Open 900: 7p Wilson [Endgame]

[Aureal]

[Aureal]

Alright, time for us old people to show you whippersnappers how to play oldskool Mafia! Come, Save the Dragons my partner in ancientness and definitely not scum, let us smite the unconfirmed!

VOTE: MargotRosa

[Aureal]

I completed 25 games last year and had to solve all of them, your math is waaaaaaaaay off

[Aureal]

I completed 25 games last year and had to solve all of them, your math is waaaaaaaaay off

I can't believe you finally rolled scum and had to solve for a second scum team

At least this game you can just kill townies

Yeah, Alianna did a good job making sure I had to work to try to catch her townstreak,

technically

breaking up the first one with that blue PM just when I'd gotten to double digits. She's sneaky like that!

[Aureal]

I completed 25 games last year and had to solve all of them, your math is waaaaaaaaay off

I can't believe you finally rolled scum and had to solve for a second scum team

At least this game you can just kill townies

Also she quoted last years numbers.

New year, 2024 is the Year of the Scumbutt Aureal

Yaaaaaaaaaaaah! Let's gooooooooo!

[Aureal]

Yeah it's honestly kinda crazy that Mafia PTs are so much the norm now that apparently the lack of it is supposed to balance the setup? Newbie games were 7p when I signed up so I played several back then, but there'd also be at least a cop or something. Now it's "you get to know the scum aren't talking to each other right now so you don't need a cop" apparently. Well thanks? Scum didn't get daytalk in 2005 either.

[Aureal]

all other posts have been nai

VOTE: save the dragons

You disagree that my luck must change this year and I must finally receive glorious red PMs?

Or is that why you're voting StD?

[Aureal]

Truly spoken, and like one who has not had to solve 25 games in a row.

[Aureal]

But really, why vote someone who's yet to even post?

[Aureal]

Really? Psyche is kinda throwing me for a loop here with the odd positioning on StD and sarcasm to deflect from it.

[Aureal]

You're actually saying you had any sort of read on a slot that took half a day to say hi?

[Aureal]

Like, I've had some suspicion of slow to post slots before, but because they might have been strategizing in the scum pt before making an entrance. Which obviously isn't happening here.

[Aureal]

Does being old/experienced mean you aren't likely to have other stuff besides mafia to do on a Sunday evening?

[Aureal]

why

I can't argue that

Question for Black(and Aureal as well)

What would be the scum motivation from Psyche to post as he has?

Well I was wondering if he's trying to make something out of the way I mentioned StD in my opening post. The mention of 'alliances' makes me think that way, dunno what it means otherwise. If StD is town then playing up a connection there could be beneficial to scum, and they'd want to focus on Dragons first. Could just as well be town trying to make something of the comment. Mostly I'm just struggling to find a train of thought because Psyche seems all over the place. I can't tell how serious to take anything because stuff that seems possibly like an honest thought promptly gets undermined with tongue-in-cheek commentary.

[Aureal]

i…i liked the way you counted your odds of landing a vote on scum, okay?

I thought this might be what you were thinking, but yeah thats really weak. I... don't think scum could possibly be confused enough to try to give the odds of someone being town from a scum PoV because the concept makes no sense from the PoV of someone who already knows.

[Aureal]

i…i liked the way you counted your odds of landing a vote on scum, okay?

I thought this might be what you were thinking, but yeah thats really weak. I... don't think scum could possibly be confused enough to try to give the odds of someone being town from a scum PoV because the concept makes no sense from the PoV of someone who already knows.

to be clear, the rationale is that i don't think scum would bother to add that detail, not that i think they'd get the odds incorrect

It's literally the only thing in the post other than the vote? @_@ It'd just be a naked vote without some comment like that.

[Aureal]

Hmmm. Maybe. I still don't think it's anywhere near as strong a thing as you think.

[Aureal]

Zebedee

[Aureal]

i think the two are in drew, std, aureal

Do you even know anything about Dragons?

[Aureal]

Zebedee

Nice cop out answer

Not my fault they haven't posted to give me anything to work with! Margot is just dead null, Drew is maaaybe a smidge below and the rest of ya a little over null. Z is as good a place to suspect as any.

[Aureal]

Uh what'd Margot even say? "I have no reads, this is probably better than my old hotheaded self"? Don't see anything ai there but I was very busy yesterday and really didn't give it much thought.

