we only get one lynch a day, so unless you are ready to lock yourself into lynching the appointed murderer tomorrow, you're taking a big risk that way.

@kunkstar - how's the chart coming? who else do you need to hear from and what info do you need?

[VP Baltar]

You're not doing it ani.


I just realized something. Now that SOG and I have been confirmed to have low sanities (and I think iLord as well, since I believe his commune of me), having one or more of us murder would essentially confirm us 100% as investigator since Cultists cannot murder. As long as our murderers do not kill the same targets (which would be stupid because it would still appear to confirm a town member and thus make process of elimination on them easier), a single successful kill would show us as close to confirmed as we could get.

I need to look at the numbers, but having three confirmed townies is a very tasty idea to me and would essentially screw the scum even more than they already are this game.

[VP Baltar]

Vikingfan probably murdered E_K last night. He's probably not murdering tonight. What do you guys think about lynching DGB today, and then lynching VF tomorrow?

I honestly don't believe she's cult based on wagon placement. That'd be some heavy bussing if it was. I'd prefer having here as one of the stalk/murder targets by pro-town players tonight and tomorrow.

I could, however, go for lynching dram or Ellibereth today.

I want to finish the chart so I can see who is in danger tonight. Furcolow, after we see who all heard noises, I thin we can then best determine who you should use your rezz kit on.

[VP Baltar]

*having her

[VP Baltar]

@rewq, SOG, and evilsnail - If you guys have occult books, it could be a good idea to cross examine one another. Thoughts?

I think Furcolow should rezz iLord just to be safe.

iLord and I should stalk some of the more suspicious people and kill them tomorrow, my suggestion would be Ellibereth and dram. Lynching vikingfan still seems like a good idea.

Anyone see faults with this plan other than the hiding murders thing? Personally, I think it'd be very dumb for a murderer to kill one of the named targets because it is going to confirm hypo-cult iLord or I, which seems counterproductive to their goal of surviving and more likely to lead to their own lynch the next day.

[VP Baltar]

What happens if Cult wards cultElli/cultDram?

Hmm, good point. Damn. I guess the only thing we can do to prevent that is to tie up would be cult with grave robbings. Additionally, however, this would basically confirm them as cult. So while it'd delay their deaths by a day or two, they are basically outting themselves if they survive the killing night.

Could be something I'm missing though. This is why talking is good.

Sure. I still have a pair of Occult Books. Wasn't SOG's insanity count already confirmed, though? By you even, I seem to remember.

Yer, I'm an idiot. So no one needs to check him again, which is actually useful since rewq doesn't have books. If SOG does, then he checks you and you check rewq.

[VP Baltar]

Furcolow - I would say the best option is to rezz iLord tonight and we'll see where we are at tomorrow. If you stalking and killing is the best option, then the town will have you do it, but if it's not then we won't have you do it. No big. We'll see what the cards look like after tonight.

@iLord/kunk - Yeah, that occured to me later, but if the cult want to waste their night actions warding people in hopes of a mislynch, so be it I guess. I dunno though, maybe the killing plan isn't very effective if announced. I'll see if I can think of something better.

@rewq - I probably wouldn't bother looking for books tonight unless you really want to. I think that situation has sorted itself out and you can most likely think of something better to do tonight.

Overall reads:
People who are town: Ani,

Sajin

, VP,

slysly

, iLord
People who are neutral, leaning town:

Phate

, Magua,

Iecerint, Katy

, Wicked
People who are neutral: DGB, Chaco, dramonic, Sarag,

Startransmission

, Faraday,

CSL

, Ellibereth
People who are neutral, leaning scum: Drench, E_K, Hayker, evilsnail,
Diescumdie: vikingfan, SOG

I think that he most likely put all the cult in the top three categories, but it really seems like he was following along with the town's popular opinion, so I don't think it can be reliable. I'm guessing the rest of the cult is in his "neutral/neutral-town" categories.

