I know someone is considering it. Don't.
That is all.
A keen grasp of human nature.ortolan wrote:How do you know this, pray tell?Xylthixlm wrote:Public service announcement:
.Do not deliberately act scummy so that you will get the gun.
I know someone is considering it. Don't.
That is all.
Not really. Keeping stuff to yourself for a while is okay, but I'd advise letting people know who you're planning to kill ahead of time, rather than just suddenly shooting. The last-minute flurry of activity is very informative.Vala Mal Doran wrote:'Sarag wrote:I also think Val should keep her thoughts to herself as much as possible (bar asking questions she wants answered, or analysis she thinks will be useful for town) - there's no point in letting the scum know how she's leaning until she pulls the trigger, and she doesn't have to prove herself town.
Noted. It's a good idea.
Let's see.Vala Mal Doran wrote:@Xylthixlm: Who in this game do you think could most convincingly pull off faking town as scum (including yourself)? Elaborate beyond a couple of sentences please.
How is this any different from a normal game?Bogre wrote:I most definitely want to avoid being shot, because it will be a loss to town. But I am not -afraid- of it...do you see the distinction? Scum have the most to lose from being targetted, not town.
Thanks. I've been off lately, I even let zwet survive to the end of Touhou.Zakeri wrote:Xyl's policy lynching takes a new low as he admits in thread that he would will the death of two confirmed townies just to teach one of them not to say something stupid.
I haven't played with Bogre much but I think I'd remember if I saw someone playing this blatantly antitown.ortolan wrote:wait how is Bogre scummy ITT, and how are we scummy by proxy for defending him; when he clearly acts like this every game. Do you disagree?
This townie wants to be evaluated "fairly" and is perfectly happy to offer information that makes himself look scummy if it happens to be true.ortolan wrote: Town players don't want to give information like this so that they can be evaluated "fairly", they want to convince others that they're town. It looks like he is going out of his way to appear "honest" rather than acting how a townie actually would- trying to convince people that they're town.
Unfortunately for you, when you're scum you're horrible at judging what you would have done as town.ortolan wrote:fyi I never do. I would only defend someone as scum if I would defend them as town.
I've seen dumber. Which doesn't make it any less dumb.Yosarian2 wrote:You make my brains hurt.
If person A defended person B, C, and D, and only person B, C, and D, and all three of person B, C, and D flipped scum, you would consider that a point in person A's favor? Really?
Stop realistically assessing my scumhunting capabilitiesYosarian2 wrote:Besides which, you seem to be taking Xyl's list with a level of seriousness that kind of perplexes me, considering we're on page 6 off day 1 here. Not that Xyl's list wasn't intended to be a serious attack, I'm sure it was, but it sounds like you're actually expecting him to name the entire scumgroup at this point of the game, which seems a little bizzare to me.
Everyone is. I have no reason to believe you're an exception.ortolan wrote:source?Xylthixlm wrote:Unfortunately for you, when you're scum you're horrible at judging what you would have done as town.ortolan wrote:fyi I never do. I would only defend someone as scum if I would defend them as town.
Absolutely not. That is the worst possible thing you could do as a townie.DraketheFake wrote:It occurs to me that correct play as a townie is to encourage being shot
Xylthixlm wrote:Public service announcement:
Do not deliberately act scummy so that you will get the gun.
I know someone is considering it. Don't.
That is all.
1) DraketheFake is completely wrong here.DraketheFake wrote:I'll amend: correct play as asuspectedtownie. This game rests more squarely on the decision-making/scum-hunting abilities of the individual rather than the group. Since the penalty for being incorrectly suspected isn't death - and since survival instinct won't kick in - the only person coming under suspicion who should hedge at the prospect of being shot this early is a scum player. Yes, a townie under early suspicion in the interests of the town playing a perfect game might try desperately to avoid the gun, but the unique mechanics of the game make it so that weaseling out from under the gun should basically be a heavy scum tell.
Town players should try to avoid getting shot. Acting nervous and defensive isDraketheFake wrote:1. So you think that with a 7/11 chance of hitting town a town player should act nervous and defensive if the gun is pointed their way?