[Aureal]

So I guess the question is: what'd YOU see to make you feel good?

[Aureal]

i think the two are in drew, std, aureal

I don't mind this PoE

I'm not really seeing scum!StD yet though

Also, why even call it a PoE, are you seriously feeling that good about your townreads on page five, without Z even posting? How can Z be out of your PoE without posting? Are you actively scumreading Drew and I?

[Aureal]

Oh look, Drew posted in there.

Hmm

Okay, feel free to scumread him

[Aureal]

@mod: prod on Zebedee please?

[Aureal]

Oh look, Drew posted in there.

Hmm

Okay, feel free to scumread him

Posted in where?

In between the last post I looked at and the vote count which somehow is what the new post marker took me to so I didn't see your post until I was in the preview page submitting mine.

[Aureal]

See, don't think I can't see that agenda in calling me 'defensive' over a perfectly reasonable question which I ask all the time when I see people suspecting someone over something that would often be read as scummy but I know from experience with that player actually isn't.

[Aureal]

I'm guessing Zebedee is likely your partner if this is what you need to do already with tightening suspicion on you

[Aureal]

What agenda, lol

The Drew Scum Agenda(tm)!

Seen clearly here by use of loaded language to shade me over my perfectly innocuous communication trying to understand where he's coming from with his read.

[Aureal]

Cool, I can bus Drew freely now

VOTE: Doctor Drew

Actually I was originally gonna wait for Z to show before voting, then after I thought they were likely the partner decided to go ahead and vote anyway. Then Black showed back up and I decided to wait to see if she'd move off Drew because I was starting to see some inconsistent thought from her after re-reading.

Black, I thought we agreed that the scum PMs are for

me

this year. It's not very nice of you guys to take them.

[Aureal]

I think I only did once seventeen years ago, and rather reluctantly it seems from what I gather reading the game.

Yeah I totally read an old scum game of mine this weekend in preparation for this upcoming glorious year

[Aureal]

Thanks for asking before it all flees my mind! Although I nonetheless am taking the way you dropped a vote then went silent overnight only to come back with a response consisting of just one character to be a sign that

you

are nervous scum.

I don't find your forming that poe to make sense with 73 which sounds like you agree with me. Forming a poe already doesn't make much sense in itself, it seems like trying to push a narrative. But the one you came up with is particularly bad, you seem to just be mirroring thread sentiment. Not including Zebedee is pretty wtf.

Also I didn't like your interaction with Drew regarding Margot, it feels like interacting for the sake of it because you gave him a pass at the end but I didn't see his explanation actually explaining things.

[Aureal]

uhhh
what now?
i guess i should try harder to choose between drew and alianna
std's coasting act is likely guaranteed to get him through D1 right

Am I Alianna now? There are certainly worse comparisons

[Aureal]

I do think your bogus read on me "going silent overnight" and then posting one character is more likely to come from town. It's just such an awful point that I don't really think scum!you would use it to try to convince others I'm scum

VOTE: StD

I'll go here for now

Do I need to cite scum you deciding to duck out for a bit rather than risk saying something to mess the situation up?

[Aureal]

I do think your bogus read on me "going silent overnight" and then posting one character is more likely to come from town. It's just such an awful point that I don't really think scum!you would use it to try to convince others I'm scum

VOTE: StD

I'll go here for now

Do I need to cite scum you deciding to duck out for a bit rather than risk saying something to mess the situation up?

Yes because I don't know what you're referring to and now I'm curious

Legit though. I go to bed at 10-10:30 every night. Please don't try to use my sleep schedule against me

Your wish is my command

viewtopic.php?p=13944385#p13944385

[Aureal]

i need to do double line breaks if I'm not going to use punctuation

I always try to do this if I make a long post, for this very reason lol

I do think your bogus read on me "going silent overnight" and then posting one character is more likely to come from town. It's just such an awful point that I don't really think scum!you would use it to try to convince others I'm scum

VOTE: StD

I'll go here for now

Do I need to cite scum you deciding to duck out for a bit rather than risk saying something to mess the situation up?

Can we talk more about you doing whatever you can to defend std now?

Go on, Drew, you're cracking me up

[Aureal]

I do think your bogus read on me "going silent overnight" and then posting one character is more likely to come from town. It's just such an awful point that I don't really think scum!you would use it to try to convince others I'm scum

VOTE: StD

I'll go here for now

Do I need to cite scum you deciding to duck out for a bit rather than risk saying something to mess the situation up?

