Goofbash Invitational (Game Over)

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Vote: SensFan

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Faraday's right; lack of dayguilty on dram is suspicious.

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(That said, I love how I've never played with Ether before, but I still know enough about her meta to say that she's town by virtue of being the one posting instead of chamber.)

It's not quite that simple, regardless of how easy Ether claims it is.

That said, CES, the lack of guilty on dram is a null tell.

Obviously. Investigating a likely daymiller is a terrible play.

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Okay, fine, you're probably town. Still took 1 more post than Mina was claiming.

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Why isn't SensFan dead yet?

P.S. I figured out SensFan's alignment by pre-game neighbor chat.

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P.S. I figured out SensFan's alignment by pre-game neighbor chat.

All right, I know this is a weird thing to ask on page two, but is this a joke, yes or no?

It's a joke; the only thing I figured out was that SensFan doesn't adequately appreciate the Konopka signing.

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*hops*

Unvote, vote: Katsina

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What about the "there's scum on the couch" part, SensFan?

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Did you catch her during pre-pre-game neighbor chat?

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Eh, Fate's neighborclaim looked plenty plausible. TBM believing him is a null tell.

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I'm sure I have been in a game with you before, though I can't remember which off the top of my head, and while you are reserved IRL I can't see you not posting at the start of the game. CES on the other hand...

I've certainly lurked at strategic times as scum before, but I don't see myself doing it at the start of the game. Start of the game is easy-peasy for me.

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That's how this generally works, yes.

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Uh, I don't believe Faraday has any magical Mina-reading skills, just fyi.

TBM, not the mason part.

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Have you ever caught her as scum, Faraday?

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Yeah, in a marathon game recently. other than that I think I've 'caught' her once, (well she was on my 'need to die list' in defcon), and got fooled by her offsite in a game.

She's nearly always been town when we've played together.

Marathon games don't count (I think I was pretty obvious in Mina's upick and I certainly how to play scum (VitR didn't see it because he wasn't looking for it)). ISOing you in DEFCON 2.0 shows me that you didn't catch her in any reasonable sense (calling her out for excessive twitching in twilight doesn't count). So your Mina-reading skills seem to consist mostly of playing in games wherein Mina is town.

Did she do "things she just doesn't do as scum" in the game she fooled you?

p-edit: I for one think the accusation of lying is silly. Is anyone here taking that seriously?

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P.S. Interesting that you called her *twitch*ing a town tell here.

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CES, you're taking issue with Faraday's defence of me (I'm finding it hard to be objective on him, because on the one hand, I'm grateful that someone is defending me, but on the other hand, I still find his posts a bit off and lacking in passion--I don't buy his "I have no motivation for Mafia" excuse, and in the interests of full disclosure, he also had a rock-solid gut town read on me in the game in which I bused my buddy), but you haven't commented on any of my own posts. So why exactly are you voting for me if you don't believe Fate and Sens caught me in a lie?

Bandwagonning!

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No no no, I always wagoned Katsuki and put him under pressure because it's the only way to get him to actually give reads / play the game but as I said his wagon is proceeding and Mina is being quite active for him which nicely frees up my vote.

So you can waste it on DGb?

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Just put tans on it. No one ever gives you flack for putting tans on a scum list.

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Unvote, vote: Faraday

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It was fun and informative?

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Faraday also just informed me of two things over AIM: #1 that Neko is confirmedtown due to mod error/slip up

Wait, that was serious?

question WHY

It's fun and informative?

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Wagoning us may be informative, but it's sure as hell not fun replacing into this mess and trying to make sense of lolfatesheep

Oh, Reck, always so negative. Just think of it as a challenge!

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^hasn't been to Goofbash

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I don't care what was established at Goofbash as TBM-meta. Forum-TBM doesn't sheep Fate so willy-nilly.

Given that this is tbm's first game since Goofbash (I think), our meta might be slightly more relevant.

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What's the Faraday wagon about?

Him being scum.

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Point me to which post

All of them.

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Unless you're all in a neighborhood QT and the joke's on me, what is the case on Faraday now?

Oh snap, he caught us.

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It's just 5 days in. We don't want the Day to end that quickly.

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I like CES as a wagon.

Throw me some posts that caught your eye.

Well, the being on the two biggest wagons, sticking on the Mina wagon when it was painfully obvious that Mina was town, and he had posted since it was clearly obvious. Sheeping onto the Reck wagon. Plus look at the content of his posts in ISO, does it look like he is scumhunting, at all?

THESE WERE GOOD WAGONS.

*hops*

Unvote, vote: tbm

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Nevertheless I don't think he is playing like he played at GB. Though his forum persona may be just as different as Fate's IRL and here as well

Face-to-face is fast enough that blindly bandwagonning is anti-town instead of pro-town.

Chamber'll be able to read me. We read each other correctly in Oldy.

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IC and tbm are mildly suspicious.

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There was plenty of time for them to notice it wasn't L-1. Not sure which scenario is more likely.

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*hops*

Unvote, vote: Nikanor

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Yeah, there's an extraneous [quote="tanstalas"] tag in that quote.

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Nikanor is the sole scum in the set-up. Trust me on this.

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Blackberry, with me!

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Blackberry, with me!

CES, tell me why you like the Nikanor wagon more than the TBM wagon.

I've forgotten!

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Forgetting things it totally a town tell for me.

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Forgetting things it totally a town tell for me.

Really? Should find it comforting that you don't seem able to recall why you're voting Nikanor instead of TBM and that that doesn't seem to spur you to re-evaluate where your vote should be? Because that doesn't seem very town to me.

