i procrastinated opening this dead thread

[Bingle]

Eh. Game was basically unwinnable mechanically.

Also, genuinely, I’m massively disappointed with the listmod submissions here. There’s just a ton of anti fun roles.

[Bingle]

no fakeclaims provided even woth a death miller
I'll be ahead and betray that we killed koba because none of us fakeclaimed and we didn't think Koba would endgame (so we'd take the auto guilty when four are alive rather than two or one)
also he had good read or something I don't read

Koba had 2/4 scum pegged and was a guilty waiting to happen. I wouldn’t have shot them because there were other, more dangerous investigations (PC’s claim was almost a full cop, thetas claim WAS full cop) and I am pretty good at mitigating specifically Koba, but the logic behind the kill was sound. In order to have a real shot at winning we basically needed to have all four scum power wolf and endgame town before Koba died, and that was already off the table when you repped in.

[Bingle]

But also a lot of roles, like mine, CCS, yours, were just boring.

AniX’s role was “agree to artificially extend day phases” to the point that xyzzy literally changed the rules mid game. Theta’s role existed to never be used. Skyg’s role is a less interesting puppeteer, which is already hard to implement well. Ircher is a neighborizor who doesn’t get to fully engage with dayplay if he uses a net even utility night action, also known as vanilla town.

Like, unironically, the only interesting role so far this game is cooks, and it was… not great.

[Bingle]

i thought my fakeclaim was an interesting role too

Well it was, I just feel like it would make more sense if you chose what modifier to give (and would actually be a more believable claim).

It would have been believable if either you had a list of potential modifiers or didn't specify negative modifier. It specifying both meant that the modifiers would have to be objectively negative in every potential case which is just a nightmare from a modding perspective and outright impossible in this game.

It was a pretty cool fakeclaim though, if you discount it not working in the context of this game. Much better than Mr. "Fakeclaim as "Not a Cop"" in the town.

[Bingle]

Also, AniX has made impressively bad calls with Night Actions this game.

[Bingle]

It would be against site rules for xyzzy to let you do so after you got dead thread access, because theoretically your decision could have changed because of dead thread info.

[Bingle]

i don't think it's a matter of site rules bingle. this game literally has a role that revives dead players as treestumps

And in order to not break site rules, players were not given access to this thread while it was still possible to reanimate them.

Allowing a dead player to read a dead thread with mod provided setup information and then make game affecting decisions is literally undue mod influence, which is against site rules without specific listmod approval.

[Bingle]

depending on who the last scum is i was probably more useful as a cop to be honest than as a tree stumper

100% accurate.

[Bingle]

Btw, xyzzy, if you want to run another veiled committee game I’d like to volunteer to look over the setup for you. Catching corner case interactions is literally my specialty as a reviewer.

[Bingle]

btw, re:mod influence, as a rule I always answer "yes" to the "this game might have any of these elements" question, which includes mod influence. my last game had a role that more or less said "you can submit whatever night action you want. I'll decide if I think it's fair and potentially tweak it if I think it's too powerful." I conferred with the designer of the treestump role on adding the 24 hour clause to make running a dead thread more straightforward, but in terms of how I submitted it to the queue, strictly speaking I could've just made the choice to let dead players into the dead thread immediately and be extremely lolconsequences about it. that being said I didn't want to do that because, as mentioned awhile back, I like to err on the side of making sure the game isn't bullshit.

My bad. I checked and technically you could mod influence in a way that would allow dead players to make game decisions in a way that would be within the site rules.

The key is to have something like non mechanically necessary mod information you need to have list mod approval via marking bastard AND reviewer approval for the specific bastardry. I'd forgotten you got approval for a reviewless game when running this one. I would be fairly disappointed in you as a mod (honestly you're on my shortlist for best mod on site) if you made a game where this kind of direct mod influence (mod influence not precipitated by roles or setup gimmick) took place though.

If you do come up with another setup where you don't navigate all the interactions pregame, I would recommend having a non spoiled person you trust to run setup questions by. Their input should help remove subconscious mod bias like "This team is already winning hard, I should probably rule against them."

FWIW, I think you absolutely made the right call with me being unable to recruit DE and with me being recruited (nowhere is AMWAY referred to as a faction, so it's reasonable that it wouldn't be the main faction). I definitely would have let Theta's modifier apply to the day recruitment, despite how absolutely broken that would have been, because RAW that's how I think it would function, but you made the call that made your game less garbage and I respect that.

[Bingle]

I can confirm that I knew ranger was wrong about submitters on D1.

[Bingle]

Honest question to everyone:

Considering my role flip which is 90% identical to my claim, do you think AniX was justified in scumreading me heavily off of my claim? (I think definitely not, because my role literally did nothing to prevent AniX's mechsolve which btw never actually came into fruition)

Also, considering again that AniX thought my role was fake, do you think I could have prevented myself getting vigged by claiming my real role on Day 2, even though it's 90% identical? (I think probably not, but open to to critique. I'm asking because I want to improve my play in the future.)

Generally in an actual massclaim like this one you shouldn’t lie about your role and AniX was completely justified in vigging you. Your claim was scummy as shit.

Also, I heavily implicated you mechanically via Amway shit.

And yeah, it’s pretty much always reasonable to shoot someone who lies in massclaim, is called out on it, and then continues not fullclaiming. They have literally proven themselves to be untrustworthy.

[Bingle]

yeah ircher was only scum in the aureal scum world lol

its good they have such a tiny PoE tho

I agree that town would lose this game without like nine mechclears.

[Bingle]

i'd like to propose a difference in modifier notation

Alignment Modifier Role

versus

Modifier Alignment Role

, where the foremost just affects the named actions to the right, and the second option affects any actions the role takes (or affects the player, versus the roles they have)

I use hyphens or brackets as necessary to denote when a modifier is linked to a specific part of a role as opposed to the player themselves, but it would be a cool thing to standardize