I basically agree with this completely. Once again my top three suspects of Chaco, Ellibereth and dramonic are smack dab in the middle of things. I'm sort of wondering why we've heard so little from Magua and Plum today...though I think the latter had a V/LA at one point.

And speaking of dram:

*epic facepalm*

You're referring to your own posting today, correct?

Vote: dramonic

*twitch*

[VP Baltar]

What if I was one of the vigs. My insanity count is getting higher, so its harder for me to contribute to lynches. Note that this would require me to take Psychopathy to be able to commit the murder. The day following the murder I should be lynched, as I would effectively be a Murderer.

So, you essentially want to lose the game for yourself? Also, as you said, we'd have to waste a lynch. I don't see how this makes sense....that is of course unless you are a murderer who is close your win con.

[VP Baltar]

Isn't someone already rezzing me or something? Shouldn't he rezz you?

I thought he was rezzing you? Regardless, I don't really need to be rezzed since I didn't hear any noise last night. I don't think I"m in any sort of danger, at least for tonight.

[VP Baltar]

VP, what about the cult kill? Actually, its better to not announce any rez plans, otherwise cult knows who not to pick. In truth though, I don't think there is anything town can really do to prevent a cult kill, due to the mechanics surrounding The Ritual and the approximate number of cult left.

Probably, but I view iLord as a major asset right now and I would rather openly discourage them from killing him than hope and pray for a successful protect. Right now we have enough of a numbers advantage that the cult picking off someone tonight isn't going to have any sort of major impact and actually could help PoE tomorrow. Losing obv-town players, however, isn't going to help anything.

[VP Baltar]

I don't think we need to lynch Furcolow. I'm pretty convinced he's town who doesn't fully understand the mechanics. If anything we can have him grave rob, but I think we can spend our lynch in much better ways.

[VP Baltar]

Factoid:

If we take for a fact that murderers won't lie to confirm other players, the one who killed Elvis is either viking or rewq.
thoughts?

It's already been established that viking probably killed EK.

You know what really makes me know you're confirmed scum dram is the fact that you are doing absolutely nothing since coming under suspicion, and yet you are a capable player.

[VP Baltar]

Factoid:

If we take for a fact that murderers won't lie to confirm other players, the one who killed Elvis is either viking or rewq.
thoughts?

I have 0 insanities, which can be confirmed tonight, therefore I could not have murdered.

Also, why are you saying that I am a possible murderer? You have said nothing else to support a suspicion of it.

Shhhhh, don't feed the scum.

[VP Baltar]

Did you ever state your night 2 actions Magua?

[VP Baltar]

No. Should I?

Noises and Insanities would be good. Anything beyond that you should only claim if you think you can either help to clear or condemn someone.

dram's list of potential murderers seems to check out on first glance other than being a little loose with iLord/Plum, but I'd probably still agree with it.

viking has to go today and rewq probably is not murderer given an insanity count that should be confirmed tonight.

Also is there any chance that Furcolow can be communed tonight by someone with 1 insanity?

I'll consider it if people really want me to since the murder-potential-scum plan was shot down. However, I am almost certain he is town that just doesn't quite understand everything going on. I think it'd be a semi-wasted night action, but if people are really that uneasy about it I can do it.

[VP Baltar]

Seriously, who were the people who were going to go murderer and failed last night? If you haven't taken psychopathy yet, claim now so we know who you are and can better assess the situation and who needs to be lynched. By staying in hiding, you are just making it much more likely that you will be lynched later.

[VP Baltar]

Furcolow - What is your mafia experience? Is this the first game you've ever played? Do you have any off-site experience?

[VP Baltar]

I'm confused by what you are asking here. What did you mean by "people who were going to go murderer and failed last night?"

I mean people who had planned to go the murderer route by getting two successful kills and not by taking psychopathy. They would have likely had a successful kill on Night 1 or 2, but would failed to either stalk or complete their murder last night if they were assigned to grave rob. I think we should give them a chance to claim now if they want so we can further use PoE to make the correct lynches and help them win with the town.