I know I had a reason. That is sufficient for me; I trust my past self.

The fact that I forgot my reason implies that I had a reason which isn't always true when I'm scum.

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Forgetting things it totally a town tell for me.

Really? Should find it comforting that you don't seem able to recall why you're voting Nikanor instead of TBM and that that doesn't seem to spur you to re-evaluate where your vote should be? Because that doesn't seem very town to me.

I know I had a reason. That is sufficient for me; I trust my past self.

The fact that I forgot my reason implies that I had a reason which isn't always true when I'm scum.

Though from our perspective, it's indistinguishable from you not having a reason, and so coming up with "I forgot".

That doesn't sound like something I (or anyone really) would randomly make up and go with.

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En garde.*

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I'm surprised CES and TBM are not all over me.

Our hydra shall be named...Cherry Breaker.

The VC doesn't allow for a ABRvote.

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CES what do you currently think of vitamin?

He feels like a #3 suspect.

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Your case on SensFan is mostly "He's acting weirdly. I wouldn't expect Senstown to act weirdly." but it fails to address why Sensscum would act that weirdly. Less quoting, more analysis, please.

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OK, for those of you who don't like to read words:

SensFan is scum because:

- He initially took credit for "catching" Mina and then backpedaled and said it was Fate (lessening his responsibility for the wagon).
- When he supposedly believed Mina was scum, he insisted on keeping Fate's identity secret.
- He tried to use what was initially a joke as evidence that he was the first to suspect Mina.
- He opportunistically sheeped Fate's read even though he had no basis for thinking there had to be scum in their neighbor group.
- He accused Mina of lying in order to push her wagon.
- He said his pm was very "shades-of-grey" about whether he could trust his neighbors, in spite of whole heartedly backing Fate's belief that one of them must be scum.
- He weakened his Mina read without unvoting in an attempt to lessen his responsibility for her wagon (same reason to back out of "catching" her and giving the responsibility of it to Fate)
- Blatantly defended Fate as town with no apparent reason for doing so (flipped to a scum read on him at the drop of a hat)

This still consists of words, just fyi (really the main difference between this and the previous case is that you haven't included quotes). Try drawing a picture and/or engaging with what I said.

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@CES: I disagree that my post was merely saying "He's acting weirdly. I wouldn't expect Senstown to act weirdly." I think that I pointed out some blatantly scummy actions. I removed anything but those actions so it would be clearer. Do you disagree that these actions are scummy? If so, feel free to explain to me howso rather than just telling me that I didn't post anything useful.

Sensscumplayingreallybadly does work, but I'm generally seeing a lack of mid- to long-term scum motivation in the actions you describe e.g. accusing Mina of lying, his view on Fate. The only point I agree is all that meanignful is the "keeping Fate's identity secret" but for different reasons - the logic that the scum would know the neighbors due to Minascum being among the neighbors should've been obvious to SensFan if he were scum due to the scum knowing the neighbors as a result of a scum neighbor in that case, but I could see the inconsistency being a result of Sensfan not considering whether the scum knowing who the neighbors are as something that he shouldn't know anything about as a subconsciously overcompensation for knowing that the scum know who the neighbors are.

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You're right, damn. I misspelled meaningful.

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That's a bit strict, SensFan; it's not like the slot was internally consistent before.

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I'm townier than Vit surely.

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You get me as townier than Vit though, right, DGb?

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We don't appear to be lacking in obvious townies anyhow.

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YARR!

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Vote: tanstalas

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Vote: DGb

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Well, that explains DGb's reaction.

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The more the merrier? Unanimous lynches are the best.

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Vote: tans

VitR, get back on tans.

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Fine.

Unvote, vote: Blackberry

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Vote: Irish Carbomb

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@Mina, I'm not even bandwagonning, so no. I'm mostly lurking due to V/LA.

P.S. chamber totes cleared me.
P.P.S. IC should hang.

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ABR is a fine shot as far as I'm concerned.

Still like the ICwagon.

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Agreed. Deadline should be set at 1 hour after we lynch Irish Carscum.

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^doesn't understand how this game is played

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IC should self-hammer if you're town.

VitaminR, don't let vengeful townies get away with not self-hammering. Hint: look at Faraday's wiki and see how many of his scum roles have "Survived" after them.

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Weird play is a town tell for me (I may be making this up.)

Blackberry going Tracker -> Cop suggests he may've been checking if DGb were scums.

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Irish Carbomb just spammed up the thread and then were declared town because some of the posts happened to the right notes. Had I had one more day or had more time near the deadline previous to that and I sure as hell wouldn't've let them get away with it.

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Indeed. Day-neighbors probably didn't even know about being allowed to use AIM.

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Self-hammering can be completely valid. I still maintain that xReck should've argued for his own lynch in the original Liten (3-1-1 endgame and he was obv getting lynched sooner or later).

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In hindsight, I think one of the major reasons IC got away with it is Blackberry distracting us 2 Days straight and thereby giving the scum time to shoot the right people.

Self-hammering can be completely valid. I still maintain that xReck should've argued for his own lynch in the original Liten (3-1-1 endgame and he was obv getting lynched sooner or later).

can you refresh my memory on this?

Sure.

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Thought it was fine myself.

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Ooh, remembered this:

CogitoErgoMafia (16:50:51): fun fact:
CogitoErgoMafia (16:51:19): at one point during goofbash inv
CogitoErgoMafia (16:51:30): I was voting for Mina while thinking she was town
CogitoErgoMafia (16:51:55): and in another game [My Little Pony] I was on the counterwagon to the Minawagon while thinking she was scum