Mafia 29: Mafia - Game over!

[DarkLight140]

"The light it burns the mafia"? What, are we all vampires now?

Mafia

vampires?

[DarkLight140]

While I'm all for stealing the initiative and gaining extra information, I just don't see how we figure HairyMezican to be that great of a lynch- or even a decent one, for that matter. All he did was say "That guy seems nervous, so I'll vote him", after an OMGUS vote. That's poor reasoning, but still better than the previous vote had- "a name like that has to be non-mafia". Admittedly, I'm not calling that a very competent play, but, well, I'm just not seeing how this is a decent lynch at all. He even explicitly stated that there was "not much to go on". And further, he seems more willing to die than to reason us out of it, which is the sort of thing I'd expect more from someone who knows they're pretty much useless than someone who has to stay alive because of a role to play for their side.

Who else to lynch? No idea... but I'm not voting HairyMezican. Now I'll watch you lynch him, he's townie and you all kill me next.

...And to go off on a useless and ultimately pointless path, seeing as we're the mafia, shouldn't we have a different term than "lynch" for our day-ending kills? "Execution", "Pre-emptive suppression of rebellion", or something? Just a random thought.

[DarkLight140]

I could definitely go with ZONEACE. While I don't exactly have that many posts myself, at least I've felt like I've done

something

. While I'm not that opposed to no lynch- I'd hope that info-gathering roles on the mafia side could help influence us in the right direction on later days- I wouldn't call lynching someone a mistake, either. After all, if nothing else we're getting the jump on the townies. So... lurker/useless player hunt, I guess.

Vote: ZONEACE

[DarkLight140]

A note after looking through the game with posts-by-player: joe has only one post the entire game, and that contains very little other than a quick vote. If we're going after useless posters, he'd be at the top of my list, but I'll leave my vote on ZONEACE for now, until I hear more opinions on this.

[DarkLight140]

All right, if we're voting the people with the most contentless posts, we've got new targets. Let's please try to get back to the actual game.

Really, I've been with Zoneace in a couple games now, and I'll admit that his ecessively annoying and scummy-seeming play style is probably just normal. So I'll

unvote

. For now.

However, I still think HairyMezican seems more like a poor player than a townie, but that could just be my take on the issue.

Frankly, I still don't like joe. He has 5 posts, three of which contain content but only one of which contains more reasoning than token suspicions and echoes of previously given reasons.

Vote joe.

[DarkLight140]

Well, there seem to be better votes than lurkers, so I'll

unvote.

That said, I'm not sure exactly who I should vote for at this point. As for Locus cosecant trying to move votes off "established choices", the only people with more than a couple votes are ZONEACE and HairyMezican, and I don't see that either of those have particularly good logic. Something about ZONEACE bugs me, admittedly, but I think it's just because I hate his style or something. I've gotten that in every game I've played with him, even non-mafia games. So trying to shift votes is okay... though I will admit that going after lurkers when it seems to me at least that that was tried, and failed to gain support, is kind of strange.

[DarkLight140]

Well, the deadline is almost here, so I'll go with the safe and mildly suspicios one.

Vote ZONEACE

.

As for Locus Cosecant, well, I'm not really sure. He's certainly not the most innocent-looking guy around, but at this point, even were there no deadline, I don't think I have anything solid enough- not even great suspicions- to vote him for. The deadline pretty much puts it out of the question.

[DarkLight140]

Well, we got as many as four killing groups out of that, if we use the "two bullet holes=two people targeted" theory. If Locus Cosecant killed someone (potentially melchizedek) last night, then we're down to three, of which probably at least two are anti-mafia, though it seems like the mafia would probably have a high number of vig roles. In any case, it would probably be a bad idea for anyone to claim a kill at this point. They would eat up protects, maybe attract a townie role block, and in general be more trouble than the knowledge is worth.

[DarkLight140]

You called?

In case you're wondering, I'm mostly unsure on this whole issue. While I can't say I particularly like Mastermind of Sin's jumping, I tentatively buy his explanations. So, no vote on him.

Maximus, I don't like, but I'm not willing to vote him, either. For all I know, he could have actual information.

