Battle for Olympus - Game Over!

[Dekes]

This isn't bastard.

Vote: AGar

Delay of game. Clear infraction.

The mod told me that the surveys had their purpose. So I would assume they were used in some way to determine the alignment. After all it was announced as a UPick game.

[Dekes]

Is it bad if I still think SD is scum?

Shadow, now that you're off the hook, you apparently decided to keep your vote parking on Ranger. Is there an update to your case on him or is it still based on Ranger's alleged grasping for straws which was completely inaccurate at the time when you made the accusation?
If you're town that quick wagon on you must surely include scum? Any suspects?

@MoI
Nice way to avoid the natural N1 kill, btw.

@Gemini
I'm paranoind about mod votes/mod being players since the ending of OoT. So I will never join a bastard game again and reminded everyone about that.

Baby Spice's vote was definitely the worst attempt at clinging to a forced RVS vote. More input needed.

Unvote; Vote: CMAR

Good wagon. But I want everyone to consider joining a diddin wagon for me. And that latest post wasn't even needed for claiming scum, diddin.

[Dekes]

Unvote; Vote: diddin

Superior wagon is a go.

[Dekes]

It starts with calling chess out for rolefishing because "MoI claimed he had more powers". Yes, this is vanillaless game. We all have more powers. Fail accusation.

Then there's a lot of stating obvious things to appear proactive.

And it ends with the false dichotomy of pushing for a chess lynch because there has to be scum within the two similar roles. There is no reason for scum-chess to CC town-SD just to push the SD-lynch through. That would be a 1:1 trade that scum don't profit from.

[Dekes]

217-219 make me scratch my head... Dekes proposes a wagon on me, SD votes me at the slightest hint a wagon could happen, and then Dekes hops right on when he sees the wagon on me is getting somewhere? Not looking good for old Dekes here.

I didn't know this game was vanillaless, but my original point on Chess stands. He's still the scummiest to me.

Yep, that's why I proposed the wagon.

And you didn't comment on my other point. Do you think it would make sense for scum-chess to cc town-SD on Day 1 and risk a 1:1 trade?

[Dekes]

hey diddin if you vote Chronopie I'll join you there.

Chronopie's unvote without revoting in his second post makes that tempting...

chess, you want this guy to start a wagon with you?

Actually, diddin, you did not address a single point against you. All you did was appeasing to your attackers by moving your vote from chess. Whom you still consider scummy, yet you entertain the idea of following his reads...because Chrono didn't revote after unvoting ...Talk about reaching.

[Dekes]

@quadz
It's no use to spread votes. Even less so on Day 1. Wagon is where it's at to get the proper results. CMAR is a good wagon, too. That's why I hopped on. But I'm more confident in my read on diddin. All I needed was a token of support.

[Dekes]

The fact I joined the diddin wagon immediately and followed up with the case on him should demonstrate my reads. A sole vote on him doesn't send a message though.

BS, you said three things in your post that were said in almost exactly the same way by others before.

[Dekes]

@Dekes

– please explain how you think the claim (and only the claim) somehow reduces my chance of being NKed.

Because no scum in their right mind will waste a kill on somebody that has to be killed by the town sooner or later.

About the Baby Spice wagon. Basically what chess said. The wagon flew right past diddin's wagon which makes me even more confident in diddin-scum. Luckily people seem to be coming to their senses.

In other news, Chrono needs to take some stances ASAP. Those three posts he has are very underwhelming. Same goes for AV and Ranger, who basically tunneled on SD in all of his ISO. Can't blame him but that matter is dead and time to move on.

Axelrod is idly active lurking around and more interested in setup speculation than scumhunting. He needs to commit to a wagon so people can see where he stands.

[Dekes]

The Gandalf - SD exchange was the most useless thing in this thread so far .

SD is not for lynching today. Best case scenario it's an SK lynch. Any other 3rd party role is untinteresting today. Though SD's is so self-obsessed it's really painful to watch. He's throwing shit at anyone attacking him. It wouldn't surprise if he was a survivor of some sort actually. Town possibility is getting slimmer and slimmer.

Why is the BS-wagon still that big?

