mini 2093, the search - an interminable period of darkness.

[Pine]

Jfc, ARC is going to be spammy.

VOTE: Baezu Leaf

A Boon vote is always a good vote.

[Pine]

And I have to deal with mafsepia

Oh shit, I’m so sorry...at least you can still have mafSilver on your main

[Pine]

VOTE: ARO

[Pine]

Color scheme jealousy, obv

[Pine]

Channel Fireball...hydra of CDB and Firebringer? Someone else?

[Pine]

Sure, if a scum wants to surrender I’ll trade info for wincon.

[Pine]

Assuming it doesn’t conflict with mine obv

[Pine]

Nah

In a game where there’s explicitly a bunch of weird wincons, it’s merely angle-shooting. I wish I’d thought of it first.

I think it’s pretty unlikely to come to anything, because if my wincon is anything to go by, the scum wincon is likely “scum must win AND this additional unlikely thing must happen for you to personally win”. So it’s probable that whatever they have will be voided by sharing info

Offer’s on the table tho!

[Pine]

Because Doug is a hateful name?

[Pine]

[Pine]

Reaffirming my ARO vote

Very happy with it

[Pine]

Hey guys

I’m about 90% sure Cyrus is also scum

[Pine]

Hey guys

I’m about 90% sure Cyrus is also scum

Care to elaborate?

Not at this time.

i honestly dont think any one forming reads cases or wagons this early in this type of game is town,

Among other reasons, though, this is pretty bad.

[Pine]

Cyrus didn’t want to get involved in the current discussion because he didn’t know howp

This smells like bussing a perceived liability

[Pine]

VOTE: Cyrus

[Pine]

Because I ALSO think ARO is scum

[Pine]

Don’t think I don’t see that strawman chainsaw tho

[Pine]

ARO is a solid vote, yeah.

[Pine]

ARO and Cyrus are.

[Pine]

i am! i had a busy weekend!

who is scum?

Gobble and possibly Dr. Easy Bake.

Ehhh Numbers might be scum too, with these moonlogic reads. Jury’s out though

[Pine]

He might have a guilty on you

I don’t.

I was around 60% when I posted that 90% figure, and sure enough he justified 90% in his response. I love when newscum fall for the old traps

[Pine]

Hi

Penguin Power and I were in a Neighborhood with Cyrus

Cyrus took a nibble at the “Out your buddy and we’ll help you with your wincon” bait

He named 123456789

PP’s a Jailkeeper (I don’t know how many shots) and protected me last night when Cyrus told us in twilight that the kill was coming for me, no-kill explained

VOTE: 123456789

[Pine]

Sorry I interrupted storytime

[Pine]

Hi

Penguin Power and I were in a Neighborhood with Cyrus

Cyrus took a nibble at the “Out your buddy and we’ll help you with your wincon” bait

He named 123456789

PP’s a Jailkeeper (I don’t know how many shots) and protected me last night when Cyrus told us in twilight that the kill was coming for me, no-kill explained

VOTE: 123456789

Okay. What was Cyrus' wincondition?

- Fireball.

I don’t know. Things happened too quickly. When I started going hard for him, he scumclaimed and clammed up except to threaten me

[Pine]

Yeah, why would cyrus, as mafia, leak any info to you assuming you are town?

He said he had an alternate, independent wincon.

[Pine]

Are you...are you fucking kidding me, Fireball?

It’s D2. You think I claim a semi-provable doc protect and a fake guilty with the whole game to go?

[Pine]

Um - yes, I lied about why Pine and I knew Cyrus was scum and stopping the nightkill.

Pls forgive me.

The muggles may not realize this is sarcasm, PP.

We were looking at Numbers (in addition to ARO) in our PT. Cyrus tried to dissuade us, then when he took the bait he said we were right about Numbers and wrong about ARO. That’s why I switched off of ARO and onto Cyrus. I’ll take claimed scum first, thank you.

I think Cyrus was trying to deal in good faith

[Pine]

I didnt

[Pine]

PP and I have shared wincons, but Cyrus said he had an additional wincon which was separate

[Pine]

My wincon is none of your damn business, and I haven’t lied yet

[Pine]

The only thing I’ll say about our wincon is that it is entirely compatible with Town’s. In fact, we can’t win without the Mafia being eliminated. That’s why we went for outed scum first.

