Open 885: Backup6 [Game Over]

[Dannflor]

eh

I think the initial setup posts to enter today look scummy but I see town making outrageous posts like that a lot

Rereading though, I don’t love the following reaction to being pushed for these posts. The reaction feels a little like being caught for the wrong reasons

[Dannflor]

I mostly don’t know where CCS’ confidence comes from

[Dannflor]

It doesn’t seem to match up with CCS entering the day being like “oh I have to reevaluate everything now” because dunn flipped town?

[Dannflor]

didnt see the flip at first

i was so sure about dunnstral that now I'm not sure on anyone anymore i might have to reassess my townreads

VOTE: Aureal

im not letting you get to elo

ok ya aureal and dann is my solve lmao

meowmeow and abnegation are just blind

at least for abnegation, shes defending aureal by saying she "trusts in her ability to roll town"

idk the tone on these just don’t seem to jive

I also don’t get the hyper confidence in iavh as town

[Dannflor]

VOTE: ccs

[Dannflor]

UNVOTE:

[Dannflor]

idk i don't know what im doing this game

[Dannflor]

i don't get why you are so confident in aureal

[Dannflor]

do you think i should have confidence in something right now

[Dannflor]

I'm just unvoting because I don't have conviction right now and want to wait until I have time to come back to the game and get some

[Dannflor]

I don't know why you aren't more suspicious of me Black

[Dannflor]

I feel like if CCS is scum he’s trying to make me look like his partner

[Dannflor]

the like “Dann is PRETENDING” feels disingenuous

[Dannflor]

I would be naturally suspicious or at least paranoid of someone who tunneled me most of D1 and also has been widely scum read

[Dannflor]

ok

[Dannflor]

im sorry ccs your behavior here is just looking weird and i don't think that's automatically scummy but it feels weirdly forced and i can't figure out why that is

[Dannflor]

VOTE: camelcasedsnivy

[Dannflor]

Why could you go me all of a sudden, Black

[Dannflor]

aureal what made you switch from snivy to abnegation

[Dannflor]

Why do you scum read me, CCS?

[Dannflor]

I feel similarly

[Dannflor]

Black, why do you town read Snivy?

[Dannflor]

VOTE: abnegation

[Dannflor]

her posting on this page and the last feels… performative to me and not in a town way

[Dannflor]

I’ve decided that two minute read is more accurate than any read I’m gonna get by rereading and analyzing the game

[Dannflor]

I think like the chances are that snivy and his scum team mate planned out a dumbslip over the night time is pretty slim, and if scum that was just something snivy instinctually did at day start

But I think meowmeow considering that world is pretty towny in terms of complex thoughts town are more likely to have

[Dannflor]

ok hear me out

[Dannflor]

aureal/abnegation

[Dannflor]

is that a thing

[Dannflor]

this is another 2 minute read based off nothing but aureal and abnegation’s posting towards each other feeling distant and mechanical


like i can totally imagine abnegation being like “time to initiate push Aureal protocol #0345 as discussed in the Scum PT” and then making 1101

and then Aureal is like “yes time for some Banter with my scum team mate”

idk i haven’t actually gone back to see if there is anything especially clearing about Generic/Aureal but considering my last 5 hour solve lead me to T3/Dunnstral as a solve I feel like this can’t possibly be any worse

[Dannflor]

meh i agree snivy/abnegation seems more sane

I don’t know why tho snivy’s tone gets me

[Dannflor]

what do you think of an abnegation elimination today

like how does it compare to a snivy elimination for you

[Dannflor]

VOTE: camelcasedsnivy

[Dannflor]

black was at e-2 so she's town for that

[Dannflor]

I don't really know why I'm hard town reading you

There's a paranoid part of me that's like uh oh maybe meowmeow is someone I always scum read when she's town and now that she's scum her tone shifts in a way that makes me town read her

but for a few reasons that paranoia hasn't really gripped me in a way I've taken seriously, at least not yet

I think the game just makes a little more sense if you're town ig and i kinda town read your predecessor and i think you're being pretty towny in unforced ways

idk maybe I'm underestimating your scum game but also I have a feeling you might have just eliminated me already if you were scum

[Dannflor]

rational brain says:

black and meowmeow are top town
aureal and iavh are lean town

which leaves abnegation and snivy as the solve

[Dannflor]