OH HAI SD's BUDDY TRYING TO KEEP HIM ALIVE

Not much has changed in the last few pages. SD is scummy now that he's unconfirmed, but I think BS is more so.

Baseless accusations thrown around to make the suspect pool bigger. And at the same time reminding everyone that BS is still the scummiest person. Coincidentally the only wagon bigger than his.

Remind me to take a look at Snow_Bunny's ISO.

V/LA until tomorrow evening

[Dekes]

@Moi
Then we apparently have different views on your claim. You can't just say my opinion doesn't hold water because you disagree. I believe that your claim alone gives you a very high chance of avoid getting NK'd.

Once again – if BabySpice is scum kill Dekes with fire. I don’t recall seeing any mention of how SD’s wagon went ‘too fast’ (which is HORRIBAD reasoning, BTW).

Different circumstances. In SD's case there wasn't any other wagon to derail.

I think first and foremost, BS is a bad player. Confusing the two Chrono's is entirely possible. But she said she doesn't want to get diddin lynched. What scum wouldn't want the counterwagon get lynched, especially if so many things are speaking for diddin-scum?
We have 20 players all equipped with two kinds of powers. I highly doubt that there isn't some form of vig in there. Like others suggested let the vig deal with BS and we focus on lynching scummier people.

Speacking of which, diddin the first one jumping at mothrax after chess attacks him is distinctive for diddin's play.

2. I saw it. I just don't and didn't like all the extreme caution coming from the hydra. I also dislike how they voted in the post replying to my suspicion for not voting. Thy crumbled under my pressure.

You are flailing in every direction. Because one reacted to it, they crumbled under your pressure? Try "they already said before that they vote only once they reach an agreement and you just failed to read their posts properly" instead.

@AGar
Mothrax is doing nothing else than half the town does, including you: Thinking BS and diddin are scum and/or detrimental to town. He's only choosing the lazy way in suggesting using two lynches on them instead of letting night actions take care of business.
What would be your next best option? Only other thing in your ISO that reads as an accusation is CMAR/ooba.

@ooba
You have BS and diddin both in your scum list but you don't feel a lynch of either of them? At least AGar has given his reasoning which was based on mothrax' stance on those people. If you agree with him, mothrax must be somewhere near the top of your scum reads. Or are there other reasons why you don't feel a BS or diddin lynch today?

- Pattern of votes & attacks.

That's an incredibly vague reason. Care to elaborate?

Note: ooba spends more time justifying the town read on chess than explaining his scum reads, especially the seemingly conflicting statements regarding BS and diddin.

[Dekes]

1. Yup. Bad players can’t possibly be scum. Noted.
2. Since you miss the obvious possibility they are partners I’ll just stuff this into my further pile of BabySpice defense from you and ignore the WIFOM here.

1. Even by the highest stretch of imagination I didn't say or imply that. I know too well that bad players can be scum. I learned that the hard way. You can't give me a solid reason why scum-BS would object the diddin-wagon, when it's clear that no matter what one flips it doesn't exonerate the other. They're scummy for independent reasons. So you brush it off as WIFOM.
2. The obvious possiblity? I may have missed it, but I didn't see anything in your ISO that would point to diddin and BS being possible partners. And mothrax' alleged connection between the two is a huge stretch. As fas as I see it I see diddin, who calls anybody scum that votes him, yet is clinging desperately to the BS wagon and BS, who openly admits she doesn't want to lynch diddin even if it is the only other wagon to hers. Nothing that strikes me as particular scum partner behavior.

And sure as hell in a 20 player game with all sorts of powers there is no possibility that scum might have a protective role, right? Right? Thought so.

Since no town role will protect BS, if at some point a vig claims a failed killing attempt on BS, she goes down, easy as that. Why wouldn't scum use the opportunity to bus the hell out of scum-BS and her atrocious game now?

That last post by BS was utter crap again, by the way. MoI is even lower on the list of lynch candidates than SD. Axel's talking about his question directed at you, BS.

[Dekes]

The fuck is this? He didn't respond to his prod and is posting in all of his other games frequently? And CMAR replaces out of this one but joins happily another Large? Way to play the game responsibly, guys.

