What'll beiamausername wrote:I think we're going to want to figure out where our votes will really end up
Good point.iamausername wrote:We're gonna need someone else to vote Korts or Musher before the next votecount (and no other votes) so we can tell which vote is which, by the way.
You mean as in not all votes on different people being treated the same? As in me voting person X doesn't necessarily lead to the same result as person Y voting person X? That would complicate things, yeah. We should probably try out "the system" with a couple of votes once we've finished this mapping.Jenter Brolincani wrote:Have you thought it my be votes BY certain people or roles ON certain people that are deflected?
If he's making up new rules, I'd much prefer it if they're rules we've already thought of. Should be easier to recognize that way.Korts wrote:Psst. Don't give ideas to the mod.
Interesting stuff: "Do you trust your memories of what has worked before?" Could very well mean that the rules do change from day to day.Tarhalindur, intro post wrote:"What is insanity to those who understand it not?
What is reality to those who cannot see it?
Each of you shall wake up to a reality unlike any you have known, a land of dreams and nightmares, a shifting superposition of aligned states. A place where technobabble is truly explanation. A reality where the rules themselves seem resistant to discovery.
Some of you will learn to adapt. Some of you... won't.
Do you trust your memories of what has worked before? Are you willing to guess as to what's really going on? Can you find those who would impose their twisted view of reality on you before time runs out?"
Reminds me of the old koan, "what is the the sound of one hand clapping?". Answer is open for debate; I kinda like "cl". What's the sound of two atoms? The sound of fusion?"What is the sound of one atom happening?"
This is apparently (according to google) a quote from Battlestar Galactica, more specifically from a Hybrid (a central computer) on a Cylon baseship. I'm not a fan of Battlestar Galactica myself, and don't have the details, but Cylons are bad guys."Genesis turns to its source, reductuon occurs stepwise though the essence is all one. End of Line"
"Penguins? In my humongous mecha mind screw anime series? HELLZ YEAH!"
This one I don't know. Baseball isn't something I'm familiar with. Sounds like some kind of reference though."The fate of the world depends on... a BASEBALL GAME?! *facepalm*"
Hint for us?"And you don't seem to understand..."
Reference to A Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, maybe?"Do YOU know where your towel is?"
Don't know. Sounds like a quote."So long as one soul exists, it will be proof that humanity once existed."
Another hint?"The pattern is self-evident, if only you can see the key."
This, too, sounds a bit like a hint... But what's the illusion and what's the reality? The voting? The FoS:es?"What is the reality behind the illusion?"
First half of this seems to be a quote from The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya (just watched that recently, btw. It's pretty messed up. I like it. ^^). The second half doesn't match TMoHS though; but it almost matches another Battlestar quote."Commencing nullification of data-link. Repairs ordered to relay zero zero zero zero."
This is from Serial Experiments Lain. Definitely a "screwed up animes" theme going here."Close the world. Enter the next."
"It's best not to think about it too much, really. Just roll the ball already."
Why'd you say that and then tell us anyway?Battousai wrote:I don't think I'm allowed to tell you the rule, as it's a special ability my role has, I think.
What's "pretty much know"? Do you know this or do you assume it? How sure are you?Korts wrote:I pretty much know from role information that everyone has these parentheses. Thus the FoS on MafiaSSK, too.
Same question here; do you know this? Do you base it on anything?Korts wrote:I am pretty confident if the mod gets the majority votes, someone else will die for him.
You were pretty confident about what would happen if we lynched the mod, why not now?Korts wrote:Hey, what if we lynched Battle Mage? I wonder.
Well, I disagree, because I don't think it's a good idea to lynch based on what you can assume about other people's role pm's, but I won't stop you from placing higher value in it.Korts wrote:"Pretty much know" means about 80-90% sure. I'm not a hundred percent sure, but I think it's more than safe to assume.
Fair enough. Could you answer this though; do you have an in-game reason, or is it strictly meta? I don't expect you to provide the specific reason if it's in-game.With this setup, I'm not 100% confident in anything. YES I base this idea on something, NO I don't feel like telling you what it is I base it on.
Ok.Because in BM's case, I just chose a scummer at random out of those not involved in this game.
iamausername wrote:Do not like this.MafiaSSK wrote:Yes [we should try lynching the mod]. Since town usually doesn't lycnh scum on the first day.FoS: MafiaSSK.
