Succession Mafia II: OVER!
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@Ludi: Why would you prefer speculation over typical scumhunting?
DrippingGoofball wrote:Cobblerfone wrote:What are these dates? And why are they the recruits because of them?
From the activity report, look at the lower corner of the page, right side. They are not recruits because of the date.
From the 4 players that would make the best recruits, I chose the one that posted less recently. Also, xvart would be a favorite recruit from anyone's perspective.
xvart wrote:Cobblerfone wrote:Us teamsters need to stick together. Although, I don't like xvart's latest response. Caught scum?
The irony, so-to-speak, of my post is that DGBs case on me is based on a timestamp. Honestly, I get the idea of picking from a pool and I agree with that as a jumping off point.
Did you miss her post where she said that the timestamps weren't a reason for calling you scum?
VOTE: Cobblerfone
I don't think the part about Yosarian as the other scum was a slip; but I do think it contradicts what he said about "It would be rather odd for there to be only one recruit per team." Also, since Cobbler has stated that professions do not indicate roles, I don't know why he would worry about lynching a power role.-
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xvart wrote:The irony, so-to-speak, of my post is that DGBs case on me is based on a timestamp. Honestly, I get the idea of picking from a pool and I agree with that as a jumping off point.
xvart wrote:bvoigt, 205 wrote:Did you miss her post where she said that the timestamps weren't a reason for calling you scum?
No, I didn't miss it. But out of the four people she identified as potential scum picks, I was selected because I had posted less frequently than the others (i.e. the timestamp).
In that case, don't you think you were misrepping the case on you?
Herodotus wrote:Herodotus wrote:@Albert: Do you have daytalk? Assuming things are symmetric between you and Kinetic, I may have a lead, but I'd rather not elaborate until you've answered.
I suppose kinetic can try answering too, but I'm not going to be overly trusting, obviously.
Are you saying you trust Albert more than Kinetic? If so, why?
Magister Ludi wrote:Vote: Yosarian2
Vote is in a bad place. And his reasoning for it is bad on two fronts. One, if xvart is being run up to a lynch today, isn't that exactly the sort of player they would avoid? How come no one mentioned this. Sheeping vote with DGB is bad. Also, reading all pages in this thread is critical, your questions have already been asked and answered.
This is a terrible vote. By your logic, one should avoid lynching anyone who is in danger of being lynched. Also, what are you talking about when you mention "the fourth faction"?
UNVOTE: Cobblerfone
VOTE: xvart
While I don't want to get into too much WIFOM, ooba may have a point about Cobblerfone (which would also apply to Ludi). So I'll put my vote here for now.-
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ThAdmiral wrote:Xvart is closer to lynch than any, butfos: any. He's one to watch for tomorrow...
Ani is the backup mod.
Cobblerfone wrote:sorry everyone. Here's it formatted correctly:
Flameaxe wrote: You have Katsuki listed as "decided to lurk" yet Kat is also one of your town reads. Consider me baffled at your logic here.
It was the way Kats announced the lurking. Though, it'll be bad if she's recruited. Maybe we should lynch Kats so she can't keep herself from showing a difference in playstyles?
You want to lynch a town read so she doesn't get recruited later?-
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Cobblerfone wrote:bvoigt wrote:
You want to lynch a town read so she doesn't get recruited later?
I was asking if we should lynch her because if she gets turned we won't really know. Plus, maybe the threat will flush her out. I really just want the lurkers to stop lurking.
But, you're advocating a lynch on a town read? That doesn't make any sense to me. Also, is there a special flavor name for your unrecruitableness? (Sort of like "Visit" or "Tour the Neighborhood" in the sample role PMs.)-
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Cobblerfone wrote:bvoigt wrote:is there a special flavor name for your unrecruitableness? (Sort of like "Visit" or "Tour the Neighborhood" in the sample role PMs.)
I don't see how that would help. (Seeing as how "Visit" and "Tour the Neighborhood" are more-or-less the same power with different names.) And I've already adressed that the flavor will hint too much at my role.
If you do actually have a flavor name for being unrecruitable, itisimportant to me that you claim it. And the flavor argument doesn't work here...I'm not asking you for a reason, just a word or phrase. It will not hint at any other aspects of your role.
