Pledge of Allegiance (Game Over! Page 76)

[VP Baltar]

Parama sure spends a lot of time talking while saying nothing.

Jack, why did you assume other=cult?

@Oj, I chose town because it takes less time to dedicate toward the game and at the time I was invited I was a bit busy at work and not sure when things would clear up for me (but I was too greedy not to play). Also, please answer your own question.

Just based on meta, I'd say that UncertainKitten couldn't resist taking scum or other. I'd also lynch Zorblag without question today.

## Vote: UncertainKitten

[VP Baltar]

So, which alignment do you guys personally prefer and why did you choose town?

I felt I had no chance of playing scum successfully against this player list.

##Vote: Jack

Really? You saw the player list before picking alignment?

[VP Baltar]

Well, all I know is that I've seen you as disinterested town more than once, particularly when you get vanilla. Therefore, I think you'd be inclined to take scum since you would see it as more "fun". You don't happen to have some of these SEVERAL TIMES do you?

@DDD - I think Troll has proven very successful as a scum player in the past and wouldn't mind the challenge. Why do you think he'd take town?

[VP Baltar]

Well, all I know is that I've seen you as disinterested town more than once, particularly when you get vanilla. Therefore, I think you'd be inclined to take scum since you would see it as more "fun". You don't happen to have some of these SEVERAL TIMES do you?

@DDD - I think Troll has proven very successful as a scum player in the past and wouldn't mind the challenge. Why do you think he'd take town?

[VP Baltar]

F U MS!

@UK - Sure, but aren't you more likely to draw vanilla than a PR as town?

As far as the role PM thing, if that's true then I forgot. I thought we picked our sides without seeing it, but I admit to not looking at the PM that closely.

[VP Baltar]

Feel free to list the hundred meta arguments I've used. Also, give a detailed explanation of how any of those make me more likely to be scum.

[VP Baltar]

1. Exaggeration is fun
2. I never said the use of meta arguments made you scum:

Most of your post talked about meta and then you voted me. Sorry if you can't see the flow of ideas in what you write.

As far as your "case", where is my logic "shallow"? Terrible gut feel isn't a very believable wagon.

##Unvote
## Vote: Parama

[VP Baltar]

Giving up at L-8 is a scumtell for everyone playing along at home.

[VP Baltar]

how many scum are in this game Para?

[VP Baltar]

how did you arrive at that number?

[VP Baltar]

Question: What do your previous two posts have to do with scumhunting?
Oh. Right.

Just highlighting your inside information. I don't expect to convince you that you're scum though.

Last time we played I was scum

Shhh, you're talking about big bad meta again.

[VP Baltar]

@Elli and Llama, your position that parama is too scummy to be scum?

[VP Baltar]

For those that know Jack, is this his standard play or is the cult business an unusual distraction?

I have limited experience with Jack, but all of it has been recent. I'm not sure what to make of the cult thing honestly because it was an odd thing to say. However, I will say that I do think he plays pretty loose as town and thus draws attention. I haven't decided yet as to his alignment.

Also, do people really call you Zorb? That's very weird.

[VP Baltar]

@VP: I don't like your posting, and am ready to vote you given how pliable you been for basically any wagon that's occured.

You sure about that? Only people I've voted have been you, who no one was voting for, and Para, who has scum juice leaking out of his eyes.

Now, I mean, if we want to talk about someone trying to hedge bets for recent wagons:

##Unvote
##Vote: VPBaltar
##FoS: xvart
##FoS: Parama
##FoS: Jack

That could be a good place to start. Using a scumtell you're guilty of to vote someone is reason to lynch you.

Also, you should refine your definition of rolefishing to actually be accurate. Unless of course you just like buzz words like Para does, in which case please carry on.

DGB I hope you revise your list:

Caught and flailing scum

:

UncertainKitten
Parama

Likely buddies

:

Llamafluff

[VP Baltar]

Heehee, I see that your only response is to counter OMGUS me. How...stereotypically scummy.

Yes, I OMGUS'ed you preemptively in my first post.

Also, how did I misrep Parama? Seems to me that several people read his post exactly as I did, so are you claiming that they are misrepping him as well? If so, why am I scummy for it and those persons are not?

[VP Baltar]

Happy scumday, Llama.

I don't know Para, so I'll take your word on his meta in terms of you believing it.