I don't really scum read aureal I just felt like the aureal / abnegation interactions felt super forced

that could just be because one of them is scum not both

[Dannflor]

I think something just really rubs me the wrong way about abnegation lackadaisically pushing aureal as if that wagon has a decent chance of going through when me/snivy/abnegation have been the talked about wagons all day

[Dannflor]

but idk camelcasedsnivy's emotions don't really feel real to me either so I'm happy to sheep you there

[Dannflor]

aureal isn't someone I'm interested in flipping today

[Dannflor]

for me it's between ccs/abnegation and my waffling has been about who between those two i think makes more sense teamed with someone else or just individually seems more likely to flip red

my confidence isn't high enough on abnegation that if you feel significantly better about ccs flipping red then I'm happy to follow you there

[Dannflor]

idk i don't know what im doing this game

[Dannflor]

ive literally tried to many times to get a better read on you ccs and you've just ignored me so idk what to do with you if you're actually town ccs

[Dannflor]

idk maybe CCS is actually wolfy

he needs to explain his Aureal scum read better

i also wanna know why iavh is so town to him

are you saying im scum?

you thought iavh was town before that though - is that just like a soul read?

im just asking you to explain your reads more bro pls

I mostly don’t know where CCS’ confidence comes from

It doesn’t seem to match up with CCS entering the day being like “oh I have to reevaluate everything now” because dunn flipped town?

i don't get why you are so confident in aureal

im sorry ccs your behavior here is just looking weird and i don't think that's automatically scummy but it feels weirdly forced and i can't figure out why that is

Why do you scum read me, CCS?

[Dannflor]

I don't really know why I'm hard town reading you

There's a paranoid part of me that's like uh oh maybe meowmeow is someone I always scum read when she's town and now that she's scum her tone shifts in a way that makes me town read her

but for a few reasons that paranoia hasn't really gripped me in a way I've taken seriously, at least not yet

I think the game just makes a little more sense if you're town ig and i kinda town read your predecessor and i think you're being pretty towny in unforced ways

idk maybe I'm underestimating your scum game but also I have a feeling you might have just eliminated me already if you were scum

could you like elaborate on the reasons other than the last line

the way people i am scum reading are treating your slot (abnegation, ccs) feels like they are tiptoeing around you in a way that they know you are town

you are reevaluating and making really nuanced reads constantly and i think at a certain point scum!you might just put in a little less effort because you really don't need to in this game state?

[Dannflor]

generic what do you think about CCGeek now?

notification hehehehehe

[Dannflor]

CCS has been super omgusy with me and Aureal but arguably you (meowmeow) have been pushing him hardest out of everyone? I've swapped off him several times and Aureal is pushing abnegation now

I just feel if CCS did really think scum were pushing him he'd lend more credence to considering or interacting with your slot but he seems stuck on dannflor/aureal which was like a gut take he spewed like 5 minutes into the day so yeah it just seems inconsistent from him

[Dannflor]

and like i doubt scum!ccs thinks he can get a miselim on you but i think aureal and more likely me are more viable targets

[Dannflor]

uh well if you were bussing him here i'd expect him to play that up in some way or at least look like he was interacting with you

it's not very intuitive to just ignore your partner hard pushing you i don't think?

[Dannflor]

im not scum zzz

[Dannflor]

abnegation why are you pushing aureal still no one wants to join you there

[Dannflor]

VOTE: abnegation

i don't think this is a town approach to today

[Dannflor]

ill vote whichever of ccs or abnegation we can get more support for

[Dannflor]

mafia never use sarcasm



/s

[Dannflor]

5 hours til deadline btw

[Dannflor]

couldn't there be a cop/rb too

[Dannflor]

ive decided not to say anything more about this game until a flip happens because i dont want to be horribly wrong