But he didn't actually suggest a no lynch, he suggested lynching the mod. Which, according to Korts (if I understand him correctly) is more like a random lynch. Which is even worse.iamausername wrote:For the reason I FoSed him in this post - What he said there was basically akin to suggesting that we should vote No Lynch today because quote "town usually doesn't lycnh scum on the first day", which I'm sure we can all agree is a terrible strategy.
I'm not sure if I understand you correctly, are you saying that you think lynching the mod would be useful to the town?remusshadow wrote: as in a game where the mod is lynchable, then we would be getting something out of the lynch, though I do admit that it would be something useful to the town in all likelihood.
I thought this would be the case, but I just wanted to clarify it. Assumptions are dangerous things.Korts wrote:In-game, definitely. I'm not sure how you imagine meta reasoning for the mod's lynch causing someone else's death.
Oh. Hmm. Still, from my point of view that's similar to random.Nonono. Not random. A specific player, if I'm right.
With that in mind, the previous such comment suddenly gets a whole new meaning:Jenter Brolincani wrote:Is it just me, or might to words 'Nuclear Launch Detected' indicate a deadline?
Three is the magic number? Three (two, now) more votecounts?The Tenth Vote Count (aka the "...Three Fries Short of a Happy Meal... WACKO!" Vote Count)
The difference, seemingly, is that the quotes I've been quoting is what he's said in italics above the vote count. My bad maybe, but the "aka the xxxxx votecount"-quotes haven't been as interesting. At least they weren't at first. A list:Macavenger wrote:In keeping with the rest of the mod's flavor this game, I'd consider it a Starcraft reference. I wouldn't consider it to have any lesser or greater meaning than any of the Matrix or what have you references that have been all over the place.Jenter Brolincani wrote:Is it just me, or might to words 'Nuclear Launch Detected' indicate a deadline?
I think we should vote more. Not necessarily lynch anyone, but vote.Tarhalindur wrote:The Twentieth Vote Count (aka the "Less Talking, More Voting, or Fail the Deadline Review" Vote Count)
Jex wrote:I'm not claiming a power role at all. I simply asked if anything happened because I have no idea what my role does. At this point I have no idea if the action was caused by me or someone else and I don't want anyone to say if they targeted him because i don't want to out anyone. My role is the most confusing thing I've ever read in a game of mafia and I'm trying to start making sense of it if I can.
My role is not particularly confusing. I'm intrigued (and a bit alarmed) by Jex's mini-claim... I could imagine all kinds of interesting (and dangerous) stuff in a setup like this.Macavenger wrote:Interesting, I didn't have any problem understanding my role. I wasn't under the impression that the roles were particularly confusing, rather the rest of the game; did I just get lucky there?
I unfortunately don't have time to read someone's meta right now (unless maybe if it's a very short game... was it?) or I'd ask for a link to that game. Nevertheless, MafiaSSK is obviously lurking in plain sight, and I don't have a problem with adding a pressure vote.Battousai wrote:Last game I was in with MafiaSSK, he was very quite and not contributing to the point of lurking. Upon being fronted with this he came up with the Lurk Strategy in which protown players don't bring attention to lurkers until close to deadline and scum bring them out early as they are easy lynches/ distractionary. He was killed and he was scum. If he's trying the same strategy, I think there is an equal chance of him being scum.
Mod Watch wrote:- Number 6,"Escape, come back,wipe this place off the face of the Earth, obliterate it, and you with it."The Prisoner. Note: This was before MSSK claimed.
My bolding. I think I said I'm not going to lynch anyone based on rolename, and I'm not, but this is mildly unsettling and seemed noteworthy.Tarhalindur wrote:A nuclear launch.A shot in the dark.
Two projectiles converge on their mark.
A change of world. A blinding flash.
And Jenter Brolincani is brought unto ash.
I think you're right about your FoS on Jex not working, but you're now definitely FoS:ing me. Also, FoS:ing worked when I tried it day one.Battousai wrote:FOS: Cavebear I thought FOS's didn't fall under the same category as the vote count ( I FoS'd Jex earlier and MafiaSSK recieved a FoS I think)
Well, what complicates thing is his claimed secret rule-detecting ability. I don't have any reason to disbelieve that. However, a lyncher having that ability doesn't really make sense to me, so I don't really think he's a lyncher. (If this was a normal game, I'd be pretty much convinced; as it is, I'm not willing to entirely write it off (having a lyncher and a survivor in a bastardmodly game seems like an appealing idea.))Battousai wrote:Cavebear, what are you leaning towards concerning iamausername? Scum, lyncher, or protown?