You'll have to explain UK for me. I've given why I think she's scum meta wise and her contradiction of her own tells can't possibly be seen as coming from town.

DGB probably is town but I wouldn't take anything for granted from her. She's always a wildcard.

[VP Baltar]

I specifically remember reading that if a lot of people pick scum or 3rd party in this game, that the town would be made up of good power roles.

And how are you arriving at the conclusion that a lot of people would pick scum? Generally speaking, I think the odds of that happening were almost zilch since most people are wimps when it comes to playing scum.

Also, how is it all random? Picking your alignment isn't random at all. Building roles based how many of each alignment there are isn't random either.

I'm quite amused at the people who are voting me while also implying suspicion of Parama.

@UK - One thing I forgot to mention last night is that I'd really like you to explain the contradiction I pointed out in your saying I'm willing to go for any wagon (which I wasn't) and then fosing/voting on all the main wagons. How does that really add up in your head?

[VP Baltar]

I said that it's possible, it doesn't matter though, because your point against UK is stretching further than Stretch Armstrong's arms.

You're totally right. Next time I make my first post of the game I'll be sure it's a fully annotated thesis so you don't think I'm being lazy.

The role you get is random, I know since I asked Spyrex to be a paranoid day cop no less than three times. I didn't get it.

Yes, but the probability is still that if you picked town you'd get a vanilla role unless the very unlikely possibility that a huge number of people picked scum.

[VP Baltar]

After I make dinner, I plan to drink an entire bottle of wine while catching up in this game. Prepare for words children.

[VP Baltar]

You only need two words (and a ##). Those are "xvart" and "vote"

Possibly. I honestly haven't had the time to look closely at your xvart case yet, so that is certainly a top priority. *looks for corkscrew*

[VP Baltar]

I'm staying on VP if anyone cares.

I'm guessing no one does, but for someone who was bitching earlier about Jack wasting posts that's some nice content.

*back to reading and writing*

[VP Baltar]

Beginning from post 153 on page 7 by xvart...I can see why people want to lynch him. Pushing the QT thing which was obviously reference to another game is very scummy. Additionally, his reasoning for choosing town is weird and doesn't seem like something that would cross my mind. Sounds contrived.

@VP: Mostly in addition to your other scumminess. It's mostly related to the Big Bad meta comment right after another rolefish. Seriously?

You know, every time I play with you my opinion just gets lower and lower. If you're not scum this game, you simply should stop playing mafia altogether. I honestly don't think you know what rolefishing is.

Contradiction of my own tells? What land are YOU coming from?

It was rather clear actually. You said I was pushing any available wagon, which was blatantly false. I had only expressed serious interest in lynching you or Parama. Then in the same post you FoS or Voted almost all of the major wagons. Calling something a scumtell and then doing it yourself shows cognitive dissonance and is a very good reason to call you scum.

@VP: really? xvart and VP are wagons? I see very few votes on either. So we have Parama and Jack. Are you telling me that none of these are scummy?

You know what would help this? Actual context so I know what you're talking about.

I've seen him as scum and as town. I'm overwhelmed with my sixth sense tingling that he's scum.

I'd like more detail if you can provide it. I've seen him as both town and scum, and I think Troll is very good at having consistent play as either. I'm not seeing a glaring difference in his play here, so you'll need to be more specific.

This guy is grasping at any available straw, and trying to turn anything he can find into a case at this point. We need a wagon going here. His vote seems to be in the wrong place, his reasons for suspicions all seem to ignore simple answers, nothing here reads like town trying to make a case.

I can agree with that assessment.

Fishy may be scum after all.

Um...ok, where did that come from?

Parama 169 is ><. You're really bad at this game, aren't you? Here's a cool example:

OMGUS =/= Vote
OMGUS = overreacting to a vote like you did in your previous post and trying to attack the player who attacked you.

Meanwhile, elsewhere:

OMGUS stands for "Oh My God, You Suck (for voting for me)!". it is sometimes used as a shorthand to

indicate that you are voting for someone primarily because they voted for you

.

indicate that you are voting

voting

You should perhaps consider sometime that five or six months on site isn't all that much in the grand scheme of things.

Setting up a dichotomy I see.

Implying you think we could be the same alignment? Haven't seen that from your play yet. But buzz words are fun.