[Dannflor]

i think it's not worth talking about until tomorrow

[Dannflor]

ccs im town and i think you are town

[Dannflor]

if you can believe im town

Black’s D1 wagon was all town

that doesn’t mean anything necessarily but

[Dannflor]

ccs im town and i think you are town

lol when did you townread me

like nowish

[Dannflor]

wait

[Dannflor]

i think it's unlikely meowmeow/black is ever the team

which means if i believe snivy is town then iavh is always scum

[Dannflor]

if we assume theres one scum on abnegation wagon that means one of you/black

which i can agree

i don't think black is scum and even if i did i doubt whoever are the other 2 townies would vote black with me so you seem like a good pick

idrk what you are saying here snivy

[Dannflor]

if you can believe im town

Black’s D1 wagon was all town

that doesn’t mean anything necessarily but

actually if the driving forces of that were me/generic I think scum can easily steer clear of that wagon in a town!Black world

[Dannflor]

Black I don't know why you think a meowmeow/dannflor team would have meowmeow hard bus me D1 to E-1 and me hard town read her all the while

[Dannflor]

tbh i think if meowmeow is scum she can only be teamed with iavh/freedom

[Dannflor]

well i don't know why i'd be expecting you to vote anyone other than me snivy

[Dannflor]

i won’t have time to really play mafia for another few hours so please no one like vote or anything in the mean time

[Dannflor]

ok

[Dannflor]

meowmeow can you explain what you meant by you need to take some lessons from your scum game?

[Dannflor]

rereading the early game and i would be very impressed if ccgeek and black was scum/scum

[Dannflor]

no it’s 2:30 am

prime time to try and solve this game

[Dannflor]

also on mobile in bed :p just rereading the game until i fall asleep

[Dannflor]

i dont like how ive been a null or scum slot for most of the game and now I'm being townread as if scum know I'm about to make the wrong choice

Ccs this is a really weird thought

what wrong choice are you about to make

are you calling me and black scum because i think we’re the only ones who stated town reads on you

I don’t get how this thought it related to anything actually happening paranoia or no

[Dannflor]

idk as of 3am im thinking it’s somewhat likely ccs decided to just hard town read his buddy all game and it’s just ccs/iavh but ill take a more proper look at this tomorrow morning

[Dannflor]

so im eliminating a ccs/meowmeow team and a meowmeow/black team

is there any case against a snivy/black team

because if i can eliminate that i would just always be voting iavh here

[Dannflor]

I often get push back for saying things like that but i have proposed in multiple games before that the correct play is just to eliminate the VT claim because they claimed VT

idk i was not trying to get you to claim i thought there was no way you weren’t anything but a VT after that

[Dannflor]

You act like every single player here just makes the correct play in the heat of the moment

It’s not about that

As a PR you are basically conf town unless someone ccs you

Psychologically you would never assume you would get eliminated in an open setup

[Dannflor]

Why have you been so confident in your meow read? I feel like Ausuka is probably a good enough scum player where you should probably have more doubts than you have displayed this game

I mean I probably should have if she’s scum here

Idk i try to generally as a rule only suspect people if i think i have a good reason to not just because they have a reputation of a good scum game

I haven’t felt I’ve had a decent enough reason to consider her seriously as scum until today

[Dannflor]

I don't think of the game that way. I know I should, but I just don't

ok that’s fine but it is how i think about it

[Dannflor]

that being said i also think scum are inherently guilty so maybe im just a weirdo

[Dannflor]

well if CCS is scum he 100% hard defended his partner from my pov

I think it makes some sense in this setup and as newer scum I’ve also had the thought process of “i’ll just defend them so hard no one will think we’re aligned”

I actually won purgatory a notoriously town sided setup off that *brag*

[Dannflor]

What you are saying makes sense though, I'm just surprised you assume all players make the best psychological decision in emotional moments

It’s not about making the best decision

I think you made if town made a bad emotional decision

But i don’t think that decision would have crossed your mind if you had a PR role pm

[Dannflor]

I don’t particularly think Black is scum individually after rereading most of the game

That’s the most compelling reason for me to eliminate ccs/black

[Dannflor]

idk rereading the game last night kinda tunneled me onto snivy

Black what are the specifics behind your town read there

[Dannflor]

If i decide to trust black here im just gonna vote iavh regardless probably because the only two teams left would be iavh/meowmeow and iavh/snivy

I don’t currently think iavh/snivy should be cleared though

[Dannflor]

I think even as a “high effort” player I never swap back and forth between ccs and abnegation so many times yesterday

like what was i doing there if paired with ccs

he very well could have flipped

I wasn’t making myself look good if he did flip red

[Dannflor]

but maybe that’s what i want you to think

[Dannflor]

i find it incredulous snivy thinks i think i can pocket him when our only other game together i was widely town read scum who pushed a miselim on him

[Dannflor]

Idk which but I probably either hard scum or hard town ccs for whatever that is worth

[Dannflor]

UNVOTE: Dunnstral

VOTE: T3

iavh has hammers on both people here so ig he can choose who to express hammer intent on

[Dannflor]

My problem with Snivy’s town read on iavh is that he admits several times his only reasoning is that no one else is defending iavh

Today Snivy admits maybe that was bad reasoning alone

Idk I guess I would expect some reconsideration earlier than today if that was all there was to the read?

