[Standard]Survivor: TRTWIUAA {Final Tribal Council}

[Bellaphant]

Bellaphant #3402

[Bellaphant]

Monty kindest!

[Bellaphant]

Discord seems to be having issues

[Bellaphant]

i'll be on icq if anyone needs me.

M/irc surely?

Or, you know, post on my MySpace.

[Bellaphant]

Pants is just really good at the tactical suck

[Bellaphant]

Merry Christmas guys

[Bellaphant]

When i was playing, kilby was a current high scorer.

[Bellaphant]

Hi ent,

Definitely your vote, sadly. Not because of the end result (I actually think that round and the round or so before it we'd started to become personally closer and connect to each other, even if just over a shared geeky interest in video games and hobbits).

It was because I went against a reactive play. I was upset, I felt left out, I felt 'on the bottom' in a way that was a fairly new feeling within the game. It would have been really easy to commit to working with you 'til endgame, voting out het and Zor...but I feel that always runs into a time where I'm suddenly noones top priority - I know you had fairly good relationships with Radja and DV, and I think handling myself well that round is definitely the place where I made choices that progressed my game.

....I'm also thrilled I won the f4 challenge. I don't think I'd be here without it, and I spent a long time and a lot of maths to make sure I won.

[Bellaphant]

DK, I'll come back to you when it's not 4am if you have any specific questions in the meantime, please let me know.

[Bellaphant]

Hi hash,

That's a really interesting question - I think initially I was so frustrated because I saw you and Zor out there 'doing things' and because of the structure of the averages for challenges, etc, I was stuck at my two TCS doing -nothing-.


I met you in the chemist vote and immediately realised you were already used to getting your way - my suggested list of four votes was very quickly narrowed down to 1, and I was unhappy with how you seemed to present Utah as the next obvious vote.


I think we both used distancing a lot on that pre merge tribe, to counter this idea that we were each others endgame, but for me that blurred way too much into reality with the pj conversation. From there I had to consider you not only a 'threat', but a threat to me. In hindsight some of this was probably stoked by people like het, who benefited from you not being my number one. Coming into merge though, I knew I needed more options and I felt some real intransigence from you around the DV push. (Your pitch of 'everyont left would be my friend' without considering how many people weren't -my- friend just confirmed what I was already thinking)

As to timing, part of it was very intentional. I had a chat with het before the pj vote about why voting you out then was a bad idea - it changes the game for like, 16 other people at that point and elevated my threat level beyond anything I was comfy with going into merge.

The first few rounds of merge it made sense to work together to remove some threats to my game, but your push on DV gave me the ammo I needed to convince people that we couldn't wait - it just happened you'd decided to 1v1 him!

Personally it felt better to work with zor, who had similar 'threat' level but who had commited to working with me til the end, but was also not an obvious relationship for me to have - it gave me more wiggle room and I was able to stop looking over my shoulder at you!

[Bellaphant]

Hi menno,



You and Radja were by far the people who'd social relationships I handled badly this game. With you I think I got into my head a bit - I felt early on that we approached this game very differently and we were looking for different things. I should've been more upfront with you about the little things, like making you our challenge hero that round.

It's not just because we had different friends - if we take away the game some of my best conversations were with pj - but that didn't help, especially in the mid game when the cabal stuff was getting me down.

I think there's a word in which I say 'fuck it' and we wreak havoc together. But that would have involved me giving my head a wobble and also trying harder to do those things that build.trust - the smal talk, the sharing of jokes, etc. That never felt organic with you and it definitely stopped us progressing in the game together. It's probably about 60% my fault as I let it happen and then got comfy with it being the status quo.

[Bellaphant]

Menno, noone was more surprised than me when I won that one! I did my best but my best was average against people like you and scoots! Sometimes immunity isn't about winning, it's about someone else not winning, so I never skipped a challenge and always tried my best, even in blind hope - one answer different on the coin game and o have that too!

[Bellaphant]

Hash, the structure of the game often frustrated me, from challenges u was mediocre at to how they were scored - pre merge there want much for me to do apart from deepen relationships with people. My swaps also didn't have masses of variety - I was with some combination of pants scoots DV menno and pj a lot. Even when we did try to throw a challenge, one of the few times the way scoring working allowed us to, someone else threw harder!


However, the game shouldn't be just about who was on a tribe with who, and I think I managed the swapping element well by making those later and deeper connections - with zor at merge, with het from the first time I met him, people I didn't have an established working relationship with.