Yes because I don't know what you're referring to and now I'm curious

Legit though. I go to bed at 10-10:30 every night. Please don't try to use my sleep schedule against me

Your wish is my command

viewtopic.php?p=13944385#p13944385

Ok, so what do you think I was trying to duck here? What situation was I trying to avoid messing up?

Trying to avoid making things worse for Drew ofc, he was pretty clearly getting suspicion from all sides

[Aureal]

i need to do double line breaks if I'm not going to use punctuation

I always try to do this if I make a long post, for this very reason lol

I do think your bogus read on me "going silent overnight" and then posting one character is more likely to come from town. It's just such an awful point that I don't really think scum!you would use it to try to convince others I'm scum

VOTE: StD

I'll go here for now

Do I need to cite scum you deciding to duck out for a bit rather than risk saying something to mess the situation up?

Can we talk more about you doing whatever you can to defend std now?

Go on, Drew, you're cracking me up

Well why are you wilding out anytime puys some pressure on him?

Like now threatening scum meta on Black when she votes std.

Lol, pressure on std

You're the one who's been getting pressure, what do

you

think of Black ditching your wagon like that?

[Aureal]

I'm still down for a Drew fade btw

Nice attempt at distancing.

Your reads are weak and there's still a missing slot but you're actually confident enough to say this? About Drew specifically, even. This is just you putting it on the record that "no guys see, I really did want to fade Drew" after he flips scum.

[Aureal]

but her voting std kinda seems like she wanted to lead Psyche to std over you or me

I voted for StD because I was getting bad vibes from him not doing anything, and Aureal is starting to town ping me

I wouldn't mind if some people followed me there though

What is town pinging you about Aureal?

I feel like her train of thought is coming from a town perspective

Like I said I don't really think scum!her would try to use my sleep schedule as a way to paint me as scum. It feels icky and it's not very convincing, so there's no real reason for her to even mention it if she's scum. I feel like this type of read comes from town!her that is paranoid that I'm scum, and I think it makes sense for her to be paranoid that I'm scum after recent games together

I also see the progression in her thinking I was trying to divert pressure off of you by voting for her. I don't think it's impossible for scum to have partner theories this early but this one actually feels real and genuine to me, idk

I was gonna call this a cheap discrediting attempt but it seems you actually haven't posted later than that, in this game anyway

So FINE you can have your precious SLEEP

[Aureal]

I'm still down for a Drew fade btw

So rude

I hope my homie Psyche is on soon before I drown my brain with beer and bad decisions

Pre Edit: God dammit, are you and Aureal possibly both town?

VOTE: std, here.....for your troubles

Which is E-1 I believe?

The idea that Black and I could be town is supposed to be shocking? We were all town when we played before, it's not at all an outlier or anything. Cmon man, you're killing me with these absurdly fake thoughts. XD

[Aureal]

but her voting std kinda seems like she wanted to lead Psyche to std over you or me

I voted for StD because I was getting bad vibes from him not doing anything, and Aureal is starting to town ping me

I wouldn't mind if some people followed me there though

What is town pinging you about Aureal?

I feel like her train of thought is coming from a town perspective

Like I said I don't really think scum!her would try to use my sleep schedule as a way to paint me as scum. It feels icky and it's not very convincing, so there's no real reason for her to even mention it if she's scum. I feel like this type of read comes from town!her that is paranoid that I'm scum, and I think it makes sense for her to be paranoid that I'm scum after recent games together

I also see the progression in her thinking I was trying to divert pressure off of you by voting for her. I don't think it's impossible for scum to have partner theories this early but this one actually feels real and genuine to me, idk

I was gonna call this a cheap discrediting attempt but it seems you actually haven't posted later than that, in this game anyway

So FINE you can have your precious SLEEP

But calling it paranoia is still cheap, Ms. "1 in 3 chance of being scum"

[Aureal]

I'm still down for a Drew fade btw

Nice attempt at distancing.

Your reads are weak and there's still a missing slot but you're actually confident enough to say this? About Drew specifically, even. This is just you putting it on the record that "no guys see, I really did want to fade Drew" after he flips scum.

I think Drew and StD are the scummiest players so far so yeah I'm down to fade either one. That doesn't mean I want to do it right now

Please show where you have given any reason to scumread Drew

[Aureal]

I haven't given any reason, and I don't have to. Seem familiar?

