Sushi Mafia! Game Over

[Pear Bear]

/confirmed

[Pear Bear]

Yay!
Attention!

Vote: Microphone_Kirby

And on a completely unrelated note, I know sirdanilot

quite

well from another forum. However he has no possible way of knowing who I am!

BWAHAHAH!

[Pear Bear]

No.

[Pear Bear]

@dan

Its DJ.
You probably don't even remember me, but I sure as hell remember you.

[Pear Bear]

@dan

Its DJ.
You probably don't even remember me, but I sure as hell remember you.

DJ... DJ DJ DJ...

Sorry but that doesn't ring a bell, although I do think that if you tell me your name without the abbreviation I will think 'oh so THAT'S you!'.

Oh, I remember already! It's Don Juan!

Now that's a nice coincidence.

You're lucky, I was almost offended.
^_^

[Pear Bear]

Just lurking over here as my random vote on MK seems to have been a bit more than just random...

[Pear Bear]

My post on M_K's case

Post 55: Random vote. Not much to look on.
Post 75: A random post. Not much to look on.
Post 88: Role fishing? Selective scumhunting? This post could be random; but it seemingly isn't.
Post 122: Admits he's scum?
Post 126: Defending himself by calling OGML's argument retarded.
Post 131: (Intended) misinterpretation.
Post 133: Backing up his speculation.
Post 161: Admitting he's scummy by answering all of Falmeaxe's questions "yes".
Post 181: Defending himself by joking around.
Post 217: Still joking around and OMGUS'ing OGML.

Worth a vote? yes. Vote M_K

Also FoS Santos for lurking in a speed game.

Seraphim and Riceball is just noise right now. We're lynching M_K. This game has serious strict deadlines, lets not mess around.

Looks much more suspicious to me than

M_K, its not tunnel vision, its looking for scums that aren't your scumteam.

Why would you find that suspicious when you just now placed your vote against MK?

[Pear Bear]

Pear Bear, why are you, in your words, 'lurking'? Your random vote has become more than random? Well, what do you find suspicious about MK? Just leaving your vote on a big bandwagon and walking away again, are you? Thoughts? Opinions? Any semblance of contribution?

Vote: Pear Bear

Sorry for not addressing you, Plum, but I hadnt noticed that you voted me.
I was hesitant to post because my random vote for MK seemed to have been a decent pick in the first place, and I was assessing what everyone else was thinking to determine if I wanted to keep my vote on MK or not.
I realize, now, that random voting and then lurking when everyone else jumps aboard is really sketchy and I don't plan on doing it again. As for MK and his alleged role fishing, In some cases role fishing can be pro-town, and I think that this may be one of those cases.

Unvote MK

[Pear Bear]

I understand that I'm looking realllllly scummy right now. My half-baked plan has basically blown up in my face. I was hoping that if I had kept my vote on MK he would be lynched and turn out to be scum, but towards the end of that process I began to doubt his scumminess. That combined with pressure to act in someway caused me to remove my vote. However, I didn't think that Santos was scum either, and that by being one of the few to not vote him I would assure my nonscumminess.
Ive made a newb mistake that could potentially end up killing me, and hurting the town.
Fail.

I was also extremely surprised that I wasnt on Plums list of suspects as he was the only person to vote me yesterday and now I look 1000x scummier than then.

And finally, I don't fully comprehend the hasty flameaxe voting...

[Pear Bear]

EBWOP:

Stupid question:

Does scum know the identity of other scum in this game?

[Pear Bear]

I didn't think that Santos was scum either, and that by being one of the few to not vote him I would assure my nonscumminess.

Just as a quick question, how did you assume that would assure you're not being scum, even if he was town. There still leaves the wide possibility that you were a mafiate who knew he would be lynched without your help, and stood off the wagon to make that very claim to non-scumminess. So I'm not seeing why thats such a good reason.

Like I said, my whole plan was based on the fact that he wasn't scum. Because I didn't think he was.

And when I say "hasty" I mean "immediate and at the very start of the day" which is that part I didn't really get.