Thus, I figure staying silent and watching, hoping someone gives something away, is probably my best bet. Unless you've got something more to ask, Mastermind of Sin?

[DarkLight140]

Mastermind of Sin, I'd ask for a claim. Saying you've already said enough to get you killed is like telling the town "kill me". Given that they already know that- and they hardly need more- I'd ask for enough information to make a decent call. There's still enough time for someone else to reach five votes, and you to move down a vote, in a day and a half, you know. There is

no reason

for you not to claim- you're dead otherwise. If you're truly worried about us wasting a lynch, you should know that it's your best shot.

[DarkLight140]

Well... I'd say that with a role claim like that, we should kill someone else. My rationale is this:

-If he's a townie, he'll probably live through the night.

Or will he?

I have an easy time beliving that there are more killing roles about, and who would pass the opportunity? Both disbelieving vigs (if there are any left) and any SK's would jump at the kill. Certainly, for vigs at least, he looks guilty enough that the kill would be better than one from mostly playstyle and conjecture.
-If he's what he claimed, he'll almost certainly die tonight anyway thanks to the town, so why waste the lynch and free their kill?
-We may get investigative roles looking at him tonight, on the chance that the town has a doc, and they'll certainly be able to tip the scales in the proper direction if the issue comes up again tomorrow.

And for a final but less substantial reason, I'd be happier letting him quietly get killed tonight than lynching him and turning out wrong, just because I'm unsure about him. And I'm not liking Maximus at all... the closer he gets to killing Mastermind of Sin, the worse-looking he seems to be willing to get for the kill. I'm not sure if this is just reckless or a townie slipping. But, given that there's no way in hell I'll pull a lynch on him unless I'm right enough for quite a few people to agree with me, I'm willing to

Vote Maximus

. Others on MoS's vote list have at least tried to give reasoning, but he's been both frequently posting and saying very little aside from a chant of "kill MoS now".

[DarkLight140]

Oh, come on. He hadn't posted here since the 12th. I'd hardly call that too pressured; more like "not around and knows it". You're really reaching, JDTAY.

In any case, we have a night scene. "Accomplice" sounds like a masonry, to me at least. A pity we lost Genocide Heart, if it's so. As for HairyMezican, well, aside from being glad we didn't lynch him, I'm thinking that we may be running a bit low on goons.

Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to start the day? Continue with the Mastermind of Sin wagon? Attack JDTAY for being so aggressive? Try and root out lurkers? Call for suspicions? Anyone?

[DarkLight140]

Well, I'd hate to disappoint you...

My thoughts on these issues: At the end of yesterday, I was willing to peg Mastermind of Sin and JDTAY as anti's if they survived the night (look through their posts yesterday, if you can spare the time), but decided that we'd be better off letting the day run its course for a while and seeing if anything new comes to light. Relevant to them being together (though they could be in separate groups), at least, is the bit of striking out I've seen today. However, I'm still of the opinion that they need careful watching.

Very

careful.

Thus far, we've had a half-started lurker hunt. While I'm normally opposed to lurker hunting, as I'm not exactly a high-frequency poster myself, somehow I can't give KE slack for the month-and-a-half break between two of his posts. His argument of having nothing to post is something that I have trouble buying, mostly because "don't post unless you have something to say" is a strategy I try to follow, and I would say that certainly there's been material for speculation, ideas, and/or observation by now. If nothing else, everyone can probably have suspicions. But as to that being enough to lynch him, I don't know. Certainly we should ask him to post some ideas. I refuse to think that anyone could look through this game and not at the least scrape together a few suspicions.

I don't know about Coron and olliep13, though I definitely need to watch them some more. I'll get back to you on this.

[DarkLight140]

While I've been checking the thread at fairly frequent intervals, I don't see anything I really need to post. I was hoping someone else would pick up discussion and I could wait until I had a decent opinion on something and evidence to back it up before posting.

[DarkLight140]

My strategy is hardly the perfect for scum to hide under. If nothing else, A viewing of all my posts can give a quick list of all the opinions and thoughts I've offered the entire game. If you want to vote me, vote because I've drawn conclusions with crap logic, or repeatedly pushed the lynching of innocents, or something. Not "Oh, we can't read you" when I've posted more actual content than a good number of others.