[Dannflor]

Boooo idk

It could be meowmeow/iavh

But maybe we can just kill iavh today and I can put off that decision or maybe scum will get scared of my amazing prowess and kill me

[Dannflor]

okay I believe you

[Dannflor]

honestly i think im just like ready to vote but i’ll hold off for freedom and for meowmeow to read and whatever else

If Black is scum

well I guess I can say I told you so or something but I’m willing to bet against myself atp

[Dannflor]

Please don’t if you are town

[Dannflor]

i thought ccs read on iavh looked tmi the whole time

i think I'm supposed to re evaluate in elo so i'm holding off on that but i never liked the read and never will

i always thought iavhs wagon was quite bs but he really was nulltown at best

He’s never really been wagoned

[Dannflor]

@snivy - you have a lot of confident reads today. which one would you say you are most confident in? like, if you had to bet the game on one person's alignment (town or scum), who would it be?

i wouldn't bet the game on anyone's alignment, since some people are just unpredictable. however, if i had to, it would either be my black or iamveryhappy townread

I don’t get the sense this is a null-town read?

[Dannflor]

i forget that all 3 townies in theory would have to be voting scum so i actually have to either abandon dannflor or actually convince yall

who am i partnered with

[Dannflor]

Also like why am i scum

I feel like you’ve never explained your read on me

[Dannflor]

i forget that all 3 townies in theory would have to be voting scum so i actually have to either abandon dannflor or actually convince yall

who am i partnered with

thats the problem i have no idea

as in i dont make sense with anyone?

[Dannflor]

did you read my posting about why i don’t thinj I’d make sense paired with meowmeow? What did you make of that snivy

[Dannflor]

as in theres no one here especially that could be a pair with you after aureal died

speaking of which, what do you think her results were?

Idk i just looked i dont see any crumbs

I might assume me tbh, aureal was scum reading me D1 then seemed to be town reading me more D2

[Dannflor]

Also like why am i scum

I feel like you’ve never explained your read on me

Also just why is your prime suspect me over like meowmeow who hard pushed you all of D2

I don’t understand your confidence in me

[Dannflor]

idk maybe CCS is actually wolfy

he needs to explain his Aureal scum read better

i also wanna know why iavh is so town to him

are you saying im scum?

you thought iavh was town before that though - is that just like a soul read?

im just asking you to explain your reads more bro pls

I mostly don’t know where CCS’ confidence comes from

It doesn’t seem to match up with CCS entering the day being like “oh I have to reevaluate everything now” because dunn flipped town?

i don't get why you are so confident in aureal

im sorry ccs your behavior here is just looking weird and i don't think that's automatically scummy but it feels weirdly forced and i can't figure out why that is

Why do you scum read me, CCS?

i find it incredulous snivy thinks i think i can pocket him when our only other game together i was widely town read scum who pushed a miselim on him

Also like why am i scum

I feel like you’ve never explained your read on me

In a CCS/Dann scum world we’ve decided that i will just endlessly pepper him with interactions and he will ignore me for a large volume of them

[Dannflor]

tbh idk if there's anyone i actually townread here lol

dannflor might actually be the towniest player in the game despite not actually being towny?? but i haven't like sorted out my black thoughts yet

[Dannflor]

Black I don't know why you think a meowmeow/dannflor team would have meowmeow hard bus me D1 to E-1 and me hard town read her all the while

This is what I’m talking about Snivy

[Dannflor]

Idk Snivy you seem kind of lost as to who could be scum here, aside from me

But there are no attempts from you to figure out who could be scum it feels like?

