Stars Aligned II - Game Over!

[SlySly]

Why did I join this game? It took forever for me to figure it out in the first game and now the rules are different enough to have me confused again. Anyway, no noise, no ward.

[SlySly]

I'm not claiming day 2.

Noise, action and insanity claims in the first game led to an overwhelming town victory. What better alternative do you suggest? A hardline stance against claims providing a tracking system for the town seems a little anti-town to me.

[SlySly]

I think the dramonic wagon, though understandable, is a bit premature. No one is a murderer yet, but there are scum already. We should be trying to lynch scum, not a later potential 3rd party.

[SlySly]

I think the point is that dram either rolled cult -or- he rolled investigator who will choose to become a murderer. Why are you not thinking about the scenario where dramonic rolled cultist?

The only reasons I have seen associated with a vote on dramonic, and I may have missed one, are ones of the basis that he is a big fan of being a 3rd party, was one in the last game, and would most likely try to be one in this game. I would gladly support his lynch if it was based on evidence of him being scum. I have not seen any of that offered up yet, feel free.

[SlySly]

I heard no noise, did not use ward.

Also, I decided to Launder myself, and I chose Avolition because I essentially, over the period of the game, seem really scummy in every game I play, as well as I always seem to find townies scummy. By day 4, I should have some info to make an informed decision.

(viii) Avolition - For three Days, your vote no longer contributes to a lynch. Your vote still shows up in vote counts.

You chose to give yourself an insanity?

unvote; vote animorpherv

I find ani's action stupid more than scummy. Scum wouldn't be willing to give up their ability to contribute to a mislynch.

-----------------------------

oh come on.
I think you are trying to consider me overpredictable. You are in the game sajin, I'm not stupid, I know I CAN'T go murderer even if I wish I could =_=

The only way you CAN'T go murderer is if you are a cultist. Do you agree?

I believe Sajin just nailed a slip right on the head!

vote:Dramonic

[SlySly]

Wait, what could've scumAni done to gain an insanity? Stalk?

Prerequisites: You must be an

Investigator

or a

Murderer

.

[SlySly]

@Slysly: Okay, so then what action could Ani possibly be covering up?

Stalk is the only thing that ani could be covering up. That means ani is one of the following.

1. Idiot (most likely)
2. Planning to become murderer and trying to cover it up with #1.
3. Warded someone and is lying about it.

If he is covering up a future insanity, that could be validated if someone has Occult Books and used them on Ani.

I don't believe what he just said was a slip, he's simply saying that Sajin would catch him the moment he went bad.

I can see that as a reasonable interpretation. My vote will likely move soon if one player in particular continues to avoid questions.

[SlySly]

And where is DGB? She is never this quiet. Active lurking?

[SlySly]

If he is covering up a future insanity, that could be validated if someone has Occult Books and used them on Ani.

On Night 0?

No, N1. If the OB user has 0 insanity, as should be the case right now, and Ani is lying, the results would be negative as Ani would have 0 insanity as well.

Effect: You learn whether your target has (strictly) more

Insanities

than you.

[SlySly]

I give up. I stalked Adel.

Reasoning:

Adel is a good player -> What if he's cult -> If he is we're all screwed.

As I stated before, I would rather lynch scum than a later potential murderer. Ani is not a murderer yet and may not become one. Ani voters, start scum hunting.

[SlySly]

2. they have players from the last Sars game

You speak like you have a list of the scum players in this game. It is hard for Investigators to make such bold assumptions.

You believe him?

I believe he didn't Launder and that he stalked.

Obviously, yeah. Laundering would be stupid. So, if Adel gets killed, kill Ani? But for today leave him alone?

If Adel gets killed and flips scum, why kill Ani? It takes 2 murders to be forced to become a murderer. All investigators, in a sense, have a 1 time free pass Vig. It just cost a night and an insanity to do it.

[SlySly]

I believe that it is essential to lynch ani at this point. Riculaulsly anti-town play requires dicipline and punishment by lynch.

I think you are scum that is running scared because Ani has a bullseye on your back. IMO, you have been anti-town so far during this game.

Giving people a pass for being "too scummy to be scum" isn't going to help us win.

He can't

prove

that he can't hammer, so his claim is not verifiable.

Proving his insanity is now pointless. He stalked you. There is no reason to doubt his honesty about his insanity choice. From my view he is obvInvestigator that chose to stalk. It is better to try and lynch scum than to lynch those who are investigators. No way around it.

Unvote

Vote:Adel

[SlySly]

prove to us that you are sincere about this.

How did you arrive at that opinion?

Which posts influenced your opinion?

What makes me more antitown than other players?

Why do you think that I shopuld be lynched?

What exactly about my play has been anti-town?

Follow along...

I'm not claiming day 2.

Noise, action and insanity claims in the first game led to an overwhelming town victory. What better alternative do you suggest? A hardline stance against claims providing a tracking system for the town seems a little anti-town to me.

Prerefusal to help the town going forward. Anti-town.

Avoiding my question, Anti-town. Given, you

much

later answered a similar question.

-------------------

Obviously, a person who played in the first game is cult in this game, and they decided to go with the full claims pronto.

Show me where it is obvious that players from the first game are scum in this game. It's not. Mere speculation. I was in the first game and I am not scum. I'm not saying there are no players from the first game on the scum team in this one, but I don't see how you can say it is obvious that is the case in this game. Nothing more than an assumption on your part, or you have inside information because you are scum.

-------------------

I give up. I stalked Adel.

Reasoning:

Adel is a good player -> What if he's cult -> If he is we're all screwed.

vote:animorpherv1

Wagon jump on obvTown player. Anti-town.

--------------------

2. they have players from the last Sars game

Same assumption as before, see above.

--------------------

I believe that it is essential to lynch ani at this point.

Panic at realization there is target on your back so you push to eliminate and obvTown player. Anti-town.

He can't

prove

that he can't hammer, so his claim is not verifiable.

Try to discredit obvTown player by bringing up a useless point. Anti-town.

--------------------

I'm for lynching him quickly and moving on to night before this spam fest leaves us with 75 pages of nosie.

Repeated panic and move for lynch of obvTown player for self-preservation reasoning. Anti-town.

I'm still not going to claim anythign on day 2.

Repeated prerefusal to help the town going forward. Anti-town.

[SlySly]

I'm not quite sure where you get the certainty to make such bold statements. How do we

know

that Ani isn't cult fake-claiming an insanity so that he can kill in the ritual tonight? How are you so sure that Ani is telling the truth about his insanity this time, as opposed to another lie? I am far from convinced that Ani is "obvInvestigator" as you say.

He can be checked with Occult Books. If he has no insanity, he is lying scum. If he does, he is either idiot town or stalker town. Town = worse lynch than scum. Pushing for town instead of scum hunting = proScum. I think he has an insanity NOW and was just trying to explain it off. I am more than willing to believe he stalked.

In other news, I think it's silly to lynch anyone other than Ani today.

I think it is silly to lynch obvtown player when there is scum to lynch.

[SlySly]

Show me where it is obvious that players from the first game are scum in this game. It's not. Mere speculation. I was in the first game and I am not scum. I'm not saying there are no players from the first game on the scum team in this one, but I don't see how you can say it is obvious that is the case in this game. Nothing more than an assumption on your part, or you have inside information because you are scum.

or I know something that you don't.

Exactly, I'm sure you do, scum.

[SlySly]

He can be checked with Occult Books. If he has no insanity, he is lying scum. If he does, he is either idiot town or stalker town. Town = worse lynch than scum. Pushing for town instead of scum hunting = proScum. I think he has an insanity NOW and was just trying to explain it off. I am more than willing to believe he stalked.

even though I was warded by another player? really?

If you were warded and he stalked you and his stalk failed, why would he be trying to cover up an insanity? He wouldn't because he wouldn't have one. If it is because he is scum and trying to cover up a future insanity, which I find highly unlikely, that can be checked with Occult Books.

[SlySly]

please stop coordinating with your scummates in your Qt thread and answer me.

I don't have a Qt thread like you. I have been answering you.

[SlySly]

now that you've outed yourself are you trying to play stupid so that we'll give you a pass for being a VI? That isn't going to happen, so please just stop it.

Well, I am glad I am outed as town.

If he really did stalk me then he

would not claim an insanity

-- but he did.

Why do you think that he is Obvtown?

He has an insanity. I don't really see why scum would at this point.

[SlySly]

You gain the insanity regardless of whether your stalk action is successful or not.

Where do you see this stated?