[Pine]

That sounds super OP in ANYONE’s hands. Parts of it at least are probably false

PE: Because getting a +2 to lynch person lynched is ridiculously hard under any circumstances. You’d claim it to fend off attempts. Straight Loved I could see, +2 AND bulletproof AND all you have to do is survive is lolbalance

Third party at best, but probably flailing scum

[Pine]

I mean seriously, come on - that’s saying you’d need 9 votes to lynch. Assuming that you don’t self-vote, we’d need to be all but unanimous. That’s outrageous

[Pine]

That sounds super OP in ANYONE’s hands. Parts of it at least are probably false

PE: Because getting a +2 to lynch person lynched is ridiculously hard under any circumstances. You’d claim it to fend off attempts. Straight Loved I could see, +2 AND bulletproof AND all you have to do is survive is lolbalance

Third party at best, but probably flailing scum

surviving isn't as easy as it seems when there appears to be three players with a lyncher win con on me.

That is not my wincon

You’re just scum

Self-vote if you have the guts to do so

[Pine]

that puts me at risk of being lolhammered by Penguin or Pine

I'm on your wagon already.

Again - no lyncher wincon.

Same

[Pine]

To be fair, the thread’s only been open 90 minutes

[Pine]

also i think sky is scummy

Nah

[Pine]

Loved I believe, Superloved I do not. This is clearly a ruse

[Pine]

Besides...I’m not sure Loved/Superloved proves anything at all w/r/t alignment

I have what I consider a guilty

[Pine]

Not I

[Pine]

That was probably just you Elements.

You said you were JK'd by Penguin, right? I don't think that's anywhere near a guilty on me.

The Jailkeep is an inno on me, actually. Your buddy tried to trade you for a separate wincon, and I think he was playing straight.

[Pine]

cyrus: nightkill aimed at you or Pine tnight
me: shoot me!
me: *JKs 123456789*

Makes sense.

Not really

Defend the target for sure or block the possible killer...you defend the target. I told him I was fine being blocked.

[Pine]

Does CC like or dislike playing scum because they are active elsewhere and they have been generally not present in this game

ClearlyClarity was V/LA until today.

[Pine]

Hey guys

I’m about 90% sure Cyrus is also scum

Explain this

I did, and he was. He was crazy scummy in our neighborhood

Finish reading first

[Pine]

Menalque you feel scummy rn

how come?

Idk some od your posts feel agenda-y

Like what? And what agenda do you think they’re pushing?

A scum agenda. Her meaning was clear.

I’m a bit suspicious of skitter too, but I’m not a fan of trying to make something out of nothing.

[Pine]

I’m a bit suspicious of skitter too, but I’m not a fan of trying to make something out of nothing.

ok, why are you suspicious of me ?

You seem to be playing to a wincon that doesn’t align with mine

Usually, I can understand the underpinnings of a read I disagree with, even if I think the logic is bad

I’m having a difficult time parsing your motives here

Normally I’d hard-SR you for that but...this game *shrug*

There are also scummier suspects, and you and I have a history of misreading one another

[Pine]

Most of them? It’s a general impression about your approach rather than specific reads. Lately I’ve been doing a lot more macro-reading of peoples’ demeanor, motives, etc, and it’s been working gangbusters for me

[Pine]

Not an all-but-guilty

An actual guilty

PP caught something I misread, and Cyrus outright stated that Numbers was scum

The only way Numbers’ power makes sense is as scum, anyway

[Pine]

Also I’m like 9 pages behind, I’ll catch up this evening. Just going to kill right back in for now

[Pine]

Numbers at L-2

Just reminding you that flipped scum Cyrus tried to trade info on Numbers for his altwincon

[Pine]

I just don’t wanna vote there until I’ve decided I’m okay with day ending

And I don’t wanna do that until I make my mind up about if it’s beneficial to me to reveal my wincon and give my thoughts on what I think is true and what I’m feeling sceptical of

Which requires reading through D2 and deciding how fucked I think the balance of the game is

“I don’t want the day to end” is a relatively newfangled and nonsensical argument. There’s been a ton of discussion already, everyone’s checked in, and there’s a guilty on the table. Let’s go.

You look Town to me. Don’t reveal your wincon to these jackals.

The balance is very fucked.

[Pine]

VOTE: ARO

Wtf is that claim

[Pine]

Elements ~ identify the bandits (prince?)