I'm not sure I understood this. 2*?Battousai wrote:Ok, if iamausername's win condition is to kill Yos, and Yos is to survive to day 3, then that means 2* of the 5 other players are scum.... I'm going to do a reread of a few players and post what I find.
So are you voting him because you think he's scum, or because he's not helping the town?Grimmy wrote:My vote is not on you. It is on Iam. he is playing very anti-town with the OMGUS vote and the WIFOM arguements. So it is not a wasted lynch to get rid of someone who is not helping the town.
You say it's "the scummiest", but how scummy do you actually think it is? On a scale from "not very scummy at all" to "extremely scummy", say?remussaidow wrote:Since this is the scummiest that's happen so far today, its what my vote is based on for now.
Let's pretend it's tomorrow. Yos2 is gone (having won) and iamausername is still here. For simplicity's sake, let's say nobody was lynched and nobody killed at night, so everybody else is still around. What do you think of iamausername?Jex wrote:I don't think that IAM is a lyncher type role [...] but I don't think lynching him today will do any good since we don't know yet if yos is telling the truth or not.
There's a difference between anti-town acts and anti-town alignment. Anyone can, intentionally or not, do something stupid and/or anti-town. I know I have; I'd be surprised if there's someone who's never acted a bit too rash or without grasping the whole picture.And while yes, anti town does not mean scum, it does mean- drumroll please- (*drum roll*)- ANTI FRIGGEN TOWN. That means that they want the town to lose.
I actually strongly dislike this statement. There's nothing to suggest cults (that I've seen anyway) and it serves little purpose but to stress us into possibly making hasty decisions about lynching. In short, it's anti-town.remussaidow wrote: For all we know we could have a cult on our hands- which, if we had one whose recruiter wasn't roleblocked, we're at lynch or lose soon.
Because you think he didn't have knowledge of the standard win condition you think he's scummy to the value of 8 on a scale from 1 to 10? The same win condition he was building his "lynch Yos2!" case on? The one Yos2, who apparently DOESN'T have that same win condition, referred to (implicating that non-town faction have access to or at the very least can figure out the town win condition - not that figuring out the town win condition usually is very hard)? That's a huge reach. I also don't like how you tried to set up the next lynch target for tomorrow "in case you're wrong". Not to mention that you seem very confident that you'll actually be here tomorrow.remussaidow wrote:Also, on the off chance that Iam flip town (scale of 1-10, 1 being town and scum (read anti-town faction) being 10, I put him at an 8 for the argument that I've been saying all "day") My first suspect will be Grimmy, and I would expect myself to be up on the lists of many of you.
I'm not particularily thrilled by the idea of choosing between those two right now. The one person I think is most likely to be scum/is acting scummiest at this point is remussaidow. Thus:Battousai wrote:On another note, if no one changes their minds, then it appears Cavebear gets to decide between Iam and grimmy. I would really like jex to answer Cavebear's questions so we can get more from Cavebear on who he thinks is most likely scum.
Grimmy is looking reasonably scummy, sure. However, a) you're not voting Grimmy, you're voting iamausername (despite you apparently thinking Grimmy is looking "incredibly scummy"... but ok, this is the hypothetical case where we lynch iam and he's not scum, correct?) and b) it's not the truthiness of the statement that really matters in this case, it's the fact that you're setting up a chain lynch. What you're essentially saying is that if you're wrong, we should lynch Grimmy, not you.remussaidow wrote:and if you note, I also peg myself as a likely target. Yes, I fully expect myself to be alive tomorrow IF IAM DIES, as that is the condition for the target naming. All I said was that if I'm wrong myself and Grimmy are looking incredibly scummy. Its a simple, true statement.
Well, he did abandon that Yos2-wagon pretty quickly. So it's his over-eager defense of himself that you find anti-town?And no, its not just because I feel that he misunderstood/ misinterpreted the town's win condition. It's because he pushed for a lynch that should never have come up until tomorrow. And its also because he fought against my solitary vote as though it were the one putting him at lynch -one. If it were me being accused in that situation, as town I wouldn't mind the one or two votes based off of this apparent evidence. Its the fact that he tried to fight, continuously, the same point, when it had to be obvious that I wasn't changing MY opinion on the matter, that my vote stays upon him firmly.