If you're looking at the game from the perspective of how a town player should act, the flaw in your reasoning is blatant and obvious. If you're looking at the game from the perspective of how a scum player should act, it's extremely subtle. I conclude that you are looking at the game from the perspective of how a scum player should act. This makes you highly likely to be scum. Q.E.D.DraketheFake wrote:2. I'd love to hear how 1 leads to 2, though I understand it isn't really your style so far to give any kind of reasoning.
WTF? Would you rather he not posted anything?Bogre wrote:Hey, way to read through the thread and post, uh, nothing new.HowardRoark wrote: stuff
Pretty easy to parrot the things -everyone- else has come up with.
Still happy about this list. Sarag has the potential to remove himself if he starts actually playing. The other three had better hope that someone else does something really really scummy, because otherwise they'll be my top suspects for a while...Xylthixlm wrote:Scum: Bogre, Sarag, ortolan, DraketheFake
I'd expect it to encourage you, if anything. But I don't really care.ortolan wrote:do you think posting this might discourage these players from attacking you?Xylthixlm wrote:Still happy about this list. Sarag has the potential to remove himself if he starts actually playing. The other three had better hope that someone else does something really really scummy, because otherwise they'll be my top suspects for a while...Xylthixlm wrote:Scum: Bogre, Sarag, ortolan, DraketheFake
Waffle harder please.Sarag wrote:Discussion between ortolan and rite - they bothseemto be nitpicking in an unhelpful way. I don'tfindortolan's accusations of rite to beparticularlycompelling, but riteseemsto be misrepresenting ort's case. Ithinkrite comes out alittleworse in it, since misrepresenting someone's argumentseemsless town than making a flimsy case in the early game. I have aslightlytown "vibe" from rite,butthat may only be because he was attacked by Bogre in a really poor way, so Imayhave tore-assesshim.
Handy probability trick: The question "Who is more likely to be scum, A or B?" always has the same answer as the question "Is it more likely that A is scum without B, or that B is scum without A?" If you can't figure out an answer to the first, try asking the second.Zakeri wrote:between Drake and Rite however, I can't really decide. They both have almost equal amounts of "trying-to-look-like-they're-helping-without-actually-doing-so", with the large difference to me being that Drake is slightly more unpleasant in attitude. between the two of them, it's likely there isn't a wrong answer.
Stop right there. Thinking this way is opening yourself up to manipulation by the scum. Don't.HackerHuck wrote:Bogre’s my second, but I think he's a bad target if we're wrong. He might do a decent job at finding scum as the shooter, but he'd need to take his sights off of me and Xyl before I'd feel really comfortable risking that. It's not so much that I don't think he's really scummy, it's that being wrong about Bogre would be like killing two townies.
This.HackerHuck wrote:My last comment is directed at Vala. I think you're in an ideal situation as gunbearer to hunt for scum. While it's probably smart to keep your true intentions somewhat private, you're in a good position to do some indirect scumhunting. Since you're confirmed, there's no danger in you trying some unique tactics to gauge the reactions of others. I would urge you to fight the tendency to sit back and watch, which seems to happen with the kingmaker type roles.
So all the scum have to do to avoid getting shot is be vocal about a bunch of totally wrong suspicions?Vala Mal Doran wrote:Out of the main few suspicions listed so far, I only think Sarag, slicey, or rite/Hacker would do okay as gunbearers if they are town. Of those people I am currently most suspicious of Sarag, so he may end up being the shot for the day. I'd like more people to weigh in, though.
No. You should find someone who is scummy, period.Vala Mal Doran wrote:Well, I should ideally find someone who is scummy AND would make at least a semi-decent gunbearer if town, at least day 1 when we have relatively little info.
Because you're not taking scum behavior account. Scum can easily make themselves look like bad gunbearers, so if you factor gunbearer quality into your thinking you give the scum an easy way to manipulate you, and the net result is that the town is worse off than if you ignored it entirely in the first place.Vala Mal Doran wrote:Why don't you think it should factor in at all? If I shoot someone like, say, Zakeri, and they turn out to be town, won't they be even less active? Isn't that detrimental to town? Don't I have an obligation to, if I should shoot incorrectly, at least make sure town isn't screwed day 2?
Go reread the stuff that led up to this post, then read that post again, then look at ort's relation with the other three players you named, then come back and tell me he's not scum.Slicey wrote: Scum list as of now: Bogre, Sarag, Drake, one of our lurkers (Vaya/Zakeri)