I wish id changed one thing about a structural element - the game would've been very different if pj had gone instead of bro at the joint TC.

However, this is where another structure element came into play - the deadlines. In a normal ms lsg, some of these votes are different - pj goes a lot earlier, Radja possibly goes instead of Lexi, etc. Using that time period to feel people out but also to make clearer plans about 'what next' was a skill I felt I developed this game. It also made my time zone less of a disadvantage - I was able to talk about votes early.

Even in the merge, the double immunity became an obstacle to work around .I knew when it was announced that the people o considered my core (me het vash) wouldn't all get through unscathed. That one I just had to ride out.

I meant what I said in brackets though - I won key immunities, I handled the button push situation in such a way that people were happy to share their responses with me (indo that zor, for example, didn't have) , I dealt with what was for me a surprise f3 by convincing people around me, especially zor, to do something that was beneficial for my game (voting out DV. I'm not remotely ashamed to say I'd lose votes to him), when really he should've made a different choice.

The structure of the game felt very confining at times, but I think I did what I could to use it to my advantage.

[Bellaphant]

Radja,

As I said to menno, I didn't do well socially with you. I feel I made it clear it the first tribe that we weren't connecting like I wanted and I felt at arms lengthy from you - you responded by chatting me up! Which, I did enjoy, but it did make me feel like I was only ever an option to you. Later in the game I felt I did try to reach out to you, but things like being your damsel in distress felt like platitudes and I really struggled to connect. I should have made how I felt more obvious - maybe to you there was nothing wrong but I needed to feel like we trusted each other within the game.

We also had issues about being online at the same time -;we missed some fairly crucial early conversation. I didn't know how strongly you felt about vash until he was gone, for example.

In the merge it felt like you had other friends and other plans, and I don't know how much I was in them. It made it hard to be vulnerable with you.

I let myself make too many assumptions about you. If you wanna chat to me about some of them, please do.

[Bellaphant]

Vash, back to you when it isn't...6am.

[Bellaphant]

Also, menno, I meant to add last night - I loved watching you in Equestria and you were like, the highlight of the jury for me, so I should have tried harder to get to know that side of you. I did enjoy our chat about reality TV and your name!

[Bellaphant]

Testing.

[Bellaphant]

Something in my response to dk is getting me an error. I'll have to wait til I'm on my pc

[Bellaphant]

Ok, so things about DK:

Firstly, you have a truly great personality. I felt like I got on with you from our very first chat. I said that you felt reasonable and made me giggle, which was entirely true, and I think I amused you too. Straight away I liked your vibe and your approach to the game – to work with PJ as much as it benefited you, but also to distance yourself slightly from the crazy. You took my jokes well and were able to see the best in things, like offhand comments I’d made about you.

You said you made friends easily in ORGs and I can see why. We both found our significant others through ORG communities. We found other similarities in crime thrillers, computer games and some board games: I still need to play Secret Hitler. I like games more than you but we both appreciate the mental downtime something like Tropico brings. I think you get on better with your boyfriend’s family than I do mine! You also went to Animal Kingdom, and I’m so jealous. I know you bar-tend sometimes and are studying Law/the LSAT? (Tbf my knowledge of this comes from Legally Blonde).

However, I don’t think that’s quite what you wanted – regurgitated facts. I want to talk to you about the thing I think we’re similar in: hearing people talk about you and coming into the game with a reputation. And I know the reputation is important to you in some ways – going to the mods to show logs with Ent is a really honourable thing to do. At the start of merge I wasn’t against you at all – you were a bit of an unknown, a wildcard to me. And I saw a lot of similarities between us in how we dealt with rumours – you seemed to quickly decide to go with your gut and your friends, rather than conspiracy theories. You are also fairly straight up and blunt, especially about gameplay decisions, which I admire and I’ve tried to do too We also had the same response to inactive vets


We got pitched against each other on your vote, which was frustrating to me: I logged on late and was told ‘this is where the numbers are’. You were also built up as a big threat – you undersold the impact you were having on the game, whether because you couldn’t see it or because other stories were shouting louder. You take the game as personally as I do, but your frustration seems to go outward, where mine goes inward. I know it means a lot to you, and that’s something I truly recognise and believe in: I didn’t think I had a shot at earning your vote, but I respect you enough to jump through hoops. I think you’d be a great addition to the community – you are full of sass and personality and I’m really pleased you considered staying enough to sign up to mod a game. I also got the feeling loyalty and trust were important – I didn’t go sharing our last conversation anywhere after I promised. I get the feeling promises are important to you.