I will, therefore, sit back an analyze all I wish. When I've got something to post I will. The fact the my posting comes in a form other than near-constant utterings of my opinion on every issue doesn't make it worse, or more scummy, than yours.

[DarkLight140]

Question: Is the deadline still in effect, with this new development? It changes my thoughts a bit.

I'd have to agree with Mastermind of Sin that, while JDTAY is hardly the most innocent-looking player at the moment, we should probably drop his bandwagon purely on the basis of Coron trying to lynch him. While it's certainly possible that he was part of a different group or is an SK, I don't think that's as likely as Coron trying to toss a lynch onto anyone not his pal, and certainly I'm crossing JDTAY off my list of possible townies, as Coron certainly doesn't seem like one to play that deep of a game.

As for who we should look at now, well, I'm inclined to take a closer look at the people on the JDTAY bandwagon (Mastermind of Sin, commify, Coron, KingEnigma, PeaceBringer). While certainly the town may not have tried to push for his lynch with all their members, it's worth thinking about. As PeaceBringer was in on that, had been under suspicion for his posts, and ALSO, Coron specifically pushed JDTAY over PeaceBringer (this could merely be his opinions on who the best lynchee from his side's view was, but it could be more sinister). I'm not quite willing to commit to a vote, but I'd certainly like to get people's opinions as to the strength of this evidence.

In case someone missed it, the number of players alive dropped to 13, and therefore dropped the number to lynch to 7, rather than 8 as it was before. Careful.

[DarkLight140]

While I'm a bit reluctant to go ahead with five people not voting and several not speaking much, I'd really, really rather this not stall again. Therefore, I'll go along with my thoughts and the trend, and

vote PeaceBringer

now, rather than wait for everyone.

A note that his last post was nine days ago... defending yourself might be a good thing, about now, yes?

[DarkLight140]

Well... I suppose an

unvote PeaceBringer

is in order. While I find the state of his targets a bit disturbing, I'd be willing to bet that a mafia would chance an innocent naming of a random live person. Also, he claimed disturbingly easily, but... for now, at least, he's not worth following for a lynch.

I don't know if we should continue on as we've been. While I don't see anyone new as too suspicious right now, but continuing on and bandwagoning KE and commify for being on the JDTAY bandwagon with Coron may very well lead to another pair of roleclaimed people and leave us back here as before. I don't think we want that, but then, where to turn? Anyone have any ideas?

[DarkLight140]

Of the people on the JDTAY wagon, two have now claimed (Mastermind of Sin, PeaceBringer). Since both seem to have valuble roles, presumably lynching them isn't on the table. If you care to lynch the claimed bodyguard, then I suppose you'd better bring forth your reasons, but I was under the impression that we were silently filing Mastermind of Sin's JDTAY vote away mentally and then going after the people who are more of unknown quantities.

In fact, my entire post was about the value or lack thereof of bandwagoning people who voted JDTAY into more roleclaims. What's not to get?

[DarkLight140]

Mastermind of Sin, he wasn't claiming you were OMGUS voting, he was agreeing with your logic and applying it to PeaceBringer's vote against him earlier. Really, you're being excessively defensive.

[DarkLight140]

Can we get a prod, kick in the pants, or other alerting-signal to get into the thread for KingEnigma and olliep13? Neither of them have been around in a while, and as discussion seems to be slowing, maybe one of them would be inclined to shed light on, well, something or other.

[DarkLight140]

Okay, what's wrong with us all? Surely we can come up with something better than "Start posting, people!" to say.

That said, I'm hypocritically saying that and promising a more detailed post of new thoughts and suspicions tomorrow. Hopefully, other people will be willing to do the same thing. Really, guys, four posts in two days in a game this big is just disgusting.

[DarkLight140]

Okay. Firstly... there are currently 13 people alive. ZONEACE, olliep13, KingEnigma, and Scalebane have not posted since before Coron was shot. Of these people, olliep13 and King Enigma are voting, although their last posts were approximately a month ago in each case. ZONEACE and Scalebane both posted last promising more detailed thought/greater participation soon, and have not returned in more than two weeks. I think all four should be considered strongly for replacement. By which I mean, replaced overnight or even sooner if at all possible. If nothing else, a new perspective might kick the game into gear.