I gave you one quite clearly in the post you are responding to … they are partners together. Now you are out-of-hand dismissing a possibility. Of course they are scummy for independent reasons. That doesn’t mean they can’t be partners. Your reaction is why I suspect you.

I'm dismissing the possibility because I don't see the connection. If I'm wrong, well, too bad.

Yes, so the you are advocating the Vig out themselves if they shoot BS and fail in a power-role rich game where any number of possibilities exists for why the shot failed. That’s bad reasoning.

What makes you assume that none of the votes on BS aren’t from scum?

And what do you make of the large levels of resistance to a BabySpice wagon as compared to the ease with which ShadowDancer was brought to L-1?

a) A person can claim a result on Baby without claiming his role. "BS is scum, trust me!" doesn't tell scum if it's a track/watch/cop/block/failed vig/whatever result.
b) In an all-PR game, scum's NK preference will be getting rid of dangeorus players over PR-hunting.

I'm sure there's scum on BS' wagon. Your premise was that I defend Bunny to keep my scumbuddy alive when it would be preferable to bus such a bad partner. The obvious answer is that just I thought she was bad town.

SD was arguably scummier. Still is scummy as hell.

Claim is meh. My experience with hiders consists of one town hider who died hiding behind scum and two scum fake claiming hider. However, given that fakeclaims are virtually guaranteed it's either true or a brutal fakeclaim (BS may have added the "don't die if hide behind scum" though).

Iecerint immediately being content with the claim on the nameclaim alone is ridiculous and scummy. Plus, #615 and #616 looks kinda staged. I don't know if Iece is known for these sort of shenanigans.

Dont die if hide behind scum. Not going to ask about bRB as I doubt Andy would answer.

Super power is messenger based but to say more would make it useless.

Why would you not try to ask Andrius if your life is on the line? What's the worst that can happen? You could at least ask if Andy's using NAR. Hiding resolves usually before Roleblocking. IIRC that's one of the things that fucked up nopoint's claim in BN. He fakeclaimed to have hidden behind someone who died N1 and assumed he was roleblocked.
Messenger as a Super Power to Hider? I don't know about the rest of you but my Super is linked very closely to my Normal. Super makes sense flavor-wise and Normal doesn't? Well, there's a lot of crap in that claim. Weell, I guess she could be scummy scum instead of scummy town indeed.

Dekes-SB links:

(Minor) Dekes promising to look into SB ISO but never doing so ..

Because you didn't remind me like I asked!
Nah, I did ISO her because I felt she was flying under the radar. But that's all there's to it. Don't feel she's avoiding any hot topic. Though the input on BS is minimal. But she's voting diddin so it's all good.

People unvoting BS but diddin's wagon still not picking up. Diddin is so guaranteed scum.
Prime example: AV: Immediately after her claim when it looked like BS wagon was losing steam and there was a chance she wouldn't get lynched (prior to the self vote debacle) he hopped off of diddin onto Iece with the mandatory addition "Of course I will revote diddin if I need to but BS could hang as well". Translation: "Of course I will bus again but I will make it as hard as possible for you to not lynch BS today by taking out the steam of the second biggest wagon".

[Dekes]

Bye bye, SB :/

Gandalf, was there one reason why you had to use your Super in secret and on BS?

I wonder if Persephone's death has anything to do with the Hellfire?
Cause she was the Queen of the Underworld, and wife of Hades.
additionally, Castrated is an odd kill flavor; SK, perhaps? And Snow_Bunny seems likely to be the scumkill due to her death flavor.
Hellfire means that we need to be particularly careful with our votes today. With 16 alive, it's 9 - 2 = 7 to lynch today.

That post sounds horrible. Overly blatant warning to town to be cautious and a lot of NK-speculation, that doesn't feel genuine at all.

Chono, are you expecting someone specific to claim getting a "Grace" pm or not?

AV's post is missing an Iece-vote -> No conviction behind his accusations of Iece lying. Claim is lol. I'd like to see it proven. Especially after a vig is already dead (at least that's what I conclude from diddin's role and SB's death flavor).

Interesting tidbit: I have reason to believe scum have daytalk.

Second vote would go to quadz or ooba. Need to hear from Chrono first.

[Dekes]

Is there a reason for SD to not say who he "jailed" last Night?