And I'm staring to feel the case against OGML because of his extreme actions during the MK/Santos lynchings. However, MK is still on my list so...

[Pear Bear]

Hypothetical question for a pro-town mafia vet:

If someone (town or scum) were to do something really obvious and scummy, and another player takes the bait, believes the lie and thinks the person who did the scummy thing is obviously pro-town (or so they say) should that player be looked at as suspicious? or just stupid?

This may or may not pertain to this specific game.

[Pear Bear]

Off to Pear Bear, an original suspect of mine. To analyze posts with relevence:

Just lurking over here as my random vote on MK seems to have been a bit more than just random...

I called this out originally. Staying on a bandwagon and lurking to see what comes of it, it seems. His response to my questions:

It was my first game in which I had been present for the first day.
I had/still have absolutely no way of personally analyzing people on the first day, and, I won't lie, my mindset during that entire day was to keep informed and follow the majority because most of you know much better than me what youre doing.

Sorry for not addressing you, Plum, but I hadnt noticed that you voted me.
I was hesitant to post because my random vote for MK seemed to have been a decent pick in the first place, and I was assessing what everyone else was thinking to determine if I wanted to keep my vote on MK or not.
I realize, now, that random voting and then lurking when everyone else jumps aboard is really sketchy and I don't plan on doing it again. As for MK and his alleged role fishing, In some cases role fishing can be pro-town, and I think that this may be one of those cases.

Unvote MK

As Farkshinsoup pointed out, there is a problem here, mostly in that PB says he was assesing what everyone else was thinking when it came to him deciding whether to keep his vote on MK, not, say, MK's behavior and various tells. I didn't catch that as clearly the first time around (and meanwhile Santos was scummily lurking without even bothering to give the appearance of making something of an actual response). He realizes it's sketchy and doesn't plan on doing it again, nulltell. He thinks MK's rolefishing might have been protown. WTH, I said before, and I'll ask PB now:

Pear Bear, please clarify what you meant when you said MK's rolefishing might have been

pro-town

.

Well if a townie was rolefishing to determine if someone had a pro-town role then that townie would be able to defend and cooperate with that player, right?
That was my thought process.

I was hoping that if I had kept my vote on MK he would be lynched and turn out to be scum, but towards the end of that process I began to doubt his scumminess. That combined with pressure to act in someway caused me to remove my vote. However, I didn't think that Santos was scum either, and that by being one of the few to not vote him I would assure my nonscumminess.

The problem

here

is that PB's motivations seem to be more related to scum's primary goal (looking pro-town and thus not getting lynched) than town's primary goal (lynching scum). Of course, scum's primary goal is town's important secondary goal as well, and sometimes priorities do get mixed up. "I didn't think that Santos was scum either, and that by being one of the few to not vote him I would assure my nonscumminess," says PB. Well and good if he didn't want to vote Santos because he actually thought he was town (and explained his position well, of course). Less well and good if he didn't vote Santos because he merely wanted to look townie. Basically, in my completed games I've been scum once; first time I was ever scum, and that was the sort of mindset I had: always trying to gage whether the wagon was worth banding and how I'd look if the gut flipped town and I'd stayed off the wagon (due to a comedy of errors, this ended up with me accidentially not bussing my scumbuddy hard enough when he was really scummy, because I was fully convinced he was actually town [/ramble]).

Like I mentioned before, my mindset on day 1 was to trust the more experienced majority, as I at no point, that day, was ever fully convinced that anyone was scum.

I was also extremely surprised that I wasnt on Plums list of suspects as he was the only person to vote me yesterday and now I look 1000x scummier than then.

First of all, I'm a girl and prefer to be referred to with femenine pronouns . Second, my list noted people I most suspected on the count of being Santos' scumbuddy, and due to the way I compiled it, had some flaws. Maybe I should check and see whether you're a likely Santos buddy again, just in case I missed something in my micro-analysis ? As to my hasty Flameaxe voting: it was the start of Day 2. There are lots of potential suspects and plenty of ways to start off. Why not jump right in, even if Flameaxe doesn't end up being my final vote for today?