On to my suspicions.

Firstly, with regards to lazarusmoth, the biggest thing I pick up from him is his continued pushing for Mastermind of Sin- all the way back to his and Coron's spamfest however many pages ago. He seems to have trouble bringing up his reasons in a concerted fashion, or maybe just doesn't bother with doing so. Therefore, I've tried to collect them: MoS has good chemistry with Coron, hops around in votes, stalled when roleclaiming, didn't die the night after he claimed doc, and can deflect suspicions well. The validity of these, well, is up to the reader, I suppose. I, at least, am willing to give Mastermind of Sin another night. I would almost have marked laz as a cop role of some sort until this recent unvote. Now, I just don't know. He also went after HairyMezican and mentioned Maximus and Coron as well, but as there's a mix of alignments there, I don't think that's either in his favor or against. As for his apparent backpedaling now... we'll see what he has to say.

Secondly, Save The Dragons. joe posted almost nothing other than votes; after pushing hard but mostly unsupportedly for HM he started voting for MoS with no reasoning at all. STD came into the game voting laz. He brought up mostly what I just said, but found it enough to vote. In any case, I don't find him particularly scummy.

Thirdly, Thesp. bigbenwd was essentially useless, doing nothing but lynching ZONEACE. He entered the game actively, tried to get read on everyone, although he had a neutral read on Coron, which might be the safest move to make. Most of his time has been spent raging against inactivity, lack of reasoning, and persuing people for those reasons. While it's easy to believe that he's actually opposed to these things and feels so strongly about it, if none of the townies were lurkers or people who vote without reasoning, it could make excellent cover.

Fourthly (I need to stop using this pattern), Uraj45. He advocated no lynch day 1, but eventually changed to voting claimed goons since he felt more day 1 claims would be bad. Since then he's gone mostly with the crowd, voting and unvoting Mastermind of Sin around his claim, PeaceBringer after Thesp attacked his style, JDTAY around Coron's shooting, then PeaceBringer around his claim. I'd call that pattern more than a bit suspicious.

Fifthly (Gah! I can't stop!), commify. He went after Coron early, following laz's post about his chemistry with MoS, and tried to push the lynch that way rather than towards claimed goons. Later, he quietly aligned against Maximus but didn't vote against him. He aligned against JDTAY, and since that dissolved, has sort of been sitting and supported other's points. Scummy? Maybe. I'm not sure.

Sixthly and lastly, JDTAY. He started the game by going against Locus, and then left for HairyMezican. He continued to push HM until he died, a which point he voted the newly arrived Thesp, but quickly took that back after a comment from me. As people started to bandwagon him, he claimed an unspecified role that needs several more nights to work, and said that his going after only confirmed innocent all game was relatively meaningless (while I'll say that it isn't, I definitely wouldn't expect a mafia kill on HM when it puts JDTAY in that situation if he was one of them). Finally, he hinted at possible resuls tomorrow if he lives through the night. He seems very aware that he's inactivebut is taking few steps to correct this. If not for the whole Coron issue, I'd probably be taking a very, very close look at him.

I'm not going to bother making summaries for the really bad lurkers (who I want replaced), myself (for whom I'm hopelessly biased), or Mastermind of Sin and PeaceBringer (who have claimed and, further, probably been looked over already by anyone who cares). In any case, I'm not actually voting anyone just yet, but hopefully this helps people reach conclusions.

[DarkLight140]

I know that it's probably not that great of a solution, but I would advocate putting the game on hold until we can get some decent replacements. There's no way that what we've got going now will live up to the game's full potential, and deadlining continually when four-six people are unable to carry on a decent discussion of twice their number is hardly fair, to anyone. The worst part, of course, is that the townies can kill off those who speak a lot- after all, those are the people most valuble to the mafia, yes?- and then there's really no one left.

Therefore, mod, can we get drastic modkills, replacements, game on hold, ANYTHING other than just saying that the game will move forward burdened by a huge amount of dead-weight-players? I don't think this is fun for any parties involved.

