Normal Idea Mafia Discussion

[Alianna]

I will get this into signups as soon as we feel that any potential issues have been sorted out.

17, 36, and 39 are problematic, as outlined in this post, so changes will need to be made to those.

[Alianna]

Is anyone going to be upset with me if I actually edit posts to errata the problematic roles?

Personally, I wouldn't be.
I don't know if this addresses the concern, but if you wanted, you could leave a note saying what the post originally was.

[Alianna]

The game is now in queue, but likely won't go into signups for a bit. I'm accepting pre-ins though.

[Alianna]

The game is now in signups in the Open Queue!

[Alianna]

if you do then rerun setup with one confirmed VT since thats required in every normal game

This is a good idea. Maybe even multiple confirmed VTs, given how townsided it was last game.

[Alianna]

Against my better judgement, I'm considering doing a second run of this setup. Would people be interested in playing? If so, what changes would you like to see from last time? For example, one that's already been discussed is having a certain number of guaranteed VT slots to balance out the level of town power.

[Alianna]

Kind of forgot about this thread, sorry.
Maybe allowing a maximum of one goon could work as a compromise?

[Alianna]

To avoid headaches, I think I'm also going to add a rule that if a night action conflict can't be resolved by either the Golden Rule or the priority list here, the conflicting actions all fail.

[Alianna]

Kind of forgot about this thread, sorry.
Maybe allowing a maximum of one goon could work as a compromise?

But then you should disallow universal backup universal backup

Somehow it didn't register that that was what happened last time.
Let me think.

[Alianna]

Maybe, instead, disallow anything that would cause an entire faction to be functionally vanilla?

[Alianna]

Against my better judgement, I'm considering doing a second run of this setup. Would people be interested in playing? If so, what changes would you like to see from last time? For example, one that's already been discussed is having a certain number of guaranteed VT slots to balance out the level of town power.

Either ban or re-roll any setup that'd prevent an entire faction from killing solely from the roles they rolled (So entire town rolling BP is fine but something like Compulsive Lazy Commuter Serial Killer should be rerolled)

Is town included in this (i.e. town must have at least one power role that can kill), or does the execution count for town's killing power?

[Alianna]

Normal Idea Mafia Redux is in queue. Accepting pre-ins.
All changes will be finalized before the setup is rolled, but discussion remains open for now.

Summary of Proposed Changes

• implementing a minimum of one vanilla townie (could increase this) and a maximum of one groupscum goon
  
• rerolling any setup that would cause an entire faction to be functionally vanilla
  
• rerolling any setup that would prevent an entire faction from killing solely based on the roles they rolled (I may word this as "an entire anti-town faction" to avoid ambiguity about what counts as town killing power)
  
• adding a rule that if a night action conflict can't be resolved by either the Golden Rule or the priority list here, the conflicting actions all fail

I like all of the above changes so far.

[Alianna]

Yeah

Should still be one goon max

I don't know how to solve the issue but this may not be enough; last time, there was indeed only one goon by the letter, but in effect the entire scumteam was functionally vanilla

That's why I proposed just rerolling any setup that would cause an entire faction to be functionally vanilla.

[Alianna]

So I expect the roles are all staying the same for future games even though there's been some changes to what's Normal since the list was generated? Like my precious Town 1-Shot Bulletproof Lazy Multitasking Checker Shield got hit with the removal of Multitasking, but now with the update a week ago would be able to have Simultaneous there instead.

If that's the only thing that's no longer Normal, then I think it'd be pretty easy to remove the multitasking modifier from all roles that have it and replace it with simultaneous for those it's applicable to (i.e. those with more than one personal ability). Perhaps also enable inherent multitasking, since the two modifiers aren't exactly the same. The only reason I didn't enable inherent multitasking last time was because certain roles had that modifier.

[Alianna]

See, I don't know if that's the only thing, just the only thing that I noticed for obvious reasons. Figuring out if there's others would require a lot of effort going through all the roles to check them against the updates, so I figured that it's probably just all staying as is, as a testament to what was Normal at the time.

I took a quick look at the update and the multitasking modifier seems to be the only thing that was removed, so I think we're good on that front.
Only other thing was the name changes. I do intend to use the new names, should be pretty easy to get those edited into the role deck.

[Alianna]

I'm slightly in favour of updating the multitasking modifiers, but I don't think there's any particular issue with leaving them as they are. I'll wait for others to weigh in on that.

[Alianna]

I'm slightly in favour of updating the multitasking modifiers, but I don't think there's any particular issue with leaving them as they are. I'll wait for others to weigh in on that.

I'd say that changing them (passively) all to Simultaneous will make them more aligned with the Normal guidelines.

Yeah, an update is necessary if we want the roles to be in accordance with the new Normal guidelines (which I would prefer).

[Alianna]

NIM Redux has filled and should launch soon. The following list of changes will be in effect.

• There will be a minimum of one vanilla townie and a maximum of one groupscum goon.
  
• I will reroll any setup that would cause an entire faction to be functionally vanilla.
  
• I will reroll any setup that would completely prevent an entire anti-town faction from killing.
  
• I am adding a rule that if a night action conflict can't be resolved by either the Golden Rule or the priority list here, the conflicting actions all fail.
  
• The role deck will be edited to reflect the new role names and to remove the multitasking modifier, replacing it with the simultaneous modifier when applicable.
  
• Inherent multitasking will be enabled.

[Alianna]

All of the above edits to the role deck have been completed.

[Alianna]

Does this SK run afoul of the rule against an antitown faction not being able to kill?

That was the example Python gave, but now that I read it, I don't think it would actually break such a rule. It only prevents the SK from killing before they're the last anti-town player left.
I know I said changes were final, but I did make one more tweak to that rule for the sake of simplicity and clarity. That SK role is still legal.