[SlySly]

perhaps when I get a forth one wrong you will catch on.

Scum never have to read as close as town. I already caught on.

[SlySly]

Scum never have to read as close as town. I already caught on.

Hmm? Really? Why? Not that I'm not somewhat receptive to Adelscum.

More of a blanket statement, in this game, I would think it be equally important for scum and town to read everything as there is so much going on. In a regular game, scum can float along when their tactics are working without having to pay attention to every detail of the thread.

[SlySly]

A failed action will not produce the Effect, but all Side Effects still apply

Ty, I was focusing on the Ward and Stalk sections when I was looking for clarification.

[SlySly]

as I see it the policy based deaths of zwet and mastin led to an overwhelming town victory.

That game was pretty much a perfect run for the town. I have not reread the game since it was over, so I don't know exactly what you are referring to, nor am I going to go back and dig for it. But I know that the ongoing information gathering by all the claims throughout the game lead to an overwhelming town victory. It was not just the lynch of two people.

why are you against an ani lynch?

I think he is obvTown and I think it is much better to look for scum to lynch.

~~~

He has an insanity. I don't really see why scum would at this point.

why do you think that he has an insanity? He claimed that he did, why do you believe him?

I see that as the only logical explanation for his actions.

[SlySly]

he backtracked almost immediately.

Hardly, I just answered Iecerint's question.

[SlySly]

I agree Sly, I don't like this blatant example of smear.

Just calling it like I see it. Only other people besides Adel who have registered on my scumdar are the possible Dramonic slip, Elliberth, and DGB. DGB only because of inactivity. I'm sure she will resurface soon and alleviate my concern of the lurk in classic DGB fashion.

[SlySly]

sure dude, day 2 opened with 3/5 of the cult dead, and all of you are geniuses for winning. Congrats on your amazing system

that the reviewers and game designer obviously weren't aware of and wouldn't have adjusted for in the design of this game

.

Sorry dude, I replaced into that game late, as you probably know since you have obviously read it more recently than I. I do not have total recall of that game at all. I do know that the claims were helpful for the town in the part of the game I played.

-----------------

The cult players who were in the first game obviously know the favored tactic from the first game and have coached their team to roll with it

If you say so, only a cult player would know what has been coached so far. I'll take your word for it.

-----------------

the real story: SlySly is cult, and either is defending his buddy, or defending someone he knos is not cult.

unvote, vote:SlySly

Severe reach with severe OMGUS.

[SlySly]

vote:animorpherv1

thank you

obvTown, like I said.

[SlySly]

bullshit, you gave no reason for thinking so! All you offered is scummy circular nonsense!

I explained it plenty well. And, I was right. Once he revealed he had stalked, obviousness struck that he was obvTown trying to cover his insanity with a bogus Launder claim. It was pretty clear before that that he wasn't cult, you just weren't willing to accept it openly. Not surprising, though. Why would scum want to derail a strong mislynch wagon?

[SlySly]

Mod: I am not voting ani, my vote is on Adel

Fixed

[SlySly]

Refer back to the first game, Dramonic. Avolition votes still show in the count but do not affect the lynch.

[SlySly]

Like there is even any question, lol!!!

[SlySly]

Anyone care to place a wager?

[SlySly]

The wait is over. Nothing is going to happen. There will be no confirmation.

[SlySly]

Nice to know Phate has appointed himself our leader!

[SlySly]

@Phayte- I actually have zero problem with ani taking other actions that cause insanities as long as he robs the lynch grave every day+ others if needed. Do you have a problem with him vigging one time? I guess that would be the only other useful action he could take that would cause insanity gain. Point stands though.

QFT

[SlySly]

So is Ani fully cleared, or are we worried about another wannabe murderer with an Avolition insanity being on the wagon trying to spread chaos?

For 100% verification we could clear the wagon and get the other 12 players to vote for Ani along with Ani.

[SlySly]

btw, I think that I just broke the setup for the town.

You're gonna piss Phate off if you steal his thunder.

[SlySly]

Um, he can only vig after a successful stalk. So the only person he can vig is Adel, which is why Sly is so happy about it. Unless he stalks somebody else and then Vigs.

Yes, I will be happy if Adel gets vig'd and flips scum but I also remember in the other game that there were times where we needed more than one person robbing graves for accountability. I'm fine with ani choosing to vig Adel because he believes he is scum, as I do, and I am also fine with him only robbing graves tonight. I suspect some more questionable players will arise that we will want robbing graves in the nights ahead. I would prefer Adel get lynched, flip scum and ani's vig ability is nullified, period.

@Adel: I don't have an alt. Yes, I still believe you are scum.

[SlySly]

And, no, I don't believe you broke the setup.

[SlySly]

If we wanted to be really meticulous about it we could cycle through every 12 player permutation.

I know it is hard for you to accept being wrong, so why do you write a script and save the rest of us the wasted time and effort?

[SlySly]

@Adel

Dude, get a grip. Some of us want to play the game that Percy worked so hard to setup and run for us. If this was my game and you offered this up, you would either be replaced immediately or modkilled. You are the type of player that ruins games for everyone, mod included. I know you think you are smarter than the rest of us, but some of us don't care and want to have fun in a cool game.

[SlySly]

I will not get onboard with a gamebreaking scenario like that. If everyone else agrees, I will request replacement and let some other a-hole take part. It is not in the spirit of the game.

[SlySly]

EBWOP:

....everyone else agrees to it...

[SlySly]

EBWOP:

....everyone else agrees to it...

do you still think that I am scum?

I think you are arrogant enough to suggest a plan that you think will break the game, scum or not, that you think will make you look more brilliant at the end of the game where you can pat yourself on the back. Your suggestion has not changed what I think of you, in game.

[SlySly]

A note on SlySly's behavior: in my only other interaction with him (can't specify as game is ongoing), he has shown himself to be extremely in favor of 'playing to the spirit of the game', which he appears to define as not cooperating with the town except to vote, discuss, and lynch. The comments he's made about me having a massclaim fetish and appointing myself town leader may tie in with this.

I think it's more likely he's scum who's trying to provoke me into replacing out and opposing concerted plans in order to win, but the possibility exists that he is simply as incompetent a player as he is a mod.

Phate,

1. I was invited to this game. I can't speak for him, but I seriously doubt that Percy is really thrilled with what is going on in the game right now. His first game of this was great and fun and I am sure he was hoping for the same in this game.
2. a)In my game, you tried to break it right off the bat. b)Read your tag. c)In the queue of this game you were already calling for massclaim. You do have a mass claim fetish!
3. I want to play the game in the spirit that Percy had in mind when he created it. I seriously doubt that what is happening right now is not how he envisioned it.
4. I am not trying to get you to replace out. Honestly, it would be much more satisfying to see you get vig'd.
5. I will point out your competence as a player at the completion of my game for any who want a good chuckle.

[SlySly]

Plan is still heterophobic.

*twitch*

[SlySly]

Personal question, here. Would you consider Ani rational?

Yes. He tried something but it failed miserably. That doesn't make him irrational.

---------------------

Who vigs night 0, seriously?

Better yet, why is he being unvoted?

No one vig'd N0. Ani stalked, big difference. Ani is town.

[SlySly]

Correct me if I'm wrong, everyone who stalked in the first game n0 flipped murderer.

You are wrong. My predecessor stalked and I never murderered or became a murderer. I was town the entire time.

[SlySly]

n0?

I think so, but I could be wrong. My predecessor had chosen Psychopathy, which no one in this game has yet, but Percy allowed me to change that choice when I replaced in. I don't remember though exactly where the game was when I came in.

[SlySly]

well if he picked psychopathy he WANTED to be a murderer, so my point stands

Technically, but do you really think it is now in the best interests of ani to go murderer? Ani's best chance for a win is definitely to stay investigator, he knows it, I know it, you know it, and everyone else knows it. His every step in this game will be tracked and he will be dealt with swiftly upon murderous deviations.

[SlySly]

I'm confused about something.
Ani Stalked Adel, it failed, then it went through.
VP Warded Adel.
Noone warded VP.
I don't get it.

I will confirm that there was an error in the Night 0 Result PM I sent to animorpherv1. It has since been corrected.

If Alice wards Bob, and Charlie wards Alice, then Charlie's ward causes Alice's ward to fail. Alice will be warded, but Bob will not be warded.

Here is my interpretation of this.

Assuming that VP really did ward Adel, someone DID ward VP and just hasn't came forward and that is why VP's ward failed and Ani's stalk was successful.

[SlySly]