If you think trying to take refuge in my playstyle is going to get you townpoints you should actually adopt it rather than try to cherry pick something you think I might do that happens to be convenient at the moment

I likely wouldn't need to answer such a question because I wouldn't be talking about my willingness to fade anyone without first having some strong reason for it.

[Aureal]

I'm still down for a Drew fade btw

So rude

I hope my homie Psyche is on soon before I drown my brain with beer and bad decisions

Pre Edit: God dammit, are you and Aureal possibly both town?

VOTE: std, here.....for your troubles

Which is E-1 I believe?

The idea that Black and I could be town is supposed to be shocking? We were all town when we played before, it's not at all an outlier or anything. Cmon man, you're killing me with these absurdly fake thoughts. XD

Why are you saying the literal thoughts going through my head are fake? Did I miss the memo where you two are confirmed town here? And wtf does another game where we were all town have to do with my reads on you two here?

I didn't think you were town for a bit, should be clear with me keeping my rvs vote on you and pushing you for protecting std until I started to understand how you were engaging with Black.

Like this kinda does annoy me a bit that you are laughing off everything I have said about you this game, and now calling my takes on you and Black as fake.......even if you disagree, I have been upfront with the issues I had with you initially, upfront why I came around on you and saw how you could see how Black was sketch with her dealings with me......and then here after reading Black's post before this one of mine understood her take on you.

Between you and Margot this is, and again saying it, getting annoying.....at least Margot isn't familiar with me so she might not get me......but wtf Aureal.....

You are giving me Koba vibes right not, and I don't like it

Wow. Good night then.

[Aureal]

Sorry if I'm actually bothering you two. I thought we were acquainted enough by this point that we could engage in friendly teasing banter, but I guess not.

Boy I almost want to thank my manager; spending an hour in the office yelling at each other about union stuff was a helpful jolt in pulling me out of a bad headspace where I cared about this Mafia shit.

...nope, never mind, writing this still hurts.

[Aureal]

I also think psyche is like, obviously town. margot is also a bit towny. the other 3 idk yet,

I don't think I can read you before we get a flip

Are you referring to me in particular or all 3 of your null reads? Also why do you think this?

i was referring to all three nulls, with an emphasis on you. the reason is your and drew's playstyle is too chaotic for me to be able to discern your alignment based on play only, and sdt's playstyle is too mild to be able to get anything out of it either. but after a flip i could probably form better reads based on how you interacted with the person who flipped.

Pre Edit: God dammit, are you and Aureal possibly both town?

if i be honest, i am not sure why, but i think black and aureal are almost never both town.

Ok, enough sweet talk. Back to scumreading and killing scum

vote aureal then.

I think my first thought about Z being Drew's partner might have been more likely correct.

[Aureal]

if i be honest, i am not sure why, but i think black and aureal are almost never both town

Also can you try to put this read into words if you can? Because to me it just feels like you don't like that we are both getting townread

I see you've picked up on the part I disliked most in that post.

[Aureal]

Intent to hammer

Will probably do this before I go to bed tonight (~3 hrs)

I'll explain my read a little before I vote

I will be sad if we never find out what Psyche is plotting

[Aureal]

Also I now think Margot is likely town from the frustration at trying to read through the emotion in other people's existing relationships

[Aureal]

My read on the gamestate is that tired repped in to an empty slot with the partner struggling, tried to push what seemed like a viable alternative wagon, had that backfire and make me look townier instead, and now just doesn't know what to do.

Sometimes town just comes together that easily. We just saw that happen with a scum slot sitting empty for a couple days at the start. Not that I'm comparing us to the likes of Klick and Dannflor.

[Aureal]

Who do you guys think tired would be partnered with if not Drew?

[Aureal]

If tired flips town, what do we do then? We're probably back after Drew tomorrow. If tired flips scum, what do we do then? We're probably back after Drew tomorrow.

Flipping tired tells me nothing, flipping Drew is actually informative. If Drew is actually town in spite of my strong suspicion, I need to know that now and I re-evaluate. We only get one wrong flip here, remember.

[Aureal]

If tired flips town, what do we do then? We're probably back after Drew tomorrow. If tired flips scum, what do we do then? We're probably back after Drew tomorrow.

Flipping tired tells me nothing, flipping Drew is actually informative. If Drew is actually town in spite of my strong suspicion, I need to know that now and I re-evaluate. We only get one wrong flip here, remember.