I'm a Royal Bodyguard ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Obviously

[Pine]

At least we have a 50/50- only one of ARO/sky is scum

UNVOTE: ARO

I immediately distrust this comment

[Pine]

I think the assumption that both are scum is suspicious. There are a lot of opposed Town roles here. With a scum Neighbor, a scum survivor, and these two roles...I don’t know if it balances

That said, nothing in this game appears to balance sooo

You’ll notice I didn’t jump my vote to you...I think making that assumption is NAI, but my gut says it’s a false dichotomy

[Pine]

VOTE: ARO

Wtf is that claim

ISOing is really hard I know

[Pine]

Wait, he’s a survivor Day 4, why don’t we just kill him Day 4 if that’s the case.

This is our best chance to take Numbers down, before they whittle away at their opponents

[Pine]

Reasons

[Pine]

Nah no reason not to say

My wincon requires that I hammer scum or I can’t win

[Pine]

Given that there’s only a few scum available, and I’m competing with Penguin for hammers, and we’re one down...it’s a rarer commodity than you think

[Pine]

So no, we aren’t Numbers lynchers. But knowing that Numbers is scum, we’re zeroed in

[Pine]

@Elements and Menalque

Now that we know that Numbers is scum, is it against your wincon to see them lynched? Town and protecting scum seems incompatible

PE: The bandits

weren’t

all Town. We already figured out which of us was and got Cyrus lynched

[Pine]

Baezu/Elements, you’ve got your group wrong

The group is Empress/Guard/Guard

The scum in it is Numbers.

[Pine]

@Elements and Menalque

Now that we know that Numbers is scum, is it against your wincon to see them lynched? Town and protecting scum seems incompatible

PE: The bandits

weren’t

all Town. We already figured out which of us was and got Cyrus lynched

I don't see the point of this post. Our alt wincon is to identify the bandits up our removal from the game. Nothing about numbers.

Aren’t you Royal Guard? I thought you were protecting the Empress?

The loophole in their Super Loved status is probably having the guards vote for them

[Pine]

Baezu/Elements, you’ve got your group wrong

The group is Empress/Guard/Guard

The scum in it is Numbers.

Why

Cyrus gave up Numbers as his scumbuddy. He was looking to trade info in order to work together

[Pine]

it doesn't say anything about protecting the empress in the role PM

Hunh. Okay, I assumed based on role name

Help us lynch Numbers, and then we’ll go after whomever you want. Today is the best shot we have at Numbers, and I think you’re the loophole in the Super Loved status

You need Town to win, this is the best chance to take down the hardest-to-lynch scum

PE: Penguin and I think Cyrus was playing above board. No offense to Cyrus, but he’s too green to fool both of us

[Pine]

Baezu/Elements, you’ve got your group wrong

The group is Empress/Guard/Guard

The scum in it is Numbers.

This is already proved incorrect, isn’t it? We had a Bandit flip

What the fuck are you talking about?

There are probably three groupings

Bandits, outlaws, Empress and guards. One scum probable in each. We got the bandit, now we go after the other known scum, then we find the third, Town wins

[Pine]

Baezu/Elements, you’ve got your group wrong

The group is Empress/Guard/Guard

The scum in it is Numbers.

How do you know this is the group?

I don’t. It’s best guess

[Pine]

@Elements and Menalque

Now that we know that Numbers is scum, is it against your wincon to see them lynched? Town and protecting scum seems incompatible

PE: The bandits

weren’t

all Town. We already figured out which of us was and got Cyrus lynched

I don't see the point of this post. Our alt wincon is to identify the bandits up our removal from the game. Nothing about numbers.

Aren’t you Royal Guard? I thought you were protecting the Empress?

The loophole in their Super Loved status is probably having the guards vote for them

Our role name has nothing to do with our ability or wincon as I have stated already. Also I've been voting numbers pretty much the whole day if that was the case numbers would have already been lynched.

My guess is that the Loved status is reduced by one for every Guard voting. If that’s correct, we only ever got Numbers to L-1

[Pine]

VOTE: Channel

This is just scum then.


PE: the original post said this is confirmed to just be town/mafia

No one said otherwise

[Pine]

Baezu/Elements, you’ve got your group wrong

The group is Empress/Guard/Guard

The scum in it is Numbers.