I had suspected you were female, but I figured the chances of finding a female on the internet werent in my favour, and decided to stick with the more likely pronouns. Thanks for clearing that up ^_^

And I still feel that if you had suspected me, and noticed that I didnt vote for Santos I should have at least been mentioned if even with a (less suspicious) disclaimer. That was the first thing that attracted my FoS in your direction.

If someone (town or scum) were to do something really obvious and scummy, and another player takes the bait, believes the lie and thinks the person who did the scummy thing is obviously pro-town (or so they say) should that player be looked at as suspicious? or just stupid?

So, should a person who applies the 'too scummy to be scum' fallacy be seen as having committed a scumtell? Depends completely on the circumstances, the relationship and other connections between the two players in question, other tells and level of suspicion of both players, etc. I've done it as scum, but in the same situation might have done it as town as well. Can't be sure. Didn't know he was actually my scumbuddy, though.

I guess if the majority of the responses to my question were for stupid rather than scummy, I won't think much of it for now.

[Pear Bear]

Plum, [...] I think you're very likely town.

This will be very interesting later on if OGML flips scum. I already suspect plum for a few fallable reasons, one of them being that whenever someone votes against me, and I am town, they automatically jump into my line of sight as potential scum, because theyre voting to lynch town. Also, in nearly every mafia game Ive played, those players who you think are "likely town" and do the best job at looking the part of a townie, end up being scum. And Plum is doing a great job at looking pro-town.

vote OGML

for the time being.

[Pear Bear]

Plum, [...] I think you're very likely town.

This will be very interesting later on if OGML flips scum. I already suspect plum for a few fallable reasons, one of them being that whenever someone votes against me, and I am town, they automatically jump into my line of sight as potential scum, because theyre voting to lynch town. Also, in nearly every mafia game Ive played, those players who you think are "likely town" and do the best job at looking the part of a townie, end up being scum. And Plum is doing a great job at looking pro-town.

vote OGML

for the time being.

Translation: I have specious reasons for suspecting Plum (OMGUS and Too Townie). I'm going to jump on this wagon over here, not so much because I think he's scum, but because it will help to clear up my thoughts about this other guy who's voting me. Oh, and I'll slap "for the time being" on there so that I can back out and put my vote somewhere else if this wagon falls apart or I attract too much attention.

This is a sad attempt at scum hunting from someone who has no interest in finding scum.

And this is a perfect example of how my newb tendancies and inexperience are being horribly misinterpereted for scum behaviour, by more experienced players who are either confusing themselves, or going for an easy kill.

I was simply putting my thoughts out there.

[Pear Bear]

If there were two scum groups, how likely would it be that they know eachothers identities?
I would think that if they were aware of eachother it would defeat the purpose of seperating them.

Currently, I'm still the most convinced by the case against OGML, and I have yet to see a post with anything solid enough to lynch Az, but I'm still waiting.
And I'm still suspicious of Plum.

[Pear Bear]

EBWOP:

I missed the last few posts on the last page, including Tal's case against Az.
My votes still on OGML, but I understand where the Az voters are coming from too, since both cases are similar.

[Pear Bear]

I still would rather lynch Pear Bear, but I think that ain't gonna happen before the deadline. I'll switch my vote to OGML if I have to.

What about my case, which I thought was fairly minor, strikes you as more scummy than OGML? If youre so desparate to lynch me then it might help if you tried a little harder. Or was this just a post to lessen the attention drawn by you switching to a faster wagon?

[Pear Bear]

EBWOP:

Also, Ive had a Ponzu sushi before.
It was quite unpleasant...

[Pear Bear]

I still would rather lynch Pear Bear, but I think that ain't gonna happen before the deadline. I'll switch my vote to OGML if I have to.

What about my case, which I thought was fairly minor, strikes you as more scummy than OGML? If youre so desparate to lynch me then it might help if you tried a little harder.