I also think you are cooler than me. I didn’t recognise your leaving post!

[Bellaphant]

'Bella, you're great and I adore you. Of the finalists you are the only one who didn't turn their back on me, even to the point of casting a protest vote. Everyone always called you a threat and yet here you are, I have every reason to vote for you. But if you want to win this game, I and everyone else need to know, in detail, what was your strategy, did you just ride your own hype wave to the end? did you make moves that people barely noticed but were key to your survival? Did you strategically choose not to do things? It sounds like the last of those based on your opening and if so, well, it certainly needs expanding on why it was necessary beyond the blurb you have.'

Ditto. You made the game a better place and again, you going home made me cry. I understand that people want more detail, but I didn't want to bore people.

I hope everyone knows I'm not a 'ride my own hype wave' sort of person. I find it difficult to sit here and tell you all how great I am. People knowing my name, in some cases before I'd met them, and having formed an impression of me (such as Entreri) was something to work against. And it was a strategic choice, as well as a structurally imposed one, to play a middle of the road game - I wasn't suggesting 6 person alliances on an 8 person tribe (PJ), but I was being totally straight with my allies and doing things like telling them 'there is a proposed group, you aren't in it and that makes me uncomfortable'. This led to people knowing that I'd be upfront and have their back.

I believe it was the second option: little moves, little decisions. Choosing to work with a majority, but also making sure the people closest to me had options: I remember two conversations wit DV specifically where I discussed ' I could get my own way if I was a dick here, but going with the majority is fine' - I was very rarely in a place where one of the options I had in front of me were bad, so choosing to go with what more people wanted was important to keep those relationships postive down the line. (Specifically, formerfish over lld and not going after Brom).

I was also consistently making sure to always be in a majority group - And to help be a focus around which those majorities could form. For example, pants and brom and scoots and you and dv would always have been safe in that tribe and I feel I did a lot to grease the wheels there. It was also things like making a group chat to share information about idol speculation: I knew I had the most info and I knew I would been seen as more valuabe, trusted and trusting by sharing. Setting up that group chat full of big threats was also incredible useful and allowed me to deepen strategic relationships with you, het and Haschel.

Being open meant I could also have those important conversations - how worried I was about Haschel, how 'he might go for anyone', how frustrated I was about my social interactions with Radja, etc. Occasionally I did let my relationships outweigh my strategic game - realistically I don't think I was in your end-game plans, but everyone knew I didn't want you to go.

I think of a lot of my strategy game at merge, and it was about managing perceived threat level, while getting votes that worked well for me. With the amount of majority votes in the merge, I don't think anyone can claim to have planned and directed a large proportion of them. That doesn't mean I did nothing though - the one thing I didn't do was cruise through the merge - I had to be honest with Zor and Scoots when DK tried to sell me out to them (this only worked as I'd been updating zor on the early conversation as it went) in order to keep that momentum shifting to me. It meant I had a constant eye on the numbers - a lot of people went into merge worried that those perceived as 'weaker' would continue to progress and become more and more attractive options for endgame the closer we got too ftc. These were also some of the people who I didn't have as strong relationships with. I went to a few of the players I saw as stronger (you, het, zor) and explained how much I didn't want this to be the case at endgame - I believe that steered some of the early votes.

Having options was always important to me, but so was being able to persuade people to my way of thinking: Zor offered to vote het with me the entreri round, as I'd convinced him of his threat level, Dv voted Radja over Scoots largely because of our existing social relationships, Zor managed to mess DV around for 48 hours dangling FTC in front of him until he made the play that I think was better for my game - eliminating DV, someone who's votes I felt we'd each canabalise, giving Zor an easier path, and keeping Scoots. These moves weren't flashy, and the didn't involve hundreds of people - they relied on one to one connections and being able to sell people on the things I wanted being the things they should want. I had the relationships and had diminished my threat level well enough that by the f8 twist, I wasn't in anyone's firing line. After that, I got what I wanted, consistently - I was the swing vote in the Ent vote, Radja went next, I'd set Het up as the one person we should all be worried about and I knew I couldn't win over DV.

Let me know if there's more you want from me.