This would at least presumably be someone who didn't do any killing.

Dekes.

I know for a fact I wasn't jailed last night.

[Dekes]

Also, why? Did you mention me even once yesterday?

[Dekes]

Because I know I wasn't.

[Dekes]

It's AGar.

[Dekes]

AV needs to come in here and claim scum again, so we can move forward with Lynch B.

[Dekes]

common sense would indicate dekes is RB immune

Not that I know of.

If anynone noticed. I didn't came out yelling "SD's a liar!", because I think it's possible that both scum and town have a reason to block SD's action. But we can make this easy:

Does anyone want to come forward and claim that he or she might be responsible for SD's jailkeep not working on me last night? If not, SD is a liar and needs-a-lynchin'.

Whoever said, "Jesus is a God". Wtf? I mean, Iece claimed beforehand that his results may not be accurate. And then he gets a result of a non-God? I see no reason whatsoever to see AGM as scum based on Iece's claim alone.

lynch2: quadz

[Dekes]

I don't think, SD's town. True, scum will probably remain silent if they're responsible. On the other hand, we can give SD another night to confirm his role.

Yet the main focus on AGM seems to be due to the cop result which was confirmed to not be sanity confirmed. Terribly bad = scummy. See Baby Spice. Plus, I actually see bits of scumhunting in AGM's ISO.

[Dekes]

EBWOP:
= should say /=

[Dekes]

SD being town makes me cringe, but eh.

Btw, Gandalf, why didn't you redirect SD, who you consider to be SK, to Iece? That would seem more sensible than trying to redirect a scum read, who might not even perform the kill.

[Dekes]

If it served a purpose other than proving I'm not lying, I would've elaborated. As of now it wouldn't help in finding scum today.

pedit:
Let the mod fix your tags, gandalf. And then start making sense.

[Dekes]

In other news, I am certainly down for an ooba lynch as lynch two. CMAR was scummy before he replaced out. Ooba hasn't really done much since then. I have specific posts in mind but can't quote ATM since I am stuck phone posting until finals are over.

So, this is not forgotten in the pile of shit that was the gandalf-chess "math theory".

I have no idea what is going on in this giant shithole.

Suspects, now. Do you think Chrono is scum despite his confirmed action of doublevote-granter?

And Ooba, was there a reason Dekes wasn't still on the table for second lynch that I have missed?

Because he obviously can read between the lines.
pedit: see?

V/LA Saturday and Sunday

.

[Dekes]

Lol, I was actually more interested in mothrax' case on ooba.

[Dekes]

Dekes, have you made comments about gandalf somewhere, other than to deny having been roleblocked?

Nope. I'm as confused as everyone else about gandalf. If he wants too keep quiet about it, it's maybe because it doesn't profit town now. I get that feeling. But he definitely has to stop stressing this issue by responding to it every single time.

Seriously, the first 15 posts are filled with speculation about claims, dead sections, and buddying to other players. Then there is some gandalfbrand content that is almost always scummy anyways. Then you go back to the fluff anf then, oh look, more setup speculation.

Lynch2: Gandalf

The way how are you keep avoiding pressuring ooba, yet still calling him scum on a constant basis, is quite telling. You voted CMAR way back based on a pretty weak reason and you refuse to update that case although I and somebody else (Magna?) have asked you to do so.


Any comments about AGM seem futile now as it boils down to whether you believe his claim or not. AV and AGM both claiming doc is definitely odd, but at least AGM's SUPER is immensely more believable. If he's a doc, he's in a danger anyway. Plus, quadz was the superior lynch before that already.

I think that AGM using his supposed ability before his lynch is a good idea. I also agree that it should be solely AGM's decision.

Basically translates into "I believe AGM's doc claim but let's lynch him anway." Coincidence that you're the second biggest wagon?

While I didn't like Axel's laying low and staying in the background initially, I do get town vibes from him after all, just something I can't put my finger on. May be because he hasn't played a lot of games in the past year and he maybe used to a different site meta. His latest posts are goodposting.

Scum:
AGar
Shadow Dancer

Have you read D1? Besides AGar being obvtown he practically signed a death sentence for the other if one of them flips scum.