*side track to charter*
Have we played any games together in the past where I was town? I really don't understand your obsession with me, especially considering your earlier points don't hold water. I know I took advantage of you in that open, but you don't have to be illogical about it.

@charter - He is stuck a little too hard on Parama lynch for my liking, but its nowhere near enough to vote him.

This is how I know Llama is town. He and I probably have a unique understanding of each other's scum play after Dark Goma Mafia where we had a strange symbiotic relationship. The fact that he's not pushing my wagon shows me his reads are accurate and coming from a town perspective.

Re: Parama. Parama is town. His posting, tone, and voting style are all consistent with my experience of TownParama.

How much experience do you have with ScumParama?

The continued, willful ignorance concerning the QT quote that Elli posted is pretty damning. "I highly doubt they share the town win condition" is probably the worst result to come out of this.

I agree with this. At first I could see him simply not understanding it, but clutching to it is scummy. Any town player would have let it go after it was explained.

someone needs to keep on VP if he's ever to be lynched.

Just as a note to you, I've only been genuinely mislynched once as town and that was my own damn fault (ask Llama), so best of luck to you this game. You'll have to NK me if you want me dead.

Gammagooey is acting weird this game. Usually he's super pro-town looking, but his posts on page 8 are meh.

Quick note: no time to fully explain this but you should know by now that I hate meta

Anyone who understands how I play knows my alignment.

I seriously don't get the town reads on him. Keep contradicting yourself champ.

People who I'm interested in hearing more from (which is what you said I didn't have) are DGB, DDD, Zor after DGB posts her case, and VP.

What would you like to hear from me?

I'm a bit swamped in real life but I'll catch up as soon as I can.

Can we get an ETA?

DGB, I think your case on Zorblag is really weak and not true other than maybe the random vote thing. Please see my above question.

Llama, is the only reason you think UK is "obviously town" meta based on that single game?

Not my meta, at least. Troll's style of thick, somewhat impenetrable posts is close to this regardless of alignment, at least from what I've seen.

Yerp. It's annoying honestly.

Phate is being ridiculously useless in this game compared to my very limited town meta of him.

Not much else to say, DGB's case is pretty decent, wanna see Troll respond to it

Not really. How much experience do you have with Troll?

I expect VP Baltar in particular to dislike this stance given what I had to say about Albert B. Rampage in Open 193

Not really for two reasons. 1) I have much more experience with DGB. 2) I don't think she says things just to get a reaction like ABR does. She is purposeful in her scumhunting even if she's very wrong at times.

Also, I should note that in the past that Cobalt seems to have a strong affinity toward lurking as scum...though I find it hard to believe he'd choose a scum role, so that is kind of a paradox for me.

Fishy and Balter on a scumteam.

How the fuck are you arriving at this conclusion? (here comes the cursing, one bottle of wine later)

Also,

Jack is scum.

Parama is town.

Zorblag is probably scum.

All of these reads are wrong. You've lost your town touch charter.

## Unvote
## Vote: xvart

(L-5 I believe)

That's today's lynch and should be pretty telling. If he flips town, I'm turning to Phate, Parama or Uk.

This post brought to you by;

[VP Baltar]

What was it that made you go from being willing to lynch me without any other information today to this defending that you seem to be doing now?

I was fishing for your reaction and was sort of teasing that you're always scum when I play with you. If you recall, at the end of F&E I said that I should just start lynching you straight out in every game.

@VPB - Yeah that game is the biggest reason I have UK-town. Some people really hate being anti-town, that game, and past experience with UK says thats she is one of them.

So you don't find it scummy that she violates her own tell?

I really just read the parts that were directed at me, because his post was so massive that I doubt anyone is going to read all of it.

hey, I worked hard on that. Am I that much of a bore to you?

[VP Baltar]

Also Troll, I don't know if I'm "sticking up" for you so much as I want DGB to explain herself better. Like I said, your posting style doesn't seem to change much from town to scum so I don't see how she is claiming it to be so obvious.

[VP Baltar]

I just like disagreeing with charter because he's obviously not trying very hard this game.

And I debated with DDD because I did want to come across as at least mildly serious to you or it definitely wouldn't have gotten a reaction. Speaking of which, why was it not worth a reaction at all when you started to believe I was serious?