[Bellaphant]

'Bella, in the final 4 vote, was Zoraster on the table for you as an option to vote out? If not, was it more because of the f2 deal with him or more because you stood a better chance against him than against DV? Was Scoots ever an option?'

Hi het,

Not really. For two reasons - early in the merge (earlier for you, I told you you were a winner about five minutes after I met you) I identified him and you as people playing really strong games that were really different to mine. I knew then that I wanted to go to the end with one of you - I believed that the jury would be looking for different things in the game, and votes Zor could get were votes I wouldn't, and vice versa. I was also pretty confident I'd get more of them: I truly believe I've played the best game of the FTC, in terms of managing a path to endgame, navigating threat and making relationships that mattered. Although Zor says he played up some of the robotic elements, he also does lean in to them: about 15 mins after I joked that Zor had been keeping a Spreadsheet for the final challenge, he sent it to me. I believe I can read people well, and although I wasn't expecting the amount of words he's given, the content is about what I expected: good, but different to mine. The f2 deal...I know he had a lot of those, as a lot of us do, but it wasn't the deciding factor.

I felt DV's content would be too similar, his game too similar, his strengths overlapping mine. Although I had a few doubts - there were votes I could point to in the late merge where my will definitely prevailed over his, I realised that even though I could point to these 'errors' in his game, I couldn't point to anything in Scoots'. I may just know his game less. But Scoots was never an option, as I realised that in the same way DV would split my votes, Zor's game outshone Scoots - they made a lot of similar moves, but Zor was always going to portray himself as an uber-marionette type figure. It's why I'm proud of the challenge win and proud of getting the f3 I wanted.

[Bellaphant]

Ent - if het goes, I believe I go soon after and FTC prolly looks something like.... you, Radja and probably scoots. Being able to draft out what was ahead if I changed course was really Important in my decision making process.

Tbf radja's behaviour worried me that round a lot too - he told het he was begging me to vote you over het (he wasn't) and that also confirmed it wasn't a safe path

DK, I felt like you wanted to get the names of 'people' who had led your vote and you went straight to those people once I'd mentioned your name. It made me hesitate to continue exploring what happened if you weren't the vote here. It may not have been 'selling me out' but I felt it was indicative of reactionary play. Does that make sense?

[Bellaphant]

That's fair too. <3.

[Bellaphant]

I didn't. I spent that round frustrated and confused and also mostly Criss at zor. It wasn't til afterwards that radja shared his real feelings about you. Like I said, it was the one round I wasn't in the know

[Bellaphant]

Sorry, yes, I thought you meant before the round. I knew before DV in the round. I didn't understand how badly Radja wanted it in the round though, until after, hence the answer. I spoke with DV about breaking the news noone was moving and he said he'd do it..

[Bellaphant]

Haschel asked about rankings: although the question feels designed to highlight flaws, I'm going to be positive!

Social: Me, Zor, Scoots
This might surprise people - why is Scoots below Zor? But for me, this question is about depths of relationships and using those deep and real connections to progress. What struck me through the game, and has been confirmed in this FTC, is that a lot of Scoots' relationships worked at the same level - you can't genuinely be everyone's bff. The game, for me, is about genuinely getting to know people - anon or non anon, I love carrying 12ish people around in my head for a few months, getting to know people and deepening those bonds. I always hope to come away with new or better friendships. And to me, having a good social game (both being 'good' at it but the social game actually mattering, being worthwhile to me) means that your actions spark emotions and have consequences - and I think that's where I stand out from the other two.

It mattered to me when Vash went home, I really enjoyed talking to Entreri about Fire Emblem (Entreri had told me they found non-game related talk difficult, and I'm glad I used this to create a relationship), I feel actual regret about not taking more chances in my relationship with Menno (we probably could've had fun, even if the game outcomes didn't change massively). I made relationships that mattered to people, that meant I never was next on enough people's hitlists, and was also enough of a social butterfly that those with other strengths, such as Zor, saw me as less of a threat to their 'strategic' game. I played up to that to: I spoke with a lot of people about an endgame between us being a 'coin-flip'.

I think the 'realness' of the social game also matters, but less, to Zor too: and I also think it comes less naturally. However, a lot of my favourite moments in this game came from him - typing exactly the same game thoughts at the same time, joking about Stoics v sweethearts v wildcards, him actually working to help me when I accidentally sent Vash a NSFW pic! I think Zor did try to be the things the person talking to him needed to be.