Only one person that said they did ward, but haven't said whether they wared VP or not, left.

Have you heard of Occum's Razor? You have been spending too much time around Adel with your tinfoil hat on. When something is blatantly obvious, accept it and move on.

[SlySly]

Assuming something like this took place is unnecessary.

It is obvious something like this did take place. The magic 8 ball says, "All signs point to Yes". Very similar to the debate I had with Adel. All signs pointed to Yes there too and low and behold, the answer was Yes, much to Adel's chagrin.

[SlySly]

You know what I think? I think Ani laundered night 0 to "confirm" not cult. I think it was planned all along, I think Adel and Ani are cult together and the former tried to insure a cult win with a fake setup break.

Very interesting. I have not looked at it from that perspective. Must evaluate.

[SlySly]

EK is right.

[SlySly]

No, I'm going to Rob Grave and Search.

I wonder how these apples are liked.

[SlySly]

Adel's and Phate's obsession with game breaking has moved them into an arrognat belief that rules do not apply to them.

Do not discuss this game with other players outside this thread. The only exception to this rule are the Cultists, who may post in their QuickTopic thread.

It is blatantly obvious that they were discussing this game here and giving the rules and the mods of this game and this site the big middle finger.

A swift modkill of both of them should take place. Rules are in place for a reason and all players should be expected to follow them.

[SlySly]

Mod(s) in case you missed it, post 472 was for you.

[SlySly]

SlySly is almost certainly scum if the two modkills he just requested are town. For one, that (= what SlySly just did) is a very dastardly thing to do. Second, there is no indication that either party was discussing this game per se until Vi transparently indicated as much. If anyone is violating the spirit of that rule, it is the party who inappropriately contextualized the conversation IMO.

Sorry, I really hate game ruining, game breakers. There is no doubt they were discussing this game, and possibly one more ongoing game(at least in Phate's case, which you are full aware of Iecerint).

[SlySly]

If it was so abstract, as it was trying to be suggested in that thread, the thread wouldn't be locked. There were subtle specifics in that thread. They know it, I know it, and the mods of this game know it too. I'm sure if you go read the whole thread, you will know it too. You might be a little more upset if a game you were running was being discussed in such a way before its completion. Rules apply to the self perceived elite on this site too.

[SlySly]

A handful suggested that he might be covering up a yet-to-come insanity

This is mute at this point. His insanity claim was tested by the 13 votes placed on him. He was covering up an existing insanity, not a future one.

[SlySly]

I also want to say that I really dislike Sly's discussion of "vigs" throughout the thread. Nobody should be taking insanities and taking the path of MURDERERS in an effort to "vig" for the town. If you want someone dead that bad, let's lynch them.

You know no one ever agrees with my lynch targets!!! EVER!!!

Rest easy, I did not Stalk on N0 and have no intention of doing so on N1.

------------------

Eh, let me revise my question. Do you believe that Ani is logical enough to listen to what the town says?

Logic aside, I think ani knows that any renegade activity from him going forward will result in his lynch. The recent ani/saber bet debacle has given me a certain opinion of him. I don't see why he wasn't banned along with saber, but I am in no way pushing that issue and have no personal problem with ani.

-----------------

Investigators can murder. Murderers can, too.

True that, but no murderers exist, yet.

[SlySly]

DGB, I would like to know whether you still feel that SlySly is

scum

town in light of the fact that he calling for modkills on two

townies

confirmed, arrogant rule ignorers.

Fixed.

[SlySly]

Just calling it like I see it. Only other people besides Adel who have registered on my scumdar are the possible Dramonic slip, Elliberth, and DGB. DGB only because of inactivity. I'm sure she will resurface soon and alleviate my concern of the lurk in classic DGB fashion.

You call not posting for a few hours lurking?

It's DGB, come on!! She's usually the most active player in the game right off the get go!!! I was basing it on pages more than hours. Anyway, DGB has returned and my lurk concerns about her no longer exist.

[SlySly]

I challenge you to find where I broke a rule.

Take it to PM if you like

- point out one single instance of where I discussed this game outside of this game.

Don't ask others to ignore the rules and break them, too, RuleBreaker.

[SlySly]

It's unsettling to know that some are exempt from the rules. Coddlefest in progress.

[SlySly]

Ellibereth, I am in favor of your plan, but you can stop wasting your breath because there are several town players who

shirk their duty to play to win

refuse to "play to break the game".

Fixed.

[SlySly]

Sly, tell me what's wrong with my plan from your Point of view.

It is still a variant of a game breaker. I am not opposed to town dictation of players who are needing monitoring, such as ani. We have no idea how many players stalked last night and how many potential murderers there are. IMO, actions of the night will expose what needs to be town controlled. I think any approach like this stands a great chance of failing when holes are revealed and the town has neglected to get the needed tools put in place by the setup, leaving the town naked, in a sense, a reverse break of the game in favor of the cultists. Although, I will say I am more open to your idea than one, such as Adel's, that makes the game become nothing more than a boring fun free observation of a game of Risk.

[SlySly]

I think anyone who stalked N0 and want to still win the game should claim.

I think counting on such is somewhat naive. Some, most likely, want to be murderers and they aren't going to just reveal that because someone says so. I think the best approach leading to a town win is, lynch scum, get proper tools, use them to gain maximum information, analyze and discuss gained information and dictate actions based on the gained information. In other words, play mafia.

[SlySly]

Shocker, the potential murderer wants a free pass at getting one step ahead of the sheep he is trying to herd!!

Ell, you idiot!

[SlySly]

I am not participating in Ell's plan.

[SlySly]

I have already stated why. I am not going to endlessly repeat myself.

[SlySly]

^^^ This wasn't a response. You say you're open to the idea. Whether this wins the game for town or not is completely up to the town's ability to townhunt.

This is the plan I am onboard with. I am not participating in any other approaches that have been presented. End of story.

I think the best approach leading to a town win is, lynch scum, get proper tools, use them to gain maximum information, analyze and discuss gained information and dictate actions based on the gained information. In other words, play mafia.

[SlySly]

We lost Adel for this?

godd@#n

.

Most "swear" words are not banned. However, going out of your way to annoy or upset users who find certain words offensive falls under the previous guideline.

Call me a MF'r, Ahole, POS, SOB, etc... all day long and I have no problem with. Chill on the GD, please. This is one phrase I do find offensive. This is a friendly request.

[SlySly]

Your stubborness to anything other than conventional methods of playing is getting ridiculous.

Your stubborness to stick to a bad plan is as ridiculous to me as my stubborness is to you. There are obvious, glaring holes in your plan. I am not going to point them out in case you convince the rest of the town to go along with the idiotic idea, as I don't want to empower the scum.

[SlySly]

Not pointing out "holes" in a plan that is being discussed is anti-town.

Point out the holes in this plan.

I think the best approach leading to a town win is, lynch scum, get proper tools, use them to gain maximum information, analyze and discuss gained information and dictate actions based on the gained information. In other words, play mafia.

There aren't any.

[SlySly]

I signed up for "Stars Aligned 2" not "Break the Stars". I almost /out'd when I saw Phate sign in. I should have. I knew he would be pushing some BS game breaker strategy, but Stars Aligned 1 was so great, I didn't want to miss out. I realize he is not the only one doing so, but, because of the perpetual insisting to break it in some way, this game is becoming no fun for me. I hope you guys are having a blast ruining the game for those that Percy invited to come and enjoy his game. If this plan is agreed to, I will request replacement. Adel and Phate should have both been modkilled for breaking the rules. I have had PM discussion with Percy about the situation and I know, probably more than the rest of you, just how close they were to the modkill button. I am not disputing Percy's ruling and he knows that. I am just sick of having fun games ruined by game/rule breakers and feel the need to vent it. I'll sit back and watch the progression for a bit now and decide if I want to continue to be a part of this game, or not.

[SlySly]

Lack of scumhunting and inflation of pages is directly due to unneeded discussion of game breaking.

[SlySly]

I also indicated the lack of town motivation for Sly's modkiller stunt. I'd almost venture to say that that's the closest to scumhunting anyone has come today

Pointing out one's stance for principle is hardly scumhunting. Breaking the rules of not only the game but of the site in general should be an immediate modkill. Nuff said.

[SlySly]

Oh btw, Adel would have been modkilled had he not requested replacement.

[SlySly]

