Open 88 - Polygamist Mafia (Game Over) before 650

[LlamaFluff]

vote Jebus

for doubting the power of random voting

[LlamaFluff]

Massclaim is definantly the right thing to do here.

[LlamaFluff]

This

Why Jebus were you eager to claim and not do popcorn. Did you not see the bennifit of waiting to see who picked who and then ask why they picked that person?

Mixed with this

Vote: Kloud

I don't really get how the random voting is supposed to work when everyone does it, but what the heck

make me comfortable with my Jebus vote for now

[LlamaFluff]

This is where we need adel. One of those diagram thingies would be great here.

What we also need is some scumhunting

[LlamaFluff]

What we also need is some scumhunting

This is true, and the diagram is one method of doing so (that I usually don't care enough about to use).

I just dont see what an overanalysis of the first three pages of votes will accomplish at this point that simple scumhunting cant, I dont think many if any have even cast something more then a random. Ususally voting history doesnt even come into play as concrete evidence untill late in the game.

[LlamaFluff]

Llama post 54 just uses quotes and very little to confirm his vote on Jebus. Post 68 gives me bad vibes. I think what was stated on how people interacted even for random should be noted

Yeah by page three I dont think anyone can make multiple paragraph cases. Jebus had done two things that I saw as scummy though so the post was made to basically reinforce my vote as most people still considered that the random stage.

In post 68 I encouraged scumhunting given that I assumed people were starting to say that the first three pages of randoms were useable as evidence on page three. I never said they should be disregarded, but used at a later point in the game when their ties were more visable.

@mod - Mass prods please?

[LlamaFluff]

I entirely don't agree with this. Like I stated before there is the percentage of hitting scum but also the percentage of hitting town. If we were to lynch town then we would have no evidence the next day to make any assumpation on who is scum and then if we random lynch again then although the chance of hitting scum is higher there is also the dangerous probability of hittting town and we can't risk that.

This is a complete misinterpretation of what goat was saying there. He is against the dice roll vote and was explaining what he made Jebus' plan out to be. So far Jebus is the only person who has suggested a random vote plan. It is well established at this point that we are not going to throw dice to try and win this game but scumhunt (and use connections from random voting that someone still needs to explain to me).

Also, why are you still voting for Caboose? You have mentioned Jebus' plan a few times already, but apart from that you have stayed out of all discussion. This doesnt line up with your vote, as you oppose the plan but at the same time are merely shooting it down. So: Does Jebus suggesting this plan make her more likely scum or town? If scum why arent you voting Jebus?

FoS OpposedForce

[LlamaFluff]

To respond to me "staying out of the discussion" I've been busy for the past few days and couldn't really get into posting my thoughts and discussing things. I tried to stay online and get active but real life gets into the way

You have more posts then me, yet you really havent contributed much (random, massclaim stuff, dice roll, and talking about setup). The problem with arguing over the dice roll vote is that we all know its a stupid idea. By simply stating what everyone knows you add nothing to the conversation but appear better for saying what everyone knows to be true. Its just filler to make you more town looking. The other things you have talked about also do nothing to advance scumhunting, more filler.

Also why are you pointing that I should be voting Jebus because I disagree with the thing? Yes I do disagree with the random lynching act but at this point I don't think it warrants a vote.

Well I tend to be a little agressive and vote quite a bit, so it may be a difference in playstyle. From what I have read though, Jebus seems to be at the top of your scum list, yes your vote was on Caboose, and now is in your pocket. You have however avoided my main question so I will ask it again here.

1) Do you think Jebus suggesting dice roll makes him more or less likely to be scum?
2) If its more likely, why arent you voting Jebus

unvote
vote OpposedForce

[LlamaFluff]

Your logic onto me for posting filler can apply onto you so that's where your case on me fails.

And before anyone asks yes I do suspect Jebus in fact I have a few suspects at the moment that I've found suspicous. I'm not voting yet because I want discussion to further and see what everybody gives their take on.

Actually with less posts then you I have been pushing more people, both Jebus and you. While you have spoken ill about Jebus' plan, you did not really take any stance towards his alignment untill I more recently half forced you to. Looking back at your posts, you have taken no stance on anyone really, apart from a random on Caboose. Since then all you have done is disagreed, and when pressured, said Jebus was suspicious along with a few others. You still arent voting.

I also dont like your "I want other peoples opinions" reasoning for holding out on acting on any of your suspicions. If you have suspicions you act on them, you dont just keep them to yourself and modify them when everyone else has checked in. I would at least prefer to hear your LoS before other people start putting theirs out there if not even get a vote out of you, even though im pretty sure im going to get OMGUSed

[LlamaFluff]

Your logic onto me for posting filler can apply onto you so that's where your case on me fails.

And before anyone asks yes I do suspect Jebus in fact I have a few suspects at the moment that I've found suspicous. I'm not voting yet because I want discussion to further and see what everybody gives their take on.

Actually with less posts then you I have been pushing more people, both Jebus and you. While you have spoken ill about Jebus' plan, you did not really take any stance towards his alignment untill I more recently half forced you to. Looking back at your posts, you have taken no stance on anyone really, apart from a random on Caboose. Since then all you have done is disagreed, and when pressured, said Jebus was suspicious along with a few others. You still arent voting.