[Dannflor]

meowmeow who are you not willing to vote

pedit thats because me and id imagine iavh are bad at coordinating

Like idk how this question is supposed to help you

[Dannflor]

Idk Snivy you seem kind of lost as to who could be scum here, aside from me

But there are no attempts from you to figure out who could be scum it feels like?

yeah idk what to do

try to figure out which teams make more sense make less sense?

evaluate the chances you could be wrong on your black or iavh town read?

i empathize with being lost and being unsure but like ??????????????????? come on

[Dannflor]

I mean it is demotivating to me too

this F5 sucks and I hate that I'm in the lim pool but uh it's make or break it and I want to win

[Dannflor]

I finished reading up and why does it feel like ccs is trying to pocket me?
But eh, I think I'd probably go for him today.

can you like give a whole lot more

like where are you at on the different slots

any spew at all from reading up would be good

[Dannflor]

you mean town CCS?

[Dannflor]

i keep coming back to iavh being the most likely partner for someone here

idk who that someone is

[Dannflor]

yeah i think everyone is scum but me tbh

[Dannflor]

i mean what i was trying to say was

saying he's 'a likely partner for someone here' confuses my brain.

idk if that's me being stupid but it sounds like he's partnered with everyone

which theoretically could mean 'he has scummy associatives with everyone' or 'that slot is just scum' etc

it's not that much of a point of interest but i am asking so i can parse the thread better

more that the slot just feels like scum

and that i can't clear teams with iavh in them like i can snivy/meowmeow or meowmeow/black

[Dannflor]

meowmeow/Freedom
camelCaseSnivy/Black
Freedom/camelCaseSnivy
Freedom/Black

like these are the teams I'm considering right now so unless it's exactly CCS/Black I should vote Freedom

[Dannflor]

yeah i mean if i didn't have some worry about that i think i would have just voted by now

[Dannflor]

You called me mafia for voting iamveryhappy. Why?

s-scummy wummmy b-baka!
though yes, I do this that CCS does look to have a pockety tone on me.

[Dannflor]

that feels kinda anti-partnery but i can't really put my finger on why

[Dannflor]

camel's defense of IAVH is bad

no it’s not

feels pretty on the nose even if the scum team plan was to be on the nose

[Dannflor]

im convinced there is not a single way i could interact with another slot in the world that would convince snivy i couldn't be scum with them

[Dannflor]

it is unfortunate that slot was allowed to live til elimlo

[Dannflor]

please don't vote me

[Dannflor]

I have also convinced myself freedom is probably not scum with snivy fwiw

[Dannflor]

[T3, CCGeek]
[Generic]
[CCS, Aureal, Dunnstral] - null
[iamveryhappy]
[Black]

I think this is about where I'm at

iamveryhappy I just didn't really like how they randomly popped in to be like "I don't like E-2s"

i will hate myself if this was accurate

[Dannflor]

VOTE: freedom

if we lose y'all can blame me

[Dannflor]

i'd rather lose this way than lose by ccs voting me anyway

[Dannflor]

was it gonna be me

[Dannflor]

i will consider it +EV for me to have made this vote then if you're town

[Dannflor]

Black says they have no thoughts on snivy like 3 distinct times in the early game

I feel it’s somewhat intuitive to have either some thoughts on your partner or not mention them at all

[Dannflor]

Yeah i guess i just wouldn’t expect for back to specifically be like “my partner? still no thoughts there” multiple times

[Dannflor]

I kinda think if freedom is scum their partner probably kinda planned to bus them today

I am really dreading what happens next because i think the most likely scenario is literally snivy gets night killed and then there’s an F3 of me/meowmeow/Black

[Dannflor]

Maybe Black will come along and quick hammer and prove me wrong though there would be some relief to that

[Dannflor]

Or I could be scum…

[Dannflor]

So either Freedom is scum or the scum team just isn't hammering for some dumb reason

I kind of want to say this post increases the odds of Black/iavh

[Dannflor]

I’m happy I made it this far at least

What a nightmare game

[Dannflor]

dann/snivy is such a meme team

[Dannflor]

dann/snivy is such a meme team

you are doing this on purpose

imagine if i was a deepwolf

[Dannflor]

Wait what

[Dannflor]

Did y’all just slowroll

[Dannflor]

gg wp

[Dannflor]

very well played both of you, thanks for modding ircher