^ Adel's earlier play was comparatively on-the-backburner. That's why I had lingering suspicions.

I brought it up immediately when I discovered the other thread.

Modkillers annoy me. For one thing, they are almost never town.

Rule breakers annoying me. For one thing, they are always assholes.

Scum (Cobalt) tried to modkill me D1. I pointed out that there was no motivation for town to have done what he did. His scumfriend (Gorrad) pulled the "he could just have PM'd the mod!" rhetoric, and that dispute ended.

Did Cobalt start an outside thread discussing the game you were playing before its completion?

[SlySly]

*Sorry in advance for my sailor's mouth SlySly. I don't mean to offend. I'm just a heathen. I'll keep it clean from here on out.*

Just the one thing I pointed out gets to me. Feel free to rip on me in any other way you desire. I can take it!

[SlySly]

Part of playing the game is obeying the "play to win" rule.

Do you think the "play to win" rule outweighs the "Do not talk outside the game thread about an ongoing game except where allowed to do so by your role" rule?

I don't. Follow all the rules or be modkilled. It is simple.

[SlySly]

EK is right on.

[SlySly]

Who did you stalk last night Iecerint?

[SlySly]

lol@Sly openly admitting that he thinks I am town, even if he probably didn't intend it to come out that way.

I didn't stalk last night.

Have I ever insinuated I thought you were scum before now?

I did bring up reservations about Adel, Ell and DGB, but not you. The observations of you by VP and EK are beginning to make me wonder. Adel appeared scummy to me way back, I pointed out why. Adel's replacement has not begun contributing so not much to go on there. Ell has came out as a stalker, explaining some of the scumminess I spotted from him earlier. DGB is not lurking, so not feeling the scum vibes there. So, at this point I see no reason not to

Unvote

Vote:Iecerint

[SlySly]

Actually, DGB has only posted 14 times. That is lurking hardcore for DGB.

I don't disagree with this. However, at the time I pointed it out, she had not started at all. I get the feeling DGB is just trying to get a feel for all the crazy things in the setup of this game. I am basing this on the reasoning of her first post. She has since contributed and has done so in usual DGB manner. She is just not quite as busy as usual and I suspect it is because this game doesn't fall into her comfort zone.

Your attitude toward me certainly seemed to indicate you thought I was scum.

This is the first time you have played with me. I approach this game differently than most. You got your first exposure to me as Mr. Nice Guy mod.

However, Sly does not appear to think like other humans

[SlySly]

Fair enough @ Sly. I should note, though, that I'm playing this game because DGB invited me to via PM. So, given that people tend to invite others to games that they are relatively interested in, I am a bit surprised by her relatively low level of activity.

Me too, that is why I brought it up in the first place. DGB is usually one of the most active players in the game. I'm sure you know that if she is inviting you to games.

[SlySly]

Fair enough @ Sly. I should note, though, that I'm playing this game because DGB invited me to via PM. So, given that people tend to invite others to games that they are relatively interested in, I am a bit surprised by her relatively low level of activity.

Me too, that is why I brought it up in the first place. DGB is usually one of the most active players in the game. I'm sure you know that if she is inviting you to games.

Oh? I don't feel like her boytoy anymore. How sad.

I've invited her to games in the past. I'd figured she was just reciprocating.

The "Me too" was surprise at her low level of activity. Percy invited me.

[SlySly]

And this

after

SlySly blames the high post count on Adel and I.

Iecerint and Ell were equally big parts of the inflation problem from my perspective as well. Sorry for not making that more clear.

[SlySly]

I find it very interesting that many of the replacement requesters are still very active in other games.

[SlySly]

Phate, from my experience with you, you are usually wrong about everything you say. Pick a stance and the rest of us can rest assured the opposite is most likely the truth.

[SlySly]

Sly, you are in a unique position to speculate about the relevance or lackthereof of Phate's laziness/slip. Could you do that for me, please?

Well, in my game, Phate's piss poor play got him in trouble and he questioned my competence because he incorrectly assumed that I gave him a false win condition. He couldn't have been more wrong. After questioning my competence, he believed the incorrect vote count that you threw out, being the scum that you were, and he posted a defeat acceptance speech, incorrectly believing scum that he had been lynched when in reality he hadn't been, where he tried to discredit all the other players in the game, with the exception of Glork(who, as it turns out, cried about his role and pushed the boundaries of modkill, in attempts to break the game, much farther than I should have allowed). He didn't even realize that I had missed his vote in a vote count. He called for a game breaker plan that wouldn't have broken my game and I even gave my support for his plan even though I pointed out that his request was similar to downloading the cheats for Super Mario Brothers instead of using skill to beat it. After his snippy remarks to me and everyone else in the game and after he stated how shitty my setup was and how easily it could be broken, I pointed out the err of his ways and the correctness of mine, it pissed him off so bad that he replaced out.

In this game, he has gotten so pissed that he requested replacement unless Percy would be kind enough to let him attempt to break the game. The last time I saw him do this, he was town. So, his replacement request in this game is in no way a scum tell to me. Just another fit being thrown by him because he fears he might actually have to play a game instead being able to find a loophole to exploit. His observation skill in my game was terrible, which leads me to believe his observation skill in any game is terrible. That explains his incessant desire to find exploits as a means to victory. The frequency of his incorrectness and the distance of his reaches in my game makes it very easy for me to ignore pretty much anything he puts forth. He reaches long and far and then assumes those reaches are without fault and should be taken as religion by the rest of the players and if they disagree it must be because they are incompetent. Never ascribe to competence that which can be explained by misguided and incorrect arrogance.

[SlySly]

Hmm. I don't like rhetoric that leads players to nullify whole swaths of potential information. More DDD nightmares. But fair enough.

For what it's worth, I don't think I ever intentionally messed up any votecounts. I deliberately tried to swap Faraday's lynch for Phate's at the end of the day. I thought there was a relatively good chance that Faraday would investigate Pom. But I was too late to save poor, poor Faraday.

For the record, I didn't think your incorrect vote count was intentional, but it would have been a good move if it had exposed something of more use. Maybe you have a more specific question you would like me to answer that has relevance to this game.

[SlySly]

I'm not crazy about it, because the rhetoric encourages us to nullify all of Phate's play from here to eternity.

It is what it is. Go read Phate's play in my game and then compare his assumptions to the setup. FAR, FAR from correct. Then observe the conviction he presented those assumptions with. Until he can demonstrate an ability to gain some control over being driven by anger and an false sense of superiority, I don't feel there is much credence that can be taken from anything he states.

You're awfully grouchy. I like you better when you're eating popcorn.

I'll pop up a good batch for post game!!

[SlySly]

IdiotEllibereth is wondering why you're voting for Yerkrint because I forgot. (I still think this whole Phate Sly Yerk thing is a giant mush of infighting in the town by the way).

Being on the Adel wagon had lost its current usefulness when he replaced out. Only fair to give Hayker a chance to hang himself before returning my vote there, however, he is in no way clear in my mind yet. The other people that had pinged my scumdar prior to the Adel replacement were you and DGB. You had came out as a town stalker and DGB had ceased her possible lurking. EK and VP stated a few things about Iecerint that I agreed with and found a little suspicious about him so I put my vote there.

Before my vote, these, along with Iec's persistent support for your scum/murderer friendly plan, are a few things that raised my suspicion about Iec...

Ell's idea seems fine. I think Adel wanted to randomize it because the background probability of the plan being net pro-town was high, whereas making a list like that could potentially allowed skilled scum to subvert group membership.

See, this is a MASSIVE problem with Elli's plan. Scum can day talk. Under no circumstance should be the town be hand selecting people to participate in this. It'd be massively easy for the scum to manipulate a town suicide with this.

Iecerint -- I see no reason why town players would blindly accept a plan put forth by a player who admits to stalking last night, a plan which will result in massive death. Players are not allowed to think about this for a while? They are not allowed to be like "that doesn't sound so good to me!" without having all the specific reasons why the plan is bad. You can intuitively know a plan seems off without knowing why. You will notice that I was suspicious from the get-go because stalker-Elli suggested it, and because it involved massive death. I wasn't able to say how that would logistically play out... but it seemed like there was already reason to discuss further and not just accept out of hand.