Structural: Zor, Bella/Scoots
Zor used the structure of the game really well. He navigated swaps, he won the Kanye challenge, he made good use of group chats..he's written a whole essay on what he did. I, on the other hand, did struggle with the structural confines of the game - I found the repetitive style of challenges frustrating, I noticeably chafed at the f8-6 immunity twist, etc. Zor is the type of player this type of game is designed for, and absolute hats off to him for making the best of it. I've answered for you before the structural things I think I did well at, I think I have a hard time vibing with this question because the type of game it is doesn't really matter overall - once you have those strong relationships, good situational awareness and an eye at end-game, it's only big twists and bad luck that can mess you up. I feel me and Scoots were affected about equally by the 'structure' of the game.

Strategic
Bella, Zor, Scoots.
Zor has written paragraphs and paragraphs about his strategic game, his roadmaps to the end, his spreadsheet of connections. My argument is, it doesn't -matter-.

You gotta work smarter, not harder.

If this route to the end was inevitable, why take so many risks, offer so many end-game deals, send Menno messages 3 minutes before deadline, leave so many people feeling betrayed? People don't work like input/output machines: I don't think Zor was ready for how upset me and DV were after the Vash vote - we'd made an 'optimal' decision, why did we care? If we flip there, I don't think it's at all likely Zor gets the endgame mentioned previously. However, because he valued our social connection, he offered to make the vote that would have been bad for all of us! I believe that people are people - you can't plan and dictate in advance how they respond. Some of your strategy has to be reactive.

The reason I think I outplayed both Zor and Scoots in the end, is the end. I'm the only one who can truthfully say I got the FTC I wanted, the one that's best for me. It's become increasingly obvious that Scoots gave very little thought to who he was sitting with at the end - we spoke once early merge about who'd get our jury votes and his response was along the lines of 'I never considered being on the jury, I was always picturing myself at FTC'. However, this survivalist method I think has been his downfall at FTC: sitting next to Zor just leads to unhelpful comparisons. By being an 'easy vote', it being 'anyone but him', it meant he lost control of an endgame that worked for him.

The same with Zor. As the f4 round started, he pitched the 'joke' of tying the vote. I reacted against it: Scoots would win a challenge, and all he'd do was dick DV around for 48 hours. But I knew a FTC with DV in it was disastrous for me - for those who appreciated the social, friendly game, DV eats my votes and gives Zor a much easier win. So, I was honest with DV and explained this - I also didn't want an endgame where we both lose. Zor, however, did exactly what I'd reasoned out not to do... only to change his mind to my way of thinking 24 hours later.

Votes this merge were often unanimous, and benefited a lot of people a lot of the time. Sometimes, the benefited me the most. Sometimes Zor. However, the two most important votes in the merge, I was able to get exactly what I wanted - and I'm the only one here who can say that.

[Bellaphant]

....that's a lot of words about the least threatening person in the FTC

[Bellaphant]

Hi DV

For me it was getting to know people in new and surprising ways. The running joke that vash is my child from the future (they have the same name), scoots agreeing to help klick with a piece of uni work, talking politics with panzer, my last conversation with dk. Sending vash a picture of my nipple and how well he handled me dying of shame. Discussing why haschel needs a better job description. A lot of things from zor - he consistently makes me laugh and has been one of the best things about the game for me. Talking to you about Christmas in hospital with my mum. Encouraging ent to progress Lorenz' supports and talking about shipping. Zor agreeing with me about how attractive scoots is.

Actually, how classy the f3 have been. Scoots made a little chat for us and it's lovely to see a)how badly we all want to win but b) how genuinely we care for each other. This whole FTC has been pretty great, so thank you all. Actually, although the game did have it rough points, you guys make the game.

I'm also thrilled personally that in the game where for a while the running joke was that my baby would do better on the challenges than me, I pulled off two immunity wins!

Oh, and my first convo with het being him just throwing shade at kilby BC he knew it would make him friends. I was in love at hello.

[Bellaphant]

Also, things like my personality quiz to make tribes:

'john tells you your best ally, Tim, has been heard telling people you are a jury threat..do you:a) talk to Tim? He's probably right but you'd like to end game with your buddy. B) discuss jury voting philosophy with john while also working out what he values in a winner. C ) vote out John and then tim'

[Bellaphant]

Love you all