I've played around 10 games, most of which poorly.

Do you have any links so I may read some of your games?

Also, please relax. This is just a game and you are likely to get called scum at one point or another. It's not the end of the world. You'll probably end up getting investigated in one way or another and then be cleared. Happened to me last night even though I think I've played a VERY pro-town game throughout. no big.

[VP Baltar]

@kunk - did you have a version of the chart with a yes or no for noises on everyone last night? I think that's critical information that needs to be completely filled out every night.

[VP Baltar]

Unvote, Vote: vikingfan

*twitch*

That's L-1. If people have other things to talk about, now's the time. Hope everyone already has a night action in mind tonight.

Furcolow, don't forget that we need you to rez iLord tonight.

Anything else that needs to be said?

[VP Baltar]

I think this is an appropriate time or a :headbash:

Eh, I don't think much else needed to be said anyhow. Most people were just lurking. Time to lynch yet another scum and move the game forward.

[VP Baltar]

That was the hammer by my count. I checked before I voted and I'm pretty sure mine was L-1.

[VP Baltar]

@furcolow- the thing is that if you use your rezz pack on iLord and no one targets him, he still lives and you don't lose your rezz pack. It's a win-win situation other than you gaining an insanity. I really want iLord alive right now and I'd be pretty pissed if he died tonight, so all WIFOM aside, rezz him.

@kunk - can I get the full noise chart while we wait for Chaco.

I don't mind waiting another day or two to see if that slot can be replaced, but letting the game stagnate too much is going to hurt the town in the long run.

[VP Baltar]

That affects if your vote counts?

yes, if you have an insanity infraction your vote does not count.

[VP Baltar]

That affects if your vote counts?

yes, if you have an insanity infraction your vote does not count.

Really? How come we were asking everyone to prove their insanity by getting an insanity infraction?

I don't understand your question. By getting a specific insanity infraction, it proves that you took that SPECIFIC insanity rather than say psychopathy or something else. Having your vote count or not is a separate issue.

[VP Baltar]

Thanks, kunk. Much appreciated.

I also agree completely with the night plan he proposes. Everyone else can do whatever the please as far as I'm concerned.

I'll decide tonight if I want to commune Furcolow.

[VP Baltar]

You could also ward iLord, DGB. Then you won't gain an insanity for nothing.

[VP Baltar]

What if the scum doesn't target iLord because of expectations he'll be rezzed? Maybe I should cover another player.

warding will prevent him from being stalked tonight, thus guaranteeing that he won't die tomorrow night.

[VP Baltar]

Yer, there are eight names on that list but only seven votes.

[VP Baltar]

Plum is da scumz. I used my Occult Books on her last night and she was more insane than me.

I took

Compulsion

as my insanity since I shouldn't need to launder anyhow.

I heard noise, but that could have been from DGB.

Who robbed vikingfan's grave last night? I thought we were leaving that for today.

Vote: Plum

*Twitch*

[VP Baltar]

Plum is da scumz. I used my Occult Books on her last night and she was more insane than me.

I took Compulsion as my insanity since I shouldn't need to launder anyhow.

I heard noise, but that could have been from DGB.

Who robbed vikingfan's grave last night? I thought we were leaving that for today.

Vote: Plum

*Twitch*

lol, I thought you were hitting furcolow. I Communed Plum as well and got the same result.

One of the murderer's probably grave-robbed. We still have 3 townie bodies though, so we could cross-rob with 3 people tonight still. Dram, Elli, and DGB?

Sorry, Plum was worrying me far more than Furcolow. If I would have known someone else was going there I wouldn't have. Oh well, scum caught anyhow.

I think we need to determine who would be the best lynch today. Personally, I think dram and Plum are both cult, so seeing either of them go is going to make me happy. So depending who is left on that list, I think that graverobbing plan works fine. I'll probably need to review once more to make sure, but seems about right.