(As for you, commify, standing by a vote against someone early on is hardly the best argument for your innocence when they're dead and confirmed town.)

[DarkLight140]

Whoa! This game started again... with a

lot

of replacements. And deaths. This'll be... uh... interesting.

In any case, note that olliep13 has a different emote next to his name in the front than a the townies. This raises the ugly possibility of another enemy group, although he could, I suppose be working alone.

As for you, PeaceBringer, sure, I'll buy it. Hopefully Thesp will show up and try to defend himself soon. If we do lynch him and it turns out he's not anti-mafia... we'll see. This is your very first investigation with a non-dead target, after all, according to what you've said. Even so-

Vote: Thesp

.

[DarkLight140]

Ugh...

unvote

. This bears consideration. I'll start pouring over the thread, I guess, and in the meantime, let's get some replacements posting.

[DarkLight140]

Have you seen PeaceBringer's claim? He said he investigated the

exact same people

as Thesp now claims. Thus, the problems. I'm not seeing anything that pushes me over the edge one way or the other at the moment, but then, I have yet to do a decent comparison. I've been putting it off because it will undoubtedly take quite a bit of time, and be doubly tough thanks to their very different play styles.

At the moment, I'm thinking we might be best off just lynching one and then killing the other based on their innocence (or lack thereof). Which one, of course, is the big question.

[DarkLight140]

Have you guys abandoned the concept of reading through the thread, or at least remembering it? Coron died the exact same way yesterday- during the day, shot right between the eyes. You were even there, STD. What you said at the last one was "Holy crud! We got day-vigged...good job whoever you are... " Why in the world would you leap to a different conclusion this time?

As to what to do now, I would like to turn to JDTAY's replacement, NanookTheWolf. JDTAY's last post (on Feb 22) said, "I really don't have any good leads, but if you guys let me survive to night I might just turn up with something good." This implies an information role of some sort, and if there's that "something good" to be had... you should probably spill anything you've got, or claim to still have nothing, NanookTheWolf.

Bear in mind, though, that when JDTAY said "I could be really beneficial to the mafia. Just give me a few more nights... ", it was Day 3, and with only eight people and a whopping six kills in this night/day cycle (four last night, one just now, and a lynch), you probably don't have another day to be given.

[DarkLight140]

I'm not particularly against lazarusmoth, but on the other hand, I came very close to casting a vote for him yesterday. I had trouble getting much of a read on him (something not helped by his lack of talkativeness today) and so was more than a little reluctant to lynch. If we can't come up with anything better, or anything against it, though...

[DarkLight140]

Unless I'm mistaken, lazarusmoth is now one from a lynch, so, I'll hold off or now and see if he's got anything to say. Although, really, StevieT92 just posting nothing but 'sorry, busy, getting a bad vibe' strikes me as kind of useless and potentially harmful. And further, the player he replaced was mostly useless, too, although not particularly scummy. So... based on what lazarusmoth says, I'll go one way or the other.

[DarkLight140]

Huh. The Head Rock showed up... hooray...

Given that nothing useful is being posted anyway, I'll squander this post mumbling about how horrible it is to be in a game where 50% of the players have been replaced in the last day. And also urging people to post, if only to show that they're here.

[DarkLight140]

Wait a minute. Nanook, I know that you were in fact arguing for Thesp's lynch, but why didn't you claim spy with an investigation on him right then? We already knew you had an information role of some sort, so it wouldn't be that much of a stretch or make you much more of a target. Besides, if you were perfectly willing to claim a moment after his death, when anything you had was rendered useless, why not before, when it would at least get slow or doubting people to vote correctly?

[DarkLight140]

Someone being me. To me, at least, it was a major issue that needed clearing up during the day... I'd just forgotten in all of the cop claiming.

StevieT92, I would say you're wrong- that claim is somewhat verifiable. I really doubt that the Godfather would have only one "Accomplice", but two sounds about right. Therefore, either someone else will counterclaim (no reason not to, really, if all they are now is effectively a Goon), or no one will. Silence from everyone would be a large point in favor of your innocence.