BTW, Ludi has ignored my question ~3 times.-
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Cobblerfone wrote:@bvoigt: How about if I get to L-2? Why does it matter? Even if the flavor name was the same for every unrecruitable, the flavor would only be verifiable to other unrecruitables. Which would bring more unrecruitables unecessarily in the open. And I know it will be different because it is somewhat tied to my role.
ParaphrasingWriting one word or phrase from a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim takes an eternity.
UNVOTE: xvart
VOTE: Cobblerfone
Looks to me like he is struggling to come up with a suitable fakeclaim after claiming a role he didn't have.-
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DrippingGoofball wrote:bvoigt wrote:UNVOTE: xvart
VOTE: Cobblerfone
Looks to me like he is struggling to come up with a suitable fakeclaim after claiming a role he didn't have.
OK. Since some of you are so very very, VERY dense. I'll explain it.
Cobblerfone is fakeclaiming unrecruitable because he doesn't want to be recruited. Claiming unrecruitable in a cult game is the equivalent of a day 1 fake dayvig in any game. I'm surprised and disappointed that there aren't more people doing it. It's the correct town play.
Cobblerfone town, leave him alone. I love him to pieces, but I wouldn't recruit him myself. I wouldn't have the heart to force him to lie to people.
It's correct town play to fakeclaim?-
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Cobblerfone wrote:DrippingGoofball wrote:Cobblerfone town, leave him alone. I love him to pieces, but I wouldn't recruit him myself. I wouldn't have the heart to force him to lie to people.
<3
Bvoigt wrote:It's correct town play to fakeclaim?
I'm not saying anything one way or the other about me. But in this game it would at least draw attention away from any real unrecruitables. And with the added tast of WIFOM-sauce if a lot of recruitables claimed unrecruitable unrecruitables could claim unrecruitable, etc. Town WIFOM, it's amazin'!
It's easy for you to say this after DGB brought it up....-
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Nobody Special wrote:Fritzler wrote:I am just saying that my vote is for sale, and it is for sale to whoever will get rid of the menace that is DGB.
*shakes first*
Fritz could only hope that he could make it so no one in his glorious city would even talk to her. He had to make sure that if she ever came public with those photos, that all her credibility would be shot.
I am going to address this tomorrow. Stay tuned. But I very much expect you to hold up your end of the bargain. Do we have a deal?
In other news, I have fully caught up, and I see no reason to move my vote. I'm quite happy with where it is currently.
If I have happened to have missed any questions aimed at me, please do ask me again.
Nothing new to say? What do you think of Cobblerfone?-
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populartajo wrote:tanarin, how does claiming unrecruitable help cobblerfone cult?
He tried to use it as an explanation to explain some earlier, scummy play.
Cobblerfone wrote:xvart wrote:Your first statement makes me believe that you would have recruited a doctor name role on the off chance that he would actually be a doctor; otherwise you are saying that you would have recruited him just because he had doctor in his name... Then you go on to say that you were trying to avoid lynching a potential PR, which your previously suggested is who you would have recruited. If the recruiters are behaving in the same manner that you are you should be lynching that person. And, your bail on that wagon makes no sense because you wanted to avoid lynching a potential PR so why did you jump on that wagon to begin with. You are obviously trying to sneak onto whatever wagon you can without making waves and then when you do make waves change your story.
I know the role I have. I was halfway sure that all teamsters might've had it too. To explain in short: I'm unrecruitable. The scum will have to lynch or kill me. That's the difference that made me not want to lynch you.-
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ThAdmiral wrote:bvoigt wrote:ThAdmiral wrote:I just can't see cobbler being a recruit, especially since he claimed what he claimed.
Did you really think his claim was believable?
I think thats sort of the point. It's so unbelievable I doubt scum would claim it.
Imo he's town telling the truth but presenting it in a very awkward way, or town lying about his role.
Is Cobbler lying about his role as town a more likely scenario than him being scum? I can definitely see newbie scum making a claim the way he did.-
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Porochaz wrote:populartajo wrote:why are we talkign about vigging dgb??
she is townier than town
NS dont be dumb
we should lynch from this pool of suspects: yosarian, spring, hero, tanarin
Yes, yes, dont see it, no.
try Lady Lambda, who has not really posted much likable since she joined.
What's your read on Yosarian?-
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Porochaz wrote:Post edit: Where did I say no to a lynch on yos?