[VP Baltar]

Eh, perhaps, but my guess is that Plum intends to continue her lurking as she's done all game.

Basically iLord, I think the scum are too scared to post in this thread because at this point it's a losing cause for them. We have them wrapped up so tight it's not even worth them putting an effort in.

In fact, scums, just claim now so we can take care of you quickly and don't need to bother dragging this out any longer than necessary.

[VP Baltar]

@dram - You're so freaking scum I don't even need an investigation to confirm it on you. As I believe I've said elsewhere, PoE is a B-I-T-C-H.

[VP Baltar]

@rewq - Not as cut and dry as that, but I think as the game has gone on and town has continued to dominate it is becoming increasingly obvious that the scum are becoming meek. I'm not really seeing much fight from them to control the game since iLord and I are basicaly given the run of the game at this point. Right now we have people who are either confirmed or near confirmed scum, so they should be our top lynch choices, but if we came to a loss for those targets (which I don't think is that likely as the game goes on) thinking about lynching the lurkers isn't really a BAD idea.

[VP Baltar]

farside, I agree with iLord, claim now please. It's absolutely necessary. Please document your actions from every single night.

[VP Baltar]

Mind if I catch up first? Instead of holding the mod up too much waiting on me I used the commune and just picked DGB figuring if anyone was more insane then me it would be her.

Unfortunately, no. I'm going to have to ask you to claim right now, before you read.

Didn't chao claim all his actions? Is there a reason you want more then just my night 3 action?
I have a right to ask since I haven't read so far. I did note that chao mentioned taking the taboo for launder.

Your slot is under suspicion. This will either clear you or damn you and the more you stall, the worse it looks. Claim in your next post.

[VP Baltar]

Yeah, you're scum. Sorry you replaced into that slot farside, but that's how it goes. You have absolutely no reason to hide your night actions other than not wanting to contradict your predecessor's story.

I gave you a legitimate reason why you need to claim them. The person you replaced is under suspicion because of PoE with night actions and vote counts. It's legit. This is your last chance to claim and quit stalling.

And I agree with iLord that it's unfortunate because you're a great player for replacing into such a large game, but it's what needs to be done.

[VP Baltar]

No offense when I state this but I really find people who try to trip up a replacement to claim when their predessor already claim the lowest form of scum hunting. You want to lynch me because my predessor claimed already and you want to see if I claimed something different.
No matter what you think about me as a player I really despise people that take advantage of a player that replaces in.
I personal have seen players I replace give false info and be town. So don't give me shit for checking out chaco.
You want to nail me as some scum suspect give me a case to look at, don't waste my time being a dick to a replacement.

You can feign anger all you like. Asking you to confirm info you wouldn't know is a very legitimate form of scumhunting. Sure, Chaco COULD have lied, but town lying is definitely not the norm and given the complexity of this game I think he'd have a fair deterrant not to. It's simply not a legitimate argument to make.

iLord, my robbing list tonight reads: dram, Elli, farside22

Lynch Plum today.

[VP Baltar]

We have too many people to lynch and not enough lynches. Would we rather lynch

Murderer

today or Cultist?

By the way the bold is what a player choses when he has to pick an insanity. chao nor myself picked it.
I can't Launder, I have to twitch when I vote and I can't vote the same person in the same day now. 2 are provable today.

Also, this is all but an admission of guilt. He asked you if we should lynch a murderer or cult today and your response is that you couldn't be murderer.

[VP Baltar]

Whatever you say clyde. You didn't answer why you wanted me to claim after my predessor already claimed so I know at that point what your trying to do.

Except for the part where I did.

PoE = Process of Elimination, btw.

And ftr, I don't expect you to read the whole game and you're not getting lynched today. The point is, however, that you've repeatedly fought down a legitimate request for no real reason other than the unlikely fact that Chaco lied as town...so...how would you read that as town?

And my name isn't clyde.

Anyhow, I'm finished with this argument.