[DarkLight140]

Huh. You know, I almost want to ask for a replacement for StevieT92 just based upon his virtual incoherence.

[DarkLight140]

Uh... guys... why are you voting StevieT92? I understand that he's being foolish, incoherent, and alternately lurkerish and annoying, but he's a hell of a lot closer to being a confirmed innocent based upon his claim than most of us. Lynching him would be, as I see it, a stupid move, since we can't really afford to lose even dead weight at this point, if it's

innocent

dead weight. He's now one from a lynch by my count, and, well, that's bad.

Unvote, people, unless you really think he's scummy enough to lynch in spite of looking about as innocent as we seem to be getting before factoring in poor play. If you do... well... we'll see if that becomes an issue.

[DarkLight140]

As far as 'clues' from the mod go, look at this: "Quietly, the body of Maximus, the lowly Goon slumps down onto the ground." From his deathscene. Was there a single Goon? No. This means that format is hint-less, I'd say. We're hardly playing outguess-the-mod games in any case by taking what's clearly a plural ("his accomplices") to mean that more than one Accomplice was in the setup. Unfortunately, it seems to me that the entire Godfather-and-Accomplice thing failed to live up to its potential, but I'd call this fairly clear-cut.

If you've got other suspicions, please share them. I would be willing to seriously consider a lynch of anyone but myself (obviously), StevieT92, or PeaceBringer. When momentum gets going in the wrong direction, the only thing to do is point out a decent one, and while I've got a few thoughts, nothing is particularly strong.

[DarkLight140]

I was talking more to Mr. Flay, and making essentially the same point you just made, Save The Dragons: The plural, "accomplices" shows something, whereas what he seemed to be interpreting as an exclusive, "the Accomplice", does not. The Goons were a supporting example.

Aside from his poor play, where

are

you deriving your vote? I don't think that if he were scum, he'd accuse people with the serious intention of turning his bandwagon into a lynch of someone else that... badly. I mean, it's a serious bungling of that objective. Your argument, from what I can tell, is "His role can't be confirmed because it involves guessing at the setup, so lynch him for being scummy." I don't buy that.

[DarkLight140]

You know... I'm starting to think I should have lynched lazarusmoth yesterday, when I had the chance. His play was scummy then, and I was holding off mostly because... well, I'll get to that later if it becomes relevant.

As for Mr. Flay, I don't particularly like the way he keeps stressing his ignorance of lazarusmoth's actions. He revoted StevieT92 on a basis of lurking after he said he thought of him as safe due to the claim. That seems more than a little off... How is voting for an innocent person, even one who's lurking, a good thing? His supposed ambiguity on there being more than one accomplice was more than a little off- and anyway, what scum would claim Accomplice when there's such a high liklihood of one being out there?

I'll agree that STD has been acting messed up, but for some reason he doesn't strike me as nearly so suspicious as Mr. Flay.

Vote: Mr. Flay.

For future reference, NanookTheWolf is behind him on my suspect list, being claiming a third spy immediately after his investigation was proven right. And yes, I know I prompted it, but he should have decided either to claim or not claim, after Thesp was accused by PeaceBringer, and stuck to that.

[DarkLight140]

NanookTheWolf- First, your earlier self was JDTAY, who was really not under much suspicion when we went to night. No one was pressing any accuasations, as far as I can tell reading back. My post was the first one directly dealing with your role, afia or otherwise, since you'd jained the thread. All I said was, "This implies an information role of some sort, and if there's that "something good" to be had... you should probably spill anything you've got, or claim to still have nothing, NanookTheWolf." Hardly something it's vital to defend yourself against. You most recent post, in fact, makes me wonder what you're thinking...

SSF352- Catching the townies, which at this point probably means only a single person, is more important than keeping any single role alive, even a power role. Any Accomplice would be counterclaiming to get the townie lynched- and then they'd live just based on the fact that they'd won the game.

[DarkLight140]

Uh... SSF352, "He never said anything about defending"? Did you miss the "I had accusations pressed against me due to my earlier self (Laz). I had to defend myself" line, which was pretty much the basis for my entire post?