The way Elli took all agreement to Adel's plan as agreement to his, and the way you tried to immediately assign scumminess to people who didn't immediately accept the plan -- these things made me feel rushed into acceptance.

Since my vote, I agree with this observation...

Your question, Iecerint? ...

I unvoted you because ...

1)Your insistence on pushing the scummy plan was bad, but what is worse is how you tried to push people into accepting the plan and accepting it fast. Implying people who don't sign onto the elli plan immediately are either dumb (and shouldn't be listened to) or scum.

The plan is kinda a no-brainer IMO. It is both simple to understand and intuitively simple to implement. The people who either can't understand it or don't think it would work should indicate what is challenging to understand or why it will not work. It looks like people are trying to cast doubt on a clearly-powerful plan because they have no other means of undermining it.

...

3) Also, you keep character assasinating me. It is very underhanded and scummy. It is a way to neutralize my contributions to this game. I don't apreciate it.

...

Constant references to me either being dumb or scum, and then your latest reasoning that I am playing so dumb that I cannot be serious, that it is some scum ploy on my part to act deliberately stupid. How is that for WIFOM unsubstantiated reasoning?

I really don't think I have been acting stupid, so stop fucking saying that.

Due to my experience with her, I believe EK to be a very competent player. I suspect Iecerint knows this as well and I find it very suspicious that he is treating her the way Phate treats people.

----------------

Can you do me a wonderous favor and join one of the nico or start wagons? Thank you!

Phate has posted that he thinks both nico and start are both scum, that convinces me they are both town. The only town wagons I would support at this point are of outed stalkers and that is only in the case that we don't have another player that is likely scum targeted for the lynch. Phate has pretty much now declared Iecerint as town, so that means Iecerint must be scum!

I have some more reading to do on some other players in iso, so it is very possible that my vote may change soon, but I am very comfortable with where it is now. I have been busy finishing my game over the last few days. Now that it is complete, I will have more time for digging in this one.

[SlySly]

Worry not, citizen,

we're

killing CSL tonight.

Thanks for telling us the ritual target.

[SlySly]

Whoops

DGB's going to kill me.

Oh, is she cultist too?

[SlySly]

@Slysly- That is a horrible read. iLord is obviously referring to sanctioning eli's murder tonight.

Please define "we're" for me.

[SlySly]

I don't see how most off this is scummy.

Review, the word I used was "Anti-town". Now review the question that prompted that post.

[SlySly]

I've never seen so much action in twilight 0_o

You ever seen a game that went 44 pages 14 days before the first deadline before?

[SlySly]

I was hoping we could reach 60 or more.

We may have without the lightning speed in which Nico's lynch just took place. Hard to argue, though. EK pretty much exposed some severe scumminess by Nico then the follow up of a self hammer. Regardless of Nico's flip, I bet we can find some scum in the later votes. If scum, serious distancing. If town, serious scum opportunist.

[SlySly]

Sure. We is used as in we the town. There is more innocents then scum and finding innocents is just as important as finding scum.

The town doesn't collectively NK in this game.

[SlySly]

Da hell. Haven't read, saw someone mention twilight?

BNico self hammered.

Then CSL L+1 voted.

[SlySly]

I was out of town this weekend, catching up now...

[SlySly]

I knew that rob graves was a free action, but it didn't register to me yesterday that robbing graves is worthless as a device to keep murderers in check the way it was in Stars Aligned 1. There will never be enough bodies to keep the suspicious busy. As was the case last night, Ani could easily have robbed the grave and murdered.

I heard noise. I didn't ward anyone. I didn't rez anyone.

[SlySly]

SlySly, we will have enough bodies for 2 graverobbers tonight. We'll have 3 dead people + whoever we lynch today, which makes 4.

What?

There were 3 murders last night. The 2 outted potential murderers, ani and ell, were seemingly block last night. That give us 5 potential murderers now. Feel free to point out anything you think I am missing.

[SlySly]

Ani, you have just demonstrated an epic fail in reading comprehension.

[SlySly]

Sly, I meant for TONIGHT, that's the case...because Elli and Ani will have 4 bodies to rob. I wasn't referring to future nights.

Oh, and I did not hear noise either and thus did not ward.

Real slow now...

Tonight, 5 potential murderers now x 2 bodies each = 10 bodies.

[SlySly]

First, the murderers/cult have to stalk tonight, THEN kill the next night. Second, they are not getting 2 kills each night, so where are you getting the x 2 from. We're going to have 4 bodies after today's lynch. Let's say we have 5 murderers...that's still only 5 bodies, plus whatever the cult does. One person can rob 2 graves a night.

What am I missing here? there's nothing close to 10 here.

Even slower now...

To keep potential murderers or actual murderers busy at night as directed by the town, they are given the instruction to rob 2 graves each so they cannot commit a murder. 1 grave rob (free action) + 1 other grave rob (instead of being left free to stalk/murder) = 2 grave robs.

Tonight, 5 potential/actual murderers x 2 grave robs each = 10 needed graves.

[SlySly]

As for having him vote for himself to test his insanity, I think it was a pointless exercise. All that it told us is that someone who voted Ani has the Avolition insanity.

We have already been through this, Adel.

-----------------------------

Hey SlySly, what do you think about the Drench wagon?

I think it is potentially interesting for a several reasons...

1.

Drench coming in and defending CSL for no apparent reason makes me think that they're both scum.

2.

On CSL L+1'ing: The difference between L and his L+1 was 2 minutes.

I would say that it's feasible that CSL simply didn't see Nico's self-hammer.

Makes it more a null-tell more than anything.

Nicodemus = Too scummy for words.

18 posts? Give me a break. Nicodemus is lurkerscum!

Vote: Nicodemus

At the point where Nico voted ani, I knew Nicodemus was scum.

(Preview) OVERKILL

!

3.

You know what is also scummy about Drench is he HAS NEVER VOTED IN THIS GAME.

Many of the insanities involve voting. If he can lurk and not vote much or at all, he can hide insanities. Nevermind that he's not helping scum hunt.

Drench's lurking is even surpassing DGB's.

vote:Drench

----------------------------

I think it could also be a good idea to look back at the ani wagon again today as well. I was correct that it was being pushed by scum (Nico), so we should look to see who he was directly agreeing with or who was agreeing with him. There was more than one scum on that wagon.

I find this case to be highly likely too.

DGB's lurking is getting as suspicious to me as it was originally. I am still not convinced Dramonic wasn't caught in a slip yesterday. Vikingfan is rounding out my scumspicions, atm. VF was on that ani wagon for reasons that seemed pretty wagon-hoppy to me.

-----------------------------

Since you are cult, you'd be too buys searching for rezz kits, crafting and handing out fetishes and participating in the ritual to BOTHER STALKING, even if you could.

Please stop while you are behind so we don't have to policy lynch you on the basis of stupidity.

[SlySly]

He has lost his

Night Action

for tonight.

Mod: Can Ani still rob a grave as a free action or has he lost that as well?

No, he has no

Night Action

choices tonight.

[SlySly]

@SlySly: Your posts make no sense. On the one hand, you assume we know the identity of five murderers, which we assuredly do not. On the other hand, we only need to interrupt a murderer every other night -- we can let them stalk, as long as we don't let them murder the next night as well.

I was merely making the point that Grave Robbing is not nearly as an effective potential/actual murderer tracking tool like it was in the first version of this game. The free action grave rob makes it where there will most likely never be enough bodies to keep the suspicious who get exposed busy. From that perspective, my post makes perfect sense.

[SlySly]

Hmm, to SlySly's probable disdain, I think I found something.

Percy, if a Cultist accrues 3 Insanity Infractions, will he lose his ability to participate in the ritual that night? Additionally, would you consider purposely going for a modkill in this game blacklistable (Like going for a modkill in any other games?)

Ani stalked on N0. Cult can't stalk. How many times do we have to rehash this particular point?

[SlySly]

I said I wish to Rob Katy's Grave tonight. Do not kill me.

With grave robbing being a free action, you should come up with stronger reasoning to support you appeals to emotion.

[SlySly]

iLord, does what you are talking about in any way infer that you believe Ani is cult and that I was asking about Ani's night action being lost because you think I was worried he had lost his ability to participate in the ritual?

[SlySly]

iLord, does what you are talking about in any way infer that you believe Ani is cult and that I was asking about Ani's night action being lost because you think I was worried he had lost his ability to participate in the ritual?

Nope, Ani's town.

I'll say more after Percy responds, because: 1). it may or may not be relevant anymore, 2). I may find a hole in my thought process, and 3). I don't feel like initiating an argument with you yet .