Here, if I understood correctly.
Porochaz wrote:populartajo wrote:why are we talkign about vigging dgb??
she is townier than town
NS dont be dumb
we should lynch from this pool of suspects: yosarian, spring, hero, tanarin
Yes, yes, dont see it, no.
try Lady Lambda, who has not really posted much likable since she joined.-
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springlullaby wrote:Yosarian2 wrote:LL: IF I were you, I'd ignore it. We already know Kinetic is scum; if he talks about actual game related stuff, it could work to our advantage, but if we let him distract the town into a pointless side conversation that slows us down, worsens the signal/noise ratio, and waste valuable time, it only helps him and hurts us. Kinetic is smart, he doesn't do anything without a reason, and this is probably a gambit. It looks like he's trying to bait you for tactical reasons, trying to make you mad and keep you talking about non-game-related stuff to make you look worse, to both stall and confuse the town and probably make you easier to lynch. Don't fall for it.
In related news, I am pretty convinced now that at least Kinetic did not recruit Lady Lambdadelta. Baiting your lone cult recruit like that, making them more visible, would be terrible play; and I also don't think LL would get this angry at her cult recruiter, and, no offense, but I don't think she's probably the kind of player who's willing or able to fake that kind of anger. That doesn't prove she's town, of course, but it lowers the odds of her being scum.
This pings hard. It smells of buddying up while trying not to be obvious by adding a light playstyle berating to the mix, and while still leaving open the option that LL might still be scum. It's just not straightforward.
VOTE YOS
I disagree. He saw that Kinetic-LLD interactions made them an unlikely scumteam, but she could be Albert's recruit. So I think Yos's post was reasonable, even if it did leave options open.-
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Looking through Tanarin's ISO, he's had several sheepy votes. Cobblerfone, Yos, Porochaz, and now ThAd. Assuming one recruit per team, though, I'd say he's still probably town.
Cobblerfone wrote:There's got to be some kind of ulterior motive in this switch of tallying. Whether it's to get the person YOU think is the most scummy lynched, ora theoretical scumbuddyinto safety.
Does this really make sense? Both versions of his list had Chronopie at the top. Also, notice the bolded.
Cobblerfone wrote:Most of us are assuming that there's only one lynchable scum per team.
UNVOTE: xvart
VOTE: Cobblerfone
Maybe we don't have time for this, but I'll switch back if necessary.-
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Battousai wrote:bv- Tell me why, absent of deadline, why xvart is the best lynch choice (out of everyone). The reason being is that tomorrow, all scum have to do is say "Duh, we needed a lynch so I had to vote!"
xvart isn't the best lynch choice; Cobbler is, but he isn't going to be lynched today. And scum can say that because they really were doing the pro-town thing.
As for why I prefer xvart: when DGB voted him early in the game, he misrepped her case in ISO #4, saying that it was based on a timestamp when he knew it wasn't. Then, he voted Cobblerfone in ISO #8, and was still suspicious in ISO #21. But Cobbler was nowhere to be found in his list of top 3 suspects. In fact, he wasn't even on xvart's vig list in ISO #29.-
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xvart wrote:bvoigt, 1151 wrote:As for why I prefer xvart: when DGB voted him early in the game, he misrepped her case in ISO #4, saying that it was based on a timestamp when he knew it wasn't.1Then, he voted Cobblerfone in ISO #8, and was still suspicious in ISO #212. But Cobbler was nowhere to be found in his list of top 3 suspects. In fact, he wasn't even on xvart's vig list in ISO #293.
1You are bringing this up again? I clearly explained this when you brought it up 38 pages ago? Even if it wasn't obvious at the time (which it should have been) my follow up explanation is perfectly reasonable: DGB narrowed a pool to people likely to be recruited and selected mebecause of a timestamp. If you didn't buy my explanation or see the fundamental reasoning behind my comment when I responded way back when why did you hold onto until a day before the deadline.
Battousai asked for my reasons for voting you. It's one of my reasons.
xvart wrote:2Taken out of context. I now believe Cobbler is who he claims to be. The progression of his questioning me, withholding his vote, and then when I voted for him it made him believe that our job titles were not the same, thus him being unrecruitable.
3See above.