Why

Cyrus gave up Numbers as his scumbuddy. He was looking to trade info in order to work together

But doesnt cyrus need scum to win to win? Like completing his alt wincon doesnt help him if scum lose so why i dont get why he'd give up a buddy here

^ what i meant to write; not sure what happened with the quotes

Cyrus implied that Numbers personally had to go down, as well as another condition

[Pine]

Channel is scum who tried outing a protective.

~FL

That might be true, and I’ll vote there tomorrow, but Numbers is scum today, and the odds of us taking them down diminish the more days pass

[Pine]

Baezu/Elements, you’ve got your group wrong

The group is Empress/Guard/Guard

The scum in it is Numbers.

This is already proved incorrect, isn’t it? We had a Bandit flip

What the fuck are you talking about?

There are probably three groupings

Bandits, outlaws, Empress and guards. One scum probable in each. We got the bandit, now we go after the other known scum, then we find the third, Town wins

Also thr prophet/whisperer group

Right, I forgot about that

So one of the groups is probably all Town

It isn’t Numbers, tho

[Pine]

hey pine, how many players did FL go through and hardcore in pastries?

Literally all of us, some multiple times

[Pine]

Holy shit.

Lynch 123456789.

I’ve never had basically outed scum be so difficult to lynch.

Like - I’m not even fulfilling my additional wincon here - I’m just trying to get town a win.

This 1000 times

[Pine]

Yeah unless ARO or Sky can say that the other is definitively scum, there’s actually no point in trying to parse them because it doesn’t affect anyone else’s wincon and Skitter just has to choose correctly.

I wish Pine and Penguin had answered my question, or anyone had really answered my questions but...

Sorry, there are so many posts it's hard to keep up. Please ask again.

[Pine]

I do not support this plan

You fucking fucks are throwing our best chance to actually win away, torching it, then pissing on it for good measure

[Pine]

We have a practically golden guilty on Numbers, and the majority of you are deciding that they’re just fine in your book

[Pine]

Pine you can either join us or get left behind. The choice is yours

No

We have to lynch Numbers to win, period

The longer we wait, the harder it is to do that

Today is the day

There may not be another

Because without PP and I reminding you, you’ll let them win the game in two Days

STAY ON TARGET

[Pine]

?
Um why do you think this is a thing?

I mean, so you're saying that scum is a lyncher ... on scum in order to win ?

Idk i think that's p unlikely

@ pine

The Lover/Guard spec is setup spec

It’s not a fucking lyncher role. Expand your vocabulary. Cyrus was probably some sort of Usurper - it’s not without precedent for scum to have an agenda against one another

[Pine]

Numbers said they had a flaw in their Loved status. It makes sense that the Royal Guards turning on the Empress is that flaw

It’s a straight up educated guess, but not an unreasonable one

[Pine]

Also, Numbers never got to 8 votes; they topped out at 7. The proposed Guard flaw has not been adequately tested

[Pine]

Sorry for spam but like really Pine and PP need to come clean because collectively we hold more sway than they do. Without their help we are only down 1 vote because presumably Numbers will follows town with whatever it does that isn’t killing him.

Okay, you win.

Penguin and I haven’t been lying so much as...massaging the truth. A version of it.

We were informed that 123456789 is the Empress, and e holds the Crown Jewel. Whoever possesses the Crown Jewel can *only* die by lynching. In order to win, a Bandit must fulfill their factional wincon AND possess the Crown Jewel at some point in the game. Complicating the matter is that the only way to take possession of the Crown Jewel is to hammer the lynch of the person who holds it.

When we put out the bait for scum to trade information on their team D1, Cyrus bit. Hard. He scumclaimed, and said he’d help us with our wincon by trading a scumbuddy for letting him have the Crown Jewel before we lynched him. We agreed, and he told us about Numbers being scum with him. He knew about eir extra powers, and said the only way ANY bandits were going to win was by working together. We promptly told him “Thanks but no thanks” and lynched him. Regardless of everything else, letting outed scum live wasn’t going to work. All he’d have to do is kill one of us, then it’s his word against the survivor.

PP is a 2-shot Jailkeeper. I’m a 2-shot Watcher. Our days are numbered. We can protect each other a little; Cyrus flipped on us and sent the scum NK after me, so PP had to spend a shot protecting me. Now we have to decide whether to Jail me again or have me Watch PP to catch his murderer. We’ve decided what we think scum are going to do, and will be keeping this to ourselves, thanks.