Gotcha, well keep me posted. I am thrilled that you are not attempting to debate the same topic that has already had a stake driven through its poor little heart.

-----------------------

I also laundered last night which gave me another insanity, since I didn't have blood on me, until now, since I've been rezzed.

Were you here yesterday? Is there an award in this particular game for stupidity?

Yess, Ellibereth. Launder. I felt like getting another insanity.

Please illustrate a pro-town reason for performing a bloodless, insanity gaining launder.

[SlySly]

Unvote, Vote: CSL

This should be self-explanatory.

It is. I am just allowing a post for comic relief before moving my vote.

[SlySly]

Uh, question. Was the wagon on me because of my

predecessor

, or policy before post 1263?

Less than 24 hours until deadline. Send in your Night Action choices by the deadline, or you will

Launder

.

Didn't use an action = auto-launder.

I had forgotten you were a replacement. I get the feeling you have read very little of this thread and know very little about what has happened. I see a small chance that you could be a lazy investigator attempting to just jump in and go with the flow.

You know, I have the STRANGEST feeling that I'm being lynched because of policy.

Go actually read the thread, focus on ani's launder debacle from Day 1 and you will understand the immediate reaction to your announcing of bloodless launder.

[SlySly]

I see what your point is there SlySly, but CSL being scum is the simplest and most likely explanation for why he got rezzed

I don't disagree with you on this but I also agree that some the alternate theories put forth as to why CSL got rezzed are possible.

and why he suddenly reveals he got another insanity.

I don't see how revealing this is a scum tell at all. This is the main thing that makes me think we are back in ani-land all over again. I don't see how revealing a bloodless, launder, especially after the ani debacle over the same topic would be pro-town or pro-scum. Convince me that this is a pro-scum and you have my vote.

Even if he didn't read the game, I'd assume that CSL read enough of the first post to know that he had night actions he could use last night.

Being an idiot and 'forgetting night actions' is not a scum tell. It is a VI tell.

[SlySly]

Ani admitted that he was lying about auto-laundering. I'm getting the same sense here that CSL's lying as well.

For the record, ani didn't claim auto-launder. He tried to pass off a manual launder. That is irrelevant now, though.

CSL has just confirmed that he has read at least a good portion of the game. I do not believe that any player scum or town would forget at that point to turn in a night action. It's simply not a natural response after investing such time into the game. Just as in Ani's case, CSL is likely lying to cover up something else, in this case, probably the ritual.

^ this ^ + v this v

I spent the whole Night Phase reading the thread to catch up.

= I'm convinced.

unvote

vote:CSL

[SlySly]

Was passed a fetish. GAH!!!!! Picked twitch for resulting insanity.

heard noise. Had to select an Insanity, so I chose Aversion and VPBaltar.

Ani, did you have to select an insanity because you were passed a fetish?

---------------

I heard noise and didn't ward anyone.

[SlySly]

Hayker, do you have anything to contribute to the game? Your lurking is becoming monumental.

[SlySly]

Was passed a fetish. GAH!!!!! Picked twitch for resulting insanity.

heard noise. Had to select an Insanity, so I chose Aversion and VPBaltar.

Ani, did you have to select an insanity because you were passed a fetish?

---------------

I heard noise and didn't ward anyone.

That could be seen as helping a scum buddy.... Are you?

DGB stated clearly why she had to pick an insanity. It seemed Ani was trying to insinuate he had been passed one, I was just clarifying the cause of his insanity pick.

[SlySly]

Yep, when I joined SA1, it was night and my predecessor had just chosen Psychopathy. Percy was kind enough to let me change it and stay a part of the town.

[SlySly]

Is there any good reason we shouldn't be lynching Hayker today?

[SlySly]

Well, that and the

extreme

lurking.

[SlySly]

That means nothing in this game. Hayker is not participating at all. That = anti-town = good lynch.

[SlySly]

That is where we differ. I got full on scumvibe from Adel.

[SlySly]

However, I do want to ask SlySly, however, if you only got to change because you replaced the same night the player took psychopathy.

That was my understanding. I think if my predecessor had already lived a day as murderer, I would have replaced in as a murderer and just had to deal with it.

I can understand Percy allowing a player to change in that circumstance, but I don't think it is likely he would allow a player to change well after the fact just because being murderer is difficult. I also don't like that kunkstar claims to have the insanity Taboo: Launder. Why in the hell would a would-be murder choose that as one of his first insanities? Seems kind of counter-intuitive to the goals of a murderer.

QFT

[SlySly]

Wait, I'm thoruohgly confused.

SlySly chose pshycopathy???

My predecessor in Stars Aligned 1 chose psychopathy.

[SlySly]

It was my original plan to take Psycho on my second stalking.

I believe you have to have taken Psychopathy already to have the option of a 2nd stalk.

-------------

Drench's not vote is indeed highly suspect and I think I called that out much earlier in the game. He could have very well have been hiding *twitch*, which he could have taken as his first insanity.

kunkstar lynch sounds better and better.

Hey kunk, how about a twitch-free vote on anybody right quick?

Vote: SlySly

to prove my twitchy.

Insanity Infraction

Kunk obviously has some kind of voting insanity other than twitchy since twitchy was in his vote.

[SlySly]

(vii) Twitchy - All posts by you in which you vote or unvote must contain "*twitch*" or "*twitches*".

If he said "twitchy" would that count or not?

I would think

twitch

y includes twitch within it.

Mod clarification, please.

[SlySly]

Me being the computer geek, took the stars as wild cards...

anythingbefore-twitch-anythingafter

but, I could be off in my interpretation.

[SlySly]

It was my original plan to take Psycho on my second stalking.

I believe you have to have taken Psychopathy already to have the option of a 2nd stalk.

False, you can stalk as many times as you want without Psycho, you need Psycho for the second murder.

Ah, I was confusing it with Stalk. Thank you for the clarification.

[SlySly]

SlySly, did Percy make the offer to you?

Yes

[SlySly]

In conclusion, we should all be lynching Sly today. If you literally can't stomach that, take some aspirin, vote Dram in the meantime, and call me in the morning because I have some AP Bio essays to write.

Vote: Drench

I guess you are not a believer in "practice what you preach".

[SlySly]

I did hear noise N1 and N2.

---------------

I laundered because I was bloody.

What pro-town action left you bloody, scum?

[SlySly]

I was almost killed, that's what.

I figured that out after SOG made his statement to VP.

[SlySly]

More for your chart EK...

I have 2 insanities. N0 I stalked Amished with intentions of going murderer (I took compulsion). The happenings of D1 may me reevaluate my plans and I decided to stick with the town route. N1 I picked up Occult Books. I checked Magua last night and he was not more insane than me, so he had 1 or less insanities last night before the resolve of my commune (I took hallucination).

[SlySly]

Interesting confession, Sly. You've played this game before, and in that one it seems you replaced and chose to go from murderer back to investigator. So last time you decided it wasn't worth it to go murderer. What made you think you should try murderer this time?

Last time I replaced into the game and was completely overwhelmed by all of the strange setup and rules and I didn't want to start my participation off in what I felt was a for sure fail role, at least from the perspective of my limited understanding and general lack of mafia abilities. When I received the invite from Percy for this game, I felt I had a better grasp of how things work in this setup and my immediate reaction was "I'm going murderer in this game" and I even started out this game with that thought process still intact. The events of D1 convinced me that going murderer is still, at least from my position, a for sure fail role, leading me to continue down the path of being a part of another town victory.

Is there any protown motive to pick hallucination in your opinion?

Well, honestly, all the insanities suck. I just chose the ones that required the least thought. I didn't want to choose any of the ones that would affect my voting abilities. Having thought through it a bit deeper now, I wish I would have chosen twitchy instead.

Sly, also why did you check magua?

Magua's posting in this game has seemed very pro-town and I tend to agree with the majority of the things he has said. Unfortunately, that was the case in SA1 as well. I wanted to do a little check on him for my own peace of mind since I didn't vig him with my first opportunity.

[SlySly]

SlySly - why would you take compulsion if your intention was to go murderer? You have already freely stated that it's a difficult role to win, so wouldn't taking compulsion make it that much more difficult? It would take you until what, Day 8, to win that way. I'm confused.

I didn't put in enough forethought to determine the earliest possible time for a murderer win. I figured taking compulsion would take some unneeded complexity out of my thought process and I didn't want to hinder my voting abilities in any way. I never really expected to be a murderer and win anyway, I just wanted to be a murderer, however, D1 changed my mind about that.

[SlySly]