Gemini input

[Dekes]

Great news: AGM's claim just became quite a lot more believable recently. I strongly advocate against an AGM-lynch today.

AV's flip will certainly help us decide on the question of mafia's mythological link.

You keep on contradicting yourself on that matter. Clear answer: Do you want AGM to get lynched or not? Do you think AGM is Jesus or not?

@Quadz
The second part of your original statement where you said it should be AGM's decision on whom to use his power implies to me that you believe his claim.

[Dekes]

Do not use the tree stump power for the sake of mod confirming yourself. If you're town, we'd effectively use a townie either way.

Third the question if you know what your other seasons do. Also, was there any season on Day 1? I find it odd that there was no indication of there being a season on Day 1.

That being said, like SD said, Hellfire has no link whatsoever to the Greek Pantheon. Claim is fishy, but at least very confirmable.

So you basically claim useless random role that confirmably caused a town death...

When did this happen? Flavor indicates that no one died by a Hellfire.

[Dekes]

Wrong. If it safes us a misslynch he needs to use it.

What if we mislynch now? Then we've lost two townies when we didn't have to. quadz's action was a pure act of self-preservation. He can't really help us anymore and he doesn't even help increasing the threshold.

Forgetful(?) Inventors aren't bastard at all. If you want to talk to the mod about bastard modding try for the unannounced no-role flips. Unless it's a mechanic caused by someone, but so far nothing indicates this.

This post is missing some sort of reaction to quadz's claim and subsequent use of his super and worse, anything resembling a scum read. Axel, anything you wanna tell us?

Out of mothrax and Axel, I'm definitely leaning mothrax. Originally I had info which led me to believe mothrax was town but in light of recent events that info may be faulty. And no, I'm not elaborating.

Lynch2: mothrax

[Dekes]

Still clinging to that AGar - SD scum theory?

Also, there is no clear stance to be found on either viable lynch option in those posts of yours.

[Dekes]

Axelrod’s 1441 is another large post that is chock full of speculation and little in the way of actual reads on players. He softly suggests several players (myself and ooba) feel like scum and immediately backs off that position by saying “I suspect those who jump at me”.

You have zero excuse for getting on me for that, considering Clash of Kings. I said more or less the exact same thing about you then, and gee, you were scum. As far as I know, Ooba isn't even jumping on me so I don't know what you're at there. I'm wary of him because he seems fairly unreadable atm.

What now? You claim MoI's point against you to be invalid by saying you said the same thing about him in another game where it would've actually been valid because he was indeed scum there?

Yeah, that's a bona fide scumslip if I ever saw one.


Also, I'll be out of town over the weekend. So if we wanna start the alternate voting now and we need my vote, speak up within the next hour. If we wait, I'll be back late Sunday evening/Monday.

V/LA until 5/15

[Dekes]

This is about his supposed "read" of me in this game. If he's Town, he should know the point he's making is not a valid point. I think MoI is actually very smart. So I am definitely holding it against him here that he's so off base.

But you can't say it's not a scumtell by pointing to a game where scum did it.

@quadz
Pretty sure I did.

- Moi attacks Axel for waffling about people attacking him ("I may just call them scum because they're attacking me")
- Axel says MoI can't use this as a valid scumtell because MoI did the same thing in Clash of Kings
- MoI was scum in Clash of Kings

[Dekes]

What? Well, it definitely reads differently. Mind giving me the link to the game (or even better, the posts in question)?

[Dekes]

EBWOP:
Okay, I think I got it now (the way you meant it). Link would still be helpful.

[Dekes]

Ooba, even if I was scum, I think it would be bad form to out anyone from the other scumteam,

Is this confirmation of two scum teams? Remember, outing members from a different scum team is playing to your win con, not bad form.

Can we start voting yet? The day's starting to drag. I expect Conspiracy to keep his promise by delivering his post tomorrow.

[Dekes]

I think you need to full claim

This. Too bad, you are replacing into a scummy slot, Conspiracy. But right now we're basically waiting solely for the mothrax slot to catch up so we can start the voting process. Claim the next time you're on.

[Dekes]

EBWOP:
Which would be right now.

[Dekes]

Roleblocker claim? Instant death warrant.