Sorry, I don't get what you mean with the second-to-last sentence. Could you clarify? Also, what made you decide I'm scummy? I wasn't on your first vig list, but now I am.
xvart wrote:For someone who hasn't said much at all the entire game you sure waited until the last minute to bust out the big accusations.
xvart wrote:Are you surprised to see that your lead wagon is having a tough time reaching the lynch threshold when most of the people on the wagon are about as active as you are? :shocked: See you in a couple days for your next one liner.
Actually, I've been doing my best to get Cobbler lynched. That's irrelevant, though. For someone who "will wear this lynch as a badge of honor," you seem pretty concerned about attacking the members of your wagon.-
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xvart wrote:bvoigt, 1178 wrote:Sorry, I don't get what you mean with the second-to-last sentence. Could you clarify?
Yes, my response was a little convoluted. Basically, as has been discussed, Cobbler withholding his vote on me and the manner in which his posts came forward show that he was under the impression that I might have been unrecruitable, too. When I voted him, from his perspective, I didn't think the same of him and his role. So then he voted for me.
But he voted for you just before ISO #9. You continued to make a case on him in ISO #11, and kept your vote on him for a while after that.
xvart wrote:bvoigt, 1178 wrote:Also, what made you decide I'm scummy? I wasn't on your first vig list, but now I am.
When I was responding to your last post and went back through your ISO I realized how you haven't really taken any stands, been very involved, and been very active; so therefore you fell into the category of people playing like a recruit likely is playing.
I guess that's reasonable.
xvart wrote:bvoigt, 1178 wrote:For someone who "will wear this lynch as a badge of honor," you seem pretty concerned about attacking the members of your wagon.
Yes; if and when I get lynched I will; but that doesn't mean I assume my lynch is a forgone conclusion and therefore have not resigned my fate. Look at my wagon. How would classify your counterparts on my wagon?
The Chronopie wagon contains just as many questionables or lurkers: xvart, Cobblerfone, Seraphim (until he switched), Magister Ludi, and Zdenek. And I have more town reads on your wagon: Yosarian2, ThAdmiral, DrippingGoofball (although she switched now), Nobody Special, and Lady Lambdadelta.
xvart wrote:bvoigt, 1179 wrote:Also, if isn't voting either xvart or Chronopie, you need to switch to one of them.
What a helpful post since this has been said ad naseum in the last few pages.
People aren't getting it; we have at least five useless votes out there.
DrippingGoofball wrote:You're not cult. I have to find another victim.
Can you explain?-
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ooba wrote:"I know one of abr's recruits (X) due to my ability"
"Tell me who, not your ability""Tell me who X targetted, not his ability"
But the "not his ability" part would imply that he knew the ability.
Magister Ludi wrote:That plan looks flawed from the start (does It matter which of Kinetic or ABR recruited someone)
So I'm infering right now you have no particular opinion on who may have been recruited night one?
What makes it flawed? IIRC, you were the one who was most willing to trust speculation on who was recruited.-
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DrippingGoofball wrote:bvoigt wrote:@DGB: Was your plan to ask, who would have recruited you? Or,who would you have recruited?
Ludi, does this change your opinion of DGB? You said, "How is it helpful if anyone states they think the most likely cult recruiter to recruit them would be (insert Kinetic or ABR)?" Now we've learned that isn't what she was asking.
populartajo wrote:FTR, MY REASON HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH KINETIC
SECRET SCUMTELL FROM DGB
Secret scumtell?
Magister Ludi wrote:We already know the cult recruiters aren't trying to help town, only trying to further their own ends. (I'm not even basing my vote off Kinetics comment, and I dont think anyone but yourself on your wagon is)
We dont need town players to die for us to realize the cult recruiters are playing to their win condition.
Self-voting as town is just horrible. With double cult. And as a potential 'power role'.
I can only consider you cult.
But it doesn't make sense for cult to vote themselves, either. It's just bad play, no matter what your alignment is.
DrippingGoofball wrote:Why would Kinetic think that. I realize this is going to sound scummy as all heck, but maybe I wasprotectedfrom being culted last night as per my explicit request, and failing to recruit me, Kinetic thinks it's because ABR did. In this context, Kinetic's actions make sense, but even I, proposing this, would estimate the chances of this having happened assignificantlyless than 5%.
This explanation actually makes sense, IMO.