How much forethought would it really take? I mean, you played in the other SA as well, so I'd think you'd at least have the basic understanding that to win as murderer here you need to do it as quickly as possible. Not sure if I'm buying this reasoning.

Lol. I still don't think I have a full grasp of the murderer win condition.

[SlySly]

I also don't understand why he chose to go legit in SA1 but not in this game.

I don't understand why you, of all people, would ever expect from me what you consider to be rational thought. I thought it would be fun. D1 just showed me it would be a quick way out of the game. If I had successfully stalked Adel or Phate on N0, I probably wouldn't have been able to control the urge to kill!!

I also think it was very misleading for him to be claiming noises for a while without telling us HE HAS HALLUCINATION. And could have cause him to get warded or rezzed even when he doesn't need it.

I just took hallucination from my commune last night. Hallucination had nothing to do with the noises I heard N1 and N2.

[SlySly]

I know, I keep flashing back to Elli saying somehting like: ANY OTHER FOOLS WHO CHOSE STALK AND REALIZE THEIR MISTAKE, CLAIM NOW.

Elli said it multiple times. If Sly changed his mind D1, he should have said it then.

Ell was pushing a game breaking scheme. Do I need to repeat my feeling about game breaking schemes?

[SlySly]

Maybe irrelevant to you.

His pushing a game breaking plan made anything he said irrelevant to me as much as anything anyone else said that was pushing any of the game breaking plans.

I didn't feel I needed to say anything as I knew I wasn't going to murder and was going to continue trying to help the town. I obviously wasn't the only one that didn't jump at Ell's command as there has been plenty of murdering going on. The difference with me and the others is that I haven't been murdering.

[SlySly]

Now that I know the history between sly and dgb, that exchange makes better sense. Sly, however...well, everything he's said since his initial confession has smelled of lies.

Fail. If I was going to lie, I would have lied about my insanities. It's not like I was under any pressure to bring forth this info. I was trying to give EK's chart the best chance of helping the town. Knee jerk lynching of non-threats hardly seems the best route to a town win, but whatever.

[SlySly]

Or to make yourself seem more credible before your slapped with occult books.

Feel free to point out the threat of occult books being used on me that pressured me into supplying information for EK's chart that I could have easily just lied about.

[SlySly]

DGB votes me cause I seem town and iLord wants to lynch his 5th top suspect.

[SlySly]

This list is not sorted in order of scumminess. You are my top target for scum.

Really?

Mostly through process of elimination (

Cultist

,

CultistorMurderer

,

NotCultistMaybeMurderer

,

LikelyTown

,

StrongNonMurdererTown

):

I would think a Cultist would be higher on a scum list than a CultistOrMurderer.

[SlySly]

To read SlySly, you have to put your scumdar in reverse, stand on your head, and spin from your body's tranverse plane.

You're doing it all wrong.

DGB, since you are going into full on meta mode, do you remember how I flipped the last time you flipped back and forth about my alignment and ultimately decided I was scum?

--------------------

Why woud Slyscum or Slymurderer claim out of the blue like that? He's town.

It does seem a little funny for people to be pushing a lynch because someone did a pro-town thing, while under absolutely no pressure, in revealing insanities that could have easily been lied about to help with a pro-town chart.

--------------------

He has to explain his insanities.

I did.

--------------------

Magua, Dramonic, Elli, VP, DGB, and wicked still need to claim insanities?

I did claim it, maybe even the day's first post.

Scared to say it again in case your stories don't match?

[SlySly]

What you did is protown in the same sense that cultist claiming cultist is beneficial to the town.

This makes absolutely no sense. My insanity reveals were pro-town in a purely pro-town sense.

Can you tell me how my reveals were pro-scum in any way?

[SlySly]

You reveals were not pro-scum in any way.

It is nice to see that you are not totally braindead.

[SlySly]

No one trying to go Murderer would

ever

take Compulsion Night One.

I did, but technically, I wasn't trying to go murderer, I was planning to go murderer. There is a difference, had I been trying, I would be a murderer by now.

Any way you slice it, he's lying and trying to make us believe he claimed to make the list of actions/Insanities more clear.

Me telling the truth seems to be a sure fire way for me to get lynched.

[SlySly]

No one who was acting with the intention of ever maybe being a Murderer would take Compulsion Night 1. Now stop playing semantics.

I did, now stop playing text deaf.

[SlySly]

Oh, and technically, it was N0.

[SlySly]

Sure, but either way he's lying to us about his actions and claiming that he's trying to help us by telling us the truth of his actions. There's no pro-Town motivation to do that. Whatsoever.

I'm telling the truth about my actions, insanities and noises heard. The pro-town motivation was for filling EK's chart.

I'm putting my money on Sly being Cult because of one or two of his interactions with Nico &c., but it's quite possible he's a Murderer.

I'm putting my money on scum being on my wagon hard. Before my insanity reveals, you had made 3 entire posts in the game. Since seeing my fresh blood in the water, you have returned like the lurking shark you are. Most of that stack of my money would be on you flipping scum since you were the first voting me for basically nothing and have returned with a vengeance to make sure and help finish me off.

Thing is, if he thought about becoming a Murderer Night 0 and took Taboo Launder or whatever, and now he says he reformed and is going the Townie way all the way,

why is he insisting he took Compulsion that Night?

. As Town he wouldn't, so his story simply isn't true. This is a case where Lynch All Liars is beyond perfectly applicable.

Thing is, I stalked Amished on N0 and took compulsion and had full intentions of becoming murderer. Just because you find that unlikely for me to do, doesn't mean you are right. The events of D1 firmly changed my mind about being murderer and that is why I picked up Occult Books on N1 instead of following through with the murder.

The other thing is, now there are murderers out there and you, and others, are busy wasting time on me while they, and scum, are jumping on my easy wagon because a few people are finding it hard to understand the reasoning of person who has already been pointed out as being an off the wall thinker.

[SlySly]

Let's review what I was talking about during the early phase of this game and see if it matches my insanity reveals and my reasoning for timing...

------------------

1. I state my belief that claims are pro-town and a way to lead to town victory (Adel was vehement against any type of claims, I highly disagreed about that. My reveals were to help with EK's chart.)

I'm not claiming day 2.

Noise, action and insanity claims in the first game led to an overwhelming town victory. What better alternative do you suggest? A hardline stance against claims providing a tracking system for the town seems a little anti-town to me.

-----------------

2. I bring up checking people with Occult Books several times very early in the game (After the Ani debacle got into full swing, I knew I was going to take Occult Books on N1 and if I survived that long to commune someone on N2.) I was hoping someone may have picked some OBs on N0 and could validate ani's claim. It came to a point where it didn't matter after the vote test.

If he is covering up a future insanity, that could be validated if someone has Occult Books and used them on Ani.

If he is covering up a future insanity, that could be validated if someone has Occult Books and used them on Ani.

On Night 0?

No, N1. If the OB user has 0 insanity, as should be the case right now, and Ani is lying, the results would be negative as Ani would have 0 insanity as well.

Effect: You learn whether your target has (strictly) more

Insanities

than you.

I'm not quite sure where you get the certainty to make such bold statements. How do we

know

that Ani isn't cult fake-claiming an insanity so that he can kill in the ritual tonight? How are you so sure that Ani is telling the truth about his insanity this time, as opposed to another lie? I am far from convinced that Ani is "obvInvestigator" as you say.

He can be checked with Occult Books. If he has no insanity, he is lying scum. If he does, he is either idiot town or stalker town. Town = worse lynch than scum. Pushing for town instead of scum hunting = proScum. I think he has an insanity NOW and was just trying to explain it off. I am more than willing to believe he stalked.

If it is because he is scum and trying to cover up a future insanity, which I find highly unlikely, that can be checked with Occult Books.

Even Chaco chimes in that I am thinking correctly about my understanding of OB usage.

Yeah, Sly and Semi have the right idea on using the occult books.

And iLord acknowledges his misunderstanding of OB usage.

No, N1. If the OB user has 0 insanity, as should be the case right now, and Ani is lying, the results would be negative as Ani would have 0 insanity as well

Ah okay, I thought Commune happened after Insanity gained from Ritual.

-----------------

3. Being the first person to believe ani had stalked after his admitting his laundering lie (takes a stalker to know and believe one). I was about the only person willing to believe Ani's story, even after the insanity validation check was done via vote test on him. Also, I point out that not all stalkers have to become murderers.