Alright

VOTE: Drew

Thanks, but you're not off the hook either way.

I'm feeling one of you or Drew is scum here, if not both together. Pushing for tired instead of Drew for the weak reasoning of 'gamestate feels like scum are cool with this' feels wrong coming from you. I've never really noticed you to be too concerned with gamestate reads. And you're a significant factor in the gamestate being the way it is, with the hammer announcement then backing down. If you're scum with Drew, it at least delays the info of a scumflip and then you probably go for getting someone to vote STD in 3p ELO if we do the likely thing and get Drew tomorrow. If you're scum with someone other than Drew, I feel like Psyche is the best fit. He also contributed to stalling the gamestate with the "idea" that has yet to materialize, and the two of you are both largely not suspected so setting up someone like tired who doesn't have the bad associations of Drew as the first flip would be strongly preferable to you.

[Aureal]

Bottom line, I think STD and Margot are just likely town so I'm not solving for teams with them. I know you guys don't like it, but STD just doesn't do a lot as town. He's being nonchalant and not trying to push an agenda.

Drew/tired
Drew/Black
Black/Psyche

[Aureal]

I don't like that you are toying with the idea of scumreading me regardless of what Drew flips here. Feels kinda agenda driven

Well yes, I don't expect you to like it, that's why I held off on giving the rest of my re-evaluation until I could see what reaction my ask would get.

[Aureal]

I don't need more reasons to shade you, I've already given them

I'm just giving my solve in case someone shoots me

[Aureal]

I hammered you

Are you scum?

Oh I missed that

No, like I said I am not scum, and what have you learned now Aureal?

That Black is scum. Probably with Psyche.

But her reactions here are already kinda telling me that.

[Aureal]

Oh right that was a 36 hour deadline, lol

would scum black hammer drew? hard to see it

by the way rules don't seem to mention what happens if deadline is reached w/o a hammer

By that logic would tired set up the hammer when momentum was somewhat shifting away from Drew?

[Aureal]

Somehow I'm not even surprised people are voting Dragons

[Aureal]

Yes

You are all my pawns now

[Aureal]

wait why don't i just skip the wallpost and hammer him right now

Please don't

[Aureal]

wait why don't i just skip the wallpost and hammer him right now

wait why don't i just skip the wallpost and hammer him right now

Please don't

Ya'll are trippin. Everyone has one vote on them

Reading vote counts after people vote more is hard

I demand a vote count in every post

[Aureal]

Aureal I expected you to push me really hard today

Why are you suddenly taking a backseat in this game?

Why would you expect that?

[Aureal]

Logic error detected, Drew was scum

Therefore statement "Black is scum" does not follow, remains in previous position of "Black might be scum"

With a dose of "this feels like annoyance at bussing only to be told she's not getting townpoints for it"

[Aureal]

Yeah

Did you ever get your idea going? Never found out what that was

[Aureal]

think case on std is stronger
there are town-telling posts in tp's iso
can't really say the same of std
aureal's stance on std seems to just that this is his meta
but that's seems to imply NAI, insufficient basis for a townread, which is what she rather confidently expresses in 356

Eh, maybe you're right

I'm not putting too much stock in Aureal's meta read. I think StD is completely capable of just lurking as scum

Ok why not

VOTE: StD

Wanna show me some scum meta you think is similar this? I haven't played with scum Dragons but read Death Note way back and I think that showed a different mindset. I've seen multiple people describe his meta differences and it's not served me poorly yet.

[Aureal]

Fiiiiine

VOTE: tired person

I was a little paranoid seeing as the NK was Margot which seems to indicate scum want to deny info, and wanted to see if Dragons would do more. Black seems to agree that he's not being very survivalistic here though so good enough.

[Aureal]

I was gonna vote Dragons here after seeing him come to life, I guess I shouldn't have gotten breakfast first

Well, I probably wasn't going to right away anyway

Glad this game is over though

[Aureal]

Really, I was leaning Dragons already because even though I was split on who it was, I just don't want to remember this game any more than I have to

That was a hell of a low blow from Drew and it really messed me up

[Aureal]

I'm sorry to hear that boo

And I'm sorry for throwing the game there at the end. In hindsight I should have taken my time. I was trying to be the hero and I ended up being a zero

It's fine, you're far from the first person to vote me in elo without even letting me talk