[Dekes]

(Apparently not a 3 double roleblock, but the other way around)

Because a triple roleblock would be easier confirmable than what you're presenting us now, right? Botched claim is botched.

And you're lying, just saying.

[Dekes]

The former.

[Dekes]

I tought it was the latter until I realized Conspiracy replaced mothrax.

[Dekes]

Looking back, mothrax didn't even raise an eyebrow after Shadow's claim and chess' counterclaim. With chess making a big deal out of two similar roles in the setup, you'd think mothrax would press Shadow and/or chess even more. Unless, of course, mothrax is lying scum who didn't want to get involved there.

[Dekes]

Gandalf has way too many shenanigans going on. And I don't like the persistence that he wanted to be checked out by Iece several times. Smells rather of godfatherism than confirming Iece's role. If it weren't for the execution on Day 1, I'd vote you over LC. However, if you're right, congrats.

Votecount, please.

LC's lack of votes so far is disturbingly telling. He's more concerned about survival (understandable if he's town), but calling out nobody on his wagon, not even the slightest of suspicion against gandalf's claim? Come on.

And, gandalf, what reason exactly did you have for withholding the info about your additional redirect of SD yesterday? IIRC, you already were a claimed redirector by then. Would've saved us a lot of unnecessary discussion.

Fine. I targeted Snow_Bunny last night. My role has to do with why there are multiple death stages.

How? Can you only target people from one of the death stages? Any reason why you picked SB over Plum?

Ooba, is it valuable for you to claim what you did to the AV's wagon yesterday?

[Dekes]

I wonder why you don't even mention my full claim with one sigle word, Dekes.

I don't know either. Probably because my super has been useless so far. But yes, I can confirm that I used my Super on Night 1. And additionally, to clear things up, I can confirm that Bunny used her power, too. And it wasn't a kill.
Given my and Bunny's Supers, I'm actually suprised so few people have used their Super so far. But it does add credibility to chesskid's claim that there might be more passive Super's out there.

1. If he was playing in a survivalistic manner he would be pressing hard on someone on his wagon. Instead he is answering questions in a controlled manner.
2. Gandalf’s claim would properly explain why his claimed normal Whispher failed even without Chesskid’s claim. Saying he should be suspicious of Gandalf because of it is horrible logic.

I disagree. If someone came out of the gate and claimed a result that happened to be that he redirected me to the only NK when I had nothing to do with it, my first thought would be "frame job". Sure, there are a lot of possibilities in an all PR game, that such a scenario could've happened. But not even the slightest bit of suspicion of this coincidence? Looks more like LC's afraid that an accusation would be seen as a weak OMGUS and confirm the impression that he got caught.

So, I take it you believe LC and gandalf. But what do you think of LC in general?

@EVERYONE

– What do you think of the following theory –

That Conspiracy’s claim and very self-sacrificing play was a gambit designed to buy Chesskid Town cred since a claimed Role-blocker flipping Scum would bolster his claim?

But we don't have actual proof of Conspiracy being a RB, have we? Did AGar ever confirm the N1 block? Okay, reading along, he did a couple of pages later. Eh, chesskid claimed early on and Conspiracy was the roleblocker if AGar was roleblocked N1, so unlikely.

Other than that, I agree with gandalf here, for different reasons though. If chesskid is part of the AV-Conspiracy scum team, LC isn't and vice versa. While it would make more sense for chesskid to discontinue his bussing attempts on LC after two of their members have died, trying to clear him in such a manner would be the doom for both of them, and chesskid would know that, too.

LC, now that we have time to wait to see the results of your claim, what do you think of your wagon?

Other than I don't see how "turned into sand" cannot be Egyptian's kill method, I don't see the benefit of speculating on how many scum teams are out there. We've seen flips from one scum team so far and three different kill flavors, one which most likely belonged to a vig. This can still go either way.

I don't like Gemini's latest post. Apart from explaining their Axel-Conspiracy ambivalence yesterday and a little flavor input and NK association they bring nothing new to the table. Pick it up, girls.

[Dekes]

Dekes said he had reason to believe Mothrax was Town, but then began to doubt it. What was that reason and is there a reason not to say?