Mr. Flay... A Wise Guy? Huh. I'm not sure if that's in-flavor, but I'll ponder its ramifications to strategy for a while anyway before making a final decision. Temporary

unvote

.

[DarkLight140]

After consideration, I don't think I buy the Wise Guy claim. When compared to the other pro-mafia roles we know, namely Goon, Assasin, Hitman, Accomplice, Godfather, Bodyguard, and Spy, it just doesn't seem to fit. The reason I was commenting on was that I felt that lazarusmoth was implicitly claiming a power role that would undoubtedly kill him that night if he claimed by remaining silent even in the face of one-from-lynch.

However, does that work at all with this claim? I think not. If he had the role Mr. Flay describes, lazarusmoth would probably have been willing to claim fairly quickly- he would have claimed second Bodyguard, probably. Something to draw a kill but probably not a protect. He knew that we were turning against him, and he'd have no reason not to be perfectly willing to claim something good with a role like that. The Lynch All Liars policy hardly applies to a role like that.

As I see it, we're left with two options regarding Mr. Flay. Given that four kills happened last night, and two killing groups (the Godfather and the Deputy) died, there should be two nightkills left. One of these, presumably, is pro-mafia, since we've already accounted for two anti-mafia groups. We can therefore try an attempted-nightkill confirmation method, with the pro-mafia killer coming out tomorrow and proclaiming their identity, or we can lynch him and figure it's not too much of a loss, since all we're losing is a pro-mafia vote that wouldn't draw kills and might draw investigations anyway.

The former has the weaknesses that we have no hard knowledge of the second killer's alignment, we'd be wasting Mr. Flay's ability if it is as he claimed, and finally, Mr. Flay could be an invincible-at-night townie. The latter, obviously, costs us our lynch and sends us to night, though it could win us the game if Mr. Flay is the only Townie left. Opinions?

Mr. Flay, by the way, I didn't mean to say JDTAY. I meant to quote NanookTheWolf, which I did. I have trouble using the Quote format effectively, and it gets on my nerves anyway.

[DarkLight140]

The "only if it's relevant" comment was in place against just this eventuality. I felt that my non-lynching of lazarusmoth had reasons, but that if I were to share them, you would gain something of an advantage if scum. Now that you've claimed and can't use my reasoning to build a better claim, I've shared it. I do not have any role-based information, since you seem to be implicitly asking that. I'm sorry if the others voting with me aren't acting correctly, but I feel I have enough against you to warrant my vote.

As everyone here can probably say of themselves, there is something special about me. However, I have no intention of claiming what it is unless pressed pretty close to a lynch. And as for my pro-mafianess, I can only say it's genuine. Rest assured that if you are indeed what you've claimed, I'll be looking at the people who were so eager to see you killed and the people who hung back with the same critical eye that rests on you now.

[DarkLight140]

Oh. Forgot I'd unvoted. Vote:

Mr. Flay

...

[DarkLight140]

Man... the mafia threw that one. I seriously thought that olliep13 was woring alone, although I'd had some suspicions... there's no way I expected that. The worst part was, I had NanookTheWolf marked as a good kill for tomorrow. This game frustrates me. Good job, Authorities, I guess, but... ugh. The game falling apart halfway through didn't help, but... I don't know. This game ends for me with more a sense of frustration and being cheated than respect for your skills.

9/21 people being anti-mafia is a LOT. In fact, they had numerical superiority from Night 2 on, unless I'm reading this wrong. That's... wow. No wonder everyone was so willing to lynch claimed goons.

Also, losing the pro-mafia independent killers Night One, and myself not being able to take my first shot until Day Three to make up for it, hurt us a bit.

[DarkLight140]

Heh. The daykilling was fun. I don't know why Quagmire didn't start partying with it Day One... I was quite proud of my townie-sense, until I realized after the game just how easy it would have been to hit. I would have been happy killing more than half the game since the start of Day 3.

The Authorities being completely invisible, not even hinted at, really hurt. I was trying to find people working together, and the Authorities firstly all lurked the hell out of everything, and after they got replaced I thought I had a pretty good idea of who the townies were already, so I was kind of off guard (though I probably would have shot NanookTheWolf, not Thesp, if not for the investigation claim).