Still a question I would like answered, FSS.
And I ask the same of Setanta, who just popped in to drop a vote.
Surely he must have checked everyones cases, because that would be the protown thing to do, but if he did, I can't see why someone would vote me over some of the more scummy suspects of today.

[Pear Bear]

I still would rather lynch Pear Bear, but I think that ain't gonna happen before the deadline. I'll switch my vote to OGML if I have to.

What about my case, which I thought was fairly minor, strikes you as more scummy than OGML? If youre so desparate to lynch me then it might help if you tried a little harder.

Still a question I would like answered, FSS.
And I ask the same of Setanta, who just popped in to drop a vote.
Surely he must have checked everyones cases, because that would be the protown thing to do, but if he did, I can't see why someone would vote me over some of the more scummy suspects of today.

You keep trying to push the albeit small bandwagon off you and onto OGML. The case on you is incredibly good. Not as good as OGML, IMHO.

And yes, I know this wasn't directed towards me, but you're trying to play it out like you've done nothing wrong. >_>

That is not at all what Ive been trying to do. Ive admitted many times that some of my previous actions have been really scummy. What I am saying, is that I feel that the case against OGML is better.

[Pear Bear]

Vote: Pear Bear

Just lurking over here as my random vote on MK seems to have been a bit more than just random...

Admitting to lurking, just as Santos did. No explanation for why he's keeping his vote on MK.

I kept it there because I had no intentions of doing any scumhunting on day one and everyone seemed to think he was scum, while I had little-no opinion.

Sorry for not addressing you, Plum, but I hadnt noticed that you voted me.
I was hesitant to post because my random vote for MK seemed to have been a decent pick in the first place, and I was assessing what everyone else was thinking to determine if I wanted to keep my vote on MK or not.
I realize, now, that random voting and then lurking when everyone else jumps aboard is really sketchy and I don't plan on doing it again. As for MK and his alleged role fishing, In some cases role fishing can be pro-town, and I think that this may be one of those cases.

Unvote MK

Unvoted after being called out by Plum. Admitting that just staying on the wagon for no reason other than his random vote was scummy. Try to do some scumhunting instead of just guessing.[/b]

I've tried scum hunting, but apparently I'm not very good at it because whenever I state my suspicions I make myself look scummy.

I understand that I'm looking realllllly scummy right now. My half-baked plan has basically blown up in my face. I was hoping that if I had kept my vote on MK he would be lynched and turn out to be scum, but towards the end of that process I began to doubt his scumminess. That combined with pressure to act in someway caused me to remove my vote. However, I didn't think that Santos was scum either, and that by being one of the few to not vote him I would assure my nonscumminess.
Ive made a newb mistake that could potentially end up killing me, and hurting the town.
Fail.

I was also extremely surprised that I wasnt on Plums list of suspects as he was the only person to vote me yesterday and now I look 1000x scummier than then.

And finally, I don't fully comprehend the hasty flameaxe voting...

Again, just hoping that MK was scum. He didn't believe he was scum, he just stayed on the wagon in HOPES that he was scum. And to act in someway? You mean acting town instead of just acting like scum which you most likely are? Also, not voting for someone whose lynched does not assure you non-scumminess, regardless of their alignment.

Also, the last comment was definitely buddying up to Flameaxe. He had one vote on him from Plum, and it was the beginning of the day phase. If Pear Bear flips scum, I bet that Flameaxe will flip scum as well.

Ive already explained my actions on day one, Im unable to analyze such little information that is provided from day 1 in order to convince myself someone is worth voting based solely on my own thoughts. I was intentionally mindlessly following the majority, because the majority was town, and you all know much better than I do. As for the flameaxe thing, if/when I flip town, that should not take suspicion off of flameaxe.

Stupid question:

Does scum know the identity of other scum in this game?

This is one of a few dumb questions by Pear Bear. I feel that he's stupidly trying to make it look like he has no idea how the scum work in this game.

I believe the first post says that if you have any questions fee free to ask them here. This is what I did, and I feel like its a question worth asking.