Waiting for the rest of the people to show up now. Plum, do you have anything to say?

[VP Baltar]

And I see no reason to claim coming in as a replacement. I have seen scum try and trip up town players and I have seen town trip up scum with that tactic. You consider me a noob and insult my intelligence and I will call you the name of Clyde.

Now that I know I'm not getting lynched today I will sit down Monday and start my read.

I don't consider you a noob at all, nor did I insult your intelligence. I asked you to claim FACTUAL information that can be checked by those of us who are up on the game. That's not insulting to you, that's just smart play on my part. It's your choice to refuse, of course, but as an experienced player you should know how badly that reflects on you and is likely to result in your own lynch.

[VP Baltar]

Agreed on noise claims being mandatory (other than Plum I guess if she's the lynch).

kunk, what do you think about SOG's plan to leave the Lynchee to be robbed later?

Also, why does evilsnail's death reflect badly on SOG and not on rewq?

[VP Baltar]

Magua, Plum, Ellibereth, dramonic, farside are the remaining cult/murderers.

/game

[VP Baltar]

/facepalm.

VP, can you look at this post and tell me how many insanities Plum should have?

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 92#2205092

...


ok. kunk has her listed as one, which was why I Communed her. So, if the chart is right, the max she should have today is two if she took some action last night that would pick one up.

[VP Baltar]

Magua, Plum, Ellibereth, dramonic, farside are the remaining cult/murderers.

/game

Which do you think are cult and which are murderers?

I think Plum and farside are murderers and the remaining three are cult. I'm fairly certain about Plum, Elli and dram. farside is definitely scum, but I'm positive of affiliation. Magua is the least certain of my reads.

[VP Baltar]

...


ok. kunk has her listed as one, which was why I Communed her. So, if the chart is right, the max she should have today is two if she took some action last night that would pick one up.

I believe Kunk's chart was incorrect - she should have 1 from rezzing, and 1 from the fetish she received at the very least, in addition to whatever insanity-gaining action she might've taken last night. Our night actions were useless .

Crap, that's right. I need to look back and fact check then. I still don't like that Plum hasn't showed up in this thread in any significant way in a long time, but we could have definitely wasted our night actions.

Unvote

for now.

*twitch*

[VP Baltar]

well, unless I missed something we've incriminating evidence against Plum.
Vote: Plum

I take it you didn't read iLord's post then?

[VP Baltar]

Why is farside asking questions to players who aren't in this game anymore?

I guess if you have any questions about Adel's actions you should ship them this way

Why? How are you going to answer for what Adel did exactly?

So I can see grave robbing in my future plans but again my sanitys are all provable in some way shape or form that means point blank I didn't chose the insanity to become a murder. As to what chaco was thinking or doing I don't know it's not how I would have gone about doing this game.

If you're town, you won't graverob tonight.

Question did anyone confirm that VP was targed with Ward from N0?
Did anyone confirm whether EK targeted adel with ward N0?

Wickedestjr, confirmed town, targeted me with ward.

As for a for changing my view...it's called reconsidering. How is this helping you scum hunt or be relevant to the current game at all?

Don't get me wrong, it's great that you're reading the whole game, but it's rather unnecessary to post your notes in the thread when all of this stuff is light years ago.

[VP Baltar]

*Mod: sorry I'm a bit busy atm. Did my vote count or does it not count with the sanity infraction?

Your vote does not count if there's an insanity infraction.

[VP Baltar]

What do you think of furcolow's response?

I think furcolow is good at putting his foot in his mouth, but due to the combination of Adel's behavior, scum reveals thus far attacking that slot, night actions, and Hayker's absence I absolutely do not feel he is scum.

[VP Baltar]

you stated you didn't believe Chaco warded Dramo (even though dramo heard a noise) What do you believe that Chaco did to Dramo then?

How do I know he did anything to dram? I don't.

How do you come up with this as your reason for pooping Elli's idea? Why do you assume that all the scum will be picked in this case to do the shooting?