Numbers is 98% scum. I don’t think Cyrus has the guile or experience to pull one over on both PP and I, and he was talking too fast to have been coached. This is the BEST chance we have to take em down, and ALL Town wincons are dependent on it.

Numbers is the only acceptable lynch today.

[Pine]

I maintain that this is not a Lyncher role. It is an objective-based, Town-aligned scum-hunting role.

Help us achieve our wincon and we will be nigh-invincible semi-ICs.

[Pine]

your prior story was incredibly fishy

this is more believable but now i'm kinda annoyed at you two for not like ... just being upfront to begin with

why didn't you just say all of this to start ... ?

Because it sounds like a third party or lyncher role. We were trying to be subtle.

There’s also not much reason, absent the Super Loved thing, for urgency. Once that dropped, the plan we’d already set out on became a lot harder. The deeper we got into the massaged version of the story the harder it got to pull out.

PP gave me the nod to rip the bandaid off entirely. I don’t think we have anything held back now.

[Pine]

Gobble seems fine to me. Awkward start, but has been Towny since daystart.

CF I have no opinion on. I’m rather laser-focused on Numbers. The longer we wait the harder it is to remove them

[Pine]

We were informed that 123456789 is the Empress, and e holds the Crown Jewel. Whoever possesses the Crown Jewel can *only* die by lynching. In order to win, a Bandit must fulfill their factional wincon AND possess the Crown Jewel at some point in the game. Complicating the matter is that the only way to take possession of the Crown Jewel is to hammer the lynch of the person who holds it.

the first time we tried to hammer test numbers, weren't you two both early on the wagon?

That’s the hard part of our role. How do you push a wagon you don’t want to vote for?

[Pine]

your prior story was incredibly fishy

this is more believable but now i'm kinda annoyed at you two for not like ... just being upfront to begin with

why didn't you just say all of this to start ... ?

Because it sounds like a third party or lyncher role. We were trying to be subtle.

There’s also not much reason, absent the Super Loved thing, for urgency. Once that dropped, the plan we’d already set out on became a lot harder. The deeper we got into the massaged version of the story the harder it got to pull out.

PP gave me the nod to rip the bandaid off entirely. I don’t think we have anything held back now.

Why not do this immediately after Cyrus claimed scum

Like...a lot of reasons. Also, things moved quickly and our communication didn’t. There were some things (like our PRs) we held back from the PT until post-lynch so he couldn’t tell the scum Pt

[Pine]

i mean the way you went about it basically you were acting like a lyncher today @pine, which is why i didn't want much to do with it

I believe I’ve admitted to having cocked it up

[Pine]

and what's your plan after pp hammers numbers ... how do you get the crown jewel exactly?

i think this is more believable than the previous version of the story but i'm not sure i'm sold still

Well...that’s the other reason we didn’t want to be open right away. Whichever of us gets it is okay being mislynched to help the other, but that’d be strictly anti-Town from the rest of your POV

We’re kind of hoping to get it down to 1 scum and hoping you all are willing to indulge us with another ML to gain an invincible IC

[Pine]

This really is an ass wincon

[Pine]

Coming clean is tantamount to “only one of us can win at most”

[Pine]

I rather doubt Cyrus told Numbers that he was out to get em

I can’t speak to Cyrus’s motives, I just know that he scumclaimed and wanted to work together. Believe me, if I could quote our PT here you’d think he was playing straight here too

[Pine]

He explicitly said that taking out Numbers would be helping Town wincon anyway.

Hold on, I'm going to go look at the PT posts and see if I can paraphrase them any closer without getting modkilled.

[Pine]

Pine, imma be real, this still sounds a lot like bullshit

I'm good at the game, but I'm not that creative.

[Pine]

Could the solve be as simple as just all the bandits are scum?

I fucking hate bussing. You saw how long I tried to keep Chemist around in Pokemon: Ruby, despite him being a liability. I don't hardbus within 48 hours like this, and neither does PP.

[Pine]

Also you did bus in that game

If you were thinking of blowing up your bussing meta why would you not do it here if you think it would give you the win?

Esp when Cyrus is the type of player who’s liable to be/become a liability anyway

Look, either PP or I or more likely both of us are going to die, either by NK or by lynching to pass the crown. The flip will disprove the bandit=scum theory. Also why the fuck would we claim our roles at all if we were scum? Easier to just stay hidden.