I also dont like your "I want other peoples opinions" reasoning for holding out on acting on any of your suspicions. If you have suspicions you act on them, you dont just keep them to yourself and modify them when everyone else has checked in. I would at least prefer to hear your LoS before other people start putting theirs out there if not even get a vote out of you, even though im pretty sure im going to get OMGUSed

Forced me to? I've had my suspicions before your posts hence why I disagreed with the whole random voting thing. I never directed the case on everybody because I wanted to see what others had to say about and if your going to come up with "I forced him to state he had suspicions" BS then I got nothing to say in my defense because that kind of logic is crap and your twisting around my words. I never stated that I wanted to "sit back and see other people's opinions" I said I wanted to see discussion further with MYSELF involving in it. Your twisting what I'm saying to put a crap case on me.

The point is you never gave any suspicions. If you wont say what they are how are you really going to get scum lynched? *spoiler* you arent. We arent all psychics here. I think that I did more or less push you into showing your suspicions though, up untill I started pressuring you the only thing you looked at as vaugely scummy was Jebus. That fact is a valid point against you, especially since you claim that you do have suspicions. I dont see any town reasons to keep them hidden.

Also the fact that you "refuse to vote untill discussion breaks out" doesnt sit well. It takes something to stimulate discussion and it looks like me pushing you did it. When you wait for others to control discussion you just go along with the ride or have to fight the direction, given that again you claim to of been suspect of a few players, I dont get how you dont push discussion on the players you suspect or even vote them. It may just be contrasting playstyles, but not voting a suspect doesnt make sense to me.

[LlamaFluff]

The point is you never gave any suspicions. If you wont say what they are how are you really going to get scum lynched? *spoiler* you arent. We arent all psychics here. I think that I did more or less push you into showing your suspicions though, up untill I started pressuring you the only thing you looked at as vaugely scummy was Jebus. That fact is a valid point against you, especially since you claim that you do have suspicions. I dont see any town reasons to keep them hidden.

Also the fact that you "refuse to vote untill discussion breaks out" doesnt sit well. It takes something to stimulate discussion and it looks like me pushing you did it. When you wait for others to control discussion you just go along with the ride or have to fight the direction, given that again you claim to of been suspect of a few players, I dont get how you dont push discussion on the players you suspect or even vote them. It may just be contrasting playstyles, but not voting a suspect doesnt make sense to me.

I'll explain this as the best as I can with this paragraph responding to your first paragraph. I have stated before that "you pushing me" is invalid on my list of suspicions. You keep stating that you pressuring me had made me come up with a quick response but I have had my suspicions on people and trying to formulate what kind of tells they have dropped. The reason why I haven't stated my suspicions is because I want to see where it goes in "discussion" meaning with discussion I can check back and see if my suspicions are justified. When I have enough evidence then I'll share them with the town.

Showing them this early won't be as much use as it could be later in discussion.

The only thing you seem to be pinning on me is the "I've pressured you into stating false things" which is untrue and this kind of logic will get you nowhere except trying to stubbornly prove that your right.

First, I am increadably stubborn in this game, especially when I feel confident. Second, explain the bolded part to me as this is one of the main points im getting at as to why you are scum. I dont see why town would avoid putting out suspicion and trying to get their suspects lynched. You say that its because you get reads off them during discussion that you act on, but without giving us any suspicions you are able to jump any wagon you want as they could of been your top suspect. There is no trail of suspicion from you. When you pressure people with cases and votes you get better reads off them then general discussion from my experiance.

I have never stated that I would vote when discussion breaks out. This is yet another misinterpretation of what I meant. I'll state it again. I wanted people to discuss with myself included in the discussion in order for me to pick up tells or information on people. I never meant to "stay in the shadows and wait for a bandwagon to form to jump on" is pretty much what your trying to accuse me of. Your stating that I'll just wait for discussion to happen and that isn't true. I've already checked back and seen what has happened and tooken note of everything. This whole arguement with you will ironically spark discussion and that's how it gets going. You've misinterpretated me and pinned false logic on me and that's why I'm voting you.

Well I never saw you try to instigate any discussion. The last few things you mentioned before our little back-and-forth here was dice rolls and setup of the game. While "stay in the shadows and wait for a bandwagon" may be an overexaggeration, you also dont seem to want to take the role of "open discussion that leads to a lynch". Given that you are opposed to the dice roll, I dont get how you are opposed, or unwilling, to creating discussion. Where is everyone else though? OF and I are just yelling at eachother here and no one else is saying anything.

[LlamaFluff]

Im going to try and address specific points here, given that what each of us say seems to be identical each time, I think one of us is missing what the other is saying.

Your assuming I won't put any of my own thoughts or opinions in and talk with the town about a lynch or activity and you also assume I won't pressure or build cases which is a complete utter misunderstanding and your trying to state of what I might do to pin blame on me which is foolish and scummy.

I am not trying to push the fact that you wont participate or make a case directly. What I dont understand is that you claim that discussion helps you get a better read on people, but you didnt start discussion on a suspicion related topic. I dont understand why someone who gets reads of general discussion would not be the first one out the gate generating it. This playstyle makes it odd that you arent making a case or a discussion topic, so indirectly I think you look scummy for not doing those.

This really is my main point and what I have been saying over and over in different ways. You being a player that benifits from discussion and not quickly generating it doesnt make a whole lot of sense to me, this is why I am pressuring you which ironically is generating discussion.

Hopefully I got my point across here, it seems we are both just grasping at shadows regarding what we are saying.

Does ANYONE else have something to say though?