There was a reason that I believed mothrax could be a doc. After AV's and AGM's claims that assumption became less believable (and on the plus side, mothrax became scummier, too). And stating that reason would do nothing but outing my role needlessly as of now .

Why? If your claim is true they cannot avoud it anyway, but it could provide useful info for town (though it would be most useful if you had blocked some NK, which you haven't - all under the assumption you're speaking the truth).

And if he hit part of a scum team, they can work their way around eventual blocked actions with that info. If it doesn't help us now, chess should keep quiet.

There would have to be crazy crazy gambitting going on for Chesskid to be a RB with ConSpiracy. Because as far as I can tell, Conspiracy wasn't lying. Or if he was, he was using a scumbuddies claim as his own. Which would be wtf.

I can confirm that Conspiracy was the roleblocker. chess is most likely not buddies' with AV/Cons.

Gemini.
Let's vig Gemini.
Yes, I

am

paranoid.
But by PoE - give me one good reason why Gemini isn't scum ("town read" is not at all an acceptable reason).

What PoE exactly? That they're the only ones who haven't (soft)-claimed their role yet? Mothrax/Cons-relations seem to indicate that they're at least not part of the Greek Pantheon.
I'll give you that I'd like to hear more from them, especially after they said they'd look into everyone again.

Also, we're revolving way too much about confirming LC's claim, which says nothing about his alignment. I believe his claim, it matches his nameclaim, matches with the fact that there are two death stages, the neighborhood part should be confirmable and the axelrod talk seems to elaborate for a scum fake claim, considering LC can't even clear himself by proving his power.
But if he's town, he will share all the axelrod info as we go all along, and if he's scum he will lie and withhold information as it suits him. I'm gonna treat the axelrod bits like a non-confirmed version of quadz.

MoI, you haven't answered my question what you think of LC.

AGM's play keeps on being underwhelming. He's been nothing but following the questionable PR claim so far. Do yu think AGar and SD are still scum/part of the Egyptians?

[Dekes]

EBWOP:
Greek = Egyptian in the first instance talking about Gemini.

[Dekes]

%&/+#!&#$! I trusted you, Gemini.

Vote: Gemini

You really want this to be 1 on 1, scum rolecop?

Claim: Apollo, Greek God of Sun, Music and Archery

Watcher + Masons with Snow_Bunny, who was a Tracker.

Watched AGar Night 1, mothrax and Chronopie visited him.
AGM Night 2, no visitors.

Super is a perma-watch on chesskid. Nobody bothered to visit him so far.

Clever. Get Greek God of Sun result and simply convert it to its Egyptian counterpart. Guess, Ice has to vig me now so you can lynch her today. I guess, no one wants to cc Ra to exonerate me? Huh, Gemini, how about it?

[Dekes]

I have no idea what the purpose of this gambit was, Gemini. I can see that you've been flying under the radar long enough now that people start to notice you're still in the game, so you thought you'd use your Super to clear yourself.

But you are aware that you will be getting lynched for this, are you?

[Dekes]

How would using her super "clear" her if the result she produces ends up being false?

That's the question, right?

[Dekes]

EBWOP:

Mod, can you fix the tags, please.

[Dekes]

DEKES ANY BREADCRUMBS?

I don't believe in crumbs. But that's how I know Conspiracy/mothrax was 99% a Roleblocker. And I hinted at my result that I saw Chrono.

And if you got some time to kill, Iso me and Bunny on D1.

@gandalf
Thanks for the support, but nah. They've got the result, I got the short end of the stick here. When Gemini flips scum, I'll still be a liability with that result of hers, whereas when I flip town, you can lynch Gemini's scummy ass right away.

[Dekes]

L
O
L

There's no way that we would volunteer to do this as a gambit knowing that Iec has a day vig. All he has to do is vig you and town could still lynch us if we were lying, or vig me and then lynch your lying ass. It would be horribly poor timing for this particular gambit if that's what we were doing.

We've got your entire role PM, including a HI-larious picture of your tiny birdie head on your big buff bod. I know your flavor (you hate the Greek for offering sacrifices to Helios rather than you) and I know your powers, which you are telling the truth about although I certainly don't see anything about Snow_Bunny in here, and you are not Apollo. Oh and I know your kill flavor so if you somehow manage to convince people and survive past this day, you better not ever make a kill because if anyone turns up BURNED TO DEATH, how will you explain that one away?