[VP Baltar]

## Unvote
## Vote: Phate

Challenge accepted. I'll address other things plus UK's pouting fit later.

[VP Baltar]

@VP Baltar, how much have you played with charter? This seems about what I expect from an opening for him.

I've played with him on three occasions if my memory serves me. His tunnelling isn't unexpected really, but generally speaking I've at least seen him tunnel for better reasons in the past. His attacks on me, much like Parama and UK, are laughable at best. That's what is annoying about him.

Oh, right, and you've still never explained how I violated my own tell and decided to woohoo ignore the evidence I had against your fucking idiotic accusation.

First, it could not be any more clear than when I first said it. I'll quote it for you since you apparently can't remember:

@VP: I don't like your posting, and am ready to vote you given how pliable you been for basically any wagon that's occured.

You sure about that? Only people I've voted have been you, who no one was voting for, and Para, who has scum juice leaking out of his eyes.

Now, I mean, if we want to talk about someone trying to hedge bets for recent wagons:

##Unvote
##Vote: VPBaltar
##FoS: xvart
##FoS: Parama
##FoS: Jack

That could be a good place to start. Using a scumtell you're guilty of to vote someone is reason to lynch you.

Second, I don't know what "evidence" you provided against it when all I saw you say was:

Contradiction of my own tells? What land are YOU coming from?

So, anytime you'd like to explain how I was pushing any wagon at that time when I only wanted to lynch you or Parama, feel free. You can also explain why that is a scumtell for me if it was true (which it's not) and not for you, who backed four major wagons in that same post.

[VP Baltar]

Already explained it. Since you are planning to ignore things that don't fit your version of events, I'm not going to waste any breath on you.

quote your explanation then because I don't see it. Also, elaborate on what is inadequate about my explanation of the point. You keep skirting the issue and stamping your feet, but you're not actually saying anything.

Feel free to let your fake indignation stop because it's quite a bore and you're not going to provoke me. I don't get mad at der Internetz.

[VP Baltar]

VP was being somewhat out-of-characteristically a total jerk to UK for that one comment to stop playing, I don't see any trigger that would even nearly warrant that rhetoric, like even nearly.

You're probably right. I should apologize. I'm sorry, UK. I had a very serious personal issue come up recently and I should not have taken my frustration from that out on you.

That being said, continually bringing up things like "don't use quotes" while calling my posts contentless and not answering my question tends to grind my gears. So....

[VP Baltar]

@VP: really? xvart and VP are wagons? I see very few votes on either. So we have Parama and Jack. Are you telling me that none of these are scummy?

Pretty much answers how I don't feel it's hypocrisy at all.

I'm pretty certain there was much vocal support for both of those before you placed your fos/vote. My point was that they were not original thoughts, which is what you were attacking me over.

[VP Baltar]

I'll look back at from where you were catching up then.

[VP Baltar]

I liked your post d3x. Mostly because I look cool in it, but it's kind of a novel way of doing things.

[VP Baltar]

What would you say if I told you Gamma majorly scumslipped in our neighbor qt?

Explain please.

Also, I was wondering if there were neighbors/masons in this setup. I may need to do some reconsidering of some things.

[VP Baltar]

Honestly, I'm really disinterested in this game atm. I think tomorrow I am going to try to muster the will to read the last like 5 pages or so since I've only been skimming. If I can't get myself into it, I may replace out because my laziness isn't helping the town and it's better replacement wise if I get out early.

[VP Baltar]

@VP Baltar & Parama

What's the matter, you didn't get the alignment you asked for? Are your buddies flailing?

As Para said, everyone got the alignment they asked for, so....

But the truth is that all you have to do is note my V/LA in my sig. I have a mountain of work over this time period and while I've been trying to do my best to keep up in my games, this one is moving at an especially rapid pace. I almost never replace out of games, but if I can't keep up in a way that I can make a meaningful contribution then I don't see any point in me staying. I couldn't even tell you the major events that have happened over the past few pages and my will to find out isn't very high atm.

[VP Baltar]

I mean damn, I'm inclined to say something like take care to him.

Oj doesn't want to kill me! Just kidding, thank you for being understanding.

Anyhow,

Mod, please replace me.

I apologize to everyone, but I think it's necessary for this game. I'm sure things will clear up for me in a week and I'll regret not staying, but c'est la vie.