This doesn't really change the fact that the statement even as a whole was anti-town. Speculating can be fun, but it didn't accomplish anything except instill a feeling of stress that we might be at LYLO any second. Still, if you feel yourself treated unfairly or misquoted, I apologize. I loathe being misquoted myself. I usually quote what I feel is the relevant part of posts (instead of eg bolding), assuming that people read everything and can go back to check the surrounding text, but maybe I cut a bit carelessly.Also, cavebear, great job on cutting up my statement so you only show the part that you want everyone else to read. I proposed a hypothetical situation of an anti-town faction that was not scum aligned either. You repeated it, in quotes, yet ignored the point where I called it hypothetical.
D'oh. Thanks.Nocmen wrote:Cavebear, you do realize that voting for remus doesn't actually vote for remus, right?
First of all, let me say something about my view on iam. The case on iam isn't invalid; the trying-to-get-Yos2-lynched thing could very well be an attempt to get him lynched for different reasons than the one stated. The problem is that I think it would be a wasted lynch for scum as well as town, leaving the possibilities of iam being either a lyncher or paranoid town (or paranoid scum, I suppose). Well, I doubt he's a lyncher, as I've already said (yes, it's mind screw mafia, it's a possibility and I'm not ruling it out). That leaves the paranoia reason, and in that case, I'm inclined to think "town". That's my take on iam right now.Grimmy wrote:Part 3: some questions
Cavebear and Bat.
Besides leaving my vote on Iam, (reason I will repeat in a minute), what else makes you think I am scum?
I did a quick search on games with lynchers (seems they're pretty rare) and couldn't find a single useful role PM, so I have no idea what would happen if a lyncher's target is someone with an independent win condition who wins in the middle of the game. I'm not sure if it's happened before. Logically, he'd probably lose. Failing that, I'd guess the same thing would happen as if the lynchee was NK:ed; standard procedure for that seems to be to revert to townie. Anyway, it's pretty dangerous to base anything on role speculation in a game like this, so I prefer not to. In other words, I don't consider the risk of iam being a lyncher who transforms into SK (vig would be harmful?) to be significant enough to warrant lynching him.IN retrospect, it seems now to be more of a slip up that he was hoping nobody would call him on, more so than just not trusting a lyncher. And it wouldnt surprise me that is he IS a lyncher, and doesnt lynch YOS, then he will get something more harmful to the town (activated vig or something along those lines)
Yosarian2 wrote:If you guys want me to hammer someone, let me know; I don't really care
For information purposes, I'd prefer it if someone else than Yosarian2 did the hammering... But yeah, a Yosarian2 hammer is better than no hammer at all.remussaidow wrote:we figured that out already yos- you, as the survivor, have it in your best interests to hammer anyone at all.
I assume this is what caused this, meaning the next lynch should work as intended. I wonder when, and why, and how, this rule came into existance; if it's been there all along or if it was the rule that was apparently introduced at the beginning of the day.Tar wrote:Rule 30 Removed.
Why not try the person we've already (tried to) lynch/ed once first? Now, if it doesn't work this time either (with the mysterious rule 30 removed), we can talk.iamausername wrote:Let's try lynching Grimmy first, and if that doesn't work either, we'll think about it.
Rule 22 DOES seem pretty good.iamausername wrote:Wait, I should pay more attention. Rule 22! Woah, that seems too good to be true.
So, if we lynch someone today, we either win (25% chance) or get a confirmed innocent (75% chance). We're then in a position where we have a 33% chance of getting the scum, with the added benefit that because there are four of us, there's no chance for the scum to quickhammer. In other words, two people have to vote for the wrong person rather than just one. Which is a good thing. What? Rule 22 pretty clearly states we get alignment, not role.Battousai wrote:I don't know, it was in the original role pm. I'm just guessing it refered to Korts.
Cavebear, if we lynch/investigate remscum/iamscum we will get their role and not their alignment. Chances are scum do have special abilities as well and they could have told us the truth about their role, just not their win condition. If we go with you, your role CAN'T be a scum role so if you lied we caught you and if you didn't it confirms rem/iam as possible scum.
Anyway, Ender is the main protagonist character in a setting that Tar referred to; that's not bad, as far as innocent-looking goes. Kyon would arguably be a better Jailkeeper (as his thing is to keep Haruhi occupied), but with Haruhi already in the game and confirmed townie, I didn't want to risk anything. Oh. I'd only seen jailkeeper in one other game, where it worked same as here.Tarhalindur wrote:Actually, the ordinary Jailkeeper only blocks kills (that's why both of your falseclaim PMs used the "prevent all kills and roleblock" structure). The role you received was a supercharged Jailkeeper.