I explained it plenty well. And, I was right. Once he revealed he had stalked, obviousness struck that he was obvTown trying to cover his insanity with a bogus Launder claim. It was pretty clear before that that he wasn't cult, you just weren't willing to accept it openly.

Wait, what could've scumAni done to gain an insanity? Stalk?

Prerequisites: You must be an

Investigator

or a

Murderer

.

As I stated before, I would rather lynch scum than a later potential murderer. Ani is not a murderer yet and may not become one. Ani voters, start scum hunting.

------------------

4. I clearly state my hating game breakers and opposition to ell's plan

Sly, tell me what's wrong with my plan from your Point of view.

It is still a variant of a game breaker.

I am not participating in Ell's plan.

------------------

5. I call ell naive for expect stalkers to claim after the trouble ani and ell brought upon themselves doing so at that point in the game.

I think anyone who stalked N0 and want to still win the game should claim.

I think counting on such is somewhat naive.

-------------------

Here is my one lie where I was trying to avoid the unneeded early heat that ani and ell brought on themselves. If I get lynched for this one lie, it is not a total loss as the town will at least know that Magua had 1 or less insanities last night and that my claimed insanity count is true. But keep in mind, there are others that didn't come forward as N0 stalkers either, and they are now murders, unlike me. They are probably among those on my wagon now or the source of the noise I heard last night and planning to murder me tonight anyway.

I also want to say that I really dislike Sly's discussion of "vigs" throughout the thread. Nobody should be taking insanities and taking the path of MURDERERS in an effort to "vig" for the town. If you want someone dead that bad, let's lynch them.

You know no one ever agrees with my lynch targets!!! EVER!!!

Rest easy, I did not Stalk on N0 and have no intention of doing so on N1.

----------------

Do those that have played with me before actually believe that I would plant things this far ahead only to reveal them and put myself under fire when being under no pressure at all?

If you believe that, why didn't I point all of these things out immediately when the crosshairs got locked on me?

Occum's Razor.

[SlySly]

@animorpherv1, evilsnail, kunkstar7, Magua, SlySly, Wickedestjr:

Where do you think your votes will be falling today?

I see no reason to vote at this point.

[SlySly]

iLord, vikingfan = murderers

DGB = scum

EK = town

[SlySly]

That's the extent of your reads in this game Sly? You have nothing to say about your imminent lynch?

I have already spoke in depth about it. It is wrong. What else needs be said?

[SlySly]

Well you just talked about your insanities as far as I can tell. I'd like your thoughts on the wagon itself.

Better yet, I'd appreciate if you could give everyone a town, townish, neutral, scummy, or scum.

Nah, I try to help and I get lynched for it. Enjoy the murderers and scum.

[SlySly]

YAWN...

Plan is flawed. Too many scum and murderers getting free passes this day.

[SlySly]

1)AVERSION PLAN

IF you get an insanity tonight, you MUST take aversion to the person below you on this list:

VP Baltar
semioldguy
dramonic
Magua
DrippingGoofball
Ellibereth
evilsnail
rewq455
animorpherv1
Chaco
vikingfan
elvis_knits
Plum
Hayker
iLord
kunkstar7
Wickedestjr

I believe we are NOT forcing everyone to gain an insanity.

Just another gamebreaker plan being pushed by non-town. Gamebreakers have ruined this game. Scum and murderers are on my wagon, believe that, don't rely on a stupid plan to figure it out. Analysis is key to winning this game, not the hairbrained ideas being pushed by murderers and seemingly supported by scum. Just because they act in support doesn't mean they are.

[SlySly]

Okay so let's force everyone to take an insanity.

You are better than this EK. You are on the wrong track. Scum tells are screaming out and everyone just ignoring them focusing on the gamebreakers. That's exactly what the gamebreakers want.

[SlySly]

Murderers are gaining insanity anyway. They are not negatively affected by aversion hardly at all. This plan actually helps them. They gain an additional excuse for an insanity that they'd be gaining anyway.

Some of the cult will be gaining insanity every night, so this plan doesn't really hurt them either. It just provides them with an easy claim.

Duh.

[SlySly]

Forcing everyone to gain aversion gives good odds for the town losing.

Finally, the voice of reason. Lynching town helps with a town loss, too. We should be lynching those pushing these types of ideas, instead of what is currently going down. SOG, what was your exact reasoning behind your vote on me?

EK, 2 things, 1. you know I think different than most, just cause you think my thinking doesn't make sense to you, doesn't mean it doesn't to me, 2. I just took hallucination last night. Hallucinations has not yet affected the noises I had heard.

[SlySly]

2)Okay. I didn't realize that.

I pointed it out to you before, but the gamebreakers have been busy filling the thread with distractions.

[SlySly]

I think it gives the best chance for a murderer to win, followed by cult and then town the least likely chance to win.

Now just think about who was pushing the plan and what they stand to gain from pushing such a plan. Those are the ones in need of lynching.

[SlySly]

I don't see how Aversion is going to affect lynching.

The 3v2 scenario brought up by SOG, illustrated:

Town 1 - Aversion to Scum 1 so can't vote Scum 1
Town 2 - Aversion to Scum 2 so can't vote Scum 2
Town 3 - aversion unimportant

Scum 1 - ain't voting scum 2
Scum 2 - ain't voting scum 1

No majority. Town lose.

I think you are playing dumb in this game. That is unlike you and suspicious.

[SlySly]

Eh, I guess both scenarios could be indicative, but even then it depends largely on playstyle. Most people in this game appear to just don't care/like to check plans and like to just leave it up to other people to perfect/find mistakes. For our game, the only people that are still alive would be me, Magua, Plum, you, and VP.

Ah, the Adel sheeple philosophy. Probably true. Out of curiosity, why is Plum on your list? Seems to me she's doing a pretty good job of saying a whole lotta nothing.

It's the old elistest "keep the chat club in the game" mentality.

[SlySly]

Sly, please post your scum list.

DGB is scum, like I said before. TYVM, VP.

[SlySly]

Sly, even if dGB is scum, there's gotta be a ton more scum in this game. We've got prob 4-5 cultists(Nico was cult and I assume CSL is cult), and atleast 2 murderers (I assume startransmission was murderer).

Who else is scum besides DGB?

Anyone in this game who has played with DGB before knows that she is not anywhere close to playing her usual game.

Hayker and Plum have pinged my scumdar considerably as well, as I have already stated.

[SlySly]

You guys are too much into breaking the game and not enough into playing it <_<

QFT

[SlySly]

vote DGB

- obvscumuberlurk

iMurderer, self appointed captains stuck in ignore-mode does not a day end.

[SlySly]

Another thing that seems to have slipped everyone's mind is that I have heard noise the last 2 nights in a row. The best idea is to lynch scum and force the murderer that has me targeted to follow through with their work, that way they won't be free to target another investigator.

[SlySly]

At this point they would not kill you because you are going to get lynched anyway. Why get bloody? They can stalk and murder someone else and be a step closer to winning.

I'm not hammered yet, though I am the majority lynch if town decides to be lazy and let the murderers and scum drive the lynch wagon. If I'm not lynched, they have to get their hands bloody.

You want to put this supposed murder closer to their win condition rather than forcing them to stalk elsewhere, which causes no harm to the town?

Well, there is no guarantee the murderer will be successful. Didn't a vig/murder already fail at least once in this game? That attempt kept them busy and that much farther from a kill. The unexpected happens in this game of mafia very often.

[SlySly]

Okay. VP's convinced me.

Unvote: VP

.

Weren't you already voting for VP?

[SlySly]

DGB should be lynched.

[SlySly]

Why do I feel like that was intentional?

That is my take too, but I knew no one would listen to me.

[SlySly]

Sly being odd? How odd!

[SlySly]

We just got to block another person thanks to DGB.

Wrong, you just got to take scum off the list of accountability while sticking someone else on the list that can no longer help the town during the night. Just what DGscum wanted. Losing her action means nothing to her, the ritual doesn't require her participation to go through.

[SlySly]

Wrong, you just got to take scum off the list of accountability while sticking someone else on the list that can no longer help the town during the night. Just what DGscum wanted. Losing her action means nothing to her, the ritual doesn't require her participation to go through.

Lol, you can stop talking now.

I don't need scum on the chopping block to explain to me why scum autoblocking herself is not good for the town.

Whatever you say, iMurderer.

[SlySly]

Oh, btw, I didn't take compulsion, I took distraction. I didn't want to rack up insanity infractions jumping back and forth on voting. I'll prove it now.

Unvote.

Vote:iMurderer(iLord)

[SlySly]

Unvote.

Vote:DGB

Lynch DGscum now.

Insanity Infraction

[SlySly]

Is Sly trying to prove DGB's statement that he never makes sense?

Actually, that was EK's statement.

[SlySly]

I think the 2 murderers pushing the grave robbing plan should be on the grave robbing list.

[SlySly]

Murders/scum just drove home a mislynch. I suggest townies on their list not follow the muderer friendly plan and do something instead that will help lead the town to a win.