Nothing wiki doesn't offer you in 5 minutes if you look up Egyptian Sun God after you got a result on a Greek Sun God.

How do you explain that S_B and I never ever unvoted diddin for several weeks, my weak attempt at distancing to her but never following up on it and Bunny and me calling each other town without interaction and based without any reasons? I can give you her tracking target and her Super, if you want. Tracked diddin N1 and Super is a tracking chain.

[Dekes]

@gandalf
No, because we weren't aware of no role-flips. If one of us ever died, the other could simply claim mason without being cc'd and that would be clearance enough.

@AGM
How do masons behave? That's just your confimation bias talking. I said I'd ISO Bunny because I didn't like her play so far and I told her as much in the QT. Nothing with a little distancing between masons. But alas, I never followed up on that suspicion, because why would I?

[Dekes]

Why would somebody ever crumb masons? There's no advantage in it, scum might pick up on it and town gains no advantage from it unlike an investigation role. And you can just confirm yourself by the flip of your mason buddy.

And I've never crumbed my roles ever. I don't know about S_B.

Pedit:
That's just what you would do, AGM. That's not some universal guideline for masons to behave.

[Dekes]

For the record, I've never been masons before, if that helps in your analysis. And Bunny had no intent of suggesting any crumbing either.

[Dekes]

These powers are mine, Gemini only replaced the siblings QT with the factional power.

[Dekes]

Tracked diddin N1 and Super is a tracking chain.

Some one look for Dekes hinting at Diddin being definite vig. I cannot remeber him adressing that theory even once...
Tracking chain?! How does it work?

She died so we didn't get a result.

Tracking chain = She tracks one person, tracks that persons target and then once again the second person's target. Basically three results at once. and a nice way of making some connections. She originally wanted to use it on chess as well, but in the end we settled for ooba.

And basically what gandalf. Why would masons act like obvmasons? That makes no sense. But I disregarded the distancing act anyway because Bunny became more active after that.
But I agree that gandalf is probably scum for defending me that fiercely and not looking from both angles.
And I do think that "burned to death" is Gemini's kill flavor. Always good to have info easily available to incriminate others.

Pedit:
Why would Gemini fess up now if they know they've already messed up?

I'll answer Moi's post seperately.

[Dekes]

@Dekes

– why did you ‘trust’ Gemini?

Because I had a town read on her up until that point.

1. To prevent a scum counter-claim. A viable breadcrumb is just the evidence you need to guarantee you don’t get lynched in a gambit.
2. In this case because we only have ‘your word’ that you were Masons at all.

1. But this will always lead to a guaranteed 1v1 which scum don't want. A flipped mason is confirmation enough for the other mason(s).
2. Yeah, that pretty much sucks. If we knew there were no role flips we probably would've played differently.

And I already agreed I should get vigged because I'll be a constant liability for town if kept alive. And I shared all my info anyway. For the record, I think you should look for Gemini's partners in the vig discussion between Iece's confirmation of having received the vig shot and Gemini's investigation claim. Partners will be in there. Guess, Gemini figured it'd be better to get out of the day with only one of their team member's dead and taking a townie with them instead of two dead scum.


@gandald
Why would scum defend me so hard knowing I am town? Did you really just say that?

@SD
Mothrax visited AGar N1. AGar claimed to have been roleblocked. Conspiracy claimed a roleblocking ability. That makes Cons/mothrax pretty much a roleblocker.

[Dekes]

I just came up with the most convincing reason not to kill Dekes: He's the last of his faction most likely, since he's Egyptian. So if ANYBODY shows up as burnt to death, we lynch him immediately. If we ever have a night with two kills and no burnt to death flavor, Dekes is confirmed town and we kill Gemini. Meantime: Chess or LC?

That would only work with a dead Gemini and living me. I am convinced that Gemini copied her kill flavor into my pm.

[Dekes]

Oh well, embarrassing perfomance by the Egyptians

[Dekes]

You really could've been a better mason, Bunny