I've been looking over the PT. Unfortunately, Cyrus was very terse and direct, paraphrasing him is difficult without directly quoting.

What makes me think he was playing straight is how rapid-fire and matter-of-fact it is. He knew he had to take out Numbers, he knew we had to take him out, so he didn't care about all that. He at one point offered to "spy on" the scum PT for us, and when we turned on him started making threats like turning the NK on us, and saying he was our only link to scum.

The part about Numbers was a little confusing - his grammar and spelling leave a lot to be desired. The tidbit which is particularly interesting is that he said there would be no nightkill if we took down Numbers, which I just realized contains inverted elements of the Beloved Princess role, which fits a scum Empress. Cyrus *definitely* doesn't come up with that on his own, and it takes someone old and creative like EP to even think of it.

The more I think of it, that last part is the nail in the WIFOM coffin. He wasn't lying.

[Pine]

Pine/PP, what happens if the player with the Crown jewel gets modkilled? What happens if a non-bandit gets the Crown Jewel?

No idea w/r/t modkill, I'll ask in our PT. The CJ might function for someone else, I don't know.

[Pine]

Lynch numbers - If town we lynch Pine
- If scum lynch CF

Lynch Pine - If Sum we lynch PP - presumably game
- If town PP is now immortal IC

That's 2 days so 4 deaths, worst case scenario numbers and pine are both town in which case we have an immortal IC in a 6v2 situation.

Idk I still kinda like CF for scum

Also I’d rather swap pine/PP if we do go that route

I support either version of this plan. I’m not afraid to die for the cause

[Pine]

Ugh I hate mechanics

I think I could prob get behind a numbers lynch if getting the Jewel thingy doesn’t lead to a win for pine/PP due to one being unlynchable in the case that they are scum

I need to actually think about the mechanics tho and that’s something I’m not gonna do until layer

The Crown Jewel makes one bulletproof, not unlynchable. Unlynchable would just be bad game design

[Pine]

Why do I have this ominous feeling that if the bandits get the loot then they win and the rest of town loses?

We don’t.

It says right in the ruleset that players have an objective in addition to their factional wincon. We still have to eliminate scum.

Help us get the Crown Jewel and we become relentless scum terminators

[Pine]

I believe I did that already with the only change being Pine and PP have to get strung up at some point

One or the other, but we’re okay with that

[Pine]

Choooo choooo

[Pine]

VOTE: Numbers

[Pine]

UNVOTE:

[Pine]

VOTE: Numbers

That should be 8. If Numbers was telling the truth, it should be hammer

[Pine]

I thought he needed 9 to be hammered - day hasn't cycled yet

Did e say the day needed to cycle?

Need one more

[Pine]

I’m here

[Pine]

How about I use my Watcher power on you, Baezu Leaf? We’ll nail anyone who tries to kill you

[Pine]

Fucking fuck, ARO

Just in case

VOTE: 123456789

[Pine]

Yeah ARO just scumclaimed. Now PP and I have to fight for the Crown

I feel like PP and I deserve a spiritual win here for causing the entire scum team to implode

[Pine]

@Mod: Serious question - can PP and I win together due to our cooperation and extreme scum sour grapes? The bandits retire peacefully and share the spoils of victory!

[Pine]

Yeah ARO just scumclaimed. Now PP and I have to fight for the Crown

I feel like PP and I deserve a spiritual win here for causing the entire scum team to implode

I will sheep you in every game forever

That’s not a winning strategy. I’m on a hot streak, but I’m usually less than one standard deviation above average.

[Pine]

i guess now we should just be trying to get as many wincons as possible?

Shit, I was hoping PP would survive to endgame. We agreed to help as many people as possible get their wincon

I still need to hammer ARO, let’s coordinate so they don’t fuck us again

Mass wincon claim, go

I need Town to win, and must hammer ARO

[Pine]

That seems a safe bet, though not guaranteed

Sorry, I don’t have any advice for making the right choice. I don’t know if Town would be a false prophet though

[Pine]

Who cares

DEB is telling the truth, is Town, and wins at end of day

Or DEB is lying, is Town, does not get help with wincon, and perhaps loses

Or DEB is lying, is scum, and gets lynched tomorrow and loses

So again...who cares?

[Pine]

Hmmm

Could be third party

[Pine]

In that case CF is lying and there is no outlaw, CF is just scum.