It was my first game in which I had been present for the first day.
I had/still have absolutely no way of personally analyzing people on the first day, and, I won't lie, my mindset during that entire day was to keep informed and follow the majority because most of you know much better than me what youre doing.

So basically, you're saying that you're just going to follow the bandwagon, correct?

Again, you has no interest in scumhunting

I dont know what you define as scum hunting.
What I am doing is observing everyone and basing opinions about them through those observations, once in a while I will attempt to voice these thoughts just to be brought back into the spotlight of suspicion with my suspicions swept under the carpet. So I tend to keep them to myself most of the time.

Like I mentioned before, my mindset on day 1 was to trust the more experienced majority, as I at no point, that day, was ever fully convinced that anyone was scum.

Santos admitted to having a

safe claim.

You didn't think he was scum then?

I legitimately do not know what a safe claim is or what it has to do with someones level of scumminess. I will look it up after posting this.

This will be very interesting later on if OGML flips scum. I already suspect plum for a few fallable reasons, one of them being that whenever someone votes against me, and I am town, they automatically jump into my line of sight as potential scum, because theyre voting to lynch town. Also, in nearly every mafia game Ive played, those players who you think are "likely town" and do the best job at looking the part of a townie, end up being scum. And Plum is doing a great job at looking pro-town.

vote OGML for the time being

FSS summed this up pretty well. That is absolutely terrible reasoning for suspecting Plum. Obviously OMGUS. And again, no real scumhunting.

And this is a perfect example of how my newb tendancies and inexperience are being horribly misinterpereted for scum behaviour, by more experienced players who are either confusing themselves, or going for an easy kill.

I was simply putting my thoughts out there.

No. Do not use the "I'm a newb" excuse. That is again, horrible reasoning. They're not being misinterpreted because that's what you meant. And if it isn't, then explain what you did mean.

Usable as an excuse or not, it's fact.

If there were two scum groups, how likely would it be that they know eachothers identities?
I would think that if they were aware of eachother it would defeat the purpose of seperating them.

Currently, I'm still the most convinced by the case against OGML, and I have yet to see a post with anything solid enough to lynch Az, but I'm still waiting.
And I'm still suspicious of Plum.

Here's another example of one of those really stupid questions.

You never really explained why you voted for OGML. In your post where you voted for him, you just said that if OGML is scum, then Plum is scum. And your reasoning for being suspicious of Plum is still horrible. "Well, Plum is voting for me. She must be scum." Seriously, you're not doing ANY scumhunting.

His last few comments I already commented upon. He's trying to tell everyone that his case is not at good as OGML's. I did agree with this, but he was trying to play it off as if it was nothing.

To sum it up, I'm voting for Pear Bear because:
Admitting to lurking
Keeping his vote on MK in

hope

that he was scum until he was called out for it

No actual scumhunting

(This is my main reason why)
Crappy reasoning for why he thinks Plum is scum (lol rhyme)
newb defense
Brushing off the wagon on him as if it was nothing

1. I suck at "scumhunting"
2. I have little enthusiasm for "scumhunting"
3. This is my second mafia game, ever.

These factors should not make me scum.


This is all the defense I can muster ATM as I am tired and in need of a shower. Maybe I'll pop in later tonight and do some of your definition of"scumhunting". But don't hold your breath.

[Pear Bear]

EBWOP:

Sorry for the shitty quote tag fail.

[Pear Bear]

If we lynch another town, would we still have a chance of winning?
Because I'm fairly certain scum is intentionally keeping me around because I'm
A) Not helpful to the town.
B) A scapegoat to draw attention to when one of them is getting lynched.

Through the course of this game Ive suspected Flameaxe, Talitha and Plum, all turned out to be town. And I wasnt convinced Santos was scum, and I ended up being wrong.

Perhaps I should focus on those who I suspect the least...

[Pear Bear]

Unexpected leave of absence.
Posting from my phone.
Unable to read previous posts and find out whats up, but I got my prod.
Requesting to be replaced.
My appologies.
Also, I'm not scum.
^_^