I came up with them by determining it was a poo poo plan. I never said anything about scum being chosen to do the shooting...in fact, scum cannot do that. Clearly you're not reading.

What was the difference between Adel's plan and Elli's?

Interesting point here and more fasinating to boot considering that the player Elli targeted was a cultist

Their plans were not similar. Again, read.

re: the second point, fair enough. I don't recall who he was targeting, but I'll take your word for it atm. That being said Ellibereth could just be cult waiting for his buddies to cut his plan down and then he gets points for trying to create a "game breaking" strategy. Iunno, I'd have to reread that whole section and I'm not too inclined to spend the time as long as we keep getting obv. scum to lynch every day.

I don't see a reason to ignore my questions I'm asking.

Probably because they are highly irrelevant to the Here and Now. I'm happy to answer things I think are actual scum hunting, but asking me "what were you thinking in this post several weeks ago" is about as useless as one can be in a game of mafia.

Simply put, get to your damn point and stop posting endless notes that mean nothing. Like it or lump it, I hate excessive blather.

I haven't caught up. I was told when I got in that I was replacing a scummy spot. I would like to know what the case is? Is this really difficult? Should I ask the mod to include a rule that states that players can not be dick's to replacements?

Yeah, you're right. You willingly replace into a game, spam the thread, call people names for thinking you're scum, make all kinds of demands that could be filled by you finishing your read and yet everyone else is being the jerk. Cool story.

Vote Plum

*twitch*

Getting close Plum, sure you don't have anything to say?

[VP Baltar]

As for VP. GFYS. I've done more scum hunting these past 2 days of reading then I have read of your post in the last 53 pages.

Awww, don't hurt my feelings. Pretty sure a majority of my reads have been correct this game and I haven't needed to pad my posts with all the noise you have, so have fun with your anger, but it means nothing to me.

Your reads are laughable and emotional at their very best. For instance, Drench isn't even in this game anymore.

But keep it up, it's fun to watch.

---

I don't think furcolow should be rezzed tonight. Sorry buddy, I think you're town but if you do get murdered tonight it would probably benefit the town.

[VP Baltar]

^basically. Don't be afraid to die in a game if it will benefit the town.

[VP Baltar]

^basically. Don't be afraid to die in a game if it will benefit the town.

how the fuck does an investigator dying BENEFIT THE TOWN?

you make 0 sense

Because you're drawing unnecessary suspicion and generally making a spectacle of OMGUSing anyone who wants you dead. Right now we are well up on the numbers, so losing you is not going to hurt us in the slightest.

[VP Baltar]

Keep proving my point, Furcolow.

Also, I'd like links to some other mafia games you've played, even if they're off site.

[VP Baltar]

I'm sorry I don't share information with cultists.

Post it or perish. Your choice.

[VP Baltar]

No, he's not.

[VP Baltar]

I'm sorry I don't share information with cultists.

Post it or perish. Your choice.

I'm sorry, but I don't share information that your cultist buddies or murderers could use to influence the derailment of the town through altering a potentially good lynch into a mislynch of someone who I know is town.

I'm on the Plum lynch there genius. In fact, I started it. Post your games and stop being annoying.

[VP Baltar]

@Magua - I think the bigger issue with Plum is the disparity in her claimed insanities, which is yet to be explained.

[VP Baltar]

I don't have any Occult Books, since my set burst into flames last night after I was successful on Plum.

[VP Baltar]

@VP- That was a pretty quick change from saying that Furcolow is just a stupid investigator to thinking we should let him die. Why did your opinion change?

He's still a stupid investigator. I never changed my opinion. I've just stopped caring if he dies because he's a massive distraction that is keeping people from having useful discussion. Right now town's numbers are so strong, losing him isn't going to hurt anything.

Feel free to rez him if you'd like, but I wouldn't cry if he was gone.

[VP Baltar]

Wait, am I missing something here?

Her lying about the number of insanities she actually has, as proven by our communes.