I rolecopped him last night and found out his role is that of bounty hunter

If CF has been lying, they’ve lost their right to wincon assistance.

Has everyone made their claim?

[Pine]

- The setup consists of only two factions: town and mafia.

Good call

[Pine]

Yeah. Town wins, we’re just hashing out individual wincons

I’m working, can someone compile a claims list?

[Pine]

ARO is town, and that’s proven with a CF flip.

ScumCF targeted ARO, and had no recollection of numbers.

Aro is town, CF is scum.

CF today.

~FL

...Are you fucking kidding me? ARO is literally modconfirmed scum.

[Pine]

ARO is town, and that’s proven with a CF flip.

ScumCF targeted ARO, and had no recollection of numbers.

Aro is town, CF is scum.

CF today.

~FL

...Are you fucking kidding me? ARO is literally modconfirmed scum.

FL r u high

If so, paranoia is a sign of a bad trip

[Pine]

- The setup consists of only two factions: town and mafia.

What's your point? Bandits are NAI. Peep the dead list.

She was refuting my third party spec

[Pine]

ARO kills Pine tonight if we don’t kill ARO. I would like at least 1 of Pine and PP to get a full win since they solved this game for us.

Like...for real

Sorry, Baezu Leaf, but if it’s you or me...

[Pine]

ARO kills Pine tonight if we don’t kill ARO. I would like at least 1 of Pine and PP to get a full win since they solved this game for us.

Like...for real

Sorry, Baezu Leaf, but if it’s you or me...

[Pine]

I think we’re ready to take this to it’s conclusion.

There are three votes on ARO, it’s 6 to lynch. I’ll check regularly all day, please let me hammer

[Pine]

That’s 4, I’m ready now Menalque

[Pine]

<3 EP

Not your fault

[Pine]

I am now.

I’ll check every 3-5 minutes for the next half hour

[Pine]

VOTE: ARO

Lyncher win

[Pine]

VOTE: ARO

Lyncher win

J/K

Wincon is as stated

GG all. Spiritual win for all of Town in my book.

Be it here known that I wish to inter the Crown Jewel in the tomb of my brother, PenguinPower, akin to the honors given to Thorin Oakenshield, laid to rest with the Arkenstone of Thrane

[Pine]

Thrain*

[Pine]

I actually liked this game very much

Very sorry for chennisden...he’s a great player but he just got tilted

Frankly, that’s not a valid excuse.

[Pine]

EP the setup could’ve used some polish, but it was otherwise fine. This was advertised as a bastard game with some wincons difficult to achieve. Anyone who didn’t heed those warnings needs to blame themselves.

I think the moderator decisions during the game were as reasonable and humane as possible in a tough situation when you had players behaving as they did.

PenguinPower deserves the win here

[Pine]

I’m nominating this setup for Mad Scientist (Best New Mechanic).

I know, it wasn’t balanced. Boo hoo - I dealt with it, and was prepared to nominate it even if I lost.

Mad Scientist doesn’t honor balance - it honors creativity and innovation, considering how the basic game of Mafia was changed and adapted. This game involved not one or two innovative mechanics, but numerous. The bandits against the Empress and Bodygurds, Outlaw vs Bounty Hunter, Prophet and Priest against Whisperers...all of these are interesting twists which would have formed the centerpiece of a more mundane setup. The meta innovation of each player having an individual wincon on top of a factional wincon also contributes to the body of knowledge for future games.

Yes, we broke the setup. Yes, the balance could have been better. But the setup was original, creative, and downright fun to play. EP deserves Scummy consideration.

[Pine]

I agree with pine, and he said it more eloquently than i could

...that was eloquent? I stopped just short of using the word “butthurt”

[Pine]

I have already mentioned that I would strongly prefer this game not be nominated for its design.

Edit: to clarify, if I have the power to pull it from consideration in response to you nominating it, I will do so.

Edit 2: to clarify further, this is not me implicitly agreeing with Channel Fireball. I personally believe I have more than adequately responded to their specific complaint(s). But yes, I firmly believe this setup does not deserve recognition.

Very well, then. Suffice it to say that I personally appreciate the thought, effort, and creativity that went into this concept. Ignore the bullshit (like “the entire scumteam quit” - no they didn’t, one had a tantrum after two went down swinging).

Keep making fun games, and I’ll keep eagerly playing them.