Bunnylover wrote:@Claim from Yos: It really doesn't matter if Yos claims or not. From this point on, unless a person is recuritable or a commuter or a hider, it doesn't matter what their role is. If they are culted, they have a fake claim which would be their town role.
But if he claims, it gives the cult more information about what they're up against, and about whether or not they'd want to recruit him.-
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DGB has a point about Magister Ludi, but I still want a Cobbler lynch. Reminder: when he claimed unrecruitable, I asked for the flavor name (not flavor reason). This would be a word or phrase in bold, and would not indicate any other powers. He refused. This makes me believe that he's lying about his role. What do you guys think?-
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DrippingGoofball wrote:bvoigt wrote:DGB has a point about Magister Ludi, but I still want a Cobbler lynch. Reminder: when he claimed unrecruitable, I asked for the flavor name (not flavor reason). This would be a word or phrase in bold, and would not indicate any other powers. He refused. This makes me believe that he's lying about his role. What do you guys think?
That un-recruitable thing is a fakeclaim, come on.
Exactly.
Herodotus wrote:The following six people should each state which of them are most likely to have been recruited:
Bvoight, Fritzler, Flameaxe, Ooba, Porochaz, Populartajo
Do you mean from a cult perspective, or based on their play so far today?-
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Herodotus wrote:The following six people should each state which of them are most likely to have been recruited:
Bvoight, Fritzler, Flameaxe, Ooba, Porochaz, Populartajo
Fritzler, then Flameaxe and ooba. Porochaz came under some suspicion yesterday, and I just can't see populartajo as scum with the way he's playing right now.-
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Cobblerfone wrote:bvoigt wrote:@Cobbler: What do you mean, your "unrecruitableness is unsure"?
It means I asked Mr. Flay if I was unrecruitable. He said he couldn't answer. (paraphrased of coursed) Therefore, I assumed I was unrecruitable and still do.
So it didnotsay you were unrecruitable in your role PM?-
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Cobblerfone wrote:bvoigt wrote:So it did not say you were unrecruitable in your role PM?
No it didn't. Not outright, I simply guessed because of the wording. For the timeframe, let's see, I think I asked Mr. Flay at around the same time that RaudhrGarm soft-claimed to be vanilla.
It really didn't seem like you were saying that yesterday.
Cobblerfone wrote:Let me last at least one night. If I'm scum the other scum will kill me anyway. From what I understand if the recruiters try to recruit an unrecruitable or another scum, the recruitment becomes a kill. I only read up to where Seraphim got replaced out in Succession I. I'll read the end to find out if it's explained there. (and assuming similiar mechanics.)
"From what you understand"? Why would you make this kind of speculation when you don't even know you're unrecruitable yourself?-
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bvoigt Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2256
- Joined: September 18, 2010
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bvoigt Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2256
- Joined: September 18, 2010
Cobblerfone wrote:If I say they might stop acting suspicious.
Cobblerfone wrote:Oh yeah, I almost forgot. My suspect. It's Lady Lambadelta. She was extremely verbose on day one, and now it's almost like she's left the game. Her latest post is just a vote for me with nothing else with no explanation even though she thought I was town on day one.
LLD didn't even post between these two posts. What made you change your mind and decide to announce your suspicions?
Katsuki wrote:HOLY HELL
THOSE DGB/CR INTERACTIONS ARE TERRIBAD.
WE HAVE CULT HERE FOLKS.
VOTE: DGB
What about their interactions? I still don't find DGB scummy at all.
UNVOTE: Cobblerfone
VOTE: Porochaz-
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bvoigt Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2256
- Joined: September 18, 2010
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bvoigt Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2256
- Joined: September 18, 2010
Yosarian2 wrote:Herodotus wrote:
We're limiting the lynch to the list I arbitrarily came up with because my guilty result was on one of the people from that list.
Wait...what?
Are you saying that you are a cop with a guilty, but you aren't going to tell us who you got a guilty on?
What the heck is going on in this game? Did everyone get "must talk in overly cryptic terms" as a post restriction or something?
I might or might not have that posting restriction.
Cobblerfone wrote:Have you played with scum!Katsuki? 'cause she was scum in my most recent completed game. Add in her somewhat changed style from D1 and I'm convinced. Now, where have you been, hmm?
Yeah, LLD has played with Katsuki as scum. From what I remember, Kats was significantly more active in that game. What about her style has changed?
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